Several times and has forged a career as an outspoken and Controversial Television personality. The craziness of whats going on in this country at the moment. Lets mic you up. In this episode of this cultural life, the radio 4 programme, she reveals her formative influences and experiences. Just come on under the shirt. Yeah, you sure . Babe. Ive been doing this a long time. If youre an old lady, you dont mind. Youre like, thank you. Whoopi goldberg, welcome to this cultural life. Thank you. On this cultural life, i ask my guests to reflect on the most significant influences and experiences that have shaped their own creativity. You were born and raised in chelsea in new york city in the late � 50s and the � 60s . Yes. What are your earliest cultural memories as a child . Youre talking about a little kid, im a little kid . The most important thing to me was that the people around me, again, the people around me never said, you cant do this. So you want to know what the inspiration was . It was my mother. Cos my mother said, if thats what you want to do, sure, lets find out how to do it. What about school . What sort of pupil were you . I was not a great pupil. I was dyslexic. I am dyslexic. But didnt know at the time . At the time, no. They just thought i was just being lazy. My mum didnt think i wasjust being lazy, shejust didnt. She said, i dont know what it is, but, you know, its ok. And so she didnt allow people to call me stupid or any of the words that lots of people had to deal with. I know im talking a lot about my mum, but i. I was very blessed to have the woman that i had as a mother because she was just odd enough to recognise the oddity in her child. And that was kind of groovy. I read that you left school very early, before you were supposed to. Yes. So how were you educated . I was educated all over the place. I made a deal because i couldnt take high school. I couldnt do it, it was really hard. And my mother said, listen, you cannot run in the streets, but what i will do with you is, we will together find the places where you can go, to the museums, you can go to a lecture. We will find these places together. And when i come from work and i say to you, � what did you learn today . � where did your mind go . , � you have to tell me. and i was lucky enough because i. You need to show me things, i dont. Im not a great reader. You have to show me, you have to tell me. And then i can sort of go wherever i need to go. And so for me, my interest in learning was lit by her saying, you cant just do nothing. How did it inspire you . And what. . It inspired me to ask questions, to say, i dont understand, can you help me understand . Or, whats the most interesting thing i need to know about this . And, you know, in the � 60s, you could do stuff like that. Things were free. Public lectures . Public lectures on all kinds of crazy stuff. So you were mixing with adults a lot during the daytime when, ordinarily, you would be at school. Some. You were later known as a comic storyteller on stage. Yes. Were you drawing on some of those people that you met on the streets, on the people around you, in the community . Just people i passed, you know . I would love to tell you it was as organised as youre. As youre talking about it, but it wasnt. I was lucky enough to have been around a lot of different people. And when i decided that i needed to create characters, ijust kind of thought back to people id met, or people id seen, because, you know, i wanted to. I wanted to be in theatres and stuff. And if you werent, you know, a good auditioner, or you were not as sharp as some, but there were things you could do, i had to find a way to show what i was able to do. You say you went to a lot of free public projects, lectures, museums, but what about theatre, which is not free . Well, it wasnt free, no, youre right. But it was free sometimes in the evenings, Becausejoe Papp used to have a travelling Theatre Company that went around new york city and did all the great shakespeare plays. New york Shakespeare Festival Mobile Theater is here tonight at 8pm at madison and ralph street. And suddenly a truck would arrive, it would open itself up, and there were six or seven actors, you know, doing midsummers night dream, and yourejust kind of like, wow and your whole neighbourhood is watching. What Dreadful Dole is here . Eyes, do you see . How can it be . These were the things that happened when i was a kid. Theatre was happening on the streets. People were doing things in the parks. The learning was there. It was there for the picking. Was it also aspiration as well . Did you look at those actors and think, thats what i want to do . No, i always knew i was going to do it. I always knew that was what i wanted. You knew anyway . Yeah, i