Former GOP representative Joe Scarborough and Mika Brezinski interview newsmakers, politicians and pundits about the issues of the day. Was obvious the meeting was to get information from foreign nationals which is a crime. Lawyers running around collusion is not a crime. Anybody knows a low he ranking congressman like i was in my first year understood you cant get an in kind contribution from mullahs in iran or Vladimir Putin in russia. Thats right, joe. The president is concerned. Hes anxious, fearful about where this is all headed. His legal team is focused on that Trump Tower Meeting as they have been for some time. Thats a key moment in the mueller investigation. Our reporting, despite what the president tweeted in response to it very much is that hes worried about don junior, expressed that worry to people hes been talking to on the phone, privately brouting about this. Mueller seems to be inching
closer and closer to the oval office, to the people in the president s circle. Thats why you see the President Lashing out at twitter, lashing out at the campaign rallies, tweet about the witch hunt more and more, tweeting about Robert Mueller more and more and more. Thats how hes channelling all that frustration and for. Its important to keep reviewing the facts as the president and others try to muddle them on twitter. The new yorkers adam staved son lays out the facts about which theres no dispute at all, that the president and top advisers knowingly met with officials connected to the russian government hopefully to obtain dirt on their political opponent. That document stolen and were later used in an overt effort to sway the election. These are facts, that when the Trump Tower Meeting was uncovered, the president instructed his son and staff to
political scandal, at the end of the day, it may not be the crime, but the coverup to the crime that does the most damage. We have all this in broad daylight. Donald trump lying through his teeth about this meeting specifically from the beginning. Thats the principle point of danger for mr. Trump right now, what happened after post meeting. We know for a fact, fac t, he sat on Air Force One and helped prepare a false statement. Richard, this further im meshes him into, not collusion, but a conspiracy. Harkening about watergate, its about what you did and then what you do about what you did. When you read the law, it never says money has to change hands, it can be a contribution of any sort. Power of the office of the presidency, but it cuts even deeper than just simply the symbolic significance of that office. It cuts to the heart of who we take ourselves to be as a democratic society. Not only was it conspiracy to defraud, hes aiding and abetting, and undermining of our democratic society. Whats interesting, i keep going back to this page 379 in Michael Wolffs Fire And Fury. Bannon blowing his stack over this meeting and what they did on the airport. He said donald junior will crack like an egg. Michael cohen will crack like an egg. Bannon said way back when whatever we think about that book, bannon expressly said that this would be the problem, this meeting right here. And you can disregard so much, kasie hunt, of what bannon
said. You can disregard so much of whats in Fire And Fury if you want to, but bannon was dead on there. I actually talked to a Reporter Back in march or april of 2017, and i asked who do you think is in the most legal jeopardy. His response, don junior. He knew about this meeting. None of us, though, knew he was in close with the trump campaign. He knew about the meeting. And if he knew about the meeting, you know muellers team knew about the meeting. There is no doubt for over a year the mueller team has been looking at don junior and this meeting and the setting up of this meeting and how excited he was to have this meeting and considered him to be perhaps of all the people around donald trump, the person in the most legal jeopardy. Joe, think about Robert Muellers broader strategy as a prosecutor. He has shown throughout this investigation that one of the most effective ways for him to put pressure on the principals hes interested in going after is to go after their families, to pressure Michael Flynns son, for example, to pressure Manafort Paul manaformanafor daughter and soninlaw has come under pressure. It shows you that this is working. This is his name sakes son. Those tweets reveal this president has been pushed farther than he has ever before and this is really getting to him. Thats not an accident. Thats a strategy. Hey, phil, ive got to ask you just because your team, your paper, you all have done some of the best reporting on this and done the reporting on this particular case that seems to have triggered the president. I find it one of the most extraordinary iron anies of this
whole thing, by writing this tweet out of concern for his son, donald trump has made his sons situation worse by effectively going on the record and saying his son, in fact, was doing something that was illegal. I want to ask you in that context what do people around the president think comes next, given one of the things that triggers trump most is the possible jeopardy of the people close to him including his family, what do they anticipate will be the next stages of this, as trump starts to lash out on twitter, how far do they think he will go to try to protect his son, soninlaw, daughter, anybody in bob muellers crosshairs. John, its entirely speculative. In truth, they dont know quite how far the president will go. Theres a couple of things going on here. Theres a general feeling on the legal team, at the white house, generally speaking, that there could be a big shoe to drop from
mueller in the next couple weeks before labor day, he may have another round of indictments and take some action before the Midterm Campaign season really kicks into gear, labor day, at which theres an expectation that mueller would go dark for a little while until after the election. The second thing going on is trump is currently weighing whether to sit down with mueller for an interview. Those discussions are going on right now as we speak over the next few days. Hes expected to decide he and his lawyers have been disagreeing about this. The president wants to talk to mueller for the interview. The lawyers obviously dont want him to because of all the potential problems the president could create for himself if hes not truthful. We know hes not always truthful. Washington post fact checker has over 4,000 miss truths and lies so far. Thats what youre seeing fueling the president. A larger universe that
havent spoken about. Its the universe called america. Right now america is being led by a man who uses his public appearances at rallies across this country, first time in my lifetime, first time in anyones lifetime, that the president of the United States uses these appearances to foster hate, division, unrest, and you just wonder now really the impact of that. I wonder about it, about the impact of that much more so than these legal things that hes going to go through, obstruction, whatever you want to call it, conspiracy. This is really a Pivotal Moment in the course of american history. It really is. There are so many different americas. Its a big place. I remember during the bp spill and we looked at the sewage the oil coming out of that pipe at the bottom of the gulf. And somebody that was a lifelong resident of the Gulf Of Mexico was concerned. We were all concerned. We read articles about how that would destroy all life in the gulf for 50 years to come and shrimping industry would be wiped out. Well, its a big gulf. It went away. Thank god it went away and hopefully there wont be too much contamination about it. But there are different americas. There is the america of Donald Trumps white house. Theres that reality, something that we focus on an awful lot because its our job to focus on it. The russia investigation is extraordinarily serious. The violence he does to constitutional norms, extraordinarily serious what he says about reporters, extraordinarily serious. We focus on that. Most of americans arent focusing on that right now. They are still focusing on their job, their paycheck every two weeks, how their Small Business is doing, are they going to be able to comfortably afford to send their kids back to school in the fall, are they going to be able to get a new car . By that standard, a lot of america is thinking things are going pretty well and no, im not going to be watching donald trump at a rally, im going to watch the office, modern family, a movie on netflix. Thats sort of what i found during impeachment. We were all going crazy up on capitol hill. Most Everybody Else during that time, the kids were out of school. Theyre getting ready for christmas. They were focusing on things far different than what we were focusing on. It doesnt mean what we or talking about, mika, right now isnt extraordinary important. I think it is. As far as history goes and
government goes, it is the most important thing, and we have to talk about it. People have a responsibility to talk about it. We do have to understand that for a lot of people donald trump is an entertaining side show, perhaps a maddening side show, but they see a very Strong Economy. Its going to be a question, do more of those people go out in november, or do more young people, black voters, hispanic voters that have been insulted, Muslim American voters who have been told you dont belong in america, do more of those voters go out and say, enough, this Isnt The Land that we read about growing up. This Isnt The Land that is framed by the statue of libbert. Well see. Theres no doubt right now its a little complicated out there and either party can win. A lot of folks are busy with their jobs. Our jobs are to ask the
questions which well continue to do. Philip rucker, be thank you and your reporting. Mika, also, what our jobs are, too, to watch the yankees and the red sox. Well, there is that. Richard, let me tell you something, 162 games as you know, this time yesterday, this time yesterday 40 years ago the Boston Red Sox were 40 games ahead of the New York Yankees and then a guy named bucky dent came into fenway and hit a home run. It aint over, richard, until its over. But just between you and me, its over. Joe, i thought you were a bigger and better man. If it makes you feel big to go after me today, i mean really. Its really all i have in life, richard. Still ahead on morning joe, trump says he likes mike. Michael jordan says he likes lebron. How the president s attempt to
divide sports fans, backfired completely. One of the folks weighing in on that, the expresident of iran who stepped up his twitter trolling over the weekend. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Call in the next ten minutes. And if thats not enough, well look after your every dollar. Put down the phone. And if thats not enough, well look after your every cent. Grab your wallet. Beeping Sound Computer Voice access denied. And if thats still not enough to help you save. Oh the new one well bring out the dogs. Mush dogs barking the old ones just fine well do anything, seriously anything, to help our customers. Thanks. Ally. Do it right. Its a hightech revolution in sleep. The new sleep number 360 smart bed. It intelligently senses your movement and automatically adjusts on each side to keep you both comfortable. And snoring . How smart is that . Smarter sleep. To help you lose your dad bod, train for that marathon, and wake up with the patience of a saint. The new sleep number 360 smart bed, from 999. Smarter sleep will change your life. I couldnt catch my breath. It was the last song of the night. It felt like my heart was skipping beats. They said i had afib. Whats afib . I knew that meant i was at a greater risk of stroke. I needed answers. My doctor and i chose xarelto® to help keep me protected from a stroke. Oncedaily xarelto®, a latestgeneration Blood Thinner significantly lowers the risk of stroke in people with afib not caused by a heart valve problem. Warfarin interferes with at least 6 of your bodys natural bloodclotting factors. Xarelto® is selective, targeting just one critical factor. For afib patients well managed on warfarin, there is limited information on how xarelto® compares in reducing the risk of stroke. Dont stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase your risk of stroke. While taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. Xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. It may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. Get help right away for unexpected bleeding or unusual bruising. Do not take xarelto® if you have an Artificial Heart Valve or abnormal bleeding. Before starting, tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures and any kidney or liver problems. Learn all you can to help protect yourself from a stroke. Talk to your doctor about xarelto®. And lets you control your network with the xfi app. Its the ultimate wifi experience. Xfinity xfi, simple, easy, awesome. President trump spent part of his weekend in a war of words with Basketball Superstar lebron james. Because that really makes sense, mika. If youre worried about an upcoming election in ohio, you want to attack ohios favorite son right before that Special Election. The president tweeted, lebron james was just interviewed by the dumbest man on television, don lemon, he made lebron look smart which isnt easy to do. I like mike, a reference to Michael Jordan. The tweet followed an interview by lemon of james for the new school for atrisk children in
