Transcripts For CSPAN Key Capitol Hill Hearings 20240622

This mr. President. Having passed an amendment that would have said tier 3 countries in the trafficking in persons report of the state department would not be allowed preferential access to the u. S. Market unless they cleaned up their record, which had a strong bipartisan support of members of the Senate Finance committee and ultimately was incorporated in the t. P. A. , the trade Promotion Authority legislation that passed the senate and was sent to the house in good faith because of concerns that maybe that would undermine the transpacific partnership. In good faith i negotiated an amendment, a provision to change in the amendment that would have said you could still negotiate with malaysia, but they had to clean up their act. If you concluded that negotiation and they were part of t. P. P. , they had to clean up their act on Human Trafficking before they got the preferential access to u. S. Markets. I thought it was a significant give on my part considering the vote of the senate, but it was a goodfaith effort. So this wasnt even necessary to do unless you just want to give malaysia a pass. The goal was to take the full weight off of the t. P. P. Deal i should say take the full weight of the t. P. P. Deal off the trafficking and persons report process. Instead of choosing the route we worked out together, requiring the president to testify in writing that malaysia has taken concrete steps to deal with their very serious Human Trafficking problem the administration backed out. I see no reason why the comprehensive ban on fasttrack for human traffickers should be amended. I see no reason why my willingness to accommodate should be amended. This underscores the need for further oversight of the trafficking in persons process both legislatively and through the noble work of human Rights Groups here in washington and out in the field. I plan to work with my colleagues to advance my amendment to the state authorization bill passed by the Senate Foreign Relations Committee last month which requires the state department to notify congress of all trafficking in persons upgrades and downgrades 30 days prior to the release of the report. I am looking forward to speaking to the chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee to see if he when in a very busy schedule because we have all of the iran nuclear review, but it seems to me that this merits a congressional hearing to determine what went on here. And if i for some reason cannot achieve that, then i may very well turn to the Inspector General of the department to seek a report as to what went on here. Despite the clear will of copping, this administration has made a mistake and will now have to answer questions as to its ability to objectively evaluate global Human Trafficking. The hardworking committed n. G. O. s who labor in the field to fight Human Trafficking and the countless victims who continue to suffer deserve an honest reflection of American Values not an arbitrary determination based on expediency and achieving a limited political objective rather than a real solution. I look forward to working with all the groups who have been instrumental in shining a light on the continued human rights abuses that take place in malaysia in cuba elsewhere to ensure that the integrity of the trafficking in persons report is restored. Thousands of men women and children around the world who are victims of Human Trafficking, it is on their behalf that i come to the floor. It is in their interests and in the interests of responsible trade policy that recognizes there can be no reward to nations who ignore these types of trafficking in persons and do nothing to end the scourge of what amounts to modernday slavery. One of the great moral challenges of our time. It is for the worlds 50 million refugees and displaced people, the largest number since world war ii, many of whom are targets of traffickers because theyre displaced have nowhere to go, they are preyed upon. We have the largest number since world war ii of refugees in the world. It is for the 36 million women and 5 million children around the world subjected to involuntary labor or sexual exploitation. For the victims of these crimes, the term modern slavery more starkly describes what is happening around the world and i will continue to fight against Human Trafficking in all its forms, and i intend to fight for the integrity of the report that is a critical tool for us to be able not only to pass the light upon Human Trafficking in the world but to get countries to understand that they must meet this great moral challenge and change the course of events in their country. And thats why i come so incredibly upset to the senate floor on something that i never would have thought would have happened mr. President. But it has. And we need to change it. And change the course of events. With that, mr. President i observe the absence of a on the next washington journal, ray lahood talks about the highway and mass transit funding and congresss attempts before it runs out next week. Will also take your phone calls to look for your comments on facebook and twitter. Washington journal is life every day on cspan. Cabinet officials returned tomorrow to testify on the it ran nuclear agreement. Energy secretary ernest ponies and treasury secretary jack lew. 10 00 a. M. Eastern on cspan three. Cspan gives you the best access to congress. Live coverage of the u. S. House. Congressional hearings and news conferences and every morning washington journal is life with elected officials, policymakers and journalists. Cspan created by americas Cable Companies and brought to you as a Public Service by your local cable and satellite provider. 15yearold Catherine Figaro a was nine when she watched her merits being arrested in a televised antiimmigration rate. Recently she sat on a panel of activists talking about sheriff jaropaios handling of the events. He has been elected six times. Hello everyone, this panel is called the people versus arpaio. we have an amazing panel. We will start out today with a small video. It is important to show the video because it showcases one of our own panelists and sheds a little bit of light into our world. Youll be able to see a little bit. There are some clips of the chain gangs, jails, and what he has done to our community. And the filmmaker is in the room and the fulllength film will be showing tomorrow at 9 00 a. M. In room 223 and catherine will be there as well. I want to invite everyone there. You should see the full film and join them tomorrow. Everyone there. You should see the full film and join them tomorrow. We will go ahead and get started and it is about a fiveminute clip for the movie. Breaking news coming into us right now. The Sheriffs Office is executing a search warrant. 25 different employees at possibly could be illegal immigrants. This is investigated by the Sheriffs Office for employers violations. I know how to solve the problem. Why do i get all of the heat because someone does something wrong and i use the word punishment, which no one else will use . Why should they not be punished . [crying] she is catherine for guerrilla, the phoenix girl whose plea to the president is being seen around the world on you too. Youtube. They were not born here and they say that is against the law. [speaking spanish] carwash. What house is this . My and. Are you staying with her . No, just yesterday. Today, i think i am going with my other aunt. There is only one reason it is you. 90 years old. I will vote as long as i am here. Can i be the sheriff at 90 . Most older people are afraid of children and afraid of people who dont obey the law because those people are nasty. They have to be punished. This year, immigration has become a source of fresh contention in our country with the passage of a controversial law in arizona and Immediate Reaction we have seen across america. 