Understand messages like 85 a day and stop smoking but not about the levels of drinking . Who didnt know it was 14 units for men . Why dont alcohol produces a spell out what the guidelines. We have this ridiculous, silver on line, no mention of the 14 units maximum. I wa nt to mention of the 14 units maximum. I want to know why this industry is allowed to regulate itself. Make up its own rules. Is that a problem we need to address, particularly for the boomer generation who are ageing . Yes. It is a cheap as it has beenin ageing . Yes. It is a cheap as it has been in 30 years in the uk and deaths the highest in 20 years. have been trying to stop people dying of Liver Disease. The drinks industry are winning is because the government spends more time listening to the industry than they do listening to doctors and the chief medical officers. Like many of us, claire like to drink at the end of the day to unwind. She never thought it would have such a devastating consequences for her life. Having lost her home, she is now living in this caravan in 0xfordshire stop it is really nice to meet you. What are we going to do, shake hands or aunt . Definitely the hard. How are you doing . For claire, a busy working mum, one glass of wine became another and then another. When it didnt really start taking off . That would be the one oclock time. What was your one oclock . 5pm, earlier. You had the kids tea on the table. I was making the tea, a glass of wine. And then they are in bed. And then we set down for a nicer glass and a nice candle on. There is no stopping them. You might is. Till bedtime. Yes, andi them. You might is. Till bedtime. Yes, and i did. I did. A quick drink to unwind every evening turned into very much more. You are well into more than 100 units a week. Absolutely but i had no idea. More than 100 units a week. Absolutely but i had no ideal more than 100 units a week. Absolutely but i had no idea. Ijust rang. At what moment did you realise what state you are in . Was it gp visit . During the liver failure. Things had got that bad before you realise what was happening to you. Honestly. I blighted up and two days later i could not move with the pain. Iwas later i could not move with the pain. I was on the bed being wheeled up pain. I was on the bed being wheeled up the corridor and all i saw was. The liver unit and it was at that point i knew. The doctors told my husband i had ten days left. From that moment, since you saw the live award sign you havent. Not that moment, since you saw the live award sign you havent. Not drop. Have you come close . No. Like so many of us, claire enjoyed drinking without understanding what a risk she was taking with her health. When i was she was taking with her health. When iwas drinking, she was taking with her health. When i was drinking, i had absolutely no idea and i still really dont know what the unit is. If it said on the box and it mentioned the river, what it was doing to my body, i would have thought i would have thought twice. What makes you angry . It is the industry. Because i know they need to make their money, fair dues but come on, you need to put it out there because it would be saving lives, it would be saving people not having to give their house up, not having to give their house up, not having to give their house up, not having to give their children up. Liver units across the country are 110w liver units across the country are now treating 20,000 people with alcohol related Liver Disease and that number is rising. Many of those patients are not what most of us would think of as problem drinkers. I have come to the Royal Liverpool hospital to meet one of the countrys leading liver specialist. This looks very much like the sharp end. This is the sharp. This is the live award which i have been on for longer than i care to remember. 0ver that time i have seen an increase in the harms from alcohol to the liver, particularly in young people and this is the frightening thing. People in their 20s and 30s who had no warning and suddenly present with advanced Liver Disease. Why would that be when we hear Alcohol Consumption is falling . The consumption is falling . The consumption is falling . The consumption is falling, particularly amongst the young. We think those people that are drinking a drink in a more destructive pattern. The peak age is between 45 and 55 when people are still in their prime. What would you say to a heavy drinker . The liver has a fantastic reserve so you can appear perfectly normal with 10 of the liver working. They go yellow, jaundice and they are in liver failure. Yellow, jaundice and they are in liverfailure. Sometimes yellow, jaundice and they are in liver failure. Sometimes these people can die within weeks. As well as causing Liver Disease, i now realise drinking is linked to hypertension, reflux and anxiety depression. In total is is linked to illnesses including cancer. In 2016 with Scientific Evidence about, the health risks piling up, new low risk guidelines were introduced by the chief medical officers of the uk. It was sent at 14 units a week for men and women but how many of us know what the advice is and what it means . It is a quiz time at my local. 0k, thank you for having me. Iam going local. 0k, thank you for having me. I am going to ask you seven questions to test your knowledge on alcohol. How many units of alcohol is there in a double gin and tonic . The number of units in a drink is not displayed in pubs and bars so i will suspect they will struggle. How many units of alcohol are in a pint of san miguel at 5 . The answers are all over the place. Is everybody ready for the answers . 2. 