his hometown of akron, ohio. It included a negative assessment saying the president using sports as a way to divide us. James received a wave of support including from Michael Jordan. A spokesman saying he supports james adding hes doing an amazing job for his community. First Lady Melania Trump commended james on his school. Her spokeswoman maintained in a further statement that mr. Trump was not taking sides on the matter. Kind of like the United States saying on december 8, 1941, we or not taking sides on the matter. Over five years ago, he tweeted congratulations to king james on winning athlete of the
year. Lebron is also a great guy. You can almost hear this guy sounded like an old, grumpy, white racist grandpa in queens or in alabama yelling at his tv said saying this black man is stupid, that a black man is stupid. First youd say, gee, boy, hes really losing it because who would be that racially insensitive to do that, but no, its his strategy. Its what donald trump thinks. He told his staff members, basically attacking black athletes, thats really good for me, thats really good politically going into the midterms. I think youre right, joe. Remember the speech in alabama when he went after nfl players
and called them s. O. B. S. Its a Situation Trump is most comfortable, especially when hes in trouble, to to be the cultural warriors that speaks to the Dark Underside of this country. To go after lebron revealed very clearly a pattern, a pattern that speaks to his on going belief about black folks and women in particular because he has this pension to describe black people as dumb. He has a tendency to describe women as dumb, not just Maxine Waters, but women in general. So it seems to me this is trump being the cultural warrior. The irony is this is the man who founded trump university, this fraudulent thing. Here is lebron james opening up a Public School in cleveland. You couldnt get a better contrast of moral human beings. And every phase of their life, mike barnicle. By the way, mel len dwras spokesperson can say she cuss on the trying to get involved, but
she got involved in the middle of it and chose to side with lebron. Joe, this gets to what we were talking about before the break and what eddy just spoke about. Race remains now and forever the third rail of american life, not american politics. We really dont have a handle on it. We have a leader, the ostensible leader of the United States of america, the president of the United States, who continually plays with it and provokes people with it. Its truly dangerous and its going to end even more badly than it is right now. It would be bad enough if it were restricted to africanamerican athletes and to africanamerican women, female members of Congress Like Maxine Waters. Think about it. You have barack obama, the first africanamerican president of the United States, hes from kenya. Maxine waters, shes an idiot. Blackwater, idiot. Black after countries, s holes. If you think of anything in political life, cultural life, gloenl life that associates itself with dark pigmentation, the president of the United States thinks theyre idiots, evil, fraudulent. Its not just a pattern that extends yes, hes obviously mao maoing Colin Kaepernick and africanamerican nfl players and lebron james now. He doesnt restrict himself to one species of africanamerican, or one category of africanamerican. If youre black, the president takes a crap all over you. This gets to your point about toxins. Its the most consistent thing in your public profile. Hes injected it. Other than don king you cant find an africanamerican that the president has any respect for. Its such a turn to his
private life before he was in politics and when he actually both personally and professionally had friends, had acquaintances in the black community. Yu can talk to reverend al about it. You can talk to a lot of entertainers about it. So it is this calculated, cynical, david dukelike use of racism for political gain. As meacham always says, it may be a good starter, but its a terrible finisher. You dont have to go back that far, john heilemann, to see whats happened in the past, predict whats going to happen in the future. Go back to doug jones Special Election in alabama. I think one of the most remarkable statistics ive seen in quite some time is the fact that more alabama black voters
across what they call the black belt in central alabama, a higher percentage of black voters came out to vote for doug jones in that Special Election than voted for barack obama in 08 and 12 percentagewise, is unheard of. It is historic. Its probably never happened before, and donald trump is the reason it happened. Right. Joe, ill ask eddie about that. The president thinks this strategy helps with his base clearly. Theres plenty of evidence to suggest that donald trump is a stonecold racist. Beyond that, theres the politics of it. He thinks it helps with his base. For every dispossessed, selfpitying white voter who likes the fact that donald trump takes on every feyerick in sight, theres often an africanamerican female voter we saw in alabama who is equally
inflamed by Donald Trumps behavior towards africanamericans and his tolerance for and praise for white nationalists and neonazis in charlottesville, virginia. We saw that evidenced in alabama and virginia. I think its important that we not simply think about donald trump appealing to a racist base. He sits in the sweet spot between loud racist, the soft bigotry of liberals and the contradictions of american capitalists. And what do i mean by that . When he sends out that bone, throws out the red meat, thats okay. It speaks to them. The soft bigotry, thats the silent majority, the folks that believe Big Government is taking money from hard working white people and giving it to undeserving brown people. These are folks that want to keep their neighborhoods the way they are, the folks committed to
racial equality but according to Social Science data, that are skeptical of policies that will remedy racial inequality. Then you have folks working their behind off in Rural America, working their behinds off with three jobs in Urban America who cant make ends meet. Donald trump sits right in that sweet spot. Every time he engages in a cultural war, hes throwing a bone to the racists. Its easy for us to think we can just denounce him as the loud racist, but thats not the source of his power. The source of his power is he sits at the intersection of all three of those things, in my view. He kbruuses this power to cr policy that separates children from families and attacks a sports star who creates a school for atrisk kids. Its really sad to use the president s little term, sad. Still ahead, from the start of his presidency, donald trump has muddied what should have been a clear message, russia interfered. Now the Washington Post is taking a deep dive into what happened in 2016. That is coming up next. Is z hey, no big deal. Youve got a good record and Liberty Mutual wont hold a grudge by raising your rates over one mistake. You hear that, karen . Liberty mutual doesnt hold grudges. How mature of them. For drivers with Accident Forgiveness Liberty Mutual wont raise their rates because of their first accident. Liberty mutual insurance. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty
this president wants to make very clear that he was not the president in 2016 when evidence of russian interference and meddling in our democracy in 2016 was presented to that president and his Security Team and buried because they wanted the other person to win and indeed thought she would win the presidency. White house counselor Kellyanne Conway yesterday giving some more alternative facts. But when the department of Homeland Security and director of National Intelligence issued a statement in October Of 2016 publicly blaming russia for hacking, President Trump claimed it was to hurt his candidacy. I notice any time anything wrong happens, they like to say the russians she doesnt know if its the russians doing the hacking. Maybe there is no hacking. They always blame russia. The reason they believe russia
because they think theyre trying to tarnish me with russia. This morning the Washington Post announced this coming october it will release a Book Exam Eng Russian enter fines in the 2016 election and the subsequent political, legal and diplomatic fallout. The book is entitled The Apprentice, trump, russia and the subversion of america, written by greg miller who joins us now. Greg, thank you very much for being on. Thank you. Who is The Apprentice in this case . And also, i understand you conducted hundreds of interviews with people who are there. As much as donald trump thinks its to hurt him, this is about America Being attacked, is it not . The apprentice, we love the title. It works on a number of levels here. Trump is an apprentice in many ways, learning on the job. It ties back to the job and hes so subservient to Vladimir Putin that he seems like an apprentice to the ruks leader. To what extent would the russian policy or intervention, however you want to call it, was that triggered by Donald Trumps emergence on the american political scene. Regardless of the specific candidates that emerged if. Thats a great question. What we know from Intelligence Reports and intelligence sources is that it started broad for russia. The sber feerns in the 2016 election, started with broad objectives to undermine american democracy, to make america look dysfunctional. It had a side objective of trying to tarnish Hillary Clinton because of Vladimir Putins animosity toward her. In the middle of the campaign when it looked like trump was starting to rise above the
crowd, the Russian Campaign pivoted behind him. Were coming to terms with the extent and reach of that effort. This books goes really, really far in trying to understand and explain just how significant it was. Greg, its kasie hunt. Ive envious that youve had so much time to focus on one topic as weve struggled to keep up with the daily pointing. To that point, we are struggling every day to understand, to follow these tweets, figure out what is important, separate the noise from the substance. Having spent all this time looking at this, what are the points that we should be spending the most time focused on . Is it the Trump Tower Meeting . Is it the president calling for russia to find the 30,000 missing Hillary Clinton emails . What are the key Turning Points . You hit on a couple of those key Turning Points, but i have to say two things. One, i feel you. The daily deluge even working on this project for the past year was really hard at times, to turn your eyes, to avert your gaze from the daily developments and crazy and chaos. By i think what i took out of this exercise was to look at the sweep of the story. What we tried to do with this book is help people understand the origin of this and where its taken us as a country. It goes inside not only the white house, but the president s legal team. It goes inside facebook. It goes inside the cia, inside the fbi and inside the mueller investigation, and it brings all of that together. Greg, you just mentioned one of the least discussed aspects of where we are now with regard to putin and russia and the present administration, and its the root of this, the origin of this. Hillary clinton and vladimir
putin. Give us an explanation of what happened and why it so affected putin to the extent hes doing what hes doing. As you must know, Vladimir Putin is really animated and motivated by a deep sense of grievance, a conviction that the collapse of the soviet union was a Terrible Development for russia, that it stepped back and ceded power in the world in a way it should president have. He became focused on Hillary Clinton much later when he was president of russia, when there were protests around russia in places like ukraine. And then when protests erupted in moscow, he blamed Hillary Clinton who was the Secretary Of State at time for fomenting this opposition to him, and he identified her as the point person for an american effort to
