I am josh rushing filling in for me ok you are in the story after 17 years of war what are the prospects for peace in darfur well look at the ongoing sudanese peace talks you can join this conversation live in our youtube chat. Dar for is all but disappeared from International Headlines but for the past 17 years the conflict in western sudan has waged on since the overthrow of sudans former president Omar Al Bashir 2019 the Transitional Council that now governs khartoum has been eager to make peace with rebel groups across the country so far talks have missed their original deadline but continue would some success just last week the government agreed to allow al bashir to face trial for crimes allegedly committed in dar 4 since 2003 fighting between rebels and government backed jonjo we militia have killed 300000 displaced 2500000 people alba sure currently faces charges from the i. C. C. That include genocide war crimes and crimes against humanity today well look at the prospects for peace in darfur with us a talk about this aljazeera correspondent has been morgan whos in juba where the talks are taking place in khartoum would want owed by surprise it it of the sudan of the future campaign and in Houston Texas sudanese activists he had el welcome everyone i want to begin with i think you know darfur was a bit of a celebrity issue in the u. S. For a while there maybe 10 years or more what happened since then we havent heard much about it. Yes indeed josh the dark for has disappeared from the headline in the os the recent years but the conflict there is far from over now weve been to north star 4 and south are for just a little less than 2 weeks ago and there are still people or its based in camps there are still people who say that they worry that they can not go back home even with the peace talks going on here in substance but theyre saying that if you like these talks is not related to them because nobody has come down and sat down with them to consult them on what they need whats their idea of security whats their idea of justice whats there and you know ending the conflict for good so you know we still see waves of violence or rather upwards of violence im just really genuinely december and there were over 200 people who were displaced and some of them even going to this insanity and sold thousands go into neighboring chad so the conflict in darfur while it is not in the headlines as much as used to be in the past it is still very much. Were whats appealing there and khartoum what theyre saying and dark or that they were told necessarily represented at the talks is or any more optimism in the capital. Just for having me and i just had leg really with what morgan just said i came back from there for 2 weeks. And i can tell you there is a lot of disappointment is still there its only a little hole about the Transitional Government that there are 4 people and i am from there for 2 they feel like they have been neglected their issues are not even being talked about there is no security i visited. South tower it is one of the largest refugee camp in dar for people are still suffering they dont even feel you know that we have evolution now when we went out on the streets we were talking about freedom peace and justice we have a lot of freedom now and this you cant tar. But we have not peace is special end up for the obama and the blue and i we have not just this thats what people feel and they have little hole and then you mentioned the blue nile there are now some talks going on the blue nile khartoum i havent heard much about the Nuba Mountains but he have i want to go to you is this part or these talks are they part of kind of the a Unity Movement post basheer what was the purpose of the talks now. Thank you for having me josh i mean these peace talks are good for the government pro prioritize that you know made a top priority before a lot of other problems because it in the collection she had in the previous regime when these marginalized regions you know whether. Its through tribal come through. I will conflict or you know just neglect of hell. And other resources infrastructure so d i think these peace talks are very special for this government to be a priority and moving forward like. A blonde nation before they need to be more in can in contact with the people in darfur that are actually affected you know and. Underscore the lucian started a lot of the main means slogans of the revolution was freedom peace and justice and as the rest as the time went by. The slogans kind of being implemented and sent to rise to the capital again you know as much as we can fight as activists as people outside to broaden the movement and actually have to have these peace treaties reach the people in the form. That would make us happy the government happy and everybody and for. Firstly and foremost happy so. Well as sincere in juba oh you can clarify this for me who is actually representing the people of darfur or at the table why is there a disconnect between the people in darfur and whoever is representing them in these talks. Well. We have to be very fair that the people who are in the talks here are mostly he there is off the record in france and members of their groups there are some windsurfers and steps and they are representative of refugees but you know we again after 4 am not up for just 2 weeks ago and people are saying that you know its not been consulted the us that what they mean demands are with their issues and concerns are what it is its a peace deal signed what is it that they want to ensure that the one thing that i heard from some