Cairo airport after appearing on the government stop list. They have beenfamilies and saye in a safe location. Greyson and dr. Loubani were arrested on august 16 after rushing to the scene of a mass shooting by state forces of supporters of ousted president mohamed morsi. They staged a threeweek Hunger Strike while being kept in a crowded and cockroach infested cell. Dozens of people were killed in iraq over the weekend as part of the countrys worst spate of violence since 2008. An attack on a Shiite School in Northern Iraq on sunday killed 13 children and left 80 people winded. On saturday, at least 48 people were killed when a suicide bomber attacked a group of shiite pilgrims. International weapons inspectors have begun destroying syrias chemical weapons stockpile. It is the first up under the u. N. Resolution to follow the august 21 attack in ghouta and threats of u. S. Military strike. The alassad regime faces a deadline of mid2014 to abandon its full chemical arsenals. Today in indonesia, secretary of state john kerry welcome the initial progress. I think it is also a credit to the assad regime for complying rapidly, as they are supposed to. We hope that will continue. I am not going to vouch today for what happens months down the road, but it is a good beginning and we should welcome a good beginning. The u. S. And russia said he hoped to convene an International Peace conference on syria and about a month. Republican leaders are refusing to back out in their campaign against obama cares the partial fedel Government Shutdown enters its seventh day. Sunday, House Speaker john boehner rejected calls to allow a vote on the government funding bill without tying it to im doing president obamas health care law. The white house has argued a so called clean measure would have enough votes from democrats and moderate republicans that john boehner would allow it to reach the floor. On sunday, the house approved a measure to pay the nations 800 thousand furloughed federal workers retroactively, but only when the government reopens. A rally on the was capital, a group of furloughed workers of their struggling to provide for their families. This is devastating to both of us. We have a fouryear old son. We had it taken out of daycare immediately because we knew it would be an expense we could not meet this month. They should give us their paychecks. They should reserve the right to give a paycheck to not get a paycheck and not be able to provide for their families, to not be able to put gas in your car or food on your table. John boehner and the republicans are also seeking cuts to programs, including medicare and Social Security the upcoming debate over raising the debt ceiling. The u. S. Faces in october 17 deadline to raise the debt limit or fail to pay off its debts. Sunday, treasury secretary jack lew said the shutdown is already causing major damage to the economy. Every day the Government Shutdown, that it does roll harm to the american people. I think we have to take a step back and look at the country as an economy. America has been fighting their way back from a recession. They dont need politics in washington to bring the economy down. The New York Times reports republicans and rightwing groups have been planning on a Government Shutdown as part of a strategy to undo obama care since president obama was reelected. A group of republicans gathered at an undisclosed location earlier this year and washington, d. C. And devised what they called a blueprint to defunding obamacare. The group linked to the koch brothers, gave more than 200 million to antiobama care efforts last year. Vigils were held around the world saturday to urge the release of 28 environmentalists and two journalists facing a receipt charges in russia. The art the dirty word attained in a direct action the arctic 30 were detained. The netherlands has filed against russia in order to get their release. For more, go to democracynow. Org. Rallies were held across the United States saturday in a call for renewed congressional action on immigration. Demonstrators in phoenix, miami, los angeles and other cities came together and what organizers dubbed the national. Ay for dignity and respect Immigration Reform has stalled in the house since the Senate Approved a landmark measure in june. In new york city, hundreds marched over the brooklyn bridge. Country. Part of this i pay taxes, go to school, drive, get a job like everyone else. If this is an passed, i probably wont be able to go to college. I want to continue my education so i can one day become a doctor and get back to society. The former vietnamese military general has died at the age of 102. He was the mastermind behind the vietnamese military resistance against france and later the u. S. House and the people gathered today and an ally to honor his life. A state funeral is expected next weekend. Angola 3 member Herman Wallace has died at the age of 71. He died friday morning at 5 30 time just three days after being released from a louisiana prison. Inspent one and 42 years solitary confinement. He was suffering from terminal liver cancer. He and two others known as the angola 3 were placed in solitary following the murder of her prison guard. The angola 3 under supporters say they were framed for their political activism as members of one of the first prison chapters of the black panther party. Wallace was freed to the home of a supporter last week after a judge overturned his 1974 conviction. Prosecutors moved to quickly reindicted him, even though he only had days to live. Free man. E died a in a statement, wallaces attorneys said and those are some of the headlines. