People were arrested. Of shia was raised, i invited all the muftis to discuss and to do welcome to hardtalk some discussion about how can with me, zeinab badawi. So thats just one example we look into a few points that of the kind of religious tensions malaysia has one of asias were talking about. Are so pertinent in our country . What has happened in that incident . Number one. But, no, youve got most vibrant economies a lot of power. Hang on, hang on, the result of decades of stability i have got an answer. Actually, if you look youve got a lot. And Economic Growth. Youre saying to me, into the incident you mentioned 0h, my hands are tied. In the hindu temple, it was not its a state affair. its also a multi ethnic, driven by any religious factor. No, thats not the case. Your office sits in the office multi religious federation religious factor was used of the Prime Minister. No, no, no. But the majority ethnic zeinab, you must understand the you are saying it is muslim malays dominate in instigating such incident. A federated state. Yes. The country politically. You have the state and are racial and religious divides now but it happened. Threatening malaysias stability and future prospects . It was muslims and hindus. You have the federal. There is growing concern that such yeah, it was really tensions have been getting worse about a developer who wants to take yes. Since a new government over the land beside the temple. In as far as the islamic took office last year. Administration is concerned, my guest is malaysias minister so youre just dismissing it as, oh, it is under the rulers, for islamic affairs, 00 01 39,555 4294966103 13 29,430 mujahid yusof rawa. It is under the king, its just about land. Under the sultan of each state. Im not saying there is no racial or religious tension. But you are the minister for islamic affairs. But in certain situations, you have a voice. There are people that exploit such i do not interfere with the state affairs. Situation, using race and religion. But what we do hang on. So you allow injustice to be done and of course it was a very in the name of mainstream islam . Challenging moment for us after not no, no, no. No. Even one year of government, i didnt say that. What i did was, i do have a platform to co ordinate with all the states that we had to face such incident. And i do present any problem and there are others. To the palace of each state, i mean, more recently updating them what had happened. In august this year, so this is a very, i would say, there was a case of one man arrested tedious matter within the state over a facebook post, and the federal but that saying that muslims must get their slaughter knives ready, just to be prepared, who knows, doesnt mean that i am, the infidels are acting like cattle for slaughter. You know, iam just and news reports say ignoring what had happened. That this man was actually but you really need to. Because. In the Malaysian Islamic Development department which comes you see, this compassionate islam under your jurisdiction. Policy, we had already talked to the state. 0k. Youve said that. Exactly. You see, in malaysia, we already had made them understand. The freedom that people of malaysia are enjoying after the new but. And we call all the muftis to sit government has made the social media a free for all, to say down and discuss the matter. All right. Anything they want. But you need, you, as a government, but of course, they are guided promised when you were campaigning by certain laws that does not that you would sign the International Covenant on civil prohibit theirfreedom, and political rights. There is a lot of concern. But guides to any posting that Amnesty International says you came could lead to any racial in on a wave of goodwill amid that or religious tension. Hope in true progress in human yes, exactly, what happened to this rights was coming to the country, man that you mentioned, and that this would slowly we had taken, the police, reseed as a priority, you cant miss this there had been reports. Golden opportunity. So you are aware that there are criticisms . When are you going to i had asked all my officers that sign this covenant . This is notjust under my authority. Whoever has created such tension i know. In their even personal posting, then i think law should take place. We did not even agree with such a posting. But you know your colleague, the home affairs minister, muhyiddin yassin, he said a couple we talk about it in the cabinet stop of months ago that there have been do you have a for signing it . Twice as many reports filed but we have a lot of local issues with the authorities on issues concerning race and religion to handle in malaysia. Compared to last year. But isnt this a priority . This looks really bad. As an executive we do take concern of our constituents. We cannotjust do things overnight. So within this priority whats going on . And within the awareness. So you are allowing injustices to occur . Whos fuelling all of this . Well, when we took over the government, we promised to give when you say allow you are not attending to it. Freedom of speech. But when you are attending to it, you are educating the world, then i think this is the true asked. We had this law which was put before, you do have to attend to it that is the law anti fake news. Because