unseat him, for regime change. He really believed that that was the case. The book The Apprentice, trump, russia and the Subversion Of American Democracy will be available october 2nd. Greg miller, thank you very much for being on this morning. Thank you for having me. Still ahead, a closer look at the abolish i. C. E. Movement and the president s child separation policy. Well talk to the author of a new piece entitled how i. C. E. Went rogue. Plus, Nicolas Maduro survives what his government describes as an assassination attempt. Well discuss that when we come back. vo this is not a video game. This is not a screensaver. This is the destruction of a cancer cell by the bodys own immune system, thanks to medicine that didnt exist until now. And today can save your life. When you have something you love, you want to protect it. At legalzoom, our network of attorneys can help you every step of the way. With an estate plan including wills or a living trust that grows along with you and your family. Legalzoom. Where life meets legal. Booking a flight doesnt have to be expensive. Just go to priceline. Its the best place to book a flight a few days before my trip and still save up to 40 . Just tap and go. For the best savings on flights, go to priceline. All around louisiana. Youre a nincompoop phone ping gentlemen, i have just received word the louisiana purchase, is complete instant Purchase Notifications from capital one. So you wont miss a purchase large, small, or very large. Technology this helpful. Could make history. Whats in your wallet . In caracas. He was speaking when an explosion occurred. The camera cuts to a wide shot of the scene and following another apparent explosion. Large number of soldiers in Attendance Break rank end flee. The attack came from overhead drones. In an address shortly after, maduro blamed farright groups in Venezuela Inaddition to financiers and planners that live in the United States in the state of florida. Maduro also says its part of a plot linked to colombian president , something a colombian officials tells reuters is absurd. The ap and reuters report a group called National Movement of soldiers in tshirts has claimed responsibility on twitter although nbc news has not confirmed the account. Venezuela says it has detained at least half a dozen people so far. Richard haas, what is going on . What you have is a country that has the worlds largest
reserves of oil is collapsing. Venezuela is a failed state. The currency is down 1 mill thrown the dollar. Hemorrhaging between 25 and 50,000 people a month. Overwhelming its neighbors. This is a country that its way past the point of any viability. Being propped up more than anything else by Cuban Security personnel, and the question is how does this nightmare end, or does it end . Richard, let me ask you, how does a country that has such a wealth of oil reserves, how does it collapse this way over a decade or so . Because over a decade first you had chavez now mr. Maduro. Its totally corrupt. Totally status leadership. Its antibusiness. Its against the people. Its driven out the most
educated, talented people. This is a tragedy. Any other place in the world, joe, we would be having a Conversation Herer and elsewhere about how does the world act . Is there some form of intervention. . Instead we have limited sanctions. We can have this conversation in six months or a year. This is an unfolding tragedy. Let me spend 30 seconds on something else. Whats so interesting with these Drone Attacks as if we didnt have enough to worry about, we have to add this to the list of things to worry about, wherever people congregate, people can use a drone against our political figure. I think this is a real threat. Absolutely. Coming up the president blows up his teams lie about the Trump Tower Meeting with a single sunday morning tweet. Well talk about what it means for the Mueller Probe. And is the state of new york in a position to take out the n ranch. Andrew cuomo tweeted if the nra goes bankrupt because of the state of new york they will be
in my thought and prayers. The governor joins us ahead on morning joe. E the wait at the counter. And choose any car in the aisle. And i dont wait when i return, thanks to drop go. At national, i can lose the wait. And keep it off. Looking good, patrick. I know. vo go national. Go like a pro. With my bladder leakage, the products ive tried just didnt fit right. They were very saggy. Its getting in the way of our camping trips. But with new sizes, depend fitflex is made for me. Introducing more sizes for better comfort. New depend fitflex underwear is guaranteed to be your best fit. Its a hightech sleep revolution. The sleep number 360 smart bed intelligently senses your movement and automatically adjusts. So you wake up ready to run the world. The new sleep number 360 smart bed, from 999. Compares in reducing the risk of stroke. Dont stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase your risk of stroke. While taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. Xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. It may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. Get help right away for unexpected bleeding or unusual bruising. Do not take xarelto® if you have an Artificial Heart Valve or abnormal bleeding. Before starting, tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures and any kidney or liver problems. Learn all you can to help protect yourself from a stroke. Talk to your doctor about xarelto®. All throughout, like hundreds, a hundred years, 125 years, whoever has the white house, that party tends to lose the midterms. I dont know why. We have the greatest economy in the history of our country. Weve had things that never happened before. If the democrats get in, they are going to raise your taxes. Youre going to have crime all over the place. Youre going to have people pouring across the border. Why would that be a blue wave. I think it could be a red wave. Really, it should be a red wave. [ cheers and applause ] welcome back to morning joe. Its monday, august 6th. By the way, again, so many things where do you begin . You have to say it. Things going well out there. This isnt the greatest economy ever. This isnt close to the greatest economy ever. Barack obama had more people getting jobs his last 16 or 18 months than they had jobs during Donald Trumps first 16 or 18 months. Again not to say the economy is not doing well. It is. But all of these claims and im not even talking to Trump Supporters, im talking to News Reporters who i cannot believe actually will ask a question by saying yes the economy is doing better than its before done
before. Were in an extraordinary six, seven year recovery right now and thats a recovery we can all be grateful for. And, you know what . Thats something we republicans, now a conservative, we conservatives have always given credit where credit is due and thats the Small Business owners to people working hard. Unfortunately, this economy taking two or three jobs. But, yeah, its a Strong Economy but mika, this is not an economy that donald trump gave us. This is an economy thats part of the seven year on going recovery. Got to keep up with the facts. Still with us we had have mike barnacle. National Affairs Analyst for nbc news and msnbc john heileman. Professor at Princeton University and president of the council on Foreign Relations richard haas. Nbc news capitol hill correspondent and host of ca
kaciedc, kasie hunt. And columnist and political contributor for msnbc and nbc news, peggy. Peggy noonan and peter baker. Peggy, i want to start with you. Always curious what youre thinking. Obviously donald trump this past weekend well actually hard to say that he went to New Territory because hes always in New Territory, but, obviously, more unhinged and more unmoored than usual. Obviously concerned about his sons possible legal troubles. But where do you put donald trump, the white house and this country as we move into the dog days of august . Well, i still think in a funny way, even though theres
so much that happens each day the news cycle always seems to dance that theres too much going on. At this same time nothing happens, i think, until more mueller stuff comes in and a final report comes in. Thats the point at which you really know where you stand. Having said that, i think the thing with the president is something true of him now that was true of him the second day after he took office. Its been true throughout his administration. He talks too much. He obscures and steps on and made us obvious not anything good happening in his administration. He thinks his constant communication is his power. I think instead his constant need to talk and tweet and be in your face and be the Center Of Attention is, in fact, his weakness. But he cannot stop. He doesnt have enough selfdiscipline to hold himself back and let events unfold in an interesting way. I think his rallies are amusing to his supporters, and kind of inspiring and kind of fun. For one thing, they all gettogether. Americans arent normally together in a big room. They get to see each other. They get to cheer their guy together. I think he says a lot of things that are not true that they know are not true. But they understand or they recognize its part of his show business, part of his desire just to say things. Also he seems to me very big on this statement thats farther to the reality. He likes to say things as if they are true to make them true. Thats what we have a year and a half in is a continuation of the drama of donald trump. Yeah. You know sorry to go so long. No, no, no. No, no. Mike barnacle i spoke with three gentlemen this weekend, educated, good guys, decent guys, all Trump Supporters and sat there and just listened to them and requested why they supported trump, and quite gave me some, you know, some facts that just werent the case. But, again, i was just listening. But what struck me was they were good men, they were decent men, they were honorable men, they were fathers, they were grand fathers, they would never accept that sort of behavior out of their children or grandchildren or friends that they ignore when it comes to donald trump. Theres no doubt donald trump lives by a different set of standards than Everybody Else. And it just seems it was interesting. These Trump Supporters, these voters did not like him as a
man. Wouldnt want him around. But the economy is doing well. And it reminded me so much of what frustrated republicans in the 1990s about bill clinton. It didnt matter what he lied about, if he was lying about transferring Missile Technology to china versus an intern, it just didnt matter. People would go, you know, the economy is doing well. He is who he is. And that seems to be the attitude that has stuck here. Well, im sure bill clinton will be thrilled that you lump him in with donald trump in what trump is doing, but joe but it is important, though, that republicans republicans were saying the same exact thing in the late 1990s about bill clinton and his lies and nobody caring about him lying that democrats and independents are saying about donald trump now, and i guess what the bigger point is this. As long as the economy is doing well, everybody is fine. Thats true. Thats true, joe, to a point, i think. But the people who you were with, the men who you were with, im sure they were great guys. Sadly for them and a lot of others, including a lot of people we see in these halls where the president gathers the crowds together they are falling for the con. Language and words as peggy alluded to are the currency of leadership. And the words that this president uses, that mr. Trump uses, are all aimed at two things that president s of the past, no matter who they were, no matter what party they belonged to they never utilized these words in these two ways, to poke at agree grievances and enlist division. I said it in the last hour there are so many different
americas, so many subsets. You got, you know, all the americans looking at donald trump and i suspect, i predict that democrats are going to do very well this fall. Im not so sure how they will do in 2020 if trump runs for reelection. Then you have the subset of people that go to these rallies and this really does seem to be the most hardened core of Donald Trumps supporters who may believe half the things he says there even though so many are lies. Then you got the type of people i spoke to this weekend that i know you talked to out on the Campaign Trail that say yeah i dont like him. I wish the guy would stop tweeting. Yeah, he may not be well mentally. He makes a joke of himself. He embarrasses himself. He embarrasses the white house. But things are going well. The economy is going well. My god, what am i going to do, turn it over to nancy pelosi and Chuck Schumer and have my taxes raised and have my Small Business damaged. Thats the mindset for so Many Americans out, there isnt it . It is. Look voters have always weighed pocketbook issues. Im surprised hes doing as poorly in the polls as the economy is doing good. A good economy we float the boat of a president and his Party Heading in to an election. Yet this president is still around 40 , 45 depending on which poll you see. Numbers as bad as any were before the midterm debacle for bill clinton in 1994, barack obama in 2010. So, you know, i look at the poll yesterday, in fact. The differential between his Approval Rating and disApproval Rating is minus 15 which is higher than any president. But that core group of people, 40 , 42 whatever it is are sticking by him and part of it is yes the economy is doing
