Transcripts For MSNBCW Deadline White House 20200720

Its basically free money. Its an easy way to earn cashback on the stuff im already buying. When you have a child and theyre constantly growing out of clothing, earning cashback from rakuten just makes everything easier. Sometimes its 3 sometimes its 8 but youre always getting cashback. The way cashback works on rakuten is so they get a commission from the store and then they share that commission with me. And you have money, more money to spend because you got both free money. Go to rakuten. Com and sign up today for a 10 bonus. Sixtytwo thousand seven hundred and ten dollars and thirtyone cents. Sofi allowed me to refinance all of my loans to one low Interest Rate and an affordable monthly payment. And i just feel like theres an end in sight now and that my debt doesnt define me anymore. Sofi is helping me get my money right. Sofi is helping me get 49i found you . Good job. Now im gonna stay here and you go hide. Watch your favorites from anywhere in the house with the Xfinity Stream app. Free with your xfinity service. Now any room can be a tv room. Stream live tv, on demand shows and movies even your dvr recordings. Download the Xfinity Stream app today to stream the entertainment you love. Xfinity. The future of awesome. Were going to get to the Portland Story in a minute but first, coronavirus numbers and fears worsen across this country, so do Donald Trumps poll numbers, less than four months until the president ial election, a brandnew abc News Washington post poll shows trump trailing joe biden by a whopping tenpoint margin among likely voters. Trump eight points behind the Presumptive Democratic nominee, trump is warning us just as he did in 2016 he may not accept the official results in november, making one thing many people fear a very real possibility. Here was trump on fox news yesterday on that topic. Are you good a loser . Im not a good loser. I dont like to lose i dont lose too often are you gracious . You dont know until you see. I think mailin voting is going to rig the election, i really do are you suggesting that you might not accept the results of the election i have to see joining our conversation the New York Times chief National Correspondent and msnbc contributor marc leivotic. Its not something that discussed with this white house, there are discussions in the military about what to do if donald trump said out loud comes to pass. Oh, boy yeah, this is one of those categories of things where Donald Tru Donald trump sews chaos into the system, i mean, he did this four years ago and freaked everybody out, freaked Hillary Clinton out on the debate stage and the fact is it never came to pass you know, this is a potentially catastrophic situation that the military certainly doesnt want to deal with this year a lot of the chaos that has characterized this presidency. Lot of it depends on the margin if hes defeated say biden wins by five points in the popular vote and in the Electoral College that will dictate. But look, this is a big uncertainty and its not Donald Trumps job at this point to comfort everyone you know, its not something that you its not his m. O its just so, anita, weve got norm busting and we democracy destroying, i worked for a candidate who won and witnessed the you know cohesive transfer of power and i worked for a candidate that lost and i worked in 2000 on an election where there was no outcome the transfer of power is a hallmark of democracy and we talk a lot about when we stop being america, we stop being a democracy whos sitting saying i dont know if im going to accept the results. He was asked the same question, he did said that he would abide by what the election showed i adopt know if he was just saying that at that time or something changed. According to recent polls he has an idea, aides and advisers who are telling him this does not look good. But still things can change. I found it interesting in that clip you showed, are you a good loser . We saw what hes like when hes lost smaller battles, weve seen what hes like a a lot of people in joe bidens world, what can we do if this does come to fruition . Yeah, i mean, he cant walk down a ramp and take the criticism that he seemed to do so with the grace of a i dont know what. Something else that he injected into the president ial contest, to screen out tests like dementia and alzheimers in the fox poll they asked people whos more competent, whose mind is sounder . Biden beats you at that. Lets take a test right now, lets go down, joe and i will take take the same test that i took incidentally i took the test too how did you do . Its not the hardest test you see, thats all misrepresentation. Thats what was on the web. Anyone in your life with dementia or alzheimers one of the nastiest of all these kind of diseases, this is pretty gutpunching to see donald trump bragging about the first few answers of a test and how they get hard at the end. Its not a math test, its a cognitive test for donald trump to be bragging in getting math questions right is next level