Transcripts For ALJAZ The Stream 2019 Ep 24 20240713

Family ok and join the stream today its not a new story but its one that continues to astound why is Maternal Health in the United States so bad but take a look at the statistics the stories behind the numbers and the world that some are tirelessly doing to reverse the trend im really could be al and this conversation is live on you tube where we welcome your questions and your comments for our guys on this is a show weve had a lot of feedback on already with people wanting to share their stories so here are just a couple. I knew the statistics of black women and our Maternal Health i knew of the stories of black women dying in childbirth and it freaked me out when i became pregnant because i did not want to be a statistic i went to every appointment with lots of questions i would ask everything i wanted to know and it didnt matter because 5 weeks before my due date my daughter decided to arrive early my birth plan was out the window so i asked all the questions again in the hospital i found her doctor i would make notes because i knew that literally her life depended on my questions thankfully we left the nicu a week after her birth and were here healthy and happy 8 months later i had a difficult pregnancy where i didnt feel like myself at all and i wasnt sure what was going on but i knew that i had to do something i later found out that i was suffering from congestive Heart Failure this made me realize how important it is for black women to have Quality Health insurance to ensure proper medical care prior to pregnancy to potentially save lives. Theres a lot to talk about today and with us on set brianna green is the director of operations an apparent Natal Community Health Worker at mama toto village in washington d. C. Mama toto is a Nonprofit Organization that creates Career Pathways for women of color in public out and provides accessible Perinatal Support Services and Las Vegas Nevada dr joye a career perry is founder and president of the National Birth Equity Collaborative shes also cofounder of black mamas matter and an obstetrician gynecologist and in Atlanta Georgia Charles Johnson the 4th is an improved Maternal Health advocate and founder of 4 hero for moms his wife Karen Johnson passed away in 2016 and everybody its good to have you here thank you so much for making the time i want to take you back to 2 years ago in april and thats when kara and charles were in the hospital and baby langston had just been born and there was so much joy and happiness in the hospital have a look. Ok. Thank. You very. Very very. Early. That is one hand sim baby so that would have happened so many years ago this coming April Charles what happened next. Thank you so much and that video scope with the smile on my face. That was one of the happiest moment of our lives and it quickly turned into a nightmare so shortly after my son was a liberal by routine with their inspection they took us back to recovery and i mean theyre soaking up all the pride of becoming a father the 2nd leg and its just relaxing in right i call that the toaster or the incubator and here is resting i look down and the the catheter from your bedside begin to tilt. Broadly the tension of the doctors and the staff at peter Sinai Medical Center and they came in they ran tests including. Blood work and a c. T. Scan was going to be that in. Long story short that they allowed here the condition to the teary a doctor for most in hours before they finally security after surgery by our family and i advocated the baby played with the staff at your son not going to take action and they kept on telling us well well just wait just wait were just late in finding when they did take her back to surgery. When they finally open her out there were 3 and a half liters of blood in her abdomen and curious are stopped immediately and theres nothing they could do to save. To save her dont do what you make. No child left to get tested every time i hear it so i am always. But i so i really appreciate the effort to see if maybe there is a waiting for so long as a failure of our Health Care System in general so listen to the mothers of this in the father this is Charles Manson he brought it there since and right away we find that over and over again some from you know william others that a lot of times our patients are our family members and that listen to their not hers and theyre not valued so we really have to work as a community and as a century to think about why is that why dont we listen to and believe in what our faces and our family members or since. And this this occurred at cedar sinai which is a major you know Hospital System in Los Angeles California here in the u. S. So keeping that in mind i wanted to bring up 2 perspectives here this is. That these stories remind this person that the element of class and affordability contribute a big deal to this imbalance were seeing but he almost immediately got some pushback from someone who wrote in this is there on twitter who says a black woman with a ph d. Has a higher chance of dying during pregnancy childbirth or postpartum than a white woman who didnt graduate high school this disparity is not due to poverty or being more unhealthy its an equity due to racism and discrimination on many levels who are we talking about here is there is there or is there a certain type of person is there a Certain Circumstance that theyre in what does that look like i mean when were talking about disparities with black mothers where yes ok income socioeconomic status they play a role but the secondary because at the end of the day black moms who are