Transcripts For CNBC Squawk 20240704

Another record. Bitcoin reaching a new high above 71,000 this morning. Look at the move. It has been a staggering move. 71,758 as we speak and climbing. Crypto adjacent names, coinbase, et cetera, seeing gains. There is three days after ethereum breached the 4,000 mark. Look at the crypto stocks. Trading higher this morning. Early this morning, i should say. Coinbase and robinhood. We will talk to Michael Saylor at 8 30 a. M. Today. We will ask why invest in the proxy when you can invest easily in the etf now . Thats one of the big shifts. Hes a brave man. He is a brave man. Buying more bitcoin. That would be his argument. He is a levered bet on crypto. The stock is a leveraged bet on crypto and bitcoin in a way that you could go leverage. Aside from the Software Business. That is not part of the deal. Have you heard about coinbase and what goes on there . The zero balances on the high volume base . I have been looking at it. Whats going on . I have seen it. That number is nice. It goes to zero. Thats what we were talking about. I have no money. Thats a good sign for coinbase. High volumes and the weird glitch. They have to get it together if they are the main one. It is hard with that much interest. Larry fink has bitcoin surging. I think jay powell has something to do with it, too. The bill in the house is moving closer to the vote to ban tiktok in the u. S. Or force the chinese parent to sell the company. The wall street journal says the momentum caught tiktok by surprise and Flood Congress with phone calls has back fired. President biden said friday he would sign the legislation if Congress Passed it. The journal reports that bobby kotick has expressed interest in buying tiktok. He floated that idea at the dinner last week which included openai ceo sam altman. And formerly President Trump now doesnt want to ban tiktok. Now swirling. It is antizuckerberg. Thats all it looked like to me. The enemy of my enemy a lot of times with the former president can be. Again, there have been times when we said you just get uncomfortable about banning companies that you dont like what theyre doing. China can do the same to us. Exactly. If ccp is manipulating our youth and krucorrupting them. We might be able to talk about this with somebody later . I forgot about that. We may be able to ask former President Trump about tiktok. He will be our guest at 7 30 a. M. Not everybody remembers do you remember trump tuesdays . I do. I do remember trump tuesdays. Before he was president. We had a segment where he would phone in. I always enjoyed it. Tho not everybody enjoyed it. I dont know if this is the beginning of another weekly segment. At this point, would you say presumptive nominee . Yes. I would say we would say that to him. Was he not the presumptive nominee before last tuesday . He probably was. I dont think he has done ain af an interview since sotu. Im sure he will have stark differences on how he views things. We will ask him a lot of things. Openai saying the law firm concluded the investigation into the events that led up to sam altmans ouster. There was a breakdown of trust with the board and altman. They did not anticipate the instability that followed. The concerns did not involve product safety or security or finances or statements to partners. Sam altman will join the board and we will talk more about the story later in the hour. This is what you expected. They did not tell you more than what you already knew. Like why. Exactly. Elon musk posting on x that his startup xa. I. Will open source grok. He unveiled it in november of last year. He sued openai and sam altman saying they broke the Funding Agreement and criticized them for not being open as in openai, the name of the company that he helped create. Nvidia has been sued by three authors who said it used copyrighted books without permission to train its a. I. Platform. The works were part of the data set of 200,000 books to train the models to simulate written language before being taken down last october due to copyright infringements. The authors say this is an admission that the company trained the model on the data set. I know this is an issue for you, andrew, in terms of what data can be used in a large language model to train it. What is up for grabs and who is getting paid . Those are a lot of questions here. The question is can you train the model yourself . I think the answer is no. I think that is going to ultimately be the answer. The question is what is the fine and how much will this cost everybody and is there a different Business Model and what happens . The bigger question for nvidia in todays session. The key reversal from friday. It hit a new high early in the session and finished at the lows. A 10 session traiintraday. What is it . Trees dont grow to the sky. This is already in the sky. Its in the sky. Through the sky . People would have said that 100 points ago. They would have. Justice department has opened a criminal investigation into the boeing 737 max plug blowout on the Alaska Airlines flight. Investigators contacted passengers on the january 5th flight. Alaska airlines doesnt believe it is the target of the investigation. We will talk more with phil lebeaulater this morning. Coming up, key inflation data tomorrow highlighting the squawk planner. Later, we referenced this, former President Trump will join us later to talk about the campaign and the economy and Regulatory Environment and maybe tiktok and more. Squawk box will be right back. At pgim, finding opportunity in fixed income today, helps secure tomorrow. Our timetested fixed income suite, backed by over 145 years of risk experience, helps investors meet their goals. Pgim investments. Shaping tomorrow today. After military service, you bring a lot back to civilian life. Leadership skills. Technical ability. And a drive to serve in new ways. Syracuse universitys Daniello Institute for veterans and military families has empowered more than 200,000 veterans to serve their communities and their careers. From professional certifications, to job training, to help navigating programs and services, we give veterans access to support from anywhere in the world. Business. Its not a ninetofive acce proposition. Its all day and into the night. Its all the things that keep this world turning. The gotos that keep us going. The places we cheer. And check in. They all choose the advanced Network Solutions and round the clock partnership from comcast business. See why comcast business powers more Small Businesses than anyone else. Get started for 49. 99 a month plus ask how to get up to an 800 prepaid card. Dont wait call today. On this weeks planner, inflation data in focus and Producer Prices and sales on thursday. It is a light week from earnings. We hear from oracle today, kohls tomorrow. On wednesday, dollar tree and home builder lennar. On thursday, Dollar General and Dicks Sporting Goods and ulta beauty and adobe. Joining us is stephanie link from high thetower. Step stephanie, the number on friday, good number, but some revisions. The labor force and the way that works put us up to the highest level we have seen in a while although the number was good. Theres all these cross currents, but the bottom line is the tenyear yield continued to come down a little. I think tomorrows number could do more of that if it looks like january was a oneoff for inflation. Yeah, joe, the data has been pretty good in the last couple of weeks. What is good . Good . Were looking for soft. Im looking for good, joe. We root for good. We want growth and we wants inflation to come down. Thats what were getting. Look at the threemonth average for jobs. Fridays number was wonkyvrevis. 260,000 jobs per month. Hourly wages are coming down 4 . That is good for the consumer. We got within gdp with consumption up 3 . You have personal income up 4. 8 . You have savings at 3. 7 and at the same time, inflation is coming down. To your point, tomorrows number is big. We are making progress. Core pce at 2. 8 versus 5. 6. We had labor costs that came in better than expected. Add it all up. Its good for earnings. We have been talking about the broadening since last october. Joe, friday was wild with tech and semis getting crushed and energy and financials have continued to rally. I like that. It is also worth pointing out the russell 1000 is up year to date. The russell is playing catch up. That was flat a couple of weeks ago. I like the broadening out. Thats good. You did indicate that generals were retreating. Do you expect that to continue . The rankandfile will be moving up, but not the same for the previous leadership . I think that tech and Comp Services could take a pause. Look at the charts. They are parabolic. Not to say they are great stories. There are a lot of great themes with a. I. And cloud and cybersecurity. I get that. They had their days to shine and the valuations are a little more rich. They are crowded. When i look at earnings and i see Financial Services earnings grew 7 and industrial at 6 and he healthcare at 8 . That is attractive for those sectors. You and i talked last week and you were laughing at my picks. I was picking more cyclical names with eton and schwab. I still like those names. They have a long way to go. Today, i like target and exxon anddr horton. There is a lot to like that is not tech. Tech isnt magnificent seven. I was looking. Adobe is a quarter of a billion. They are under appreciated. Both reporting this week. Interesting . I think oracle is interesting. They just have inconsistent execution. The valuation is attractive. Obviously, they are in the whole cloud arena as well. I think it will probably be a good report. It has lagged the mag seven. I think within tech, there are other places to own. You know i liked ibm forever. That stock has done well. It is trading at 18 times forward. You do get Data Center Cloud and a. I. In that. I like cdw. You and i have talked about that, too. I think if you listen pto dell, the pc cycle is bottoming out. I like apple. I know the stock acts horribly, but it is more attractive now ahead of the april print when numbers have come down and expectations have come down. We know china is a disaster for them. They will fix that eventually. You have wwdc in june that comes. We will learn more about the a. I. Strategy. I think in the april quarter, you get another 90 billion buyback. How late were you up . Did you see best picture . What did your night look like, steph . I was asleep by then, but i was up early to watch iowa. Did you see the red carpet or anything . I did not. I will watch entertainment tonight to watch the reviews. It was on early. It was a little late. What was your favorite outfit . Sounds like you watched it for the outfits, joe. Did you like the barbie song . I saw that. What is his name . Phineas. She is only 22 or 21. I have interested parties in the house. Thanks, steph. They had me strapped in the couch. Did you watch . I did not. Just clips, my friend. Why . We have breaking news. We can come back. We have news on the i p po. Revealing more details in the filing. Leslie picker with more. Good morning, andrew. Reddit filing with the pricing details for marketing its ipo. 31 to 34 a share. They plan to sell 70 of the offering and shareholders and employees on the rest. The valuation range amounts to 5. 8 billion to 6. 4 billion. That is a 36 decline from the 10 billion valuation that reddit received in the 2021 private funding round. It calls itself a Global Digital city where 73 Million People collaborate with common interests. At the high end of the range, reddit is seeking eight times the sales where snap is trading at six times. Last year, 98 of the revenue generated from third parties advertising on the platform. The Company Recently signed a Licensing Agreement with google worth 60 million annually to share content to help train a. I. Models. 8 of the stock will be reserved as part of the socalled directed share program. This allows for qualified moderators and users and a few other types of people on the platform to buy in at the ipo price. Im told the company is aiming to set a final price next week and will debut the following day with the listing on nyrc as rddt. Looking through the filing. Alexis ohanian doesnt own more than 5 . I dont think so. The first filing came out and obviously the one that got a lot of attention was the ownership of sam altman. This filing shows those who are selling into the ipo. We didnt know that initially. You have Steve Huffman here selling 500,000 shares. You have some of the employees selling a combined 1. 3 million shares. None of the major vcs that own 5 appear to be selling here. It is more on the individual basis. This is a company thats been private since 2005. Nearly 19 years. They have a lot of people seeking liquidity. Given the allowance for liquidity on day one, i know it is not vcs, but what pressure do you expect to see on day one . How much harder does it make for the folks running the book, if you will . They have 8 of the shares allocated for the direct the share program. That allows more Retail Investors and moderators and users and friends and family, those types of people to buy in at the ipo price. You see the 8 level before. That is not out of the ordinary. I believe it was airbnb had something similar to that. Uber had less allowing more interest to come in buying the programs. Thats something that people were somewhat concerned about. How much are they allocating to more of a Retail Investor community as opposed to the Institution Investors with the concentrated book and can expect to hold on to it for longer. That dynamic is important here. In terms of the selling side, you have 22 million shares. Employees had to say if they are putting shares up or ownership up for sale in the ipo based on what was out there as the floating valuation idea. Thats part of the 30 of the 22 million shares sold is comprised of selling shareholders, including employees. Leslie picker, thank you. I appreciate it. Coming up, a big night for oppenheimer at the oscars winning awards in seven ca categcat categories. Up next, the biggest winners. As someone who was a changemaker means pushing the boundaries of innovation and a new vision of how business should be done around the world. I feel like i operate with grace, humility and execution and grit. Im not sure that can be defined by gender. 