11th hour you tuuturn bit president hours before the raids were set to begin and at least ten u. S. Cities, the president tweeting yesterday afternoon that at the request of democrats, hes delaying the mass arrests. However, President Trump threatened to start deportations again in two weeks if democrats do not agree to change the countrys asylum laws. The looming mass roundup of around 2,000 families threatened to separate children born in the u. S. From their undocumented parents. Also on the line, more than 4 billion in new funding. Congress was inching closer to approving to alleviate the dire humanitarian crisis at the border. What prompted the president to pivot on a central policy thats integral to his Reelection Campaign . Two Homeland Security officials are saying the raids were called off in large part because details of the plan had been leaked to the media and also because i. C. E. Did not have enough detention space. The president s latest attempt to pressure his opponents to concede to his immigration demands frightened immigration communities around the country. Right now, children are still living with the possibility of being separated from their parents in just two weeks. Parents are considering who is going to look after their children if they get arrested. Its a frustration expressed by many activists and democrats running for president. The fear so big in those communities that people are afraid to come out of their homes. People with american spouses, american children. Its tearing apart families, its hurting people. We have parents afraid to take their children to the pediatrician because if they go out of their home and if they go into a hospital or a clinic, they may be picked up and arrested. This president uses the threat of whether i. C. E. Raids are Citizenship Question on the census as a way to terrify immigrant families. To keep people from fully participating in american life. This is his [ bleep ] politics. People need to see through that and understand that this guy is a political con man. Nbcs mike veiqueira at the white house for us. Good morning, jo. Its a big mystery in many respects. Yesterday the president left the white house on his way to camp david. He stopped to talk to reporters for 20 minutes and at that point the raids were on. The president was talking about the need for them. A couple of minutes later, the retweet. At the request of democrats ive delayed the removal process, deportation for two weeks to see if the democrats and republicans can get together and work out a solution to the asylum and loophole problems at the southern border. If not, deportations start. First of all, a slim chance as you reported that theres going to be any kind of agreement whatsoever. This all started when the president last monday night tweeted that millionsas he put, the deeportation millions. That left people scram toblg tell the media and public what they needed to know without telling them too much. Lo and behold, one of the reasons we heard that the raids were called off, because too many details had leaked to the press. Also, they didnt have a place to put these 2,000 family members, to put them temporarily before they were deported. The acting head of i. C. E. , the immigration and Customs Enforcement bureau, mark morgan, gave this rationale to fox news. Im always hopeful, but i absolutely remain a healthy skeptic. Judge, let me assure the American People, the president is absolutely committed to enforcing the rule of law, maintaining the integrity of this system. I assure you, ive got the green light to anyone thats here, here in violation of federal immigration law, i have the authority and the support to go after thema ply consequences and remove them. Were going after individuals and removing them every day. So this was not anything new. Its just not about the numbers. Its also said in the message. We need to continue to do enforcement against here illegally, including families, because we do that, i promise American People we start removing people they have final orders, including familiar lirks the numbers will go down and the crisis will be positively impacted. Theres two major Things Congress can fix. The settlement agreement, which if youre a family and youre a kid, youre released. We need to fix that. Congress needs to help us fix that. Right now, thats what happens. What we do is we dont just release them. We do put ankle bracelets on them. Okay. Jo, to review. Talking tough is mark morgan. Very slim chance theres a legislative agreement or solution over the course of the next two weeks. Nancy pelosi, let it be known she called President Trump on friday and urged him to back off. Lo and behold, thats what happened, at least temporarily. Jo . Mike viqueira at the white house. Thank you so much. Joining me now National Political reporter and david mark with the washington examiner. Guys, lets take a look at the big picture here. Youve got two major reversals from the president in 48 hours. Youve got the plan to strike iran. That reverse and now the immigration raids. Thats been a uturn. Not to mention the president reversed his threat on the tariffs to mexico. Jonathan, is the president able to handle a crisis here . I think there are democrats all over the country wondering if they can can get him to reverse his decision to run for reelection. That seems unlikely. Definitely unlikely. In terms of the question of handling a crisis, with regard to immigration the plan to round up 2,000 people and deport them as youve heard mark morgan