lunacy we all kind of laugh it off. What a buffoon, hes bragging about, you know, on results to screen out dementia. Whats really going on here in. Well, i mean, its very its easy to dismiss it and say this is another goofy moment that we have to deal with this president. The fact is, donald trump is in big trouble with older voters, it seems like his number one sort of attack in attacking joe biden he doesnt know where he is, hes essenti ees senile. Obviously is not going to help him with senior voters, these are real and present issues that affect everyone especially if you have aging parents, also more importantly, the group of people that are most likely to vote are seniors in places like florida and arizona, lot of questionable voting, you know, effects if youre donald trump anita, its also hideous politics, i mean, ive been involved in campaigns that have had more bad days than good days but this is what lays underneath the gutter, underneath the gutter, who thinks this is a good idea politically for donald trump . Right, well, theres been so many people that are close to the president that are telling him that the message in the campaign is all over the place, and it is. On coronavirus on law and order on everything hes been talking about and there are a lot of people that think if he goes after joe biden thats when this race is going to sort of clear up and that they have they can come back and they could actually be victorious if they go after joe biden, one thing that well see from now on everything they can think of against joe biden this included, theyre going to go there, because its what they have left at this point. Those other messages on himself havent resonated yet and theyre thinking in this general election they have to go after joe biden. Thats unbelievable thank you both so much for spending some time with us to talk about it all. When we come back those federal Law Enforcement agents, from portland, they may be heading to other cities next r h. At subaru, were taking on distracted driving. With sensors that alert you when your eyes are off the road. The subaru forester. The safest forester ever. Now to portland, oregon, where demonstrators protesting Racial Injustice for almost go months now are clashing with federal Law Enforcement amid reports that theyre being arrested unlawfully by shadowy agents in unmarked vans. Officials are now suing the department of Homeland Security for its use of police force and requesting a restraining order portland warns that the Trump Administration directing hundreds of agents to his city is an escalation of an alreadydangerous situation. Now, from Top Administration officials and the president himself, the threat that the tactics theyre using in portland could very well be expanded across the entire country. Joining our conversation ryan hass who has been covering this story, ryan, were trying to get our arms around this story, youve been so far out in front on whats happening, tell us tell us the state of affairs today. Yes, so, as we have seen federal agents are here in portland, and theyre continuing to both protect federal property but also gather protesters and arrest protesters nowhere prote protests were seeing an escalation. What happens once somebody is arrested in. In at lot of cases theyre taken in for questioning theyre grabbed generally off the street and taken inside the federal courthouse here in portland, and then held for some amount of time often asked questions and released some of these folks have been charged for things like. Pointing laser pointers at officials. In one case there was an assault on a federal officer. Ryan, are you aware of anyone at the local or state level or anyone in the congressional delegation, any of your senators asking for federal help . No, not that im aware of, in fact everybody from local to state, to federal officials, have all actually said we do not want federal officers here taking actions, we would accept that they can defend federal property thats their job, but especially asked for this to be scaled back, because its only escalating the protests every night. Ryan, i imagine in your reporting youve come across people who have been picked up by the federal militias, how do they describe those interactions . Its pretty scary, honestly, the person we spoke to he said he was walking down the street at 2 00 a. M. Blocks away from any federal property and a van swerved up, men jumped out, pulled his hat down over his eyes and pushed him van and did not tell him where he was going, why he was being detained, or any information about what they were doing or what agency they were with so its the kind of stuff that youre really just not used to hearing out of american Law Enforcement. Truer words have not been uttered on this show in a long time ryan, thank you so much. Were going to keep coming back to you, because as you say, you remain way outfront on this story. Thank you so much for spending some time with us. When we come back, its far from back to normal, but Major League Baseball is making its final