Anthony valdez the new secretary for the environment welcome and good luck with our new position next item. Roll call vote commissioner president vietor commissioner courtney commissioner caen is on her way the approval of the minutes pr the approval of the minutes of the november 10, 2015. So motion to approve the minutes. Second any questions any Public Comment on the minutes all in favor, say i. I. Opposed . That motion carries next item. Is general Public Comment under any Public Comments on matters that are currently not on the agenda today. Hearing none next item, please. Item 5 communications. You have before you all the communications that have been forwarded which youve had a chance to review any questions or comments on the Communications Commission . Any Public Comment on communications . Hearing next item, please item 6 other Commission Business 6 a authorize the general manager for a new recognize program for excellent 0 performances for the Public Utilities commission we the puc and contractor and consultant and or other audit partners and ms. Ellis. Im julia i was the resolution before you authorizes. A new recognize program to recognize the outstanding work by the Public Utilities commission and consultant and other outside partners we had the warned at the puc a recognition excellence innovations and officers milestone awards for years of service currently, the milestones are still awarded the Collections Program has been on hold tennis 20132014 the staff extended the program in order to make the changes you knew program were proposing the item before you is still to be named a Recognition Program is it differs from the Prior Program in a few ways to begin with we know the work is complicate and no environment is the environment were working in we need other entities it recognizes not only internal staff but other key helpers with the public agencies and other private companies and nonprofits a new program is our efforts to promote and insure the sfpuc is around services and stewardship and lastly our winners with commission hopefully event yaesh as you may know the creation of a new puc is a priority for commissioner courtney want to thank his leadership in this development of this program and look forward to working with the commission and commissioner courtney in developing the details of the program in the fall. Great, thank you it sounds like a wonderful new program i too want to thank county on his leadership would you like to say anything. If thats okay to the chair i too represent the workers and staff and carmen because going beyond puc staff is absolutely appropriate given the great work for the utilities by nonprofits and contractors and developers, etc. Especially with the sources of the improvement coming up im enthusiastic about alu all of is participating in those events we do it in so many vrpts an antidote theyre big boys and nothing phases them until you talk to them they like that insurance thing when it comes down we kind of miss that im really, really happy to have the conversation my 0 40e7 wed like to embarrass it together and keep to going through the general manager. Sounds great are there any questions or comments. Just is comment it is a great thing and add my voice for commissioner courtney providing the leadership one thing ill mention to the general manager it is important that we put the details together how elections are made especially in the area of sloekt contractors for onward not indicating favorism or compromise the future for the contractors im not sure how we do that task but a sensitivity in the process. Are there any is there any additional Public Comment on this item. And if no objection move forward with the general manager to institute this new program. Ill 0 come back with more detailed how the Selection Process and flush it out more. Theres a resolution that needs to be voted on. Ill move. All in favor, say i. I. Opposed . That motion carries thank you very much. Bless you. Next speaker, please. Item 7 is report of the general manager. So the first item is an update on the drought steve richie. Gadget steve richie assistant general manager for the water slides please with the drought updates pretty standard here again, our reservoir levels show you hetch hetchy is still about 72 percent holding steadily and drawing down the water supply before you in flows and water bank has down and maintain that up in the Hetch Hetchy Reservoir the precipitation front again, were still ahead of the medium curve for precipitation for this water year that given on october 1st that red line the black line is the medium we actually for the last year left off 1993 that is the blue line weve added it in for a target to shoot for the snow pack has leveled off over the last few weeks but we have seen a fair amount of precipitation in october and november above average a 40 in percent and more expected on thursday locally well have a half of inch in december not nearly as much of the upper country level on this front the precipitation forecast rookies good an anticipation one or two feet of snow in above 7 feet in the sierra and pro tem on the snow front whether it is up country or in the bay area as well both for thursday turning to consumption those are the october results again in the 15 lowest per capital a 13 are them and customers for San Francisco again about 41 gallons per person per day a low use and is wholesale and the city customers are doing a great job at conjecturally that was october the total chart shows for thanksgiving week demand was down region wide people didnt washer their dishes from thanksgiving dinner but matches colonel in the christmas week that last blue front so we may go lower than last year before the late season when you get do winter the irrigation is gone that is indoor use and eventually cutting back on the total system water savings continues to be high one of the things to know about this that the state water board held a workshop talking about the extension of the drought regulations into 9 next year the govern made a declaration a few weeks ago the drought continues to extend them to october theres been a lot of discussion about folks in the inn land a climate jauflt factor for them and weve indicated in our comments well, if they maintain the goal of 25 percent and reduce there shouldnt be pressure on those folks for low capital to explicit conserve lower weve been working with groups to have redirected impacts of giving someone a break somewhere for that someone doing a good job in early february we go forward thats where we are at ill be happy to answer any questions. Commissioners. No. All right. Next item. So the next is the Hetch Hetchy Cip and at that point wastewater data at the same time. Good afternoon, commissioners i just wanted to highlight where the delays or the Cost Increases were and so for the water and joint projects one project a scheduled detail the lower cherry aqueduct for the permitting approval that took are longer we originally anticipated and we have two projects showing Cost Increases one is other power house projects additional equipment is being ordered and installed and the other is cherry dam outcomes this was approved without Construction Funding so the increase is to include Construction Funding the Power Projects we have 3 projects that are showing scheduled details one is civic center and the Sustainable Program under the Efficiency Program it is really depending on the other departments main dpw doing their improvements and getting money to do the title 24 and Energy Efficiency projects with the larger programs and the other two are the meter monitoring both of them are do not selecting a consultant for strategy those are the hetch hetchy Capital Projects for the wastewater capitalized one project that is detailed by approximately, six most that is oceanside plant handling and coding and the delay is in construction and there is more corotation repair than anticipated so that work is being completed right now so why is sustainable civic center theyre waiting on funding you know barb can help me if im not mistaken the departments do the work and come to puc for title 24 and have Energy Efficiency in the building were not the lead on the projects you. So is there a way to giving them encouragement or a letter of something. Barbara hale assistant general manager our need to collect data about the operations of the building and that in and of itself is an important task for the efficiency measures and that takes time some of the projects taking more time to get the Staff Support you know the building operators are altitudes very busy and were coming and knocking on their door to ask them to take on a new task that part of challenge but we have the contracting capacity and have the ability to provide the support we just need to move it apace that works for our customer. So can you please come back with a timeline to get this done with a sense of urgency