20 other states are considering similar legislation. This law does not fix the immigration problem. It adds new problems. Law or no law we will still do our crime suppression operation and continue enforcing illegal immigration laws. We are at 35 tonight. Now they are going to go to jail. We are scared to go out. If they have to hide, i have to hide. [speaking spanish] today, you will years in testimony on how it affects children, communities, and families. I will begin with catherine for guerrilla. I would like to send a message to arpaio. I am taking a little heat on my crackdown on illegal immigration. The Justice Department launched an investigation. Who do they think they are . This is my hate file. They get pretty nasty. Shows you how volatile this whole situation is. Is it taking . I dont know. Eric holder said there will be some responsibility. Your thoughts . Maybe it was not a correct remark to make. I work for my reputation and no one will take that away. Destruction of evidence financial fraud, abuse of power. This is the most out of control Law Enforcement in america. No one from the mexican on the street to the presiding judge of the criminal court no one is a safe. I kept thinking that maybe i would see my parents when i got back home. [speaking spanish] [crying] [speaking spanish] what do we want . Justice when to do we want it . Now the matter how it turns out i wanted justice. Period. With our blood sweat, tears. Get out of my country. I dont want anything that happened to have been again. To happen again. [applause] welcome, everyone. My name is Carlos Garcia and imd director. What we are going to do today is have a conversation with the six people up here and we will do a series of questions and open it up for questions from people in the room. I also wanted to recognize the parents of catherine who were also in the room. They are here and you saw them in the video and for their fight and continuing to support their daughter. I wanted [applause] we can get started with catherine and asking the question of what it was like. What is it like looking at the video and seeing what happened and in that moment, what was a like to see our parents being arrested on tv . Ms. Forfigeroa it was really hard. I felt alone like i was in a completely different world. I knew i had my family members with me but it was not the same. I knew that i had to fight for them to matter what [emotional] how they fought for me. They always wanted a good education for me. They are they are everything to me so i knew i had to fight for them. It was really hard. I i was scared i would maybe never see them again. I was scared of the got deported, i would stay here alone and nobody would want me because i wouldnt have any parents. I felt like people werent going to like me. [crying] i was really scared but once i started hearing about things i could do to help my parents, i did them, i fought for them, and i did everything so i could be them again. With them again. [applause] [applause] we are all very proud of you. Thank you for sharing. One of my mentors has been fighting for a long time fighting the whole time. I want to ask you, why did a rpaio do this . Why did you start doing this to our people . Let me take a few seconds to tell you how inspirational for those of you who were not here as this unraveled, this was arpaios first televised worksite raid and what catherine had to go through is to see their own parents taken away. What inspired catherine, she then entered inspired in turn inspired all of us in the community and i want to recognize her and her parents. She fought to get them out of that once they were out, they continued the battle to make sure it doesnt happen ever again. [applause] what inspires arpaio . What makes him who he is . He is a racist pig, etc. Etc. I think there is a certain version, a certain pleasure in what he does. Let me remind you that his first major what he calls crime suppression rates these are neighborhood raids where he would send hundreds of officers into them and build temporary jails in parking lots the first one was on good friday. It was on good friday and he was aimed precisely at the people who were going to mass and going to church. What we got to witness that day was people dressed well on their way to church or coming from church being walked through all of the media. Remember, this was the first one. All of the media was there. Local, national, international. They got to watch mexicans being carted. So, part of it is really, it is a personal hatred, a personal perversion, a personal sickness and him. The other part is pure politics. This is arizona, a very fine point of the arrow of hatred towards immigrants, towards mexicans, latinos. He has learned to exploit that. He is, we must concede, perhaps a sick man but a highly talented one at manipulating the media and in sharing his political longevity. Next, victoria lopez formally on the florence project. The torilla, who was arpaio victoria, who was arpaio before he decided to go after the community . Ms. Lopez interestingly, i had not caught the club before. He says i work hard for my reputation. He has been working hard at it for a long time. Certainly, one of the areas he has been the tory aslee notorious at by letting peoples rights is in the gl. Through his in the jail the tory us at violating all of you should participate in the action going on tomorrow afternoon in a campaign to try to shut down the city. Building tent city as part of his political strategy to show how he was so willing to go after people and punish people in a really degrading and dehumanizing way. We had been involved in litigation around the jail conditions for over 40 years now. That litigation has been going on longer than i have been alive, challenging the Inadequate Health care, the overall conditions in the gl documenting people having to be in the tents in oppressive heat. There are people currently dealing with the oppressive conditions. This is something that he continues to use as part of his political platform to gain favor with those who support him touting how terrible the conditions are touting having people in the jails where pink wear pink underwear that is an effort to dehumanize people in the community. Not just immigrants, but for people, people facing jail and the criminal justice system. That was clearly part of his political agenda and his political platform was around the conditions in the jails. We saw maybe we could market with the Sheriffs Office entering into an agreement with the federal government. It propelled the conversation about Immigration Enforcement and authorizing local agencies to engage in immigration activities. That was not that was through agreements a liver the country. Through that agreement and through that process, i would say it emboldened the share of and agency to begin the dramatic increase in Immigration Enforcement activity in the county. There have been particular moments certainly through what he has done in the gl and the area of Immigration Enforcement that has served as a platform for him for many years. This has been going on for decades. Thank you. Next, mr. Morrowms. Romero. She is working toward her deferred action. What was it like inside the gl . Please speak a little of what your experience was like. My experience was not the best. [laughter] it was something i never thought i would be living but unfortunately, i had to be in that jail for three months. I remember the ugly striped uniform that smelled horrible. Another thing was i had to share a room with over hundred 25 other girls 125 other girls. I had to share a shower. The food in there just the name sounds horrible. Slop. It is really smelly and it is food that i dont even think a dog would eat. There were times when the sl op had worms and they said that was fine and it was just vitamins. There was a time i got my milk and it was rotten and they said i had to drink it that way. Another thing every time i would visit, they would handcuff me to a table. I was not allowed to have contact with my family members. [crying] im sorry. After those two months, i was transferred to the detention center. When i got there, they offered me an application to work. I said i would not take it because the reason i was there was because i was working and i didnt think it was fair to go in there and work for them for one dollar a day. Thank you. [applause] next, jose. What was the raid like for you and what was your experience like and can you paint a picture of that experience . What were you thinking when that happened . [speaking spanish] thank you for being here. [speaking spanish] my name is jose and i was one of the many victims of arpaio. [speaking spanish] october 18, 2012 was a normal day like any other at my job. I left my home around 4 30 in the morning. I never expected that this would happen to me. [speaking spanish] i arrived at work and we had to load the trucks with material. [speaking spanish] all of the sedin, we heard people say all of the sud den, we heard people say the share ofs arrived sherriffs arrived. We were completely surrounded. It was probably 6080. We were told to sit on the ground. Not to move or to try anything. They had us from 5 00 until 9 00 in the morning sitting on the ground. [speaking spanish] as soon as i saw it was the sheriff, i was scared for my family. I knew the share ofs sheriffs were deporting people. [speaking spanish] i thought i would be deported and never see my family. I didnt know if to call my wife or leave it. [speaking spanish] i finally called her while no one was looking. [speaking spanish] and the sheriff saw me and study would break the phone. Said he would break the phone. I told my wife that arpaio was there and he would take me. We were transferred to 4th avenue jail. They had us overnight and a little of the next day. They transferred me to the jail. I was there for 4. 