never thought i was going to be a famous movie person, but i always knew i was going to be a character actor. That was never a question. It was in my soul. Itjust was. It was just part of me. In the late 1970s, you moved to california to pursue these acting ambitions. No, no, i wish that were true. You went there for other reasons . Yes, i went there for a guy. And ijust happened to fall into. All the folks at the san diego rep. Sure. He worked with them. And later, in 1984, you met the oscar winning director mike nichols, who made the graduate and whos afraid of Virginia Woolf . And this is the next significant moment that were going to discuss. How did you meet him . I was invited to do a series of monologues, and the first night, there were maybe four people in the audience, because nobody knew who i was, and then someone wrote a wonderful review about me in the new york times. Right. Which shocked me. But it was like, wow, great. And then suddenly, the houses were full. And one day, my mother said to me � cos we would walk over to the theatre, cos it was in the old neighbourhood and she said, i dont ever want to tell you what i know, but. , i said, what . She said, i think mike nichols is going to be in the audience. And i said, wait, mike nichols, like the graduate guy . She said, yes. Isaid, well, what makes you think that . She said, well, i think maybe i saw his name on a list. Im not sure. Isaid, 0k. Because i had no idea what he looked like, it didnt freak me out at all, but she was very excited and i was happy. And i did my show and. I went to change my clothes and there was a knock, and i opened the door and my mother went. She gasps and i went, hi. And he said, hello, miss goldberg, im mike nichols. And i was like, hi hello. And he said, i have to tell you that ive been weeping because the story you did about fontaine, who was the first character that you meet, hes a junkie. She laughs. Rosanna cu tay looking good, my name is fontaine. And love is my game. And when i kiss the girls, hey, they all aflame. Come on, let me kiss your hand. No, the one with the diamonds on it. Laughter and he ends up going across to europe and ends up in amsterdam, at the anne frank house. And i ran to the door, but i got stopped by a big sign. That said, in spite of everything, i still believe people are good at heart. I say, what . i mean, who put this up . Why would they put it in this room, huh . I just couldnt understand it, you know . So i copped am attitude, decided to write a letter to the author of the quote so i got up close enough to see the authors name and myjaw dropped cos it said, anne frank. And i thought, this is too childish forwords, man. And as soon as i said that, it made perfect sense. Of course anne frank could say that. She was a child, she was a kid. And, you know, no matter what you do to children, they are always able to still see some good in you. Mike nichols, he says, i was on the last boat out of germany. As a refugee . As a refugee. And so that story knocked me out. Would you ever want to do. This show for broadway . I thought he was kidding orjust being nice. And i said, absolutely, absolutely. So when we got home, my mother said, i think he was asking if you wanted to work with him. Isaid, no, no, he would have said that. He would have said that. So a month after i get home, my phone rings in berkeley, where i live. And he says, ms goldberg, and his voice was very distinctive, so you always knew who it was. And i said, hey, hey, mike nichols, how are you . You know, he said, im well. He said, ive found a theatre. I said, you found a theatre . Great. He says, you dont know what im talking about, do you . Isaid, no. He said, i want you to bring your show to new york and i want to produce it. And i said, wait, wait a minute, are you sure . Because, you know, im not always good, you saw me on a good night. I said, im not sure. He said, well, think about it, think about it. And i said, what if im terrible . He said, have you been terrible before . Isaid, oh, yeah, many times. He said, then youll be terrible again. Here are the dates, i would like to do this. And i said, ok, and hung up, called my mother and said, i think Mike Nicholsjust invited me to come back to new york. She said, i told you. And so i went back, and. There is no greater experience than having someone like mike. Sit and listen, because he would say. In the theatre for rehearsal, he would say, id be onstage and id be doing it, and youd hear. Deep sigh and id | say, are you 0k . He said, yes, im fine. Is there an end to this story or are you just talking . And i said, well, no, there is an end. He said, good, because i heard it about seven minutes ago. And youre not listening to yourself. And i thought, oh, this is an adult, 