well. Hes not getting as much credit as normally he would because of these other issues, his own conduct in office, the investigation, other things that are holding him back. We talked about last week, there are political realities. President s that have 40 Approval Ratings, lose the house and they lose the senate in midterm elections. President s that kowtow to Vladimir Putin, exkgb president s. Donald trump is not in a Strong Political position. Again when were trying to figure out why people are supporting him a lot has to do with economy which might help im in 2020. Ill keep saying this over and over again. 1994 a huge republican year, bill clinton had a Strong Economy. 2006 a huge democratic year,
guess what . You had george h. W. Bush with a Strong Economy. You can say the same thing about 2014 and barack obama, the economy was, at that point, was in a four or five year recovery. Republicans still had a big year. Sign the midterms its not always the economy, stupid. Usually thats in president ial years. Lets talk more about the president s sunday tweet. Here it is. Fake News Reporting, a complete fabrication that i am concerned about the meeting my wonderful son, dont had in trump tower. That was a meeting to get information on an opponent totally legal and done all the time in politics and it went nowhere. I did not know about it. Donald trump confided to friends and advisors hes worried that
Mueller Probe could destroy the lives of innocent and decent people namely trump jr. Who is under scrutiny by mueller for organizing a june 16th meeting with russians promising dirt on Hillary Clinton. Notice the president at the end says i didnt know about it to make sure he saves himself mostly. As one adviser described the president s thinking, he does not believe his son purposely broke the law, but is fearful nonetheless that trump jr. May have inadvertently wandered into legal jeopardy. On saturday former Communications Director hope hicks was spotted on the tarmac joining the president on his trip to ohio. According to trump, trump jr. Senate Testimony Hicks was in the middle of the president dictating his sons misleading statement about adoptions to the new york times, followed by explanation that quickly unravelled. Politics is not the Nicest Business in the world but very standard where they have information and you take the information. In the case of don, he listened. I guess they talked about, as i see it, they talked about adoption and some things. There was nothing as far as we would know to lead anybody to believe there was anything but adoption. President didnt sign off on anything. Hes coming back from the g20. The statement that was released on saturday was released by donald trump jr. In consultation with his lawyers. He certainly didnt dictate but, you know, like i said he weighed in, offered a suggestion like any father would do. One of those false statements you heard there was from President Trumps lawyer, jay sekulow yesterday. George stephanopoulos got a chance to ask him about it. Why did you deny trumps involvement. When did you learn that the denial wasnt true. Number one, i was in the case
at that point, what a couple of weeks and there was a lot of information that was gathered. As my colleague Rudy Giuliani said i had Bad Information at that point. I made a mistakes in my statement. However, sekulow did not say where he got the Bad Information from. Its hard to keep up, joe, with the twists and turns of how the president is trying to handle his own lies, trying to protect his son but really actually working harder to protect himself because ultimately it appears to be all about trump. Well, john heileman, it shouldnt be surprising, but you see one, two, three, four not false statements, lies. Four lies spewed out by four different people in the administration, including the president of the United States, and any other administration that person would go out, issue
an apology, said i had Bad Information, i am so sorry, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. In this case, that line has become so common from some of those same characters, that theres quite a bit of discussion this weekend about where somebody who works for donald trump right now and spread lies for donald trump right now, and refuses to distance themselves from donald trump calling the free press the enemy of the people right now, you sit there and go where are these people going to get jobs as soon as donald trump leaves town . The answer is they just are not. Not in any respectable firm. Not in any respectable business because of their brand is lying. Right. Its easy given the fact that as was pointed out earlier given how much the president lies, given the documented 4,000 lies
or something in the course of the first 18 months of the presidency its easy to lose focus on how extraordinary this statement was, what the president said on twitter on sunday. The president basically came on twitter in a casual enraged fit. Went on twitter and basically said that he misled the American People, he dictated a statement, helped shape a statement that was an outright lie about a Pivotal Moment in the history of the president ial campaign and the history of this investigation. Basically said, admitted straightforwardly, went on the record and said this meeting was about colluding with a Foreign Government or attempting to collude with a Foreign Government to get dirt on my opponent. He basically said i lied about this, i been lying about this. Everyone around me has been lying about this. It is i would say peter baker
ill ask you because youve been with many president ial administrations. Youve seen a lot of things. Youve seen a lot of lies. Theres not a president weve covered that we havent seen lie. Even by the standards of donald trump or by the standard of any president ive covered this is one of the most extraordinary admissions of having lied on the record of any president. I cant think of anything in anales of presidency thats anything like this, not just as gratuitous but consequential. It is consequential. Weve seen these reports of Measure Mural looking at the president s tweets as part of his look into whether theres obstruction of justice. Certainly in the last couple of weeks more tweets would add to that possible case. This being one of them. The other is his not quite order to Jeff Sessions to shut down the investigation. So you got a president here that
any lawyer would certainly be leery of having as a client because you can say anything at any time, undermines his own case, his own defers, his own story, his own version of the truth. It must be frustrating to lawyers, like jay sekulow shown right before you were talking there about Bad Information. Who gave him Bad Information. That was an important thing. If i was a lawyer in a situation being given Bad Information you have to wonder whether its worth staying and if youre putting yourself in professional jeopardy. Peggy, you worked for a president who used language to soar, to make america feel more at ease, more comfortable, to explain things to america. The challenger explosion, things like that, Ronald Reagan. We all had our differences with Ronald Reagan, that administration had difficulties as well as every other administration does. What goes through your mind when you listen to the language being deployed and employed by this president . A few things. One is that reagan was clear to use clarity. He wanted to be clear about his thinking. He wanted his arguments to be clear. When he said the soviet union deserves to fall and well he gave the logical case for it. He gave you his thinking. So way beyond a certain aspirational nature or language there was the simple desire for candor and clarity. Look, that is not the age were in now. I think when donald trump was elected i said we have entered the age of the postheroic presidency. It seems to me people kind of decided, kind of deliberately were not going be looking up to these fellows any more. The next person we choose might be someone from the field of entertainment, or an unusual field but it wont be a political figure and it wont be someone aiming for the aspirational styles of old rhetorically. Were in a new time. Its a postheroic time. I think donald trump knows this, and asserts on it. Richard, the questions that, you know, weve been asking and we can continue to ask because they are just as relevant now as they have been since january 20th, 2017 is what is the impact of donald trump lying. Everybody in his administration lying. One day after another. We talk about baghdad bob, but ill tell you some of, i think some of americas greatest currency during the cold war, Ronald Reagans greatest currency was that the soviet
union lied. They lied to themselves, they tlied their people, they lied to the countries they were enslaving, they lied to the world. And for us that was always a sign ever weakness that they had to lie to try to shape a reality that was vastly that could compete with the United States with the reality was that they were vastly inferior morally, economically, and militarily to the United States of america. Now its a president who admires russias leaders, russias governing that is producing his own form of problem every day. The implications are terrible on many front. You have a divided country that many people cant believe what the president says so how can we act in a unified, concerted way. Some of the important things the
United States does in Foreign Policy doesnt have anything to go diplomats or soldiers its the example we set. We just talked about Ronald Reagan who we worked for. This is not a shining city on a hill. The idea were having the coarseness of this dialogue, this degree of untruth said, this is not a country that the rest of the world will respect, and, again, we should never forget the rest of the world depends on us. If were seen as lying, if were seen as not being reliable, essentially the rest of the world will take its fate into its own hands. This will be a world that will have far less american influence, this will be a world that will be far less stable because people will essentially be going their own ways or deferring to powerful neighbors. What this is doing is setting in motion trends here domestically where its harder for us to come together and reinforcing sentry
fug centrifugal forces in the world. This is serious, this is consequential. Totally agree. Peter baker, thank you very much. Still ahead on morning joe well have conversations around two of the most controversial and consequential aspects of the trump administration. The role i. C. E. Plays in his Immigration Policy and the dark undercurrents that welled up in charlottesville one year ago this week. Well be right back. Ooh sfx [cell phone dialing]
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[ Audience Chanting Build That Wall ] President Trump speaking in Ohio On Saturday and joining us now, National Correspondent for the atlantic, he writes the magazines cover story for the latest issue entitled how i. C. E. Went rogue inside americas unfolding Immigration Crisis joe there was some critique of my concern that the president has lost a step or two, or is Over The Edge on friday, and some analysts or i dont know what to call them, Trump Abologists state tv that what you thought there was brilliance unfolding before our eyes. Hes so talented i cant understand talent when i see it. They said you were so boring. Thats the other reason. Went on and talked about you for ten minutes. Thats okay. No, its great. Got to talk about something. Got to talk about something. No news to cover. Theres nothing going on. At all. Just wanted to talk about boring things for ten minutes. Frank, yesterday what fascinated you. We havent been able to talk about the world cup on tv, premier league, football starts next week. Its going to be good. When are you booking your game clock for the show . Very soon. They will have a great year. Well get you back on. Well get you back on with roger. Lets talk about i. C. E. Right now. It seems that so much of the immigration debate, so much of Donald Trumps schtick during the campaign, the crowd chanting, building that wall,
build that wall. Its all nonsense. Not fact driven. Weve talked about Immigration Rates plummeting, for a decade now. One thing thats very real is what is now happening on the border with i. C. E. And the separation of children, it seems that i. C. E. Has lost its focus on its primary mission because they got a president pushing them to do certain things. If we step back we can see that this is a donald trump problem but also an american problem in that weve spent generations now building up a massive Immigration Enforcement apparatus. And because it exists in this little bubble, this Little Pocket of civil law in the department of Homeland Security, it exists in such a manner in which its able to dehumanize all the people it comes in contact with. The department of Homeland Security is a classic example of a bureaucratic mess that was put
together in a rush with resources not clear delineations of its authority. We just didnt pay much attention it until the trump administration. Now what trump has done thats very different is that hes deliberately tried to cultivate fear. That one of the ends of his administrations policy and this grows out of a doctrine thats very clearly declinated is to cause people to deport themselves. That they want to raise the consequences for the 11 million undocumented, and to make them feel a sense of terror and panic and foreboding that causes them to leave the United States on their own accord. And i studied a group, i went to columbus, ohio, spent with a community of west africanamericans who came here, applied for asylum, were rejected because they got scammed. Every time i go back to columbus