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We apologize for the inconvenience. The marketplace is currently undergoing regularly scheduled maintenance and will be back up monday, 10 seven 3013. Seven, 30ht, october 13. That is what many faced when they attempted to log onto the marketplace. The new york sun has taken down the notice, but widespread computer problems have plagued problems across the nation since the state and federal marketplaces launch last tuesday. Receivedhcare. Gov also a warning site saying it is unclear how many people have actually been able to sign up so far anywhere in the country. Administration has not released any figures. According to forbes, the number of people may be in the Single Digits when they looked, for example, california. On tuesday, president obama promised quick fixes to the problems. We found out there had been times where the site has been running more slowly than it probably will. More than is because one Million People visited healthcare. Gov before 7 00 in the morning. To put that in context, there were five times more users in the marketplace this morning than have ever been on medicare. Gov at one time. Of howves you a sense important this is to millions of americans around the country. And that is a good thing. And we are going to be speeding things up in the next few hours to handle this demand that exceeds anything that we expected. That was president obama speaking on tuesday. Many of the issues remain unresolved. For more were joined by audio stream by bill kurtis, Senior Vice President and chief scientist and cast, Software Quality Analysis Firm and also director of the consortium for i. T. Software quality. Bill curtis, welcome to democracy now president obama has said this is a sign of success of obamacare because so many people have pounded the websites that they did not expect this level of response. But why . They have been talking about this level of response for a long time. What do you see as the problems in this last week . Many websites, federal and state, have basically not work for seven days. Right. I think there are at least three problems. Number one, under complex lawsuit leads to complex software to try to implement this. Youre trying to implement systems and the government, state government, Insurance Companies, several federal agencies that alone is very complex. All the data you have to coordinate is very complex, specially they didnt represent the same way and are trying to get all that coordinated. I probably underestimated the hangups they would have on the website. So that is a problem. It really has the hallmark of a project that was rushed. We see this constantly in the i. T. World. If you give people a day and they cant meet it, they rush and make mistakes and dont have time to fix them all. In addition, it appears people have been able to look at the site and see a lot of it is inefficient. When you have this kind of response, any kind of inefficiency in the software itself is going to be highlighted. It will cause slowdowns. Apparently, that is what has happened. That have complex code isnt necessarily efficient as it should be rushed out with very complex logic. The law itself is a complex piece of logic and you try to translate that into a piece of software, which is for complex piece of logic, you try to do it in a rush and you get the kind of situation we have had. You have not only the websites on the federal website they have the dropdown menu and that doesnt work at all. Is. Ain what that go ahead. Go ahead. Standardmenus are techniques, but apparently, some of the areas which were supposed to enter information did not receive it, did not accepted, which tells us there are problems inside the software itself. Again, they were in a russian probably not able to do a thorough job of testing so some aspects of the interface dont work. But are their basic procedures . Wasnt it astounding that october 1 was the first day you could go, the day you could sign up, isnt there something called a soft launch where you could have people looking at it in the days before but not able, perhaps, to actually sign up so that more people could be testing it or you test it the federal government website is in a score of states. You tested in a smaller area before all of the states . Use early have a lot of options for rolling this thing out that dont require everybody be online day one. You could do it to some states, smaller states, just a lower portion of the people, and not everyone, maybe between letters ac. You can allow part of the functionality to be available. There are many ways it could have been rolled out serially having to prepare some of the functionality and not have as much stress on the system as we saw. They tried to go full day one and probably didnt have an adequate time to tested. Certainly, did not appear to beta test it. That leads to a lot of the problems we have seen, inadequate time to work