there are a lot of pressing concerns in malaysia. But when we took over, we promised to take away that bill and we did that twice in the parliament, but at the same i cite the words of time, i think the new government the counterterrorism chief is also committed to educate of malaysia who, particularly the public that you have to be within the context of terrorism says malaysia is a transit responsible for the freedom point for terrorists were giving you. Following the collapse of isis. He says hes uncovered a plan to use malaysia as a safe haven. He says its enough for them so i think in light of that, there are people who have to exploit and manipulate religious no controls over what they say, what they want to post, tensions. You cannot afford, for security and that in fact. Reasons, her reasons, to allow these religious its all unleashed, do you think . Its Something Like that but i think tensions to bubble over. We are under control because there are certain laws that will look into it. So youre saying its because your government brought we cannot and we will not stop in freedom of expression and thats why people are off the leash. Because you have two things here. However, the advisor to mahathir mohamad, you have the body that deals the Prime Minister, his Media Advisor kadirjasin, blames opposition parties like umno and pas, and he says what better way with terrorist issues. To hide their own sins than by resorting to race and religious issues . And of course this alliance has overturned more than 60 years of unmo rule. But the minister of religious affairs, islamic affairs, we deal with the longer term you see, if you want to really of making people understand that understand the situation, islam is a compassionate religion the freedom that we gave to the malaysia people especially in social media, has been used and you should not listen to those with extensive force by the opposition, who radicalise their faith. Using race and religion. Now this is a long process, it doesnt happen in just one night. And this is exactly what had all right. You keep saying compassionate happened because the opposition but you visited china in june this year. Yes. You visited some of has no other agenda than to create the uighur muslim camps. You said there are Vocational Training institutions. Dissatisfaction to the government you know so well there are many organisations, Amnesty International says so they only have race and they only have religion and the platform in the facebook was really the best that these are forced political platform for them to disseminate all of these race they indoctrination camps and religion issues. But the background also, where they are forced to renounce their faith. As one prominent muslim cleric awang from the progressive so why did you say that . Islamic amanah party, he said that there are muslim they were disappointed, preachers going around in malaysia Amnesty International, who probably support the opposition, who are telling their congregations that your current government is anti islam and by your comments. Liberal. Agreed, yes. And, for example, there has been i did not say that. A bit of a backlash about the fact that is one thing for sure. That the attorney general whos been i have already made a statement that appointed is non muslim. I did not say this isjust and so, is your government rightly or wrongly stoking these tensions a Vocational Training school. When you should be i did not even make any statement. What had happened was they brought me to visit this, dampening them down . The vocational camp, i did not say yes, i did not say no. Why . Because my visit was not merely yes we are actually to go and visit there. Looking into the matter. Because the friday sermons happen my visit was bigger than that. All over the country and i must say but did you speak up . We dont have much time. To you that in malaysia, as a minister, i do not have control did you speak up against their treatment . There should be a fair treatment over the state matter. Because Islamic Administration to old people based on human rights. Nothing more than that. A prominent malaysian minister, comes under the state. Part of the Ruling Coalition has so some of the state have not taken talked about the need for a National Dialogue to ease the situation. Serious measures to control all those who are giving sermons he says if left unchecked it could cause a national tragedy. You dont want tensions on friday which they used at that to bubble over so much that sermon to attack the government jeopardise your stability and your countrys prosperity . Definitely. By using islam as its face. Attacking the government that is why we need as liberals, attacking the government as not supporting to take the opportunity in the new government to change islamic causes and agenda which is actually not right. The way we do things in the last government. Especially on the race and religion relationship. The important things but what we do have is that in the federal territory, we have full control over all the mosques and i think we have already talked to all the states, that in their sermons, they should be delivering not political issues. And not hate speech, in malaysia are Economic Growth thats absolutely your position . Yes, agreed. So, minister mujahid yusof, i have to ask you