It does escalate. I would say 2008 and when obama comes in they are off to the races because of the decisions came into play. Pledged to abolish guantanamo. So i also would like to say quickly this is not all about drowns. This idea picking off critical notes, dismantling the enemy war machine goes back a long way. It is never pursued were pursued in vietnam pursued in the 1st iraq war where they tried to kill saddam and field. This was seemingly made easier. As i said politics always politics. If you want a turning. , i would say 2008 anyone else . Im not sure how long i have been talking. Thank you for coming. I hope you like the book. [applause] [applause] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] and it is memorial day weekend on book tv. Three full days of nonfiction authors and books you can follow us on facebook facebook. Com book tv. Publishing news throughout the weekend. Book tv on this memorial day weekend. Three days of nonfiction books and authors. Let me say, journalists have an aversion to become the story. That certainly has been judy millers preference. A decade ago she ended up the subject of not one but two controversies, one involving the question of iraqs alleged pursuit of weapons of mass distraction and the other involving the disclosure of cia operatives here to discuss those experiences and much more call chronicled in her new memoir. The book covers the whole span for long, accomplished career before and immediately after the attacks, a pulitzer prize. During the runup to the iraq war she wrote a number of high profile articles that later turned out to be based on information. Many critics a former critic. The story her 5th book. Biological weapons the 1st gulf war in the holocaust. In the office. Lighthearted. Her story or stories raise important questions about the practice of journalism relationships between reporters and sources. Especially for classified or highly Sensitive Information is involved. It is certainly a lot to discuss this evening. Conversations with an old friend of mine. A Foreign Correspondent and editor during his 20 years with the washington post. Went on to lead and became senior fellow at brookings and served as Senior Advisor to europe. Please please join me in welcoming judy miller. [applause] is thank you for that introduction. I thought we would start out with some softball questions about how you got into journalism. The controversial aspects of your career. Behind every behind every journalists there is a series of mentors are inspirational people. The progressive publication out of madison. Larry stein was a close friend and editor. Back then i was a graduate student have decided that i was never going to be an economist because it was too boring. I hated the site. I felt journalism would be an interesting way to spend ones life. I started doing freelance stories when i was a graduate student. To the middle east for summer. I started out in israel and got hooked in the arabisraeli conflict. People forget we had together cyprus because there was no direct connection. Fully to cyprus went to egypt. This is 72. I was reading the papers. I tried to interview him. He found a storing it for me. Me. That became the beginning of a long friendship. Beirut and syria. I got into being a journalist. Woodward and bernstein were superheroes of the day. Early mentor of mine nothing if not skeptical. Just remember my he would say everyday just remember they are all lies. And the only thing you can depend on is what they put in the documents sometimes. Inspiration. When i got to the times i was hired because of affirmative action. The women of the New York Times had sued the paper for sexual discrimination. The case was rock solid. On and on. Three women out of 35 people all of a sudden people like me began to be hired. It is my good fortune to come along at the right time but i always wanted to go back to the middle east. Another mentor and inspiration we agreed on one thing the importance of journalism to keeping americans informed. Is something we share. Your 1st big foreign assignment, how did that change your perspective . The way to cover it as a journalist. I had discovered when i was a student the story often times was the major story that everyone was writing about. It was about this group in israel, the 1st group to form illegal settlements. I think settlements. I think i wrote one of the 1st early pieces for the progressives before i joined the times about the importance of people who felt that the land is more important than the rule of law. Then when i got to egypt fulltime the 1st big story was not in egypt that david in 1983. The marine compound was blown up. Rather than an area that have been a bomb site. It was utter chaos. I phoned to israel because lebanon was closed. I persuaded the lebanese friend to take me with him. I got there at dawn as they were digging out american bodies from the rubble. That was the 1st time i understood her up against. We all heard the story of the shiite driver yellow mercedes who smiled as he drove through the compound command we did not understand what that was about. It would be a long time before we understood what jihad is believed about the afterlife and how important it was to do something memorable an important. That is where my interest in islamic militancy began. That directed the rest of my reporting the next 20 years. If i recall correctly the suicide bomber was guided from tehran. Absolutely. That was early days of hezbollah. It was just being formed. A lot of misinformation and a lot of us have stories that turned out to be partly to not true. It was hard to figure out what was going on. I knew that day that this was not going to stop. Lo and behold two months later over standing in another pile of rubble of the American Embassy in kuwait. Fortunately no one was killed because the area that was bombed was a a place where people that stopped working. We were hugely lucky that more people were not killed. I began to see it again and again and again in different groups that we tended to flock together. I knew they were all different and were motivated by some of the same things. All politics are local. I had to go to each country to figure out what motivated that particular group. In your reporting you found the causes were different for suicidal maniacal islamic jihadists . The goal is the same to establish the caliphate or restoration of islamic rule. The methods, grievances, the mo was different everywhere. People always said that israel was an important factor. Factor. Well it was if you were on the west bank or gaza were in a refugee camp but if i went to morocco or algeria algeria they really didnt care about israel. It just was not a factor. So i began to be wary about broad generalizations. That led to my book god has 99 names. There are actually 100, but one is known only to god. Once again it was the broad generalization that frightened