Transcripts For BBCNEWS HARDtalk 20241010

Thank you for having me again, stephen. Ambassador Danny Danon in new york, welcome to hardtalk. Thank you for having me again, stephen. Its a pleasure to have you on hardtalk. Now, israel is currently fighting a multi front war. How much pressure, both military and diplomatic, would you say israel is under right now . Stephen, a year after October 7th and israel is still under attack, not only from hamas In Gaza, but also from lebanon, yemen, iraq, iran. We have seven fronts, and unfortunately we have casualties. Israelis are dying from those rockets, but we are determined, we are determined to win this war. We realise we dont have any other choice, and that is why we have seen that we moved forward both In Gaza and with hezbollah. You know, we are a peaceful nation. If you would have asked me a year before that what we are doing now will happen, i will tell you, no way, because we have no desire to be in any conflict, not with hamas, not with iran, not with hezbollah. And all those attacks were unprovoked attacks. But today we feel stronger. We are in pain. We are in deep pain because of the number of the casualties that died on October 7th. And unfortunately, we still have soldiers dying and civilians. So, we are in deep pain, but this pain is not weakness, its actually the opposite. It gives us a lot of strength to push back and to make sure we allow the israelis to go back to normal life. You say you have no choice, but of course you do have choices and israel is making choices. It was your choice to activate those pagers And Walkie Talkies and maim and kill so many members of hezbollah, but also some innocent civilians, too. It was your choice to assassinate hassan nasrallah, and it is now your choice to make a major Ground Incursion into lebanon. Those are choices. Absolutely not, absolutely not. And lets talk about the facts. The facts are that on October 7th, we were attacked by hamas. On october 8th, nasrallah decided to attack israel without any provocation, and he explained it. He said that he wanted to show solidarity. He wanted to show sympathy with hamas, and he started to send thousands of rockets. So far, 8,000 rockets landed in israel from lebanon. So, we had no. I understand the context, but i also understand that for many months, israel simply fired rockets back at hezbollah. Israel controlled the situation. What you have done in recent weeks is completely change the status quo, and it seems youre changing your Strategy Hour by hour. You said just a week or so ago that this was going to be a precise, a limited operation in south lebanon. Now what we see is your Prime Minister, your boss, bibi netanyahu, telling the lebanese People that unless they turn against hezbollah, he will turn lebanon into gaza. Let me first answer your previous mistake about choices. We didnt choose to fight, period. I dont want to send my son to fight against hezbollah or against hamas. We were attacked. It was an unprovoked attack against civilians. So, we had no choice, no choice but to defend ourselves. Thats crucial to understand. And all the suffering and all the things that you will describe in the next few minutes, the blame is not on us. The blame is not on us, because we were attacked without any provocation. And i want to remind you, we have no argument with lebanon. We have no disputes with them. We even signed a deal about the Natural Gas with the government of lebanon. But the fact that the iranians decided to use lebanon as a Launch Pad against israel, dont come and blame israel for defending ourselves. You think its legitimate for the Prime Minister of israel to tell the lebanese People that unless they do what he says, and, frankly, its beyond their power to actually move against hezbollah, which has a far more potent weaponry than the lebanese army, unless they do that, netanyahu says, your fate will be that of gaza. First, lets look at the fate of the israelis. And we care more about our People. 70,000 israelis. Oh, i dont doubt you care more about your People. But as you know, as you know, at least 1,500 lebanese People have already been killed, including more than 100 children. You cannot blame us for taking care of our People. 70,000 israelis are refugees, left their communities, left their homes, and for a year, they live in shelters, waiting for the day when they can go back to their communities. And i think today there is an opportunity for the lebanese People. You know, hezbollah is not the same. They are much weaker today. And i think today is an opportunity for the lebanese People, the lebanese government, to take control, to implement Un Resolution 1701, that basically said that the lebanese military will be in southern lebanon, not the hezbollah terrorists. You know what we found in the last few days, in the border next to our border . We found tunnels. We found bunkers with maps of communities and plans to invade israel, very similar to what hamas did, but with much more power and abilities. But, ambassador, if i may, in