Transcripts For CSPAN2 Hearing Focuses On Hate Crimes Targeting Religious Groups 20170503

Welcome to a very important hearing that we have been thanks for being patient as we get started. I will have an Opening Statement and senator feinstein then we will introduce the first panel then when we are done to the second panel. The Senate Judiciary committee responses to the increase of religious hate crimes. It is the great bipartisan interest religious hate crimes are victims the crimes would not have been committed except for hatred. Overthecounter to our america is freedom and they would treat this as religious groups rather than individuals. Religious hate crimes are on the rise. Crimes against jewish people are the most common religious a crime and they have increased against muslims try the fastestgrowing category. To these crimes increased by 67 percent by 2014 and 2015 from where the fbi has records available. I have been contacted the year from practicing religion should never have been. This is my pledge to you to confront antisemitism tuesday about prejudice and condemn hatred and we will act. With the statements to follow a tradition of Government Action dating back to George Washington wrote to a synagogue that the government of the United States no sanctions or persecution no assistance. If their rights are to be protected Law Enforcement resources to the houses of worship of necessary and then create a specific task force to create special assistance to in house security or purposes but that reality may require people who have the First Amendment establishment clause to prevent any to reconsider those views so for instance. The Supreme Court consider the constitutionality of the provision for government Financial Assistance if it could prevent iran the edges institution for receiving government grants to be made available to the secular entities. In den the oral argumentsked asking about a Grant Program with the heart and nonprofit facilities and then if you have a synagogue that is a high risk of attack by the antisemitic group or a mosque that is considered to be a mosque by the entire muslim group like we have around the court here . From j and astonishing to me though lawyer responded no. D know they would not permit the state even on a neutral basis to minister a security Grant Program. The safety of buildings is important in itself but we cannot lose sight the fact that people are so often in the buildings and being targeted. This douglas because shin not be prevented from those practicing their religion i believe religious a crimes a g require a response of Financial Assistance to facilities that are targeteds killed the Supreme Court supreme decided sure ruling to allow government to forbid religious entities receiving assistance that is available to other organizations to hear from the Justice Department with the efforts of the way from religious hate crimes on the nature of the of problem and how to address that. Will also hear from a victim of religious a crime eyelet forward to their testimony. Mr. Chairman thank you for calling this hearing. It is important topic and it goes to a core value that is freedom and tolerance. W we pride ourselves to be a unique and diverse a society which means we have got to except many differences of creeds, colors and ethnicities and that is important to the concept of america to be a United Country that respects these differences with the suspicion and hate so the topic today is religious hate crimes i think it doesnt matter if it is based on religion, race religion, race, ethnicity, s exual orientation, gender or any other element of the shared values and humanity as a country. We have got to condemn every form of it mattered who was targeted that is the depth of my being. I am hopeful that this committee can continue to work on this even with religious hate to delaware la the federal government has an Important Role to play on one to make clear 15 to my view to take place on the local level. They each face their own unique challenge with religious bias. For sun 18 years and i remember when the swastika was painted on the synagogueynae i got on the phone to call the chief of police to say you go down there and you looked at it and have your people do something about it. I made a strong Public Statement met this would not be tolerated in my city. The same thing happened with other kinds of crimes because of food they are in their religion, race, straight or gay. So it is very important to address it and say we will not allow it in very important for the leaders not to shrink from this but to lead. Did of sense this is the start and i think everybody here understands for was to create a Different Society that does not deal with the hate according to the Antidefamation League theres reports of 541 antisemitic incidents in the first four months of this year. Increase of 86 percent compared to the number of those recorded over the same period one year before. 380 harassment incidents 161 bomb threats is an increase of 127 percent over 2016. Bob threats were called into more than 80 Jewish Community centers and childrens schools located in 33 states and two canadian provinces. The rate 27th, there were 31 prance called then add 23 Jewish Community centers and day school that is in a single day. They sparked tremendous fear and thankfully the Justice Department arrested the man responsible no one was injured or killed. Hate crimes against muslims and those perceived to be kelso increased at an alarming rate. These crimes include a horrific murders. Id like to draw your attention to a map which shows the recent incidents of the entire muslim hate crimes chucked tracked by abacus group negative advocates you can see where they are concentrated. I find that interesting as well. 254 separate incidents and in 2016 the Southern Poverty Law Center found the number of antimuslim hate groups tripled in 2016 from 34 up at 101 last year. Seventy the fbi data also captures a sharp increase during the same period. In my home state of california, hate crimes against american muslims increased 70 . The tax the attack on perceived muslim was risen sharply. Is incumbent for leaders to condemn the crime with race or religion in my view the rise of a crime is due to the perception those that po are in different to what is happening dont prioritize the protection of the right of all american sandoz speak out. We have to make clear that hate has no place in our country and there will be investigated and the seriousness is taken into consideration with the sentencing. Second, to ensure that communities have the support and resources they need to prevent and investigate these crimes. With state and local agencies and the Justice Department needs to provide in the third the federal their freedom must improve the reporting of the hate crime. Because it increases awareness and accountability but it is inadequate. If we dont have an accurate picture of what is happening is much harder for justice and fbi to address thehe problem. To require the fbi to collect the hate crime data to develop reporting guidelines so the of quality of that data has improved the Justice Department t revised the incident report to collect data on hate crimes against mormon and Orthodox Christian and jewish individuals. 267 requested the change. We must do better many jurisdictions still dont report the hate crime to the fbi while the fbi typically reports between five and 10,008 crimes the true number may approach 300,000 which is 30 times the fbi estimation. Senator hatch and i just introduced a bill to update the arson prevention act of 1996 to prevent the intention of making of threats to religious property. Re that is a big deal. The summary goes to another church to deface that or rates threatening graffiti and has an impact of a wide range of people so wouldwi have to be taken very seriously. When human lives are in danger or dignity is in jeopardy national sensitivities are irrelevant. Whenever men and women are persecuted the at that moment they must become the center of the universe. With that before us, thank you for working with us. Go now introduce the first witness, a special counsel for religious discrimination in the Civil Rights Division of the department of justice as an undergraduate degree with the law degree from harvard. I recognize you for five minutes if you have a longer statement the never cut anybody off but then just summarize the rest of your statement. Go ahead. Good morning and chairman and Ranking Member and members of the Committee Thanks for holding this hearing to discuss the topic to enforce federal hate crime laws. I am sorry acting assistant attorney general cannot be here today due to a familyem emergency. Hate crimes are a serious problem that the attorney general must be a part of the National Effort to reduce Violent Crime. First hate crimes make up for percent of Violent Crime in america and second these are crimes meant to intimidate and terrorize communities as were all concerned about our familiesel becoming victims but when people are targeted for hate crimes they experience the concern they be attacked because they stand out because of race or religion or National Origin president c trump spoke about the threat to Jewish Community centers and stated we are a country that stands united to condemn hate and evil and all forms in attorneygeneral sessions has stressed against people of all religious backgrounds. While the race hate crime is the largest category of religion based is the secondlargest. The fbi data shows 23 percent rise and entire muslim the hate crime or the jewish hate crime. On april 21st reid we obtained the conviction of a fairy and then january tend to have the Death Penalty against dylan for the murder of nine africanamerican worshipers at the bible study at the church in south carolina. Iran testimony details the federal hate crime laws in the situations their powerful to bring resources to bear support. To be sure the serious crimes have serious consequences. In to provide resources with houses of worship the we can bring in the atf raid the fbi to find and pursue the perpetrators of those policies in place with the partners with the efficient and effective manner in rica always get better and we must do better. That is why the attorney general has made the hate crime subcommittee of the Violent Crime Task Force One of the pillars of the effort it will hold a summit on Violent Crime the following week the hate crime subcommittee will hold an additional one day summit focusing on identifying and preventing hate crime. And how to best produce a crime in america. The senate and the subcommittee are focused on the incomplete hate crime data. So this is part of a conversation going for word. Politically deal with if we fully understand it also working on ways to improve training and outreach through the language or cultural barriers that is critical to the success of any program to combat hate crime. Acting assistant attorney general and i can attest to the importance of communication for us says the government to hear what is going on in but we can do better to let the Community Know the area is getting help i think you for the dialogue you are facilitating an accord to half your question. If thank you covered my first question when the summit this so important to get some ask you to elaborate further. The idea not just to bring the expertise from the components of doj Civilrights Division Community Relations but never saw kennedys racial communities representing elegy bt and those of a year doing well or not doing well Data Collection and what we can do to make that better tractor komi talked about the longterm plan to migrate but also the several years before that is fully implemented. For anyone to say just a listening session but we want to hear from the experts and local Law Enforcement from the communities about what we should be doing. With second question is asking for examples of religious hate crime and administration that some are probably carried over i dont expect you to give us a long list now buchanan supplemented with the some written material. That is outlined in the written testimony i just highlighted a few tattoos minnesota senators here on march 8 a judge sentenced of a case that we brought to 12 months in prison with a threat to blow up the mosque and bakersfield california april 10 there is a 15 year sentence for a man who fired a shot gun toward a latino family then fired at pay middle eastern million at a convenience store. And mention this because we found people that hate are not discriminating. They are angry at muslims or middle easterners or anybody who looks different. We think of that as a general problem that we need to address into have a case to receive a guilty plea from a man who threatened grotius store owners in Orlando Florida that they had 30 days to close the store or be attacked that is the kind of violence so when they are attacking them because of the race and to move into the neighborhood of their choice that protects the underlying civil rights of society. So is their religious freedom cases over many years those that our religious hate crimes is it your