0k. No more fooling around, this is what it is. This is how you do it. So he helped refine the show. And me . And to hone it. And also, just to be clear, what you were doing with the show, � cos its a series of characters. Yes. You have thejunkie burglar, you have a sort of valley girl surfer. Theres a jamaican guy and theres a woman with a disability. Theres all these different people. And they were monologues, and you were going from one character to another. But he was telling me i needed to Pay Attention to the monologue i was doing. He was editing you, then . Yes, he was. And he was saying, if youre not going to Pay Attention, theyre not going to Pay Attention, so get here. It was like, 0k. And i never made that mistake again. How old are you . 35. Im going to be seven on wednesday. Yeah, thank you. Im big for my age cos we live near a nuclear reactor. Laughter and applause this is a life changing moment because hes putting you on the broadway stage. Yes before that, youre playing the clubs, the small theatres, small crowds. Ijust thought, look at how lucky i am. I mean, my god, its mike nichols. He could have had a headache rather than come and see my show. What would have happened then if he hadnt come . Would it have still happened . Would this have. Who knows . But luck had it that he came. I mean, your comedy has been controversial over the years, hasnt it . Do you look back at any of it. Apparently do you regret any of the sketches, the routines . Not one thing, no. Any of the gags . Well, because im not a gag person. Right. But the things that ive done, thereve been a reason. You know, there was a reason i wanted to show thatjust because someone visually looks different or physically looks different doesnt mean theyre not entitled to the same loves, the same heartbreak, the same everything as the rest of us. And all of my work, all of my work has been aboutjust. Think about this. It may not be your experience, but just think about it cos you may find somebody whose experience it becomes. Your stage show in new york, which ran in 1984 and 1985, Won A Grammy Award For Best Comedy Album the recording of the show. Yes, yes. Hi, whoopi. How are you feeling today . Pretty good. How are you doing . Theyre all upstairs waiting for you. All right, see you later. See you now. And it was around this time that Steven Spielberg. Yes. Saw the show, and your life changed again. Yeah. When did you first meet him . When he said, i cant come to see your show because im here in la. Are you coming back to la at any point . Would you mind letting me see the show . And i was like, sure, cos i wanted to be in, you know, Raiders Of The Lost Ark and, you know, et, if it came back. So i said, sure and so, i was on my way back to berkeley, california, and i stopped and he said, ive just built the stage Here At Amblin which was his company and, would you mind doing the show here . I was like, sure he says, i want to talk to you. Im making a movie. Now, during all of this before everything, before i went to broadway i had listened to a reading of The Color Purple on npr. And my daughter and i were in the car and we pulled over our van to listen to this reading, and we made a decision that instead of maybe buying two pairs of shoes for my daughter, wed get a book and a pair of shoes. And so, The Color Purple was one that she and i listened to together. And so, when i got to los angeles and i met steve and he said, oh, and im making this movie. I said, what are you making . He said, color purple. I said, oh, cool i wrote alice walker a letter. He said, i know, and he pulled it out. She had sent it to him. Why had you written to alice walker . Well, i because i thought the book was magnificent. And i said, if they ever make a movie, i would like to play dirt on the floor, and shes like, 0k she wrote to quinchones and wrote to Steven Spielberg and wrote back to me saying, you know, they may be making a movie. Ill keep you posted. And she had already sent it all to steven, because alice walker lived in berkeley and she had seen my show. Shed come to see the show . Shed come and seen my show. But you had no idea. No you know, because you dont really meet the audience necessarily, unless they come and say, hello, i am so and so. So, you arrive at Steven Spielbergs private theatre, expecting just to entertain him. Did you realise that this was an audition . No, nor did i realise he had other people sitting in the audience at the same time, you know . And he didnt tell me, which im ever gratefulfor, but im standing behind this curtain and i never i never look. I generally dont care. But ijust was curious, cos i could hear people talking and i kind of looked through the curtain. Im thinking, oh, my god is that michaeljackson . Is that Ashford