5 months. It is a terrible, ugly place. I would never wish it on anyone. The food was terrible. [speaking spanish] there are many times i preferred not to eat at all. Most of the food is rotten. [speaking spanish] the clothes you had to wear whether they fit or not. The rooms were cold. Imsi am sick. I have a problem with my back. I could not do too much movement. When i got there, i had a top bunk. It was very difficult for me to climb every morning and come down. I asked if i could get the bottom bunk. They said no. I said i was sick and he said he didnt care. I had to sleep wherever he told me. I asked for an appointment with a doctor and it was not until they wanted me to see the doctor until i got it. When it came for the appointment, i told the doctor and he said i needed an actual official form from the officer so that he could give me the bottom bunk. I went with the officer and told him what i had been told and he said i needed a doctors note so he would give me the bottom bed. They were just playing around with me. They are really ugly experiences. [applause] next, the organizing director at quentin. Why are these people here . Why arent they deported or why arent they still imprisoned . I am the organizing director. We have been around the past eight years and we came out of a direct response to the contract that sheriff arpaio signed and put into a limitation into implementation. We were born out of the crisis and a few years back, a big piece of the needs of our key minute he beyond community beyond doing the protest and the legal stuff it was essentially on a casebycase basis. Our people were saying they need support. My family, my husband my daughter is in detention and we need you to help us get them out. Jose found out about our work inside the jail and called his wife and said to look for us. We have been becoming experts at understanding the legal system, helping families navigate it and fight to get their loved ones out and in the past two years, we have gotten over 150 people out of detention through this level of advocacy and political education and leadership building. [applause] thank you. I want to come back to catherine. If you could expand a little more on the experience of fighting for your parents. We saw in the video you want to d. C. And kept fighting. How the think this will shape your future, set the rest of your life . I went to washington, d. C. To talk to congress. After that, i started going to marches, protests, different events where i could speak to people to make them helped me so they could help me get my parents out. I also got involved with puente. They were ably big help. They were always there even after my parents were out, they were always supporting us. In the future, i think this will help me because i am going to be a stronger person. What ever i become in the future, i am going to be strong and have more knowledge of what i am doing to help me and my community, my family. It is something that me and my parents are never going to forget an experience that will scar us forever, but now i know that we can live in not total peace but 95 peace so we can stay here together and i think in the future, there will be a big difference for everyone. Not just my family, but for everyone in the community. [applause] will you expand a little bit about what arpaio symbolizes and how he has impacted politics. The icon nationally for the antiimmigrant movement, donald trump. There is a legitimate discussion to be had about immigration in this country and about how to proceed forward. There is a legitimate escutcheon. You cannot have that discussion with people who believe that we are inferior, criminals, rapists , murderers, and believe we are raising our children that way with those values. What arpaio is is a moral gathering point for the people that exists evil that exists in this country. This battle, this clear hate against us he became the beacon for it. As his popularity grew, he gave license to others to speak in that most vile way that he has described us, Catherine Catherines family that most vile way. You think about arpaio and all of the and traditional institutional evil. He is a beacon of evil for racism. Donald trump is trying to take his place and he is welldressed with 1 billion but we will see whether he has his reserve of hate and people in his get. Ut. It appears he does but that is what we face and that is who arpaio is in this state and country. Victoria, what has the legal battle looked like with arpaio . We always hear he will always almost go down. I think the litigation has started with immunity in the county. We currently at the aclu have two major lawsuits challenging the activities we have heard about today, the worksite raids and the crime suppression sweeps we heard about. That litigation i think in part, we got to that point where we had to bring this to the court because politically arpaio had free reign and i think through the court, we have had some major wins, frankly in stopping worksite raids and ending the crime suppression sw eeps and finding Court Findings that arpaio engaged in racial profiling, violated constitutional rights. These have been major victories that have been carried by the community through their experiences and having that affirmed by a court and also having a court order that there be major reforms taking place in the agency itself. I think one of the important things that has come to light out of the litigation is the disrepair the agency has been in as a policing agency in this country and as we look at how Police Conduct themselves across the country ncso is an important example of what reform looks like in a police department. Through the racial profiling case, we had an order from the judge ordering training revision of policy, data collection, body cameras to monitor the activities of a sheriffs deputies, ordering the Sheriffs Office to stop enforcing immigration laws, stop Immigration Enforcement activities. Those have been major wins. They have, to cut there have been people in the Community Forward and testified in hearings, then plaintiffs in these cases and used the courts to be able to end those practices and frankly, it is the beginning of a conversation about what happens next. I can go through the history of the cases. Im sure many of you are following what is happening in the racial profiling case. There are currently content he contempt hearings going on against arpaio for violating court orders. We will be back in court monday despite arpaios efforts. We will see on monday how we will proceed and hopefully the back on track with hearings to address those violations of the court order and what the remedies will be for the community and work from there. That is not really an update on what the litigation look like but if anyone is interested in knowing more specifics about the cases, i am happy to answer those. We have had some major wins in defeating arpaio but the committee has really driven those cases successfully. I want to ask you you work to fight other peoples cases. If you could talk a bit about what you do and a similar question i had with catherine. How do you see your experience shaping your future . How do you think it will affect your future . I work with puente and im helping people detained like i was fighting their cases. We are not lawyers but we help them because i know there are lot of people that cannot afford to pay a lawyer. I do it because i dont believe in families being separated. I just do it because i dont want anybody suffering the way i suffered. I dont think there should be children without their parents. And that is really why i do it. The way i see this affecting my future in a way it has already affected me. Due to the criminal charge i was left with, im no longer eligible for daca which was my only hope so i could go to college and get a better job and have a Better Future and help my family. But, for now, those dreams are kind of just going with the flow. But, i am not going to stop fighting for what i believe is right and that is why i joined this lawsuit. I have the faith we will win. [applause] carlos jose, how did you feel when you heard your family was outside fighting for you . It was an emotional video were your children are talking and pushing to get you out. How did you feel when your family was fighting for you . Jose [speaking spanish] translator there is a video made that was very moving to me. Jose [speaking spanish] translator they fought really hard for me and im really proud of my family. They gave me strength to really withstand the time i spent in jail. Very hard to be in jail and have your children outside. They call you and ask where you are. I had to lie to my children the first two months. Because i did not want them to know i was in jail. The first time i spoke to them inside the jail, i