Stolen. He amplified these lies at every turn, seeking to convince supporters that they were victims of a massive electoral conspiracy that threatened the nations continued existence, but every single court to consider the president s attacks on the outcome of the election rejected them and state and federal officials from both parties refuse President Trumps increasingly desperate demands that they break the law to keep him in power. With his options running out, trump announced a save america rally. It was an january 6th. He promised it would be, quote, wild. Each of those facts cited by House Democrats is indisputably true. Goes on to draw on Donald Trumps exact words at the january 6th rally. Words we can just play for you because trump said them publicly in front of cameras. We won this election and we won it by a landslide. Were going to have somebody in there that should not be in there and our country will be destroyed and were not going to stand for that. Were going to walk down to the capitol and were going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women and were probably not going to be cheering so much some of them because youll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength and you have to be strong. And if you dont fight like hell, youre not going to have a country anymore. Were going to try to give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country, so lets walk down pennsylvania avenue. I want to thank you all, god bless you, and god bless america. And we all know what happened next. Donald trump and his attorneys filed their response to the Impeachment Charge against trump. Their argument centers mainly on process points. Claiming that its unconstitutional to impeach a president once hes out of office. Well work to debunk that in a moment but first, their arguments on substance, especially the words uttered publicly by their client are interesting too. What appears to be the very best they could come up with. Quote. It is denied that the phrase if you dont fight like hell, youre not going to have a country anymore had anything to do with the action at the capitol. As it was clearly about the need to fight for election security, what . Thats not how the insurrectionists took trumps words all all. Watch. Were going to walk down to the capitol. Were going to walk down to the capitol. Capitol building. Take the capitol. Take the capitol take the capitol. Take the capitol right now. And this complicates the defense lawyers case too. So we all know now that donald trump went home and watched the insurrection unfold on live tv for hours and hours and hours. Didnt even take calls. And he never rushed to twitter to clarify, whoa, whoa, wait, my supporters misunderstood me. He never addressed the American People as president until much, much later. Until much of the damage was already done hours after the capitol was breached and even then, he told the insurrectionists he quote, loved them. The case against donald trump with some of our favorite friends. Dan goldman, lead counsel during the democrats first impeachment as well as former assistant u. S. Attorney for the Southern District of new york. Now lucky for us an msnbc impeachment analyst. You need one nowadays. Cofounder and then elizabeth newman, Threat Prevention at the department of Homeland Security now director of the republican Accountability Project is also here. Dan goldman, let me ask you about the case made by the house Impeachment Managers first and then well get to what seems like some silliness on the president s legal team. Start with the case laid out by the Impeachment Managers today. I thought they did an excellent job of putting everything that weve been talking about in bits and pieces throughout the last couple of weeks into a very impactful and persuasive brief. Ultimately, its not just about january 6th. That was the culmination of a months long effort to overthrow the election and in the end, january 6th was the final fuse that lit the bomb so to speak but donald trump had been planning for this rally for a long time. His supporters had been eyeing it. Hotels in washington, dc closed down well in advance because they understood that violent protesters were going to come to washington, dc for no good reason and the house, i think, did a very good job of linking all of this together. Linking the ravnsberger call and saying it was going to be wild with the statements he and others made on january 6th and as you rightly point out, nicole, his inaction after the rioting began, i think, is the most telling evidence as to what his State Of Mind was and what his expectation was for his words that day. Dan goldman, i dont want to spend a ton of time on the defense because i think in a real court of law, im not sure they mount statements like this because theyre demonstrably false but let me read some of them. It is denied that President Trump intended to interfere with the counting of electoral votes. So the problem is their client blows that one up. Let me show you some of donald trump on january 6th talking about exactly what he wants mike pence to do on the day that they were counting the electoral votes, which his lawyers say he didnt intend to interfere with. Watch. I hope mike is going to do the right thing. I hope so. I hope so. Because if mike pence does the right thing, we win the