from ree i. C. E. Just say. 2,000 people is not a lot. Its a lot for the 2,000 people and their families, obviously. But the president talked about deporting a million people. Were sitting im sitting in washington, d. C. Next to the Homeland Security department. I think people were laughing at the idea that they would deport a million people. I think theyre looking for optics and trying to send a message to potential immigrants and theyre also trying to send a message to people who support the president that he is deporting people and what theyre not getting and they wanted was a message from the border that was good for him politically. Rounding up folks from i. C. E. And getting video of that cities across america will send a message to the people who support President Trump that hes doing what he can to deport people who have been ordered to be deported. 2,000 a relatively small number but the political optics of that, the message to his base is much bigger. The president is trying to extract those concessions from the democrats on change ago asylum laws. David, first thing i want to ask you, do we know exactly what the president wants to change this terms of the asylum laws in terms of what is feasible here. Secondly, has the president undermined congressional efforts to before the july 4th recess . In a way, it was a shrewd move by President Trump, as was noted in the prior orpt, the news leaked. When youre going to have i. C. E. Raids, you dont usually give out that information, particularly ten cities. The president was trying to put some of this on democrats. Fair or not. Whether or not a deal could be reached, thats an open question. Both sides are so far apart from each other. What the Trump Administration wants is a broad rewrite of immigration laws generally, including what they call the lottery, what they refer to as chain migration. Other issues, democrats want no part of that. Its hard to see them coming together. It is interesting that the president spoke with Speaker Pelosi on friday night and that may have had some effect. All right. So house Speaker Pelosi has this call with the president on friday night. He urges she urges him to try to cancel the raids and then she publicly goes out and urges him to do the same thing. Jonathan, are we looking at a new chapter in relationship between pelosi and trump here . How much i am dpampact did she r this delay. I think he wanted to put this on democrats, to the extent there might be disappointment politically in his base. Hed like to put that on the democrats. I think on the part of nancy pelosi, any time she sees the president do something, take some sort of step, have a behavior that she believes is the right one, shes going to encourage him to do it. I dont think youve seen her in the past look at something hes done that she thinks is the right thing to do and have her criticize him for it. Okay. Fair enough. Lets talk about the president on iran here. Hes saying that more sanctioning will be imposed on iran tomorrow. This week. Hes also going to the g20 summit and meet president jinping. What will that play in the role between the u. S. s relationship with china and also japan. Let talk about that. Could they play a role in influencing President Trump on iran as well . Were looking at Major Oil Price issues here. Its interesting. Japan has a lot of investment this is iran, particularly the oil sector. Of late, the president and Prime Minister abe of japan have made nice. The president was just there. Maybe theres something going on behind the scenes. This is an area where his base may want to see retaliatory action for the shooting of the missile drone. This may look like the administration is doing something about the iranian attack but not using military force. Thats the thing. It seems like theyre putting economic pressure on iran to force them to negotiate a tougher nuclear deal than the one under the obama addm. Hasnt President Trump made this type of deal harder . . I think in a lot of ways that story is yet to be told, right . Iran is obviously reacting to the squeezing of its economy. Yet, its still able to get oil revenue. Its not like theres a naval blockade on iran or anything like that. Theyre able to operate in the world when the United States aliened its allies that theres not an effort to rein iran n if you look at those who signed off on the nuclear deal, theyre angry at us for breaking that apart or trying to break it apart. Not angry at iran for breaking its part of the pledge or angry at us. If you look at japan, it was their tanker attacked and theyre not concluding that iran was responsible for that. The United States would love for japan, its ally to come out and say this was a we want retaliation and japan is not doing that. I think the United States is isolated right now and makes it more difficult to put the kind of pressure that the president would like to put on iran so you dont have to use mill tariff force to get the capitulation he wants on other issues. National security adviser met in jerusalem with israeli Prime Minister benjamin netanyahu. He spoke surrounding Nuclear Ambitions saying this comes as obviously, this is something we just learned. The president wanted to disable missiles. Another thing i want to adhere, you see bolton coming out and saying iran should not is make prudence and u. S. Discretion for weakness. What do you say about that . This is Old School Tactics used against the Iranian Regime in the past. Used by the obama team and the Push Administration going back a