Southern coast of ukraine in the future- the future. is it fair to say this is a the future. is it fair to say this is a sort the future. is it fair to say this is a sort of the future. is it fair to say this is a sort of defining . this is a sort of defining moment in this war? is that the point at which the russians begin to retreat and acknowledge some kind of defeat in their action? i acknowledge some kind of defeat in their action? in their action? i don t think so. i in their action? i don t think so- i think in their action? i don t think so. i think the in their action? i don t think so. i think the ukrainians i in their action? i don t think. so. i think the ukrainians have to defeat russians on the ground. the russians are giving every indication that they will mild mac launch an invasion in the donbas region. i don t think the loss of moskva, humiliating it may be, will transform the military situation or convince president putin that it s a bad idea to continue.
It s great to get you on the programme, doctor farley. i just want to get your reaction to the sinking of that black see flagship. whether it s caused by mistake, how significant is this in terms of the conflict in ukraine? this is an enormous the conflict in ukraine? this is an enormous symbolic . the conflict in ukraine? ti 3 is an enormous symbolic victory for the ukrainians, whether the ship sank because they had it with missiles or whether it should think out of russian incompetence. the name of the ship is moskva. would suggest an enormous political importance. it was involved in the attack on snake island, the most famous moment but thus far. this is a tremendous victory for ukraine, even if they didn t contribute to the sinking, and it s an enormous defeat for russia. the armed forces simply aren t up to snuff in terms of modern
Has now sunk while being towed back to harbour that, i think, is a major blow to the prestige of the russian armed forces. and it kind of goes against what president putin was saying just a couple of days ago when he declared that what he calls his special military operation was going according to plan. talking of president putin, a couple of things struck me, clive, when i was listening to your interview. the first thing is how different the presidents of russia and ukraine are. on the one hand, you ve got president zelensky trying to get his message out to the world, giving interviews to western journalists. vladimir putin hasn t given interviews to the western media since russia attacked ukraine. but there s one thing the two men have in common publicly, at least, they both insist they re going to win. i m joined now by dr robert farley from the patterson school of diplomacy and international commerce, and is author of the the battleship book.