said i want to vegas to work. My youngest spm on was five years old. He kept asking me when i would be back. I would say i was not sure because i had a lot of work. They would ask me for pictures of where i was. How was i going to send pictures if arpaio took away my phone . I said i will send you a picture. One time, my eldest son asked me when i was returning home. I said i did not know. He said he must have a lot of money because you have working a long time. I said yeah. He said when i came home he had a list of toys he wanted me to buy him. I said ok. I could not lie any longer. So i had to tell my wife to tell the truth. I did not have the courage to tell them. My wife thought for fought for me a lot. She never left me alone. She worked to sustain my children. She paid for the attorney. She paid all of the bills. I am very thankful for her. There was a moment when i told her i would not do anything and i would selfdeport. Because the attorney was taking money and not doing much. She said no. When i would speak to my daughter alejandra she was a person that gave me a lot of strength. She would tell me that i was there because god believed i was strong. And to fight and not give up. She told me to keep fighting and fighting and not give up. They also told me while i was inside that my father was very sick. I cried because i could not speak with him. I just knew he was a sick and was going to die. Without being able to do much myself. Theyre moments that hurt and will hurt for the rest of my life. [applause] to close the panel, what is next . What did the demands look like . Why are we marching tomorrow . Has anybody here heard there is a big protest happening tomorrow outside the 4th avenue jail . Great. That is good. So come as we have heard from different folks here, a lot of our people have gone through the 4th avenue jail, including myself. It is a terrible place. At this moment, it is a very volatile moment for arpaio. When you have some free time you can read about why. He is in big trouble in the courts and his ratings are down and at this moment, we can tip the pendulum our way and there have been some small moments where that has been a possibility. He is in big trouble and we want him out. We want his resignation and not only that, but we know with him gone, his entire legacy will not be gone and we have a lot of work to do beyond him leaving. Everything from the terrible conditions in the jails and human right violations to the racist practices on parole to what he has symbolized and the trend he has set for the entire nation and what he represents for a very rabidly racist conservative base in arizona and across the country. Money of the people who give him money are across the country not just in arizona. You would be shocked to see how much money people put in to his campaign. We want him to be gone. We want justice for all his victims in terms of people like jose like catherine and her parents and the thousands of lives he has devastated. We want 10 city shut down. We want tent city shut down. We want an host arpaiofree town. Tomorrow, we will be outside the 4th avenue jail. We are taking kicking off the campaign. When you get arrested and you look like me, you get sent to an ice agent if you dont immediately give them an id. We have heard about the horrors. We will be demanding tomorrow ice out of the jail. To uproot the sickness we have been living with for the past 20 years and we hope you will join us. Thank you. [applause] carlos we have some time for some questions. If you will ask questions, please keep them short and please use the microphone. We probably have time for 3 or 4 questions. Say your name. I have spent some time in the deal also and i noticed even manipulating the system as a collegeeducated white girl, i was in there almost a week before i could figure out how to make a phone call. They gave me a handbook on how the jail operations work but at the first opportunity when you go anywhere but a search you. You have to do the whole of noxious of noxious obnoxious thing. The first time i did that, they took all of the things in my pockets and did not give them back. The reason was because they noticed i had been making notes. If i was a spanish speaker, how would i figure this out . I was wondering if you could speak a little bit to that part of the experience where you guys are like double punished by not even being able to understand what is going on there. There is nothing in spanish, no translation. I can imagine it was just hell. You have so much respect from me. I know what it is like in there for me and i saw what it was like for girls like you and it was a lot worse. As bad as that is my situation was, i cannot imagine. You have my mad props. If you can talk about that special discrimination. I have a question about the specifics can everyone hear me . If they took couldnt he have why didnt he get impeached long ago . [laughter] based on the fact how many human right violations there would have been. That is a human rights violation, probably a couple dozen policies. And then one of the people i cannot remember his name but a very important person to not come this year because he was too worried about him and his family getting assaulted by arpaio. Thank you. Great question. [applause] [laughter] my name is kimberly ellis. Yesterday, i went on the borders store with carlos tour with carlos. It was transformative. I spoke with liz who also went and we have been processing the whole time. We consider ourselves informed and there was so much we did not know. It was very heartbreaking. It is like i cannot move forward in my life without helping to address this situation. The first time i heard about sheriff arpaio in a real and fluid way was with the jodi arias trial. I saw the racism in the jodi arias trial, and when i talked about it on twitter, i was attacked. I have never been attacked like i was when i said i sought a racism here. This is without knowing any of the other aspect. For me, for the people i work with back home, we associated dan brewer being a bad person. I did not make that connection between sheriff arpaio, jodi arias, and how it effectively served to ramp up White Supremacy and imagery, although she is not an undocumented citizen. So my question is, number one, i asked carlos, and he said it was disconnected. I wonder how you process how the jodi arias trial made things worse, or did it help . I dont really know. Number two, i was concerned about issues of solidarity. What is the background relationship here . How is there a discussion about haitian immigration and how they are treated in florida . There needs to be more working together, and there are ways to do that. She said on the stage that people raise money nationally for sheriff arpaio. We experience the same thing. People raised money for Darren Wilson and george zimmerman. But we can raise money nationally for our causes. We have to Work Together to do that. Carlos thank you. Maybe noemi, you said you helped other women. Maybe you could answer the question about what it was like for other women who didnt speak english and what they had to go to navigate the jail. Noemi when i was in there, i actually got to experience, one time, one of the guards, she started yelling at this girl because she had put away her apple for later in the day because we werent going to get any more food after that. She started yelling at her, and started saying, you stupid mexican, you need to get rid of your apple. The girl stood there and looked at her. She had no idea what she was saying. I went up to her, and i was like, she is not understanding you. And she was like, well, why is she here . Why is she in the United States if she doesnt speak our language . I was like, that is none of your business. But i can tell her she needs to get rid of the apple. But you dont need to insult her. She was just like, well, she has been here for a reason. She must be a criminal like everybody else. I was like, look, lady. There is no reason for you to call her a criminal. You dont know the reason why most of the people are in here. And she was just like, well, you are acting up. I will write you up and send you to the whole. To the hole. And i said, it is not right, the way you are yelling at her. I think they take advantage of us when they see we are mexican or whatever, they are like, they dont speak english. I can insult them and they will not say anything. I saw that many times, and i dont think it is right. They dont understand, they dont know all the bad things they are being told. To them, it is like, oh, i have to do what they say. Or i remember one girl, she said [speaking spanish], and i wasnt going to tell her the mean things she was being told. But it is hard for them. They never understood what they were being told. There were times when they wouldnt get their food because they wouldnt hear their