Frozen out diplomatically and financially mollies coup leaders say they cant count a road map back to democracy well the plan lead to the end of regional sanctions will a skeptical opposition return to the streets this is inside story. Hello and welcome to the show im sam is a than nearly a month after malis military coup agreements seem to have been reached on a transition the plan sees a return to civilian rule within 18 months the ruling announced the political charter on saturday after talks with the political and Civil Society groups but has been rejected by the coalition that led protests against the post president to bring him back a cater the west african bloc echo us is due to discuss mali during a summit on tuesday well this is what the military announced an interim president and Vice President who will be chosen by a group appointed by the jointer a Transitional Council will serve as the National Assembly or parliament for 18 months until elections can be held but here is the big Sticking Point the Transitional Government could be led by someone from the military the opposition and ecowas insist it must be a civilian. So lets bring our guests into the show we have joining us from by macau 100 publish of a mag dot com 100 writes extensively on security and conflict in the saha region in the on they cameroon boa c. E. O. Of Africa International media group and then Africa Affairs analyst and in scotland manno electrons a lecturer at the university of aberdeen and author of inherent and contemporary challenges to African Security a warm welcome to you all let me start with milo and say well this transition plan from to an end to a resurgence of protests for now i think who will have to wait and see to be honest. I never mentioned earlier in some discussions or apparent with syria or are those who be on a monday an army or didnt want to people wanted by removing. Their protest initially and also raise concerns regarding the army and the air yes because there arent a lot of corruption within the army and atrocities coursed riding on me before the coup. And this current or a war me is seeing is that the decision to have an 18 month transmission is not totally accepted by the movement that started the protest in the 1st place so i wouldnt say that is a done deal the transition proposal seems reasonable for them the neat time to kind of handover to a reasonable government we need to wait and see whether disk will be accepted by an order which used to position groups which may actually cause problems Going Forward but well it is hearing that if i can jump in here where already hearing a rejection from one of those powerful opposition groups the m 5 are a. Let me take that point to marie and say can this transitional plan succeed without the support of the m 5 are a fee absolutely not thats a big question is is just not possible you know what happened in manley was. First a huge launch projects against the regime and it was really ok down to white and the military took the opportunity to overthrow the president and that was very popular so what people thought and believed and hoped was that they did that sort of in back in behalf of the people and they will do everything to stay sort of in connection in harmony with people as we are but what we and until the yesterday when the the consultation ended. People were very hopeful that they do want consultation and want to some of the people and find out the best way to relieve their transition to have a road map for the transition will be backed by a large majority but what we see is that the floor back to what military rejoinders or all over the globe used to is tickled to skate the power and to try to take advantage of allies and not Work Together for a success the Successful Transition may let me be devils advocate here and jump in for a moment i guess from the perspective of the authorities they would say well they did have a very inclusive consultative process that included even groups that have been left out of a conversation a political conversation for a long time and ultimately the authority Going Forward the Transitional Authority is going to be shaped by a group which is to be appointed not directly by the military itself how do you see the flaws in that. You know. This is a Strong Demand war from ecowas which has now weakened position there and from the super sect that they meet you not for a military jet local to be sort of accept. Its all the neighbors well the International Community so that not everything stops the formalities they want the transition to leaders led by civilians right dont exclude that they want that transition to be led by me ok when we see that they change it change the decisions which had been made together and you know what has been released easily leaving leaving all that many of the disposition which way. And they are adding things to to reinforce their own well ok let me let me jump in here the rain hammered into the discussion i guess thats were coming to the crux of the issue now Going Forward do you think ultimately the military wants to have the top job in the Transitional Authority i. E. The president dont you think theyre going to let that go to a civilian figure served before or responding to the question and i think the. Key lock image and that might be an people who are looking for and or sort of the military heartland sought in military or civilian of milan and what we need now. Is. Though there are a lot of blog military and civilian. Positions the cannot get is it doesnt. Just use are both of them. It scott insists order the you know not what. It is the end for the little dog as well as the military who wish the president to resign so from one point of view the military wants to be fired after the shot and the other they are part of the transition but do they want to be in control and in charge of the entire Transitional Authority do you think i think they want to show they want to share with civilian who want to leave to leave and you did but they were busy. During the course of dish on 18 months. For all of that transition so in being a military and civilian we cant walk to go to one who doesnt shut until. Election and then 100 worked until you dont go up to an elected