experience that is on the rise . Nonsense of president ial election those that they witnessed in previous administrations hate crimes are a perpetual problem in society. So it is a problem we have been battling for many years. We have seen a trend in the data with a rise the year before we dont have the data but i can say we have many referrals that are coming in from your taking the problem very seriously tearing our resources added in the attorney general believes and will aggressively pursue new hate crime. What i am bothered by is the statistics dont really give the right situation. For example, the fbi typically reports between 7,000 and 10,008 crimes in with the estimation in to be nearly tripled between 2004 and 2012 how do you account for the discrepancies . Senator it is on to different methodologies i do agree the fbi undercounts headed accounts actual instance where a Police Officer in the field received a reported case maybe prosecution or not but includes that as a hate crime minos some states are better than others. Those expected 1400 more. Yes senator. One thing we did last summer. And we expect to do it again is to reach out to over 94 us attorneys. And give them a list of what cities in their district are not reporting hate crimes and get them in their normal interactions with their mayors and say this is some you can help us with. So we have to read with those us attorneys. Tells whose only hate crimes subcommittee of the task force on crime reeducation and Public Safety. Who is on this and what is the committee supposed to accomplish . Typically it is chaired by the acting attorney for civil rights. Representatives from the fbi hate crimes unit, other components of fbi, city relations and service. A wide range. It is all doj. Doj coming together and talk about what there is we have and then going out of the summit to hear from the community from experts. Maybe that is a good place to start. To really try and see if this cant be infused nationally with local people who are there and know their populations who when they stand up, hopefully, they listen. As opposed to some remote source in the federal bureaucracy. Cell i mean that is what i would hope this committee would take a look at doing. That is involving local leaders and encourage them to take a position. I have found that where local leaders step up, and we are not going to tolerate this it does make a difference. Senator i think that is a very good idea and ill take that back. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you for this important hearing today. It is right for people to believe what they want to and exercise some of the nations foundational and fundamental principles. That said there is troubling hate crimes in the us and throughout the world. Some of the recent examples include the more than 100 bomb threats made in Jewish Community centers throughout the country. As well as the vandalism of jewish cemeteries in st. Louis, philadelphia and other cities. In response to all of these hate crimes the president addressed the issue during a joint session of congress when he said quote we may be a nation divided on policies, but we are a country that stands united in condemning hate and evil and all of its very evil forms. The Vice President also denounced these acts of religious intolerance when he said there is no place in america for hatred or acts of antisemitism. For someone whos own finer ancestors were persecuted and driven from their homes, forced to settle down on the mountain was because of their beliefs. I agree that america must not tolerate religiously motivated hate crimes or any hate crimes for that matter. Yesterday i was joined by my friend the Ranking Member and introducing the protecting religiously affiliated institutions act. I want to thank senator feinstein for joining me in offering this bill which would expand the Church Arson Prevention act to criminalize the threats made to intentionally deface, damage or destroy any religious property or to threaten, obstruct, by force or threat the enjoyment of someones enjoyment of free exercise of their religious beliefs. In the coming weeks the senate will consider and pass this as a demonstration of our commitment to the united against evil and hate. With that i just have a few questions. Let me ask you this. Can you please share what the department is doing to promote religious liberty of all people in this country . Thank you senator. One of the things that we are focuseds aggressive enforcement of the religious land use and institutionalized act. It is widely sponsored with senator kennedy in the senate and has done a great deal to expand religious liberty of all people. One of the things we have seen in recent years since 2010, is a rise in the number of antimuslim cases. Some cases where someone opposes a Muslim School are embossed. Does make up about 37 percent of our investigations. Muslims make up 1 to 2 percent of the population. We have right now, one case that we resolved in march and three that are ongoing involving mosques. We have these involving many different communities of faith. And their ability to construct places of worship and we continue to aggressively pursue these cases. Many are concerned that in the country are not accurate. Many jurisdictions do not fully participate in reporting the activities. In those crimes. So i am very concerned about that too. Is this an accurate assessment and what can be done to improve the accuracy of hate Crime Statistics in the United States. It is true. The hate Crime Reporting relies on voluntary compliance. We have 14,000 agencies participating in the program. There are some that do not as we discussed a moment ago, one goal is to get more involved and also those who are already involved, get better training for officers to spot hate crimes. To know what to look for. How to record it so it gets captured in the data. It seems to be targeting Police Officers by the virtue of the fact that they are Police Officers. What is the department doing about that as well . The attorney general has made fighting Violent Crime one of the very highest priorities. And certainly protecting our men and women who are out there in the field putting their lives on the line to protect us and face violence. It is an important part of that Violent Crime picture and on march 31 the attorney general issued a letter regarding Public Safety and Law Enforcement and talk about issues such as protecting Police Officer safety, boosting morale and also a number of other things including protecting civil rights of all americans. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator. Thank you very much, mr. Chairman. I thank you for holiness and important hearing. Senator collins and i actually spoke at the Prayer Breakfast this year. I did the closing prayer and i use it home from walt whitman and when he said i hear america singing very carol. In the poem he talks about shoemakers, masons and all of the various jobs americans hold. But i said that they were talking about the very religions. And we had a rabbi on the stage, we had christians there and we had an emomin the front row. And this is what america has been built on, the freedom of religion. And i want to ask you first of all from a state that has the largest somali population in the country as you have a knowledge we have had a recent attack on a mosque. We have had attacks on africanamerican homes. But many states we have threats on Jewish Community centers. I would like to know as we have seen the rash of threats and actual violent acts from your perspective, and the Justice Department what you see as the cause of this increase in threats . Thank you senator. Your mentioning the somali population in minnesota. We handled a couple of years ago, i was involved personally in a case involving a somali Muslim Community wanted to rent out a for purchase a building. Im aware of the case and the us attorney and you worked on that. Can you semiquickly because i want to get two or three more questions. What you see is the cause . I just wanted to say the end of that case, there is a photo of the mayor embracing the somali anything that shows the breaking down of the barriers of misunderstanding. If you look at data. But what are you seeing as the increase . What is the cause . One of the leading causes of antimuslim is not knowing a muslim. People are who likely to have a friend who is or know someone are less likely to have that. Saw the increase in the last few years . We had muslims and minnesota for that now we are suddenly seeing this number of threats against them and in the jewish communities . Im not a sociologist. I can say that we are concerned by trends. When we see Something Like a 67 percent rise in antimuslim hate crimes. We take action and we are bringing cases to try to meet this problem. Let me just tell you some of my views having been prosecutor after 9 11 and saying when president bush stood up and said this is not about one religion. Going around with our republican appointed us attorney. We did not see a rash of hate crimes. We had wanted to my jurisdiction because of that. And so i think the language at the top matters. I recently heard that story of a muslim family that had been in 9 11 in minnesota and experienced no bad language or threats. Now here they are with their kids 10 years or so or more later and at a restaurant a guy walks by and says go home to a came from. The little girl looks up at her mom says mom, i dont want to go home. He said we could eat out tonight. Can you think of the words of the innocent child. She didnt even know what he was talking about. Because minnesota is the only home that she knows. The United States is the home that she knows. My point is first of all, language matters. And i appreciate the work that the Justice Department is not a hope he passes on to the highest officials of our government. People in the last year and month say it was or should not be able to run for president. Maybe that will happen in our lifetime but it is at least a dream every child in this country. That they should be able to run for president if they are a citizen of the country. I think those words matter. I also think we have some additional funding we are trying to get for Homeland Security for faithbased Community Centers and i know that is out of Homeland Security. But hope you look at that. And talk to the attorney general about that. And then the third thing is some of the work that we have been doing in minnesota and other places targeting extremism. So i will admit that with what you think we should be doing more . And what is the Justice Departments views of trying to do more to when you mention Homeland Security and helping with communities of faith, one of the things we do in the Civil Rights Division in outreach is hold joint meetings, joint Conference Calls with Community Leaders and one of the things he had to offer communities is protective security advisors. They do walkthroughs into any Critical Infrastructure that includes places of worship, religious schools, other schools and point out vulnerabilities to our sin, to active shooter, other Security Issues and so that is something very positive going on that we are making a point of talking to the community about. Method next week we are cosponsoring with fema Church Person Awareness Week focusing on house of worship arson. And to heighten awareness of these issues. And for communities to take advantage of those federal resources out there for them. Thank you very much. Senator, your next if you are not ready senator leahy senator lee is ready. I would like to before. Thank you. I appreciate it. What can you tell us about what the department is doing to reach out to vulnerable communities . One of the things the Civil Rights Division has traditionally done, and attorney general tom wheeler has made a special commitment to reach out to communities. We have a quarterly meeting with muslim arabs, south asian and hindu organizations probably bring in Homeland Security department transportation, Civil Rights Division and talk about the range of issues. Not just hate crimes although that is a major part of it. But all the different issues of discrimination facing a particular Community Based on the backlash started after 9 11 and has continued in the present. We also do outreach to many communities of faith as well as many different civil rights organizations. Thank you. Now, i know you cannot comment something about that but can you confirm that you do have an ongoing . ,yes we do. We have a number of investigations to plan tightly just hate crimes of various sorts and reels of an Ongoing Investigation into the jcc threats. We made an arrest. There was a man that we identified after some real heavy work by the fbi and they really ran this on to the ground. The man has been charged in several ports in florida, georgia and the investigation continues. To your knowledge sir, the administration changed any of its policies with regard to investigating and prosecuting hate crimes since the beginning of the administration . No, the attorney general has been consistent and strong in his message that hate crime is Violent Crime. And we need to