Transcripts For ALJAZ Talk 20240704

C has become a beacon of relief and recovery. So those quotes in the cross was of conflict and disaster as well as surfaces on the wall on garza identified by the ill see as well that vs pays for civilians. The dangers also extend to those trying to help garza ranks as the most dangerous place to aid work is presenting significant challenges for organizations like the ill see to reach those in desperate need. Navigating the intricate dynamics of Global Politics involves critical questions. The engagement with how much but this huge of piece and then at least on the role of major powers in conflict resolution. On this episode with joined by david miller. As a former u. K. Foreign secretary leads the aisle and see his insights of a road map for understanding the necessary actions to address the crises and garza and also in other regions to dump the democratic republic of congo, ukraine, and beyond. David met of, im president of the International Rescue Committee Talks to alexs era, the david millers and president of the International Rescue committee. Thank you for talking to alex, is there around that . Start with garza, its a well be cover extensively on this channel. The ill see is in bold as trying to deliver aids. What are the challenges its facing . Well, 1st of all, i think its important to say that the coverage that ill just era is giving to the gaza crisis is well narrative. And its very, very important because its vital that the facts and the reality and the agony of the situation on the ground in gaza is broad cost accurately to a wide audience. The International Rescue committee is a Global Humanitarian Organization and weve been absolutely committed to doing everything we can on the ground in gaza without local was to make sure that some relief from the war without ever forgetting that the only way to give absolute protection to civilians in gauze and to ensure the aid is delivered that the injured or treated is for the fighting to stop. Now while the fighting goes on, were still committed to the humanitarian imperative. And you use the phrase deliver aid. Thats true in the sense of procuring medical goods, delivering medical goods, trying to support hospitals and other health facilities, also try and support civilians with economic support. But as well as delivering aid, we are delivering people a we now have the, the Emergency Medical Team sponsored, supported by the International Rescue committee and partner the medical aid for palestinians. House, the Emergency Medical Team made up of international doctors, surgeons, orthopedics specialists, and his anesthesiologist. They are in a gaza at the moment, working at one of the hospitals, as i say, is the 3rd medical team. Theyre working on the extraordinarily difficult conditions. And you asked about the difficulties, and of course, the biggest difficulty is that the war is on going up, but access, getting them in, getting them safe and getting them operating is a massive challenge as well. I mean, so whats the deadliest place in the world . Full aid . What goes into that more than a 150 un . What . Because have been killed since the starts of this war. As the i r c suffered casualties. We have not suffered to say, tyler, to use. Thank goodness, amongst our own stuff. But the we did have injuries from a missile strike on a guest house. And obviously the danger to a work cause is shed with the danger to civilians. You rightly flags the terrible number now 29000. 00 i without i would say a minimum of 29000. 00 because of course, tragically we fear that there are many more under rubble and elsewhere as yet on discovery. I think its important to say as well, while your youre absolutely right to flag that guns are, is the most dangerous place in the world to be a civilian and to be an aide . Well, ive just come from sounds to don and whats happening in gauze a while terrible is not the only place in the world where its dangerous to be an aide. Well, because now saddam, you use the figure a 150 and thats why i just want to make a global points 158 work cuz itd be lost in south saddam as well. It was. Yeah. So this is a global phenomenon, as well as a local phenomenon, and its terrible on a little front. Absolutely. Ill see is present in more than 50 countries where there is quite sees that we will touch on a number of days in the course of this interview. I just want to focus on garza for a little bit longer for us though, because you said the only thing that really needs to happen and goals is for the will to stop for a cease fire and immediate humanitarian sci fi window. Of course, that the us has just vetoed back to the Un Security Council view k of stained in that vote. So how do you get the cx 5 and goza will use your right to, to, to highlight the need to stop the fighting . As humanitarians as the humanitarian agency, we can to relieve the suffering. But in the end to end the suffering, we need politics to come into play. Another moment, politics is getting in the way rather than facilitating the end of the suffering. You mentioned successive