through the details and sort of know orkup plan no backup plan role of sound and pieces so we could see how it works and solve the problems before we launch it to the entire country. I want to go back to president obama on tuesday. A couple of weeks ago, apple rolled out a new mobile operating system. Within days, they found a glitch so they fixed it. I dont remember anybody suggesting apple should stop selling iphones are i paths. Or threatening to shut down the company if they didnt. That is not how we do things in america. We dont root for failure. We get to work, make things happen, make them better. We keep going. About aere not talking few glitches on a few days. In new york, for example, its not clear whether one person has been able to sign up. In this is 7 days out. Maybe one person has been able to sign up, but the state has a release that information. Bill curtis . A workingtill had product. We dont have a working product yet and the Affordable Health care market. That is a huge difference. Apple had a glitch. Most all large Information Systems do. But if they were, you can get some things done. You could use your iphone. They can fix that glitch. This was a whole different situation. It was a much larger problem than underestimating capacity was software there probably wasnt efficient as it should be , which was even more exposed by the amount of capacity on day one. This is a very different situation than apple having a glitch in the iphone. It makes you think about the companies they got the tremendous contracts, tens of millions of dollars, for the state and federal government to make these, whether in fact, they were chosen for their ability to do this or whether it was politics. There are all kinds of issues. The federal government has been working with the Acquisition Policy for decades. This is not the first time weve had a major system outsourced into various contractors and then had a problem when it went live. This is fairly consistent a fairly consistent problem. We saw with the old irs system, traffic control, a number of areas where we had systems rollout that did not work the way they were supposed to and had to be replenished or reworked. This is a real problem in federal i. T. System acquisitions. There have been some laws passed. They still struggle. We need as qualified collection managers as we can in the federal government to manage projects of the size. Really, theyre not understanding all of the resources they need, all of the problems theyre going to run into, and how to better manage a collection of contractors trying to integrate all these different systems. Provide a time in a kind of makes you wonder if some of the hackers of the a bid to obama administration, if they were brought together to look at the state and federal websites, if they could solve this quickly. That is speculation. Hackers are good at breaking into certain things, but building a large complex Information System like the Affordable Health care act is not something that can be done by hackers. They really take some pretty solid project management, long term planning and organization, and coordination with an awful lot of people. It is not basic hacking. I was actually using that team loosely term loosely. At the very creative people who are being targeted right now, if they were involved in building these websites, not just hacking. Exactly. But bill curtis i want to i think there is a missed misconception. All i have to have a really bright people and i could make this work. It is much more complex than that. You have to have a strong management and planning, not just the right people. You need bright people, but you need more. You forcurtis, thank being with us, Senior Vice President and chief scientist at cast, a Software Quality Analysis Firm. He is also the director of the consortium for i. T. Software quality in texas. A discussion about obamacare, is a road to singlepayer . Stay with us. [music break] this is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We turn to discussion on whether Affordable Care act or obamacare goes far enough in addressing the Nations Health crisis. The New York Times recently reported the law will leave out two thirds of the nations poor blacks and single mothers and more than half the nations low wage workers who dont have insurance because they live in 26 states controlled by republicans that have rejected the vast expansion of medicaid will stop where joined by dr. Steffie woolhandler who is a professor of Public Health at cunyhunter college. And were joined from boston by John Mcdonough, director at the new center for public leadership. Between 2008 in 2010, he served as a Senior Adviser on National Health reform to the u. S. Senate committee on health, education, labor and pensions. The between 2003 and 2008, he served as executive director of health care for all in massachusetts. He recently wrote a book called, inside National Health reform. We welcome you both back to democracy now lets start in boston with John Mcdonough. Your thoughts on this sevenday rollout where most of the websites have not work . And it ispredicted disappointing and we hope they will get it fixed up as quickly as possible. In 2006l what happened with the rollout of the Medicare Prescription Drug program which was