people when we were talking to them in the displacement camps and walked off or was that you know if anything happens in tottenham or the president read those people on the streets i wouldnt somebody has been killed in a big lot in the streets and the massacre happened on june 16th at the sit in front of the on exports as people to the streets by the dozens by b. Thousands actually but theyre saying that you know the killings happened in there for 20 years and nobody came out for them so with. One sentence that stuck to me was one of them saying are we not part of sudan we are part of them and so is this disconnect between the capitol hill and those in power and the people and thats thats from the biggest clinic there is then theres the rebel movements with ice and there is this for for 17 years and the people there are saying that again you know theyre just collect will damage the hundreds of thousands its they sometimes they see themselves damage because we havent seen inside in the force and ease their homes so so they feel like nobody was actually with them in the camps can represent them because they havent gone through what they have on what the possums and. You know bringing up to what happened last year with the overthrow of a share and the massacre that happened what june 3rd in the streets there with the Rapid Support forces opened up fire on the protesters killing over 100. 118 was a number that i saw well those Rapid Support forces those are what we used to call a general we militia right. And they fall under control of the tenet general Mohammad Condon we can go to my computer ill show you here New York Times has a profile of him says sudan ousted a brutal dictator his successor was his in force or so d hes not as have many which is this is not is called the protector right what this is for but hes the guy whos actually in charge of the our s. F. Which are this is the same unit that opened fire on the protestors in khartoum and are attacking the villages in darfur so we want to ask you is it a bit like the who said new boss is the same as the old boss can anyone trust the Transitional Government if right hand man in a bourse or is now one of the leaders on it. You know im for 7 nobody trusts the Transitional Government and that includes. Civilian part of this government because that for people they havent seen genuine and practical steps towards peace or towards solving issues that matters the people are down for. Everybody knows him it was the. Leader of the gang and now they generate began. And they are the army of the state actually theyre Even Stronger and more powerful than the sudanese. Force itself. You know but the people of darfur the just to be honest here they do have a problem with him at the but they have more problems with the system that have pounded him mickey and supported him to kill his on the air for ease because him at himself he is from there for 2 people to look at. The real criminal look at elba sure and the whole system is just. You know i saw brock so the problem is that with him it himself but with the system that created him at the end it is very provocative to see him met down by hand baath leave the Transitional Government. And so theres lots of us here even just to talk about the issue of that i. C. C. You know all the criminals including al bashir himself he should be handed over to the i. C. C. And hes wanted for crimes against humanity of for committing genocide but there is still being child on very minor issues like corruption and this kind of thing so it is it is very provocative for all the victims people believe that were not going to see any justice were not going to see any peace if there are criminals are still straight well ok. Ill just point out a story right now on the anywhere from the independent that says its like bashir is still here inside war ravaged are forward deadly violence is killing the revolution so lets take that off i just said that tweet out for anyone whos watching checked out article out right after the sale im sorry it was that you who were just jumping in there. Yes there is something that would run just said you know about the fact that people in power for dont believe that you know they did they have an issue with the system back created the deputy. President of the server or the deputy head of the Sovereign Council and thats i bet you know its like the International Criminal court would be better trying to better suited to try him or for the work crimes and for that much of where crimes against now up for us to be accurate there has been Commission Set up by the prosecutor in this in general that is looking into those were crimes but then this issue of hanging over a former president bashir and those who have been indicted alongside with him or 41 percent of 51 and also there has been at this point exactly in the Transitional Government when they said you know well youre in front of the i. C. C. You know you should it was just me and the over that is something we heard from the spokesperson the Government Spokesperson saying that we have discussed this before this round of talks as many of them wanting to response it but right after that statement you know weve seen the head of the Supreme Council military has affect the amount of cheap people calling by the military component atoms that will be on the tubes does this and theyre saying that no were not going to hand him over were going to try and get rid of and that is one of the biggest issues that people in south for are facing which they show the Transitional Justice or justice as a all they feel like