do everything we can to with all of our tools to fight this problem. It is my understanding that the attorney general established this hate crimes subcommittee. Is that something that existed before . No, it is a new subcommittee part of his task force on crime redemption and Public Safety. It is a premier initiative and he made hate Crimes Committee a principal part of that initiative. It is part of that work of the subcommittee, are they looking at whether there has been an increase in hate crimes . There looking at the data. They are looking also at processes. Do we have all of the tools that we need . Are there reforms that we should recommend as a department . Are there things that we should do internally differently . How we work with attorney generals, local Law Enforcement, everything is on the table to try and improve how we are addressing the hate crimes problem. I would imagine when looking at Something Like that and trying to figure out where the trend is, it has to be frustrating. To realize that anytime youre looking at data, you are already a year at least removed from the data. And it has to make it difficult to track that. Is there Anything Congress can do to help you with that . Yes, the data conversation is really part of an ongoing conversation. I note director, has testified about it. There are longterm plans for migrating to a new data system. Shortterm solutions that should be explored. But yes, i mean having good data helps us allocate resources. That said, we know now that we have a hate crime problem and a religious hate crime problem. Regardless. And we do not need to wait for the data to know that. We are putting resources into combating that. But having better data does allow us to do that more efficiently. Thank you. And thank you for your work on this issue. We live in a country that is an island oasis of religious freedom in many respects. And at that status, we are not free from this type of bigotry that has causeds are suffering and summary parts of the world. We want to make sure that our Law Enforcement personnel have the tools they need to combat the violence of bigotry and as they see it. We thank you for your service. Thank you, sir. Thank you, mr. Chairman and thank you Ranking Member for this important hearing. Thank you for joining us today especially short notice. You begin your written testimony with the Trump Administration transport they have made to address hate crimes. In addition to the Justice Department investigations into hate crimes and other potentially biased motivated incidents that you point out, the president condemned hate during his first address to congress and then last week he quote reasserted his resolve. To confront hate crimes at an event here in the capital. These are steps and the president should be commended clearly and unequivocally condemning hate. But far too often whether it is through missteps or associations with controversial figures, the white house fails to speak clearly in opposition to bias in hate. Far too often the white house sends mixed messages. Mr. Trevor will attempt to see factors in the rise of hate crimes and i wonder what message you think it sends to individuals who may engage in that kind of reprehensible behavior when the president selects steve bannon as his chief strategist. Steve bannon d former chairman of breitbart news. And as leadership was regularly in an ideology of racism, misogyny, homophobia, antimuslim propaganda and what message does mr. Bannons presence sends . Senator, the message that i feel strongest as a prosecutor and attorney is the consistent message that i have gone through the attorney general to pursue hate crimes. To continue doing the work we have been doing. Quasimethane message that you got. I am saying, because you are not committing any of the religious hate crimes. Im talking about people that do. What message does it send it to them . Not you. That mr. Bannon is chief strategist. Right. I am as encouraged as you were by the presence before congress. That is not answer my question. Yes, i can only really speak for myself and i have consistently been given the message to continue to pursue cases on behalf of muslims. You are the special counsel for religious discrimination. Certainly you must have some perspective on this so you can share with us and what it means when the president selects a special counsel. Someone who is trafficked in antimuslim propaganda. Senator, with all due respect i am here talking about hate crimes and can only stress i insisted that we should continue to pursue the cases involving entities hate crime cases regardless of the religion. I understand that. I asked the question. Listen, the president came to minnesota sunday before the election. It was work public appearance there. And he told the people gathered at the airport, and airport about 1000 somalis were that minnesota suffered enough. Because of the Somali Refugees that were there. What kind of message does that send to these people who desecrate mosques, who attack people who are muslim with a finger muslim . What kind of message does that send to them . Senator i will just say in my role i am done with sending out a message that we will enforce the law for all persons that regardless of somebodys nationality, their religion, the department of justice and ready to protect their rights. Thank you. Thank you, mr. Chairman. I grew up in a segregated country. Some would say it is segregated south and of course the south was segregated. So with our country. Because it has been my experience that racism and bigotry doesnt understand geographical lines. And i know we still have problems in this country. As senator frankin spoke about. It struck me listen to testimony. We are here talking about hate crimes. It is something that not that many years ago in america we would not be talking about. And i think that is a good thing. And again while we have a lot of problems in the country in terms of the way we stereotype people, im pretty proud of whats happened in this country. I mean in 150 years, we have gone from institutionalized avery to give one example. To a president of the United States that is africanamerican. And in the grand scheme of things, 150 years is not much at all. Having said that we still have work to do. I understand that. But i want to be sure to understand our terms. What is your definition of a hate crime . The term hate crime can be very misleading. There are many crimes caused by hate. Dont filibuster me. All im saying is, hate crime, there are a lot of crimes motivated by hatred, neighbor versus neighbor over something and those are serious crimes. We also recognize a category think bias crimes a better term probably. A hate crime has caught on both domestically and internationally. Is based on status of legitimate status . Based on a particular status that the legislature has decided is in need of particular protection. Like race. Yes. Again, hate crimes are committed all hate crimes at least in america in the state or county or parish but they are prosecuted by local officials. What is the Justice Department doing to assist them and make sure they take it seriously . Ar hate crime statutes and 45 states. But those that do have them cover some of the which dont have them . I do not know that offhand senator. It is not perfect. There will sometimes be crimes or there is a gap in coverage in a state. Our prosecutors work with state, local Law Enforcement to determine is this better for them to proceed, better for us to proceed . Is a cooperative endeavor . Sometimes regular crimes. If someone is murdered, is facing capital murder. We do not need to step in, it does not need to be a hate crime. But sometimes if there was arson at a place of worship and the arson laws will only give a couple years whereas we can bring a prosecution and get b,1 for burning down a church or a mosque. So we were cooperative with the state and locals on these issues. What kind of hate crimes nationwide to see the most of . I would assume race but races number one then religion. And which particular religion . Jewish religion. About 650 and 2015. And then i think 260 something antimuslim. So jewish is number one and the muslim is number two. Both representing roughly small portions of the population which is a particular concern. Does mr. Bannon work in the department of justice . No, sir. Okay. Does the attorney general have any jurisdiction over the white house . And the white house staff . No senator. Okay. Is there any doubt in your mind, any doubt whatsoever that in your opinion, the attorney general of the United States intends to pursue hate crimes vigorously . He has consistently given us encouragement to pursue these cases vigorously, yes. Is there any doubt in your mind . No. None . No, sir. Zero . No. Thank you. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Some disagreement, she is next. Let me know because i am going by, there is disagreement . [inaudible] proceed senator. Thank you, mr. Chairman. It is no accident that there is a rise in hate crimes because we are in an environment where the president targets muslims with his language. And of course during world war ii and there was tremendous antijapanese leading to the termination of 220,000 japanese americans. During heights of fears about importing of japanese cars, this is where the federal government does play a role. Because there murdered a prosecutor at the state level and were acquitted and the federal government had to pursue these murderers. So after a most Divisive Campaign we are in an environment where people think it is okay to express their racism through not just words but through threats. So i know that we acknowledge a rise in hate crimes and that there is underreporting. So just want to ask you, last week the department of Homeland Security security launched the victims of immigration on the one had to have an administration that supports the focus on hate crimes and then the office puts people at risk by putting personally identifiable information and not necessarily Accurate Information and information about children also. How can we be assured that we are not demonizing immigrants, many of whom are actually victims of hate crimes . When you were in office like this where people are encouraged to provide information about immigrant for crimes committed by immigrants . Your thoughts . Yes senator, thank you. At the Civil Rights Division we frequently interact with the office of civil rights and Civil Liberties at dhs. I do not know about what you race but one of the things i mentioned earlier we have quarterly meetings with communities they are part of that. The community raised issues like the one that you have raised and this is something that we can discuss with civil rights and Civil Liberties office and pursue but i currently do not have any secular information about that office. I would ask that you pay some attention to whatever was the reason for the voice office and what is coming out of it and any endangerment of people. In fact, if the information that is released through voice is inaccurate i would say that the federal government is subject to some litigation. Going onto, i realized the Civil Rights Division has a subcommittee on hate crimes that is embedded in a larger task force targeting Illegal Immigrants and drug trafficking. Im concerned that that hate crimes subcommittee is under a larger task force on immigration enforcement. Can you assure us that the hate crimes subcommittee is given sufficient clarity within the Civil Rights Division . Yes senator, the overall task force, the task force on Crime Reduction in Public Safety. And in recognition of the fact that the attorney general believes that hate crime is a Violent Crime problem. It is part of the Violent Crime problem in america. He has put one of the key subcommittees there as a hate crimes subcommittee that is headed by the head of the Civil Rights Division. And so it has a great deal of autonomy. It is also part of that broader effort so that marquis effort to combat all forms of Violent Crime in the us. Actually there is a larger task force targeting Illegal Immigrants. And the administration is not a fan of immigration. So i would hate for the subcommittee to become consumed by the fervor of focusing on illegal immigration. So please assure me that it will not happen. To my understanding, the task force, is focused on all forms of Violent Crime and that is its focus. And hate crimes are a part of that. I do not have any indication that it is focused on is there something that they will issue your own reports or, and also since education, racism is learned. And so i would be really interested to know how your subcommittee will focus on starting early through the educational or through education efforts because prosecution is one thing. I do not know how much of a deterrent prosecution is. Albeit very important. But really hatred is learned so i would like to know what kind of focus you are putting on the prevention side through education. I agreed with that and in the Civil Rights Division we put a lot of focus into ensuring equal educational opportunity. Dues are able to get educated free of harassment. I