i see people leaving to go to canada because fear has taken hold. I want to ask a question. Let me frame it in this way. I want to ask a question about the moral crisis that i. C. E. Has put the nation in. In the 1850s there was the fugitive slave law. Because it did what it did suddenly tissue of slavery was nationalized. Not justin south. It was a moral question that m emerson had to confront in massachusetts. Now we have i. C. E. Trying from text Family Members from being snatched from them. This fear youve talked about. How has this i. C. E. , this 248 crease in jail tran fierce, how has this created a moral crisis thats nationalized now, not a local issue. Thats exactly the way i would frame tight, theres this moral crisis that, you know, i believe in borders and that a nation state has the prerogative
to figure out who comes in and who comes out of the country and immigration is something we should legitimately regulate. When it comes to the 11 million who exist within our communities, these are the other who exist within us, and twothirds of them have lived in this country for over a decade. And so the way that we treat them is a test of our National Character because never before or very, very rarely in our history have we attempted to excise the other from our midst. Sure weve turned people away at the border oftentimes callously or turned away immigrants trying to enter through ellis island. But only in very, very rare instances have we gone after and tried to remove people who live amoungs. We did this in 1950s with Operation Wet back where millions of mexicans were moved and that was a moral stain on our country. But before the existence of i. C. E. , before we ramped up i. C. E. s existence after nooirn we never had a Significant Police apparatus that was assigned the mission of removing immigrants from the interior of the country. And its a tremendous power. Its really its largely unchecked. The way we use that power is indeed a moral test. Well, you know, peggy, the man you worked with, the man you worked for, Ronald Reagan believed that immigration was a moral test. He also believed that immigration was extraordinarily critical to who we were to the character of america and he said it throughout his presidency. I think in his Farewell Address he said if a nation has to have walls, the walls should have doors, meaning those who want to come here, who have a compelling reason, who we can
accept, get them in here. Its what we have always done. Why would we stop this . Reagan thought, i think, in part that the desire to be an america, a hunger to be an american, the hunger to live here was to a certain degree an establishing rationale or a reason for you to be taken in. However, ill tell you i think we need Immigration Control, we need an Immigration Control agency. Of course we do. But it looks to me like this is a large agency that maybe has a very strong sense of what is possible for it in terms of its aggression. Im wondering what could a president do right now, could this president do if he had a mind to, what two things could he do to make this albert on the ground and make i. C. E. Seem less intrusive and less obnoxious and
less bullying. The Ronald Reagan example is an interesting one because he was the last president to give amnesty in large number to undocumented immigrants and really the failure of impressive Immigration Reform is the most serious indictment of our political system because weve had bipartisan agreement about the necessity of coming up with some sort of compromise on Immigration Reform and because weve had major votes endorsing it its only because of Guerilla Tactics of House Republicans and the lahaster rule. Ronald reagan would understand the problem of bureaucracy has run amuck. Thats the issue with i. C. E. Barack obama struggled with how to corral this institution. It took him a long time and a lot of Trial And Error and a lot of flops before in the last couple years of his administration he was able to
impose priorities on the organization. He said that, that i. C. E. Should only target serious criminals for deportation. In the absence of Immigration Reform that would grant amnesty to most of the 11 million, he said you know what . Were not going to send you out of this country if you swerve out of the wrong lane or run a red light, but if you commit a serious crime youre going to be deported. I agree with you, peggy, that we do need to have some sort of apparatus that deports, deports immigrants because thats just something that we need to have a Functioning Society but i dont think we want to have a bureaucracy like the one that weve amassed. Yeah. Frank, thank you very much. Well be looking for your reporting online and in the upcoming September Issue of the atlantic. Still ahead nearly a year since the deadly rally in
charlottesville, virginia and many perpetrators of that racist violence have not been held accountable. A new documentary is investigating why. Thats coming up next. The first thing that was important for me to change was the culture of the company. And i think that had to shift to responsible growth. Second thing i wanted to change was the leadership of the company. And the third was for us to start listening. Listening to our riders. Listening to our driver partners. I think listening is ultimately going to make us a better company. Your insurance rates a scratch so smallr you could fix it with a pen. How about using that pen to sign up for new insurance instead . For drivers with Accident Forgiveness, Liberty Mutual wont raise their rates because of their first accident. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Nearly one year after the deadly rally in charlottesville, virginia, pbs front line are investigating White Supremacist resurgence in america with a new special entitled documents hate, charlottesville. Heres a clip from the report that premiers tomorrow night and some of the scenes might be disturbing to watch. Charlottesville rally was supposed to be about a confederate monument. But anyone who was paying attention could see it was about more than a single statue. It felt like a National Reckoning around race was coming. I came here to ask questions. And as the day unravelled into chaos around me, one thing became clear, this was not a place to listen or understand. Charlottesville was a crime scene. Front line correspondent and reporter a. C. Thompson joins us now. What did you fine in your search for whether or not justice was served out of charlottesville . You know, i think one of the key things for us is we encountered one person after another who had been violent in rallies after Char Advocatesvil charlottesville before and after charlottesville. There was no consequence for them. We went looking for these violent actors, not the people who wanted the spotlight but the people who didnt want to be in the spotlight, want to operate
from the shadows and engaging Criminal Activity and there were a lot of them out there. Why no consequences, one year after charlottesville why no consequences . Thats a good question. What we know is that a lot of these local authorities, for example, in berkeley, california to charlottesville dont have a ton of resources to go after these characters. In some cases they havent been vigorous in going after these characters. We believe that the federal bureau of investigation is more interested in some of these groups, and has acted. But its still an open question why some of these people havent been brought to justice. Whats the consequence that follows from the failure to foum. We know what just happened in portland, oregon. What are the consequences that follow . I think the concern is that people that are able to go from one rally to the next and physically attack people, and basically then return to their normal lives they feel like hey i can do this, i can get away
with this and engenders more violence. How is it that a collection of neonazis stone cold racist from across the country, from many, many different states across the country gather in charlottesville for one specific purpose, everybody in charlottesville once they gets there know what the purpose is. Where was the preparation, Police Planning . Thats a totally crucial question. Its been overlooked. There was a 200 page report that came out after charlottesville that said hey here are the failures and there were many. There were intelligence failures on the front end. There were failures to really plan. There were failures between the Virginia State police and the local police to coordinate and even be able to talk to one another on the same radiofrequencies, but most importantly what we know now is that basically the police said were going to allow this to escalate. Were going to allow violence to
happen. When that violence has happened well have a reason to declare Unlawful Assembly and clear these people out. That helped to lead to failed consequences of that day. Its a year later, right. Ill ask you the biggest urgent question i can. Take everything thats all happened, all the attention ever char lost via, what the president said, the counter reaction, the recruiting videos, the totality of everything. A year later has charlottesville been good or bad for the cause of White Supremacy in america. It works in two ways or even three ways. A lot of people have left the movement. They felt they were chastened by what happened. They dont want to be a part of it. Other people said we have to organize big ways. Well do flash mobs. Posters. Other people said well do terrorism. Well go underground. Were done with protests and politicking now well start
killing people and start blowing stuff up. It goes in three different ways. How many people were at charlottesville that day when it all blew up . How big transparent crowds . How big were the opposing forces. Thats still in debate. If you look at the numbers people put White Supremacist 500 with more people on the opposing side. Thats about right. You had mostly, you know, around 500 White Supremacists, a bigger group of opponents. In the streets directly in front of them was a smaller group. Most opponents were nonviolent. In a nation of 305 million, 500 really bad guys thats not a lot. So what does it imply to you two things. One thing is i think they are reflective of a deeper fissure in society. Thats a key thing. Is that they are the extreme edge of a deeper movement and a
deeper unease. Theres a lot of white people who have to some competent in the last few years said hey, im unhappy about illegal immigration, im unhappy about immigration period and returned to this Na Negativist racist rhetoric and these guys are the most extreme version of it. The other thing you dont need a lot of people to do extreme violence. We know that from tim mcveigh. He killed 168 people basically by himself. When you have people this motivated to do harm you dont need a lot. You know, kasie hunt, if you go back over the trump presidency, yes, there are bizarre things happening every day. There are abnormalities politically. But i look at three events that caused donald trump, i think, the greatest political consequence. One was charlottesville. Two was ripping babies from their mothers at the border and three was what happened in
helsinki and Vladimir Putin. I think the long term impact of that will being a great. But also great for the Republican Party. I think going back to charlottesville wasnt that really the beginning of almost well, a dramatic abandonment from suburban moms, suburban women and suburban voters that were formerly republicans who helped elect a democratic governor in virginia and helped elect a democratic senator in alabama . I think that we are still facing as a country pretty crucial tests around exactly those moments that you point out, and this one in charlottesville was in some ways the beginning. Also, it was the sharpest, most emotional in many ways, crystallizing all of the things that this president has done did as a candidate, in pushing on these or ripping open
really these wounds that have been a part of the American Fabric since the beginning of our country. And it is a real test, i think, for American Voters to see, okay, you know, are those women that you mention, are they going to come out to the polls in droves in 2018 and then in 2020 . Or is this president s strategy of inflaming these racial wounds going to really be shown to actually have been effective, joe. Yeah. And, eddie, i ask you this same question about the longterm political impact of charlottesville. We certainly saw in alabama black voters coming out in higher numbers than even for Barack Obamas elections in 08 and 12. In a president ial year versus an offyear Special Election, which it is just an extraordinary political event, and also in virginia. Does this does charlottesville and beyond, is that what actually breaks donald