the system is not qualified and is not ready to serve them they just is that theyve been asked for for 17 years now well lets bring in some voices for people who are in the displacement camp and call ma this is what they say about bashir being tried. Shot him about in the mosque we felt relieved when pasha fell. But now we will feel better when all the people agree to hand over the shia to the i. C. C. This is one of the primary demands i did not. Put him in the here because im probably behind the handing over of bashir is a victory for the victims a victory for all the sudanese people in the name and a warning for any other person to not repeat the same action condemning what. He had does it make a difference if the sheriff tried in sudan or at the i. C. C. I think that the sudanese people a lot of people want to see a shift tried to see you know that was. Something that everybody was rooting for for the longest time but on the country though i think. This is being placed and the progress of this Transitional Government handing it to the i. C. C. But not send a clear message to the International Community on the progression but also i think the Transitional Government has nation that if the shoe does not get over to the hug there could be i. C. C. Representatives come and try. To down or in the court within the region and i think to the people of sudan they want to see i. C. C. Theres not a lot of trust with the recall system in sudan and people dont think that the shooter will be tried try. Its fairly. New to me soil that sounds very wrong message to cities people and i think when the ship is trying to sit down with the same crimes that he was tried with the i. C. C. That would send a strong message but with that happened thats very questionable and i think im going to have that really say from beginning right amps was one thing that spared from people in power for is that you know we want to see the i. C. C. Because great effect times because they dont trust the system because system created to me to this inflated him system but sometimes so basically they think the whole system is flawed and to try to make reforms with the Transitional Government is just 6 months old you know and and even they say that for us to be the complete overhaul of phones that were in office or people rather people out there it will take some time and people say you know again spoken to people and our whore and what they feel about whether the whole president should be tried in the i. C. C. Or women should be fired and of its own like some people are saying and they say that thats a reflection of you know the disparity that its connected between people and cuts all of the people who have suffered from on the consequences of the war were saying that because you know people consume talent and there when the winds of big drop when their villages were being burned when they were displaced they think that its big and waits on the issue of justice so even if we followed up on 6 months if its a 2 years and 600 years people are going to have well thats a big leap isnt our 4 say that theyve already been living it for 17 years and it dont have that kind of patience anymore thats why theyve been back in to see the former president handed over because they see that theyve been theyve been waiting for too long and and you know for the waiting its just a waste of their time like to share a couple of the knives from some of the people in khartoum the last sound bites were were actually from the call ma. Displacement camp but these are a couple from the streets of khartoum about whether bashir should be handed over or not. I dont want to give myself the more i agree with handing him over for him to become an example to others because he destroyed sudan he didnt do anything for it and he stole our money i asked people to organize other demonstrations to pressure to hand over to the criminal court and for him to be punished to set an example to others. As long as there is a law in the judiciary he must be held accountable inside sudan if you goes abroad foreigners can take advantage of him we do not know foreigners and do not trust them i see that the law should be fair and just he should be tried inside sudan because our customs traditions and values do not allow us to hand over a dog from sudan to the outside of them but you know if you check out our youtube live event theres tons of comments coming in right now and im looking at one from mandate and throw the says i. C. C. Is not trustworthy he can be in custody until the system is ready to take his case is the traditional system or one at this point is the traditional system couldnt handle a case like omar bashir. At the moment no unclear no wiking are and you know because the system is still exist you know. The minister of justice for example thats nice but then he is an amazing person Everybody Knows and hes been working hard to fix the judiciary system in sudan. But the thing is there are like just so many things and its very complicated like even for me i cannot trust that bashir will remain in the prison for let us say 2 years sort of 3 areas and nobody knows if hes going to escape nobody knows if you know what is going to happen is still some people even don believe that he is in prison saw but even if the system is good i think sudan should. Hand over al bashir to the i. C. C. Because we should respect the International Laws and theyre part of. The court and i think it will do a lot of healing the victims who have suffered far from vicious dictatorship i want to give props you are so ready for that last question if