attendance at the United Nations to bring release. That is at the moment, gridlocked. And obviously our greatest judging out, urging every day, urging in every meeting are urging and every statement is yes. To respect the humanitarian imperative and to remind you to respect, humanitarian law, humanitarian law says that civilians have a right to protection from violence and civilian and internationally. Montana little also says that civilians have a right. Do you mind geron aid as well as assessing that we argue at every opportunity that the conduct of the fighting means that the only way to offer proper protection to civilian is the only way to guarantee not just the flow of aid, but the restoration of basic infrastructure is for the fighting to stop, and thats a plea on a gene, a dom on that we make continually because we can do so on the basis of what we see. Were not a political agency, but we do have the opportunity to bear witness to what were seeing and the testimony of doctors the testimony about stop the testimony of upon those, the testimony of our clients. And i would say the testimony of our stop in the region who have friends and relatives in gaza is that the fighting has to stop. I, im speaking to you from a mom where i am here for a couple of days. I had the opportunity to meet with some of our staff who have lost relatives in garza, they lost friends in gauze or their links that tightly link asked off to the situation in gauze, went to people in gauze. And part of my job is to relay the as i get an e to a global audience, but also to Decision Makers because the suffering is absolutely intense. And the rights of the civilians in gauze are, im not being respected and thats something that we uphold. Youve said in the past that when americans want to put the squeeze on, they can put the squeeze on you. They said that if they want something they can make your life tough. And of course youve been in that unique position where you can see that. But the relation fee in the us and the u. K. So my question is, why are they not now doing that on israel to . Well, i think that the best on that is the you have to ask the americans about how the discussions are ongoing. As you know, there is a simple pot to this and a complicated part to this. The simple part that i speak to is that the identity and the suffering and the loss of life in gaza is unconscionable that of the scale of the loss. And it is, is that theres a simple humanitarian principle, just as its important to say that was a simple humanitarian principle. What happened on october, the 7th is unconscionable that as a humanitarian agency, we stand full square behind the idea that the suffering of civilians is never justified. Thats the simple part. The complicated part, as you know extremely well from the region, is that history and politics is bound up with the suffering of the palestinian people. And the political solution is, has a matter of complexities to it. I think that if you ask the american, the american negotiators, if you ask the american diplomats, if you ask the american politicians, but also frankly, if you ask category politicians, if you ask and there are auntie politicians, if you all sound the politicians, theyd say that there are many layers to the political solution and my point would be from the humanitarian perspective, is that we have to be able to do 2 things at the same time. Somebody monetary and perspective that has to be a fulfillment of the imperative to stop the violence. But there also has to be a plan for the future. And thats a double imperative that exists. Ok, i it, most of the welto agrees that enough is enough. That needs to be in the media to humanitarian seized by the u. S. Has very much standing out on that side and on this and the u. K is standing behind it. What does this do to the u. K. Stands in the world and the us . Well, obviously were living in a not just a dividing world, but of the world. It is becoming more divided and its become more divided since october the 7th. So in, in very direct on such a, your question, the consequences off of the Global Division at the time when the world can ill afford this division. I mean, the middle east can look forward to this Global Division. And frankly, the wide world can ill afford this division because there are so many global risks at the moment. And those global risks are being exacerbated by the geo political division. Were seeing. Its been on display this week. What i can do is speak to you from the current position i had not from the former position i have, but what i can offer is urgency as an imperative because every day that the war in gauze it goes on, it exacerbates those divisions. It makes the potent politics more difficult, not less difficult a day. But if youll let me, i just wanted to take you back to when you were a foreign secretary of the u. K, you came to the post in 2007. Should you have engaged with him us off to that one the election in golf and in 2006. Uh well, i think the, the uh, the situation by 2007 had moved on. Uh, quite false. And obviously the um, the 