will have further questions for you. Thank you. Thank you, mr. Chair. Mr. Treene. Thank you for being here. I think some has been said about some of the advisors the president has brought in. I think in the department of justice we can go back to 2009 and see in attorney general and a senator who is a Ranking Member that had a concern with the uptick in hate crimes and prompted a discussion and ultimately a hearing on it. It sounds like to me you are not getting anything but keep your foot on the accelerator in terms of pursuing hate crime prosecutions. That is correct, senator. The task force he mentioned 45 states implement in some legislation. And looking at how you can work more closely with state and local governments, is there any forward leaning states in terms of how well they have done at the state level . The reason i asked that question is to get more leverage in terms of judicial capacity and have other resources. I am a little reluctant to put out a little for leaving out some that are doing a good job. But we talked to some prosecutors about new york. And he said i dont remember the last time that after looking at a hate crime thought we need to come in because they were doing such a fantastic job. Kudos to them but kudos to others and i do not want to leave others out by listing several. How are your resources going . Are you properly resourced for the cases you are dealing with . s yes. I mean i would hold back on answering that because i know we are coming up on budget time. I know we are able to do a lot of great work. Every agency will say we need more but i will leave that to the departmental folks who are making requests on behalf of the whole department. What about other devices or authorities that we should consider at the federal level to give you more tools for prosecution . The summit will have a general look at legislative proposals. Any generally accepted as things that you would like to see . You know i do not want to jump the gun and discuss what i think is good when we have not had the time. We are creating space for communities and local prosecutors, fbi, civil rights to come together and work through this. And i do not want to get ahead of that. One thing in the task force that i would really encourage you to look at. I was in the North Carolina legislature for a few years. Making sure that Data Collection is very important. We need more information to be more instructed in how we pursue these kinds of crimes and identify trends. But there can also be heavyhanded Data Collection which creates a distraction for people in Law Enforcement and the courts and then there can be rights treene hope you have the right minds and the task force looking for that. The right. That is what we want to make sure we include state and local Law Enforcement in the discussion. Theyre the ones are we facing the burden of Data Collection on the user end. Thank you mr. Chair. Before i call on senator senator leahy, they were not able to come incident but if i do put a statement in the record for them. Without objection that will happen now. Thank you chairman. Ranking member feinstein. Thank you mr. Treene for your testimony. As you heard from my colleagues on both sides of the aisle we are deeply concerned about the rise in hate crimes targeting religious minority facing the United States and the rise. In delaware a bit alarmed to see the Jewish Community targeted with multiple bomb threats and to see Muslim Americans and neighbors and friends fearful as a result of the toxic rhetoric and violence around the country. You sir have testified there has been a noticeable uptake in Violent Crimes, hate crimes against muslims and those who are perceived to be muslim. In my home state we have had a period of positive rallies voting tolerance at the jcc, at the main mosque, at the general assembly. But citizens from my state are asking for a clear unified message from federal Law Enforcement and from the federal government. And you and administration of gotten that message. 100 senators. Have joined a lender back in march calling for doj, jhs at the agitate Quick Response to widespread bunkers to jcc and i will submit for the record it is pretty rare that 100 of us agree on anything. And in april Ranking Member feinstein wrote a letter in the doj needs to directly address the steadily increasing number of religiously motivated hate crimes. Ive two questions. First how do you establish priorities when there are so many different groups that are feeling unsafe . They feel threatened, they feel that the proportion of drugs against them as a percentage of the population as you suggested steadily going up. And how do we pursue prosecution and had to be changed the temperature . And my second question follows up on what senator franken asked. I hear that you have gotten consistent message from attorney general sessions to keep prosecuting hate crimes. But this is in response to a significant deficit created in the course of the campaign. And it would suggest that then candidate donald trump in raleigh at the rally made statements about a muslim vent, about immigrants, about those minority folks that i think led to an inflaming of passions and an unconstructive way. And i do think that the continued presence of steve bannon is one of the most in your advisors, continue to send mixed messages. While im encouraged of the City Attorney general has sent a consistent message and that is good, and concerned that there is a mixed message being sent to the country. That the president last week at an event made positive appropriate statements about combating religiously hatred and theres a lot of work to do to overcome and accumulated deficit. Message that was spread far and wide during the campaign and in Steve Bannons present in the United States continues to reinforce a mixed message. How do set priorities and how do set them in a way that deals with this deficit of confidence among some religious minorities in the country feel that they were targeted in the course of the campaign . Thank you, senator. On the question of priorities. We want to be able to ensure that every hate crime that occurs in the United States that the perpetrators card and are punished with just punishment. And that is something that the federal government alone cannot do but we have 94 us attorneys working with state and local Law Enforcement and is a very complex, the system of government is very complex but it is a complex system of working with state and locals, finding and giving cases, maybe we dont think they are pursuing it strongly enough and then stepping in and having a tough discussion or more often, having a giveandtake about who should be prosecuting this case. It is complex but we are a country with 50 different states and a web of federalist laws. So that is how we do it. But it is something that we think we can do better and that is part of the purpose of the task force and on the question of messaging, one of the things that we always try to do is we send a message in our actions and prosecuting the case. Tom wheeler has been very strong in his press statements as the us attorneys press statement in hate crimes. Especially the muslim hate crimes saying that an attack on one faith is an attack on her fundamental principles. And we as americans cannot stand as one group is attached. Anything that messaging is very important coming from the Civil Rights Division and coming from the attorney general and the whole Justice Department. Thank you, sir. At some point i expect that the committee will send a unified message that we expect the prosecution of hate crimes particularly against religious minorities particularly against those where they have been a steady uptake in both hate speech and hate crime against them. That will be high on his or her priority list. Senator thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you having the hearing. Welcome mr. Treene. Thank you for your testimony. Your job is to fight hatred and bias based on race, religion or ethnicity, correct . Yes, as well as hate crimes based on sexual orientation. And you are a law clerk for a very interesting federal judge, were you not . Yes. Does it concern you that the president of United States denounced a judge based on his ethnicity . Im here representing the department on hate crimes and i do not think it is appropriate for me to speak about that. Really . A federal judge denounced based on ethnicity and you have no comment . Well, you know i am here to discuss the issue of religious intolerance and hate crimes and do not believe it is appropriate to go far afield into many other areas that might be out there. I recognize that we cannot extract an answer from you here. But i am surprised that you do not have a concern about the enunciation by the president of the United States of a federal judge based on his ethnicity. And i hope you will reconsider and perhaps submit something further in writing. Because culture and leadership are important in this area. I want to tell you a story. That i think illustrates the importance of leadership. Hate crimes are insidious because they harm not only the victim but also the community. And in connecticut, we had an incident that deeply divided our community and created tremendous contention when one of the mosques neighbors shot the building and was then charged under federal hate crimes laws by the United States attorney for connecticut. Instead of this man being condemned to incarceration, instead, he was assigned as the advocacy of the mosque itself. To do Community Service. And in fact, he performed Community Service at the mosque and tried to bring together the entire community. His example of Community Service at the mosque was the result of the leaders of the Muslim Community advocating to the Us Attorneys Office and of course the incarceration would have a less constructive i have a bill called the nohit act that would permit judges to for people convicted under hate crime laws. I visited the mosque and in fact i observed the individual who fired the shots through the press at the mosque and i think i may have met him there and heard leaders in the mosque described their personal experience. The kind of awareness and education and cultural contribution made by this kind of statute i think could be substantial. Would you agree . Very much so senator. And i would just mention that in my work, i interact with many muslim communities around the world and have heard stories like this. One in tennessee with one of the chief opponents of the mosque they went into an emergency room with a heart problem and low and behold, the cardiologist she was brought in to help her was one of the Board Members of the mosque. After he treated her with Great Respect even know if she was, and he left, he started crying and told the er dr. That she just did not know. She just did not know that this is who or that he could be like this. And this is what we need to overcome. I agree. And senator made a reference to the importance of culture and learning and so forth. There is a great song in musical called South Pacific about prejudice. It has to be carefully taught. And i think im teaching that kind of bias and prejudice is something all of us have to do and in fact, i am among 13 senators, 12 of my colleagues have joined in this effort including senator in a letter calling for the white house to establish a president ial task force. On hate crimes. Would you think that is a good idea . That is only something i will take back to the attorney general and the subcommittee as one possible recommendation. Thank you. By the way, calling senator blumenthal your honor is not a bad thing. I think he is argue more cases in front of the us Supreme Court than any living senator. So dont worry about that. I appreciate your commitment to making sure that hate crimes get prosecuted and i want to echo the view. I think youve heard loud and clear from all of my colleagues that it is a bit disconcerting to have an administration that so often telegraphs enthusiasm for division and for discrimination while at the same time you are being asked to prosecute fully and fairly where these cases turn up. If that is not a message he received from his hearing, let me say that it should be. One cant just wait around for a hate crime to take place and then prosecuted as you well know. It is also very important that proper investigation be done into organizations that promise or threatened hate crimes. There are neonazi groups in this country. There are white supremacist groups in this country. There are socalled militia groups in this country. That create a significant risk of violence and even terrorism. And a lot of what they would do in the way of criminal activity i think would be safely described as a hate crime given the motivations that bring those groups together. Could you tell me a little bit on the investigative side. Obviously we cannot go into details but are you satisfied that efforts to monitor, infiltrate, get warnings of violent behavior from and in other ways, put the Law Enforcement spotlight onto these groups is adequate . Thank you, senator. Certainly organize hate groups are a significant problem