plagued for many months with significant technical problems, and his problems were dealt with and addressed and hardly anybody remembers them right now. What they remember is the program is working pretty well for the tens of millions of americans who are in it. Steffie woolhandler dr. Steffie woolhandler, your thoughts on this program that started october 1 . The completer glitches will get sorted out, but the complexity that cause the computer glitches is baked into a obamacare. The exchanges have to deal with millions of enrollees and doing income verification. They have to deal with thousands of private insurance plans. It is a very complex system. Unfortunately, that complexity also contributes to high expense. The private entrance that is offering the coverage to the plans had overhead costs that are about four times as high as traditional medicare. Havedition, we are going overhead about 4 added attitude insurance overhead just for the exchanges. It is a complex system, a very expensive system, and when we see the way it is performing, we understand why we need a simple singlepayer system that could save about 400 billion dollars on a minister at a simplification. For people who dont have insurance or want to get cheaper insurance, do encourage them to go to the websites to sign up on these new exchanges . Need toutely people take a look, but they also need to know many of the new plans have high copayments, high deductibles, they can have very restricted networks. For some people, this will be a great deal of your income is in the low range and you get a subsidy. If you are middle income, i think youre going to find your paying an awful lot of money for very skimpy coverage through the exchanges. Your response, John Mcdonough . Well, yes, the law and the system around the law are complicated and our Underlying Health care system is incredibly complicated, far more than it needs to be. I dont really have a disagreement with my friend and colleague Steffie Woolhandler about division of what we would like to see. The reality is, this was probably the best we could have 2009, 2010, getting anything close to this would be politically impossible today. I hope this is a movement in the direction toward a more rational and less complex system, but it is an important start in an important step forward for potentially tens of millions of americans. A lot of them will get coverage that will be very affordable and at almost no cost. Is this a road to single payer, dr. Steffie woolhandler . Only if we find. A player only if we fight for singlepayer. Singlepayer is often known as expanded and improved medicare for all, also known as Nonprofit Health insurance. It means you get a car the day youre born and you keep your entire life. It would entitle you to medical care without copayments, without deductibles and because it is such a simple system like Social Security, there would be very low administrative expenses. We would save about 400 billion, which would allow us to afford the system. I want to remind you when medicare was rolled out in 1966, it was rolled out in six months using index cards. If you have a simple system, you dont need all this expense and complexity. What you mean, index cards . They didnt have computers in 1966, so they expanded they went from zero to over 20 Million People enrolled in medicare in six months. Because it was a simple system based on the Social Security records, it was a taxbased system, you did not have hundreds of people programming the state of oregon, thousands of different plans, tons of different copayments, deductibles and restrictions. One singlepayer plan. What we need for all americans to give the americans really the choice they want, it is not the choice between Insurance Company a or Insurance Company be. They want the choice of any doctor or hospital like you get with traditional medicare. Senatorand democratic has failed obamacare is a victory for women. Millions of people dont have a doctor, dont have access to a doctor, but they have hope beinge the health care is implemented. We speak for the 150 million women in the United States of america who now have health care because obamacare has been implemented. Being a woman in the United States of america is no longer considered a craigslist in condition considered a pre existing condition by the Insurance Company. We have been denied health care because of pregnancy, because of domestic violence, and because of other things. That was the democratic senator from maryland. That there isat some guaranteed issues, meaning the Insurance Companies have to give you coverage if you apply. But much of the coverage is going to be extremely skimpy and not particularly affordable. There will be 31 million americans left out of obamacare and about 5 million of those 31 million uninsured will be uninsured because of the red state governors opting out of medicaid. The 25 million of those uninsured are uninsured by the very design of obamacare. They were never included in the original estimations of the bill because you have to take money out of your pocket to buy insurance. If you get up into the middle incomes, the insurance is extremely expensive and many people wont be buying it. About one third of those people will be undocumented immigrants, but two thirds