the problem is that the because they are running out of time to enforce the january 6th committee s subpoenas and to take testimony and issue their report, i suspect pence felt pretty safe flouting that one. doj is an entirely different story. in terms of what we could learn here that we don t already know, you write about this, you write when did trump start discussing the idea of interfering with certification with pence? did he threaten or offer anything? what do we know that pence could shed light on? this is exactly the proper focus with pence. he is a fact witness. this isn t a political witch-hunt. no one cares about his views on trump. the questions they ll have will center on what the former president asked him to do, whether or not the president ever indicated he knew he had lost the election, and on and on. pence is in essence a witness to the formation of the conspiracy
talk to us a little bit about that. and if the january 6th committee does decide a criminal referral is necessary against the former president, how would that play out? exactly. there s been mounting frustration among house democrats in recent months, about the lack of action by the justice department against trump and his allies. yes, for refusing so far, not doing anything about the criminal referrals that they sent over for some of these trump allies who defied the january 6th committee s subpoenas, for not moving to charge the president with any crimes, or for moving to levy any kind of sanctions against the former president. and so if the january 6th committee were to decide to submit a formal criminal referral for the former president, i mean there s not actually any type of formal process for them to do so. the committee could include this in their final report. and how exactly they thought the former president committed a