They staged a coup and forced the president to resign malis new military rulers under pressure to restore democracy so after weeks of unrest whats next for this west african nation and committed to take over it prevent this is the inside story. Hello welcome to the program im husham. Molly has seen weeks of antigovernment protests and rest on tuesday its military took charge and forced the resignation of the president the coleader say they want to prevent the nation falling further into chaos the soldiers have pledged to set up a transitional civilian government and hold elections the move to take over follows the demand by thousands of bali ends for better security economy and that and to corruption former president. Critics blame him for the country is hardships the u. N. Security council has condemned what it calls a mutiny calling for the Immediate Release of the president and his officials the African Union is also calling for the restoration of the Constitutional Order in mali will bring in our guests in a moment 1st this report from about historys. Jubilation on the streets of by michael after months of demonstrations that resulted in death and injuries to and to government protesters opposition supporters are now ecstatic about the potential for change to the government i mean to feel young and the amount of out of the way this regime fell was a good thing it was good for us so what the military did is not what they did will support the people in order to alleviate the suffering in democracy the power belongs to the people the same people who gave the power to the president but he was unable to achieve what the people expected of him wont let military. The military need to organize a transition and that some point they can return it to the civilians to the Political Parties what yesterday is that he said down hold talks and find a Global Solution for the problems of mali. And even modest new military rulers a Group Calling themselves the National Committee for the salvation of the people said the intervention was necessary and they vow to return mali to democratic war money and money and people of mali we are not holding on to power but we are holding on to the stability of the country which will allow us to organize within an agreed reasonable timeframe general elections to equip mali with strong institutions which are able to better manage our everyday lives and restore confidence between the government and the government. On tuesday the military leaders overthrew president Brian Katulis government arresting him and members of the cabinet and Senior Army Officers their kids the president and the others are failing to protect and for allowing corruption to flourish. The promise of a return to constitutional democracy is welcome news to the opposition but there are also concerns that the army may seek to hold on to power something the opposition say they will resist. Their. But i think i might just like what. Makes you less wealthy and bad governance would be a. International reactions to the coup was swift the United Nations france and the United States have condemned the cool with the African Union suspending malice membership of the organization the regional bloc they can have a community of West African States and i was to list of sanctions and land an air blockade of the landlocked country is in effect it will also restrict financial flows from Member States to the country measures that could worsen the already tough Living Conditions for mandaeans. Aljazeera. Thats introduce our guests in aberdeen scotland monolith lecturer at the university of aberdeen and author of inherent and contemplate challenges or africas security in philadelphia so that a wing specialist on west africa and associate professor at the heart of afford college so that is also author of course trotting democracy in africa mali and turns asian in the mali and capital bamako how much journalist and publisher of the. Dot com in mali and news website mohammed writes extensively on security and conflict in this region welcome to all of you. Before we get into the details of this coup its strange in a way because you get a sense that this is a repeat of 2012 the same scenario basically he says and so i am a member had started with words as well and then when i was reflecting on this interview i said i would why are terrible viewers do think that we are in 2012 why were birds de kooning 2002 of think about it or extreme poverty about 42 percent of monuments need in extreme poverty one spread insecurity in terms of east newsgroup spreading one on ice is neat one daniel have the 2 are a group that declared the republic of azawad on corruption links and they didnt know then president was removed by a coup and you have this. Moving right down to bamako and really attacking the president ial candidates so in general a situation of insecurity in this problem is there to date was going on in 2000. More happens if cool happens then the organizers. Organize elections which the money and people will get you know will see sure which books are going to keep them going was the opposition on that had their wheels from the margin people dense fast forward serving yes i had exactly the same thing is not going to see the problems with rocky it does dent demonstrated that he is sealed to change anything and not to be seen what happens so this is where we have come from this is were not so on and i see of point b. I just let it go to says and so between those that are between 2012 and know what was the missed opportunity in mali why have things further degenerated into chaos and instability well thats a good question. I think to go to the previous speakers points you know there was a lot on the agenda that had to be addressed i mean mali had widespread insecurity and it had basically failed education and Health System the economy certainly was plummeting particularly once the north and central mali became really shut down for tourism. And so i mean i think we have to say that the president had a lot to address. And yet he failed spectacularly right and so how much do we blame on the corruption of the regime which we can all admit is is a problem has been an enduring problem right and then how much is just the dire circumstances currently that mollys face