will be u. S. Citizens, mostly working poor, who still cannot afford Health Insurance under obamacare. John mcdonough, your response to that and how you see this transitioning . Do you ultimately see expanded medicare for everyone as the answer in this country . Two very big questions. Million, when medicaid was started in 1965, it was voluntary for states to get in. It wasnt until the 1970s that nearly all states were in and not until 1982 that all 50 states were and. Arizona was the last day to join. I would predict within five years all 50 states will be participating in this new Medicaid Expansion because the benefits of it are so great for states. It will be a lot easier when the temperature on obamacare is a political issue images. The other thing to keep in mind of the 25 million, about one third of them are people who will be eligible for medicaid and who failed to sign up for medicaid. We would like those folks to sign up and get all of the Preventive Care and primary care , but the important thing to understand is that when those folks show up at a clinic, at a hospital for care, they wont be. Ld, we cant treat you they can get signed up and qualify for medicaid on the spot. It is a different relationship in terms of who will still be uncovered there will still be a significant amount uncovered, but they will have access to services and not be walking in and say, sorry, you have to pay or we wont treat you. It will be a very different situation for those people. Whether this leads to medicare singlepayer, i think it is way too early to say. I hope it would because, frankly, i did not seen a particular traction in ter of trying to move to that direction before obamacare. I think theres enough changes going on right now that there may be some changes in terms of the prospects. Dr. Steffie woolhandler . I am doubtful people can walk into any Doctors Office is their uninsured and gay care because somebody there happens to think they might get medicaid. That is not how things work now and i dont see why would work that way under obamacare. , obamacare is an expensive program that offers halfway coverage to have the people who need it. We need to be moving forward to singlepayer to make sure every single american can go to any doctor they want and be able to afford that. President obama with black the way it is worked in massachusetts and since 2007 is that if you are eligible for medicaid categorically and you go into a clinic, a Community Health center or hospital and you can get enrolled in medicaid, you get enrolled on the spot. So you walk you were uninsured for you need medical services, you go in and youre covered. That is the model for how the system is designed to work under the aca beginning january 1. President obama has cited a woman named Natoma Canfield as inspiration for his Affordable Care act. Theres a framed letter hanging my office right now centimeter in the Health Care Debate a woman named Natoma Canfield. For years and years she did everything right. She bought Health Insurance, paid or premiums on time. At 18 years ago she was diagnosed with cancer. Even though she had been cancer free for more than a decade, her jackinge company helpe kept up her rates. Despite her fears that she would get sick again, she had to surrender her Health Insurance and was forced to hang her fortunes on chance. I carried her story with me every day in the fight to pass this law. , with aie woolhandler woman like Natoma Canfield now have Better Options than before . It depends on her income. If her income is hovering around 400 of the poverty line, the Health Insurance would be very am a very expensive. What we need is something that covers everyone automatically. How are you doing that work now . You talk about how expanded medicare, medicare for all, would be the path to go, but now you see just obamacare alone has brought down the government or do you see obamacare not as a step to singlepayer that it makes sense to you that republicans would be objecting to this as well . Obamacare is the law of the land. There are some good things, certainly, expanding Medicaid Program is a good thing. Has about 17,000 thinkinour grp members. As you can imagine, there are some disagreements. Some people are very proobama care and others are more tepid, let myself. But we all agree it is not a solution, that we still need singlepayer, and we need to be moving forward and building the movement to go forward to singlepayer. John mcdonough dr. John mcdonough, the issue of medicaid being denied to so many millions of people around the country. Was obamacare framed around them actually getting that medicaid so that what is your response to that . The way it was written by the folks in the house and the senate was that all states on january 1, 2014 are required to open up their Medicaid Programs to all uninsured people with incomes below 138 of the federal poverty line, which is about 14,000 to 15,000 for a single adult. The u. S. Supreme courts decision in june 2012 changed that, the one substantive change they made in the aca was to say the Medicaid Expansion had to be a state option. Reallyre faced with this awful situation where beginning january 1 of next year, the only americans who will not have some form of Health Insurance available to them as a matter