decade to take on iran in military ways. Go after the computer programs. Sometimes scientists, that goes back a ways. This is a way of getting around, again, that military action which the president seems loath to take at this point. David mark, jonathan allen, thank you both so much for getting up early with us this morning. Thanks. Jo, youre doing a great job up there. Thanks. What you missed from the South Carolina Democratic Convention. A mashup of all the candidates coming up. The leading luxury suv of all time. Lease the 2019 rx 350 for 399 month for 36 months. Experience amazing at your lexus dealer. Its tough to quit smoking cold turkey. So chantix can help you quit slow turkey. Along with support, chantix is proven to help you quit. With chantix, you can keep smoking at first and ease into quitting. Chantix reduces the urge so when the day arrives, youll be more ready to kiss cigarettes goodbye. When you try to quit smoking, with or without chantix, you may have nicotine withdrawal symptoms. 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Meanwhile, President Trump is waking up at camp david this morning having spent a day mulling further sanctions against iran and on how to avoid another military provocation. Chief Foreign Correspondent Richard Engel has the latest from doha. The u. S. And iran pulling back from the brink of war and for showing restraint by only targeting an unmanned drone not a manned u. S. Military aircraft. They had it in their sights and they didnt shoot it down. They were wise to do that. The New York Times reports all president president s top advisers wanted a strike, including National Security adviser and iran hawk john bolton. Everybody was saying im a warmonger. And now they say im a dove. And i think im neither, you want to know the truth. Im a man with common sense. Now, diplomacy, the u. S. Envoy to iran said the administration wants to force iran to the negotiating table. Were going to increase our sanctions on iran, were going to continue with this foreign policy. The president on twitter giving a timetable, writing we are putting major additional sanctioning on iran on monday. But tightening sanctions is what caused iran to lash out in the first place. Reporter the biggest hope for a diplomatic breakthrough could come in japan next week at the g20. China in particular, which is highly dependent on oil from here in the persian gulf is likely to be pushing both sides to deescalate. I dont . Richard engel, thank you so much. Top lines. Hear from every sing candidate from the weekends Democratic Convention down in South Carolina. This is the story of john smith. Not this john smith. Or this john smith. Or any of the other hundreds of john smiths that are humana Medicare Advantage members. No, its this john smith. Who we paired with a humana team member to help address his own specific health needs. At humana, we take a personal approach to your health, to provide care thats just as unique as you are. No matter what your name is. 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Ow and protect your wealth. son nooooo. avo quick, the quicker picker upper bounty picks up messes quicker and is 2x more absorbent. Bounty, the quicker picker upper. Were going to dig into the escalating tensions. Bobby ghosh is joining me from bloomberg, a member of the editorial board. Bobby, thanks for joining us. What do you think . Is there going to be a diplomatic breakthrough at the g20 next week and World Leaders convince either side to step back and reassess . Well, the iranians are not going to be theyre the people who need to be persuaded. Trump, pompeo have said several times in the last couple of weeks, theyre open to negotiation, open to negotiations without preconditions, but the iranians made it clear they do not want to negotiate with trump. Theyre waiting and hoping that he loses the next election. They want him to sit out and wait it out. The Prime Minister of japan went to tehran with an offer to negotiate, with an offer to mediate. He was humiliated by the leader of iran and came away empty handed. Over and over again, the iranians made it clear theyre not open to negotiations. They do not trust this administration and it sounds like theyll wait for the next one. Im not expecting a breakthrough. One of your fellow columnists says the president is ordering military strikes with a lame duck acting military of defense and acting air force secretary. Hes handed key decisions over to a National Security adviser who he regularly badmouthed publicly. Is he right . Does the president lack a plan here . Oh, he lacks a plan, he lacks the people. Theres an absolute i mean, if you can imagine the worst way to try and drift into a war, this is the way to do t you dont have the right people in the right positions. The president has not articulated what he wants from the iranians. He keeps moving the bar on that one. So, yeah, he has this is clearly a series of actions without a larger plan. Perhaps, thats something the president might useful to in osaka next week where he can articulate what it is that he wants from iran. I think americas allies are waiting to hear that as well as americas forces and the iranians themselves. Is it just about nukes . Is it irans bad haver because their owe behavior because the what do they want in order to lift the sanctions . Hes not ever really stated that clearly. Bobby, you say in your june 21st article on bloomberg that hes winning already in a sense. You advised president to hold his nerve, keep his patience and