the last 2a hours, the Deputy Leader of hezbollah, of course, theyve got a complicated hierarchy now since youve killed several of their leaders, but naim qassem, a Deputy Leader of hezbollah, said in public that hezbollah is ready for ceasefire negotiations, wants those negotiations, and he made it plain by omission that hezbollah is no longer tying a ceasefire to what it had previously insisted to, which is a ceasefire In Gaza as well. So, in otherwords, hezbollah is ready to talk on the basis you want them to talk, but it seems youre not ready to talk to them. So, first, i dont know if its valid or not, but i think that its important that the linkage will not be valid any more. You know, that linkage was a sick reasoning of nasrallah, and im happy that he is not with us any more. But i think its very easy, you know . You know, you can solve the conflict with lebanon in a day and you have negotiators who are involved in that. Basically, it will require two things. First, that hezbollah will stop targeting israel, sending rockets. You know, two israelis were killed because they were. Once they were walking the dog in kiryat shmona. So, they should stop the rockets flying into israel. And the second step, they should move north of the litani river. Thats what the Un Resolution decided. And it was accepted by all parties in 2006. So, you dont really need to have deep negotiations. We dont have a desire to stay in lebanon. We dont want to control southern lebanon. Once we have those two conditions met, we can call it a day. You are obviously israels top diplomat at the United Nations. How uncomfortable is it for you to sit there listening Tojoe Biden calling for an immediate ceasefire in lebanon and, of course, a ceasefire In Gaza as well, to hear the europeans demand an immediate ceasefire in lebanon, to hear your arab partners calling for a ceasefire in lebanon . The saudis, whom you are desperate to make peace with, theyre demanding an immediate ceasefire. Why are you ignoring them all . We are not ignoring them. We have engagement going. Every day i meet with my colleagues, we discuss those issues, and i think they understand, you know, to call for a ceasefire, it sounds very nice. It sounds easy, you know, lets finish with that. But what do you do with the israeli hostages In Gaza . You leave them behind . That will not happen. We cannot leave them behind. What do you do with the residents that left the northern part of israel . You leave them outside from their communities . So, its not so easy. I think a ceasefire will happen once we will know that we can protect our People in the north. And i think we have seen, and you mentioned it earlier, stephen, we have seen some change. We waited for a year. Ive spoken at the Security Council dozens of times and i said, you have to take actions against hezbollah. We will not wait forever. And we waited for a year. And then the government decided, rightfully so, to add the goal of allowing the residents to come back to their homes. And now we are using our power to push hezbollah from our communities, from the fence. And i think we have seen great progress on that matter. Lets talk about the israel iran relationship, or what realistically right now is the israel iran confrontation. The biden administration, on this particular issue, israels next move against iran, has been quite clear. Joe biden himself has said, dont hit nuclear facilities, dont hit oil infrastructure. Are you going to listen to him on that . First, lets talk about what we can all agree, all western democracies, that iran is behind all the chaos in the region. We know that. We know that lebanon, syria, yemen, militias in iraq, its all being paid and directed from tehran. You know, theyre playing a game for having like a new leadership. Its a lie. They are a hostile regime. Second, we can agree that the attack on israel was the largest attack in the history, from One Nation to another nation, 200 ballistic missiles. Thats something which is beyond imagination. You know, Ten Million People had to run for shelters. The entire population of israel. And we were able to intercept most of the missiles, but not all of them. So there will be a response. It will be painful. Iran will pay a price for what they did, that i can tell you. Regarding what will be the target, you know, we are taking the time, we are thinking about it. We take it, think about it very carefully. Yourformer likud Party Colleague and former pm, naftali bennett, says this is a historic opportunity for israel. He says, we must act now to destroy irans nuclear programme, cripple this quote, unquote terrorist regime. We have the tools. Israel, iran right now, he says, stands exposed. Youre a hawk on iran yourself. Do you agree with Mr Bennett . Well, you understand that i will not be able to go today with you on specific targets. Im involved in the discussions. Im saying that were thinking very carefully. We didnt respond immediately. I think, many countries, if they would have been targeted like the way we were, the