those have lost budget money but seem to be put on the back burn theyre important. We can definitely reach out to the other departments that have the facilities but again, it is really challenging when hair operating the building and asking them to get data i mean by just in the nature it is like on the back burner and theyre under staffed were doing everything we can to encourage them. Come back with a timeline that would be great as well. Next item. Lowest the process report good afternoon, commissioners eric sandler assistant general manager of Business Services today, this stem is the next installment in what has been a series of presentations reviewing the Commission Policies before the adoption of the new budget a memo and a policy in youre packet and this presentation summarizes some of the highlights were talking about the rates policy which was established in february 2012 but essentially was a codification in policy form of a number of rates and charges with respect to state law and the city chapter and best practices since then adopted a 4year of sewer and water rates with wholesale water rates and a number of action on power rates so the policy the itself is composed of 4 principles the first be affordability relates to the level the stability of roeven harasses with the long term trend compliance with the late regarding state law contractual sufficiency relates to if you Cost Recovery you recover all the costs of enterprise and transparency relates to how the Commission Goes about developing vetting and proposing and adopting the rates heres some the progress related we regularly show you where the typical bell for water and sewer sophomore puc services compares with other local utilities and we regularly present the 10 year rate projection with the 10 year capital plan and made adjustments in the last study taking form some the rates more the clerk will take the roll to cost of Service Principle and be compliant with them and the great making has involved the transparent process with the oversight by the revenue by the Oversight Committee and siding and the rate fairness board and commission you know as we look at the policy as i reviewed it i think one of the things that struck me which is a theme weve talked about for that the last several months is the review availability weve been seeing the impact on all thE Enterprises as we entered this extended drought well recommend the commission rises the policy for this to perhaps enhance the sufficiency principle to identify the need to balance competing policy objectives when looking at rated skyline so the trade off between a conservatism on one hand and revenue 125ib8g9 on the other so to refresh our memory on our retail water revenue is approximately 15 fixed and metric the sewer rates are 100 percent bio metric so you know as were dealing with the drought and embarking on a very last year Capital Improvement plan for the sewer system is it mines to i think we consider our rate structure issues so we recommend that you direct you go us to come back with a policy revision for the consideration and in january were planning to come and speak but a little bit on the activities with respect to innovation and our wet weather charges ill be happy to answer any questions about the rate policy or take any direction from the commission. First of all, thank you very much i appreciate youre putting this together and as weve been looking for ways to accomplish that i think youre very close to the mark you appreciate the work you do that i guess one question and then a couple of comments the question one of the things the written policy calls out specifically we follow best practices as far as funding our costs i dont know if you have a quick answer or on opinion about that when i talk about traffics thats one of the areas frequently one of the lows that can shortchange r and r as a question when is youre sense as to how were doing on this where were funding appropriate level something we should look at on the budget coming down. So i think some of the challenges you know when the budget that is coming forward has responses to investing in r and r over a 10 year period one of the challenges not only how you invest but how you fund it, it is easy to become addicted to depth and instruction of assets to be reasonably assumed to be rate funding that investment is it so hard to make those transitioned when our facing impacts with respect to increased volumes but ill suggest it make sense for the commission to consider in its debt policy a consideration of how much it wants to fund its Capital Improvement plan with rate funded revenue or debt funded revenue a nice compliment to an r and r program. We video a separate policy as you recall that were going to do be reviewing or is that thats been reviewed early in the year january or february. If there is Something Like that that is a clarification that would make life and direction easier i would encourage you to come forward and propose a change to deal with that and similar kind of thinking a and you talked about maybe amending this policy to include moving towards rates that more fully capture the rates cost im encourage you to come forward as an amendment to consider one thing i noticed that is missing from here was a statement i know what the commission intent direction has been but not made it into the policy over time we wanted to move hetch hetchy general fund power rates towards market and thats something for some reason we didnt put in the last time i part of the reason for doing this not only hocking to see how the department is doing with complying with the policy the other thing the test of the policy itself is if there is areas the policy is deficient more guidance or you think that the commission on record is helpful that is part why we review this coming forward with the amendments that will be helpful. Want to clarify i stated you wanted us to show the general Fund Departments cost of power comes to the cost of market are you talking about the cost of delivery or youre referring to power or i want to be clear. It would be probable be better if i were clear over time the specific obviously how fast that happens it has ripple effects over time we migrate to the Energy Efficient resolution. I think the goal was 0 the cost of actual delivery verse the cost of market so for example, from the cost us 0. 10 per kilowatt for 13 we need to show some benefit providing a power. I wanted to i was getting greedy again. Perhaps youre right that reflects what the commission. As well just to let you know were in the process of working on a cost of Service Study for the power enterprise so we will have a really good 10 east sense of cost of services and other rates and how much will our full costs of service might be. And it maybe appropriate to have some statement to the effect ill hate to get into a position to charge the rates just to cover the cost we may want to a parallel statement that says the objective to manage the enterprise such the costs are less than. You want something the efficiency principle raedz addresses that would you want a specific element in the policy with respect to the power rates or i mean, i think my sense is yes and certainly when you come forward well have a discussion of greater depth but my sense that is something that effects so 34 people and because of the departure from past practice weve moved in that disconnection it is important to have its own medication you can point to and talk about to people. Okay terrific. This question around the cost of service is relevant to all 3 enterprises E Enterprises it is hard to separate from the debt policy when you come forward with our recommendation on a fixed rate it should reference or refresher our minds on the debt policy piece it the r and r question which could fall under the what the could have of services does it fall under it seems to me that would so nuance in there i think we want to try and capture the highlevel of policy in order to set the policies needs a better understanding. We have a great opportunity to revisit in a comprehensive way you know our Debt Service Ratio and Capital Improvement plan and r and r policy. Our hetch hetchy and rates and charges. So figure out when we can undertake that but a helpful education process. I think that is a good idea as we enter into budget time needs to make decisions so somewhere in there to do an education i dont want to lose site of the stormwater. That will be part of it were bringing that in january for an update. Yeah. I think we are hopeful that by the time we introduce the new i guess rate structure we will have all that ironed out but bringing it up more and more weve already looking at what the impacts would be if we were to do a wastewater fee for example, weve been go talking with the Mayors Office of the bureaucratic budget with the general fund increases over time so weve been you know talking about that as well so