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When you sponsor a job, you immediately get your shortlist of quality candidates, whose resumes on indeed match your job criteria. Visit indeed. Com hire and get started today. Businesses go further with 5g solutions. Thats why they choose tmobile for business. Pga of america and tmobile are partnering on 5gpowered analytics to help improve player performance. Tmobiles Network Helps aaa stay connected nationwide. To get their members back on the road. And Las Vegas Grand Prix chose tmobile to help fuel operations for one of the Worlds Largest racing events. Now is the time to see what americas largest 5g network can do for your business. Welcome back to squawk box. The big winner was oppenheimer last night. We have matt belloni here with us. Take us inn sooiside the room. A big coronation for oppenheimer. All of the studios had the opportunity and universal took this on. They made almost 1 billion in theaters and now an Old Fashioned sweep at the oscars with seven wins. Its a huge win for Nbc Universal and comcast. Matt, when you look at the oscars this year and a period of time where the ratings were low and the idea that nobody was watching movies and everyone was disinterested. This was a pandemic situation. Do you think that has changed this year . I think so. We have seen award shows rise in the ratings across the board this season. Starting with the globes and dp going through the grammys. The oscars went up last year. Not nearly the hey day that used to watch. The ratings will go up this year. They did start an hour early, which was a challenge. If they dont go up with barbie and oppenheimer they may as well throw in the towel. Matt, i thought for a while the make good on sideways was going to happen for paul giamatti. I like to see the academy just drag kicking and screaming into not considering makeup or dei or any of that. There is no way not to gillve i to Cillian Murphy with that. The star of the big biopic movie, that actor tends to win best actor as well. The academy thought exactly what you were thinking. How do you honor this moveie as best of the year and win in all of these categories and not honor the center of the movie . Paul giamatti had the momentum, but it was clear that Cillian Murphy was going to win. Matt, explain how the voting works. We talk about the academy and i put the academy in quotes, has decided to give it to this person, but not this person. Dont they vote on each thing singularly and dont know what is happening on the other side in the moment . In the nominations phase, where they determine the nominations, the individual branches vote for the nominees. The actors vote for actors, editors vote for editors and everyone votes on best picture. For the actual winners in phase two, everybody votes on everything. There is a group thing out there where people talk to each other and theres advertising and Campaign Events and media appearances. You sort of start to have a group around town. That is where it narrows down to the faceoffs. Emma stone against lily gladstone. That went to emma stone. The oppenheimer movement was very strong. It never really waivwharf waver. Matt, do you think any of the streamers get a bump . Peacock has oppenheimer on it. Do you see a winner or see a song played and say im going to subscribes on is that too much . We will see. The major streamers, netflix and apple, were shutout. Netflix won one award in the shorts category and apple won nothing. Amazon won for american fiction. There is not a lot to crow about on this night. All of the movies that are plugged and promoted to the huge crowd, even barbie which get a bump on streaming. We have seen that in the past couple years on these movies that a lot of people have seen in theaters. We have to run. Mike tyson and jake paul fighting it out on netflix. Netflix said they were not doing sports. Wrestling and boxing. It is entertainment sports. Not live sports. The question is when they get into payperview. Im waiting to be netflix have the addon effect. They have the drama of sports. It is not technically sports. They see it as an advertising play. They want a new advertising tier to get excited about the stunt. That is why they havent done the payperview yet. What netflix is doing is a series of experiments. They are seeing the data on the events, tennis or golf or now boxing. They will change accordingly. Maybe they do payperview. I think ads is the movement right now. Matt belloni, thank you for staying up with us. Coming up on squawk box we will talk about the week ahead with the live shot of the capitol and the momentum building for a potential ban for tiktok. Thats next. Later, we talk to him about this. Former President Donald Trump will talk about tiktok and the economy and the race for the white usansohoe d much more. Squawk box is coming right back. Announcer executive edge is sponsored by at t business. Next level moments need the next level network. From rylees r hi this listing sounds incredible. Lets check it out. Says here it gets plenty of light. And this must be the ocean view . Of aruba . Huh. This listing is misleading. Well, when at t says we give businesses get our best deal, on the iphone 15 pro made with titanium. We mean it. Amazing. All my agents want it. Says here. inviting pool. Come on over too inviting. Only at t gives businesses our best deals on any iphone. Get iphone 15 pro on us. the future is not just going to happen. You have to make it. And if you want a successful business, all it takes is an idea, and now becomes the future where you grew a dream into a reality. The all new godaddy airo. Put your Business Online in minutes with the power of ai. Glp1 drugs used in weight loss treatments stand out as the biggest global blockbuster, but these treatments require cumbersome injections. With lexarias patented oral delivery technology, early studies suggest a better way. Lexaria bioscience. Fisher Investments its easy to think that all Money Managers are pretty much the same, early studies suggest a better way. But at Fisher Investments were clearly different. other money manager different how . You sell High Commission investment products, right . Fisher Investments nope. Fisher avoids them. other money manager well, you must earn commissions on trades. Fisher Investments never at Fisher Investments. other money manager ok, then you probably sneak in some hidden and layered fees. Fisher Investments no. We structure our fees so we do better when clients do better. That might be why most of our clients come from other Money Managers. At Fisher Investments, were clearly different. Good morning. Welcome back to squawk box. Were live at the Nasdaq Market site in times area. The dow is off 80 points. The nasdaq is looking to open higher 17 points. Joe. Momentum building in congress to ban tiktok unless the Chinese Parent Company divests. We have our washington correspondent Emily Wilkins here with us. You lost . We will get to washington much like the lawmakers. Thats the way to do it. Same. No tsa precheck. The wifi was good on the way up. The food. Bison chili. That or oysters. Bold moves. We expect the tiktok bill vote on wednesday in the house. We saw it go through committee and we saw it pass 500. That is not common for any piece of legislation that has the controversy that tiktok has around it. It is interesting to see the margins in the house. I was talking last week with chairman mike gallagher. The head of the committee on the ccp. He said the house is strong and we hope to get a vote in the senate and biden said he will sign it. It is surprising how quickly this bill has moved. That raises questions of the challenges and could it slowdown in the senate. What does divestiture mean . That is how lawmakers are pitching it. 165 days for tiktok to find another buyer and go off somewhere else. This raised questions about what a sale would look like and who would be the potential buyer. Certainly, you see that trickle into the politics of it as well. Tiktok said that is not enough time for us, but talking with mike gallagher, he said tiktok knew this was coming. They knew we had problems. They knew we had issue with the Parent Company bytedance and we wanted to divest. Do you think this gets signed . Not necessarily. You have seen concerns raised with the tiktok bill. First amendment. Freedom of speech platform. That has tanked other efforts to ban tiktok in the past. Then this bill actually names tiktok. That can wind up with a couple of legal issues for them calling the company out the way they do. Law mmakers say this is not jus tiktok, but it could apply to other apps. They dont have an answer with other apps right now. In your heart of hearts, dont you feel uncomfortable . Im trying to not im not using my brain. Strange bed fellows way i have questions about tiktok and the kids no, i dont. Want a ban . No, no, no. I thought you want to ban it. No. All about security . All of the people running around i know. The biden campaign. The default mode. My default mode is let things fall where they may. I cant believe you are not there. Let things fall . My issue from the getdo from the time of the last administration began with this situation is it is unclear to me whether this was actually a National Security concern. You dont want to ban it. We are on the same side . I have never fundamentally believed the ccp is taking the data what data is being taken if it is taken . I have never found that. Point to the tiktok algorithm. It is as successful as it is due to the strong algorithm and that is powered with data. Americans data. They raised concerns of what they have done with the data in the past and targeted journalists. I think there was a shock to capitol hill last week when tiktok sent a push notification to the users and said congress is trying to ban tiktok. Call your lawmakers. Lawmakers were flooded. A lot of them had phones go straight to voicemail. A lot of teenagers and didnt know what they were talking about. It freaked them out that tiktok could with one move put out a push notification. What do you think of the Kellyanne Conway lobbying for tiktok . There is a reason they crafted a bill after remember when the tiktok ceo came to the hill and both sides had strong push back. It is taking that long to get to a bill because they had to make sure. What is happening with the american investors in bytedance . We had bill ford on who runs general atlantic. He is on the board of the company. Right. He got mad about the questions. It is a huge question as to what happens with american investors. Lawmakers talk about a National Security issues and the legality of it and the money aspect of it. We have seen that play into trumps recent comments on tiktok and facebook. Emily, thank you. When we come back, more on squawk box. Sam altman has rejoined the board of openai after the ouster last year. The ga asand soap opera. We will have the details after the break. With its customizable options chain, easytouse tools and paper trading to help sharpen your skills, you can stay on top of the market from wherever you are. E trade from Morgan Stanley. vo what does it mean to be rich . Maybe rich is less abouthe mareaching a magic number. And more about discovering magic. Rich is being able to keep your loved ones close. And also send them away. Rich is living life your way. And having someone who can help you get there. The key to being rich is knowing what counts. 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The summary into the investigation by the outside law firm found altman did not do anything last year to justify the original firing. First, the Board Members sued the former ceo of the bill and Melinda Gates foundation and the general counsel at sony and the ceo of instacart and former facebook executive and three current Board Members are sticking around. Brett taylor and Larry Summers and adam deangelo. As to the investigation of the fi firing is light on details. Here is what it is saying. The big one. Altmans behavior did not justify the firing by the previous board. They will adopt the governance guidelines, but it is unclear if they nix the nonprofit. Also events leading up to the firing of altman which said the prior board had the authority to fire him and believed it would help with internal management challenges by doing so. Like i said, the board did not realize the disruption to the company that the firing would cause. The understatement of the year. The firing had nothing to do with a. I. Safety or the Company Finances or statements to investors, things like. That we found out the s. E. C. Was looking into that as well. Basically, it was a breakdown in the relationship with altman and the old board. The New York Times reported that the concerns of the altman management style before the board fired him. The board drama appears to be over for now, but still plenty of questions remain about the governance and what happened that made the board think they needed to fire him and so forth. How important do you think it is for the public from a trust perspective to understand this . Is this the juournalista . In the short run, theres the narrative which got away from the board and the original board, that is. Remember the news first broke and all of the signs that oh, he was going too fast and moving and developing a. I. Too quickly. There were things about the management style and rumors. Those will remain until they come out and say specifically what happened. If they are okay with the conversations happening, it seems they are, it will continue. The interesting thing is the governance. What does that mean . Will they change the structure of the organization or what . I know we have to go. One of the most important people inside the company doesnt seem to not be mentioned and no one knows if he is staying or going. There are talks he is in conversations he is staying. That seems significant. That is more significant than all of the other issues. He was at the center of the complaints with altman. Who knows what his role is right n now. He is like a ghost employee. Thank you. Coming up, the nvidia 5. 