number. Thats how bad it was. They didnt know what number. We would go by numbers. We werent being called by names, we were identified by number. Sometimes they would miss their food because they didnt hear when no number was called. When their number was called. So it was hard, not being able to understand. Carlos thank you. Victoria why does the food stay the way it is . Why arent we changing that . I was on the recall committee, we were wondering that as well. Victoria the issue of Language Access in the jails it was raised by the department of justice or filed a lawsuit against the sheriffs pop the Sheriffs Office in 2012. One thing they raised has to do with access to resources material translation for nonenglish speakers in the jails. But it has been a systemic problem in the jails. Certainly, noemis experience is commonplace. It is awful. Hopefully, we will see that remedied in some way, through the litigation. The question, i mean, i have to say, it is a hard question to answer. The conditions in the jail. Litigation can only get you so far, i think. We have been challenging the conditions in the jails for years. The case is 40 years old. It only gets you so far in terms of how you can change the conditions inside the jail and what is minimally required to comply with the constitutional standards that you can raise in the litigation. It is not really an answer to the question, but it really is the reality of where you can get with litigation on some of this. We continue to monitor those conditions. We have medical and Mental Health monitors that going to the jails, and review what an cso is doing. We continue to do that. One of the challenges when we are talking about jail and detention litigation is, how to bring some of that information out of the jail, and how to show litigation to the public, making people in the community, making people sub such as yourselves, aware of what is happening inside the jails. It is a difficult system to penetrate, unless you are in there or you have someone who is in their who is impacted i by the conditions. To be able to speak to the change we want to see in there. Carlos alfredo, if you could talk about why he hasnt been impeached. Or will, other spectacles we have seen with the jodi arias trial, and ending with the final question about politics in arizona. Alfredo i may be the only person in arizona who did not follow the jodi arias case. I made it a point not to. I cant comment on that. Why hasnt he been impeached . First of all the term impeached, of course, refers to a process of removing him by other elected officials, in this case the board of supervisors. There is no such procedure available under the arizona constitution. Impeachment was not available. What is in available, there were two other courses of action. One is for the board of supervisors essentially to deny him funding. Because it is through the budget that they can control independently elected officials. They were terrified of him. They were afraid of him. One of the settlements in the doj case is his admission of retaliation. They were afraid of him. That wasnt going to happen. The other factors, the voters. Whenever this. He was, until recently exceedingly popular in this state and in many parts of the nation. He declared that he was going to feed the bologna, that is, rotten bologna, to prisoners. It was a popular thing, when he closed them in black and white stripes it was popular. When he started chain gangs it was popular. When he started the homophobic practice of putting them in pink shorts, he started selling the pink shorts and they sold like wildfire in this county. When he began tent city 20 years ago, it was begun as a temporary facility while a permanent facility was built. It has been there for 20 years. Attracting celebrities of all kinds, you all know about stephenson golf Steven Seagal and other movie stars. A Catholic Bishop of Maricopa County has toured the facility and took his picture with him, and never, never raise the issue , never raised the issue of a concentration camp in the middle of a desert in arizona. It is his popularity, the only way and the ultimate way we are going to remove him is, actually there are two routes. The most simple and direct is to vote. I have something to say to our people. We have never voted 40 of those who are eligible. I am not sure we could take him out, but we could come close and we have not done that. The other was of action course of action is the aclu suit. The contempt portion, we might remove him. He will run again. Assuming the devil doesnt call him sooner. He will run again. We will have that opportunity to defeat him. We have to make it real this time. Carlos i want to thank all the panelists. I want to remind you all to please come out and march tomorrow, and please tell others. We will need help. After the keynote speech by Elizabeth Warren, we will march together. Thank you once again. Working lawyers cable affiliates across the country we are learning about the Literary History of augusta, georgia. Jimmy was a hero and was awarded the medal of honor in world war ii. We were in the museum of history and the decision was made to do a Permanent Military display to honor jimmy and i went through the metal recipients and the medal of honor recipients and it appears he is the only to have earned both a awards. He would say he did not deserve it and would point out that somebody else was more. He never took the Carnegie Medal. I interviewed people and people knew him well. I said, tell me about the Carnegie Medal and i have known a lot of recipients over my years and most will tell you that they did not deserve the medal and it should have been given to somebody else. It is a teaching in humility and he would have then in that category. We visited the home of woodrow wilson. He was just one year old and lived in a house standing at the gate and men came by in a hurry and were excited. They said, lincoln is president and there will be a war. He ran inside and asked his father what was war. Abraham lincoln and another war. See all of the programs from augusta. And, sunday at two. Cspan did you the best access to coverage. It brings you events that shape public policy. Every morning, washington journal is live. Cspan was created i the Cable Company and brought to you as a Public Service. A forum on strengthening investments to grow the economy. Create jobs and grow the economy. We will hear from Newt Gingrich and a panel of researchers and academics. It is part of what is called the middleclass prosperity project launched by Elizabeth Warren of massachusetts and representative Elijah Cummings of maryland. We will start the middleclass prosperity project for them. Why is the prosperity project holding a hearing on the imports the importance of federal funding for research . The recent art deeply the reasons are deeply interrelated. Investments in research produce good jobs right here in america. Breakthroughs in research are our best chance to keep free to keep from bankrupting our country and the middle class. Keeping us from going broke over all timers, diabetes, and the other costs of medical care. Research will give it give us a chance to lead better lives. Television has changed the world in america. Advances like supercomputers, the internet, sequencing the human genome and treatments for diseases have saved lives and create a jobs for middleclass americans. Economists agree, advances in science and technology have been the predominant provider of gdp growth over the past halfcentury. Today, 2. 7 million americans work in jobs focused on Scientific Research. Many, many more are employed by the companys built from new discoveries and technological innovations. Companies like google and facebook. For every dollar invested in the National Institutes of health, we get about 2. 20 back in immediate economic activity. Private industry is great at generating new inventions based on scientific development. That have a clear application. But a sick research, the kind of applications that arent clear yet, doesnt get so much investment. Government provides patient capital, the kind they can wait for longterm results. An american president once said that quote although basic research does not begin with a particular practical goal, when you look at the results of the years, it turns up being one of the most practical things government does. That was ronald reagan, a conservative who understood the value of investing in american innovation. For decades, investment in science have been a bipartisan priority. Todays washington has lost sight of the priority. Everyone come republicans and democrats, say that investing in science in and innovation is good. But talk is cheap. We need action and we havent had any in a long time. One proposal for congress is the 21st century cures act, which includes 1. 