bouncing ideas around, we were just testing things out, and this was where we landed. absolutely. do you know what they were trying to test things out with, the vice president. let s listen to what he told me yesterday. what the president was convinced it seemed to me in december was that i had some right to reject or return electoral votes. i don t know what was in his heart. i don t know what his intentions were, but i do know that he and his lawyers asked me to do. what i want the american people to know is that president trump was wrong then and he s wrong now. that i had no right to jeefr turn the election. i had no right to reject or return votes. he suggested to me that he would be a witness, he said, you know, he would do his duty and john lauro on another network said that he thinks mike pence would be one of their best witnesses at a trial. clearly he s just speaking here suggesting that vice president mike pence would be their best witness at a trial, it would be e
frankly, i ve said before, i hope that it not come to this point. i don t know if the government can meet the burden of proof beyond reasonable doubt for criminal charges. but the american people deserve to know that president trump and his advisers didn t just ask me to pause. they asked me to reject votes, return votes. essentially overturn the election. i rejected that out of hand and i did my duty that day. martha: you say the criminal process is separate. put yourself on that jury for just a moment. if you were on the jury, would you say that this defendant, the former president had committed a crime that day? do you believe it rises to the level of a crime? you know, martha, i don t know. honestly, i don t know the full case that the government has. you know, i ve said on your