Simpson . Oh, my god, is that quinchones . and so now im like, ok, so these people, theyre a regular old audience, im not going to think about it but my agent my newly minted agent said to me, now, look. Just do your show. Dont do anything extra just do the show. So, i do the show and theyre laughing, theyre having a great time, and im thinking, oh, my god they think im good and it goes on and on, and they say, more and i think, oh, this is not a good thing. Isaid, well, no, i dont really have any. Oh, no more, more. And im like, oh, no ithink, ok, i have one more thing. But they told me not to do it, so i dont really think i should do it, and of course, that was the wrong thing to say. And they said, you must do it now. Its like, ah so i say, its called blee t. Chuckles. And steven looks at me and i say, yes. Its what happens when et comes into a black neighbourhood in the projects. And so, now everybody� s like, oh so, i did it. Its me telling the story of the three kids. They find him and they take him and they take him into the projects. Now, theyre hiding him from everybody and they give him a gun. And he has a gun. And when his people come to get him, he doesnt recognise them because hes assimilated. And so, he mows them all down. And he cant phone home because none of the phones are working. So, i say, so the the end all, be all of all of this is dont make people assimilate, let them share their experience with you. And steven stood up and started applauding. He said, i. he said, id never thought of it that way. Assimilation someone coming from somewhere else and having to fit in. He said, its one of the best things i think ive ever heard having to do with et. Ironically, subverting the story of one of Steven Spielbergs best loved films got you the role in his next movie. Well, lets say it helped. Celie, no until you do right by me, everything you think about is going to crumble. Dont do it, miss c. Dont trade places with what ive been through. Come on, miss celie. Lets go to the car. He aint worth it. Who you think you is . You cant cuss nobody. Look at you. Youre black, youre poor, i youre ugly, youre a woman, youre nothing at all till you do right by me, everything you even think about gonna fail. You played celie in The Color Purple. Yes. A story of struggle and survival set in the southern states. Right. In the early part of the 20th century, and it got you an oscar nomination as well. Your life must have changed i mean, tangibly, you must have felt at that moment . Well, are you a parent . Yeah. 0k. You know your life doesnt change unless your kids life changes. So, because youre really still that parent, you cant go out and go do all the stuff that, you know, Young Hollywood could do. No, i had to put my kid to bed, i had to take care of her, i had to do all of that. So, life changed in that there was more money and we could get a couple more pair of shoes. There was more ability to do more things. I could do great things for my mom, who had done great things for me my whole life, and it helped me get the freedom to be myself and stay myself. And remember i said, had i not been brought in by mike and steven, i would not have had that ability. Being brought in between two titans doesnt allow people to question your ability to do your gig. It was just like, this is who i am. You have now made, i think, around 100 films, the latest of which is till. The body of Emmett Louis Till has been found dead. I need to prepare you. Can you bring emmetts black suit . Its how hed like to be seen. Bos in no kind of shape to be seen by anyone. I hes injust the right shape. That smell is my sons body reeking of racial hatred. And its the story of the struggle for justice. Emmett till, the young boy who was killed brutally tortured and killed in mississippi in 1955, and the mother campaigned forjustice, and you play emmett till� s grandmother in this film and youve produced this film as well . Yeah. Whats wrong, mamie . Weve never been apart this long. Hesjust going to see his cousins. Its not a bad thing for him to know where he comes from. Chicago is all he needs to know. I dont want him seeing himself the way those people are seen down there. Those people like me . Even you left mississippi, mama. Mamie, bo is growing up. Youre going to have to let him go. This is a story which i know has been a long time in the making or youve been wanting to make for a long time, at least . I suspect now its happening at the right time. It is the story of a mother and a son. And this mother made sure that the world saw what these horrible people did to her son because of systemic racism, because they felt they could. They felt they had the right to do this because a 14 year old 14 year old boys are dumb. They just are, they cant