but, yeah i think we definitely like to talk about it for about the wastewater it takes a little bit of time to do the study get information were hoping that when we have a significant amount of work in the off year next fiscal year implementing our executing the cost of Service Study for wastewater were doing one for power i think we have the probably the ban width for the commission to look at the enter play between those policies. Maybe give you a schedule of activities to lead up to when we present to you a full picture of what the rate structure would be moving forward including the wastewater San Francisco Entertainment Commission fee and decide how much fixed cost for wastewater and water so we can probably do a timeline. Well put together a rough speakers shall address their comments to the commission as a whole and neither the Police Commission nor the over the next you know two years what we hope to cover when. A policy question i feel well need some of that information in order to be able to amend the policy i imagine. Yeah. Thank you very much any other questions or comments . Anything else on the general manager report that concludes my report. Next speaker, please. Oh, Public Comment on the general manager report . Hearing next item, please. Item 5820152016 financial audit report. R6 r67 20152016 audit report. Good afternoon, commissioners this is franciscy deputy chief Financial Officer for fiscal year 20142015 those Financial Statements were audited by our dependent auditors who have render their opinion the opinion for each of 3 enterprises for the 7 Consecutive Year in a row each enterprises has an unmodified clean opinion of the Financial Statements 6th district at large theyre appropriately presented containing no artificial information additionally the city and county of San Francisco adopted the golf standards board the statement 68 forth and Financial Reporting for pensions and this is one of the reasons the Financial Statements were issued in november instead of the earlier timeline of october in the past the comprehensive annual Financial Reports will be issued tomorrow and we expect that we will submit to the Government Finance Office Association the g f o a an award for excellence and Financial Reporting again, no questions id like to introduce jenny the audit senior manager to present to the commission the audit results of the 3 enterprises. Thank you my name is jamie a senior manager i worked on the puc account for 3 years now so thank you for having me. I will be presenting the 2015 audit results to the commission and its presentation will address the communications to the board and in accordance with the Audit Standards one 15 and provide a highlevel similarly of 2015 audit to start responsibility to perform the audit under the general accepted auditing standards and the government auditing standards and we extensive the internal control for efficient audit approach not for the purposes of an opinion or assurance of operating effectiveness of the control a pubically trade company we design the procedures based on the understanding the puc and not saluted assurance of the absent of the materials in the Financial Statements as indicated this means we develop and audit Performance Materials we sample the tractions contributions and not testing 100 percent of the transactions and perform is a at the time of the puc compliance with certain provisions of laws and contracts to the level and stent have a material effect on the Financial Statements and opine on the Financial Statements based on the audit results as indicated earlier we issued two reports for each of the Enterprise Funds and independent auditors on the Financial Statements of which we issued on urban modified clean opinion and issued a report on the internal controls over financial compliance according to the government auditing standards a clean report no deficiencies or significant undermines we confirm were independent worksheet to the city and county and defined by the professional standards in the government auditing standards and in the reports youll see the significant accounting policy needs this is referenced but note two for the puc in each the i didnt say funds financial we assure that the policies are in corners with the compliant of industry practices and standards one new standard effective in 2015 the 68 theth and Financial Reporting for pensions of which had a Significant Impact on the puc finltz as well as all other city and county departmental funds the statement revised the pension liability for the pension plan provides by the city and county to the employees the accumulative effect and the decrease and beginning of net position or decrease in 2014 ending that position the adjustment youll see here and the effects were on water one and 55 million and wastewater 69 million hetch hetchy at 69 and hetch hetchy power at 20. 7 million. We have significant accounts and transactions to require the adjusted and estimate the reason those are higher inherit because of the significance in the Financial Statement and because of the possibility of future events effecting them this defer from managements current judgment weve listed the significant accounts and in our process we review the method or estimate and determine the reasonableness of the assumptions of the data used audit adjustment exist to should the difference in the accounting literature foyer what management has recorded we have one cricket audit adjustment applicable to all the puc Enterprise Funds this is a reclassification judgment one the cash flow statement of which none were included in the skwiegs of the accounting statement therefore we proposed and management adjusted and corrected the cash flow of nonoperating expenses from operating activities down below to noncapital and related financial activities this was 12. 9 for water and warranted and 7 millions for hetch hetchy once again only a reclassification adjustment on the cash flow statements next, we did have an uncorrected judgment related to hetch hetchy and this was related to a deviation of a general accounting principle we call a nongap policy of which management has the policy if totaled to less than 2 million the extraordinary items subsequent to the initial year will be recorded as other operating or nonoperating expenses rather than below the line in extraordinary items if so once again a reclassification on or about on the income statement related to the rim fire and had a net amount of 1. 4 million wrap up her we have no disagreements or difficulties with management the accounting and finance department are great and our audit request they make the audit a priority and thE Enterprises have knowledgeable folks that provide skwiegsz promptly to us management didnt consult with other dependent consultant not to agreeing with our analysis or interpretation of literature and we maintain our dependence no implication outside of the audit and have two written communications we receive annually the engage letter with the San Francisco it documents our representation letters weve received for each report that is signed by management to finalize the outing anti e audit that concludes my presentation. If any questions. Questions or comments i want to first of all, congratulations on 5 clean audits in seven years in a row Pretty Amazing work thank you for your work those last few years. Ill add we lost our cfo but as near as i can tell well not only replace him not specifically in the process thats the kind of depth that we can appreciate. Other comments thank you very much for your presentation. Public comment on the audit . Hearing none next item, please. Item 9 the bosco update mr. Hurley i understand is here to present. Yes. Good afternoon michael the Water Resources manager ever bosco my colleague cant be here but a brief update on the activities youre wholesale customers and getting the slides here start off giving you a look at the individual targets as you can see from the slides the green bars are the targets given to each agency by the state board and you blue h the blue to date as you can see for the vast majority of agencies exceeding is it amount the 15 bar represents the waited afternoon for all the bosco agencies target assigned to them theyre at the 29 percent well above their the fact of the matter were not see the savings in the summer but all the agency are shaped up. Can you go back didnt quite understand it was counterintuitive active. The green bars are what was assigned to each agency by the state board into the october from june to october. I see the blowing blue how theyve exceeded the conservatism standards. Thats good but the solid green line bar 15 percent is accumulative of what theyre doing taking away at look at it with the powers to date on the total 9 month target each agencies listens those the vertical act assess and converted to percentages for the totals 9 months 19 of the agencies have achieved that the fact