9 billion for five years in new funding for nih. That sounds like a good start, and it is. But it is not enough. Todays nih budget, adjusted for inflation, is 12. 5 billion less than it was in 2003. That is a 25 reduction in our federal investment in nih alone. Even worse, the bill doesnt include maintenance of effort provision, which means there is nothing to stop congress from cutting the nihs budget at the same time that it adds new money on top. If that happens, instead of expanding our investment in the nih under the bill, nih could shrink. Earlier this year, i introduce the medical innovation act which would rebuild the nih budget. It could boost funding by 20 without raising taxes, gutting vital programs, and without adding to the deficit. Dozens of dr. Organizations, patient groups and scientific associations have supported it and there is no research there is no reason that every republican democrat, and independent in congress could not support it, too. Members of congress are responsible for deciding whether we make these investment in our future, or whether we just talk, talk, talk about them. The American People deserve better from congress, and that is why we are holding this for them today, to have a real discussion about what we can and should do to get more money into research. I am pleased that we have speaker gingrich to talk about his work to increase federal investment in Health Science research and to talk about what it takes to make real, effective partisan progress. There are many things that the speaker and i disagree on. But, we strongly agree that investment in research is a fundamental response ability of our elected leaders. It is long past time to meet that responsibility. We also have a distinguished panel of researchers economists, and innovators, who will talk about increased funding creating jobs and strengthening the economy, and how congress can do a better job of prioritizing federal investment in science. Dr. Wilson, dr. Kessel chaim dr. Kesselheim, i look forward to this congress this conversation. Sen. Cummings we convene as part of the prosperity project. Today, we will examine our nations investments in research and development, charting the past progress for our economy. Over seven decades and the end of world war ii, sending the middleclass jobs in the process. We will examine how cuts to these investments, and unpredictability in funding for research and development has affected our future progress. American ingenuity is unmatched in the history of the world. The United States harnessed creation, and help new discoveries leap from the lab to the marketplace anyway that is the envy of countries all over in a way that is the envy of countries around the globe. The federal government is the nations largest supporter of basic research. It funded more than half of basic research in the u. S. In 2012. As a result of funding appropriated by congress, the National Science foundation, the National Institute of health the department of energy, the department of defense, and other agencies award tens of thousands of Research Grants every year. Federal funding, through programs like the Small Business Innovation Research program have been critical to help researchers and entrepreneurs convert the results of Scientific Research into new products and technologies that improve the lives of millions of people, while creating entirely new industries, and the jobs that come with them. In 1961, president kennedy called on americans to make a Major National commitment of scientific and technical manpower, material, and facilities, and as a result of that commitment, the u. S. Became the first and only nation to put astronauts on the moon. We reap the benefits of the discoveries that were made through the states program. In the form of technologies, products that were never imagined when we began lunar explanation exploration. The role in the 13 year effort to decode the human genome has lead to treatments for devastating diseases. This advancement created in or miss benefits interest benefits in or miss benefits. 8 billion was invested in the program, and generated in Economic Impact of 796 billion between 1998 and 2010. This is a massive return on investment 14one. The question is, what story will leave right in the 21st century will we write in the 21st century. Will it be new Economic Growth or will it be a story that we can no longer afford the next big discovery . Will we remain the world leader in Scientific Research and development, or will we succumb to a culture of mediocrity, and watch as other nations outpace our investments our discoveries, and our progress . Into the nine, the american recovery and reinvestment act contributed more than 20 billion into the in the federal research and development at it. In 2013, sequestration intensified a series of events that began shortly after the recovery act was passed. According to the American Association for the events but of science, our nations federal research and develop and budget declined by more than 26 billion. That is a drop of 16 . These cuts, and the uncertainty scientists face, have had devastating impacts on research initiatives. These cuts are shrinking the pipeline from which discoveries will emerge, 10 or 20 years from now. The decisions we are making from the shortterm perspectives of the annual budget cycle are shaping the nation and the economy we will leave to our children. We need to make sure they inherit a country that continues to lead in science and innovation, that creates a better world and a stronger economy, and that will take prosperous middle class. I am pleased to welcome speaker gingrich. I served with speaker gingrich, and i thank him on his leadership in investing in biomedical research. I welcome our distinguished members of the second panel. We have an Extraordinary Group of experts assembled today. It is an honor to have the opportunity to hear from each of you. I yield back. Sen. Warren thank you congressman. We are honored to welcome the former speaker of the house of representatives to this forum. Congressman gingrich. Good to see you here. [applause] congressman gingrich represent george represented georgia. He was the 58th speaker of the house of representatives. I join you in welcoming speaker gingrich to the forum. Not only did i served with speaker gingrich, but i daresay, he gave my parents one of the greatest thrills of their life. Both my parents had less than a sixth grade education. They were former sharecroppers from south carolina. Speaker gingrich, use swarming in in a special election. You took a moment after the swearing in to speak to my parents. I shall forever, ever be grateful. Thank you. And welcome. Speaker gingrich let me thank both of you, and to say as a former member of the house, i am delighted to have had that opportunity, congressman cummings, and i appreciate you bringing your parents. It is one of those magic moments, the first time you get sworn in. It means a lot. Thank you, senator warren, and i can appreciate how hectic your schedule is. When you called me i was both surprised and delighted. I am glad to be here. Im delighted to be here to discuss federal funding for research and development, a topic that has the potential to transform the lives of millions of americans of all backgrounds and clearly, to bring together liberal democrats and conservative rule republicans. Before i offer general principles for funding, let me start with an example that is close to my heart. That is, finding cures for the most common and Serious Health problems. This is a challenge that is important, it is urgent, and now, there is great hope that it is doable. It is important, because everyone of us has been touched by the devastating effects of problems like alzheimers disease, dementia, cancer, kidney disease, and parkinsons. We know how debilitating it can be, how they absorb the energies of family members and character caretakers, and how they strain the finances of all families. From a fiscal as well as a human perspective, funding and finding cures for these diseases is urgent. I chaired the Alzheimers Group for a few years. Americans will spend 20 trillion on alzheimers and other dementias. That is more than a full years ddp. Imagine more than a full the taxpayers are on the hook for much of it includinging a 420 increase to medicare, and 330 increase to medicaid. These are two out of many. The federal funding for research to cure alzheimers is only a tiny fraction of the money the government is already spending to treat alzheimers every year. The nih grants sunday 1 million on Dementia Research this year less than one half of 1 of the 154 billion medicare and medicaid are spending to treat it. Part of the reason for the imbalance is that nih funding has been cut more than 20 in real terms since 2003. Given the costs we know are coming, boosting Research Funding may be the most fiscally responsible step