5 drop in the market spoking inve spooking investors. We will talk to one of the analysts next. What do you know about rock stars . Billy idol . I mean wheres the skintight leather . My shoes are leather. Wheres the unnecessary zippers . That thing billy, rock star is just how doug feels when he uses workday. Thanks, rory. Ill show you rock star be a finance and hr rock star. Workday. For a changing world. Billy idol just stole your golf cart theyre waiting for you. Hey, do you have a second . Theyre all expecting more. More efficiency. More benefits. More growth. When you realize you can give your people everything, and more. Thank you very much. [applause] ask, now what . Heres what. You go with prudential to protect, empower and grow. With everything you need to deliver, you guessed it. More. One more thing. Whos your rock . Learn more at prudential. Com nvidia stock is up more than 80 this year alone. Our next guest has a 1,400 price target and buy right on the stock, highest on the street. Here is rosenberg Senior Research analyst. Hans, great to have you with us. The 10 intraday drop record high to the closing loes on friday. Im wondering i know this is a technical signal, but does that concern you at all in terms of how its positioned . Well, were a little volatile here as some players are going through the remnants of the down cycle. Last week broadcom and marvel broaderbased semiconductor plays, some parts of the market still weak. Some of these stocks have shot up aggressively, so some profit taking. But i think the nvidia gtc in a couple weeks we like the story and certainly into the year. What do you think will be announced there . Well, theres going to be a significant amount of debt, not just on the product side, the gpu, compute side acceleration and the Software Side. Thats an element of the story that over time is more important than the hardware. The software stack, the technology and investors will realize this is a soft ip play longterm on ai, not just hardware. Yeah. I think that what they havent necessarily communicated too well to investors is this notion that once you buy that gpu for ai youre also on the hook for the Software Side of it. Youre buying into an ecosystem do you think jenson hong will be able to sell that at this event . Hes been selling it for years. Are investors going to buy it at the event . Well, i think that its a matter of little by little. And people realize that this is not just, you know, a quick cycle. This is the mother of all cycles youve been calling it. And theyre the tip of the spear. The Software Side of the business is one that probably could be about half the business by the end of the decade. So its huge. And obviously thats all profits coming from royalties, subscriptions and son on. You mentioned marvels specifically, disappointment and broadcom. People would overlook that to your point, they are broader semiconductor plays and not necessarily the nvidia story. Yet we had the contagion felt in the space. Does that signal to you there may be investor just concern about how far semis broadly have run. Yeah. I think we got a little ahead of ourselves. There are parts of business this cycle is different. It came in waves in terms of how it went down and how theyre coming back. Marvel and broadcom got nvidia love on the ai side since the beginning of the year. Got a little ahead of itself. About half the business is still going through the throes of this down cycle, probably another quarter. I dont look at that something thats fundamentally wrong. Marvel and broadcom are doing custom basics. Not everybody can use nvidia for their workloads in the data center and enterprise. All right. Hans, well leave it there. Thank you so much. 1400 price target on nvidia. Coming up, former President Trump will join us at 7 30 a. M. Eastern. Well talk about his view on the economy, his campaign and a lot more. Squawk box coming right back. I wanna hold you forever hey little bear bear. Im gonna love you forever cmon, bear. You dont. You dont have to worry. Be by your side. Ill be there. With my arms wrapped around. Hey you, with the small business. Whoa. Youve got all kinds of bright ideas, that your customers need to know about. Constant contact makes it easy. With everything from managing your social posts, and events, to email and sms marketing. Constant contact delivers all the tools you need to help your business grow. Get started today at constantcontact. Com constant contact. Helping the small stand tall. Good morning. Breaking news this hour, former President Donald Trump is going to be with us, joining us, at 7 30 a. M. Eastern time, right here, in a wideranging interview about his campaign, his view of the economy and so much more. Plus, a very big week for the markets. Wall street coming off a losing week, making its worst performance since october. Were going to find out if this is the beginning of a pullback after a strong run for equities, infrags data and a read on the consumer and jobless claims will be a key focus for investors in the days ahead. Were going to discuss that all as the second hour of squawk box begins right now. Good morning and welcome back to squawk box here on cnbc. Im joe kernen along with Andrew Ross Sorkin and melissa lee is in for becky this morning. Well take a quick look at the futures. Earlier i know the dow was down. Its paired its indicated losses by about half now down 41 points or so. Nasdaq indicated higher. Treasuries, yields have been falling a little bit since we have seen some of this data thats come in in the past week or so. 408, up a little this morning. And then crypto and bitcoin above 70,000 now. Got to 72 at one point. 71. 5, up about 3 . In the next hour, micro strategy executive chairman Michael Sailer is going to join us to discuss the move in bitcoin. Lets talk about whats making headlines this hour. The road show for reddit closely watched new York Exchange debut kicks off today. Company filing for its ipo earlier this morning and now expecting to offer 22 million shares at a price of between 31 and 34 a share. So well be watching that over the coming weeks. In the meantime, the Justice Department is now launched a criminal probe of the door panel blowout on that Alaska Airlines flight in january. Investigators reportedly contacted passengers and crew on that boeing 737 max 9 jet. Phil lebeau will be with us in just a bit to discuss this story. Universal pictures, oppenheimer winning best picture and six others oscars in last nights 96th academy awards. Best actor and best director. There was a whole there were so many. We should also mention that oppenheimer is a film owned by Parent Company of this network. Bank of america second consumer Robert Downey jr. , too. Oh, yes. Supporting. Bank of america second consumer check point of 2024 is out and its a soft spending momentum. But total spending rose 2. 9 following. 2 decline. Lets bring in head of the bank of america institute. Liz, great to have you with us. Soft but stable overall. But im wondering how that is differentiated between the income cohorts. Sure, yes. And great to be here. Sorry i cant be there with you in person this morning because im down at the bank of america consumer and retail conference which is kicking off today. But, as you said, the headline number was up 2. 9 in february. But really what was doing most of the work there was the extra day of leap year. So, if you were to control for that and we looked at seasonably adjusted month over month spending, it was up. 4, real rebound from the down. 3 number in january. But as you pointed out, i think that the issue there is really a rebound. It wasnt a leap. And to your question, about who is doing the spending, what really jumped out to me in our data the most was the moderation in spending of lower and middle income households. Because remember, lower and middle income households were really outperforming for much of 2023. And whats interesting is when you look at the fundamentals that are driving lower and middle income households, you look at wage growth. Wage growth in february, the way that we look at it in terms of the actual money coming into consumer deposit accounts was up 3. 4 . Thats the highest number through all of 2023. When you look at checking and savings balances, those are stable at 40 higher than where they were back in 2019 before the pandemic. Yet, the lower income and the middle income consumer is moderating their spending, which certainly creates some questions. Really i think driven by whats going on with consumer sentiment. Now, if we were to contrast that to whats going on with higher income consumers. Higher income consumers arent benefitting from wage growth. Their wage growth declined in our data again. And really over the last year theyve been relatively flat. Yet, their consumer their sentiment, if you look at michigan, continues to increase. And why do we think that is . I think its really a function of which households are invested in the market. We talk about whats going on in the market. The market has obviously done well. Thats the real driver. But for lower and middle income consumers, theyre not participating as much. And therefore, the sentiment is a little bit lower and were seeing them moderate their spending. The wealth effect when it comes to the gains in the stock market is really felt by the higher income households which makes sense therefore theyre sort of holding up better in the spending game. Absolutely. And impressivingly when we break down the higher income consumer, higher income consumer we define as the top third, which is above 120,000 in household income. But there is a real dichotomy there between the highest of high income consumers. So those households making 600 and above, versus those that are just high income making 120,000 and above. And really the difference there, the spending growth is coming almost really exclusively from the highest of high income households. Their sentiment certainly better. Again, those would be the households we think are really participating more in the financial markets. What i thought was also interesting was buy now pay later. And that youre still seeing that go on. Im wondering if you can give us any sort of color in terms of who is employing buy now pay later maybe the credit quality of those using it increasingly is lower, those are people more strapped on a paycheck to paycheck basis and choosing to spread out their payments. Absolutely. So we are still seeing growth in utilization of buy now pay later. In terms of little under 9 of bank of america consumer deposit holders actually are you did a buy now pay later transaction in february. But, whats interesting is that pace of that growth has halved, relative to last year. And the people who are really slowing down higher income consumers, they were essentially flat. So were seeing the growth come from the lower income households relative to the higher income households. The other thing i thought was really interesting that we saw in our data was that retail spending by those people who are using bnpl, that has been accelerating faster than those who arent. Right . So to your point, maybe buy now pay later is really supporting the retail spending of those folks. But, the pace at which theyre spending, spending growth is happening, that has come down in the last month. So that may not be the buoy that it had been in 2023. Liz, thank you for joining us. Great to see you. Thanks. Coming up, former President Donald Trump joins us live at 7 30 a. M. Eastern. Well discuss his campaign and the economy and much more. But up next, Institutional Shareholder Services offering up a number of options from Voting Policy choices ahead of proxy season. Iss, global head of the investment stewardship will join us right after the break this morning. Coming right back. Lets check it out. Says here it gets plenty of light. And this must be the ocean view . Of aruba . Huh. This listing is misleading. Well, when at t says we give businesses get our best deal, on the iphone 15 pro made with titanium. We mean it. Amazing. All my agents want it. Says here. inviting pool. Come on over too inviting. Only at t gives businesses our best deals on any iphone. Get iphone 15 pro on us. dad, dont forget about my new cleats. Sweetie, i cant make it to dicks this week. Have you heard of dicks. Com . Have i heard of dicks. Com . Girl lets go lets go have i heard of dicks. Com . screaming whoa. Dont overthink it. Lets go shopping. Actually what i need are some cleats. How about one of these . Great. Done. Anything else . No. Golf clubs . Not for me, for a friend. Yeah, yeah, of course. Anyone impressed with how fast that was . Yeah, totally i know, i went to dicks. My cleats thank you i love you wha. Ii went to dicks. Com. Ever heard of it . Girl 2 yeah, i told you about that. business. Girl 2 yeah its not a ninetofive about tha proposition. Its all day and into the night. Its all the things that keep this world turning. Its the gotos that keep us going. The places we cheer. Trust. Hang out. And check in. They all choose the advanced Network Solutions and round the clock partnership from comcast business. Powering more businesses than anyone. Powering possibilities. You can make money the hard way as a bullfighter or a human cannonball. Or save money the easy way, with xfinity mobile. Existing customers can get a free line of our most popular unlimited plan for a year not only will you save hundreds but youll also be joining millions who have connected to americas most reliable 5g network. Sure is a lot safer than becoming a stuntman for money. Get a free line of unlimited intro for a year when you buy one unlimited line. Visit xfinitymobile. Com today to learn more. Welcome back to squawk box this morning. The proxy season Institutional Shareholder Services is now predicting three key trends when it comes to Voting Policy choices. Board accountability, esg and Artificial Intelligence shareholder proposals. Joining us right now is iss global head of investment stewardship lorraine kelly. Good morning to you. Thank you for having me. Its great to have you. You know, i dont know if the public understands how much influence you have over Corporate America in so many ways given how you what your recommendations are around Board Governance and the like, but it is vast and it is big. Lets talk about esg, because that has been sort of the canary in the coal mines the topic du jour all the time and you are shifting i dont know shifting, but offering a new product of sorts. So, let me first start by saying thank you for being here. But the comment on influence we dont believe that we have the influence. Its really about Institutional Investors. So our Business Model is that we offer research and recommendations through the lens of a Voting Policy and investors make those vote decisions. Happy to chat about esg we can talk about your influence in a moment. Esg seems to be the news right now. Absolutely. So what i wanted to comment on is that we offer voting choice. Weve offered multiple voting policies. We always have. What you read about in the newspaper is our benchmark or our house view. But we offer other policies as well, such as catholic values, sustainability, global board. In keeping with that theme, we determined were going to offer a policy from a Company Called boyer research, which is self described as esg skeptical because we believe that that meets a need of the marketplace. What does that mean in practice . What does the policy mean in practice . What does the policy mean in practice. So pretend im an institutional investor, i subscribe to your services and i get the esg skeptic recommendation, everybody or just those who pay for it . Again, if an investor chooses to use iss, they will sect a policy that meets their needs. In this particular case, sit a boyer research policy, so its actually not an iss