in the us. One that particularly affects the Jewish Community. I think we look at, they submitted crimes are disproportionately submitted by organized groups as opposed to individuals who just go off on their own. If you look at our cases, i really am reluctant to talk about investigative techniques. Except to the extent in cases like the robert case mentioned earlier in testimony. A man from tennessee who was reaching out to others on the internet to plot this attack on a mosque in a community in new york. A very Small Community formed by africanamericans in upstate new york. And there, the fbi using confidential informants was able to infiltrate and obtain the information we needed to prove a trial and have them convicted on four counts. So it is certainly a tool the fbis toolbox. Do see that as an episodic effort that occurred because somebody bumped across information that caused the investigation to emerge . Or are you comfortable that the fbi has a systemic and systematic efforts to infiltrate and gather intelligence on white supremacist militia type groups that threaten violence to american citizens . At the civil reservation we are on the prosecutorial and purity work with the fbi and i would defer largely to fbi to testify. My question is are you satisfied from what you see . Yes, yes i am. Of the fbi has a systematic effort to infiltrate, gather evidence and intelligence about potential violence from such organizations. Yes, in the cases i have worked on. That has been my experience. Great, thank you very much. Thank you, chairman. Thank you very much for your testimony. I know it is a long series of questions you had. It is very important to have the administrations and your department. I thank you very much and you are dismissed. With the next panel, as i introduce you . Our second panel has four witnesses. Jonathan greenblatt, ceo and National Director of anti defamation league. Prior to that serve the special assistant to president obama. Mr. Greenblatt has a degree from university. Next is doctor the dr. Is the director of the arnold institute of Global Health at mount sinai hospital. He is also an attending physician. Phd degree from Rockefeller University and md from cornell third witness on june 1 she became president and ceo of the Leadership Conference on civil and human rights. Prior to that she served as acting assistant attorney general at justices Civil Rights Division. She has 100 letters degree from yale and law from new york university. Achieved will johnson is our final witness. He is the chief of police for the Arlington Police department in arlington, texas. He is testifying on behalf of the International Association of chiefs of police. He is a graduate of the fbi national academy, hasnt undergraduate from texas tech, masters degree from tcu and will go in the way the way she should be mr. Greenblatt, will you please proceed. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Chairman, Ranking Member feinstein and members of the committee. On behalf of the Antidefamation League let me first say thank you for your leadership and recognizing the importance of religious hate crimes. Since 1913 the goal has been to stop the to us this is a dual mission. With fair treatment secured for all, our democracy is strengthened. That is what puts jews and minorities, and when they feel safe and secure in the country that is good for the democracy. You have my full testimony. First they have been pulling and antisomatic attitudes since 1964. The good news is that a large majority of americans do not subscribe to the stereotypes. But while attitudes are down as the chairman noted in his opening comments actual antisemitic instances are off. Lester was a 34 percent increase including acts of harassment and violence. Alarming and just the first three months of this year that contain six percent. Moreover there are nearly as many incidents of antisemitic bullying and vandalism at k12 schools in the last quarter is to place in all of 2016. We see this as a deeply unsettling pattern about the messages of our children are getting and acting upon. Second, the Ranking Member noted, we have data relevant to the size of this growing problem. Even the fbis information is incomplete. Others are being targeted for their religion. I should point out that muslims are feeling especially vulnerable because of the rhetoric that was touted during the last campaign and during the muslim man earlier. In a recent poll they found that americans that violence against jews in a higher percentage, 76 were violent perhaps surprisingly, 89 of Muslim Americans indicated the same. In response to these challenges, we believe to mix the approaches this would include number one, establishing a federal tax force to i applaud them for creating a subcommittee within the aji tax force and we think a federal approach to launch the next. Number two, helping Law Enforcement agencies to improve Data Collection and training about how to handle hate crimes and deal with their victims. Number three, moving forward on legislative strategy including an acting center to involve no hate asked, passing an amendment to the Church Arson Prevention act which was referenced earlier , securing passage of the antisemitism awareness back and strengthening existing hate crime laws. For, addressing cyber hate, new means for legal redress of Cyber Bullying, cyber stalking, which are not covered under the existing loss. Finally, number five, making sure that calling out bigotry whenever it happens, we appreciated the president strong statement when he was here last month. We were grateful in the Senate Unanimously passed a resolution condemning racial and ethnic hate crimes. Whether its the us president calling out heat in the country or University President calling out hate on the campus, we hope this trend will continue. In sum, we have a leadership role in conducting hate crimes and alleviating intolerance. Thank you. Mr. Greenblatt,. My name. Thank you for inviting me here today. As a physician and scientist focus on Community Health im an optimist by nature but the last month it felt particularly cruel strategy has rippled across the community. Last month, a sick cabdriver was assaulted and had his turban ripped off in new york city. In march, us chic was shot outside his cab in seattle. Apart from chairing humanity we share something else. On september 201st 2013 i just dropped off my wife and my son was one year old at the time. Before walking to a well lit intersection near columbia university. As i passed a group of 2030 young men on bicycles i heard terraced and osama from behind me as i felt my beard forcibly pulled. I turned around in time to see the entire group was mobilizing for me. The group surrounded me and began punching my face and body. As a physician, i neatly knew that my job was fractured as i could feel my teeth moving back and forth. Thankfully bystanders intervened and prevented even worse outcome the next morning i had surgery to place a stabilizing plate in my mouth which remains in place for many weeks even as a return to work. A few days after being attacked i wrote an article that showed how date grateful i was that my wife and son were not with me. Today they are here with me and he is now four years old. I still think about that evening my experience receive National Attention and americans open their hearts to be. I still have boxes overflowing with prayer cards from churches nationwide. I cherish the letters from jewish leaders who share their experience antisemitism. I still remember the letters from muslims who share their fears about their children safety. I experienced the professionalism of nyd beneath hate crime unit and i was interested in whether mikes breeze had become part of the fbi cream statistics. We cannot address we do not know. None of the headlines during that time mentioned that a recent somalian immigrant, muslim for a job, was also attacked by the same group, that same evening. The young men for a bottle of urine at her face cutting her nose. I know that because she was in the stretcher next to me in the emergency room. When i asked reporters why they didnt mention it they said it would copy the story which was about a professor and a doctor was mistakenly attacked in his own neighborhood. We cannot accept this premise. Theres no such thing as a mistaken hate crime. No one should ever be targeted. The only mistake is thinking otherwise. The other two times i was physically attacked after 911 did not make the news. In fact, i do not feel comfortable reporting them to anyone for my family and friends in the aftermath while finishing my phd i struggle with depression but also gonzalez and practicing my faith. On august 5th 2012 a neonazi gunman walked into a. [inaudible] in oak creek wisconsin and murdered six worshipers. [inaudible] who lost his mom delivered test meaning between a Senate Judiciary and i heard all of you urge all of you to watch it again. These attacks may be more aware of the broader context of heat in america. Its a breathtaking and frightening landscape that is surged interview in the past months as the religious minority communities have been subjected to threats, arson, assault and murder. Why are these acts of a growing work i was horrified to hear our president just this past weekend telling thousands of people at a rally that immigrants are snakes waiting to fight america. Words matter. When political leaders divide and dehumanize us it lays the groundwork for hate to impact our society. Senators i urge you to review the written testimony of the coalition and other groups that work on these issues. I was too close with two recommendations. One, hate Crime Reporting should be mandatory not voluntary. We cannot address we do not know. As a physician, i can attest that mandatory data reporting is crucial in the scope of the challenge unknown and solutions are urgently needed. Secondly, words matter. Politicians must hold each other accountable for putting their constituents in danger. It seems fashionable these days to for pelicans to scapegoat muslims. This endangers all of us. My personal experience is case in point. Please hold each other accountable and make it stop. Senators i have two young sons. You can see my eldest here today with his grandfather, my dad. I worry about both of them. My father who brought us for michigan from kenya currently lives in indiana and works for. [inaudible] he may be surprised that he is a Large Population in indiana. They have recently asked for help to address vandalism against their businesses in violent encounters when they are asked to leave the country. I fear they will be heard until something tragic happens. My son is about to start kindergarten in the fall. He loves soccer, trains and dora the explorer. Like most six boys you will wear a small piece of cloth on his head to cover his long hair. No one on our block treats them differently and they watch out for him like he was theirs. According to the coalition of majority of kids like it will be bullied and harassed in school. As someone who had issues 30 years ago, i know firsthand that i didnt want to talk about verbal or physical assault with my parents. These are formative years and how children are treated tells us who we are as a nation. One day i want to talk with him about this hearing and tell them that on this day a group of senators looks me in the eye and said that hate is a problem in america and that they thought about you as they committed to address it openly and honestly. Senators i am deeply grateful for the opportunity to share my story with you. Thank you. Hard to follow that testimony chairman grassley, and members of the committee i am the president and ceo of the Leadership Conference on civil and human rights. The nations premier civil and Human Rights Coalition is more than 200 national organizations. I am also the former acting assistant general of the Us Department of justice Civil Rights Division which as you know constitutes federal hate crimes. Thank you for holding this hearing on this very important topic on the rise in the list of hate crimes and inviting me to testify. Im particularly pleased to be here with longstanding partners of the Leadership Conference. This hearing comes at a very crucial time when too many people in our country feel and welcome anti and the divisive rhetoric of the recent election and comments in policies that are targeting dispersions on muslim immigrants and other marginalized amenities have heightened concerns that the United States is increasingly legitimizing or normalizing hate it can also very much kill victim reporting period and not gutwrenching instances have shaken the public including the tragic shooting of two south asian men in Kansas City Missouri to get out of my country and mosque arsons in synagogue vandalism around the country. Is it incumbent about all of us. [inaudible] hate crime is the hate crimes original form of terrorism. I met with a crime victims and family members whose loved ones had been slain by hate violence. They reverberate striking fear in their communities. The Senate Hearing today in into the rise of religious hate crimes sends a powerful message