American studies and history professor Kathleen Sprows Cummings, who has led the Cushwa Center for the Study of American Catholicism for the past 11 yea.
familiarity with a lot of catholics. also joining me for our coverage, nbc s and thompson who spent 36 straight days in rome covering the resignation of pope benedict and the election of pope francis. former editor and chief of america magazine. a catholic journal and nbc news contributor father mao malone. director of the crucial center for study of american catholicism. and nbc news analyst kathleen cummings. great to have all of you here. and you and i were there. but i remember being here 30 rock island somebody sound to me as i am sitting on my desk, so, we just got a notification that the pope has resigned. and i said, where is that. pope s don t resign. that is not right. they woke me up out of a sound sleep to tell me that pope benedict had resigned. and i was in absolute shock because it was something that of all of the things you expect for a pope to do, resigning at the time was not one of them. and i think that is the thing
Benedict XVI had an "acute theological mind" but "an exceedingly poor grasp of the world in which he lived," according to the University of Southern California s Sheila Briggs.
history. certainly a unique moment but a tough moment. molly hunter, kathleen cummings, thank you very much turning now to the situation on the southern border where there is growing uncertainty following the supreme court s decision to keep title 42 in place for now. the controversial trump era policy makes it easier for the government to turn away people trying to enter the country. the supreme court will hear oral arguments in february, and will decide by june whether to lift the policy or keep it in place. joining me now, the deputy director of aclu s immigrants rights program and aclu s lead attorney on the title 42 challenge. talk a little bit about what this decision by the supreme court, what it means to temporarily keep this in place. yes, thanks for having me back. we re deeply disappointed with title 42, that it will remain in place. it will be real harm, as it has been for the past two and a half years. families without children, being