trumps hold Over Washington thats run by conservative republicans . I think it certainly will be part of the reason, joe. We will see barack obama numbers, i believe, among africanAmerican Voters in the midterm and in the 2020 election. But i want to be very clear, we need to move from melodrama where we have our obvious villains and our obvious heroes and our desire for a happy ending, and we need to understand how deeply tragic this is. A. C. Said something thats really important. The White Supremacists in charlottesville were the radical edge of a deeper, deeper current. We need to understand that all of this stuff has to be made explicit for us to imagine america differently. If we dont, if we fall back into the old mode we will find ourselves on this racial Hamster Wheel again, and we cant have that happen. Hopefully we are moving into a different moment, but im not sure. Our history says we wont, but im not sure. The film is documenting
hate, charlottesville. Premieres tomorrow night on pbs and online at pbs. Org frontline. You can read related reporting at propublica. Org. A. C. Thompson, thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. Up next, Governor Cuomo is picking a fight with the nra. We will talk about that and the primary challenger he is facing this fall. The new york democrat joins us straight ahead on morning joe. This is a story about mail and packages. And its also a story about people. People who rely on us every day to deliver their dreams theyre handing us more than mail theyre handing us their business and while we make more ecommerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country, we never forget. That your business is our business the United States postal service. Priority you but one blows them all out of the water. Hydro boost from neutrogena®. With Hyaluronic Acid to plump skin cells so it bounces back. Neutrogena® so it bounces back. Whoamike and jen doyle . Than i thought. Yeah. Time for medicare, huh. I have no idea how were going to get through this. Follow me. Choosing a plan can be supercomplicated. But it doesnt have to be. Unitedhealthcare can guide you through the confusion, with helpful people, tools and plans. Including the only plans with the aarp name. Well that wasnt so bad at all. Thats how we like it. Aarp medicare plans, from unitedhealthcare. We really pride ourselves on temaking it easy for youass, to get your windshield fixed. Teacher lets turn in your science papers. Tech vo this teacher always puts her students first. Student i did mine on volcanoes. Teacher you did . oh, i cant wait to read it. Tech vo so when she had auto glass damage. She chose safelite. With safelite, she could see exactly when wed be there. Teacher you must be pascal. Tech yes maam. Tech vo saving her time. [honk, honk] kids bye tech vo . So she can save the science project. Kids whoa kids vo safelite repair, safelite replace
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last night for throws who went to bed early last night, the sunday night game, red sox came back in the ninth to tie it and won it in the tenth, 54. Richard haas next to me, how are you today . Lets go back to the news. Yeah. I mean, richard, you could have made that throw from third base to first. I mean in the ninth, i thought seriously, i thought it was so nonchalant, i couldnt believe they didnt get zander out. Even the wild card is beginning to look slightly questionable. This is this is worse than the nightmare many of us were concerned going into the four games. So i think it is time to move on though, joe. I dont think we ought to dwell on it. Mika, it is time to move on, but at some point i know we only talk about east coast teams and specifically only two east coast teams. One of these mornings, mike, were going to have to talk about the oakland as and the extraordinary job theyre doing
right now. Yes. Billy ball in full swing. Oakland is playing very well. Again, to richards point, oakland could catch the yankees for the wild card. That would be heartbreaking. Everyone is a little sleepy this morning. As you see, we have national Affairs Analyst for nbc news, john heilman, the president of the council on Foreign Relations a very dejected yankees fan richard haas. Professor at Princeton University, eddie claw jr. White house bureau chief at the Washington Post and political analyst for msnbc and nbc news philip rubber, and host of kasie dc on msnbc, kasie hunt. I was watching last night. She is awesome. Anyhow, joe, as you were saying, it was pretty clear anyway, but now President Trump is directly confirming that his son attempted to get dirt on Hillary Clinton by hosting russians at trump tower. Is that bad . Well get to that in a second. Meanwhile, he split his time
over the weekend between attacking the media and attacking lebron james. Well show you that. And why Michael Jordan is weighing in, among many others. Speaking of stars from the 90s, steven segal is teaming up with Vladimir Putin. Russia made him a special representative to improve relations between the u. S. And moscow. That will do the trick. We will get to that as well. Maybe instead of getting a burnedout movie star, maybe just dont try to subvert democracy in america. It will be good. You keep steven, we will keep our democratic processes, and well call it even. You have Dennis Rodman for north korea and segal for russia. Who is next . Who is for iran . Anyhow, we will begin with President Trump reigniting the controversy around his campaigns june 2016 Trump Tower Meeting with russians. Tweeting on sunday, fake News Reporting a complete fabrication, that i am concerned about the meeting my wonderful
son this is always bad when he does this donald had in trump tower. This was a meeting to get information on an opponent. Totally legal and done all the time in politics. Nope. And it went nowhere. I did not know about it. Thats a lie. This means he knew about it and his son really messed up. Thats my translation. Three lies in a row, boom, boom, boom. He appears to be referring to the Washington Post reporting, trump has confided to friends and advisers he is worried the Mueller Probe could destroy the lives of what he calls innocent and decent people. Remember when he called you about miller, joe . Yeah. Anyhow, namely his son who is under scrutiny for organizing a meeting at trump tower, let me help you understand, it is bad. You know he is up and tweeting. As one adviser described the president s thinking, he does not believe his son purposely broke the law. Since ignorance of the law is actually a oh, wait, never
mind. But is fearful nonetheless trump jr. May have wandered inadvertently into legal jeopardy. On saturday hope hicks was spotted on the tarmac, joining the president on his trip to ohio. According to trump jr. , senate testimony, hicks was in the middle of the president dictating his sons misleading statement about adoptions to the new york times, followed by explanations that quickly unraveled. Politics is not the Nicest Business in the world, but it is very standard where you have information and you take the information. In the case of don, he listened. I guess they talked about, as i see it, they talked about adoption and some things. There was nothing as far as we know that would lead anyone to believe that there was anything except for a discussion about adoption. The president didnt sign off on anything. He is coming back from g20. The statement that was released on saturday was released by donald trump jr. And im sure in consultation with his lawyers. The president wasnt involved in that. He certainly didnt dictate but, you know, he like i said, he weighed in, offered suggestion like any father would do. It really is odd. It is breathtaking. Were used to the lying, but on something this big, perhaps the most important part of this entire investigation, everything you heard from every white house representative there was a lie. And donald trump admitted this weekend they were all lying. What are the consequences of this . Well, i dont know what the consequences are, but i know that it is an indication that some folks here are not just in serious trouble, but now recognize theyre in serious trouble. I think if you ask the question, joe, you know, last week we watched as donald trump went further, deeper into the realm of public obstruction of justice when he started attacking the Mueller Probe, suggesting that the attorney general should shut it down. We now have a pretty clear explanation of why it is, that the president is starting to look at the manafort trial
focusing on rick gates, focusing on some of the things that perhaps Michael Cohen has told investigators about this meeting, about what led up to it, about who might have known about it in advance, about what the president s role might have been, about what donald jr. s role was. We have an email trail on that. As the president has started to recognize, using various metaphors, walls closing in and the facts are starting to come closer to the surface and corroborating witnesses are starting to come forward or appear to be about to come forward, the president is in an exact 180degree opposite of what his statement in the tweet says. As mika suggested just a second ago, you know if hes up and tweeting about how hes not concerned about donald trump jr. , hes concerned about donald trump jr. Hes concerned about donald trump jr. Phil rucker, hes concerned that donald trump jr. May have stumbled into some illegal territory on his own. Also obviously he has to be
concerned by the fact that, again, it is going to be coming out, not only whether it is in the manafort trial or somewhere else, that it is obvious that meeting from the very beginning was to get information from foreign nationals in this case the russians which is a crime. They can run around people, lawyers running around, collusion is not a crime. Anybody knows, a lowlyranking congressman like i was in my first year understood, you cant get an inkind contribution from, you know, mullahs in iran or Vladimir Putin in russia. Thats right, joe. And the president is concerned. Hes anxious, he is fearful about where this is all headed. His legal team is focused on that Trump Tower Meeting as they have been for some time. That is a key moment in the mueller investigation, but our reporting, despite what the president tweeted in response to it, very much is that hes worried about don jr. He has expressed that worry to the people that he has been talking to on the phone. He has been privately brooding over this, sort of feeling very uneasy that mueller seems to be inching closer and closer to the oval office. Yeah. To the people in the president s circle, and thats why youve seen him the President Lashing out on twitter, lashing out at these campaign rallies, tearing into the media, tweeting about the witchhunt more and more and more, tweeting about Robert Mueller by name more and more and more. Thats how hes channelling all of that frustration and fear. You know, it is important to keep reviewing the facts, especially as the president and others try and muddle them on twitter. The new yorkers Adam Davidson lays out the facts about which there is no dispute at all, that the president s son and top advisers knowingly met with individuals connected to the russian government, hoping to obtain dirt on their political opponent. That document stolen from the Democratic National committee and members of the Clinton Campaign were later used in an
overt effort to sway the election. These are facts. That when the Trump Tower Meeting was uncovered, the president instructed his son and staff to lie about the meeting and told them precisely which lies to use, and that the president is attempting to end the investigation into this meeting and other instances of attempted collusion between his Campaign Staff and representatives of the russian government. Joe, the president all along saying, no collusion, no collusion. Yeah, well, i mean no that means nothing. He might as well be saying no whiffle ball tournaments in the backyard. I mean if theres conspiracy, thats a crime. If theres a conspiracy to get information from a foreign national, anything of worth, thats a crime. Mike barnacle, he can run around saying no collusion all he wants, you know. Maybe maybe it is a conspiracy again to collude with
a foreign national, to get something anything of value. Thats a crime. But, again, in this case, as we said about watergate, as everybody says about it seems every political scandal, at the end of the day it may not be the crime, it may be the coverup to the crime that does the most damage, and we have all of this in broad daylight. Donald trump has been lying through his teeth about everything, but about this meeting specifically from the very beginning. Yeah. Well, joe, thats the point, the principal point of danger for mr. Trump right now postmeeting, what happened after postmeeting. We know for a fact, fact, that he sat on Air Force One and helped prepare a false statement. Richard, this just further enmeshes him into not collusion but a conspiracy. Yeah, because, again, harkening back to watergate, it is both what you do and then what you do about what you did. So now we have the pretty clear