that america will not normalize hate and hate based violence in any form. Thank you. In recent years we talked about these statistics theres money market increase in eight instances around the country particularly against jews, muslims and those perceived to be muslim. The fbi reported that they rose 14 between 2013 and 2014 by a staggering 57 between 2014 and 2015. Since january of this year they have taxed more than 80 incidences of violence and threats of violence targeting american muslims and those perceived including insult of an airport worker wearing a hijab by a traveler in new york. The Antidefamation League also reports anti somatic incidences in us have surged by more than one third and have jumped 86 in the First Quarter of 2017. Since the election hate crimes overall have spikes the Southern Poverty Law Center 867 incidents in the ten days following the president ial election and that number continues to rise. In response to these Disturbing Trends the Leadership Conference recently partnered with organizations to launch communities against hate. They coordinated an effort to raise Public Awareness and empower local communities and Community Based organizations to respond effectively to hate including report crimes please and assist in prosecution to the justice system. When i let the Civil Rights Division we not only aggressively. [inaudible] but we promoted prevention efforts held in our face roundtable discussions on religious determination and schoolbased bowling around the country and conducted training with federal state and local Law Enforcement partners and how to recognize and investigate hate crimes. These efforts must continue. While my written statement contains many recommendations i want to provide, highlight a few that i think they are mentioning today. First, congress should make reporting of bias motivated crimes mandatory. Until that happens however, the fbi and Us Attorneys Office which are really the face of the Justice Department and local communities can do more to follow up with the overwhelming number of jurisdictions that fail to report a report that there are zero hate crimes at all. Second, congress should pass legislation to address the gap in current law to cover threats to religious property. It should also support the no hate act. Third, congress should provide oversight and resources to ensure that the Justice Department continues to aggressively investigate and prosecute crimes. And conduct outreach prevention and training efforts with federal, local, state partners. Four, congress should provide funding for federal anti bias education and hate Crime Prevention initiative. It is not enough to engage in enforcement we need to be promoting awareness and effective anti bias education initiatives as well. Those initiatives need money. Finally, everyone has spoken to this and it bears repeating but we urge congress, the white house and the entire administration to use the bully pulpit to speak out unequivocally around religious intolerance and bias motivated crimes in all forms. Our government must do everything in its power to ensure that people in this country live free from physical harm or intimidation that is based on their race, gender, religion, special orientation, gender identity, National Origin or disability status. Thank you all for the opportunity to speak today and for your leadership on this issue. I look forward to answering questions you may have. Chief johnson. Chairman grassley, Ranking Member feinstein and members of the same committee. Thank you for the opportunity to speak with you today about an issue of major concern to Law Enforcement professionals an increase in religious hate crimes. My name is will johnson, please chief in Arlington Texas and a member of the board of directors for the International Association of chief of police and currently chair of the iac p human and Civil Rights Committee i acp is the Worlds Largest association of lawenforcement leaders with over 28000 members representing a hundred and 37 different countries. Today we are focusing solely on religious hate crimes but hate crimes can also extend to crimes based on sundays race, National Origin, ethnicity, gender, gender identity, disability or sexual orientation. What makes religious hate crimes so malicious is the impact there spreads far beyond the direct victims and their families. These crimes have farreaching effects on our communities, spreading fear and toxicity throughout everyone that lives in our community. The acp is discussing the challenges and broadening in facts of hate crimes for two decades when we held our first summit on the issue and develop recommendations and a guide for officer response and an investigation in hate crimes. Since that time we have developed a model policy Accounting Concepts and issues paper on the investigation of hate crimes to aid Law Enforcement agencies. This resource was developed in conjunction with the Antidefamation League in september of 2016. Im happy to be here participating introduction with the adl as a been a trusted partner as had ms. Gupta and look forward to working with her and her new role on the Sikh Coalition and protecting civil rights. Over the years one of the greatest barriers and confronting overcoming hate violence on the state and local level has been the lack of firm statistical data on the incidences and nature of these crimes. In short, we have a data problem i wont restate what has already been stated before the committee today but clearly, we have a hate crime problem in the United States and the Data Available does not provide us with sufficient optics on how to best go forward to address this. While more data needs to be reported by Law Enforcement agencies we also need our communities to report a crime incidences. The most recent hate Crime Victimization publication by bj s shows an estimated 60 of total and violent hate crimes victimization were not reported to the police in 2012. Regrettably, we heard another example it has 40 today about hate crimes that were reported but were endured by the community. The decision of lawenforcement officials to classify a crime is a hate crime in a separate act of local prosecutor to decide whether or not to bring forth hate crime charges can be compensated. Its actually difficult to determine the intention of the individual offender. We must press forward to aggressively pursue all hate crimes and prosecute them as such. As previously mentioned the i acp has produced an investigation on hate crimes model policy and concepts issue paper to assist in this process. Additionally, the internet provides extremists with unprecedented ability to spread and recruit followers. Individual racists or racist organizations now have the power to reach a global audience of millions and to communicate among the likeminded individuals, easily and inexpensively and often times anonymously. We must find ways to partner at all levels of government to address this issue and to address the issue of self radicalization that can come from these types of outreaches. Obviously, hate speech is offensive and hurtful the First Amendment usually protects many forms of expression however, there is a growing trend on the internet to intimidate people and we must fight against this because regardless of the mode of delivery, hate speech containing criminal threats is never acceptable, nor is it protected under the First Amendment. As i come before you today id like to bring forward a few instances on which we feel that you can directly assist local Law Enforcement. First and foremost, we need more programs and funding for officer training and education. Clearly, we have a responsibility as a profession to make sure that we are doing the best job possible for capturing instances of hate crimes so that they can be successfully introduced into the judicial process for successful prosecution. Next, we need to expanded programs and funding and enhancing Community Police relationship only for effective Community Relations can we address this hate and underreporting of hate instances and in the sort of of justice that must follow each of these instances. Finally, its been spoken about what can be done to enhance mandatory reporting on the reporting of hate crimes in the United States. Specialized tax force and units specializing on hate force entrant crimes enhance Victim Services for those who are the recipients of these heinous crimes. The i acp is pleased with the generals. [inaudible] part of the attorney generals task force on Crime Reduction in Public Safety. As a Membership Organization we look forward to participating in the process but we would urge that this must ultimately produce action and not just the discussion on this point so that we can serve our members of our communities. Finally, we would echo the statements about all elected officials and those empowered using the bully pulpit to bring this issue to the forefront of public discussion. All elected officials need to condemn acts of bigotry every chance they get. As elected officials you hold an Important Role and as a nation your communities want to hear you speak out against these issues. I implore you to use your role to speak out against a crimes and assist your local Law Enforcement in helping successfully address these issues. It was, religious freedom is the bedrock of our democratic republic. And a constitutional right we must protect at all costs. A fundamental aspect of protecting religious freedom is to protect those who are worshiping from hate crimes and protect those citizens and the protection of our citizens should be a universally shared goal by all persons in society. On behalf of the i acp i conclude by thanking you again for the opportunity to testify on this most important topic and im happy to answer any questions you might have. Doctor singh, its probably not enough for us to say that were sorry for the crime you had to endure in the suffering that came from it but i dont think wed be very human if we didnt recognize thats what you face but we do appreciate your telling us your story. One of the parts of the crime committed against you that struck me was how the mob humiliated you before the assault. Apart from your serious, physical injuries can you tell us about any lasting emotional or psychological trauma based by religious hate crime victims and if that describes you, tell us about your point of view on that as well. Thank you. Thank you for your kind remarks. I appreciate it. On a personal basis given that the attack was in 2003 and was the third time since i was attacked 911, the first two times i struggled considerably from an emotional perspective. While i was going to training as a physician, as a scientist to National Institute of Health Training program. I made it through but it was a significant challenge. How one deals with the aftermath is a question of working with family and otherwise what i think wouldve been helpful at that juncture what ive heard from our community and others is that improving, informed engagement with hate crime victims is very important. I know that from our local Law Enforcement perspective, i saw two different sides of the coin. An incredibly professional and my bt hate crime that knew how to interact with me that had resources and background to in that very moment move forward from that incident and i rarely learned from my local precinct but they were prepared to interact with a crime victim in that juncture. I think it starts with the right resourcing at the outset because the effects are lasting inconsiderable. I know that for myself ive had incredible night of support for my community. Its a real source of support but i do know that most of the people that have reached out to me by email, my inbox that i hear regularly are struggling or alone and dont know what to do in the aftermath. I think its a significant area of work in Mental Health as it relates to a crimes and something i hope we will learn more about from my colleagues at the adl and from other civil rights groups. For Chief Johnson, you heard my colleagues and people on the panel bring up the issue that Crime Statistics arent very accurate and we need weve had a summit recommendation for mandatory reporting and of course there are problems with agencies failing to report at all or failing to report accurately with so many saying there have never been or encountered such crimes. Im skeptical that there is an easy legislative answer to this problem. We often see news reports of crimes that were obviously hate crimes but the reports often indicate that Law Enforcement only considers them to be potential he crimes. Correct me on this stuff if you think i have it wrong, there seems to be a real reluctance for Law Enforcement to call religious hate crimes what they are, religious hate crimes. If Law Enforcement is unwilling to call a crime a hate crime, i dont see how changing the law to require reporting will change the Current Situation of body data and missed opportunities. So, this is my question, what do you think explains the reluctance of Law Enforcement to try to classify a crime as religious hate crime is there any way to get around the problem if you