next day they would have retaliated. We take the time, we think very carefully, and i think that we have the ability to protect ourselves. But the burden to deal with nuclear iran should not be only on the shoulders of israel. The thing is, you do risk making your relationship with the united states deeply toxic. Listen to the words of a former, very senior, cia official, alan pino, who said, basically, israel cia official, alan pino, who said, basically, israel risks increasing frictions with the united states, further isolating itself and involving the israeli military in a, quote, extended offensive on multi fronts with ill defined objectives that is very much prone to mission creep. Youre in a dangerous place right now. You know, thats one voice. I speak with many officials and americans that understand that we are fighting the war of the us. We are fighting the enemies of the us. Lets talk a minute about nuclear iran. Do you think if they will be able to put up a nuclear bomb, you think it will be a threat only to israel . No, it will be a threat to the saudis, to the moderate arab countries in the gulf, to the american People. The iranian regime is threatening the us almost every day. So, we are fighting the fight of western democracies. You know, some People ignore that. Yeah, but you know what . You know what . What the western democracies say to you, alongside many of the other international players in the region, is that, ultimately, as long as you do not have a vision of a day after that is some sort of vision of a peaceful settlement with the palestinians, with whom you share this narrow strip of land between the Mediterranean Sea and thejordan, as long as you have no vision for the day after, there is no way youre going to get to regional security. So lets bring it back to gaza. Would you accept that your assault on gaza has not achieved what you wanted it to . Youre going to have to rethink. Well, first, i agree with you that we havent achieved all the goals. The very fact that we still have, as we speak, 101 hostages babies, mothers, fathers being held in the dungeons of the tunnels of gaza Thats Something beyond imagination. Yeah, and theirfamilies say that the one thing that you should do as a government right now is get to a ceasefire so that those People can be brought home. But allow me to finish my sentence. But we have seen changes of the capabilities of hamas. You know, today the residents of the south can go back to their communities. Hamas is not a threat to israel any more and we will continue to finish thejob and eliminate hamas. You know what . Weve talked several times. You keep telling me, were going to finish the job. Allow me to finish this point, please. But when we speak about the day after In Gaza, and i come to the Security Council almost every day, we have discussions about gaza. And i tell my colleagues, if you care about the palestinians In Gaza, you should know that hamas should not stay there. There will be no future for gaza with hamas. There will be no reconstruction of gaza with hamas. The only way to build something betterfor the palestinians In Gaza is to get rid of hamas. And thats exactly what we are doing now. We are getting rid of hamas. And then there will be an opening, an opening to build something better for the palestinians, but also for us. But, ambassador. Ambassador, do you not see that every day you continue with this language of fighting this war In Gaza until you eliminate hamas, every day you do that, you are further tarnishing israels international reputation and isolating israel in the international community . Not least at the United Nations where you sit. Your country right now is being held before the international Court Ofjustice with the accusation that your practices In Gaza represent genocide. A decision will come in later months or years on that. The icc Chief Prosecutor wants your boss, netanyahu, indicted on war crimes, and all of this Reputational Damage gets worse Day By Day By day. So, i want to go back to my earlier assumption. We didnt choose this fight. We have no choice. You know, we cannot leave the Hostages Today behind and say, we tried, we failed, and lets wait for hamas to decide what will be the next step. It doesnt work that way. And thats why we are continuing to push, and we are making progress. When you look today at the leadership of hamas, the capabilities of hamas, you know, basically, the only assets they have left are the hostages, which is a major asset. And thats why we are still so involved In Gaza. If they will release the hostages tomorrow morning, it will be much easier to think about whats happening next. But its not happening. We know that sinwar, he doesnt care about the People of gaza. He doesnt care about israelis, for sure. And that is why we are continuing with the pressure. Well, you, many would say, clearly dont care about the People of gaza because the Death Toll, according to the Health Ministry In Gaza, has now gone beyond 42,000. Wait, wait. We know from independent charities who