evidence that this meeting took place, and when you read the law it never says that money has to change hands. It can be a contribution of any sort. So youve got the meeting, and then youve got now the attempt to essentially hide what actually the purpose of the meeting and what happened at the meeting. So youve got it coming and going. I think weve actually entered now a very different realm because were no longer speculating. Now we actually have people essentially admitting what happened. The president. The people, yeah. The people in this case being the president of the United States in word on twitter admitting what happened. Still ahead on morning joe, it was one of the more biting responses to President Trumps attacks on lebron james. One puts kids in classrooms, the other puts them in cages. Well break down the president s tweets straight ahead. But first, bill karins with a check on the forecast. Bill. Well, mika, we had a lot of hot temperatures to talk about, but first to talk about the fires in california. The mendocino complex fire exploded over the weekend, burning thousands upon thousands
of new acreage. It is the fourth largest fire in california history, it is still growing. Only about 20,000 acres to go to top last years number one, the thomas fire. Yes, two years in a row were likely to break the record for the largest fire ever recorded in california history, and those records go back to about 1932. It hasnt been your average fire seasons the last couple of years. So 50 Million People under heat advisories in the northeast. Hot, just like yesterday. 26 Million People under excessive heat warning in areas of Southern California and arizona and southern nevada. We are hot in the northeast and the west. Gusty thunderstorms, watch out detroit to chicago. By the time we get to wednesday, the showers make their way through kentucky, tennessee, the mid atlantic and the northeast and were hot throughout all areas of the west. Thats where the heat will be, and it will get worst during the week as temperatures may be record highs by thursday and friday. Look at boise, 104 by friday. Looks like another week we will be talking a lot about the heat and also probably more fires out in areas of the west. Kind of the opposite of what they wanted. New york city, heat advisory. It will feel like 100 degrees in the shade this afternoon. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Hey allergy muddlers are you one sneeze away from being voted out of the carpool . Try zyrtec® zyrtec® starts working hard at hour one and works twice as hard when you take it again the next day. Stick with zyrtec®. Muddle no more®. And try childrens zyrtec® for consistently powerful relief of your kids allergies. So lets promote our Summer Travel deal on choicehotels. Com like this. Surfs up. Earn a 50 gift card when you stay just twice this summer. Or, badda book. Badda boom. Book now at choicehotels. Com
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got involved in the middle of it and chose the side of lebron. Yeah. But, joe, this gets to what we were talking about before the break and what eddie just spoke about. I mean race remains now and forever the third rail of american life, not american politics. We really dont have a handle on it, and we have a leader, the ostensible leader of the United States, the president of the United States, who continually plays with it and provokes people with it. It is truly dangerous and it is going to end more badly than it is right now. Coming up, the governor of new york state, andrew cuomo, is standing but. He joins the conversation next on morning joe. When you rent from national. Its kind of like playing your own version of best ball. Because here, you can choose any car in the aisle, even if its a better car class than the one you reserved. So no matter what, youre guaranteed to have a perfect drive. [laughter] vo go national. Go like a pro. See what i did there . Booking a flight doesnt have to be expensive. Just go to priceline. Its the best place to book a flight a few days before my trip and still save up to 40 . Just tap and go. For the best savings on flights, go to priceline. Until i held her. Managing my type 2 diabetes wasnt my top priority. I found my tresiba® reason. Now im doing more to lower my a1c. I take tresiba® once a day. Tresiba® controls blood sugar for 24 hours for powerful a1c reduction. woman wed been counting down to his retirement. It was our tresiba® reason. He needs insulin to control his high blood sugar and, at his age, hes at greater risk for low blood sugar. Tresiba® releases slow and steady and works all day and night like the bodys insulin. vo tresiba® is a longacting insulin used to control high blood sugar in adults with diabetes. Dont use tresiba® to treat diabetic ketoacidosis, during episodes of low blood sugar, or if you are allergic to any of its ingredients. Dont share needles or insulin pens. Dont reuse needles. The most common side effect is low blood sugar, which may cause dizziness, sweating, confusion, and headache. Check your blood sugar. Low blood sugar can be serious and may be lifethreatening. Injection site reactions may occur. Tell your prescriber about all medicines you take and all your medical conditions. Taking tzds with insulins like tresiba® may cause serious side effects like heart failure. Your insulin dose shouldnt be changed without asking your prescriber. Get medical help right away if you have trouble breathing, fast heartbeat, extreme drowsiness, swelling of your face, tongue or throat, dizziness or confusion. man i found my tresiba® reason. Find yours. vo ask your Health Care Provider about tresiba®. Covered by most commercial Health Insurance and Medicare Part d plans. You might or joints. Hing for your heart. But do you take something for your brain. With an ingredient originally discovered in jellyfish, prevagen has been shown in Clinical Trials to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. The nra told npr if insurers remain afraid to transact with the nra, there is a substantial risk that nra tv will be forced to cease operating, and the governor of new york, andrew cuomo, joins us now. Thank you very much, governor. I understand theres a little bit of a delay here, but well get through it. Are you black listing the nra . No. What happened, mika, is, as you know, states regulate the Insurance Industry within that state, and we have a law in new york that says you cannot insure someone for an intentional bad act. You cant insure someone for breaking the law, and this insurance product was called carry guard. It was designed for people who carry weapons, and it basically insured them for an intentional bad act. The expression was murder insurance. The Insurance Company that was
providing the product paid a fine. They signed a consent order. Theyre no longer selling the product. The nra was the broker on the product essentially, and they were making a commission. Theyre no longer making the commission, but they were selling an illegal product, you know. I dont have a lot of sympathy for a group that says, well, ive lost the revenue from now being disabled from selling that illegal product. You know, thats i dont they dont get a lot of sympathy from me in general, mika, but here they clearly broke the law. They are right that i have been a longterm political opponent of the nra. It went back to my time in the federal government with the Clinton Administration. I believe they are an extremist organization. I believe they dont want any progress on gun reform because it would put them out of business. The majority of gun owners in this country support reasonable gun control, background checks, et cetera, and i think the nra
frustrates any progress just so they have a business line to further. So i dont understand, governor. When i was reading these stories over the past several days that the nra claims it is in a financial crisis and may be facing bankruptcy because of some issues that theyre having in the state of new york. I dont really understand that considering they still give millions of dollars to people that promote their agenda on capitol hill. So are we just talking about a reorganization that would prevent them from being liable in any possible legal lawsuits . When they say they may be facing bankruptcy, what exactly does that mean . No, joe, im with you. I think it is a frivolous lawsuit. I dont even know their point. I am sure they lost revenue from losing the sale of this insurance product. I did not know that it was such a significant portion of their revenue. Im not sure that it is, by the way, but theyre crying poverty. Now, it is true that they rely on the money because the way they bully the politicians, joe, as you know, we have both seen it, they need millions of dollars to run those ads to keep the politicians in line. And theyre saying that the loss of this insurance product is going to make a significant dent on their coffers. I dont know if thats true or not true, but, look, from my point of view i do disagree with them politically. And if they have less money to bully and threaten politicians into irrational positions, you know, im not going to lose any sleep over that. And if they went away, you know, i would offer my thoughts and prayers, joe, just like they do every time we have another
situation of nninnocents losing their lives, 154 Mass Shootings this year. The nation is paralysed. Were doing nothing, no reasonable reform that we know we could agree to if you didnt have politicians scared to death of the nra. Hey, governor. John hooilman hereilman here. I want to ask a question in a broader scale. It seems the action you are taking and the effect you are having, you are fighting a guerilla campaign, like a guerilla warfare against the nra. I wonder if you think you are successful, and if you do at whatever level, make kind of a dent in the nra, whether this provides a blueprint to ways in which other states can chip away at the nras power or, on the other hand, whether the only way to really take the nra down is on the National Level . Well, it is a good question, john. You know, i think they have shown a vulnerability here, frankly, that i didnt see. When they said that loss of this insurance product is going to make such a significant difference on their revenues, i am now reaching out to the other states because i believe this insurance product is going to be illegal from a Public Policy point of view in most states. Now that the nra said this is a major source of revenue, im going to pursue it nationwide. It wasnt a guerilla attack. Look, i think these guys are bad guys, and it started from the Clinton Administration with the safe act that could have done great work that the gun manufacturers supported until the nra came in and literally pressured the gun manufacturers not to make an arrangement. I passed the best gun control law in the nation five years ago called the safe act. They demonized me. The safe act does everything were trying to do today, everything. Mental health database, assault weapons, et cetera. You know what . Five years later, hunters still have their guns, legal owners have guns. There was no slippery slope. The nra hates that. They hate letting people know that you could actually have reasonable gun control that most gun owners support. But if we if were not willing to take them on, well never get anywhere on this problem. I mean i was there. I know the dynamic in washington. The republicans are afraid of the nra, period. The president after the parkland shooting did that briefing in the white house Conference Room where he was asking very reasonable questions. Why dont we raise the purchase age . Why do we really need young people with assault weapons . He met with the nra and did a 180 the next day. Theyre afraid of the nra and thats why were doing absolutely nothing. All right. Governor andrew cuomo, thank you so much for being with us. We greatly appreciate it. Thank for having me, joe, mika. Thank you so much. Thank you. We got quite a delay here, sort of here to pakistan almost. Mike barnacle, color me skept kl her skeptical here. The nra in financial trouble . I dont think so. Maybe theyre saying that in their court filings, but here is an entity that already contributed 5. 6 million this election cycle over the past year and a half to republican candidates and maybe one or two democrats, and theyre going to be spending another four to five million for the end of this year. It seems like just a
reorganization effort to me. Yeah, i dont want to talk you out of your scepticism, joe. I think it is wellearned. History has shown it is wellearned. One of the things that is really that i think a lot of people fail to understand, and Governor Cuomo just mentioned it, you know, he has gone after reasonable gun control and has succeeded at a certain level in achieving reasonable gun control. In this day and age when people can organize so many things so quickly using social media, i am amazed and i think more people are amazed that a collection of Police Associations around the country, in various states, various big cities, havent been organized as a group to combat the nra. They and the innocent victims who die in Mass Shootings obviously are among the biggest victims of outofcontrol or uneven forced gun laws in this country and people being able to get guns with more ease than a library book. The fact they havent been