of the matter a couple of as that have compliments for moderate youll not see the summer swing but all exceptions theyll make that accumulative for all agencies the total target what over 10 billion gallons weve exceeded it go close to 12 one half billion some are what the state board is looking at this will benefit the wholesale customers so you know were all hoping and wishing for the best but the drought from the drought continues well continue to assume more work is needed with the landscape ordinance needs to be updated bosco has put together an ordinance that is more appropriate for the service area that is something they did in 2010 it is something the agencies can adopt on their own or the bosco ordinance the ordinance is provided to the valley water districts customers that are interested in the same level of customized ordinance the reneutral Drought Campaign our thought at this point shifts gears our agencies in the city retail customers have obviously done a great job and continue to ask them to continue their ways. Finally mr. Richie said weve been in communication with steve and his staff on this we appreciate that the agencies and other parts of state are maybe in different situations but whatever is proposed really shouldnt be born on the backs of the retail customers as well as the bosco agencies performing at outstanding low levels on the same page with that, im available to answer any questions. Congratulations yeah. Same to you. Any other questions or comments Public Comment . Thank you very much next up the consent calendar please read the items calendar, are considered to be routine and may be acted upon by a single roll call vote of the commission. There will be no separate discussion of these items unless a member of the commission, the public, or staff so requests in which event the matter shall be removed from the consent calendar and considered as a separate item at this or a future hearing. Approve the water supply for the ecology cotton and expansion project b approve the water supply assessment for the 950 Market Street project, c approve amendment number one and increase it by 900 million with 3 years and the specifics and award the contract in view of them 4 million to the lost qualified responsible and responsive birds for the company and e the contract number for total contract amount for 55 million plus and a total contractor during of one hundred and 49 contract days and for the construction in the in the amount of of 3 million plus and the contingency or 61 calendar days g approve an increase in the duration of 1 hundred and 96 consecutive calendar days and accept the contracts approve the modifications two and three and increasing the contract by 1 hundred 46 thousands plus and one hundred and 4 consecutive days and i w d2627 r approve the modification for the duration by one and 76 clashed days and authorize the payment to the contractor and the contingency in the amount of 200 million plus with the duration of 200 and 60 calendar days for the contract and k approve an increase in the construction for the contingency for contract of up to one hundred and 80 consecutive calendar days l accept contract approve the modification number 2 increasing the contract by one hundred and 20 thousand plus in the modification and increasing the contract and authorize the final payment to the contract and m for the specifications and award the contract in the amount of of one hundred 80 plus to the lowest responsive bird with the yerba buena engineering and jurisdiction and n the plans and specifications for the contract invited 7 million plus to the lowest responsive bird j forest construction. Thank you would anyone like to remove any of those items commissioners . Is there a motion to approve the consent calendar so moved. Seconded. Any question for the Public Comment. All in favor, say i. I. Of approving the consent calendar. Opposed . Consent calendar is approval next item, please. Item 11 approve the terms and authorize the general manager to execute a 5 year recognize the wlns for the santa clara. Deputy general manager a pretty straightforward item to issue a new license for the existing permit to temporarily allow them space to lay down to do repairs to their levy approval . Second. Questions e questions or comments any Public Comment on this item all in favor, say i. I. Opposed . Carries thank you very much next item. Item 12 approve the modification to the collection agreement by the United States forest city in the city and county of San Francisco and authorize an amendment expend the duration up to one year. Again Michael Deputy general manager for camp mather were trying to do a Land Exchange with the u. S. Forest we need additional times actually, the Forest Service needs additional time. Ill questions or comments public i. Opposed . Carries next item, please. Item 13 approval amendment to the agreement and authorizing the agreement and increase by one Million Dollars with a time of months. Good afternoon. Commissioners. Good afternoon. This is a dan wade the assistant director to allow the construction manager for the mountain tunnel to continue and continue the work for the project. Is there a most motion to approve this item. Second. Comments or questions on this any any Public Comment . All in favor, say i. I. Opposed . That motion carries thank you item 14. A public hearing and possible action to approve the provisions for the 6 projects as part of Water System Improvement Program and direct the staff to the California Public health and the Seismic Safety Commission and dan again an extension of 6 projects for time only these projects are only service about continuing the negotiation on claims on several the projects and finishing punchless items on a few of them as well and this is in accordance with the thirty day item that was issued well thirty days ago. Is there a motion to approve this item. So moved. Second. Mr. Hurley you have a Public Comment. Yes. Just a brief comment in our packet a letter in support of this proposed changes and scheduled thank you to mr. Wade and his staff the outreach is the showing the continuing value of the progress on those different projects given the fact the level of goals are being met and glad to answer any questions. Thank you, mr. Wade and puc staff for reaching out our relationship with bosco is very important comments from i. Opposed . That motion carries. Next speaker, please. Item 15 adopt the negative declaration the monitoring and reporting program and findings as required by the californias California Environmental quality act for the long term improvement programs and approve the project steve richie assistant general manager for water that is approval of the adoption of the final mitigated negative declaration it is the long terms consortiums thats been underway for quite sometime additional constitutes a new yard facilities as well as the creek watershed center that has meeting space and visitor space to celebrate a key element of our water system we have had long discussions with the Small Community about this and i believe there is a letter that made it in late and still in support of project ill be happy to answer any questions. Im for one glad to see that this Sonoma County wants to see this come to fruition. The valley rock is fine. We need part of buffer space around the query no issue. Is there a motion to approve that item. Ill second. Any other comments Public Comment on i. Opposed . That motion carries next item, please. Item 16 authorize and roadways the memorandum of understanding were the general agency and office of contract administrations with the 17 and establishing the terms and conditions of the transfer of the property at 18 geraldo. Deputy general manager again an item youve passed and still one memorandum of understanding with the jurisdictional control over the sites that is purchased we had a further meeting with the city administrator and had discussion how jurisdictions will be handled 24 718 jerry additional on the sitsites its been if the property or dont use it well recover some of our money but in order to have a long term lasting agreement the office of city administrator felt to have jurisdiction over the property that will be purchased wooech well get the jurisdictional transfer for the southeast plant thats the change in the mou that has occurred since you last passed this any questions. Ill move the item. Second. Questions or comments . Any Public Comment on this item all in favor, say i. I. Opposed . Thank you, mr. Garland. Next, we have items that i would like to call together unless there is objection 17, 18, 19, 20 and 21 please read those items 17 is not ax an action but the following are. Item 17 presentation and discussions of final Risk Assessment and Business Plan and update the power supply Contract Negotiations 18 urge the california Public Utilities commission to reject the power charge in adjustment and application, 19 