educated. Have the same outcomes as moms who are not or have lower Socio Economic status so were really looking at the structural issues that are repeated and all of these stories and all these situations have similar. Base backgrounds that end up impacting it so at the end of the day we had to address the racism and it has its inherent within the system and thats what at the bottom line of it theres no other owner balancing out all the other factors thats the bottom line so structural if youre going to. Absolutely have to direct. Your. Of what i feel a great bulk narrative associated with women that are dying in childbirth is that there seems to be somewhat of a big complex she must not have had access to care she must have had complication the baby might have been in distress she might whod been in a Community Hospital and all would be mothers regardless of their Socio Economics economic status or background or question but a thing about to hear a story she defied every single one of the merits she was exceptionally how she was diligent about her prenatal care she was it was supposed to be one of the best hospitals in the country but the world and it still didnt matter because she was spared to be seen and valued as human child so when we talk about a wembley on a sad start to a shuttle teaching you can jump in hand because you were taught to say you know in times that mckenna if you cant like in the last structural issues that code full rank this m. And i think its important for us to really tactically say the 3rd rank them people think of it as an emotion or a moral assessment or as if someone calling someone a bad name and the same people do call people that names and it does happen that will be i think about racism we have a history of like if the United States and the close of betting people face the funniest skin color in the fire that we have a higher giving the value based on skin color but thats codify that not only our policies like laws and procedures but even how we interact and how we treat people and so its why you see if its fairly ordinary but even if some of my famous audi a 3 to 4 times greater than 7 places 8 that well that is not because black women are not getting here and that is the police still up and they do seem to care if i tell you that there is about axis and i think they are not the is valuable for the human but in the sense that you would say knowledge someone leading a muslim saint you get data to show that those that did not. And to that point its not them the mother. You know job to. Take care of herself or herself in a way that her providers inherently be doing you know so its not the moms fault theyre being blamed for things that are not their responsibility they should be going to these efficient than expecting that theyre going to be receiving care that is of the utmost integrity and respect as any human would come into a hospital brianna i want to share the story with Fantasia Graham because it really emphasizes how horrific lack of k. Can be when youre having a baby fantaisie a. National geographic. Spread in the National Geographic spread theyre looking at Maternal Deaths in baby steps in the u. S. And why theyre so high this is fantaisie a story have a listen have a look i was in and out the hospital i was a lie. By dying. And i they just ignore me is that i you know when i checked. You know ok go back home everything is fine. And i die deep down in my heart everything with not because my body was given a life so much for. I was among. You know you know ready for school i just saw a lie and i knew something was wrong and i saw my grandmother and she was i go to the hospital like now when i got there. And they told me to hear a heartbeat. Brianna she knew something was wrong she knew her own body then what happened. She knew something was wrong and we i went with her several times to the hospital on those is this you saying she was sent back home and she was articulating to them something is not right. And not being a medical provider she couldnt say exactly wasnt right what wasnt right but she knew something wasnt correct and every day she was sent back and we were probably about 4 or 5 times that i went with her personally. When she lost the baby at that visit she was actually alone when she went to that and she sat in the hospital waiting room for about 3 to 4 hours before someone actually called me to come and be with her and once i arrived there we sat for another several hours before someone even actually came out and spoke to her about what her next steps were going to be can you explain what those next steps what i will never forget what the next steps were so we went back to speak to the doctor and the doctor told her. It was the day before thanksgiving so they said you can deliver your baby today. And the baby the baby had to have died inside of her yes ok so this is the options that you can deliver this baby today by induction or if you want to go home and have thanksgiving tomorrow you can come back after the weekend and when they told her that she was she literally was dumbfounded why would you ask me Something Like that it just felt so. So so heartless it didnt take into consideration what she was feeling at that time when she was devastated and then just added to her devastation so we did go on and she had that baby that same night so tough to hear and of course even tougher to have to live through our community is weighing in on that as well one person just wrote on you tube stand says they see her color and then they do not see us as human beings so its that idea of being dehumanized here but i wanted to push on just a little