preparations to get back on the field and theyre wearing masks. Thats next. Ill at risk for a heart attack or stroke . Even if youre on a statin . Statins may lower some risks, but may not be enough. Thats why science delivered vascepa. For people who have persistent Cardiovascular Risk Factors and take a statin only vascepa is clinically proven to provide 25 lower risk from heart attack and stroke. Dont take vascepa if youre allergic to icosapent ethyl or any inactive ingredient in vascepa. Tell your doctor about any medicines you take, and if you are allergic to fish or shellfish. Stop taking vascepa and seek medical help if you have symptoms of an allergic reaction. Serious side effects may occur like heart rhythm problems and bleeding. Heart rhythm problems may occur in more people with persistent cardiovascular risk or who have had heart rhythm problems. Tell your doctor if you have symptoms such as irregular beat, lightheadedness, dizziness, shortness of breath, chest discomfort or fainting. Possible side effects include muscle and joint pain. Proven by science, fda approved. Vascepa can reduce your risk and add cardio protection. Call your doctor about vascepa today. Major League Baseball is getting ready for opening day this week. With the shortened season scheduled to begin on thursday, but well take it. Over the weekend, teams held spring training games, including the yankees and mets, where lots of players donned masks on the field. Nbcs Vaughn Hillyard is in phoenix at chase field where the Arizona Diamondbacks will officially start the season in just a few days. Vaughn, i was amazed watching this mets yankees game saturday, which didnt end the way i wanted it to for my mets, at how many players didnt make a thing about it, it was ant a politic statement, just had their masks on and were going about the business of playing baseball reporter exactly theres an intrasquad game between the Arizona Diamondbacks taking place at chase field back behind us right now and the same thing can be said right here what you saw over the course of the weekend was baseball is what were going to see over the course of these next 60 games. Our great photographer, i feel like i have to talk in a golf voice right here, because you can hear everything thats going on and im pretty sure they can hear us down on the field. The one constant through all the years has been baseball, and that is what youre going to see on thursday, opening day here. We should note, every other day, these players are being tested and those tests are being sent to a lab out in utah you have seen no major outbreak among any organization at this point in these players, they say theyre taking this seriously, because they have every intention to make it through the season and the postseason i had a conversation with tony clark, longtime former major leaguer as well as the executive director of mlb players association. Take a listen to part of our association. What weve seen over these past couple of weeks with the testing, with the adjustments to the protocols and the things that need to be done, an effort to get back and playing, both individually and collectively, but the guys have taken it serious. That the staff around them have taken it serious that those the other onfield personnel, including the umpire, have taken it seriously. And that gives me hope to believe that we can get through what right now is a 60game season nicole, not only are we seeing opening day at baseball this week, but nfl Training Camp begins this week ten days from now, the nba tips off and the nhl comes to play just 12 days from now. Nicole well, we certainly need sports back in our life. Well stay on this Vaughn Hillyard in phoenix for us, thank you so much for spending some time with us today. Coming up, Donald Trumps ignorance and defiance in the face of the coronavirus ndemic on full display. Deadline white house next some Companies Still have hr stuck between employees and their data. Entering data. Changing data. More and more sensitive, personal data. And it doesnt just drag hr down. It drags the entire business down with inefficiency, errors and waste. Its ridiculous. So ridiculous. With paycom, employees enter and manage their own data in a single, easy to use software. Visit paycom. Com, and schedule your demo today. Save without even leaving your house. Just keep your phone and switch to xfinity mobile. You can get it by ordering a free sim card online. Once you activate, you only have to pay for the data you need, starting at just 15 a month. There are no term contracts, no activation fees, and no credit check on the first two lines. Get a 50 prepaid card when you switch. 