election. I mean, what he wants pence to do and he said it in georgia what he wants pence to do is exactly what the lawyers deny that he wanted pence to interfere with the counting of the electoral votes and the insurrectionists stormed into the mob Chanting Hang mike pence because by the time they breached the capitol, he hadnt done what trump directed him to do. I hope mike pence does the right thing. Is there any consequence for the lawyers lying, dan goldman . No. Theres no judge to rule them in contempt, theres no judge to prohibit any of these arguments. If we were in a court of law, their argument about the unconstitutionality of this trial and their argument about somehow Donald Trumps speech being protected by the First Amendment would both not be permitted to be used against a jury but of course, nicole, we are not in a court of law. We are in the Senate Chamber and anything goes. And they are looking for anything that 37 republicans or 34 republican senators can glob on to to avoid actually addressing the conduct and ill give you my favorite example of what their defense is. And i think last night on television, one of trumps lawyers said, oh no. Hes not guilty of inciting the insurrection because the insurrection had already been planned before his speech. It is absolutely amazing that that article, in effect what hes saying is, no, Donald Trumps conduct was even worse than we expected but it wasnt a technical term of the article of impeachment. What hes saying is that donald trump has actually conspired with the protesters to interfere with the capitol but thats not what hes charged with, only charged with inciting them. Its unbelievable. Steve schmidt, i think that one of the mistakes the media covering the first impeachment made was to constantly push it through a political filter and through that political filter, the republican senators, jurists were fact immune and they so much as admitted it after the fact. I think this time, this impeachment is really not about politics. Trumps out. Hes basically deplatformed, but there is a Homeland Security crisis that in some ways he brought in to full view by revealing what the New York Times started reporting on pretty aggressively, ties between republicans, sitting republican members of congress and domestic terrorists and white militia groups. Im wondering if you think these republicans seem to do, through their inaction, what donald trump did in his debate with joe biden. Basically telling the militias and domestic terrorists to stand back and stand by, were not going to touch trump. If that happens, if there is no accountability imposed for the inciters along with the incited who committed acts of violence, who, for the first time in American History since 1797, bloodied the peaceful transfer of power, thats what they did. The capitol fell to those men and women. They tore down the american flag, raised the maga flag. If theres not accountability, this will happen again and there will be Political Violence in this country. This was a crowd that was filled with White Supremacists, with white nationalists, extremists, militias, neonazis, proud boy fascists, and this group thats being arrested all over the country was incited. They were incited by trump. They were incited by hawley, cruz, the big lie that the election was stolen and during the months where that lie was propagated as it spread around the country by donald trump, by fox news and news max and oan, the consequence of that was the poisoning of democracy and the attack. The attack where the capitol of the United States fell for a period of hours to violent insurrectionists who tore down our flag and raised the maga flag. You know, steve, it seems like this vote isnt even about staying in the good favor of the trump base. This is about whether or not you want trump to take over and lead the party again in four years because the notion that that isnt the clear intention, thats what this vote seems to be about and i think if youve got Mitch Mcconnell speaking out now about the qanon character in the house and youve got liz cheney under, i think, a pushback that may not have been anticipated that i think people thought she was safe as a House Republican could be. Shes now got matt gates and all the trumpists in her district attacking her. What do you think this vote is about about whether to convict donald trump . Its about whether theyll be faithful to their Oath Of Office and theyll be faithful to their oath as jurors. If they will consider the facts or theyve decided to nullify the evidence by placing their loyalty to a man, trump, above their oath. And most of them have done that and have continued to do that for some time now, but thats fundamentally what this is about. You know, look in the end, liz cheney is the leader of the democracy caucus, a minority of House Republicans. Kevin mccarthy is the leader of the autocracy caucus. Matt gates said that donald trump is the forever leader of the Republican Party and declared him the leader of the America First movement which likely last movement is a fascistic movement. Donald trump is of course in control of the Republican Party. The Qanon Movement is in control of multiple republican state parties. The walls have been breached. Mitch mcconnell tried to ride the tiger for a very long time. He thought that he could maneuver his way