me. There was one thing the critics and people who worried about it got right do not think this will stay in the middle east. They were right about that. It mustve been particularly must have been particularly difficult as a woman reporter a western woman reporter covering the middle east. Were there hidden advantages . There were many. Not many. Not only did i get my job through affirmative action but those days you are at risk. Women were not kidnapped or killed. That was islamic chivalry. They did not do to us but they did to some of you. Is also what i call the saudi us syndrome where you would go to saudi arabia where women could not drive, had to sit in the back of the bus. I did that. It is not fun. You cant really work with men. We all know the conditions of that i that i was an honorary man for the time i was there. The saudi trained american trained saudi officials would bend over backwards to show how enlightened in question they were. I have extraordinary access. The gender thing plays both ways. Its its always a generalization that tends to be wrong. What interested you weapons of mass distraction . You wrote about germs, biological warfare. The happy subjects. You seem to be drawn to grisly ways of dying. Its crazy. I have been blessed. My life was lacking. Ahead of wealthy talented father and brother who was a great musician and comfortable that i grew up part of the time in las vegas. I did not realize until i was sent back to the cable for using the nevada test for. I did not realize that i have action dont know during a testing. Seeing one of the tests. No space was only 60 miles away from where did most of the above ground testing. The bomb very much being a part of my childhood. I write about this pictures it is an absolutely horrific thing. The atomic testing is so and feel the rumble of the love they recreated the. All of a sudden it came back to me. Nevermind the fact that are systematically lied to the radiation. As part of the reason i want to write this. Its almost. And some of my early pieces were skeptical. The neutron bomb. Did you connect it to your interest in the middle east suicidal religious fanatics. That is. To me. In 1991 dollars and chosen to be part of the team is continuing prominent saudis war broke out. They they close their airspace and i was trapped their for three months. The m children and wives to mecca. I finally had a chance to talk to him and going with the vulnerable. They knew the picture of saddam want. And being told about this mad saudi named Osama Bin Laden from a wealthy family only around showing how we did not need the infidels. We can fight this war ourselves. I encountered him the reputation again in afghanistan when i went in as a guest to see what life was like. And that would have been went . 1991 and i went to tell afghanistan before 2001. And it was enough to stand with the mujahedin had been trained. By him. By American Special forces. I dont know if we trained his group. Remember having an argument with a friend superb diplomat had been given a tour is. These are my kind of holy warriors. I remember saying, im nervous about the notion of any holy warrior because they tend to forget that all virtue and wisdom is not on this. I knew how this translates. And that should times they do a series. We did the 1st piece in 1997. Osama bin laden becoming more than a financier. The whole phenomenon was impressive. A wonderful. The present saddam there was a time when he was considered a friend. We covering in those days . Donald rumsfeld went to baghdad to see how. It is touted as a socialist secular bulwark so what do you think . 1976 is saddam was there tell us about that. And for helping to get the iraqi official government documents. It is exquisite records everything. They were proud of their Campaign Documents is it in detail. As to how many pills there were. It was just terrific. A frontpage cover story peter got me access to working together to translate these documents. Seeing pictures. Remember seeing pictures of this woman had been taken out of the grave was frozen for the sky you fail. Resolution after resolution after resolution. Saddam always thought he could buy the west. By and large he was right. I i want to open it up to questions in the audience. Try to two or three. We can start. Please ask a question right here. I actually came expecting to hear more of your problems to see pressures you fill in your child to report his sister. His is just something you talk about. The proper operation and governing there has to be some higher level of openness i was going on his face to make good decisions dont see whats going on. Anytime and governing person dealing with governing matters that should be accessible and it is not. Touched on big challenges veteran to deceive is public officials. One of the reasons i wrote this book is wanted to look at something so many people still. We know from exhaustive reports on bipartisan and pretty nonpartisan you exhaustive examination it was worse than all my everything intelligence agencies. Billions per year got it wrong for understandable reasons the same reasons we journalists going on. This area understanding Foreign Countries other programs as orange is the hardest things to do as you have reallife human beings often times. The source and methods hides what is going on. The symbol this information and combine it with satellites able to collect. The programs. And it is so hard to do they get it wrong so often. What have you there was pressure on these analysts not the kind you think no one is telling them that saddam had these for the last time they underestimated the threat. He turned out to be closer said. They were not going to underestimate the threat again. No these i had done with since i 1st started writing. Write about the lands program. The right about biological and chemical and ultimately for the soviet union and the fact that the cia pretty much mr. Program 60,000 people and dozens of institutions through of russia the soviet union at that time. They had not understood the depth and breadth of the program. This is really bad so much depends on you. I you going to underestimate are told the president you need to worry. And because these people had been so right for so long and often times some of the few people who said, you know that bin laden guy i think is a real problem and they were left to believe. It was us. So hard to figure out. Have confidence. Next question. They are lining up. Picture. A question about independence of journalists. How does it turns avoid acquiring a partisan bias . I guess the reason im asking is it seems timely. Is the notion of independence obsolete or naive . And it seems it seems to me it is a bigger problem over time. That is if you are village assumed to be sort of biased, he gently so in one direction as they may be a tendency to accelerate. Is it an obsolete assumption . It is getting to be. American press is