bit to try to explain this from a medical perspective we got a video comment from the twin doctors and full disclosure one of those doctors is my brother in law and they sent a video about why they think this is have a listen. So i think a big part of the problem of poor people care and postnatal care for black and brown women has to do with the fact that we dont have universal health care we need universal health care to provide care i think the 2nd issue is a social safety net we dont have the social safety net there are people to get to the doctor if you dont have a good doctor you dont have some of the watch your children having Health Insurance is going to do it now access to care is certainly an issue for minorities but another issue is the fact that minorities are typically kerrick or by the majority and so you have issues of implicit bias and so what happens oftentimes with implicit biases majority Healthcare Providers when they look at minorities dont relate to them what that would really maan their sister their brother their neighbor and so oftentimes theyre kind of put it when there is an emergency this developing and oftentimes they dont recognize that theres an emergency the need to be addressed until it becomes an urgent life threatening situation. So dr there when we talk about implicit bias bias here in the medical field when did you realize that this was a problem did you learn in school. What i tell the story when i was in school and it was in my mind that long ago and its like 1982000 i was taught that there were 3 races mongoloid. And this in this country where weve been teaching that didnt attic space disgrace to our position so that allows them to be to believe in a higher value because thats what the thought that really we could use to him and they could see thousands every year and still we have a lot of metaphor viruses still sleep with races that met a dynamic that means that when we say things like the spirit when they hear those words what they hear is of course youre going to hear words because your genetics period and that history if you didnt expect history of metal even it was the same is embedded in how we survive here and but it is that the implicit biases with every one of the clear people are treated not just based upon a feeling but the act of we not sometimes there are harmful because they explicitly believe that we are different so that is both implicit and explicit in what way different that different meaning that we are not genetically the same blackness in and of itself our skin is sick or we dont feel pain in the same way we must have higher rates of im sure you get time at the get higher rate than 5 percent of the research that hes with that except the innately broken about it and its the same if were all cynically to say that this thing that is farming this is the thing that were living inside of in this country and people come from africa from the continent that us they have better that than africanamericans or black people who live here to get a sense because once youve been here and living inside of this system that treats us differently based upon our skin color you have a Health Impact that we are not. But. I mean it just resonated with me what she was saying as far as the you know the outcomes of women who are living in this country who would expect to be able to have the benefits of being in america and yet still you know africanamerican women who have been here their entire lives are having horrible disparities there are people who are coming here immigrating here. And theres this idea here that i want to bring up but based on what both of you are saying i want to get this you charles. E. Cat writes in that theres a lack of black doctors doctors disbelief of what their black patients tell them blacks get less pain medication than whites Healthcare System itself the maternal care desert in southeast d. C. Not too far away from us here in the studio all contribute to the statistics health care is racist in the u. S. So this is one persons view there but charles i wanted to pick up on this idea of the disbelieving of what black patients tell them because i know that that can then be internalized and then not wanting to seem pushy or like we know more than the doctor when were trying to talk about a problem talk to us about your thoughts on that and what it felt like to know there was something wrong and not feel like you could speak up absolutely and so appreciate you guys. Because ill be transparent one of the things i want to me is actually a big night tomorrow what could i have done what should i have done differently. And i ask myself well maybe if i had been more vocal maybe if i had been more at that maybe if i had grabbed a doctor by the collar. Maybe if i had raised my voice maybe if i had made a scene maybe my wife would be here today but when i was in the moment and i was at the hospital advocating my wife my thought was that a black man i have to remain calm because if im seen as a threat and i get removed from the hospital whos going to be here advocating my wife. And that really i want to be honest. If i would. Have. To make you feel you know my life. But you know what you are advocating now i think thats really important because we have spent a big chunk of this discussion talking about the issues in the problems but you also know the solutions briana you are one of the solutions explain. A Little Village which is an organization that is working with at risk primarily women of color how many black women we are located in order 7 of d. C. Which for those who are not local is one of the most at risk areas in d. C. And