right so i think that. You know opportunities were missed. How could mali have promoted better education. And therefore better opportunities for mali and themselves the insecurity frankly only got worse since 2012 and that was just very disheartening for molly and themselves right make quite a lot of stake in that transition and it simply the country was not moving forward and there was a lot of hope that it would lets go to mohamed. Hamad into 1012 there were the deep sea to problems but the trigger was a take over northern mali by groups who were basically on the verge of capture the capital itself now in 2020 what was the trigger what was the Pivotal Moment that paved the way for the for the just take over. Ok thank you like dont want to make some point really going to be gud to prove your sentiments in 2010. For him what country to candle power after the cool. My boot money to rid of former president. Its clear that the same people who shes the president were going to get there from the power of decision to people who helped him to come to power you see the military has a pretty good work ok time to come to power particularly among your son who lived to go. In 2012 and hes a force of the Brandenburg Gate to come to power or so. The legions live here and complain and for me to come to power because it is the end of the work they do for us in money the bleeding and failure of peaceful protests that have been welcomed into the ship if all we do is it but if you had been brutal but at the saw this simply walk all day in the power to day deceive people who kill him or rice because of. Whats well just one point in the military one bought the brand new book arcade is only ever linked in and once all the present to the east who seem to do to me and that is a regime lets move forward because we have many men it is yours to debate model in a healthy democracy the opposition will look for a healthy transparent way to come to power in this case we have seen the Opposition Coalition which is basically the m 5 movement saying right at the beginning of the cold we are siding with the military establishment is there a potential for this to backfire on the opposition in the near future so i think this is the Crucial Point because the almost all of the International Community african actors are you know universally condemned and they have condemned you based on the fact that his own constitution so we need to deal with this opposition asked senior simak what you need to wear that could change the way i see it is that there money in constitutional doesnt see that a president cannot use on. The deal despite how difficult the job was mr key interference in the money and have been in the street for the past 3 months demanding for him to resign is really you more government has increasingly not just our one on shrunk to have very niemi take our. Power on the ground and as the previous speaker said this scene people were elected. In the hope that you can change things seeing someone dimitri seeing is that we have just assisted change you could go into a cool you can corner whatever you want to call it what game is seeing now is that assisted change and you wouldnt 100 were to the opposition or to a simple yes or such and such you know and well have to look at what happens because i think there demurely too were not able to force themselves to stay in power because they have a very popular confusion in mind and sons there was this is what we learned this is what we learnt in from history and africa is going to be my question to says anna i mean made it to hunters all over the world that particular enough ruka they only survive when they have a window dressing and the window dressing you know it could be potentially the m 5 more movement but they making the same mistake the opposition made in 2012 you align yourself with the military establishment the mr somebody is going to ditch you one day. Well this is so thats thats an interesting question i think if you go back we might even go farther back to 1901 right and that in fact who was led by amadou toumani to mentally well he said it right he led the transition government and birth to the 3rd republic of mali and so i think a lot of mullions look to that moment of a Successful Transition and then the and then to towards stepped out of the picture and there was 10 years under president alpha kanade and at which point then toward it was elected as president and so i you know i look at the 2012 who as frankly quite a disaster there were they were about a month from elections for president ial elections at that time right i mean we molly needed change but they were close to new elections but many molly and said these elections will be a farce we dont actually want them to go forward because we dont trust them right now but if you go all the way back to 91 i believe there was a true transition and it was the military that started that transition then there was a Transitional Government and then there were free and Fair Elections and so we could use that as a model in which this could possibly work Going Forward mohamed was in obama code by the way in 2012 when a mother sanogo took over and thats to remember when he was talking about the need to rebuild a vibrant democracy you know what happened to him of the hes in jail what could change though with. The whole is the new coleader. Im going to i also know war. Is unconditional and free and on is in burma guarding 2 main us the news and he is fine according to reporting what the bullet him to see me see me is described as the Syrian Military or you and who knows the top and according to was what he says the people a lot believe on him and the lean in. Is warm and what he think the power of a lot of money and went down the street protesting against the regime they really need change but the let me just go on some point when. Everybody an up wanted him like in men of the city asian and man and on problems of money and he had no properly again into. Never say for peace and instead it is stuck in haiti in norfolk and aria and and once all do the killing of minutely but if wed like to see since the big one came into power and didnt know the problem couldnt be resolved and duds once myself frustration. And see how the study of court will come back