product, andrew. But it is a policy that we will implement on their behalf. What does that mean for them . Right. I think boyer research would be best to describe their own policy, but they are really not supporting the majority of the esg proposals that are going to be on the ballot this year. So theyre going to support maybe 5 in comparison, the iss benchmark or house view, which is pretty centrist, supports about 50 . How much of this is about the investment thesis, the actual underlying investment thesis of whats going to actually get you to a better return longterm versus Something Else . And how do you think about that in the context of this new product . So, the investment thesis is something we leave to the investors, frankly. And when we work with the investors right. They help articulate what their philosophies and their programs are. Can i interject. This goes to at the top, you say we dont have this influence. I would make an argument, you can disagree with this argument, i actually think its unfortunate but its the truth and i understand how the world works. That a lot of Institutional Investors effectively outsource their investment philosophies on governance to you. Thats why theyre hiring you. And a lot of folks get the iss recommendation and theyre able to then turn around to their investors and say well, pensioners and everybody else, we did what iss did and thats an easier way rather than us have thousands of people who are going to work for us who are going to look at every single stock and every Single Company and figure out the governance, were not going to do that. Theres this other Company Called iss. Thats what they do. And were going to let them tell us what to do and thats how were going to run things. I dont think its a fair expla explanation. Thats why i think you have the influence you do even if you dont want to believe it. I dont think thats whats happening. I think we enable investors. So investors will come to us. Again, its not one view that were offering. Its a multitude of views. Theyre going to pick that policy. The majority of large investors come to us and we implement their house views, their custom policies. So they established their views and their perspectives. We then provide a Research Report that collates all the data takes them through the framework and gives them that recommendation. Ten years from now if we go back and look at Stock Performance on these esg companies with esg proposals and companies without, what do you think were going to see . Well, thats an interesting comment because on the esg proposals and the esg shareholder proposals this year, and you know, we have seen record numbers of them in terms of the volume, but we are seeing less investor support. So, there is a disconnect there. Theyre not happening. No. Its at 16 as of last year. And what do you think the distinction is between u. S. Investors and european investors . Because one of the things that you used to hear from larry fink all the time, one of the reasons they were offering all sorts of different esg products and the like was this idea that they were getting pushed from frankly european investors originally to think this way. I think there is definitely, if you speak broadly, more of an esg mindset in europe. And i think that the u. S. Tends to be more about financial materiality on these factors. Right. There are certainly areas within the u. S. That are very proesg as well. You can see that maybe the european stance can go a little bit whacky. Did you see john kerrys comments last week . If you can get to a person he actually was designated to be forming our policy in this country, and he said maybe wed putin would be we would forgive him for what happened in ukraine if he cut his emissions. Youre getting to the point where youre not really thinking too clearly. And i think that happens a lot with esg, does it not . Yeah. I think investors are thinking clearly. I dont think investors are looking at that because they have to, you know theyre answering to their underlying beneficial owners, right, if its an investment owner. The United States have a lot of money at retirement, that would be do you think there should be a restriction a greater restriction on the ability to put forth these esg proposal or any proposal based on having a modicum of shares three shares. Right. I think thats issue for the s. E. C. I think if you look at the numbers, though, you can see that those proposals have significantly increased. As i said, the but do you think thats good for your business because you have to opine on all of those things. Im asking you from a policy perspective, do you think thats a good thing or bad thing . If you were the s. E. C. , which tried to democratize business in some way. I dont know if democratizing all this is such a great thing. Is it . As i said, i think its good for your business. But is it actually good for business . I fundamentally think its an s. E. C. Issue. When you say its good for our business the s. E. C. Called you and said, what do you think . Do you think we should put in a Stronger Program effectively that says you need to own x percent of the company before you can make a proposal. And that was how it used to be. Yes. Right . Do you think that was better or worse . Do you think its better or worse now . In what way in terms of the business outcome. My sense is that you will probably see it go back to a certain extent depending on what we see moving forward because there are so many issues in this space now. Investors as well, are not voting for many of these or supporting many of these because they are not theyre not good for longterm they are not linked to longterm shareholder value. Right. And in many cases they are far too, you know, prescriptive. Right. Lorraine, thank you for joining us this morning. Its fascinating. Appreciate it. Thank you very much. Thank you. Coming up, the Justice Department has opened a criminal investigation into the boeing 737 max plug blowout on an ak arc airlines flight. We have the details next. Then, former President Donald Trump will join us live to discuss the economy, geopolitics and much more. Take a look at futures, we have turned negative across the board. S p 500 just barely positive right now. Nasdaq lose half a point here as we approach the open year on this monday. Ay tedstun. Youre watching squawk box on cnbc. Its odd how in an instant things can transform. Slipping out of balance into freefall. the stock market is now down 23 . This is happening people. Where there are so few certainties. laughing look around you. You deserve to know. As we navigate a future unknown. Im glad i found stability amidst it all. Gold. Standing the test of time. Saudi arabia oil giant aram moe reporting 20 decline in profit to 121. 3 billion in 2023. It attributed the decrease to lower volume and crude price as well as tighter margins for refining and chemical products. The company boosting base dividend by 4 and performance by 9 resulting in 30 billion payday. Meantime, lets get over to phil lebeau. The doj now opened a criminal investigation into the Alaska Airlines 737 blowout. Nice to see you this morning, mr. Lebeau. What a story. Reporter it is a story, andrew. When this first broke over the weekend, by the way, first reported by the wall street journal, a number of people said, well, are they looking specifically at the door plug blowout or looking at boeing . And its a little bit of both. Here is what we know based on our conversations with a number of people who are surrounding these events. First of all, the doj is investing the Alaska Airlines door plug blow out. Theyre looking at that event, part of that is interviewing alaska crew members as well as passengers. And there is a review of boeing that is part of a broader review. Well explain that in just a little bit. Remember, were over two months now since we had that incident, which the ntsb has already filed an initial conclusion of, saying that there were four bolts not in the door plug when it was ripped off midair. Those plugs were not put in as part of the manufacturing process at boeing. By the way, the ntsb probe is not finalized. That continues. In fact; they have been critical of boeing in terms of being slow to provide certain information. As for Alaska Airlines, we reached out to the airline and it says in an event like this, its normal for the doj to be conducting an investigation. Were fully cooperating and do not believe we are the target of the investigation. The target is widely believed to be boeing and it ties back into the 737 max crash investigation by the doj in 2019 20 and 21. They settled that in 2021 at a cost of 2. 5 billion. Part of the agreement in that settlement was to avoid any criminal charges over the next three years. In other words, if you kept your nose clean, there would be no criminal charges. There was a threeyear period there. Were within that threeyear period. As we look at shares of boeing, we should also tell you we reached out to the company. It has no comment regarding this doj investigation. As for the department of justice, as is typical, guys, they will not comment about an on going investigation nor will they acknowledge that an investigation is taking place. Bottom line is this, for boeing, the risk here is substantial, guys, because if the doj comes back and says, look, part of the settlement here was you had to keep everything clean. You couldnt have any situations develop that would say, we really arent paying attention to the terps of the agreement of the settlement. Therefore there could be criminal charges. Or, further finds with the doj. So that is the real challenge and the real potential problem for boeing in all of this. Phil, just quickly, would it be criminal charges that would not be, you know, on the table for the past crashes in addition to the door blowout . Or just the door blowout . Good question. Melissa, we dont know for sure. It could be both. It could be neither of them ultimately. It could bethat there is an amended settlement coming off of the 2021 agreement. All right, phil, thanks. Phil lebeau. Coming up after the break, former President Donald Trump on his bid for the white house, the state of the economy, thoughts on bidenomics and soucmo. lbeig back. Re you know doug, ever since switching to workday youve been a real rock star. Rock star . What do you know about rock stars . Billy idol . I mean wheres the skintight leather . My shoes are leather. Wheres the unnecessary zippers . That thing billy, rock star is just how doug feels when he uses workday. Thanks, rory. Ill show you rock star be a finance and hr rock star. Workday. For a changing world. Billy idol just stole your golf cart welcome back to squawk box. Were getting ready for our interview with former President Donald Trump. In the meantime, here are the futures this morning. I think that theres some reportedly some inflation data coming tomorrow, which will be closely watched following the jobs report we had on friday. There you can see not a whole lot. The dow jones paired its losses to some extent, but still negative. In fact, everything is in the red at this point. Joining us on the set, jay clayton, former s. E. C. Chairman and a cnbc contributor. Someone who will join us interviewing the former president , who you work for, know fairly well. I think you have a pretty good feel for the Regulatory Environment that we had under former President Trump and what we have right now. Uhhuh, uhhuh. Look, i think the Regulatory Environment under a future President Trump would emphasize growth. And not sacrificing Consumer Protection or competition or those core values of regulation. But theres no doubt that this country is going to need growth given our debt position. Exactly. I believe on the squawk newsline we are joined by former president , donald j. Trump, djt 45. Its good to welcome you. Its been a while, mr. President. Good morning. Nice to be with you. This is the first interview ive been told since you became the presumptive nominee. Im not sure that prior to last week you werent already the presumptive nominee, but i think this is your first interview since the state of the union as well. So, can we just start with your vision for this country after watching the state of the union. How does it differ from what you heard from President Biden, President Trump . Well, i heard a very angry man who is losing badly in the polls. Who is willing to weaponize government like has never taken place in this country. It has taken place in third world countries, quite often actually. And theyre willing to use the Justice Department to sue opponents, like me, because im his only opponent other than life, life itself. And frankly, i serve a very angry and confused man. I assume hes going to be the candidate. I think it probably maybe was a terrible performance, but i think it was probably good enough to get him over the heap, to get him over the you know, the barrier as to whether or not hes going to be their nominee. I was saying that for a long time i find it hard to believe, but i think he probably ill. And well see what happens. But it was really a speech on division and hate more than anything else. Talking about snickers, you dont want to really talk about snickers, even though its true. They put a little bit less in the bag. But you have more interesting examples of inflation and other things that he was trying to point out than that. You have a lot of you have a lot of big League Things you can talking about like Energy Prices through the roof and food prices through the roof. But, you know, it was probably the worst state of the union ever made, according to many. Thats not according to me. Although according to me it was also. But i havent heard too many of them. There are stark policy differences, obviously, mr. President. But one thing that i think that at least the perception is that theres not a whole lot of difference between what you think we should do with entitlements or nondiscretionary spending and what President Biden is proposing. Its almost a third rail of politics. And weve got, what, a 33, 34 trillion total debt built up. And very little we can do in terms of cutting spending discretionary is not going to help. Have you changed your outlook on how to handle entitlements, Social Security, medicare, medicaid, mr. President . Seems like something has to be done or else were going to be stuck at 120 of debt to gdp forever. So, first of all, there is a rot you can do in terms of entitlements, in terms of cutting and in terms of also the theft and the bad management of entit entitlements. Tremendous bad management of entitlements. Tremendous amounts of things numbers of things you can do. So i dont necessarily agree with the statement. I know that theyre going to end up weakening Social