let iran dig itself into deeper hole. Do you think that the president of the United States is capable of that . He is never demonstrated that capacity. Look, there are different ways to deal with geopolitical problems. Hes chosen sanctions as the way he wants to do this. Okay. If you choose sanctions, sanctions dont work in a few months, might not even work in a couple of years. It takes time for sanctions to have an effect. It took decades for the soviet union to succumb by the pressure from american sanctions. The cubans never fully did. It takes a lot of time to weaken a regime to the point theyre willing to come to the negotiation table. If the president is not willing to take that time, not willing to hold his nerve and be patient, he should look for another way out. Sanctions wont be done in a matter of weeks or months. The sanctions will not yield what the president wants assuming he knows what it is he wants. The sanctions will not yield that in time for the next election cycle. Perhaps not even in time for the election cycle after that. So having chosen this particular form of pressure on the iranians my argument is he should give it time to work or pick another form. Thats interesting. Because a lot of americans are wondering how major these sanctions will be and even though they may not go into effect and yield the results youre talking about here, the very action of them might be enough to play to his base. What do you think . Well, yes. Hes been playing to his base with regard to iran from the beginning. He put iran on the list of countries from which people are not allowed to travel to the u. S. The muslim ban was he tore up the nuclear deal that the iranians struck with the Obama Administration and several other world powers. Tos extent that his base cares, im honestly, a little skeptical about that. But to the extent that his base does care specifically about iran, hes done plenty for his base. I dont think he needs certainly his base would, i think, go the other way if he brought the United States into military conflict with iran. Theres plenty of polling, plenty of anecdotal evidence that even his base does not want that. That might explain why last week he brought us to the edge of a military strike with the iranians, scrambled the jets and brought them back. That was because, as he says, somebody told him innocent iranians would die at the other end of the bombs or that his base would not be satisfied or happy with a military strike on iran. Its hard to know. His base, i dont think, is pressing him for more action on iran. One last question i want to ask you before i let you go. President trump suggested that the drone may have been a mistake. By an overzealous actor. Do you think theres a back communication line open . Do you think that line is open and effective . Well, there are several lines of communication to iran. There are all kinds of countries that stepped up that have communications with iran that stepped up and offered to play that role, the iraqis, the ohman is. Can you wait kuwaitis. Dont forget, the president of the United States, his primary form of communications is on twitter. Oh, yeah. All the iranians need to do is follow his twitter account. Of course, thats the problem. He doesnt seem to know what it is he want. Its not a problem of getting the melsage to the iranians. Its a problem of first figuring out what the message is. Until the president does that, until his administration does that, there are too many voices saying different things. Pompeo says no conditions. Then bolton says with conditions. We warned you. We wont start until theyre met. The president has to cut through all of this confusion and state his line clearly. Bobby ghosh, pointing out the most open line of communication is the president s twitter feed. Thank you so much for joining us. We appreciate it. Any time. Now to an up tate on the war crimes trial of a navy s. E. A. L. After the shocking confession this week by another seal that he was the one who killed an isis prisoner in iraq. The family of the man spoke about that in an interview with steve patterson. At the center of a war crimes trial spiraling with twists and turns, the family of deck ated navy s. E. A. L. Chief is speaking out. Their testimony on the stand, i think, reveals exactly what my husband was saying all along is true. They are cowards, they are liars. Gallagher faces multiple charges from a tour of duty in iraq. Including the murder of an unmanned isis detainee. He stabbed a man in the neck. But this week, a bombshell. The prosecutors own key witness, cory scott, who was granted immunity, admitting to a stunned courtroom that it was he, not gallagher who killed the prisoner. I always knew that my husband was not guilty of murder. But to hear that testimony from him, i was honestly, i couldnt process it. I felt so relieved that at least one of these individuals had a conscience check. Despite the confession, prosecutors say they will not drop premeditated murder charges against gallagher saying the credibility of a witness is for the jury to decide. But his wife says the prosecutions case is unraveling. I never would have dreamed that this case would have fallen apart the way it has. I feel lining were winning this. It drew the attention of President Trump hinting a a pardon if gallagher is convicted. Gallaghers brother shawna plauding the support. He looked at his military and saw a travesty of justice happening. Testimony expected to wrap up early next week. The jury will decide whether he walks