see it as i see it if you dont, thats okay too senator, i appreciate the person. I would agree that there are opportunities within our profession to always do better. I believe theres an opportunity to focus training to better equip and educate our workforce where they can recognize, understand hate crimes so that they are effectively and adequately reported. I would also like to provide an example to the committee, if i can, about a challenge beyond the individual reporting of the hate crime by the responding officer. One of the reasons why im so passionate about this topic. As i was a young Patrol Officer proximally 22 years of age i responded to a woman, middleaged africanamerican female, who is buying groceries and when she came out of the Grocery Store somebody had carved a racial epithet into the side of her minivan. I remember how wholly inadequate i felt like my response was at the time because there was nothing i could do to help her store what this woman had gone through. I also remember the fact that it was clear to me this is not the first time she had experienced a hate crime. But had somebody expressed that hatred without carving and habitat into the side of her car and only damage her car it would have been impossible for the responding officer to know that it was hate motivated and that suspects committing an act. That truly is the problem and the challenge that Law Enforcement has. Oftentimes unless the offender is explicit in their motivation in why they committed the crime we might believe or have a hunch that it was a hunt bait crime but no way to report it definitively in our reporting process. We have to have a balanced approach in what we do. Enhanced officer training in the recognition that this is not an easily solved the problem. Let me say thank you to the four of you. I think each one of you gave very different presentations but extraordinarily meaningful. I do think that leaders have to stand up and i think leader of the Police Leaders have to stand up. Youve made three recommendations, you said make hate Crime Reporting mandatory. I agree. Secondly, programs and training and then thirdly, expanded Perspective Police Community Relations. I would like to make a suggestion to you that you go to the Chiefs Association, i understand you have a new chief from florida and i have found the chiefs very effective on the hill. I suggest that they take up this i am willing to draft legislation and ill go to my chairman and say will you work with me on it to do all of the three but theres this vulgar expression the fish rots from the head. I think the head of our government has to be more understanding that you cannot divide people. We have to work to bring people together and thats a very big part of a leadership agenda. What im asking of you is if you will involve the chief association in the three points that you made in terms of recommendations, i know that senator roto will likely assist with this, i hope senator grassley and other members of this committee. I think we can bring about another day of awareness. I think, particularly, with the Cyber Bullying and doing this over the internet, i have firsthand information on what it does to young people. Its terrible what it does. The suicides, the cuttings of themselves, the kind of emasculation they feel. I think there is a role for us to establish some prohibitions so, i would like to work with the Chiefs Association and i hope you would take that message back. Will you . Thank you, senator. Bia cp is absolutely. Could you raise that mikes work. Yes, maam. We are absolutely prepared to make sure that all persons are provided equal protection under the law. Thats over speaking of on this issue. As it relates to mandatory hate Crime Reporting certainly, the recording of all hate crimes understand what issues we are facing would be helpful. I also know that mandatory reporting was the only element that was passed in this larger discussion, it would be ineffective. It is going to take all of the pillars of the argument that have been expressed at the table today to be able to have a stronger, robust response as a community, including Law Enforcement to address this issue. Were prepared to work to meet. I think thats a bingo moment thank you. Ms. Gupta, i know of your good work in the past and welcome back here anytime. Would you provide leadership in your organization to help with this effort . Of course. The issue of siding hate and bias motivated violence has been a longstanding priority for the Leadership Conference and it continues to be obvious he, in these times, and i do want to underscore that while everyone is that i have heard and indeed, many senders have spoken of the importance of officials using their bully pulpit that its not just about words but its about policies that can target and make communities, some of the most vulnerable communities, to hate crimes. They feel like they cant trust the government and the government doesnt protect them or that it can have a joint effects on victims. Thank you. Mr. Greenblatt, would you lead the adl to provide some help if we try to put together a legislative agenda and this assumes that were going to stand on the bully part. Thats right. Yes, the adl would be gratified to collaborate with you. What i might do and you asked in the first session about the numbers. I can tell you we have a little over 18000 Law Enforcement agencies in the United States. About 1800 actively report on hate crimes which means over 13000 do not report report zero hate crimes. 3400, 3400 Population Centers communities dont report at all. There are 87 communities with over 100,000 populations that also did not report at all. The adl trained Law Enforcement, weve done great work with the Police Chiefs this was noted earlier. We train about 15000 officers every year and this is a big part of our focus. As you pointed out, it is indeed so important. To build upon what ms. Gupta said his words and actions and noting the data tries policy. There are policies that you could explore in the legislation we pointed out in my testimony but a highlight of quick bullets number one the department of justice from the attorney general down should promote hate Crime Reporting in the fci office should encourages wellin their jurisdictions. Number two you could raid and score Police Departments and consider them for federal funding on the basis do they report here crimes, do they track them. You also think about performance audits for fbi offices based on compliance with a crimes statistic act. There are some programs, the fbi has a terrific program called the National Incident reporting system. They could use more money if they presented the ability for the fbi to track these more effectively. There could be both carrots and sticks that you could use to ensure compliance and performance in this area. Doctor singh, would you be willing to participate in an effort to put a policy instruction together which we might turn into law . Thank you, senator. Absolutely. I would also count on the support of my colleagues here and in the coalition to do so. That would be excellent. Mr. Chairman, just the Growth Numbers are so extraordinary that i really believe we have to take action and its fortuitous that the four people here really represent varying aspects of our society which can be very important in the solution. So, if we can put something together that we can take our thoughts and particularly mandatory reporting that ought to happen. We can certainly do that but the rest of the program to really develop a policy directive that can be used on the local and state level as well as our level would really be helpful. Those institutions that can be helped would be very welcome. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator coons, while you ask questions im going to step in the anteroom to be briefed on another subject and ill come back and close the meeting down. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank all the panelists for your testimony, very enlightening. I was particularly taken with your testimony doctor singh. I think education is so important and what happens in our School System as you indicated, you have Major Concerns about what kind of expenses your son will have and so, one of the things that should happen is that every school should have some kind of policy on how they deal with bullying and to identify bullying and maybe the subset of bullying that is biased based or hate based. Would you agree that that would be a step toward addressing some of the underlying problems with the expression of bias in our country . Thank you, senator. I strongly agree that would be important. I would also add especially that formative stage when children are going through elementary school, theyre curious what the world, they like to know about the people around them and its the perfect time to make sure that we give them the opportunity to engage with that broader set of education that they need. I agree on a policy perspective is very practical and important. At the National Level and all her schools, this is something that misconduct can adjust. You did say that one of the recommendations you had made was the funding Educational Programs to prevent the learning of bias and racism not every state requires schools to have this kind of anti bullying policies and actions that can be taken. Is there something we can do at the federal level to address the bullying in our schools problem . Yes, its important that there be a funding for our evaluated active programs for schools and violence prevention. If the federal government to make available information as well to the public about perspective around anti bias training and hate Crime Prevention programs. This is a cultural issue is much as we can talk about enforcement , weve got to be focusing on prevention as well and starting in the schools where children can be the most vulnerable but as doctor singh so ably said, really exposes children to understanding those values are fundamental. I also, just because, you know, a lot of nonprofits including the Sea Coalition and adl have been so concerned about the current state and hate crimes is very important that we have been working together on the hate initiative. In the interim, we need to put out messages that are focused on preventing a crimes, changing the culture around hate, working with the students, connecting victims of hate crimes to report to our outline, to fill the void right now but certainly funding Educational Programs to help do that is vitally important. Cleared, there are number of steps we need to be taken. Not consecutive but there are a lot of collaborations that need to occur we really want to get to the bottom of this. Racism in our country is never far below the surface. That is my view. As a minority person myself, i can certainly relate to how it feels to be targeted. Every time our country targets a Minority Group for different treatment we are deemed that history shows that we have been very wrong and right now, the Jewish Community, Muslim Community, this doesnt stop in our country. I think this is an opportunity for us to support the is a programs that evidence shows works. Theres a number of fronts that we can go in. In fact, i was shocked that there was Cyber Bullying going on and thats another area that im glad all of you have said that you would work with our committee and senator feinstein to come up with appropriate legislation to address these issues. Cyber billing 2. 