Security because the country is weak. Lets look at outside of the stock market, our what were going through hell, people are going through hell. I believe the number is 50 . They say 32 and 33 . I believe we have accumulative inflation of over 50 . That means people are, you know, have to make more than 50 more over a fairly short period of time to stay up. Theyve gotten routed. The middle class in our country has been routed. And the middle class largely built our country. And they have been treated very, very badly with policy. When i was president , i was doing a job we were going to start to pay off debt. We were drill baby, drill. We were producing oil but we were going at a much higher level. Oil and gas, we were doing we were third when i started. And when i ended, we were won by a long shot and very close, energy independent. We were very close to becoming energy dominant, joe. We were going to be dominant. So dominant like double what saudi arabia and russia were doing. And we were on that path. We were going to be paying down debt. We were doing a lot of things. Then we got hit with covid. We did a fantastic job with covid. But nobody nobody wins with covid. I guess china found that out because they also really got hit very hard also. But nobody wins with covid. So we had to get we had to do other things. We had to help you know, if we didnt if i didnt do the expenditures, if we didnt do the kinds of things we did for the economy, we would have had a 1929type depression. I had to stay out in front of it. We did. We did a great job with that and with all of the things, coming up with regeneron and doing so much else. Getting all because we had empty when i came in, we had empty i call them empty cupboards. We had empty shelves. We didnt have equipment. We didnt are the gowns. We didnt have the ventilators. We didnt have anything. This country wasnt prepared for a thing like that. Im not blaming in anybody on that. When it came, nobody thought a pandemic would ever happen again. It sounds like an ancient problem, not a problem that you have in you know, at the time. Very modern a very modern age. It was like an ancient thing. Who would ever so im not blaming anybody for that. But we had empty cupboards. I got them stocked. And i got them stocked fast. And we did a great job with it. Never got credit. I got credit for the greatest economy. I got credit for Foreign Policy. I got credit for knocking out isis and not going into wars. Right. But we beat isis. But i never got the credit for having done a great job with that. Mr. President some day i think history will give us the credit. Im sorry to interrupt. Jay clayton is here. I know you worked with jay. Jay was at the s. E. C. I want to get jay to talk to you about regulation, et cetera. But before i turn it over to jay, i just wanted to ask you about something very specific for regulation. And that is, bitcoin. And i have in the past i dont know if you recall, but i said you got to get you have to look at this closely, mr. President. And you know, the current s. E. C. Commissioner, gary gensler finally allowed for this spot ets and now we see bitcoin at almost 72,000. But its almost as if its in spite of some of the efforts over regulation of maybe the Biden Administration. Do you have any thoughts now on crypto . I do Little Things sometimes for fun. And you know, make money with it. But i have fun with it, too. You mean you bought bitcoin . No, no, no. Sometimes well let people pay through bitcoin or well let people get involved in a new you know, if you think of it, its an additional form of currency. I used to say, you know i want one currency. I want the dollar. I dont want people leaving the dollar. I feel that way. But i will tell you, it has taken on a life. I did a thing that people smile at, but it was wild. We did 1,000 sneakers. So limited Edition Sneaker run. The last one and you can go through you know our crazy new currencies. Because thats what i call them. Crazy new, whether its bitcoin or others. And so many people were buying these things. Ultimately the last pair of sneakers sold for approximately i hear, 450,000. It was a limited edition. A run. They were gold. And we thought it was just very small thing. It was a branding thing. And it was i had a good time with it. The last pair sold for 450,000. People were going crazy for these sneak eers. You probably were, too. Everybody was. Every friend i have has called me for a pair of sneakers. So it just took off. And i notice that so many of them were paid for with this with the new currency. The crypto. Its a new crypto, yeah. Crypto currency. And i couldnt believe the amount. And im saying, you know, this thing has really and other things i do. People are using it. And you know, i would be im very much a traditionalist. I like staying with the dollar. You know that from when i was there. Make the dollar the choice. I hate when countries go off the dollar. I would not allow countries to go off the dollar because when we lose that standard, that will be like losing a revolutionary war. That will be a hit to our country just like losing a war. And we cant let that happen. And too many countries now are fighting to get off the dollar. And frankly i know jay feels strongly about this, and jay did a fantastic job, by the way. In a group where theres always scandal and problems, jay went through four years. There wasnt one scandal i dont know, jay, maybe you can tell me, but there wasnt one scandal. That is the most scandalous position because it involves massive amounts of money. With jay clayton, we had no scandals. Zero, nothing whatsoever. So i thought it was great. But i have seen i have seen there has been a lot of use of that. And im not sure that i want to take it away at this point. Yeah. Hey, mr. President. Thank you for that. That was nice. Before you came on, i was saying to joe, look, your regulatory agenda in a second term would be one of progrowth. Not anticonsumer. Not anticompetition but pro growth. Right. Correct. Mostly because we dont have a lot of fiscal tools left. Do you want to talk about the progrowth agenda that you had in the last term . Yeah. Number one, we dont have a choice. It has to be growth. Its not like we have a choice. It would be nice to say lets get nice and conservative and lets not grow. If we dont grow, you know, we have 35 trillion out there. We have to grow our way out of it more than anything else. But we also have to cut spending. And we can cut spending. Theres massive amounts of waste. Look, we give Foreign Countries trillions and trillions of dollars a year. And when you want to cut them, youre met with levels its crazy. When you want to cut some of these Foreign Countries, many of whom dont like us, many of whom almost all of whom takes advantage everybody takes advantage of the United States. I have that very much stopped. But they very much take advantage of the United States. China until i came along, china was killing us. China was taking out 300 and in terms of numbers, you know, were just its 507 billion a year. Now under biden its worse. Its gotten much worse. And its you cant no country can sustain. We cant sustain that. When somebody when a country just rips us off like china, then what i did is tariff. They were forcing Companies Back to the United States. We want those companies to go to china and many other countries, not only china. The European Union rips us almost as bad as china but they do it with a smile. Nobody thinks of the European Union that way. Oh, theyre wonder mfl they really take advantage of us. Until i came along, they took advantage of us militarily, as you know. Nato was a total disaster for us. We were paying almost so think of it. European union, paying almost all the military. We were paying close to 100 until i came along. I said im not doing it. Youre going to have to pay. Were not doing it anymore. They said would you protect us if you dont. If youre delinquent. They said yes. If youre delinquent youre not going to be protected. 400 billion came in like clock work. Obama, bush, everybody else they did absolutely nothing. Mr. President , i just wanted to ask you, though, you also talked about proposing a 10 tariff, if you will. Yeah. I wanted to ask you about that because the Center Action forum, a think tank, said that they thought the plan would, quote, distort global trade, discourage Economic Activity and have broad negative consequences for the u. S. Economy. Well, theyre wrong. It would distort international trade. It would bring it back to the United States. We have companies if you look at if you look at india, you look at china, you look at so many different countries, theyre smart. Much smarter than our country. We were getting ready to do this. And we were i had it just about set. But you dont think it results in higher prices for American Families . By some estimates it would be the ekwi lent of 2,000 a family, according to economists . No. I think it will i think taxes could be cut. I think other things could happen to more than adjust that. But im a big believer in tariffs. Number one, i fully believe in them economically. When youre being taken advantage of by other countries. For example, china was taking advantage of us on the steel. They were destroying our entire Steel Industry which was never doing very well over the last 25 years any way. But because its been eaten alive by foreign competition. And they were dumping steel. I put a 50 tax on china steel coming in and every person in the Steel Industry when they see me they started crying. They would hug me. They would kiss me. Sir, you saved our industry. I put a strong, 50 tariff on, on dumping steel, when they dump steel. And by the way, nothing was perfect. Frankly the tariff should have been higher. I was getting ready to do that, by the way. Mr. President tariff should have been highered. Saved a whole this saved a whole industry. One thing, let me say, beyond the economics. Uhhuh. It gives you power in dealing with other countries because china would come in and say, no, no more tax. No more tax. They were absolutely fine for me to deal with because they were so petrified of me putting on additional tariffs. And we dont use that. China is right now our boss. They are the boss of the United States. Almost like were subsidiary of china. And thats because the Biden Administration has been so weak. Mr. President , is there no concern that china could impose retaliatory tariffs or retaliatory reactions that would make doing business in china difficult on china its okay. Its okay . Tell starbucks, mcdonalds, it will be more difficult to do business there . Sure. They didnt do it with me. They went through years and they didnt do it with me. And they never pulled that trigger. Thats a big trigger for them to pull. But even if they do, let American Companies come back to america. Look, if you want to sell a car in china, you cant. Okay. You have to put a they pay you pay a massive tax or massive tariff. If we make our because we cant sell in china, they charge tremendous tariffs. Well, theyre very mart. Theyre saying, come over to this country. Look at apple. Ive had a great relationship with apple. And with everybody over there. Its fine. But i said you have to build your plants here. They built a big prlant in texa. I was working on that very, very hard with various companies. They build in china. Because if they build in china they have no tax. They make it in china. I said we want you to make it here. They did. They came back with a very big plant here. Said, im not doing this unless topic of tariffs to me is so e simple. Number one, its great economically for us and it brings our Companies Back. Because if you charge tariffs to china, theyre going to build theyre going to build their car plants here. And theyre going to employ our people. Theyre building big plants because of biden in mexico. So they big a big china plant in mexico. Then they sell it across the border with very little tax. Its ridiculous. We want them to build their plants in the United States. We dont want to get cars from china. We want to get cars made by china in the United States using our workers. Mr. President but also gives us a big political power. Tariffs are tremendously powerful in terms of stopping wars because they dont want tariffs. And frankly, i can i made them sing. I made other countries sing with the threat of tariffs. And if you dont have tariffs, we have nothing whatsoever on them. We have lost such an opportunity. What ive seen if you want to build harley davidson, as an example. I said, how are you doing in india . They were in the white house. How are you doing in india, no good. Why . They have 100 tariff or more than that even. And therefore we basically cancer, because you have to double and triple the price in india. What are you going to do . They want us to build a plant in india. They go and build a big plant in india. Under me, we started doing the same thing here. And we have the pot of gold. We have the best pot of gold. But eventually we wont have that because our country is going down. And were not going to have it. Were losing our economic power. Mr. President , talking about china. I want to ask you about perhaps one of the biggest business stories in policy stories of the moment and that is tiktok. You have called tiktok a National Security threat. At one point you said that they are, quote, Data Collection threatens to allow the Chinese Communist party access to americans personal and proprietary information and yet it appears that you now reversed your view on banning tiktok. Why is that . So, i had it done. And then congress said, well, they never they ultimately usually fail, you know. They are like extremely political and theyre extremely subject to people calmed lobbyi happen to be very talented, good and very rich. I could have banned tiktok. I had it banned just about, could have gotten it done, but i said, you know what . Ill leave it up to you. Didnt push them too hard. Let them do their own research and development and they decided not do it. I was at the point i could have gotten it done if i wanted to. I could have said you make the decision, its a tough decision. Frankly a lot of people are on tiktok that love it. Young kids on tiktok would go crazy without it. A lot of users. Theres you know, a lot of good, and theres a lot of bad with tiktok, but the thing i dont like is that without tiktok you can make facebook bigger. I consider facebook to be an enemy of the people, along with a lot of the media. What facebook did with lockboxes with the 500 million zuckerbucks lock boxes he put in i considered illegal. You know, they put people in jail when they spend put people in jail when they spend more than 5,600 in a campaign. Go to jail if theyre 200, look at dsouza. Put him in