discussion regarding the cleanpowersf Business Plan and possible action for the occupation of the cleanpowersf clean practice policies and item 20 possible action for the charges appearing for the rates and charges for the San Francisco Public Utilities commission and power entrepreneurs the cleanpowersf system within San Francisco and item 21 the approval the line of credit and associated agreement with j. P. Morgan chase notifying 40 millions for the cleanpowersf and authorize the general manager to execute the line of credit. So commissioners just wanted to take this opportunity to try to remind you where we are today at the last meeting we reviewed the Business Plan for cca today, well make a presentation and discuss some of the acts that are before you the intent of the program is to launch the program by march 2016 we put a aggressive schedule and all hands on deck to meet that schedule and their intent to meet the march 2016 the truth of the matter weve identified but provided that where we analyzed the program to demonstrated to operate the program while charging the rates that are equal or less than penguin that is the affordability weve leading with the affordability and cannot you know deliver the program equal or less than penguin we will have the policy come back to you so milestones that are upcoming i want to make sure youre aware of and barbara will talk about that one we talked about last time was that pg e recently put forward their pc i a their power charge and adjustment which is pretty sure the exit fee if you no longer choose to be receiving the power from pg e or go to the cca that actually charge a fee they went to the california puc and they have something that item before the california puc which they would like to increase by 94 percent increase that has we talked about last time the way were offering our product were making sure that our customers total bill is equal then it was if they were in pg e customer which means our jurisdictions has to be low enough to absorb it by increasing the pc i a were actually having to put a lower generation that means we have to feed into our margin that is why one of the items on here is a really resolution urging the california puc to reject pg es proposal to increase the fee it impacts the program that is the one thing out there and the other thing we want you to adopt the business practice policies so it really helps the guide the implementation and Ongoing Operations and approve the schedule raised and charges for phase one of the program and then also the stand by letter credit that supports our supplies with the program and so barb will spend time walk you through the changes in the program and then have discussion on what you want to see as we move forward. Thank you general manager Kelly Barbara hale assistant general manager for power another big milestones for cleanpowersf weve produced the final draft copies for the public youve received copies as well ill do as the general manager said walk you through the new information since weve presented on november 10th specifically associated with additional working capital refresh the supply pricing and the pg e revised exit fee the general manager mentioned well also look at what that means to our program projections our final projections how we you to adjust the policies in the Advisory Committee of the new information and give you a contract workshop with the milestones of the calendar for launch so first up the goals the program that is something that has not changed sticking with the Program Goals and the Overall Program design it is fundamental to launching the program so those things have not yielded changed had a has changed new information weve present to you on november 10th on november 13th the california puc administrator law judge overseeing it issued a proposed decision agreeing with pg e exit fee were expecting according to the california puc schedule a decision on this item on december 17th we have also worked with the board of supervisors to have a resolution for the record where the board about urge certain acts the pg e and the action before you today item 18 that would have you urging the c p to denouncement alternative proposals that help to mitigate the rate impacts on customers of pg e proposal and to express support that the california puc reexamine how to calculates and how it supplies to pg e customers thats a quick summary of action were looking for were also the other piece new information an inclusion of the 4 million in working Capital Loans and we have since november 10th received a supply refresh from the Supplier Companies were working with and negotiating with and that reduces our projected costs for supply for the program and thats at 70 percent of the Program Costs of supplies that is an important refresh for us. Can you i think there is a lot of information especially new information im wondering too pause for a minute i have a question. Sure. Ill be happy to to take youre questions. So this december 17th decision is pretty important i know that our love our state literatures are they engaged as echoing it this feels like a moment to be able to see what can happen on this important decision auto and alice may speak more but engaged with our sacramento legislators and lobbyists and working with them we are proposing various letters send work with the other cca associations trying to make sure that we have a very engaged voice at the california puc myself and some of the puc San Francisco puc staff a calendared to meet with the couple of the advisors for the commissioners there to make sure we have a facing face to face meeting what the impacts on our program and cca generally. Great. That is important and then on the second item whats the 4 million Additional Capital loan for. That of the working capital in order to support the launch the program we had the hetch hetchy loan was set at 4 million we requested an additional 4 million to give ourselves for the launch room it turns out quite important to us now that the program has taken this the hit on the financial projections from the pg e action took youll see that explained in the next slide. Okay. Great. Anything else. I have a question i want to understand more thoroughly about the exit fee. Uhhuh. Im assuming and maybe the correct me if i am wrong assumption the people cut to the chase im assuming it is the fact that very purchased the power now that power will not be used thats the fee they put on the personal loan is if sort of the power may pg e has made a commitment either because they own generation or theyve purchased generation assuming that a certain amount of customer if a customer leaves the california puc said you can charge their customers their share of the power youll have to pay forest they left. Holy ghost how long does it last. It is bureaucratic and archiveic there is in Expiration Date under the current puc date in calculating the exit fee that is part of the reason we want them to reexamine how they calculate it. Thats not right i mean a contract cant be that long. Correct and if you know prudent Utility Management required or requires that long and mid and short time candidates they should be forecasted to match and departure of youre Customer Base pg e is getting that wrong if we continue to pay exit fees theyre not forecasting the low departure appropriately so theyre not doing their jobs right or the reshths have set up a methodologies that didnt loot the costs one of the two things is happening we want the puc to investigate that is before you in item 18. Another question on previous question so in a sense it is like three hundred plates and chair mar the guests not showing up but pg e can turn around and sell. We should only have to pay in pg e is going suffering a loss. Right. Which is why this conversation engaged with the regulators and the legislators is very important because it didnt sync up. Right and depending on how things workout on the 17 we may find ourselves back talking about what sort of legislative activity we should be pursuing we need this to fix an improvement on this for the programs ongoing success. You know to that point and maybe come back to this after the presentation you sort of applied saying the Program Design is not changing but you know the faensz approach in the neighborhood weve selected not asset on affordability and so it might are implementations for Program Design. Like i said were leading with affordability so if i cant offer and setting price or cheaper ill pause unless youre direct me to offer more expensive programs to me you know if we cant meet or beat pg e we need to think about it right now we feel we can we are you know planning were go over some of the things well do to try to mitigate if something were to happen next year that will challenge that you know we do have some levers we can pull but the intent of the program is to leave with affordability to i dont want to say that were going to make it more comprehensive. Im suggesting that but suggesting something in the program skwien that is not about pausing but looking at you know a different place to launch or a phased approach or inclination or combination of activities maybe affordability. Well go over it you know i dont want to steal her thunders were looking at whatever you know areas of how were launch to minimize that effect. Great but all of those things are talking about the overall financial projections and the slide you see here shows the same slide we shouted on november 10th able to fund the reserves with the operating and the contingency stabilization reserve those are circled in red at the bottom the 3 new pieces of information that field into those 3 items 1, 2, 3 with the green arrows lets talk about each of those number one thats the exit fee impact it reduces our electricity Sales Revenues by 88. 