president so i think. He was defeated you need chips on our. Agenda and that was issued on to decide how. Does a shot well be organizing right now what and and i guess the problem let me take im ok go go ahead ari. You know it was astounding some of them saying that they did not carry their final shots. Yes that is one of the issues and it comes back to this main point let me bring mallow in and say at the end of the day even you know if as mohammed says the military just wants to share things its got to be someone to leave it who leaves it now what when you so we say check the temperature of the military how much appetite is there do you think when that special day as they head into that crucial meeting on tuesday how much of an appetite is there to be the leaders of this transitional process rather than the military in the in the background in the barracks so i think we need to understand that the the opposition or the Civil Society groups that came out to protest options some of them are organized groups some of them are not some of them have experience or government some of them dont or most of them dont and so while the International Community. Works actually. Despise the on constitutional removal. You also 40 aware that the military is some sort of an institution with some order with some wield doing things that you could deal with when there are the people who want to come in and want to play a leading our people we generally dont know what. With regards to governance so its a daily kid balancing act here its not as easy as who is going to lead or whos not going to need is sate who is going to lead in a way that could actually do some structure that people can deal with. Thats an interesting link thats an interesting sentiment that if i could let me take that point to mary and say how do you think that meeting is going to go on tuesday then between the 1000000 jointer and accost leaders do you think theyre going to come around to the sort of thinking that analysis that were hearing from milo that well this is kind of a delicate situation some of the civilian figures may not even be ready to lead this transitional process maybe the military need to have a more prominent role than a cause and the opposition have been calling for your great santa if they feel that they are doing their own thing daniel. This war of images of them maybe what he can force as it will we can be the transition of the gent 1st it was really it might lead vehicle us to apply more serious sanctions on them so 2nd dont you that money is not just a kountry where you had me to recoup money had 7 borders is enough better instead you know yeah weve. Carol weve jihad weve all is security we know and have. International troops all of that they are with the frying french but can i meet with soap and transition is not just their time way to say ok lets. Move around and. Maybe restore institutions and we do an election and said Something Like well like we have been used to seeing east what are the what maps how dilute deal with Security Issues absolute deal with the economy the situation which isnt an emergency so if you have light the other colleagues say unexperienced people not an experience because they were accepted because they were so out of the hands all over through we. And change but if they will get it it will get that they did a military coup which is rejected by the International Community and that they are digital missy was that the are they happy to support and yet they lose thats what ive been everything we get completely debt so they are better people then east again jewel of strength didnt get along with all the stakeholders right and so they had it and had team of competent people to lead the kind of transition we need for man all right let me bring in mohammed. Mentioned there that she thinks its likely or possible that cost could be heading towards increased sanctions on mali war what that means your perspective you know from america increased sanctions on mali what would that mean for peoples lives there. I want to jump on that point before responding to a question is what and what gentle not just to get in there but slant people who organize protests. Planned and. Dance when its going to budget and how it was immoral to what will is before is the cause that might indeed change but thats you need to in order is not because of their political but its not my money and mine and what they dont believe to what it is young but thats why im doing then conservation someone asked of my aunt cancel one for a transition lead but immediately because if im going to see one of those people who are earlier protested the dissolute there when decisions were humbler of his you know the energy and asked of then. It didnt resign so all the other leeches bided and seemingly so coming back to hang on my comments are you saying that when the main Opposition Coalition the m 5 are a few and they say that the majority of the mali and people do not want a Transitional Authority led by a military figure are you saying theyre wrong. I say that conservation money and mind and some people think that they once it doesnt need a military might you not be empty with money and dont know how to do bullshit disemployed of what clearly what it is lesion of the president your brain. Well but of these regimes ok thats thats an interesting thats interesting perspective let me take that perspective to marie and ask that question do you agree with that analysis from mohammed there that during the consultative process it was clear a lot of people wanted the military to lead the Transitional Authority rather than the politicians because they dont have faith in the politicians you know there is a saying that. When somebody kills the lion you cannot use. Their eggs you know so the military the military other one will change because they are. President and let you do is act but and i dont think its reasonable to have the army against nobody i think its not reasonable to say we want to try this and were not the later but its fair to say that if you have yet another corner metal generally living there. The it will last for many reasons is adamant do to stop that because you have in the same region of the west members who