8 units in a pint of san miguel. That is zero points all around. How many millilitres of your average 12. 5 wine and you have to drink to have drunk one unit of alcohol . And no consensus on this one at all. That is 85 millilitres, believe it or not. Still no points for anyone. That is more than 85 you are drinking there, by the way. The average drinker does not appear to be startling up to date. Now to the guidelines. What is the maximum recommended weekly intake of alcohol expressed in units as stated by the government chief medical officers . Per week, for women it is a 14 units. Disappointingly, for men, it is also 14 units. That is around seven pints of beer, a bottle and a half of wine or 14 shots a week which, to regular social drinkers that does not sound very much. Who didnt know it was 14 units for men . How did you do . Absolutely terrible. You look like clever men of the world, you didnt know that 14 units is the recommended limit . May i congratulate you, wise men and women, you are the only ones who seem women, you are the only ones who seem to know 14 units is a recommended limit. Just you dead. I read it and remembered it. It is amazing that nobody in that room, apart from one woman, knew the advice was not to drink more than 14 units. Not new it and rejected but didnt know the advice in the first place. That is just mad. The didnt know the advice in the first place. That isjust mad. The people are not aware of it, there is something wrong in the message. You are right. 0nly16 of us are aware of the 14 unit guideline. The limit we re of the 14 unit guideline. The limit were at 28 units a week for men and 21 for women. Three years ago, when the chief medical officers change that to 14 units for both men and women, they asked drink producers to make sure the new guidelines were clearly shown on bottles and cans. Catherine, from the institute of alcohol studies, has come around to ta ke alcohol studies, has come around to take me through just how much progress in the industry has made on this centre 2016. I have some bottles into look at the labelling with you. These are not all mine. I got them earlier. It does not represent my daily intake just so you know. We would argue that consumers should have information about the chief medical officers low risk drinking guideline. It should say 14 units, dont drink any more than that. Lets see how this one does. I have to use my torch to light it up. It does not give the 14 units a week. It gives a daily inta ke units a week. It gives a daily intake and it is a different one for men and women. That reflects the old guidelines that were updated by the educative medicals officers in january 2016. It is not acceptable to be displaying the old guidelines because they could be inadvertently putting consumers at greater risk. What it might indicate is as a man you can drink 100 more than the current weekly guideline so this information really does need to be removed. This is some rose, my god, thatis removed. This is some rose, my god, that is so small. How hard is that too red, silver on white and again it is the old guidelines. Some products on the shelf do not provide Health Information on the health but advised consumers to visit and alcohol producer or industry website. How many recorded instances in the history of the world has anyone gone, looking forward to drinking that, illjust go to the drinker where website and check for information. It is an unreasonable assumption that consumers, especially in crowded shops and supermarkets, are going to check websites. Im here, 2. 8 units for the whole lot so not much on that. Why arent there rules for this . Currently there is no mandatory regulation around Health Information units and guidelines on alcohol products into the uk. It is entirely self regulated by the alcohol industry. And there are no penalties for alcohol producers who give drinkers wrong, out of date advice. I have been known to drink more than one of these at one sitting. We have this ridiculous silver on white again, again no mention of the 14 units maximum. Panorama checked 100 labels installed, only 14 had the new lower safe drinking units. This has the up to date 14 units a week. That again is difficult to read. Jack daniels, what has this god . These are the old guidelines. This self regulating system is failing consumers. Noone is saying alcohol kills on it. Put the units and the maximum unit suggested. Im getting sick of looking at these, it is all the same story. The organisation responsible for self regulation issues guidance to users as to what Health Advice should go on their labels with the question how it can be trusted to do that when it is entirely funded the alcohol industry. The industry is not regulated as such. At a self regulated. What would you say about that . It is attractive to government because they are not picking up the bill. The problem is that industry has a primary responsibility to its shareholders. If people drink less, they will make less money and that conflict of interest is not always appreciated by government and i think government must waive a stick and accept the fact that industry cannot be unbiased and give unbiased advice on this topic. While the arrangement is voluntary it will not step up to the plate. When the guidelines were changed almost three yea rs guidelines were changed almost three years ago, the Portman Group was given until the timber this year to get out of date Health Advice removed from labours labels on boxes like these. So why is it had not done so. Why have so few labels refuse to refer to 14 units. They recommend safe drinking guideline, do you buyers . They say its 14 units that is what matters now. Industrys