4 million over the first 5 years and our Capital Improvement plan sorry youre working capital loan increases by 4 million that is number 2 and then the third item to our advantage is the lower supply costs associated with the supplier price refresh we got so the pc i reduces the projected revenues by 8. 4 million this is advocating the california puc to revisit how it is calculated item 18 that the number one is our largest impact and it is one of the sensitivities that we evaluated a price change and so we also modified our sensitivities analysis from november 10th ill talk about that just a minute the fact when you look at the bottom you only see one number circled thats our new financial observed to fund our reserves but no longer agriculture to have the stabilization reserve within the target this is an important change to note the kind of action that pg e took with the change in that rate element as i say the kind of action we performed a Sensitivity Analysis the reserve was to help us weather our way through changes like that without a reserve no longer have a cushion to weather on effect like that this is the importance have lost the rate stability reserve those are projections they assume that pg e request is grant by the california puc and whole so it sort of the 1 30 i dont want to sound like im running on the brake but part of the exercise to test our Program Design and method of deploying stuff like that so holed up to the goals the Financial Stability of the program. Oh, i see i didnt quite go through all the animations there but theres all the numbers now so i mentioned the Sensitivity Analysis it is Sensitivity Analysis that was presented on the 10 it was conducted on the key risks of the pg e regulatory Hidden Valley high school the left pg e changes and the revised sensitivities using the new information so basically, if the cu puc adapts it the program realize the risk and then prior to launch and as i mentioned without the ability to use you know were this to occur we wont have the cushion the rate go stabilization to weather through this is a thin margin business as weve talked about tonsillitis tenth we are that projecting an 8 percent margin and now what we are looking 6. 5 our small margin you know it has become smaller i want to emphasize that all the Business Plan and Risk Assessment materials are based on reasonable assumptions some Key Assumptions will become more clear and settled after january 1st importantly the pg e generations and exit fee will be gotten e known and the Electrical Supply costs known and meanwhile well have to continue to plan and prepare and to address this new information were making proposals to change proposed changes to our adopted best practices so on the tenth we had proposed the general manager having some rate go flexibility within the year were removing that wear i i think were aware that the process the rate making process can be accelerated, the instead of this form of flexibility youll see in the rate setting item 20 on todays agenda there is a Administrative Authority to adjust the rates based on the c pi were replying that and recommending a change on november 10th recommend a 0. 5 rate now a 0. 25 to demonstrate our rates are lower but to provide some small amount of additional revenue and then the larger what more impactful change is the change to the reserve policy to allow the contingency and Rate Stabilization reserve to be funded at a slower pace that will allow us to continue forward with the program but again without that cushion ill refer to as that cushion now, when we get to january and the general manager is faced with looking at what are our costs can we set our rates at are below pg e rates and recover ore operating reserve when were at that moment if it looks like we are going to need to pause we can we can look at pulling some of the levers we have we have talked about the ability to modify the customer mix of it have more commercial customers in the earliest part of program than planned that brings in addition revenue and be able to look at the enrollment area you know were looking at citywide; right . For our initial enrollment and looking at we had initially proposed automatic enrollment ignore part of city and moving on to the central part of city and have more of a mixed of central San Francisco than previously recommended we might want to look at not offering automatic enrollment to customers in the low income care program from the commissions is concerned about the affordability and if were lose that battle once we see what the commission across the street does at the california level you know we might want to make some of those changes to help to buffer the program some also. We pay hetch hetchy. Yes. And then always the possibility we could repay the hetch hetchy loan at a slower pace than modeled that Internal Revenue service us to go back to the board of supervisors to take action the board sets the schedule for repayment. So thats the quick overview on the plan changes im ready to move into the Contract Negotiation if youre ready. May i have find it not surprising but egregious to pull this stunt ill call that that go using the word pause makes everyone a little bit tense whatever we support this and to youre point earlier the cu puc how those charges are calculated and what are you going to do with that money this is the tricks to detail but by the pg e move is disconcerting ill say that through the chair. Commission. A couple off points within the Business Plan and practices ill tell you. Ill give a contract update and the milestones schedule but, yes. 3 things i want to talk about and if so it more appropriate to wait a few minutes let me know one is that in the rip between cca and hetch hetchy we have tried to maintain this as separate operations as soon as possible a couple of areas that line gets crossed one is the loan for the working capital and the presumption there from the fireman succeeds that loan will be repaid so it is a loan as opposed to a gift the larger area hetch hetchy is the credit for the letter of credit that basically back stops the power purchase contracts if we fail to enroll people were in a position to have costs but no revenue the letter of credit stands behind that and makes the Power Providers whole the cost of the letter of credit the annual cost is built into the cca program as i understand. To the full stent the letter of credit 40. 01 of the things i asked the few minutes ago folks to basically do a stress test given the 10 year plan what were the impact of that date and i think it would be important for finance staff to present the results of that and the other two things in terms of one is longterm and one short term the short term issue we have talked about making go solar an over and over are cca and i was a and other hetch hetchy customers the redevelopment areas that is not in here it is something that as we contemplate the marketing the program any grove we can have makes the program for interesting to folks that are not arent you can keep an eye on the dollars i felt strongly if i dont see the utility purpose of us funding a program for other peoples customers so that is the one and the second one is the criteria for scaling beyond the rollout the 50 millions and now going to the next increment what is the thought process in under the criteria for saying yes, were ready whats is definition of success that says we have met the criteria the letters are funded whatever else the Customer Base. I think that is the key is the operating reserves are funded. Okay. As you look at the phasing plan as it is laid out in the Business Plan thats the threshold that had to think be met before the next set of customers could be brought on. Part of the rebate that is important as you go to the next phase that which you have reserves and the demands for reserves gets bigger. Youre immediately out of guidance as soon as you bring on the new customers. You need to think that through having the level of reserve enough what is the way to think about that and the letter of