1st one of the only things that i was dealing with was a 20089 gauze, a conflict. So the cease fire was broken in december 2008. And it was my role to negotiate very hard and urgently to bring the ceasefire resolution that was eventually passed in the 1st week of january, 2009 to a conclusion. Now the, the conflict carried on for 10 days. A whole range of people led by the norwegians, i think of the time, was speaking to him as the fact that the war wasnt finished for 10 days off to the conclusion of those negation negotiations cost lives. But it wasnt the lack of engagement that was failure. To follow the resolution on both sides, it to a number of lessons about the need to address the root cause of the conflict. It took lessons about the way in which diplomacy can can help. Because that was a very significant arab presence and engagement. But that was also very sustained western engagement us u. K. Funds on the Security Council at the time. And the imperative that i explained to the house of commons off to that vote was to make sure that those lessons were alone. The trouble is they want none by wednesday because the root cause is when never are dressed completely. Youre absolutely right to say that the, it would be wrong to say that there was a byron period of diplomacy off the 2009, but that was extremely limited diplomacy off to 2009. Uh, president obama a pointed George Mitchell is a special envoy the it his 2nd time he aust, dont carry to undertake next size. But really the period since 2009 has shown much small, limited political effort, especially in the last few years. And the last 5 of 6 years to address those root cause is compared to the previous period. I mean, the obvious point to make to you that i made many times, i think including on your channel is that the 2002 or a piece initiative was a very, very significant piece of diplomacy. And it had urgency and energy and engagement behind it. Really for the 7 or 8 years off to that, but the last 10 years have had extremely limited. So where did it go wrong . And the front of it is that there are tons of that to what i mean. Im a great believer in diplomacy. Im a great believer in tackling difficult problems and so youll, youll, youll rights to points out the costs of that failure of diplomacy when i and my organization are doing at the moment is having to try to minimize the damage on the ground. And thats what we do not just in gaza, we have a programs in, in jordan and lebanon, and syria and iraq. And in yemen. And thats the humanitarian enterprise to which im a decades of the moment. But obviously, the worst, the politics, the greater the humanitarian button and its not a button. We can, we can have a, we can never substitute for politics. We can mitigate and minimize and limit the consequences of failure politics. But we depend on politics to you and just as the industrial rescue committee now advocate for how much to be engaged as we are looking to the future to the end of the war and goes into the future of a state of palestine. Well, were a humanitarian organization. We advocate for the rights of the civilians who we serve, then we advocate for that rights when that caught up and conflict a we also, in the most general terms, ways on do that, that the whatever, the heroism and the effectiveness of what we can do in will its nothing compared to what people the way people can live in, in peace. And when i said earlier that its desperate for the people of, of the middle east. That there is a viable political plan on speaking to a moral imperative that we dont get into with were not saying organization that can go into the details of peace, make a peace making is something thats both skilled and the essence of politics and diplomacy. What we can, uh, is the piece make us go about the business with urgency, not just in this region, but elsewhere. Because i think youve covered on your show, there are 50 full conflicts going on around the world. This is one of the most acute. And its desperate that the piece make cars get working. Lets move on to tom. This is the Worlds Largest displacement crisis. Moving to the population that needs support and protection. And the ill see is wanting that 7000000 people could face extreme hung up by june. Besides me as a story that has slipped out of the headlines kinda catastrophe via vetch as well. Yes, it gets us to be can be of us. And so thank you for recognizing the importance of the issue while without in any way diminishing the cause. In the urgency in gauze as to don is, as you know, a country of 25000000 people and the fact that they should be 7000000 people facing famine is a catastrophic reality seats. But it is also inevitable, etc. Suzanne has been consumed by civil conflict, led by the government and the rebel group, the recess, the Rapid Support force. Since last april. I was in south through dawn, which is a country with its own enormous challenges south to donnas number 3 on the policies. Emergency watch list full this. Yeah. But 500000 people have fled to south, sued on despite its own problems, one and a half 1000000 people