jail over a couple hundred bucks. Heres a guy spends 500 million and he doesnt go to jail. Very interesting. But do you believe tiktok is a National Security threat or not . I believe the Emergency Powers put in place at the time suggested it was. Was that not true . I do believe. I do believe it, and we have to very much go into privacy and make sure that we are protecting the american peoples privacy and data rights. And you know, we also have a problem with others. Facebook and lots of other companies, too. I mean, they get the information. They get plenty of information and they deal with china, and theyll do whatever china wants. You know, if you look at some of our American Companies, when you talk about ight. Highly sophisticated companies you think are american. Theyre not selling american. They deal in china, and if china wants anything from them, they will give it. So thats a National Security risk also. But when i look at it, im not looking to make Facebook Double the size, and if you ban tiktok, facebook and others, but mostly facebook will be a big beneficiary and i think facebook has been very very bad for our country. Especially when it comes to elections. Mr. Trump, you met recently with jeff yas, hedge fund manager, stake in tiktok. Huge gop donor. Steve bannon suggested youve been paid off to switch your view. How did your view change . How did that comable and did you have a conversation with jeff yas about it . No, i didnt. I met with him briefly. Made a speech and said hello to him and his wife who was lovely. Actually, her primary thing was on education. She wants choice, as i do, and she mentioned to me more than anything, you know, we talked about education. It was a meeting that last add few minutes. Now, the only one i met was i met them both, and i dont think i ever met them before, but he never mentioned tiktok. She did mention school choice, and thats what in fact, she said, my whole life is based around school choice. Very important thing to her and i agree with that. Mr. Trump also a meeting with elon musk recently. I did. I saw a a piece written that Silicon Valley uncharacteristically, not saying its 100 behind your candidacy, but certainly there seems to be a sea change to some extent this time around. What did you what did elon musk tell you . You think youll eventually get his support in some way whether verbal or monetary . I dont know. Look, ive been friendly with him over the years and helped him when i was president. Ive liked him. We obviously have opposing views on a minor suggest called electric cars. Im all for electric cars but you need alternatives also. You cant just go to electric. You have a grid system thats obsolete and a disaster, worked on it a lot, our grid system. Cant produce the electricity and cant distributes electricity. Electric cars are not even a possibility to the go allelectric. Biden, allelectric mandate very, very stupid people. First of all, they dont go far, far too much and going to all be made in china and autoworkers are voting for biden. No idea why. Like blind sheep, but the auto workers are going to vote for trump because they understand. Look at my numbers in michigan. Leading him by 12 or 14 points. Thats always hard for a republican, but not now. Leading in a lot of places that republicans dont lead and including with African Americans. We are, we have numbers with the African American population, black population. The asian population. Hispanics. We have numbers like like nobodys ever seen before. So i think were going to have a very good election and i think thats probably why Silicon Valley is but i think theyre also with me, because i want, i want to help businesses. I want to they saw what happened. We had, and you know that, jut p just prior to this horrible scourge, gift of china, we had the greatest economy in history of the world. There was never an economy. Blacks were doing best theyve ever done. Hispanics. Women. Asian men with a diploma from m. I. T. , without a diploma at all from a high school. Every single group, every single group was doing great. And thats the way it is. And we had the greatest economy ever and ready to pay off debt. We were drilling, doing things. Think of it. I got anwar approved. Its bigger, perhaps, close, but probably bigger than saudi arabia, in alaska. And one of the first things biden did is end it. Reagan tried to get it. Couldnt get it done. Nobody got it done but me, and nobody else could have gotten it done. Anwar is the biggest probably the biggest site, if you look at remember, we celebrated that. Nobody could believe i got it done and were getting ready to start drilling and they were doing it, great for alaska. A tremendous Economic Development for alaska, but i got it done, and they ended it. We were going to pay off debt. We were going to do things that were incredible, and then we had an election that, i would be very nice if you show didnt go too well. Didnt go too well. Go ahead. Let me ask you about that, mr. President. Something i want you to comment on that ive said on this program is, you know, we have a tendency to want to import European Regulation to the u. S. Thinking that europeanstyle regulation, whether its around the environment, whether its around how we deal with National Security, financial matters and the like. Can you comment on that . Because i think the u. S. Is different, and we have to play to our strengths. Thoughts on that . Yeah. I think youre right. I think you know, we have a tendency to follow them a little bit amazingly in regulation because theyre doing so badly. They do so badly. Theyve become a socialist state and you know, not doing great. You look at what happened. Angela believe it or not i was very friendly with her but i disagreed allowing 2 million illegal aliens, we would say, or migrants, call them whatever way you want. About 19 different names and everyone becomes obsolete within about two week. Now they like to call them neighbors. The new name by the democrats is, we like to call them neighbors so they want to call the people flowing into our country, and in many cases killing people neighbors. But you know, europe what they did, what germanys done to itself between that and their Energy Policies has been a disaster for germany. Nobody talks about it. And they totally reversed course amazingly. Totally reversed course. So we shouldnt be following them. We have to go by our own. We need guys like jay clayton and others. Jay did a fantastic job in deregulating so much of the s. E. C. And so much of, you know what he did. He was a big deregulator. And again did it with with, it was a beautiful thing to watch that agency ran so i have a lot of great people. Never talk about those people. I think thats natural. We talked about some of the ones i didnt like, and some of the ones i had in there i didnt like, but mostly i had fantastic people, because you know, we get we got you can check every record in the book. Nobody was even close. I did the biggest cut in regulations. We did the biggest tax cut in history and gave the biggest regulation cut in history. We gave a tax cut, by the way, coming up. Its going to be very bad for democrats and very bad for this country if thats not extended the trump tax cuts. Biggest in history. The other one biggest regulation cuts in history. Jay a part of that. From what he was doing. We gave them on the environment, gave them on so many different things. We had plants built in louisiana, refineries, absolutely debt for 14 years, and i got them approved in one day. I got two plants in louisiana, massive plants mr. President like three empire state buildings playing on their side. These wering biggest plants. I got them done, literally, in one day. Waiting for 14 years for permits. I got it done in one day. Mr. President , you mentioned earlier. Yes. About the country losing economic power and some might cite downgrade of the United States Credit Rating one way were losing economic power. Fitch down graded over the summer specifically cited increase in polarization, declining governance over the past 20 years more specifically cited january 6th insurrection. Under your presidency, if you are reelected, what can you tell us about how stable the u. S. Will be especially as it appears that you are stoking political divide. You held a rally in waco, texas, and sort of playing to this polarization of groups here. Well, when i was roud any waco we had 100,000 people show up. Thats where they wanted the rally. Im like a businessman politician. You go where the people are, and i go to places, had a tremendous rally this rally this weekend. Were having rallies in michigan. The rallies are bigger than theyve ever been. We have, as soon as the season gets warmer where we can do outdoor. Right now no arena can hold the number of people. Does had matter weve been downgraded and that our Credit Rating could be at further risk . Should there be further polarization . Its not because of january 6th. Were downgraded because of incompetent people, very incompetent people doing incompetent things. Losing countries. We lose iran, this one, have russia thats out. Many, many countries that we throw out of the system. And we cant lose that system. That system is raised the dollar. That system is a very important system to the vitality and strength of our country. If we ever do lose that, take out russia. China would love to be you know, leader of the pack is china, because theyd love to take it over, and it will be possible to take it over if were not strong. We have to hold countries in. And if countries want to get out were going to have tosy, well, if you want to get out of our system, and go to, lets say, a russian version, or your own version, were not going to do trade with you and theyll be back in about two seconds. Depends on whos posing that statement to whoever it is the leader. Like dealing with macron or dealing with leaders. You have to be able to talk to them properly. Our people dont know how to talk to them. Our people are like, we go there hat in hand. Were like beggars. Our country is no longer respected. The people representing us are not respected. I just had viktor orban, a tough man from hungary at my place in florida. You know, get along with him very well, friendly, i have respect for him. He made the statement. A wonderful statement. He said well solve the problems of the world if donald trump comes back. He said russia was afraid of him, china afraid of him. No problems what so ever under trump and now we have israel attacked, by the way would have never happened. We have ukraine and russia fighting. That would have never happened. All of those dead people and in blown up cities. Ukraine is now just just its like a demolition site what theyve done to ukraine. None of that would have happened. All of those people would be alive today if the Election Results were, lets say, correct. And united. Mr. President , given how divided it feels this country is, i want to play you just a piece of tape from ken langon on squawk box about a month and a half ago now and show you what he had to say. I think it represents a lot of voters out there. Im curious if you would react to it and explain sort of how you feel about it to the voters. Look at this, if you could, for a second. I worry if trump wins that its going to be four years of getting even. And thats scary. Because we got serious issues coming up that need to be addressed. What do you think of that, mr. President . Because i think that there is a feeling that there is still an anger and frustration that you have about certain issues . Well, look, never been a fan of ken. Never. I dont know if he supported me. Maybe he supported me because i was the only one he could support, because thats the reason, but never been a fan. Ive been a fan of Bernie Marcus. Big fan, Bernie Marcus is a big fan of mine and that was the side i chose and frankly, you know, hes right in one sense. People think that theres going to be revenge and i say, no. Revenge will be success. Not revenge in a readvantage stance. Its really gob to are success. Turn our country around. Were goingto bring sense and, common sense. You know, people say you are conservative. Im not conservative. You know what i am . Im a man of common sense and a lot of conservative policies are common sense. No open borders you have to come in legally. Close up the borders. I had the sayest, the best border in history of our country and all he had to do, gone to the beach like he likes doing. He look goods in a bathing suit. If he would have left everything in place. Including the people that were doing it, i had the best border in history. We built 571 miles of wall. I got mexico to give us massive numbers of free soldiers. Theres a case of tariffs. I said if you dont give us the soldiers well put a 25 tariff on your cars. They laughed at me when i said i want 28,000 soldiers and i liked the president of mexico. A very good guy. Happens to be a socialist but you cant have everything. They laughed. I want you to give us 25,000, 28,000 soldiers on our border stop the people coming in with the caravan. Its they laughed. Dont want to do it . Yea yeah. Im going to put a 25 tariff on all products including all cars youre selling. They stole, like we were babies. 32 of our car Manufacturing Business over the last 30 years. 