we can take. I want to emphasize this for a second one of the places i bring a unique background we balance the federal budget for four straight years. We did it while doubling the nih budget because we set priorities. I want to make a deeper point about the future. With the baby boomers aging, if we do not find a researchbased solution, we will never balance the federal budget because we will never impose the level of regulatory pain it would take to balance the budget, which means people not getting treated people being an miserable circumstances. What alzheimers, caretakers are twice as likely to be sick as not caretakers. You not only have the alzheimers population, you have the caretaker population both at risk. The good news is hearing major diseases appears more durable doable today than anytime in history thanks to basic research. We are in a time of extraordinary breakthroughs in biology, genetics, and materials. The nih in general and console then have shown real initiative. They are pioneering immunity. To allow Research Funding to languish at a time of historic opportunity when we could be saving lives and money takes a special kind of stupidity that is reserved for the city. I should note as an excessive exception of this criticism, the colleagues whose Cures Initiative is one of the most important efforts in congress in recent years and the senators are working hard in the same direction. In addition to drastic increases in Research Funding, i called for doubling the nih budget and i would include a substantial increase in the National Science foundation, which is the one mistake i think we made an Research Funding. We should have tripled nsf when we doubled nih. Let me offer some bold ideas. The first is research bonds. Four large, expensive projects with the potential to generate huge savings, it is worth exploring issuing bonds to finance the research, which would then pay out some fraction of the savings. This without the benefit of taking important projects off budget and raising larger sums of money than the federal government is likely to appropriate. Congressman Michael Burgess has proposed a version of this idea with the mind act. Similar models could apply to large infrastructure investments. Philip howard has argued that if we simply rationalized the absurdly bureaucratic review process we could create 3 million more jobs with the same appropriation. For research and development the return is a less obvious savings but im a big supporter of prizes. They are good for a couple reasons. Taxpayers dont pay a thing unless the goal is achieved and they never pay more than the prize amount. You get a lot of competing strategies or solving the problem when you have multiple groups working independently to get the price. This means you get better results that are far more efficient than costplus contracting and you may end up with several working designs. I would reorient many of our efforts in space and transportation procurement around prizes to accelerate competition and development. I look forward to your questions. Spake her, thank you speaker, thank you for your presentation. You argue that it is a responsible and shortsighted to let financing for basic research window. What do you think are the main reasons we have let financing for basic research dwindle . Speaker gingrich one is that the past has lobbyists and the future has publicist and in this city lobbyists often be pubea publicistts. Second, i think that there are those fiscal conservatives who are antigovernment in a way that makes no sense. It is a little like the woman who wrote brown and told him to quit going to the moon. There are people with no notion of the power of the government whether it is the airplane you ride or the computer you are using or the internet or 1000 different things. Government investment in this country we are the only country in the world that created a Patent Office in its constitution. There is a branch who doesnt get it. I think we have allowed welfare state spending and other bureaucratic spending to crowd out investment. If you look at the percent of the size of the government we were spending on investment and Research Investment infrastructure 30 or 40 years ago is dramatically bigger than now. One of the reasons i am for Something Like alzheimers bonds is i dont think we will win the fight. We will make some incremental progress but compared to the size of the tidal wave of illness coming down the road as people age, were not going to get ahead of it with the traditional mental appropriations process and that is why i looked for some way to break out as i suggested with issuing bonds that would be retired as we gain the savings of people not getting sick. I want to come balk to alzheimers in a minute. Didnt some of the things you just stated exist back then when you were able to double the budget with regard to research . The reason i am asking is im 20 figure out how we can get trying to figure out how we can get back to where you want. Speaker gingrich i think something sort of magic happened when we were in the first stages of trying to balance the federal budget and john kasich had the lead in that project. Congressman john porter who spent his entire career on nih problems and senator connie mack who had a familybased concern with cancer both came to cs and they brought with them every Vice President for research of every pharmaceutical in the country. We had a meeting of 70 people and they said this is a function of jobs. You want really highvalue american jobs, you invest in basic research. You want to have the most competitive economy on the planet you invest in basic research. You want to have the best National Security, you invest in basic research. Those things have carried us or 150 years and it is utter foolishness to walk away from the things that have worked and that means those of us who are conservative have to win the argument with other conservatives about the centro the of government investment. Iowas point out the transgression i always point out the Transcontinental Railroad was built with a huge part of the senate. It did not happen randomly. Even the wealth of nations argues there are times and places for National Security reasons when government should be shaping the market. I would argue that the areas we are talking about are a key part of that. I give john porter and connie mack a great tool of credit for making it possible to build the momentum to double the nih budget. Just curious, has private sector funding increased to fill the gaps. Private sectors would be do more . Speaker gingrich theres some areas of private sector activity that you can see where theres been an investment, there are two things that operate against that. The first is that wall street is very very one quarter at a time my did. The analysts would not look at a 20 Year Investment strategy and give you a very good mark. Most ceos are really driven by the finance system towards shortterm optimization in a way which undermines the kind of investment you are describing. There is a second part to this. Most economists agree with this. When you are talking about fundamental breakthroughs everybody has an incentive to help someone else will pay for it. That is just an objective. The jet engine is as good an example as any. Jet engines were really complicated and really experimental in 1939. You were not going to get those created without massive government investment. Once we built jet engines come it was pretty easy to build the bowling boeing 707. Without that edging capability, you cannot have a transfer into commercial activities. You have to be honest about what the private sector will really invest in. We have had a really wonderful history of philanthropy. I and a big fan of the american easing of Natural History funded and founded by private citizens. That is terrific but if you are talking about the scale of science that we need, particularly in National Security and dealing with health , youre not going to get that from philanthropy or forprofit companies. One more question. I was stunned to read in the m. I. T. Report that over the past two years, the fda has approved 19 cancer drugs but over the past decade, not a single new drug for alzheimers disease has been approved. Based on what you just said, it would be almost impossible for the private sector to make that breakthrough with regard to alzheimers without a lot of government help. Speaker gingrich that is partially true. The other thing i would say, i think we really need to rethink how the fda works. If youre dealing with a lifetime condition, you cannot afford to test a drug that takes 20 years to figure out if you will legalize it. You will never raise the capital to invest in a drug with a 20 year time horizon of getting approved and when you get into brain science, the fda is not scientifically prepared to deal with