job is to communicate 14 units in the context of wider risk in the industry does that. In which case, how come only 16 of the population are aware of the guideline to the 16 one in five. You are right that there is more to do and it will take time for people to understand the new guidelines and we understand that and that is why we understand that and that is why we are looking for different ways to communicate. The simplest way of communicating it is to put it on the bottles. This smirnoff bottle he has the old units. Four units a day possible for men, that is twice. Just to be clear that is the old guidance. It is two or three years on now and this has been produced since then. Why have they not changed it . When the guidance came out we were given a period of grace to change labels and that ends in september this year. There is ongoing discussion about how to communicate the risk and follow guidance. What commitment can you give us that by october after this ludicrously long grace period is over we will finally have the up to date guidance in some barely legible form on these bottles . The period of grace is then over and it will have 14 units or expressed in a daily thing if you must. We are talking to our members about what they will do and those discussions are ongoing and it should be finished by september. It is not just the guidelines the industry is refusing to embrace. It is also opposed proposals to designed to tackle the link between low prices and alcohol harm. In england, alcohol is now more affordable than it has been at any time in the last 30 years. 0ften costing little more than soft drink. Some alcohol is incredibly cheap. See this one . Three litres of strong cider for less tha n three litres of strong cider for less than four quid. Easily enough to knock me clean out but put another way, your weekly recommended limit will cost you just to pound 41. £2 41. The limit will cost you just to pound 41. £2 41. The government under the David Cameron proposed minimum unit pricing. The thinking was that would push up the price of the cheapest booze, that often associated with problem drinking. It was a proposal welcomed by many in the medical profession. It is a tax thatis the medical profession. It is a tax that is focused exquisitely focused on really heavy drinkers. Most people will not drink light cider. 16 points a unit, if it goes up to 50pa unit 16 points a unit, if it goes up to 50p a unit that is a threefold increase in price and will have a marked impact on behaviour. That is why when the evidence has been studied, mup is the most effective way to reduce alcohol related illness. Today, Many Companies remain opposed to the measure. This is the International Wine fair in london where producers from 32 countries have gathered to show off their wares. That is quite strong, that one. 13. 5. I am their wares. That is quite strong, that one. 13. 5. Iam here their wares. That is quite strong, that one. 13. 5. I am here to meet myles beale, a former Civil Servant who now represent 300 wine and spirits companies in their negotiations with government. Why was minimum unit pricing vociferously lobbied against . Our position thought it would be unfair on the less well off and ineffective. Wales and Northern Ireland are seeing feet to try it so why not england . We have this the wrong way round, dont we . If you manage to achieve a 15 decrease in consumption since 2004, 15 in 15 yea rs. Consumption since 2004, 15 in 15 years. Had an increase in Liver Disease, an increase in incidence of that. Is there a problem we need to address, particularly with an ageing baby boomer generation . Yes. Should industry be responsible . No. Cove na nt industry be responsible . No. Covenant should be, they should encourage it and Public Health lobbies should do something. It is definitely not our area of expertise and nor should it need. The Scottish Government face down fierce opposition to its plans to introduce a minimum pricing. 0ne opposition to its plans to introduce a minimum pricing. One of its biggest opponents was the scotch whiskey association. It fought a bitter court at all arguing it would bea bitter court at all arguing it would be a restraint on trade. The government won and from may last year, alcohol and scotland cannot be sold for any less and 50p per unit. Iam in sold for any less and 50p per unit. I am in glasgow to see what effect that his having. How are you . Hello. Nice to meet you. This must be the tiniest shop in all of glasgow. I have brought this very fine bottle. Extremely cheap and very strong. I purchased this for £3 79 in a less civilised part of the country known as england. How much is this costing here . £11. We used to stock it between £4 and five for minimal pricing came in. After that, over £11. Since minimum pricing was introduced, sales of strong light cider have fallen by almost three quarters. So overnight, people stopped buying it . Yes. People would not going to pay £11 for a few leaders of cider. If they want to pay that amount they will go for spirits. How much of the new rules affected the price of other drinks here . So this stuff here, what increase in price . Nothing majorly. Maybe the odd 50p here and there but nothing as drastic as the white cider. What else . How about the wine . Some of the minimum powders for pound for 50 but nothing at that price here. One of the arguments from the alcohol industry was that you would affect sensible drinkers. Do you think it has . No. No. Not in the slightest. If youre only purchasing two bottles of wine a week, people dont mind paying an extra 50p. In the grand scheme of things it is not a major price difference. What do