32 now made in mexico and getting bigger all the time. And now as i told you before with china going in building plants there to sell in to the United States, i would say to china, if youre building a plant on our border, to build cars in mexico and to tell them into the United States, im putting a 50 tariff on all of those cars and know what . They would stop building their plants in about we dont do that. We have stupid people running our government. To be honest. Mr. President , we will we will see. I i know youve got a lot going on. The campaign. Got legal issues. People sometimes wonder, you know, how to prioritize and you just keep charging. The legal issues, joe, arent legal issues. Theyre biden issues. Biden put fani, beautiful fani, whos turned out now to be a corrupt district attorney, but in my opinion, theyre almost all corrupt. All of the stuff that you see is weaponized government, and the d. A. In new york is being run by the doj. They put their top person into the d. A. s office. All of this stuff and frankly i get a lot of credit for it. I think im much more popular now, because theydid it. It backfired on them. Theyve weaponized government. Think of it. Put one of their top people, the top person into the d. A. s office to go get trump. They deal with letitia james, a real low life. They put people with her. Dealing with her all the time to go get trump. These are the democrats. The prosecutors and judges in new york, our country could fall because of it. How bad it is, and companies are moving out of new york because of what theyve done to me. And im going to end up winning on appeal and if i didnt win an appeal of these ridiculous decisions, if i didnt win on appeal, the most ridiculous decisions, including the ms. Bergdorf goodman. A person i never no idea who she is except one thing. Sued. From that point on i said, wow thats crazy what this is. I got charged. Given a false accusation and had to post a 91 million bond on a false accusation. People arena t moving into new york because of the crap theyre pup pulling on me. I feel like a pioneer. We have a very fragile country. We have to be careful. People are rejecting it and watching. Normally somebody would be out of office stuff likes that happens. My numbers are much higher had this not happened but you have to be able to speak about it. A very, very dangerous thing for our country what theyre doing. Its the weaponization of the doj, the fbi, et cetera. We we appreciate all the time youve given us this morning. Mr. President , look forward to another conversation in the not too distant future. Thank you very much, joe. Thank you, everybody. Thank you. Yes, okay. Thank you. All right. Just after 8 00 a. M. On the east coast. Youre watching squawk box on cnbc. Just joining us speaking with former President Donald Trump for the last half hour. Jay clayton is here with us. Would you work in another Trump Administration, if asked . Look, if the president asked you to work in a position and youre very confident in the team around you have to say yes. I think anybody should anybody who has the opportunity to make a difference for people in america should do it. You do you think that if y he were to win reelection hed have people, the type of quality people because people were expressing that concern. Ive heard the opposite from a lineup once again. Just saw Stephen Mnuchin doing a transaction. He came on this network. His ability to articulate exactly what was going on, to demonstrate confidence, you know, people like that did incredibly well in the last administration, and i think hell get people like Steve Mnuchin again. I think its good to have, go around just all of us ask questions, and you will concede hes willing to take any questions from anyone without saying, uhoh. Im going get in trouble. Right . Acknowledge that . Tries to engage with the question. And hes ready. How long was that . 40 minutes of even got merkel right. All right. Were going to this is your case. Take us out here. Thank you jay for being here. Come back. A lot more on squawk talking about the market week ahead. You dont want to miss this one. Microstrategy cofounder cochairman Michael Saylor talking crypto and bitcoin. Dont miss that interview ppinat 8 30 a. M. Eastern time. Squawk returns after this. It should be called wiffle tennis. Pickle yeah, aw whoo these guys are intense. We got nothing to worry about. With e trade from Morgan Stanley, were ready for whatever gets served up. Dude, you gotta work on your trash talk. Id rather work on saving for retirement. Or college, since you like to get schooled. Thats a pretty good burn, right . Got him. Good game. Thanks for coming to our clinic, first ones free. Theyre waiting for you. Hey, do you have a second . Theyre all expecting more. More efficiency. More benefits. More growth. When you realize you can give your people everything, and more. Thank you very much. [applause] ask, now what . Heres what. You go with prudential to protect, empower and grow. With everything you need to deliver, you guessed it. More. One more thing. Whos your rock . Learn more at prudential. Com welcome back to squawk. Joining us, mike santoli. Hello. Hesitation in the premarket action follows on last fridays pretty sharp reversal on highest momentum areas of the market. Look how the s p shapes up. Its been mostly reward and not a lot of risk since october. Very, very strong orderly uptrend. 25 low to high. Kind of built on all of the economic optimism. Soft landing expectations. Feds going to cut rates into a record high stock market. A lot into the market and high octane action in things like nvidia. Nikkei in japan strongest momentum trade in the world had reversal as currency and rates reversed in japan. Now is it a gut check on the most popular trades . Look at momentum segment of the s p 500 against the calmest part of the s p 500. The s p low volatility versus s p momentum. Really matched up pretty well back when in a defensivetype market. 2023, most of it. Then you see liftoff. Nvidia, meta, lilly, costco, the strongest stocks. Just that little sharp downtick at the end there. The question is, are we going to have a greater unwind . Creating instability in the tape . Look at the volatility index. A little clue here. Been sticky up in this 14, 15 area for a while even though the s p 500 has been making new highs. You see were up off the low around 12 from december. Yeah, Pay Attention to that. Some is seasonal. Some we have a higher velocity, higher octane tape right now taking account of that. Some sense out there maybe were overdue. If for nothing else a little turbulence on the wayto whatever landing we get. Mike, thanks. Mike santoli. Joining us now onset for more on the markets is jason trenor. Chairman and ceo of a Research Partner which is a baird company. A lot of print over the weekend with the wall street journal and mr. Freeman . Yes. Tell us about it. Well, just talking about the idea how you get out ofs 34 trillion of debt. Two points i made. One, grow your way out. No other way out. Youre not able to raise taxes enough, in my opinion, in the next administration. Whoevers president , to get out of that. Also we talked a lot about our common man cpi. Which suggests to me its going to be very difficult for President Biden trying to be as fair as possible. Very hard for him to ignore this issue going into november, because peoples standard of living declined over the past threeyears, based on our common cpi things you have to buy. Its food, energy insurance. Clothing, housing. Utilities. Its now things you might like to buy. Food and energy noncore, and for most people eating and staying warm is pretty core. This is what we focused on. Thats shown, again, a pretty serious deterioration in the standard of living, over the past three years. People forget and i think you forget the key elements of effect of the fouryear highs in inflation, and when inflation comes down, the prices dont come down. They go up less slowly. If you just do the math, between what things are costing and the raises in dollars that people have gotten, it doesnt in real dollars is does not add up to more of a paycheck. Adjusted inflation below where they are. Absolutely. One of the implications, its likely you get another wave of inflation. We look back. Chief economist dan looked back at 100 years of data 30 different countries. One wave of inflation over six you are about 90 likely to get another wave of inflation over six. Largely because of what you describe. People behind. Labor wants more. Come back for more saying listen, nice. Saw teamsters and uaw last year get nice wage increases but not enough to make up for decline. I wish fiscally we were doing more things to not try to, i would say, no coordination between fiscal Monetary Policy right now. Fiscal policy is stepping on the gas while Monetary Policy is trying to step on the brakes. We ask President Trump about tariffs and whether or not it would be inflationary. How do you few this tunder a potential Trump Administration . Talking tax cuts and same time tariffs are tariffs. If companies reshore to the unite thats inherently inflationary . Melissa, thats happening anyway. I feel strongly that the relationship weve had with china before the pandemic, thats over. Not coming back. And i think the bloom is off the rose. Few things democrats and republicans can agree upon right now and one of them is china is seen as a threat and very few other countries in the world that really have the scale to match chinas ability to produce things and to ship them. So first, i would say that reshoring or onshoring is going to happen regardless whos president , in my opinion. Tariffs are obviously very inflationary over time. No two ways about that. The question is, can you get counterrallied benefits to offset the negative impacts of tariffs . Used as a tool or is it something that just the only tool in your tool kit . Right now i would say very little difference between joe bidens policy towards china and President Bidens policies towards china when it comes to trade. The style is very different, but if you look at the actual trade policies theres not a lot of difference between the two. That might change if President Trump were reelected. Theres no, not much difference now. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Tough act to follow. Yeah. A biggy. Coming up, canvas interview if you are in the world of crypto or just thinking about what it all means. The top corporate supporter perhaps in america. Microstrategies Michael Saylor is with us. The company revealing purchase of an additional 820 million in bitcoin. Stay tedun. Youre watching squawk on cnbc. Use they saw how cancer adapts to different oxygen levels and starved it. I am here because they switched off egfr gene mutation and stopped the growth of tumor cells. Theres a place thats making one advanced Cancer Discovery after another for 75 years. I am here. I am here. Because of danafarber. What we do here changes lives everywhere. I am here. You know doug, ever since switching to workday youve been a real rock star. Rock star . What do you know about rock stars . Billy idol . I mean wheres the skintight leather . My shoes are leather. Wheres the unnecessary zippers . That thing billy, rock star is just how doug feels when he uses workday. Thanks, rory. Ill show you rock star be a finance and hr rock star. Workday. For a changing world. Billy idol just stole your golf cart . We spoke at length with former President Trump last hour. He sounded off on everything. Literally almost from Foreign Policy to entitlements, a bit of what he said on that topic and touched on the stock market and inflation. There is a lot you can do in terms of entitlements. In terms of cutting, and in terms of also the theft and the bad management of entitlements. Tremendous bad management of entitles. Tremendous amount of things and numbers are things can you do. I dont necessarily agree with the statement. I know theyre going to end up weakening Social Security, because the country is weakened. Look at outside of the stock market, what were going through, were going through hell. People are going through hell. I believe the numbers, 50 . They say 32 , 33 . I believe we have accumulative inflation of over 50 . That means people are they have to make more than 50 more over a fairly short period of time to stay up. Former president also spoke about bitcoin and were going to get reaction in a few minutes with microstrategy executive chairman Michael Saylor. Coming up takeaways from last Nights Academy awards. Who won big at the oscars . Thats next. Stay tuned. U wchg qukn cnbc. feel the power of osteo biflex®. Taken every day, its clinically shown to improve joint comfort in 7 days, with significant improvement over time. oppenheimer, big winner at lat last Nights Academy awards. Seven oscars best picture, director, actor and supporting actor. Talking more about hollywoods biggest night we bring in Julia Boorstin and talked a little earlier, julia, and there have been previous years where i thought the academy and also we talk how its not you know, theyre not monolithic. They all vote and things happen, but they just couldnt avoid oppenheimer and Cillian Murphy. Give it because of the slight for sideways. All said and done you have to give it mostly to oppenheimer . Yeah. A huge sweep for oppenheimer and for universal, which we have to say is cnbcs Sister Company both owned by Nbc Universal, but what was really notable here is seven wins for oppenheimer of its ten nominations. Eight total for universal, because the holdovers also did win an ward faward for best supg actress and streamers didnt get assen wins. Netflix expected nominations for maestro. Didnt bring home any oscars. Apple tv martin scorsese, so many nomination and didnt bring any home. We saw this year not just dominance of oppenheimer but success of a movie from a traditional Hollywood Studio and a movie that did very wealthy at trickily. For many years now the academy criticized for giving a lot of awards to films not a lot of people saw. That was not the case this year. A critical success, commercial success and now a massive success at the oscars. I mean, i saw a lot of it. I guess heard it was bad it started early. Well see. I think it will be above last year. Maybe over 20 million again. Is that what youre thinking . There tends interesting to see how earlier start impacts things. I was there last night. A lot of people were very excited it was starting early because it meant it wasnt going to be finishing so late. And the idea of it starting early that it will also reach a broader audience on the east coast as opposed to running so late at night. But i think the sense is that if people had seen the movies which they certain did between barbie and oppenheimer, people have seen movies more inclined to kuhn in. One reason the academy expanded the number of films that could be nominated for best picture beyond just five, the prior limit. Now if you have more people seeing the films theyre more invested, joe. Thats true. I had seen, having been seen also still havent seen barbie. You havent seen barbie . I havent either. I really dont understand it. You should see it, joe. A cultural phenomenon. Got to see it. And everybodys named barbie in it . More than one just got to see it. Really . He knows that. I knew that. Founding member. Dammit. Julia, thank you. Up next, bitcoin and microstrategy executive Michael Saylor joins us. Dont go anywhere. Squawk box will be right back. Into the night. Its all the things that keep this world turning. Its the gotos that keep us going. The places we cheer. Trust. Hang out. And check in. They all choose the advanced Network Solutions and round the clock partnership from comcast business. Powering more businesses than anyone. Powering possibilities. Its time. Yes, the time has come for a fresh approach to dog food. Everyday more dog people are deciding its time to quit the kibble and feed their dogs fresh food from the farmers dog. Made by vets and delivered right to your door precisely portioned for your dogs needs. Its an idea whose time has come. Welcome back to squawk box. This morning bitcoin crossing the 70,000 mark first time friday. This morning above 72,000. Joining us now to talk bitcoin Michael Saylor. Strategy microstrategy and end of last month the company held about 200,000 bitcoins. Michael, thank you for joining us. You have been early and courageous and you continue to double down. I want to talk about where you think bitcoin is, but also i want to talk about how you think about a microstrategy, your company has a proxy for bitcoin now that etfs are available to the public. Sure. Well, i think id start just with bitcoin. Bitcoin is certainly a least digital goal and going to eat gold. Has all great attributes of gold and none of the defects of gold. If you could teleport gold from new york to tokyo in a few minutes, people would like it. Its going to divert capital from risk assets and risk etfs like spy and you can see that these etfs are doing that. Its going to be incorporated into a lot of funds like a Blackrock Global Opportunities Fund or Strategic Income opportunities fund, and so as its an asset class. As it goes into other funds its going to become structural. The havings will cut organic supply of sellers in half by april 20th meaning only abouts 3ds 1 million, 32 million a day of natural sellers. The price of bitcoin will have to adjust up to meet that investor demand. I think thats whats happening next to the asset class n. Terms of how investors should think about your company and right now i think they think of it as a proxy if bitcoin. A way for investors, frankly, who didnt want to buy the underlying coins to get access to bitcoin and exposure to bitcoin. The question now, though, that these etfs are approved and folks are funneling money towards blackrock and so many others, how should they think about your Company Versus doing that . Yeah. So blackrock is like the containership or the super tanker of bitcoin. They can take a billion a day into their capital structure and can haul that efficiently. 