home free with his family. Steve patterson, nbc news, san diego. A big weekend for the 2020 candidates. Nearly all of them made pitches to voters in South Carolina as they took the stainige for the Democratic Convention. Heres what each one had to say. We need somebody who as president of the United States understands the need to rebuild the party. We need washington to look more like our best cities and towns instead of the other way around. Were fighting to uphold the values our leaders have abandoned. Were fighting for who we are. Donald trump started the riot and Lindsey Graham and Mitch Mcconnell are the looters. Although the republicans dont walk their talk, the democrats are not that good at talking their walk. We automated away 4 Million Manufacturing jobs. We take advantage of, i would say free labor. For many i am dprants. But this country dont penalize corporations for hiring illegal labor. The lack of investments in our schools and health are a direct result of us not having a robust middle class. We defeat trump by running a campaign of energy and enthusiasm that substantially grows. Restore the Voting Rights act to include sameday Voter Registration all across this country. We can cancel Student Loan Debt for 95 of the folks who have got it. Invest in Affordable Housing because the rent is going through the roof in too many communities, not only the big cities but the smaller towns. A responsible nation would have created a universal Health Care System a long time ago. Youve got the nra on the run. When im president , well keep them on the run across the United States of america. We will not have the resources unless we deal with the central issue. The cost of war. I have a plan for the first 100 days, over 100 things you can do without mch mcconnell, without the republican. I am never going to be polite when Republican Party is attacking our constitutional rights. Wall street did not build america. You built america. Average people given a chance built america. Theres plenty of money in this world. Theres plenty of money in this country. Its just in the wrong hands. Whether you just got here and youre at the u. S. mexico border or whether youre here in South Carolina, that your story is part of the american story. Our basic american compact says the people had a right to be safe, unafraid and secure in their communities. Beating donald trump is the floor, not the ceiling. Beating donald trump gets us out of the valley, but it does not get us to the mountaintop. Maryan williamson is one of the democrats candidates that attended the convention yesterday. Shell be joining us here next hour on msnbc live. We remind you, of course, you can watch the first democratic president ial debate on wednesday and thursday of this week at 9 00 eastern here on msnbc. A closer look at congresswoman tulsa i gabbert and her big idea as she runs for president. Thats next. Fisher investments tailors portfolios to your goals and needs. Some only call when they have something to sell. Fisher calls regularly so you stay informed. And while some advisors are happy to earn commissions whether you do well or not. Fisher investments fees are structured so we do better when you do better. Maybe thats why most of our clients come from other money managers. Fisher investments. Clearly better money management. Well, heres to first dates you look amazing. And you look amazingly comfortable. When your vneck looks more like a uneck. Thats when you know, its halfwashed. 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It was an instant savings and i should have changed a long time ago. It was funny because when we would call another insurance company, hey would say oh we cant beat usaa were the webber family. Were the tenneys were the hayles, and were usaa members for life. Get your usaa Auto Insurance quote today. Now to your morning headlines. No confirmation from the white house this morning about a personal letter from President Trump to north Korean Leader kim jongun. According to a news agency, kim seen right there on your screen, is apparently reading this letter and is said to be satisfied with the, quote, excellent content and seriously contemplating it there. Nuclear talks stalled since the summit in vietnam between the two leaders. We have new daylight video of the deadly plane crash in oahu. Faa officials confirming there were 11 victims in saturdays accident. Investigators say the aircraft went down shortly after takeoff and there are reports that it nosedived bursting into flames on impact. Some scary moments at a Balloon Festival in missouri when a balloon made a hard landing on to a crowded field. No word what caused the pilot to lose control. Several people were injured but none seriously when it careened into the onlookers. Scary video there. In the latest real clear politics average of polls, Tulsi Gabbard garners a third of 1 . The congresswoman from hawaii is like the one she sard with harry smith in his series, my big idea. Whats your big idea . My big idea is to bring peace and prosperity to this country by ending these wasteful regime change wars. In a crowded democratic field, Tulsi Gabbard stands out. The hawaiian congresswoman is pal indonesian, born in american sa samoa. Shes an iraq war veteran. We met her on the mall in washington, d. C. People may not know that youve been in the reserves for years, that you did two tours of duty in the middle east. How did that shape your views visavis what youre talking about now . Immensely. Every single day i was confro confronted