6 million tweets , anti somatic treats and sometimes these tweets lead to overt actions that are dangerous they certainly do. The adl does open up an office in Silicon Valley to focus on the increasing threat of online abuse, Cyber Bullying, cyber stalking, vaccine, this is all really starting to crest and at the current time we lacked adequate policy mechanisms to deal with these challenges. We engaged very directly with industry on a daily basis my office is working on google, facebook, microsoft, amazon, twitter, ebay to identify and deal with specific instances but i could give you a long list of where we see these online activities actually go off into the world real work. We seem journalist have been identified in targeted on twitter and then attacked mercilessly with people stocking their homes, people sending threatening letters, people doing things to undermine their professional lives, weve seen it happen to journalists over the campaign, we recently saw situation in montana that was quite horrible where the Jewish Community leaders were threatened by the quote unquote white supremacist. It is a big problem that youre pointing out. We would be delighted to work with you to explore legislation to deal with the issue. Thank you. A note to Chief Johnson thank you for the enlightened thinking that you brought to this committee. Before recognizing senator coons id like to ask unanimous consent to place the following statements in the record and then the arc to his action, Muslim Public Affairs council, the sick coalition and a letter from members of the senate to the president of the United States. Senator coons. Thank you. I like to think our traffic panel for your service and leadership in your testimony here today. Doctor singh your individual testimony about your experiences in your advocacy and work was deeply compelling great chief, thank you for what youre doing in the leadership of your department and elsewhere. Ms. Gupta, mr. Greenblatt, in your current roles in in previous roles you been terrific and effective voices. Against let me see if i can get one question into each of you in the brief amount of time that i have. As i said, delaware saw as his only other states bomb threats against our Jewish Community center back in february and march. I was encouraged that a broad range of delaware ians stood up to such hate and to such threat and terrorism. Similarly when there were threats and inappropriate statements about muslims and those perceived to be muslims earlier in the year. Mr. Greenblatt you talked about pushing back against the scourge of online hates. I was encouraged by your answers by that. Im also concerned about the threat the target houses of worship. Leasing mosques, targeted by arsonist and proceeding on threats, what more should the government do in this committee do to ensure that federal resources are available to support institutions that are seen significant threats to their security . It starts with making certain local Law Enforcement is adequately trained to provide support for houses of worship and other state based faith. Its critical that local Law Enforcement appreciate the complexity and the sensitivity of ensuring that congregants in these houses of worship have adequate protection. Secondly, speaking up at the local level really matters as well. As i heard about the stories of what happened in delaware because were tracking these jcc s, the fact that local elected officials stood up and spoke spoke out and stood up in defense of their Community Center is vital. Theres been some debate about some consideration about additional funds to pardon the institution himself, we appreciate that some would want Additional Resources but we have some concern about that because of the fundamental the difficulty of tracking such dollars, the competition that can ensue with the local level and muddying the church state divide. We think investing in our Law Enforcement agencies to achieve they provide adequate training and support at the local faithbased communities is an appropriate response back thank you, mr. Guilmette. Chief, what training and cools can tools can help local Law Enforcement how to properly respond against threats at the local faithbased centers are smart having them in particular a train and respond to threats against houses of worship, and trained in how to respond to a crimes and conduct by this replacing makes it more likely that we will have more thorough reporting, more timely and appropriate investigation and thus more effective prosecution. Was your view, chief. Thank you for the question. I would agree theres a variety of different avenues which we can focus our training, much of the testimony today spoke about partnership with the different agencies and representatives in the panel and how we collaboratively work on this topic. Id also take an opportunity to celebrate the funding and resources that come with the department of justice that helps us to provide focused and dedicated training materials and support for topics that are supportive of this. Inclusive procedural justice, bias based policing, policing and minority and disenfranchised communities and also addressing hate crimes. I would close with what i would argue is our highest need. Law enforcement is facing unprecedented challenges in terms of a variety of different topics, hate crimes being one, elevated Violent Crimes, the ability for bond and gray injuries and prosecution and Mental Health and all of these Different Things touching Law Enforcement which is bringing us in different directions. We need to pass a National Crime commission and be able to have a holistic review of all of these threats and issues confronting our communities and be able to address systematically from all different aspects, not just from a Law Enforcement mac i agree. Thank you for speaking up. We should sustain the cop program and sustained investments that make it possible for local and state law verses from the academy through their whole career service, to get there sort of training and research and engagement with adl and with other organizations that have terrific curriculum materials. My last question is to, these issues shouldnt be partisan. You heard earlier that a hundred senators joined in sending a letter to the attorney general urging prompt response, Effective Response to the jcc farming threats earlier this year. Are the Civil Rights Initiative that you hope to see continue that would be effective in combating hate crimes and promoting inclusiveness during this initiative. Yes, thank you senator. Enforcement and robust enforcement of our hate crime laws is vital but it is slowly insufficient to address and meet the needs right now. Its really incumbent on the Justice Department to continue very aggressive outreach with particularly vulnerable communities. When i was the head of the Civil Rights Division we went all corners of the country to have interface conversation, to talk about the relationship between bullying and a crimes and understand what the local solutions are and what local communities are doing and we invested in training, federal state and local Law Enforcement, digestive department made it a priority and there was not a single local Law Enforcement agency that was not starved for our specific training and they were traffic partners with the fbi, us attorney offices in specific a crimes identification proof how you will trust. Those kinds of training are vitally important. They were also with communitybased organizations. I want to close with it is really important, of course, that in order to have an effective enforcement for local Law Enforcement and for the Justice Department there needs to be trust between the most vulnerable communities and the very important institutions. The ongoing work of ensuring trust that victims dont feel that they are that they dont trust police were often the face of government in their community or the government itself is vitally important. That ongoing work that is a broader thing there needs to be an ongoing investment in the kind of programs that the Justice Department engages in to rebuild trust where it has been vitally eroded but also to recognize that words and policies that come out of any Government Entity carry and in cap their own impact on the ability for Law Enforcement to be able to address and prevent crime. It is a multifaceted effort, out of the justice system. I hope they will continue very robustly. Thank you, ms. Gupta. I look forward to working with you and your help and working with i acp. I want to thank the Antidefamation League and your resources and material been very helpful in delaware as our local Law Enforcement has done improved training to be more conscious of these. As we step up to try to advocate for and defenders. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you very much mr. Chairman. Thank you for bringing together this excellent panel on supremely profoundly important topic. I want to thank mr. Greenblatt and ms. Gupta for endorsing that no heat bill and thank each of you and other members of the panel for your handson work. I want to say how grateful i am to be adl for its educational work in connecticut. Apart from working with our Law Enforcement as you do, the work that you do in our schools, in our communities is so profoundly important in raising awareness and education. I want to say also, how grateful i am for the amicus. [inaudible] that you filed in the litigation against the president s executive order on the travel ban and refugee fighting. In our history, the nations history, the greatest nation in the world where we have turned away refugees in the past and st. Louis, in 1939 the exclusion in the 1800s and the internment of the japanese during world war ii, shameful periods in our history where in effect the nation to come to hatred and demonstrated the importance of proactive and popular leadership at the National Level. I hope that we will see such leadership in my view, we have yet to see it and i hope that we will see it in the future. I want to ask ms. Gupta, could you talk to us about why you think there are relatively few prosecution . I know the answer as a state attorney general and portal former federal prosecutor but could you tell us about the difficulty of investigating and prosecuting these crimes and why its so important to have leaders at the local level like Chief Johnson on your side. Thank you for that question. It is absolutely vital to have leaders like Chief Johnson and i acp that have been working on, not only affected hate crime response, but also on rebuilding Police Community trust and communities all over the country this is as i said a vitally important thing. Nobody in Law Enforcement or at the Justice Department from my experience can do much about any hate crime if communities dont feel safe and reporting them. We know that not only we talked about the data problems and pointed to what we can do about local Police Departments reporting but the fact of the matter is individuals in these vulnerable communities need to feel safe and reporting and we know there is not. Its important for Law Enforcement to have trust with communitybased organizations in the local communities because often these organizations are the front lines for hearing about incidents of violence from victims who need are afraid to report and dont trust the government or trust the police. Being able to have that is vitally important. I think its why its incredibly important to have training in all parts of the country with Law Enforcement, with fbi, state , local Law Enforcement and communitybased organizations of the kind that we have been doing in prior years so that we can build trust so that communities and Law Enforcement are aware of how best what information is necessary to prosecute these cases. They are difficult cases and there are some high standards of proof that have been established in the courts. Therefore, having that flow of information is vitally important as you have probably read and perhaps seen from your own experience as. [inaudible] the fears that have been so widespread as a result of the administrations expanded apprehension policies relating to immigration the kind of panic in some cases that have caused women, victims of domestic violence, to decline to come forward simply because they fear a deportation. Im wondering whether that kind of fear also can deter members of other communities, immigrants who are here illegally who may be victim of a crime, from coming forward and participating in the criminal justice system. Center, thank you for raising it. I think it is a very real thing. It has always been real but its very real right now. It isnt just that people who are undocumented may be feeling fear, it affects people, all immigrants and people of color from feeling comfortable and in certain circumstances from trusting Law Enforcement. I think its most important not to silly for me but here it from the Police Chiefs around the country that very much understand how important it is that their ability to solve crime and to have the trust and victims not be impeded through politicized policymaking that will hurt their very core Public Safety mission and affect all Law Enforcement activity up and down the chain. I have talked with members of the Muslim Community, for example, in connecticut who told me often they know of victims including their children were bullied at school or others who are victims of harassment based on their ethnic or racial or religious status. They are very reluctant to come forward because they feel they may get immigration authorities and sometime without any real basis as you say the apprehension may be complete that theyre here and that there immigrants. Therefore there reluctant to come forward and i would encourage others that if you have answers to this question or comments or observation. I can tell you from the adl perspective that we certainly hear about this. We certainly hear about legal immigrants who are concerned with working with police. In their home towns, government resulted in imprisonment or worse. Its inhibited their desire to work with Law Enforcement or other authorities. Id also like to say is a grandson of a holocaust survivor who fled the whole quarters of nazi germany and went to bridgeport connecticut from where i was raised, your comments about our position on immigrants have a personal residence for me. Its incumbent upon all of us as public figures whether we hold elected office or whether were involved in organizations like all of us or simply prominent in our community but to speak up and stand up for the other. We were once strangers and we know what it means to be strangers thank you. Thank you for participating in a very worthwhile meeting weve had in a very worthwhile panel. Meeting adjourned [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]