credits how were dealing with the back letters of credit dpaing with an expanded letter of concreting credit or some other thinking that needs to go into that in your presentation the material provides to the commission and in the Business Plan a section that talks about scaling or the phasing policy and i think that is a good start i think that could be more explicit that is something ill ask we do as a we go forward the short time the products that included go solar and little letter of credit exercises. So maybe ill talk about the go solar we had an opportunity to talk about that the mayor feels that go solar is a program hes persuade proud of it creates a lot of jobs and is for everyone to have a conversation which we talked about of having go solar really tie into our customers i think with her talking about that we were talking about the power enterprise customers and so at this time we thought cca would be part of power customers that make sense but given the fact a separate enterprise you you know we talked about it like you know if you are making the go solar that is funded by hetch hetchy executive for cca youre loaning money for go solar the fact that cca should find its own Solar Program it gets complicated the other thing i want to put that out there if were going to do the phase one only a subset of folks that will be offered go solar because we have not yielded rolled it out to the city probable a longer conversation how we should think about it but something i totally agree we should offer something especially, if we are doing go solar to the pg e customers he totally get that and we need to think about you know how do we use the go solar from hetch hetchy and apply to cca because theyre not the same enterprise i dont know if you understand autopsy the different enterprise argument ill have more sympathy with hetch hetchy the fact that those things cross and hetch hetchy has skin in the game as well. I see. I do. And yeah. My main concern i want to make this a product that people want to buy and joking with one of you earlier that in mire household the ulcer asterisk argument will sell my wife shes there because its the right thing to do how did does it pencil out if there is a program in there that gives a financial benefit for participating in the program then youve got both part of my household that works i think that is important more than a consideration in the city it is important we have that kind of especially, when penguin by every action theyre making it harder to be a solar customer thats one way to differentiate ourselves from pg e theyre the people that want to make that harder and were the people that want to make that easier who do you want to belong to you recognize the problems youve expressed i would very much encourage and not sure love to put it in the resolution here somehow that the go Solar Program be focused on hetch hetchy customers inclusive if that mathematics the go solar the Clean Power Program great the more people the marketing the better and make that an economic interest to have the program succeed as well im looking for what the trigger to pull on that and obviously the rest of the commission. The go solar for hetch hetchy or cca customers. Well, ill say for hetch hetchy it is a hetch hetchy program if you are a customer of ours in Hunters Point or Treasure Island Treasure Island might be tricky but if youre a customer of ours have the program and pg e you might want to think about becoming a customer of ours. Which means the cca customer. Right. If you can comment on the fact were only doing a small part of the city for a couple of years. I dont know that work outs i recognize that is an issue if the solution no longer exclusive but have something exclusive. I want to put that out there if we were to incentivize if youre a cca customer that we make solar for affordable if you were a pg e customer would that will something you may wanted to look at . Isnt that the idea. I mean. Youre saying i think you careful crafted that language to the distinction im not sure what it is laughter . If it is clear as i contemplate putting solar panels will i be better as a cracking Customer Service customer then im interested. What im saying so were all clear our saying if you are a pg e customer go solar doesnt apply and cca it applies im saying if you go solar it prices but cca you get a bigger contribution to advise you that way so im saying to make it go away for the entire city. Im listen to anything but not in the position if i can stay with pg e and get a similar benefit then i think what it is salt in the wound no reason to provide that benefit to people that are our customers not consistent with our utility customers. So eric do you want to i think commissioner courtney you want to hold off. I think the tone the last 20 minutes is absent down we kind of anticipated most of that stuff we knew we were going to have turbulence and more. Yes. Okay. So no no more tush lens then we got out the door. Just to be clear. I appreciate that i think we have known it was going to be turbulence and keep our eyes open and not leaving opportunities for unturned in possible and so lets finish the presentation and then come up with to answer youre question about the letter of Credit Commission kwh when eric comes up to present well have the backstop anothers financial consequences. Looking at the Contract Negotiations we are continuing to negotiate with our pool were making Good Progress you see on the screen here the full pool is represented by the logos are good options for folks in active and the blue circles active negotiation with and have outstanding issues with those pools of suppliers credit and collateral requirements that the contractor supplies us with we provide them rather as one of the issues the bids option one folks were righting the details how to do scheduling and requirements and have city contract language that is troubling for example, the controllers certification of funds for the bid option two folks those are the specified solar and wind projects theyre the outstanding issues are you know performance assurance i know we have some construction still under law will they be able to deliver on the date we need them and the credit and collateral issues assuming we resolve the issues krabts will be ready for execution by december 18th that starts to get us into the milestone schedule let me flip to that. The boards action on the contract will be complete by tomorrow hopefully then the mayor has a 10 days to address the legislation or not so between the 18 and 28 the general manager will be able to execute the general contract and move to the first of the year where well learn what pg e 2016 will be both the pc i a and the rate itself and get our suppliers best and final offers will come 70 percent of cost really matters what those folks tells you theyll sell the power to us for assuming the Commission Adopts 18, 1 and 20 well move through the milestones and launch the program specifically staff will test the program against the new pg e rates into jen and p cia from the costs including the operating reserves within 3 years of launch can be recovered from Program Rates that are 0. 25 blow pg e rates the gm will go execute the confirmation and initiate the process for Program Launch well come back and report what happens on the 12 youre First Commission meeting in january so you know weve been talking about those unknowns that will suddenly become known i think i want to emphasize that is this furthermore offramp we have the offramps that is you know money tests and seeing if we can where i know the program in under pg e rates and recovery the funding operating reserves make that target under those items before you the general manager will have the authority to begin the launch with that, now have the Business Plan Risk Assessment update and overview ill be happy to answer any questions or morph ton moving on on to hearing the motion for 18 and 19 are ready for you 20 is not so do you want to hear 20 before vote on 18 and 19 fwls no. I think he wants to yeah. Yeah. 20 and do a presentation 20 on 20. Lets have the slides please i have two pregnancy for you financier relates to the public hearing regarding not to exceed for the Clean Power Program im holy this sheds lights on the p cia discussion weve been having so on the agenda for this presentation i want to give you a little bit of background to talk about the rated methodologies and youve approved in may talk about cleanpowersf rates and is requested actions of this particular item that are to approve the initial rates and second to offer an adjustment based on january pg e rates and the administrative adjustment by the general manager and to approve the methods for future annual rates that pg E Barbara Hale talked about but before we get into the nittygritty details i thought to step back and look at the methodologies that general manager kelly a methodology and basic structure you adopted in may, may 12th is basically says that you start with the pg e generation rate and make a couple of deductions one through the price excessiveness reduction of half percent which is an item i think that hal talked about it to lore to a quarter of a percent and the pass through charges the p cia the power charge and the surcharge to calculate the pg e power rates so essentially we need to offer a discount equal to have rate parities with the pg e so we have some kind of the next two slides provide a little bit of numbers behind the discussion were having those numbers relate to the pg e current rates not werent to projected january 2016 rates this first slide is a summary of the current pg e Residential Service rate and as you can see it is broke down into two components the generation rate and then a rate that represents a lot of things contribution and distribution a number of adjustments and credits and the generate rate for this classify of customer is 9 point 75 cents all the other rates are 0. 