with the high human cost of war. Gabbard wants to end u. S. Overseas efforts at regime change. For instance, she opposes the u. S. Arming of syrian rebels. She wants to put more money toward health care, a Green Economy and social programs by clawing back trillions of dollars from defense spending. Im just imagining the pushback from all the lobbyists and all the industries that are out there that benefit from the amount of money that we spend on defense. How are you going to tame that pushback . The power of our democracy and the American People standing up saying were sick and tired of the military Industrial Complex and selfserving politicians in washington who have beating these war drum for so long. Theyre not the ones paying the price. We are. Aloha, peace and prosperity. Thats Tulsi Gabbards big idea. Harry smith, nbc news, washington. A New York Times report says joe biden is viewed by many black voters as the play it safe choice who could best recreate the obama coalition. Will that remain so in light of last weeks remarks about segregationist senators . Thats ahead. And more time loving every room, even the ones you never thought could look good. You get great deals on the things you need and actually want. You get fast and Free Shipping on thousands of items and finds for every home, and every style, at every price. Thats what you get when youve got wayfair. So shop now here are even more reasons to join tmobile. 1. Do you like netflix . Sure you do. Thats why its on us. 2. Unlimited data. Use as much as you want, when you want. 3. No surprises on your bill. Taxes and fees included. Still think you have a better deal . Bring in your discount, and well match it. Thats right. Tmobile will match your discount. 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Thats 2020 president ial contender cory booker at South Carolinas Democratic Convention. Candidates all making their pitch to voters in the critical early state there. Of course, those other key events like congressman jim clyburns fish fry. Break this down and look at how everyone did. We have radio talk show host Rashad Richie and ned ryan, ceo of american majority. And a former writer for president george w. Bush. Lets start with you. It was a big weekend for the democrats. Whose pitch is getting the most buzz . Nobody. No one moved the needle here. 21 president ial candidates x and each one had seven minutes to talk. Thats exhausting already. I dont think anybody really came out moving the needle one way or the other. I think everyone did good to great. But nobody is changing their minds. Joe biden is still the number one pick in South Carolina. Back in early may and at the end of may, he was polling at 47, 45 . Hes now polling at 37 as of midjune. I dont think thats going to change much. But hes 20 points a he had had of his nearest competitor. Joe biden is the candidate to beat. Its requesti going to be tough to do so in South Carolina. Some played up their fight against the president. Others focusing on their policies and vision for the country. Which way works . What was the best approach from your view . I would say if there was a winner, i would agree there was probably not Much Movement in the polls. It would be Elizabeth Warren. Which still sprieurprises me. Shes sticking to the policies. I disagree with all of her policies. But at least theres a somewhat coherent plan what she would do to be the nominee and run against donald trump. I think thats helping Elizabeth Warren because shes laying out a plan whereas others, im not hearing as clear a message. I will say this about joe biden. He might be the frontrunner now. Were just getting started. The knives are out. Not only were the segregationist remarks, but when theyre going after Hunter Bidens business deals in china and the ukraine while hes Vice President , were going see the fallout from that. Biden has 50 of African American supporters so far. Rashad, aside from the biden factor, is there anyone who didnt do well and who is probably going to struggle i think out of those 21 candidates, you probably have about 10 who are still polling 3 and below. Right. If that continues, those ten need to acquiesce behind another candidate so that this process can continue to move forward. Whats unfortunate about having over 20 people run is that we dont get an opportunity to hear them in true debate fashion. I know we have a debate coming up, but lets be clear, you have five people asking questions and a whole lot of people on the stage. Youre not going to get into the meat or topics like you should. You only get to that place when candidates start dropping out and we hear direct debate happen in these forums. You wont get there with over 20 people running. Ned, we also want to talk about the economy here, my favorite topic, and its one of President Trumps biggest themes. He keeps on harping on how well the market is doing, the economy is doing. So, what are republicans taking notice of and do you think bidens still the best candidate for actually pushing that forward and threatening trump in a Strong Economy . I will say this, first of all, we know from historical trends, if you have an incumbent president running on a Strong Economy, almost virtually impossible to beat the incumbent. So, if the economy continues this way, i think Donald Trumps going to be very hard to beat november of 2020. Again, i just dont see joe biden hes had two previous runs. They have been complete, utter mediocrity when hes been running for president. Fair. I dont think he won any