have fled to chad and obviously large numbers i caught up in the fighting inside. So that now, so don also suffers from a deficit of diplomacy. There is a very limited process to try to stop the fighting lead by this. The government of saudi arabia, the kingdom of saudi arabia, about the people in suit on paying the price for the failure of diplomacy and of the limits of diplomacy. You are kind of catastrophe be of a tenant. Yes, it certainly can. How can that happen festival . That the policies to the conflict fulfilled the legal and moral obligations to allow aid to flow. Secondly, about the funding for the World Food Program as well as for organizations like the International Rescue committee. Is that because at the moment the funding is not that he said theres a lack of funding the you and emergency a chief loss in griffith last year said that their appeal was less than half funded. How do you get those funds in these situations . Because we just say it diplomacy and its funding. And if you dont have the funding that catastrophe is not going to be, as i said, well, theres a very stock message here and its not just the message to the traditional donors in the western world. Its a message to donors, frankly, in the gulf as well. Because when we talk about the responsibilities that come with wells, that doesnt just apply to those who story actually rich countries in applies to those newly rich countries. And the u. N. 8 architecture comp just depend on the traditional donors in the western world. I think im right in saying that for the United Nations High Commission on refugees, they depend for about half of their income on the u. S. Government. That is not a sustainable long term solution. It needs those newly wealthy countries to fulfill their responsibilities. And i would argue theyll best fulfilled not just by, by latrell, support from Child Support organizations in the gulf to Child Support organizations on the ground. For example, read precedent, have a good look. Its vital that the newly wealthy countries are part of the multilateral system. I know in massive conflict that is getting under reported as eastern democratic republic of congo. A correspondent in government says, hundreds of thousands of people once again on the move, trying to escape an intense fight saying thats already killed. Extraordinary. Think as have 6000000 people on a route of 6000000 people is does he get conflict in saying that the aisle seat has been on the ground the for the entirety of this conflict . Can you give us an idea of why it has gone on for so long to . Well, thank you for raising that. And theres obviously a danger that your view is just, theyre exhausted by the conflict in gaza when we Start Talking south saddam, when we talk about the democratic republic of congo, theres a danger for organizations like mine that people just say off. I cant cope with more of these. Let me just speak to the democratic over republic of congo issue and make a global point in our emergency watch list, which is the watch list of the top 20 countries facing humanitarian crisis. Those countries which include the democratic republic of congo, they constitute more than 80 percent of total humanitarian need. And i would argue thats a more manageable way of thinking about the humanitarian burden that exists around the world. In the d all see what we see. We see 1st of all the splintering of governing authority. Thats true, not just in d. C is true elsewhere. Secondly, we see external support for civil conflict. There are intended whats called into nationalized civil conflict. Certainly we see the duration of conflict extended and falsely. We see acute but bone by women and goals because the emergency fits them. Honda and you know that from the middle east conflict as well. Now the roots of this speak to a very deadly combination. Puppets, a miss governance and conflict going together and feeding off each other and the challenges in the all see show the when humanitarian issues and also addressed that exacerbates the political instability. And thats the cycle that weve seen. Weve the International Rescue committee. Ive seen in the d. C. Over the last 30 years. I would want to talk more about d. C, but as you say, there was so many crises going on in the world. I do also want to bring up you crane and this all the time that we have ukraine is just the quote, secure significant funding from the you. But of course, the us is now looking, say came 5 and struggling to get an aide package to Congress Present a former president , donald trump, possibly the next president , indicating that he would attach conditions to an aid package for ukraine. 