these customers make of scotlands new tougher drink law . Ive cut down. You know that, dont you. The way of cut down. Do you have a view on minimum unit pricing . It has deterred people so i think it is worth a try. It is worth a try. Are you going to pop these in your sporran . Enjoy your day have a nice day. Minimum pricing is not the only restriction placed on alcohol sales here. Scottish stores cannot promote alcohol on multi by so there is no three fraternal or by fourfor there is no three fraternal or by four for the there is no three fraternal or by fourfor the price of there is no three fraternal or by four for the price of three. There is no three fraternal or by fourfor the price of three. And shops must stop selling alcohol by ten oclock at night. At the royal glasgow infirmarys liver unit, doctors are encouraged by what they see. We certainly have the impression that we are seeing you are patients with severe liver related alcohol disease. We still see patients with Liver Disease and lets be clear that it is still a major problem but the most severe forms of the condition, alcoholic hepatitis, seems to be less frequent thanit hepatitis, seems to be less frequent than it was previously. So i think it is vital that we have taken action. Doing nothing and sitting on our hands would have led to the persistence of an intolerable situation so taking action has been the right thing to do. It is too early to know whether these First Impressions will translate into hard statistics. And if they do, whether even that will persuade the producers to embrace minimum pricing. Alcohol related illnesses are costing the nhs an estimated £3. 5 billion a year. Uk alcohol industry is worth £16 billion to the economy and provides tax revenue of more than £10 billion. And that is why doctors think the industry is so effective when it comes to lobbying against Alcohol Health initiatives. I have been in this game for 20 yea rs i have been in this game for 20 years and trying to stop people dying of Liver Disease by changing alcohol policy. If i thought 20 yea rs alcohol policy. If i thought 20 years ago that this was where we we re years ago that this was where we were i would have been so depressed. Were just not were i would have been so depressed. Werejust not winning. Were i would have been so depressed. Were just not winning. The drinks industry are winning and they are winning because the government spends more time listening to them than they do listening to doctors and chief medical officers. The World Health Organization says that governments should not sit down with the alcohol industry to discuss health policy. Panorama has found out that there are meetings between our department of health and the din Drinks Department twice a month. The Portman Group insists they are on the side of the angels. For me, i would love everyone who chooses to drink to drink within guidelines. That would cost the industry somewhere north of £10 billion a year. If everyone started drinking moderately. Are you sure the people who pay you would be up for that . This is an industry that generally does care about harm. Even if evenif even if losing profit . Yes. We want to get people drinking sensibly and in moderation. The department of health told us it is important to hold the alcohol industry to account and says it is working with the industry to get the chief medical 0fficer s guidance shown on labels. The Department Also said that while evidence from scotland will remain under review, there are no plans to introduce minimum unit pricing in england. The former Public Health minister steve bryant england. The former Public Health minister steve brya nt ta kes england. The former Public Health minister steve bryant takes a different view on that and says self regulation isnt working. |j dont think we should be setting ourselves up for an argument, for a punch up with the industry. Ourselves up for an argument, for a punchup with the industry. Four is, if it was working we would have proper labelling. Would you agree . I would agree that it is completely not working at the moment and we should not work with the industry because it is a voluntary arrangement. Working with the industry with a legislative stick is what we have seen make change in the obesity space, for example. So with sugar it was carrot and stick with alcohol it will is all carried at the moment question i guess. Alcohol it will is all carried at the moment question i guesslj alcohol it will is all carried at the moment question i guess. I want this to work with the alcohol industry but i want them to know we are deadly serious about making a change here. It doesnt seem a lot to ask, for the alcohol industry to meet its own commitment to label its products properly. And if it does not do so, for the government to lay the law down to force them to do it. As for minimum unit pricing, england will soon be the only part of the uk where someone with serious alcohol addiction issues and inevitably heading to serious harm will still be able to pick up a three litre bottle of super strong cider for less tha n bottle of super strong cider for less than four quid. And that, apparently, is something the westminster government is entirely relaxed about. Welcome to bbc news, broadcasting to viewers in north america and around the globe. My name is mike embley. Our top stories chaos on the streets of hong kong demonstrators defy police orders, blocking main roads and barricading government buildings. Tens of thousands are protesting against a proposed extradition law, due to get its second reading this hour, this is the scene live. 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