of law are poor individuals who live in states that have chosen not to expand medicaid. So it is probably one of the most cruel and despicable forms of rationing i can imagine. It is the folks remote who are in some of the most media states who are denied coverage. I do think it will happen relatively quickly, and i would say within five years, i think just about all states are going to be part of this expansion. Your response, dr. Steffie woolhandler, and how are you working on expanding medicare for all . But it depends on your definition of affordable. Someone my age with about 45,000 euro more income under obamacare would have to pay 8,300 a year in premiums, more than 8,000 year premiums. And her a few people have room for that in their budget. That is why many middle income people will remain uninsured under obama care. Plus, they will be paying a penalty for not participating in the expensive insurance. It is simply not going to be affordable. Our group has been working with health care now, unions, and mostly working in their own community, the physician community, to educate people about singlepayer, to advocate for singlepayer, to continue to push for singlepayer both at the state level and at the national level. We feel once people see what obamacare really is, that it is not a solution to the health care crisis. Once they realize obamacare is not a solution, they will be motivated to join the movement for singlepayer. And how do what do you think is the most critical first step now in that movement given how the republicans are even i thinkng to this . People need to educate themselves about singlepayer. They need to work in their communities around singlepayer. I think what the republicans are doing is reprehensible. Im not supportive of that, obviously, but i think we need to be push and saying we want singlepayer. The republicans have made a big deal about half of americans reject obamacare, but what they dont tell you is that one third of those people who reject obamacare because they did not think it went far enough. The New York Times, they interviewed a very conservative man in georgia who said, i hate obamacare, i support the republicans. What we need is a singlepayer system. I think a lot of people are coming around to that view. We need to continue to put that out there. We need to push for that because that is what americans need. If we are going to single payer expanded medicare today october 1, what would have happened . We could have enrolled everyone automatically through the Social Security ministration, which artie has the names of everyones Social Security numbers, it already , it does atcome least where we work it probably where we live so he would not have had to set up all of these exchanges and new systems with all of these glitches and all this expense. Because by going with the Social Securitybased system, like they have in canada and most of europe, you save all of that paperwork cost and that allows you to devote more money to care. Other nations have nonprofit National Health insurance and spend substantially less than we do and cover everyone, largely because they save on the administrative complexity. I want to thank you both for being with us, dr. Steffie woolhandler now at cunyhunter cofounder of physicians for a National Health program. And John Mcdonough conjured it to shaping romneycare and obamacare. When we come back, an exclusive conversation with ladar levison who ran lavabit until he shut it down. Edward snowden is the email service and the fbi came knocking. He will explain what happened. Stay with us. [music break] this is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We turn now to lavabit, the First Technology from to take the decision to shut down other than disclose information to the federal government. In august, ladar levison shut down his company lavabit after refusing to comply with the government effort to tap his customers information. He is now confirmed the fbi was targeting nsa whistleblower edward snowden, he used lavabits services. These are the government effectively wanted access to the accounts of 400,000 other lavabit customers and forcing his decision to close. He now says since first going public is been summoned before a grand jury, fined 10,000 for handing over incorruption keys on paper instead of digitally, and threatened with arrest for speaking out. The Justice Department began targeting lavabit the day after snow and revealed himself as the source of the nsa leaks. To talk about the case where joined by ladar levison, founder, owner, operator of lavabit. We also joined by his lawyer Jesse Binnall. It is great to have you back, ladar. Explain what happened. Is important, so you dont get me in trouble, i still cant confirm who the subject of the investigation was. That is the one piece of information they kept redacted. You mean you cant confirm it was edward snowden. I cant confirm that, no. But what i can say is what they wanted was the ability to basically listen to every piece of information coming in and out of my network. Effectively, what they needed were my ssl private keys. For those of you on the dont know what ssl is, it is a lock icon in your web browser. It is a technology that effectively secures all communication on the internet between