so what were doing is were really on the ground trying to make changes within our community. By providing not just maternity support but were also accessing their entire families supporting these families and identifying that the fact that a lot of our moms are having poor outcomes is not just solely based on their physical pregnancy but also the other factors that impact their lives Food Insecurity Homelessness Mental Health issues environmental stresses and so at moments also we train our workers to really address the whole woman all those issues that are affecting her in order to give her a better outcome im looking here at one of the post mama toto and looking here about building your home visitation skills you giving people that agency in order to be out to help other women who are expecting probably and a lot of a lot of women who are in our program who are working with these mothers were actually served as mothers prior to coming to our program and thats part of the beauty of this program is not just accessing you know people who are not accessible to this community or familiar with the community but also bring people out of the community to come back and serve so its the creation of services jenny here agrees that your work matters journeys as midwives can mitigate the inherent risks of birthing while black and bearing the disproportionate burden of or. During pregnancy birth and postpartum and another member of our community here brings up the black mommas Matter Organization dr joy monica says Community Engagement and participatory work is essential see the Holistic Care of these organizations she lifts she listed here to talk to us about that Holistic Care we are alliance created among dealers and o. B. G. Y. N. To create a safer because of black faces and its really a Holistic Care for mothers and what this place is like on the set of beliefs which is a part of the safe as well as in d. C. The center there is if. There is a birth center instead of think about having access. In a community thats usually marginalized its important for us to have spaces that value. Is a way of looking at having to care that allows. Access to care. For their insurance status and so the bill thats when the doctors were there earlier that doesnt have. Health care basically. Essentially they have to have all those things that only are flexible and that in a sense the right women are doing. Well the social safety that the. Wealthiest here should have and we use racism to. Tell them m. P. s i cany saying that maybe you didnt do enough but now you can see impacting so many more women full came a full moms is right hand on my laptop can you explain what it is that you advocating for and how you doing it. Absolutely so this is an organization that we created to pay tribute to hear of not only cure the 10s of thousands of women that are impacted and have been impacted by this crisis so were doing a couple things 1st and foremost working diligently with the help of programs like yours to raise the awareness of course this is been americas dirty little secret that we have this crisis going on in that were working. Toward legislation and policies that will make america a better safer place for mothers and babies and lastly working. In cooperation to create programs that will better serve all families the particularly mothers of color and one of the things i wanted to say and i have to say is that. People like but specifically briana and dr joy are are my she wrote right and what you heard from them is talk about a lot of the expertise that organizations like my matelot bring to the table and that black Mommas Matter Alliance me that they will but one of the things i want to be clear that they bring to the table the next thing is they bring compassion and whether or not its arena williams whether or not its keira dixon. The thing across the board that were finding at that somebody did not listen to these women and they didnt bring a level of compassion that is sorely lacking in our country and so for that im grateful. Legislation would be remiss in this conversation without talking about legislation that passed not too long ago preventing Maternal Death act of 2018 and see it on my screen here not very pretty but it happened dr your thoughts on this great weve been trying to get a bill passed but its been 10 years that. Weve been trying to get workers to count the number of deaths in the United States we have not been accurately counted it was going to death and thats where you. And i would do the dirty little secret so this bill allows us to invest in counseling work and then really having robots interviews with family members and others to see what really happened if you look inside that. Story listening to charles talk about why this is the charles talked about the fact that in that moment and we know that number of the community deliberate will and theyre having a baby there is a number of medical student event that if they could be in a room that i am not a person is never the baby its important to bear. Thank you doll to say much and also charles for sharing such a personal painful story really appreciate you being on the string today. The ending sentiment is this that weve seen several times from people online but song says its difficult to understand that this is happening in the usa me everybody can look up for camera for moms online also look at that. Page for more details about all the organizations that may be out to help you if you want to make an improved session of Maternal Health thanks so much for taking. January on out you see the. 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