10, the west, a 4 to give off on this country. Well, ill, i think about this from the perspective of the civilians on the ground in ukraine and the civilians who are refugees in europe. They come to for the will to give up on the rights to choose their own government and to have the solvency and territorial integrity of the country defended an i think this is a global issue, not just a western issue. If the world becomes a place where the borders of countries are just decided by c a and i say this consists of the of this region the, the. Busy then becomes ungovernable, and ukraine is not just a european problem, its a global problem. Those around the world are right to say that europe should have a principled stand on global issues, not just on the ukraine issue, but i think its vital that we dont end up in a situation where the rights of civilians and ukraine are traded off against the rights of civilians from other in the middle east or in africa that youve been discussing to and the fact that the ukraine issue and the goals are, as you have divided the world, rob the united it behind the imperatives of living up to International Law, seems to me to be a tragedy when you look at ukraine, the global south, sol, how quickly the us, the west, the u. U. K. Mobilize to help a fight against russia to take him refugees, and they of course, competitive its too complex in their own neighborhoods. Do you feel that the west, when i say that, i mean the, you, us and we okay. They know some moral standing that in the world to well, i wrote about this last year in foreigners as because i said the ukraine has united the west, but divided the world. And the allegation that the west was giving better treatment to refugees in the you from ukraine, that it was the refugees. Altima is one that has stopped the unit. See that i think is important if you monetary and crisis is to properly be addressed. And so i think is a very stock warning for politicians and citizens across the western world, but they need to live up to their responsibilities. And that is a very challenging global agenda. Is one that reflects a different global balance of power, but its one way of principles of social justice and International Law are absolutely vital. The warning for the western world is very, very clear. And the principles that they need to live up to a ones that they have a not in c aged, but they need to live up to them. But all they doing now is to be looking out the climate prices, again being a title divider of the world. The record of the west since 1990 is a dominant palace of the global system as involves some achievements, but it hasnt been good enough. And that has a corroded confidence. The west needs to make sure that his own house is in order, but that its contribution to the global system is also in order. Thats partly financial is also political, but its also geo political is also about how it conceives of a fast shattering of the worlds responsibilities. Were living at the time of growing global risks. Theres a health risk conflict risk and you mentioned that climate risk. So those with the greatest results is have the greatest responsibility. And i am a passionately committed to the idea that the western world, the democratic world, if you like, needs to do better, say to me in advance presence of the instructional rescue committee. Thank you for talking 1000. Thank you very much. The, the on march, the 7th us president , joe 5 and well deliver his state of the Union Address with issues like immigration, economic recovery, add americas response to global conflicts on his agenda. Environment. Re up to his leadership credentials in this personal election year. Special coverage from washington Early Morning is feeding time, as especially from industry to general southern melisha. While my ridgemont works here, okay, usually after he stopped going out to sea to fish 2 years ago, when my phone was on the way back to show the winds changed suddenly, in less than 5 minutes, that would launch waves in my mobile sense. I only thought of getting back safely. I lost half my catch, but i didnt care. Changing with patterns, meaning that fewer months with safe for small scale fishermen to head up to see serena rahman is a conservation scientist has been studying the impact of Climate Change on root communities. So Everybody Knows the temperature of the ocean side creasing. It is also affects the movements of the species. So we have changed for species season now. Latino, they know where they used to be. Official not coming in. I so easily touched when, kilograms of crips before. No, it is difficult to. You wouldnt get 5 kilograms. Usual fishing has been the backbone of coastal communities in the nation for generations. But thats the way of life is coming on different exploring type 1st culture. Exciting political discourse. Exposing societies doc Award Winning intense investigation. The get compelling insights into humanity. Holden unto stories from asia or in the pacific 1. 00, oh 1. 00 east on which is 0. The us is always of inside 50 for the world. People Pay Attention to this one here just is very good. Theyre bringing the news to the world from here. The at least 90 palestinians killed in the past. 24 hours is ready for us is a bombing residential areas across garza refugee camps and family homes among the target. The find this, i may say that this is out to 0, live from del how so coming up, the us says theres a Framework Agreement on the table for a 6 week garza seats. 5 says israel hasnt