websites, between mail servers, secures instant messages, and represents the identity of a business online. The effectively wanted that from me. It is a very closely guarded secret, something ive compared to the secret formula for coca cola. They wanted it so they could masquerade as me or my business on the internet and intercept all the communications coming in. How did they come to you . They knocked on my door. They left a Business Card on my door sometime in may. We ended up waking up via email and set up an appointment. They came by my office and we sat down and i spent a couple of hours explaining to them the nature of my system and my business. It is probably important to mention that at least in may, they still didnt know the agents who approached me, did not know who the target of the investigation was. But i pretty much have forgotten about it until they came back at the end of june with their trap and trace order, which is a law that is been on the books for 40 years that allows federal Law Enforcement to basically put a listening device on a telephone or a network to collect information. Case, the information they wanted was encrypted so they wanted to peel back the encryption on everyones information as are connecting to my server, just so they could listen to this one user. The yet at the same time, they wouldnt provide any kind of transparency back to me to assure me there were only collecting information on one user. I had a real problem with that. Given the sensitivity of the information they were asking for and given how it would harm my reputation if they ended up violating the court order, i just didnt feel it was appropriate to give them the access that they wanted so i recruited jesse, whom well hear from in a moment, and he is been helping the fight that request ever since. When the federal judge unsealed the documents in the case allowing you just ignore candidly let me ask Jesse Binnall this question. Why did the judge do that . Order unsealing the case is still partially under seal, but what we can say motion made a actually, two motions. Made two motions to unsealed this case and to get rid of the nondisclosure obligations on ladar over a month ago. And now that there is an appeal pending in the fourth circuit, the court has finally lifted the privacy and the sealed nature of the case so we can finally talk about the record of everything that ladar levison did go through. What is happening right now, Jesse Binnall . We still have some legal issues pending at various stages of the process, but the majority of what is going on right now is there is an appeal that has been noted and there is a brief that sll be filed by ladar levison legal team here within the next few days outlining our position on why the actions taken by the government are both unconstitutional and violates statute. What exactly is at stake . The privacy issues of all americans when they deal with communications by methods like email, when there is a third party involved like ladar levisons. And whether the fourth memo protects those communications. The Fourth Amendment i think what is important to highlight here is what is at stake is trust. Trust on the internet. Absolutely. When youre connected to paypal, can you trust your browser to be communicating with paypal or your bank or someone in the middle . And these private keys they were demanding are the technological mechanism for guaranteeing that trust. And by removing our ability to protect them, they are effectively violating forcing us to violate that trust. I asked you when you came on the show before, ladar, if you had received a National Security letter in he said you could not say. Thousands of americans face up to five years in prison if they even reveal that information to someone close to them, that demands they give out information. Can you say now . There is more than one issue at play here. I think it is important to highlight there are still things i cant talk about, but that the most important thing at least in my opinion that i really wanted to talk about was this demand for the sll key and that has been unsealed. I decided early on in this battle i can live with turning over the keys if i can also tell people what was going on. Howdy fight a law you cant tell anybody that it exists. How do you go to Congress Without being able to relate what you are your story is and how it the laws affected you. That is effectively how a democracy works. They were handicapping a by restraining my speech. What has your company done differently or you have done differently than other companies to protect the security of your users . Just because of my background in Information Security and i took a very serious approach when i designed and architected the system to effectively minimize its number of vulnerabilities. I have spent a lot of time working with Information Technology in the Financial Services sector, so i was using the same types of protocols and procedes that a lot of banks use to protect information. As a result, the information they wanted to collect was not being passed around in unencrypted form. So theres no place for them to intercept it. That was one of the big differentiators between, for example, my service, and a lot of other services that they may or may not have approached. My