are working In Gaza that the Death Toll of children, children alone, is way beyond 10,000. The humanitarian situation in terms of food, in terms of disease, is an unfolding catastrophe, according to independent observers. This is the reality of gaza today. And every day that you continue this assault on gaza, it gets worse. First of all, when you say Ministry Of Health of gaza, lets remind the audience that you say hamas. Basically, hamas sending those numbers out. And i dont buy those numbers, i dont believe them. We are doing everything we can to minimise civilian casualties. And you know, stephen, the very fact that we talk now, a year after October 7th, and we havent completed the mission, it shows, it proved, that basically we take the time because we try to minimise civilian casualties. We could have finished the war very fast with different numbers, but we are doing exactly the opposite. We take the time, we risk our forces in order to minimise civilian casualties. So. Yeah, again, again, im very mindful that youre the top diplomat for israel at the un. So you must be more aware than anyone of the degree to which the united states doesnt share your view of what is happening In Gaza, and not only gaza, the West Bank as well. Just listen to the words recently of the secretary of state, antony blinken, addressing the surge in violence in the West Bank. He said, quote, the israeli Security Forces need to make fundamental changes in the way they operate in the West Bank, including changes in their rules of engagement. The concern about israel when it comes to alleged abuses of international law, the concern is deep and its growing. So, lets talk about whats happening Injudea And Samaria. Its also connected to iran. They are flooding Judea And Samaria with explosives, with weapons, in order to create instability. And unfortunately, they were able to smuggle a lot of weapons into Judea And Samaria. And we have no choice. We have to neutralise those terrorists and stop them before they commit terror attacks Injudea And Samaria and other parts of israel. So, we have no choice on this issue. And instead of blaming. With respect, you havent addressed my point about the behaviours of the idf, notjust In Gaza, but weve moved the discussion on to the West Bank. So, im asking you, im very proud of the behaviour of the idf. I think its the most moral military in the world. If i compare the conduct of the way we fight terrorists with every other military in the world, im very proud of what we are doing. Its not even. If i may say so, its not even just about the idf. Its about the armed Settler Movement as well. Listen to the words of your own Shin Bet Chief ronen bar, very recently expressing profound concern about jewish Settler Violence in the occupied West Bank. He said it was causing indescribable damage to israel. He said that the governments light handed approach to these armed extremist settlers was deeply problematic. Its long become, he said, a widespread phenomenon of violent activity against palestinians, which is tantamount to, his word, terrorism. That is jewish extremist terrorism. You know, what you did just now is what im dealing with at the un every day, that hypocrisy because you take an incident of a few dozen outlaws that were indicted and injail now, and everybody is condemning them in israel, and you compare it to whats happening at the palestinian side, that they glorify terrorists. Do you know that president abbas and the pa never condemned the atrocities of October 7th . Have you heard the speech of president abbas in the general assembly . He never mentioned hamas. He cannot mention hamas. So our culture, when we have radicals, and we do, but, you know, very few, we arrest them, we indict them. But the pa, they glorify them and they make them heroes and they pay them salaries. And you come and ask me about those incidents, and you dont speak about the culture of hate that we are facing, not from hamas, from abbas, from the pa. And thats what im worried about, because many People discuss the future with the palestinians. But i expect the palestinians to distinguish themselves from hamas and condemn hamas. That will be a sign for the future. Ambassador, weve ranged over discussion of Front Lines from gaza to lebanon to the West Bank to iran. Whichever Front Line were talking about, surely it comes back to what is the vision that israel has when the fighting stops . Let me just give you this thought from jake sullivan, National Security Advisor Tojoe Biden, who says, quote, israel needs to turn whatever tactical wins it scores in battle into a strategy that can secure israels People and its future. For him, for him, that is a two state solution. And yet you and your boss, netanyahu, adamantly reject it. Well, i agree with the beginning of your quote. I think first we have to win. Victory, defeat the enemy, first stage, and then we can move forward with peace. We are a peaceful nation. We signed Peace Treaties with egypt, jordan, uae, morocco, bahrain. Inshallah, gods will, we