through this. But the insanity that has let loose that did not face any resistance has now consumed Republican Party. Thats what this vote means. You know, elizabeth, as sort of the student of extremism and counterextremism, ive been so drawn to your analysis of what extremists here in our politics and with all the reporting about ongoing threat, the federal Law Enforcement, the dhs issued a bulletin extending through april 31st warning of an ongoing threat from domestic violent terrorists associated with the insurrection of the capitol. What would the acquittal over the incitement of the insurrection, how would that be read by the extremists themselves, elizabeth . Its likely to further embolden them, that there is at least a willingness on the right for them to continue to associate politically and just be encouraged by rightwing movement or figure heads. Put another way, if he is impeached and they actually convicted him, the impact that that has is for the, i think its an estimated 57 Million People that still believe that the election was stolen, 57 million of his voters, if you convict, then theres this opportunity to educate and inform the 57 million that in fact, he lied to you. The election was not stolen but that has to come from voices that they were listening to. It is sadly not this show or my voice, its not steves voice. It has to come from the people that voted for trump, in large part, the Elected Officials that represent in congress. If they would come out and say he lied to you. I lied to you. I am sorry for that, the election was not stolen. What that does is shrinking the 57 million down to a much more tangible or a number that Security Forces could actually handle because i think, and again, im not saying 57 million would radicalize to violence but some small percentage of them will be vulnerable to neonazis. Theyre actively recruiting them. Im reading online postings of neonazis and proud boys, theyre giving instructions with how to go about approaching a disheartened qanon adherent. Heres how you talk to them and encourage them to move away from the gop and into this fascist third way that they describe. That is a very frightening thing that when you have 57 million americans who are very angry that their government is not legitimate because it was, the election was stolen from them, they could be prey for these Extremist Groups. So if we do not debunk this lie through the impeachment process, we are likely to see increases in recruitment and increases to violence. If you insert doubt into that Information Cycle that the conservative infotainment, it wont reduce everything but violence in the next few months but maybe not as much. To hear well still have violence you fear in the next few months, i mean, what is your Threat Assessment of the chances or propensity for violence around the Impeachment Trial next week, elizabeth . Well, i think that the Law Enforcement notification, the bulletin, the fact that the capitol has this massive and i could be wrong and i hope im not. My bigger concern would be as we start seeing more gatherings, those are targets for extremists. Theyre looking for civil war and opportunities to accelerate the societal collapse and january 6th was a victory for them, a symbolic call to arms that now is the time we can actually do it and have this civil war overthrow the u. S. Government and establish our white nation. So the violence is still going to be there. We need to shrink the number of people that are associating with these. Dan goldman, what is your advice to the Impeachment Manager on how much to make what elizabeth is talking about and steve about the ongoing threat that the extremist elements inside the gop now present, how much do you think that should be an emphasis in terms of the damage done by trumps Big Lie In Incitement of the insurrection . Well, theres a combination of things. Adam shiff with why conviction was so important. It played out worse than he could have ever feared with what has been going on right now. But the idea of sending a message to the extremists, to donald trump, future Elected Officials and to the International Community that the United States will not accept this type of antidemocratic violent behavior and this runs counter to our fundamental values, so i do think that they will spend some time stressing the impact of the senators votes. It didnt work last time. Thank you both so much for starting us off. Elizabeth is sticking around. When we come back, we now know where Mitch Mcconnells line is. Mcconnell slamming the anon member of the house. Four years of aiding and abetting trumps overtaking of the gop, well ask one of his former colleagues with mcconnells stand is too little, too late. Bob corker who early on remarked publicly that trump lacked fitness for the office he held will be our guest and alexandria ocasiocortez known for her polished and precise terms in hearings and interviews gets very raw and very personal about the attack on the capitol and explains why she thought she was going to die. All those stories and more when Deadline White House continues after this. Dont go anywhere. No dad, its a video call. You got to move the phone in front of you like. Like its a mirror, dad. You know . Alright, okay. Hows that . Is that how you hold a mirror . 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