you would allow me just yet this is something you have been forced out of ones point here are you know i would allow a stronger than bashir i mean he was sent to set a Rehabilitation Center and i could get prison sort he wasnt even tried fairly for those charges of corruption you know and they let a lot of things lie when it came to where the money actually came from. A lot of ones point i think we need to risk take the people 1st and foremost the people that were affected mainly by bashir. War criminal friends and then from there take it on to the next step see what actually works. With the International Community to trial bashir. Have a key you tell us what is life like and our for right now and what they hope to gain from these talks. Probably when we went there you know we. Are 4 and selves are 4 weve seen that i would say its stability in the capitals but then once you drive outside you can see the little which is where you can definitely see that in the impact of the 17 years on the to know many of them just dont have schools many villages tones how Health Care Expenses they dont have proper ones or sources so its deeply impacted the development and lets not forget that these are people who have come out of the real space and gas trying to live so for some of the good its you know it was for them something they say that they were originally farmers before they were displaced and then they were displaced and now theyre trying to earn a living by following other peoples answer that in general to earn some kind of infamous operative and theres already facing a very high inflation so low and lots of things are on affordable for them and thats just on the side of you know development is that the needs are inside as well and people in the camps are saying that the Food Distribution nations have been drastically and you know made much of the united nations. After he emerged in time for is supposed to be pulling out by 20 so theyre concerned about theyre saying that you know were already seeing space on violence in sort of the ledges and surface placement and says well we still can but go back home because we go back to the land that once and of was ours we see soldiers there you see honest men so that doesnt send a good signal so a lot of security a lot of uncertainty over what comes after 202020 when you have whats happening here and make. People have time to go all on and share trying to sort out the issue of Transitional Justice and im sort of the issue of security arrangements but whatever they want with here. Some time to actually be insulated from that paper that theyre going to sign on to the brown and then to the people who have been affected by the war and again we will go back to the point where they said that nobody. Actually so even if its even speech here and people in. House and land rights and simply just its not everybody in fact i think it may actually be whats going. On you know you mentioned the you were an African Union mission ending soon Mc International did a report says sudan fresh evidence of government sponsored crimes in darfur showed drawdown of peacekeepers premature and reckless im going to tweet this out for followers so you guys can check that out right after the show just sent that out the one i know that these talks for these peace talks for darfur of happened the government each had tried to do it in 0405 you win a you tried in 06 again in 072000 in 2012 there were the doha mediators who try to bring peace to the region and now south sudan why should we have any more hope in these talks than the last talks. You know when these talks are better we close it right after the sudanese do volution. But still you know what people of darfur feel they feel like even those who are rude presenting them let us say. That for movements or military movements and therefore are being executed the even. Current government because when the military movement came and they wanted to be part of the government they were excluded by the elites of khartoum exclude everyone and i got to stop you there we got 20 seconds to the end of the show i want to thank all of my guests for being here i hope these peace talks work and bring Something Better dark for thats all the time we have thank you for watching and see you next on. Business leaders this is what you find a bright spot. Business leaders just want to find the brass paul. Informed opinions the economy is actually whats keeping donald trump afloat right now and indepth analysis of the days headlines the cultist movement is only getting stronger the more people who kill the resilient the resistant they will become the inside story on aljazeera understand the differences and similarities of cultures across the wound is another matter when you will be the news and Current Affairs that matter to you australians on Person Injured fire season has killed more than a 1000000000 animal. One a one aced investigates a wild one from urgency. On aljazeera. Hello im Barbara Sarah in london these are the top stories on aljazeera syria is experiencing its biggest exodus in 9 years of civil war nearly a 1000000 people most of them women and children have now fled italy the province the countrys last revel stronghold turkish president purchased a better the hunt says he is ready to launch a military offensive against Syrian Forces the un has warned of catastrophic human suffering in italy province which is under continued government bombardment. People are fleeing under horrendous conditions many are on foot or on the backs of trucks in below freezing temperatures in the rain and in the snow then