will sign with Saudi Arabia and many other countries. But 7 Million palestinians live on that small strip of land between the mediterranean and thejordan river, alongside 7 Million jews, roughly. You have to find a way to peaceful coexistence with them. You have to surely recognise their right to an independent state. First, you know, fact check. You know, its not 7 Million. You have Arab Israelis who live inside israel and are equal citizens in israel. And i dont think they consider themselves future residents of any palestinian entity. They are proud israelis, the Arab Israelis, who live among us. Thats a very, very fair point. But my point still remains that ultimately there are two Peoples, one small land. The only solution, surely, is mutual recognition. Absolutely. And i think we realise that the palestinians are not going anywhere, but they have to realise the same. We are not going anywhere. We are not weak, we will not be destroyed. And the fact that 70 of the palestinians Injudea And Samaria supported the atrocities of October 7th, thats a bad sign for many israelis. And samaria supported the atrocities of October 7th, thats a bad sign for many israelis. And i think that should change. We need to see the pa and the palestinian People distinguish themselves from hamas, condemn hamas, and then we can speak about agreements, Peace Treaties, coexistence. But when you see somebody who is actually celebrating what happened to us a year ago, it makes us wonder if we have a partner. Ambassador Danny Danon, sadly were out of time, but thank you very much forjoining me on hardtalk. Thank you, stephen. Hello. Our weather has started to turn a little bit cooler. You might have noticed the change, and the trend is set to continue as well. Well, here in North Yorkshire we had signs of the change, waves being driven onto the beaches here by the strengthening north to north easterly wind. Temperatures on tuesday in rhyl got up to 17 degrees, but it was just 12 degrees on wednesday, a drop of some five degrees celsius. The drop in temperatures came as these northerly winds worked in. Now, over the next few hours, weve still got some patches of Cloud And Rain to come across england and wales, with Clearing Skies further north in scotland and northern ireland. And its here where well have the chilliest start to the day on thursday. Temperatures low enough even for a nip of frost in sheltered glens in scotland. So, starting the day on thursday, expect a bit of damp weather for southern parts of england and wales. That should clear out of the way as we go through the morning, and then elsewhere, loads of Sunshine Draped around coastal fringes. Therell be a scattering of showers, and Theyll Turn to come and go, really, through the day. A chilly wind, yes. Temperatures below where they have been over recent days 10 12 celsius. Although cooler, these temperatures are actually a little bit closer to average for the time of year. Now, the colder weather is still going to be with us into friday. Indeed, we could have A Touch Of Frost to start the day across southern portions of england and wales. Further north in scotland, Cloud Will Thicken on friday as a Weather System moves in, bringing some outbreaks of rain. Some of that rain could just about skirt into the far north of northern ireland, but further south in england and wales, its going to be a beautiful day with barely a cloud in the sky. For the weekend, still some rain left over from this area of low pressure affecting Northern Areas. Sunday looks to be the better sunday looks to be the better of the two days of the weekend as High Pressure builds in. So, saturday, some rain around across northern ireland, scotland, Northern Areas of england, and accompanying that rain, therell be some pretty strong and gusty winds. Of the two days of the weekend another blast of northerly air coming down, really dropping those temperatures just seven or eight degrees for northern scotland. For northern ireland, england and wales, meanwhile, were looking at temperatures around 11 14 degrees, which is pretty close to average. As that High Pressure builds in, though, for the second half of the weekend, were looking at a cold start to the morning, a few Mist And Fog patches, but a mostly dry day with sunny spells coming and going. Temperatures for most of us between around 10 13 degrees. Bye for now. At this point, its too dangerous to evacuate safely. So you happen to shelter in place and just hunker down. And Israels Defence Minister warns its response to iran will be deadly, precise and surprising. Hello. Hurricane milton has now started to make landfall in the us state of florida, where it could be one of the most destructive storms in the states history. The centre of the storm is now less than 30 miles from land, and residents are being urged by authorities to shelter in place. Milton is now a category three storm as It Collides with the coastline in sarasota county. The city of tampa is also near the path of the storm. Heres a live look now at tampa in florida