to those points in detail later. Now lets take a look at some other military coups in the raids into 1000 turning jointer overthrew president my mother turned after he attempted to extend his role in 2013 ijaz 1st democratically elected president Mohammed Morsy was deposed by the military after serving just one year 2017 Zimbabwes PresidentRobert Mugabe was forced out after 37 years in power because of a military takeover last year sudans military moved long time president ill be here after months of until government protests. In the case of mali do you think that the echo of the African Union have leverage to reinstate. And somehow engage with all the parties to agree on a consensus im sorry i find it very difficult to see how it course will have to continue or not anyone else could do that you would have to neutralise force on i dont see how theyre going to deploy the military to achieve that so i think that really has passed the house in course could have done something before the actual khushi went back right now its just a matter of seeing who else could be als i mean in terms of the indian could be put in place were Going Forward one that wants to this is not feasible so there are some there are some estimates that if they have there has been more than 200 coup attempts in africa over the last 60 years and we had a feeling over the last few years that finally that way of forcing change is declining by doesnt seem to be the case now. No not at all i think there was a hopeful moment that. You know the era of coups might have might be over but certainly thats not the case many people are talking about this mali situation as a corrective right so when the Democratic Institutions fail then you have a corrective who and then you set democracy back on the path well you know thats not really supposed to be how democracy works but i think theres more than enough evidence to show that. Many africans are relying on coups because the Democratic Institutions what are not functioning well one of this government has been blamed for failing to bring about stability in north northern mali but how can you blame a government for failing when the International Community itself failed to bring about stability and peace. Again nothing in order to the problem of one is complete this is the huge and large problem saw in this important money and i am waiting for a lot of perspectives from the new government and from president dunce a liar. If if no on in government and the president can make he didnt call the become thrusted what you see is just causal the problem is the soil in the home of native nations on the arm for serve french our men and we hug you for a good laws. And those of international couldnt come on beautiful solution to my emigration so instead you make and the mine and when we meet foreign soil and what i would add why they would prefer under president then its origin to present. Its importance once all its employing in just finished is important what sort to notice that my then need to change the meaning then once again one lookin want for peace and stability doesnt look good on others all atwitter see are for genuine change man oh but well look at the history of the country. Deposed. Deposed about a monetary tory deposed a mother sanogo depose him cater depose youre talking about something deep in trance in the political establishment or the d. N. A. Of the molly of themselves. Yes and i dont thats a good point glenn let me put this very deeply and we can look at so many different metrics where youre talking about the g. D. P. And the Parliament Index whatever Poverty Index whatever fragile state whatever metric you want to use and people near i agree or disagree even if abilities beyond this mentions but theres one key thing that i keep repeating is that 98 percent of money and that territory is threatened by does a terrific you should im disinclined my man population has doubled since 2000 so this is a cheap metrics nobody can duck i view against so not move people competing for fewer resources in this very dire need of skinners sources people have turned to believe that if things went wrong in my or wait according to my own beliefs perhaps i would be better so thats why hes tried by groups fighting for the ones the its in just because resources so scarce you think if you did things that china will way you would be better off and yet you have the east the rest and then you have this people in the sun who would live in this new corneal state i need think if things were done you know one way you would be better off let me this is the link round that is dividing mars and there is nothing seems on the order of those reasons you listed for the past 30 years nothing has need to go this formed a mental. So that i have unemployment you have poverty have thousands of people displaced. Refugees in places like what i tell you and bork enough us all you have. Poverty. Convinced political order. Deal with those problems. Well. Thats a big question obviously not all at once and but these are the issues that must be addressed i think the fundamental problem of access to resources. Needs to at least have a some path forward and when i say that i think i want to underscore that for decades one of the key accesses to money to power to influence is through Government Employment and therefore if you find a place in the government right then you can share the resources that you then have access amongst your group of of friends and cohort etc and thats a real problem right because then everybody all anybody wants is to have a piece of that pie and and so with the increasing population and desertification and less access to other sorts of fundamental resources the state is what people look to actually to get a piece of the pie if they cant and thats doesnt work well thank you thank you i really appreciate your insight i promise you all will definitely revisit the issue of bali and its future in the coming days and weeks this is on a waiting and wow months aloha thank you thank you very much indeed and thank you too for watching you can see the program again any time by visiting our website dot com for further discussion go to our Facebook Page thats facebook dot com for was last a. 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