help it. They do stupid stuff. And he whistled at a white woman and it cost him his life. This story is the story of what can happen when people let systemic racism run amok and solidify. Weve been looking back over decades of your life and you have done so much. What about the future . What drives you on creatively . I get bored easily. Laughter. So, there are things that i, you know, that i really want to be able to get to do. Directing . No i always think, yes, i would like to direct that. You have to you have to have a certain ability to work with groups of people. This is why im not married i dont do well as a pair. Im good on my own. Yeah, im not a good director but i do like acting and so, id like to keep doing that. And i also want to do a horror movie. Oh, yeah . Yeah i love horror. But you havent done one . No no one will let me and i keep saying to people, who better than me . whoopi goldberg, keep on working so you dont get bored, of course and thank you so much for sharing your cultural life. Thank you voiceover and for podcast episodes of this cultural life, | go to bbc sounds or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello there. Theres a promise of something a little bit warmer for all of us, towards the end of the week. But its going to be a short lived warm snap, as cooler, Wetter Conditions return for many northern and Western Areas over the weekend. For the next few days, its southern areas which will see the mist, the murk, the cloud, the rain. A bit brighter further north. This deep area of low pressure will bring all sorts of problems to scandinavia, with localised flooding, heavy rain and strong winds. But the Weather Front pushing in across the south of the uk for tuesday will be a much weakeraffair, bringing increasing cloud to the southern half of the country, with some patchy rain and drizzle, low cloud, some sea fog around south Western Coasts and into wales. But for northern england, northern ireland, scotland, bright with some sunny spells, one or two showers in north east scotland, where it will be windier, especially in the Northern Isles gusts up to 50 miles an hour here, with only 12 degrees in lerwick. But for the mainland of the uk, 16 to maybe 20 degrees from north to south. As we move through tuesday night, it looks like the showers, long spells of rain across the south of england clear away and it turns dry with lengthy clear spells. But it will continue to be windy in the north east of scotland, into the Northern Isles. Temperatures in Single Digits across the north. Another chilly night to come here, but milder in the south and west, where it will be a bit more humid, misty and murky. Wednesday, then, not a bad looking day. Quite a bit of sunshine around. Still windy in the north east of scotland and the Northern Isles, but thicker cloud will push into Western Areas at times and there will be some mist and murk around too. But i think most places will stay dry. Increasing sunshine across the east and south east of england. So, here, 2a, maybe 25 degrees and itll feel increasingly humid as well. Towards the end of the week, we start to tap into that warmer air over the near continent, so it will turn drier and sunnier. But it will turn a little bit humid as well. But you can see the red and orange colours spreading their way northwards across the uk. We could be up to the mid 20s in Scotland On Thursday and the high 20s for parts of england and wales. But it will be a short lived warm spell. Low pressure out in the atlantic will send a Weather Front across the uk during friday, which will bring showers or longer spells of rain, particularly to the north and the west of the uk. Some of them may be heavy. And as it moves through, temperatures will drop back down below the seasonal norm once again. So an unsettled theme as we head into friday and the weekend across the north and the west of the uk. Not looking that bad, though, across southern and eastern parts of england. Live from washington, this is bbc news. Niger closes its airspace as the political chaos grows on the ground. Donald trumps lawyers say a protective order violates his First Amendment rights. Our panel will look at the former president s legal hurdles. Plus, a mother daughter trip like no other we meet the intergenerational duo who are heading to space. Hello. Im helena humphrey. A Senior Us State Department official met with coup leaders in niger on monday as they continue to defy International Pressure to reinstate deposed president mohamed bazoum. Acting deputy secretary of state Victoria Nuland travelled to the countrys capital, niamey, for two hours of talks, which shes described as extremely frank. The coup leaders have closed the countrys airspace, saying theyre ready to defend themselves,