system was effectively to secure to be tapped any other way. To me ask you about another issue, the National Security agency, the nsa, has made repeated attempts to develop a tax against people using tor to a popular tool designed to protect online anonymity despite the fact the software is primarily funded and promoted by the u. S. Government itself. That is absolutely correct. Tor was originally sponsored by the u. S. Government to allow people in countries like china that were firewalls off and the rest of the world to access the internet freely. It is actually designed to resist attempts by governments to uncover the identity of whoever is using the network. And to my knowledge, the network itself has actually been able to resist any attempts by the u. S. Government to uncover the identity of users, of what the government has been doing is basically following a practice of taking over websites on the tor network and using them to hijacked websites to install malware on visitors computers, and then using that malware to submit the actual ip or location of a person back to a server in virginia. Where the fbi is located. I dont necessarily have a real. Vocal problem with them taking , for example, that promote child pornography i dont have a problem with them taking down websites, for example, that promote child proper fee, but i do have a philosophical problem their loading malware onto peoples computers without any kind of restriction, restrain, or oversight. Xd face imprisonment . If i say little bit more, i think i could. I think one of the reasons im not in prison right now is all of the media attention. What are your plans now . Are you going to restart lavabit . Do you feel you have to go overseas . Overseas if i went could run a service, but im not ready to give up on america. The courtto see how case plays out. If we end up winning, i will be able to reopen lavabit here in the u. S. If i lose, i will probably end up turning over the service to somebody abroad and let them run it so i can stay here in america and move on to something else. You were willing to hand over it, if it was just one person, lets say was edward snowden. What is the distinction you make . The distinction is access. What they wanted was unrestricted, and audited access to everyones communications. That was something i was uncomfortable with. If the summer of snowden has taught us anything, it is that we cannot trust our own government with access to information they should not have access to. What are you doing now to protect your self . Talking to you, trying to raise money through lavabit. Com and rally. Org doubt fight the case in speaking out and hoping someone has the ability to make a difference hears it. Have other email providers come to you or others going to be speaking out . I dont know. I hope so. The big ones are doing everything they can, but they face a number of restrictions on their speech that really prevent them from saying what is really going on, just like i faced up until recently. Ladar levison, founder, owner, operator of lobby bit and Jesse Binnall is his lawyer and a lawyer for lavabit. That does it for our broadcast. Democracy now is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. Email your comments to outreach democracynow. Org or mail them to democracy now p. O. Box 6 tavis good evening. From los angeles, i am tavis smiley. Tonight, a conversation with David Dinkins, the former mayor of new york city who has put down what he has learned in more than five decades in a new text called a mayors life. We are glad you have joined us with former mayor David Dinkins coming up right now. And by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. Thank you. Tavis being the mayor of new york is called the second most difficult job in america. He just chronicled his life and times governing new yorks gorgeous mosaic. Id add you back on the program, sir. Glad to have you back on the program, sir. We will get straight to the text. There is a major race happening in the city of new york. Michael bloomberg got the city council to give him a third term. Herself in terms of being the next mayor, but one of those finalists got his start working for you. Tell me you have endorsed and take it away. I endorse bill thompson, the past controller. Mike bloomberg did pretty well. Lost by four or five points. But the mayor spent over 100 million. Billorsed him again, but one. He worked in our office in city hall and worked with bill lynch, known to many as a rumpled genius. It brought him along as he has done so many others. Bill is dead now and has his reward. But he has left quite a legacy. You endorse him now that he is one of the two finalists . Absolutely. I called them on Election Night and congratulated him, offering to do whatever i could the help. To help. He not only worked for us, but his wife did, too. She worked in our speech office. The office of the reporters, the news office. She was terrific. Very pleased that they are together. I suppose the whole world knows about dante and his afro. Tavis you are the first africanamerican mayor, but he is married to annette an africanamerican woman and his son has a huge afro. The president gave his afro a shout out. Most multicultural and
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