05 a total of 0. 15 just under 0. 15 kilowatt hours as a percentage 9 total rates as you can see the general rate is 2 3rds of the generate and all the other stuff but what were talking about is the jen rate the basis for the rate so, now less looking at the pass through charges. Wait so can you go back one slide to understand so that i know youre about to unpack the other rights the t n d stays the same. The same as we developing generations we start with the pg e generate. And the t n d. The same on everybodys bill. How much is the 5. 1. It is all. All of it okay. So your next slide youll go to you thought turn up going to do go to the other. This is not unpacking the other it is slightly confusing sorry about that now were talking about the nonrestricted bypassable charges the pass through that are only las vegas i didnt do on pg e the franchisee fee. In addition. Yeah. This is how we develop the discount to offer our customers for price disparity this is the existing numbers for p cia and the franchisee fees for you know Residential Service e1 and as you can see the p. I. P cia is point one. 6 and the other is under of. 78 percent pass through charges are 1, 2, 3, 4 chents that is equal to the generate so we have to offer a discount of. 2. 5 to be below pg e this is the existing p cia now the permanent ma on november 10th was based on projections of an increase in the p cia of 70 percent we were looking at instead of one. 6, one. 98 an increase of 70 percent and we thought that was the e vaunt now if were not successful the by cia theyre talking about for this class of services 2 point 32 cents an increase of just under 100 percent so, now the discount is looking more like 24 percent as you can see how this regulatory maneuvering has such an impact on our margin it is dramatic and see what pg e put together eroded the preservation recur with one regulatory mirror this is inside bans the p. I. P cia is by customer and vantage so people that opt out have a difference by cia they have different vantage so each customer has a different p cia potentially any questions about the methodologies . Do you understand that. Kind of understand that i just you know the notion that the p cia is variable is harder get our heads around. It is an impact to margin historically not changed this much over time a penny and penny and penny. Are there certain clarification like commercial for example, not this great of an impact. You can look at the exhibit to the item it has the p kay for every customer class and type i dont know the answer to that. Im going to plan b i dont know the pause notion i like the plan b option in indeed an exit you know if this went through you can an variable a certain class it make sense because of the customer type of. I think; right . I dont have an answer to that maybe hale has that or certainly we can come back. If thats an option we need to come back to that i dont know if we need an answer. Well verify i think theyre all impacted some more than other but i think that is large overall and just kind of varies per customer look at which one will be you know best suited for us to move forward as we really it out thats why we want to kind of see in the 17 is when the california puc would make their recommendations but it will be a while in john a. January you see the actual rates they will actually see the rates which we will see the rates from pg e based on the california puc decisions go in december. Im curious to know what justification pg e has for doubling the effect of this rate. What justification. Its call cca. Barbara hale manager for power the way the p cia methodology works as market wholly market for electrical go down pg e what theyve committed to purchase for their customers is more out of market could be higher than p than the market price the p cia will capture that price when we see the prices go down we expect the pg e to allow to go up. Now that assumes that penguin takes no mitigation action to keep the cost of competitive you know we know that contracts are struck that have out clauses that allow parties to walk away has pg e exercised theyre built to walk away at every opportunity were not allowed to see those contracts the puc puts those contracts under seal we cant check how the p cia is calculated we cant see the underlying contracts but the general idea market prices go down and pg e is out of market above the market cost if this difference in priced between portfolio the p cia will cover the cellist rates costs are sharing the costs among fewer and fewer folks leave as they join programs like ours. Quite and deal. A monopoly. So any other questions about the methodology. Lets turn now to cleanpowersf rate action so various entities can we have the slides please a bit of rate relayed activity over the past year on april 17th reviews the methodologies without the discount with the rate fairness board they deemed it fair and held a public hearing on live cleanpowersf rates with no additional discounts you authorized the gm to justify initial rates on the pg e and established the future adjustments motion assisting you requested to review the exterminates cost prior to the opt out process thats what we are doing right now. Of course setting clean power rates and charges abides by the policies and procedures we conform with in setting our other charges first and foremost with the rate policy weve discussed earlier today which establishes privileges of transparency and wed follow the standard procedures for rates setting contained in the charter and state law and also as with our existing retails rates a provision for an administrative adjustment annually to adjust the p cia if not sufficient then a more rate setting process. So here is the performer a theyve provided an update of the performer that we presented on november 10th so just to reiterate it contains the new projected january 16th generates and p cia it contains the additional 4 million hetch hetchy loan, and it contains an updated refresh of power supply costs from the providers what you see here you know sources and resources match the ability to fund the reserve ways we kicked in the 4 million from the handful power enterprise and on a delay basis an ability for contingency reserve as hale showed the movement from pg e on the p cia was a significant downward impact any questions on that performer a so look at the performer a here a slight improvement if 9 consumes of the requires or reserve before 600,000 over the total period from that from lowering that discount but i would point out that just about all of this this sources and uses that performa reflects the power enterprise to run the process a much better sense the cost of program than in may when you took action thats why were here with that information. As i mentioned earlier exhibit one to this item contains a complete schedule based on the generates and the methodologies using the existing p cia and franchisee surcharge and this is just a representation of some of the major of our products with the major the green product with the residential rates the small commercial rate, the super green 0. 02 more than the green product and summer, winter rates for the smaller customers and offpeak and other rates and charges so, now we always show when we present rates and charges what a customer might look like a comparison of all of the items that are electric utility bill and highlighted the ones that change between a penguin and clean power customer in green and so you see the generate and the jen bill amount on the top line the pg e charge for the clean power and the sfgh on the left the pg e customer but a p cia in the middle you see the pg e customer that has the higher jen rate with no franchisee fee and the different way see is that for that is a modest difference a low use 0. 11 diffuse on a 1 generate bill that is kwaulth actuate to half a billion were not talking about a lot of money but