25 basis points. Microstrategy is like airfreight. Higher performance. So whats going on here . Microstrategy has leverage. If we borrowed 860 million at 62 basis points, is there any company in the world you wouldnt like to invest in that could borrow a billion dollars less than 1 interest to buy into your best idea . We get intelligent leverage. Nonrecourse, unsecured and then buy bitcoin with it. That leverage gives volatility. The, gives performance. The performance gives us volatility. That attracts capital and we can then leverage more. Its kind of intelligent, because its convertible debt. Its its given our shareholders more bitcoin per share this week than they had a few weeks ago. So its very creative for them and compelling for every investor. If youre bitcoin curious right now and want to buy bitcoin at the alltime high how do you get upside in bitcoin with Downside Protection . Microstrategies sold 800 million in debt and we have 12 billion, 13 billion of bitcoin. Bitcoin max mist and love it and want to hold it forever etfs charge 25 basis points. Microstrategy is giving you a yield against your shares. And a taxefficient fashion. So maximus equity, hedgers, like the upside with Downside Protection. The traders love the vol. 100 vol asset and they like that. Were unique, because you cant really trade options on the etfs and that isnt going to issue a convertible bond with upside to bitcoin with Downside Protection. So, michael, i try to understand the mathematics and i know people like you, went to m. I. T. And it just seems maybe its more understandable for you or andreeson or peter thiel or everybody, but at 17 down from 68, and you know your leverage and everything else. Did you ever wake up in the middle of the night and have any doubt whatsoever, thats my one question . I was thinking about you at 17,000 and look at it now and its i just cant believe what the, the markup your company is based on it now. I guess the other thing is, when it halves should we, look at it on stock to flow, do we have to double what the potential price is based if you use that metric . Is that a valid metric to use and amps having shouldnt be that immediately if its at 62 now . Two good questions. Thanks for asking me. With regard to bitcoin, no doubt in my mind bitcoin was a better investment at 17,000 than at 65,000. I take the Warren Buffett view on this. Bitcoin superior investment to gold, equity bonds and real estate because its digital. Trade it 1 million times faster than conventional assets using a computer. Its available. Most other assets only trade less than 20 of the time. Bitcoins trading 168 hours a week. We bought 800 Million Dollars of bitcoin and a lot of it we bought over the weekend when all of the conventional markets are closed. Its global. Its the most widely recognized and trusted investment asset in the world right now. Its ethical, because its the king of all commodities. Theres no issuer. Theres no company, theres no country controlling it. And fundamentally its useful. Thousands of marketmakers can trade it all the time. Millions of companies can trade it. Billions are people. If you want to buy a house on saturday in africa, this is the way to do it. If you want to buy a car on sunday morning, this is the way to do it. So its a pretty great asset. Its the greatest of the assets, in my opinion, theres no secondbest asset. I didnt have any question about it. Were just waiting for the rest of the world to realize how good it is. As for your second question the having . Look, the selling and market the past month primarily bankruptcy estates liquidating gbtc at ftx, genesis or the like. Once they got done rebalancing the natural sellers of the miners, they can only sell 900 bitcoin a day now. Only able toll sell 450 bitcoin day coming end of april. As long as theres more demand in the market than 450 bitcoin a day there isnt a catalyst to drive this asset down. It has no cash flows. The critics think thats a defect. Its a feature. With no cash flows, no quarterly results, no product cycles, this is the longestlived asset in the financial ecosystem with the least uncertainty. Were buying it to hold it 100 years. So that being the case, that 66 to 16,000 dollar crash, that shook out the tourist. Shook out the nonbelievers. When it was 16,000 we were already to write it to zero and thats what youll find with the bitcoin maximus. Now writing it the other direction, and the protocols working, working to everybodys benefit. Just no reason why it shouldnt just keep adjusting up to find the marginal supply as demand builds. 25 million. Gots 25 billion on the Balance Sheet of bitcoin. Substantial is bitcoin opposed to the Core Software business. Is Software Business solely to borrow off that to buy bitcoin and how can we understand health of your business undergoing transition of customers to Cloudbased Software . We have now rebranded ourselves as a Bitcoin Development company. Think like a Real Estate Development company. And certainly a substantial amount of value unique ability to issue securities and purchase bitcoin with convertible debt with equity and the like. So we understand that. But the only reason we can make this transition is because the Software Business was healthy. It does generate steady cash flow. It does allow us to issue debt, to issue equity and make us unique. We have a very functional options market, a very functional debt market. And weve got a very stable operating business that we can use. If you look at our last result, we actually bought a lot of bitcoin with operating cash. Or cash out of the operating business, and that is purely accredit the to shareholders. We think were unique and its working very, very well right now. Michael, do you think long term that theres any risk at this point . Has bitcoin reached such a scape velocity that theres any risk that governments, the u. S. Government, chinese government, other governments, somehow do something to bitcoin that puts its growth in jeopardy . You know, another great question, andrew. A lot of times the skeptics say bitcoin looks too good to be true. So good to be true someones going to take it away from you. Thats based on a fundamental misunderstanding about bitcoin. People refer to it as currency or Digital Currency and thats not artifact. Its digital property. Once you makethat big leap, i understand its property. The compelling use case is capital preservation for everyone in the world. Theres no theres no anathema associated with owning property. You can own a 1 billion building in new york city. Every place in the world allowing you to own property, china, europe, the u. S. , theyre going to embrace bitcoin as digital property. All of the controversial issues around crypto what do with use as a medium of exchange. What im here to say really is median Exchange Worth a few dollars. Store of value is worth 100 trillion. I give your company, your family, a trillion dollars drop it in africa and say save it 100 years. What are you going to buy . The answer is nothing. Nothing on the entire continent you can buy better than bitcoin. So bitcoins going to be embraced as property. Its going to be controversial if people think of it as a currency. I encourage people to think of it as digital property, 1 billion property in cyber space 100 years. Ever consider a currency . It doesnt have to be a currency is nobodys trying to buy a cup of coffee with a fraction of their building on fifth avenue. Right . But every rich person i know owns property in london or new york city or somewhere, and none of them complain about not being able to spend their building to, as a medium of exchange. So the killer application is capital preservation for everybody. The store of value is the killer use case. Medium of exchange a distraction. Governmenting always issue currency make it legal tender always and thats just fine. Bitcoins competing with gold. Its going to eat it and then its competing with risk assets as a longterm hold and its competing with you buying an airbnb as a Retirement Income source. If youre a middleclass person. Michael, thank you for joining us this morning. Really appreciate it. Look forward to talking to you again very, very soon. Thank you. Yeah. Thanks for everything. Coming up, the death of a highprofile computer hack. Chris krebs. Squawk box will be right back. With no children and no casinos. We actually have reinvented ocean voyages, designing allinclusive experiences for the thinking person. Viking voted worlds best by both travel leisure and conde nast traveler. Learn more at viking. Com. Next. Next. Stop. We got it . No. Keep going. Aga. [ sigh ] next. Next. If you dont pick one. Oh, you have time. Am i keeping you from your job. Next. I dont even know where i am anymore. Stop. Do we finally have it . Lets go back to the beginning. Are you. Your electric future. Customized. The fullyelectric audi q4 etron. At pgim, finding opportunity in fixed income today, helps secure tomorrow. Our timetested fixed income suite, backed by over 145 years of risk experience, helps investors meet their goals. Pgim investments. Shaping tomorrow today. Dealing with hackers who reached Corporate Accounts back in late november ajer it said it was reaching out to customers with offers of help after hackers sold secrets such as passwords apasswords. Ajer chris, great to have you with us. Certainly its a black eye formicrosoft, dealing with an attack thats been ongoing for so long. It had been ongoing prior to them admitting that it happened. Im wondering what your take on it iis. If anything has to do with anything in your opinion and figuring out where they can breach. Were obviously having some difficulty with the audio, so well check that. Oh, chris o i sisback. There are probably two separate i think things we need to isolate and look at here ajer state Security Services from russia, china, and elsewhere are certainly aware corporate governments across the world are making this significant pivot into the cloud, and unfortunately the hyperscale cloud gains are over and its dominated by microsoft, google, and amazon aj. So theyre dedicating their resources to compromise, get inside, and as i understand in talking to government officials, the threat is very, very real and theyre hanging on by a thread. Do you mean other hyperscalers that might be handling Cloud Business across Corporate America as well as government . I think its mainly cloud provider providers. Its the old joke ajer why are the threat acactors going after them . Theyre going after the source code, the shared information by microsoft for clients including u. S. Government climates. So when the breach happens and it has to do with data breach in the cloud, whose response is it . Im trying to figure out where the blame lies and where the costs lie. Thats actually one of the pivots to the cloud ajer. Yes, theyre responsible for patching and securing that what they ship is secure. Theres absolute responsibility that lies on the clouds of the providers including microsoft in this case. I think one of the great concerns out of the government is there is not the ability to go in and audit the security practices. Theres a significant amount of investment debt out of the Cloud Security advisers and they have a lot to make up for in the coming years, and theres a lot of explaining to do, and i expect congress to up their interest in what the security practices are and what the security investments have been and what theyre going to be. Chris, great to speak with you. Thanks so much. Coming up, were going to look at the futures and trading days in just a moment. Squawk box coming right back. American announcer thats 21 missed cuts in a row. [car trunk slammed shut] for 88 years, Morgan Stanley has offered clients determination and forward thinking to create the future. Crowd stop it . Only you can see. American announcer rose, back in the winners circle. [crowd cheers] [music out] test youre doing a lot of good and theres a lot of bad with ti tiktok, but the thing i dont like you consider facebook. Its the enemy of the people along with a lot of the media. Youve got the susquehanna guy actually visiting. Its very hard. I thought he answered your question. I thought he answered it. He answered it. I met him briefly, talked to the wife. Talking about that. No, i still want to understand more. Look, the issue is if its a National Security threat, its a National Security threat. If its not, its not. To use one National Security threat and say its the enemy of the people is a whole nother thing. Youve always got to look underneath the friggin hood. You just have to. Make sure you join us tomorrow. Squawk on the street is next. Good monday morning. Welcome to squawk on the street. Cramer has the morning off. Premarket is extending the weakness from fridays downside reversal. Calendar packed this week with cpi, retail sales. We begin with the big week for investors. Well get the latest