are. Running for the dollar like maybe he said making pools they would really love me again then very much and it ok they should do what they do best i mean it be in the Security Side you know securing the all process being there of course i claim my security stay out of politics they let let let me off my know what is the possibility we might see you if we could call it the egyptian coup model where the military leader resigns from the military and takes over wearing a civilian suit rather than from fatigues. So just just in for size or whatever saying im here is. Going to your question is that there is there you have to know that word removed or next to the coup was a Popular Movement im going to movements and dont misread your own countries. And the military is dealing with a situation maintaining popularity benedicite him time me to new continuity so as other speakers are said there each shoes in martinique that will not go away dont need a government to do it so to continue. And popularity is the key issue and the opposition are those who have to understand that yes they have achieved in news theyre running a country needs some sort of institutions with regards to what youve said in terms of egypt shouldnt stop i think so i think the military is actually indicate that theyre not willing to just go looks to me as if they may actually transform into something more deep political now were seeing right now do you think. Community will accept that that echo us will accept that. Well ecowas is voted weeks you know we keep hearing the opinion of ecowas bed scenes you can see all the requests that it coas have been making have been not been an idea to buy their military do you do you do you are doing what do you think can add taken in consideration what it was is saying theyre not actually changing their behavior because of the us now to understand that even a sanctions that is putting on dam are limited based on the borders the biggest borders we. Are with our general our journey on more again so would be good can get out of some of this shoes in just honest and a reality has one on the ground doing nor did your friends joel soldiers did the g 5 soldiers is un someone has to coordinate and deal with this so im not come in and do this the military has to do with rand a Popular Movement cannot do it so dan in no way in a strong position and theyre playing it very well so far lets bring in mohammed if we can and say you know we can talk all day about the political instability in the political challenge to the success of the Transitional Authority but the reality is even if all of those details are worked out the Transitional Authority faces a number of different challenges from environmental developmental the security situation in the saddle i mean what is the likelihood that this Transitional Council will complete its 18 months given Everything Else thats going on. Ok i have to answer the question you got me if what i answer it was a go ahead in the section i think here in marley and above all it would be it does equalize with the mighty endeavor some because of the. Brand work. And part of my life now need to put an end to the sanctions because my then economy is already in the it has been weakened by the fight against terror is on the china of 6. And other things or my you need to look. At destruction and. What does. That mean then choose the indigent and learn that a judge or person they need an ascension so coming back to do challenges of the transition in order to transition we the Main Objective of the guns issue is to organize Transparent Elections and and. To an elected but i am going to try and get his legs are not. Sick you might enjoy. The n ds is walk to sore the done. Done the right to any mistake was minor. For. The hunger of the bar and change after this does im sure they are waiting for a quick change talking about change though marie if we look at the situation now what impact is all of the political and perhaps Even Economic instability having on the conflict in the sad region man who mentioned a moment ago that you know ultimately the International Community wants to have someone to talk to about the south whole region is that person they talk to in the south who region still able to take charge of the situation there. You know. If its agreed that that transition at the end of the day there to lead to elections but you cannot lead to election if in the meantime everything is breaking down you know that you have a doctor of record out of institution a doctor right down to security and some people are suspects the jet is booked and all of this. Is security a new virus and spend most to take advantage of the situation and and or a sort of a bagel or whatever they want so is a very important moment you cannot just say we want election what kind of election you know not. To tell them to choose to die on the dollar and 2030 when it was a transition we saw what happened you know he said we do elections and we had a big guy being elected and not being had change and setting if they do the same thing they were just setting the stage well another coup and another transition is really crucial to sit down and make sure everybody wants the same thing and everybodys aware of the objectives of what is at stake here and you know echo us it will wax has been a very important factor but theyve had to understand that the change is a change is really needed and that that even if it takes it to my us what being right so. Thats what we need to have been mine that. Gender needs to have in mind that yeah theyre all that people or and thats not a good thats a good point perhaps to end on they should be there for the people of im afraid we are out of time so lets thank our guests very much for their participation in the show from a to la rosa we are and the man who led. And thank you too for watching you can see the show again any time by visiting our website aljazeera dot com for further discussion head over to our Facebook Page thats facebook dot com forward slash a. J. Inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter our handle is add a. J. Inside story from me sam is a band and the whole team here finale go by. 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