the complexities this is true for Regenerative Medicine. There are entire zones happening in science we are not bureaucratically prepared to understand. The government has to make the investment but candidly, we could dramatically excel in right getting investment in new drugs and we could accelerate getting all summer related things, many of which will have to be conditional. If you are doing with a 20 year process, you have to say we dont see any immediate safety problems and those of you with informed consent, do it because we will not know for another generation if it will work. Sen. Warren thank you very much, speaker. Thank you for your remarks. I am delighted to hear you talk about tripling the nsf budget. I strongly agree with you but i focus for a minute on the nih. This is the crown jewel of medical research, supporting the work of more than 300,000 researchers, including hundred 45 nobel Prize Winners at more than 25 hundred institutions. This work expands our understanding of biomedical science and saves lives. For Decades Congress increased the nih budget year over year and in the late 1990s, both parties worked together to double the budget. You are the architect of that historic achievement. I think it should be a lesson for Todays Congress a lot of people think we are too partisan to get much of anything done but i dont think anyone would describe the late 1990s as the golden age of nonpartisanship. Despite that, you successfully built Bipartisan Coalition to support nih funding. You got it done so that is what i want to ask about. Despite the divides, why was it that members of both parties decided that nih funding was so important in the late 1990s . Speaker gingrich i think there were three things involved. Im partially thinking through thats a very good question. The first is, as Hillary Clinton has said on the campaign trail her husband and i had a technique where we could fight all morning and negotiate all evening. I think it is important that does not educate to a nonpartisan, Perfect World but you have to place the country above whatever your fights are and you have to say ok, now we have both gotten it out of our system. What can we do . Lets not talk about what we are not going to do. That is where clinton and i could find solutions. Second, we did have remarkably strong Corporate Support and that allowed us to overcome a lot of the conservative bias against government because you have people who were Vice President s and you can imagine today if you took the biological company in the san diego area and harvard and all of the ceos showed up, you would have so many hundreds of ceos saying you want us to have good jobs and be able to solve problems. We were able to bring a private Sector Energy to get more money for the public sector. The third thing was we were able to engage a lot of the constituency groups in have a direct, immediate interest. I remember when bob kerrey and i spent three years on a bipartisan basis on the alzheimers study group and we had a 15 or 18 senators come to a hearing. I think all but two of them had a personal relationship with alzheimers. Suddenly, your people saying this will create jobs, it is the right thing to do for disease come and it is the only possible strategy to balance the federal budget and somehow that conversation broke through. I am tried to figure out how we get it into the president ial Campaign Next year because i would love to have the candidates answer the question are you going to try to get to a balanced budget by bureaucratically depriving people of goods and services or are you going to try to invest in the research that lets us break free . If you postpone alzheimers onset by five years, you cut the projection and half. That is 10 trillion. They are not many places you can say i can take 10 trillion out of the spending stream in a positive way by keeping you healthier. Sen. Warren let me follow up on this now. Youre conservative, may have a little more correct than i do in some circles on the question of the role of government here. Why isnt it enough to count on a private industry . Why do we have to have a substantial investment from the federal government . Speaker gingrich its a question about american history. Were currently developing an entire project on why George Washington matters. People dont often notice that the Founding Fathers wrote into the constitution a Patent Office. They so deeply believed in the future. They made investments. The First Federal highway was built during washingtons lifetime. They believed in improving things. Jefferson launches an expedition westward by the way, in a Childrens Book on this, it is supposed to cost 2800 and costs 35,000. The idea and jeffersons era of taking a group of people and sending them to the pacific is comparable to going to mars today and yet jefferson understood we needed the knowledge, most of which is stored in the academy of natural sciences. I think we have had a very long history of investment. The Congress Passed the money to enable the first telegraph to be built between the capital and baltimore. That was a congressional investment. I think we have to recognize that lincoln was the only president to hold a patent and he was totally fascinated with technology and brought a lot of it into the civil war to the benefit of the union. There is a long history of america being a country of technological advance and recognizing government has a significant role to play. Sen. Warren let me ask with a little more sharpness to the point on health care in particular. Given that the taxpayers are on the hook for medicare for the veterans administration, for all their health care cost, if we fail to make the investments in nih and discover the cheers cures we need, who will pay for this . Speaker gingrich let me try to paint a picture for a second. Anybody who talks to cutting edge scientists knows we are right at the edge of breakthroughs. It is so extraordinary. I am of an age where i have several friends with unique am a difficult problems. When i can help them find the best two or three people in the country, their allies are suddenly transformed because the best people in the country are 20 years ahead and are doing things on laboratories and hospitals that are like magic. We are having breakthroughs at every single level of health. To know that exists and were this close and were generative in Regenerative Medicine to help you regrow your liver instead of having a transplant, regrow your kidney to be able to regrow your nervous system if youre in a car accident. You see these things in the lab and you look at what is happening to wounded warrior. The science we are applying is 20 years behind the science in the laboratory. Look at the failure to fund this and frankly, it is probably the thing that comes closest to driving me nuts because i say this to all my fiscal conservative friends you have trillions of dollars of guaranteed expense sitting on the table. You will never get away from it and never have enough bureaucracy to rationally spend this money away because in the end, you have to cut off services. That is what happens. If you dont want to cut off services to people who love very long problems like alzheimers or park at sans parkinsons or autism, you have to be solving this. I think the creative and honest about it, i can get as to a federal balanced budget through health breakthroughs. There is no other strategy with the baby boomers aging that will get you to a sustainable balance budget. One other thing. By the way, while were doing that to save ourselves trillions of dollars, we will create hundreds of thousands of very high paying american jobs and dramatically strengthen our balance of payments. Sen. Warren if congress boosted nih funding again, how would you recommend that we structure this funding . Speaker gingrich first of all without putting it absurdly, i will try to get Francis Collins to really reflect on the lessons from the human genome project. I and not a big fan of the Peer Reviewed small grant model. I think it leads to extraordinary caution and it has not made progress and i think this is one of the challenge s we have. What is the rhythm, the excitement . Similar problems nasa has. Boredom is not a good device for getting people to be involved. The human genome product project was stunning. I will carefully at three areas one is to what degree can we design much larger grant projects that are very driven towards goals the way the human genome project was . The second is to what degree can a modest amount of money be put into prizes of a variety of forms and if you look at aviation, it is a new how much activity was stimulated by very modest prizes. Lindbergh flew the atlantic for 25,000. Lots of people were trying. Third, we need to find a way to guarantee that a significant part of that money goes to younger researchers so they have