why it is then and national unity. That you have allowed a very controversial Indian Muslim preacher zakir naik who is accused of, the exact words are, as minister of islamic affairs, i want to contribute to that unity the criticism from a lawyer, so the prosperity we aspire that he is an extremely to can be achieved. Divisive figure in malaysia, mujahid yusof rawa, thank you very he pits muslims against much for coming on hardtalk. Non muslims. Thank you. This is somebody youve applauded, why . When we came in power, zakir naik was already a permanent resident in malaysia. We know that zakir naik is a preacher who engaged in debates with other religion. Hello. Wednesday started decently enough across the south west of england and south wales and then came he pits muslims against non muslims, a mix of rain or snow, just depending on elevation. To keep decent weather, according to lawyers for liberty you had to be a good deal director melissa sasidaran, further away towards the east and it was a dryer and finer day than weve seen that was the point i made to you. Of late but there was no escaping the fact the system that has brought that combination of wet and at times wintry fair into that the point is that, i have said this many times, south western quarter is going to be a player more widely that zakir naiks approach is not across the southern half of britain relevant to the malaysia contacts. And i have met him, personally, during the course of thursday. Really quite wet for the commute i called him to my office and explained to him the situation in malaysia, across the southern counties that we are multiracial and he should respect the Current Situation come the afternoon, welljust that we are in and the pressure pushing the eastern portion thats the malaysian government of the front with some significant rainfall up towards those flood affected areas and if you dont happen to see during daylight hours, given the fact has now imposed on. That this system is going to move a little bit further north, you might get it during the evening but he does talk within the context on what would have of the malaysian situation. He is indian born and he has said been another single he is a permanent resident there is more sunshine to be had in malaysia, he has stated that across scotland and northern malaysia hindus are more loyal ireland with a few showers to india than malaysia. But it wont make an awful lot of difference. Here we are into the wee small hours of friday, hes also criticised ethnic this frontal system tending chinese in malaysia, to fracture a little saying they are old guests but each individual pulse of rain and they should leave the country im showing there could be quite quite before new guests like himself. Heavy and unwelcome rain at that into the flood affected areas, thats exactly what im saying, that all these words and statements on what is going to be another are not suitable in malaysia. Fairly cool night and a cool and i have said this many times. Start to friday. Still dominated by the big area of low pressure sitting across us and indeed much of central and western europe and the onshore why then did you say, in march, about him, flow from the north sea, his experience in preaching moisture laden airs and theres throughout the world is an still bits of pieces of rain an inspiration for us to be had quite widely to continue preaching work, may allah strengthen his preaching across england and wales but not efforts to guide people to recognise with the same sort of intensity islam . Why did you say that . That we might have seen on thursday. But at the same time, scotland, Northern Ireland seeing i also warned him about his position the very best of the sunshine, in malaysia, that he should be more the north of scotland alert in the sense that malaysia is a multiracial country. Still picking up on one or two showers, each in their own right being wintry but you also applauded across higher ground. Him though, minister. What news of the weekend . You applauded him, you said not a great deal changes. Hes an inspiration. Not much intensity about the rain i speak of but that set up but that doesnt mean that i agree with everything for saturday is very similar he does in malaysia, on friday, still the big area of low pressure, because i have a nation to protect. It could sound like an endorsement, to be honest with you. Still the moisture laden air it is not an endorsement. Well, it sounds like a compliment. On its northern flank, feeding cloud and bits of pieces of rain, particularly in eastern you can also check with my other parts of scotland and england. Statement about him, separate weather front eventually telling him, iwarned him many times closes on the western isles. That he should also be in between, bits and concerned about the multiracial situation we are in in malaysia. Pieces of sunshine but you know, you have been here in london and the uk could be favoured giving your view on islam, and we mayjust about find a degree on the temperatures. And you said that islam does not teach its believers to hurt ive changed the day, the storys same. Or oppress others, so you really we are going to bring the front ought to practise what you preach. Exactly, exactly. Of scotland with snow on the high ground but further south, but that didnt sound sunshine in really