delegat delegates. I have a hard time believing with all of the baggage that joe biden is bringing to the table that he will end up being the nominee, especially as you see the aoc wing of the party really gaining in strength. And having that ability to be kind of the kingmaker in the primaries when joe biden is really a throwback to when the party used to be more moderate. So again, i remain convinced that joe biden will not be the nominee when everythings said and done. Let me insert something quickly. I think its laughable that ned will say, somehow, joe biden has too much baggage to become president of the United States and the country elected trump, who had an unlimited amount of baggage and that baggage is still dumping stuff out every day. So i dont think this is going to come down to baggage. I want to ask you you about that, biden is namedropping obama at this convention in north carolina. Should he keep that up, how far will that actually get him here . He should definitely keep that up in South Carolina. Black people run things in South Carolina as far as the primary is concerned. They make up 60 of the primary process. Also, you have congressman clyburn, who was a huge fan and supporter of barack obama. Hes the guy with the most influence of singular democratic figure in that state. So, if he gets the endorsement of congressman clyburn, you can lock it up for joe biden in South Carolina. All right, ned. So, you also have this explanation from biden. It follows his backandforth with cory booker over the last couple of days. Again, no apology, but he said he didnt intend for it to be taken the way it was. Does that play into bidens future here and those future poll numbers you talk about . I have to tell you, jo, i dont think most people again, they look at the senator eastlins as being racist. But when he was head of the judiciary committee, it was called the civil rights movement. There was a period of history where he killed 121 of 1 22 civil rights bills in judiciary committee. I think when people understand with joe biden touting a relationship with somebody like eastland, id be interested how much it hurts him in the polls. Again, i still think its the business dealings of hunter biden that will hurt him even more. Rashad, what do you think . Totally disagree. I think the biden comments were unfortunate and in my opinion, biden should absolutely apologize. I understand the point he was trying to make. Right plan, wrong man when he decided to connect himself with known, documented racists, that was a mistake. Is it a gamechanger for joe biden . No, because most of the individuals who are supporting joe biden, who happen to be africanamerican or even progressive, are doing it because they believe he makes a better case against trump in a general election. Well, rashad, i want to play you sound of how he responded to this, bidens recent missteps, those comments about segregationists. Heres how he explained those comments to msnbcs reverend al sharpton. I do understand the consequence of the word boy, but it wasnt said in any of that context at all. But you understand no, no, no they would never call me son. They would never call me boy. No, but they called Teddy Kennedy boy. That was the distinction. The reason he called me senator was to demean me more i mean, son, because he said im not even qualified to be in the senate, im not old enough. And to the extent that anybody thought that i meant something different, that is not what i intended. All right, so, does that satisfy voters, that explanation, rashad . Its going satisfy some voters. It may not satisfy all. But as i said, most of the people who are supporting joe biden, theyre not doing it because they feel as if joe biden personifies all of their political ideology, but rather, they feel that he is the best person to beat trump. And right now, a lot of voters are feeling as if this country needs a hard reset, and joe biden presents that option. Its funny, because a hard reset is also going back to parts of the Obama Administration. Ned, i want to wrap up with you. In just a few days, of course, weve got this big debate here on msnbc. The candidates are going to take the stage. Did this weekend give you any hints about what to expect and whos going to survive . Well, i will say this, if it gave me any hints, i would say mayor petes in big trouble. First of all, he didnt show up at the fish fry because of the situation back home. And i dont think he responded very well to the black lives matter activists. So, i think mayor pete this weekend kind of showed me that hes in a little bit of trouble. It might be the beginning of the end for him. But again, these debates are so highly fractured, i dont think much will come out of it unless someone makes a big slipup or gaffe. Rashad, last word . I think the debates will be what they are. Youre not going to have a lot of interaction with the candidates and they basically have to play it safe, so well see what happens in the attack mode coming the next few days. All right, Rashad Richey and ned ryun, thank you both so much. Thank you. Thanks. Just ahead, president ial candidate Marianne Williamson clarifying her remarks about mandated vaccines. Were going to ask her about that and why the reason President Trump called off todays immigration raids is not what he says it is. Is not what he says it is this is a commercial about insurance and i know youre thinking. I dont want to hear about insurance. cause lets be honest. 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