yes. what the democrats can do is what they ve been doing since trump took office and reconvene. they ve been trying to attack trump in different ways. the issue is with mueller not testifying, there is no actual proven fact that, perhaps, trump did that perhaps trump did, sorry, go against or collude with russians, then democrats have to wonder what their next strategy is going to be. this is not just about mueller, it s also about what are they going to do heading into 2020. right now speaker pelosi has said she s not interested in pursuing impeachment and democrats have a higher goal and that s retaking office. let s move, guys, to bill barr s investigation of the russia investigation. senate judiciary chairman lindsey graham who s discussing what he expects to be the results from all this. take a listen to him. in terms of the counterintelligence investigation, you re going to
speaker pelosi has said let the process play out. we have a legal case. it doesn t have to take forever. these are two big victories in a row. that gives her breathing room within the caucus. internally, her politics are good. trump has basically taken the position that he s going to take everything to the supreme court. he believes that it s his supreme court now. the interesting question is what happens when the supreme court rules against him? there is nothing in trump s character or record that shows he respects any ruling outside of his own feeling. so that will be if you re looking at it from nancy pelosi s point of view, even if one of the cases gets to the supreme court and he defies the supreme court then she s got her ace in the hole of saying now we have to impeach. if the supreme court rules against him. exactly right. it s if, not when at this
my own view is that there is a fear. there is a fear that trump will use impeachment to organize his base, to engender opposition. i think there are really two things to say to that. first, what s really at stake here is the constitution, and leader pelosi has said speaker pelosi has said before that the constitution is what should govern. it s very clear that there is a separation of powers and that congress should have oversight ability over the executive branch and essentially what trump is doing is trying to stop that. you have to think through what the issues are and most importantly democrats were elected on overseeing and offering a check to trump. if they re stymied by that, i think people will smell weakness and donald trump, himself, will smell weakness and become more emboldened. neera tanden gets the last word in our opening segment tonight. neera tanden, john heilemann,
speaker pelosi has said before that the constitution is what should govern. it s very clear that there is a separation of powers and that congress should have oversight ability over the executive branch and essentially what trump is doing is trying to stop that. you have to think through what the issues are and most importantly democrats were elected on overseeing and offering a check to trump. if they re stymied by that, i think people will smell weakness and donald trump, himself, will smell weakness and become more emboldened. neera tanden gets the last word in our opening segment tonight. neera tanden, john heilemann, thank you for joining us tonight. really appreciate it. when we come back, harvard law professor laurence tribe will join us on this night when we really need him as the impeachment war and the subpoena wars continue between president trump and the house of representatives. also, former housing urban development secretary julian castro will join us tonight to
republicans and only one republican in congress has talked about impeachment and it came in recent days. this is the argument that speaker pelosi has made. i want to check with our control room to see if we have the sound bite from jerry nadler about obstruction. it will be inest ther interesti your take on that. listen to jerry nadler talking where don mcgahn did not show up and why he thinks that is wrong. a lot of reaction coming from capitol hill. let me play that. there are reports that the president and lieutenants exerting other kind of pressure on mr. mcgahn. in short, the president took it upon himself to intimidate a witness who has a legal obligation to be here today. this conduct is not remotely acceptable. and, joyce, that was jerry nadler talking about the potential for intimidation as we discuss that relates to obstruction. how does the white house make the argument here? because as you ve described,