more like the european press. Pick up his paper. You know you are reading the left of publication. You pick up this country. You think your getting stuff from the left. Correctly in my view. I am one of the token nets. A broad diversity of opinion i new line skip to question. The standard of objectivity of course we all have biases and prejudices and beliefs but the New York Times model of journalism the journalism was taught in our schools is try to compensate and major artifact. Because of thats what im upset. We have three reports so there is no evidence of pressure no evidence that anyone deliberately lied. Why americans want to believe they were deliberately lied to is a separate question. The. You raise about journalism that is very much in flux. I dont see americans as being better informed today despite the fancy knew technology. Okay. I think im too short. The microphone is to talk i dont have a question. I have a debate issue. I was at the center. I dont know what to do. Does that work in fact there was enormous pressure. I was on 60 minutes. There was enormous pressure. To do what . Confirm the weapons of mass distraction. I was the person leading the know there is. I have two and a half feet of paper proof. Im not going to let you get away with the intelligence agencies were wrong. It was politicized. [applause] they figured out how to validate things. They went to oak ridge. I will stand up. Identify yourself. Margaret hemlock. There was and is pressure. They want to. There was a lot of pressure. Resume to read the commission report. The unclassified one is correct. We all heard the session. The question asked in his book you would not talk to me from my book. Many claim to have been doubters. I did not know about you. People identified to either not talk or would not confirm in his book called leadership he said he gets furious as people doubted the intelligence that he was given. He asked the question of where were these people are going to want . Where were these people then that is his account. Sorry. An awful. Right. Larry wilkerson. [inaudible question] [inaudible question] and other countries as well there were debates striking to me. Was intelligence and Israeli Intelligence as german intelligence. And i want to go to work there were not deeply divided with the disagreed they disagreed about was whether or not that was sufficient cause to go to war and people of goodwill could disagree about the 2nd part. Theres a lot of rewriting in history were the papers out a good article americans already knew that the tubes there was an intense debate. They knew that the New York Times. Five days after michael and i wrote the story about a tubes but the debate that story and put it in the New York Times. I i would like to have been on the front page but it wasnt. I think its i no you are involved in the debate at the time you feel strongly that all people like me have to go on to get at that moment and subsequently the findings of these different panels getting it wrong is just as bad. The famous case involving curveball. Fifty not accurate. People have different memories. And analysts he was not an analyst. Maam. Man. I think it was important. Something about the classified part. Youve written about the classified information. There was only an unclassified report. I did not report on mobile biological labs until we actually the group in which i was embedded came across which turned out to be for rockets. But they were convinced is doing measurements of the work is that these lands were for biological production. We wrote the 1st story about that in the cia issued a white paper. Then i went back in june to talk to people. Still in britain david kelly the british biological analysts who told me what people told me the cia has a david have the weapons hunt and said this is biological as sure as im sending you got it wrong. He did not lie. He got it. We ended the 3rd article. These labs actually appear to be for whether balloons. The stuff what talk about mistakes that were made. It is important to look at the mistakes so you can understand how to make them again. When you stop doing that. Going back and asking questions that you fall into convenient patterns of thought that ideological preference is something you want to believe, and it is important hearing on for all of us to get out of your comfort zone. That is provided in this book. I went back and talk to some of the people who would not talk to me who were presumably doubters. One of them is in this and try and go back and look at the story. Are you with your Service Years from someone else will go back and take a different look at it and have a greater understanding. The only thing we can agree on is that the war whether or not it was justified was an absolute disaster for this country and what we are sold with. Okay. We only have a few minutes left. Three more questions. Will come back to judy. I just wanted to shift the controversy. Explain what you did there. A related question. Acai what i didnt do. I never wrote about valerie. I dont believe my job as a journalist is to help agents. Other people can do that. I didnt think it was my job i thought i was told that pretty early on but i was so consumed about how we got this wrong. Ive been out there covering the research day after day hundreds of places they visit coming up dry. The deck of everything. They had everything with potential. I came back with a list of questions. That is what i was focused on. In in the course of my questions i came across a reference. Tell you how it happened. Her husband had written a story and oped page article saying basically that is what they five people died began in earnest here gone and looked at the intelligence. That was the piece. So i began investigating whether or not that was true i thought i thought i had learned about it when i was talking to skip the. It was only years later that i discovered my testimony had been on because i have misinterpreted the very brief notes and references that i had in my notebook. I felt horrible. I had testified against Scooter Libby. But when i began researching memory i learned that what i had done is one of the most common errors and part of the defense that he was never permitted to offer. Almost every witness who testified against him you can see differences between with these people told the grand jury the fbi, what they want of testifying to. I am open to my views on this. Once it was determined by the cia there was damage to her at that the National Security to any source at home or abroad that investigation should have ended. Because there was a special prosecutor did not. It consumed a huge amount is print more than that government time. Because i subsequently learned that Scooter Libby early as one of the few people saying this war is going south we will lose it no space shift strategy and adopt the surge
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