organized as a unit to combat the nra and i think it would be a powerful group, police combatting the nra hasnt been done is kind of a mystery. It is a mystery. What is so interesting is, mika, when we talk about it there used to be a huge gulf between conservatives and liberals on gun issues, even going back into the 90s. Conservatives obviously and nra supporters wanting more access to more guns, while liberals were talking about the banning of handguns. Yeah. You dont even have that conversation anymore. What you have now, the gun battle is being fought on pretty comfortable territory for middle america. You know, increased background checks, which have you know, a lot of people have wanted since newtown. Common sense. Increased background checks to keep guns out of the hands of terrorists, to keep begins out of the hands of domestic
abusers, to keep guns out of the hands of those not mentally fit to have guns. Even if you talk about the assaultstyle weapon, the militarystyle bans, thats you know, for most of the things weve seen, 55, 60, 65, sometimes even 70 of americans support that as well. So this battle is not actually even a battle at all. Youve got three or four people who are nra leaders up in washington, d. C. That are pushing the most extreme agenda for the gun manufacturers, while most nra members across america want the enhanced background checks, and also even a majority last time i checked wanted a ban on militarystyle weapons being sold, especially to people who were under 21. That amidst an epidemic of Mass Shootings that everybody can see and feel for themselves. Up next, republican strategist rick wilson joins us with his subtly titled new book,
everything trump touches dies. Well be right back. The fact is, there are over ninetysix
now that you know the truth, are you in good hands . With us now republican political strategist, troublemaker, northwest florida hero rick wilson. He is out with a new book, everything trump touches dies. Our republican strategist gets real about the worst president. Ever you know, rick and i grew up in the same backyard. Yeah. We knew the same political players. We had the same sort of interparty battles which actually there wasnt a great difference between republicans in primaries, even though yeah. Not you, but everybody would have to exaggerate the issues. What im hearing from a lot of my republican friends now, especially in northwest florida, some representatives up there, it is just extraordinary. I mean sure. People that are doing like
Vladimir Putin by trying to cover up political investigations of putins interference in american democracy. Yeah, imagine how it would have played in the first or second Congressional District of florida five years ago. Yeah. The idea that somebody was trying to cover up russia interference in our elections, there would have been pitchforks and torches in the streets of pensacola. Yeah. Now we look at the governors race, and you and i both have known adam putnam for years. He is a guy getting his tail whipped because donald trump is tweeting about his opponent. You know, so the ground has changed, but, unfortunately for a lot of the guys that accepted that gift of trump in the primary, theyre going it looks like they will be paying a heavy price for it come the general election this year. And thats how bizarre it is. Im glad you brought up adam putnam. Here is a guy thats been in politics, in Public Service for years and years. Yeah. I knew him when he served in congress. Sure. Everybody that has known him
says he is great, decent guy, a good man and representative. As i was explaining a week or two ago, just because a guy reads his kid trump bedtime stories doesnt mean he will be able to handle things when it hits the fan and a category four hurricane comes in tampa bay. Right. Yet that doesnt seem to matter to a lot of primary voters. It doesnt seem to matter to primary voters, but it may matter in the general election when we have a democratic governor in florida for the first time in decades. It is definitely a the signs of trumps doom in the general, yeah, weve seen it play out in all of the Special Elections so far in the last year and a half, and were seeing it play out i think this fall in the imminent doom of a lot of republican candidates in swing districts all over the state and swing states like our home state of florida. I tell you what, were going to give the audience a treat right now. We dont usually go behind the
scenes, but just so you all know, rick has an understudy for his book tour if for any reason he gets sick during the book tour, has problems communicating because of a bad cough. Oh, my gosh. I couldnt grow that beard. John is here. John, do you have a question. Plus im about a foot taller than rick. Oh, wow. Can we have the book cover up on screen real quick . Just show the book cover. The book cover has two fundamental truths it announces. One, everything trump touches dies, and also look at that tiny hand. Look at that little, ittybitty hand. Theres cocktail sausage fingers. Im not sure it could be clearer. Heres the question heres the thing. You are one of the avatars of
never trump republicanism, right . Yes. For a little while there were a lot of loud never trumpers, and they seemed important. One of the things we have seen, one of the most extraordinary thing is the fact that the president can genuinely boast he has the highest Approval Rating within his party of any president in the modern history of america. S theres just a huge courage deficit in this country. We have eddie with us. Real quickly, now, we tend to exceptionalize trump. But you just talked about the id of the Republican Party. Give me more content. Whats the soil of the Republican Party that made possible trump . You can be a never trump but it seems to me you need to be a never that too. I am a never that. Say more of that then. I think theres a part of the gop that has emerged in this populist culture, in this separated media silo that is built by the 90 million households that fox news hits every day and by this talk radio and online segment that really didnt want a fair and balanced approach to the world and how we talk about issues. They wanted that separate media thing. They wanted what they always think the liberals have. Where only their views and their grace notes were hit. And i think there is a there is a deep underpinning of racial anxiety that informed a lot of
trump voters. As i said this before, not every single trump voter is a racist and aphobic jerk. Every single racist and aphobic jerk is a trump voter. True. Rick, you know, one of the im just curious how youre sorting through this. Guys like you and me have spent our entire lives pushing back on the belief there was this subterranean racism in the Republican Party. That it wasnt really about that. Whether it was about freedom. Whether it was about economics. Whether it was about low tax rates. Whether it was about the american dream. Whether it was about affording everybody, you know, equal opportunity, thats what i believe my entire life, and it is, at least to me, its been shocking and somewhat embarrassing just how wrong i was all along that a huge chunk
of the Republican Party was exactly what liberals had been accusing us of being for a very long time. Joe, its a fight like you said, weve both pushed back on it for years and years and years. And said thats ridiculous, thats absurd. We can go back to dwight d. Eisenhower. This whole arc we pushed back on for years, we were wrong. Theres a faction of this party that really wants to hear that message. Theres a whole industry now in the trump world of, you know, what i call the coal country christophs. The people that want to explain away the racial animus trump has ignited in a lot of these folks. Theres a part of it, we have to call it out. I call it out in the book pretty directly. If a conservative party wants to survive in the future, it has to purge that. Aggressively go after people who believe in that stuff, who touch the alt right, involved in this
sort of explaining away trumpism in this regard. Mika, you know, when you have unemployment at 3. 9 and when donald trump himself says the economys doing better than its ever done before, which its not, but its still doing very well, its kind of hard to say, oh, people are being racially incensensitive because the economys so bad. Thats just in the words of my friend rick wilson, thats just chicken bonk. Yes, or something else. The book is everything trump touches dies. Its out tomorrow. Rick wilson, thank you very much. Thank you, rick. Up next, education runs on lies. Thats a direct quote from former education secretary arne duncans new book. He joins us next to explain it. , we offer innovative investing tools to prepare you for the future. Looks like you hooked it. And if thats not enough, well help your kid prepare for the future. Dont hook it kid. And if thats still not enough,
well help your kids kid prepare for the future. Looks like he hooked it. Well do anything. Takes after his grandad. Seriously anything, to help you invest for the future. Ally. Do it right. Joining us now is former secretary of education under president obama arne duncan. He has a new book out tomorrow,
how schools work, an inside account of failure and success from one of the nations longest serving secretaries of education. In it, writes, in part, education runs on lies. Thats probably not what youd expect from a former secretary of education, but its the truth. How schools work best is often by confronting and fighting these lies, but this is exhausting and sometimes perilous work. Usually undertaken by an isolated teacher or principal. So the lies persist. They are emblematic of our system as an apple left of the corner of a favorite teachers desk. But unlike the apple, the lies arent sweet. They are overripe and rotten. Arne duncan joins us open in thank you for being with us. Good morning, thanks for having me. What are the lies . Ill start with the basic premise that we care about education. And the fact is we as voters, we never vote on education. We dont hold any politician accountable for results at the local level, at the state level,
at the National Level. Good words, good sound bites, but not reality. We say we value teachers. And teachers are so hugely important. But we dont compensate. We dont train. We dont reward teachers like the True Professionals they are doing the most important work as, you know, raising, educating our babies. For me, maybe the toughest lie is we say we value our children. What weve done as a nation, much to my horror, we have raised a generation of teens on gun violence, on Mass Shootings. That doesnt happen in other nations. That has a direct impact of children growing up terrifies, living with trauma, living with fear. I dont spend much time listening to what they say. Tell me what the countrys going to look like in 20 years when we have an educational system where if your child is in an inner city school, youre a
single mother, youre working a part time job, and that child going on to another inner City High School is going to have to compete against other kids from suburban schools where they have much more materials to work with, their families are more secure. Whats it going to look like . Its competing with children in india and china and, you know, south korea. So for me, doesnt matter if youre coming out of the inner city or Rural America ornative american reservation. If you have access to great teachers. If you have teachers that care about you. If you have a fantastic principal, im actually very optimistic. I think you can be on track to be successful. If we dont do those things, though, we perpetuate cycles of poverty. Are we doing them now . It varies place by place and school by school. I had the joy of traveling the nation. Visiting schools. I saw amazing schools at the heart of the inner city. In west virginia. I also saw places that break your heart. So one of the lies is weve never committed ourselves to educating all of our kids. All of our kids. How do you convince the country, folks who are in very homogenous neighborhoods, however you want to describe it, that we should be committed to educating owl of our kids . Thats the right question. If we want a thriving and growing middle class. If we want a vibrant civic democracy, we have to do that. Its in our nations best interest. Its not just my children, your children. We need to educate all of our children and we all gain. Rising tide lifts all boats in this area. All right. The book is how schools work. Its out tomorrow. Secretary arne duncan, great to see you, and thank you so much for being on the show this morning. Thank you for having me, i appreciate it. Final thoughts, joe . Well, we see the madness
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