short supply. And im afraid it is going to be like you were then. One of those weekends. No, no, that doesnt represent the whole idea about my position to him because it also relates to my position on the country, it also relates to my position to protect the multiracial situation in malaysia and that doesnt go well with the situation we are in today. You know that religion in malaysia represents a major barrier to national integration, doesnt it . That has been the case really since independence from the uk. I wouldnt agree to say that the main barrier. We today would say that religion should be the main factor for the growth and prosperity of our nation. All right, let me just roughly break it down, three main ethnic groups in malaysia, you have ethnic muslim malays, about 60 , the chinese are about 23 and the indians are about 7 . And youve got christians, muslims, buddhists and hindus. Ok, but research by a leading academic, dr lee hwok aun from the institute of Southeast Asian studies says this, its quite a long quote, but it makes the point. Malaysians dont have much opportunity to develop inter ethnic friendships because schools lack diversity and this is due to a combination of public policy, personal choice, language, cultural differences and political manipulation of ethnic tensions and unwholesome deficit of religious knowledge, particularly amongst muslims. Therefore its more incumbent on muslims, isnt it, to reach out across the religious and racial divides. Agreed, that is why you see islam position in malaysia as the federal religion, is a very important, they have a very Important Role to play and that is why when we come into power, we reject to be that government who uses or exploits religion and race for their political purposes. That is why we are now proposing or advocating islam as a very progressive religion and role that it can play and we have come with a new narrative of islam in malaysia of what we call compassionate islam. That we would hope to trigger the national unity, and i would agree that in most of the fact that you mentioned, it is a challenge for us this fundamental abuse of power, as a new government to overcome it fitness for office. Im Sharanjit Leyl in singapore. And not to repeat the same mistakes the headlines public impeachment hearings into Donald Trumps presidency get that the previous government under way in washington. Mr trump, whos hosting turkeys has made. In order to do that, leader, says hes too busy to watch. You need to have a strong narrative of islam and that narrative i hear its a joke. We have proposed and agreed upon by the cabinet, i have not watched, i have not that is the compassionate islam, as being the main narrative watched for one minute of islam in malaysia. Well, you want all that and yet, because ive been with why are you not doing more the president , which is much more important as far to support the sisters as i am concerned. In islam group . Earlier, president erdogan received a warm welcome to the white house thats a very progressive islamist despite tensions over group, a Progressive Muslim group. Its founder zainah anwar has been the war in syria. Im Maryam Moshiri in london. Also in the programme applauded by the united nations, a breakthrough in the war against ebola, the World Health Organization recently given an award, talks out against Domestic Abuse against women, child marriage, that sort of thing, and here we are seeing them referred to the sharia court because there was a religious decree, a fatwa, against them, saying that they promote a liberal, a deviant form of islam. When really, theyre doing very good, honourable work, applauded by the daughter of the Prime Minister marina mahathir. Why are you not doing more to support them . Define how i am not doing more. Because theyve been referred to the sharia court and you know what will happen to them there that was a case that happened in a previous government, not during our government, our tenure. But back to the sisters in islam. They were the first to come and see me. I invited them, talk to them and saw how they could play a better role in advocating their role in helping the woman being oppressed. I do not think that in my position as a minister of religious affairs that i neglected their position. And what had happened in the sharia court, it was the previously the last government that they had come into trouble with, the last government. So youre going to leave them there . Because you know marina mahathir, the daughter of the Prime Minister, has said what has happened the fact that they have been referred to the sharia court she says this is, and shes just said this now, this is a backdoor shariaisation of our entiree law because it means fatwas can be issued against any organisations as long as it has muslim directors. Shes unhappy. I mean, could you not do more . You said you welcome them in, you said we like what youre doing, can you not do more to help them . Of course i wanted to do more than what i can. What i said is that when we come into power, just one year and a half, not even two years, there are other issues that we had to tackle. So i think these issues were presented to me, we know what had happened. 00 15 14,405 2147483051 44 21,918 and we will see what 2147483051 44 21,918 4294966103 13 29,430 we can do about it