instead to broadly make the argument that an indictment, a federal indictment, another one of the former president they believed would cause more turmoil in the country. of course the idea of whether or not jack smith was receptive to that message, we don t know that, and we don t believe we don t have any reason to believe, i should say, that it changes the nature of this investigation and the direction of it. kay tlan, stand by. norm eyes zen with us as well. norm, what do you make of the arguments trump s legal team is now making to the special counsel, jack smith? do you think the counsel will buy it? wolf, i don t think he ll buy it. as you know, i practiced law for years, criminal defense law, with john lauro, who was in that meeting. i m sure he made a forceful presentation. he picked a novel approach, according to kaitlan s reporting, of talking about the effect this would have, not arguing the facts of the case. i suspect he articulated some of trump s defenses. we saw t