5g is now included with all new data options. Switch and save hundreds. Xfinity mobile. Hi, everyone its 4 00 in new york on a monday in pan interview reminiscent of Katie Courics palin interview, Chris Wallace revealed Donald Trumps delusional approach to the coronavirus, laying bare the president s ignorance and defiance of the Public Health crisis that has paralyzed our country and decimated the economy. Wallace wielding the weapon of facts to counter trumps lies in an interview for the ages. Sir, testing is up 37 . Well, thats good i understand. Cases are up 194 . It isnt just that testing has gone up, its that the virus has spread the Positivity Rate has increased. Many of those are worst than it was. Many of those cases are young people that would heal in a day. 75,000 cases a day. Show me the death chart well, i dont have the death chart. Well , the death chart the death chart is 1,000 cases a day. Excuse me its all too much. It shouldnt be one case it came from china they should have never let it escape, they should have never let it out, but it is what it is take a look at europe, take a look at the numbers in europe. I can tell you, cases are 6,000 in the whole european union. They dont test they dont test like we do is it possible they dont have the virus as badly as we do its possible that they dont test, thats whats possible ill be right eventually i will be right eventually i said, its going to disappear. Ill say it again. Its going to disappear and ill be right it was a master class, a relentless effort to fact check even the most baseless, nonsensical attempts by this president to paint the Coronavirus Crisis in the u. S. As anything less than disastrous but that didnt stop trump from trying and failing to manufacture a mic drop moment against wallace that of course backfired on him kayleighs right here i hear we have one of the lowest maybe the lowest mortality rate anywhere in the world. Do you have the numbers, please. I heard we have the best mortality rate countries as dr. Birx points out and this is number one low mortality rate i hope you show this, because it shows what fake news is all about. I dont think im fake news today you are you said we had the worst mortality rate in the world. I had the second its a little complicated, but bear with us we went with numbers from Johns Hopkins university, which charted the mortality rate for 20 countries hit by the virus. The u. S. Ranks seventh, better than the united kingdom, but worst than brazil and russia the white house went with this chart from the european cdc, which shows italy and spain doing worse, but countries like brazil and south korea doing better other countries doing better like russia arent included in the white house chart. So there you have it. A brazen president ial falsehood that the United States has the best mortality rate in the world, dismantled by Chris Wallace Research Team the interview airing on a weekend of crushing new revelations about the president s failures, failures to respond to warnings about the coming explosion in coronavirus cases. The New York Times reports on the white house efforts to operationalize their abdication of a federal leadership role in combatting the virus this way. Quote, their ultimate goal is to shift responsibility for leading the civil right against the pandemic from the white house to the states they referred to this as state authority handoff. And it was at the heart of what would become, at once, a catastrophic policy blunder and an attempt to escape blame for a crisis that has engulfed the country. Perhaps one of the greatest failures of president ial leadership in generations. And that once in a generation failure in leadership is also ushering in a grim new political reality for donald trump the typically subservient species formerly known as republicans have finally reached a breaking point the New York Times reports on a secret society of gop governors who convene without staff on latenight calls to trade advice about best practices and who communicate with mike pence sometimes. From the times, quote, once reticent republican governors are now issuing orders on mask wearing and business restrictions that run counter to mr. Trumps demands. Some of those governors have been holding latenight phone calls among themselves to trade ideas and grievances they have sought out partners in the administration, other than the president , including Vice President mike pence, who despite echoing mr. Trump in public, is seen by governors as far more attentive to the continuing disaster. So it must have come as a crushing blow to that group of anxious republicans when trump today announced that hes bring back his daily appearances at coronavirus briefings. You know, the ones that were suspended after he suggested injecting disinfectant inside the body, almost like a cleaning, he said. We are all paging sarah cooper just about now but when history looks back on the worst weekend yet in americas handling of the coronavirus, with more than 206,000 new cases reported, indiana, kentucky, louisiana, and South Carolina all breaking singleday records for new infections, is the latest spate of republican defiance of the delusional president too little, too late the sad and sorry state of the american presidency is where we start today. Dr. Vin gupta, Global Health policy expert and msnbc medical contributor is here. Plus Associated Press white house reporter, Jonathan Lamir is back, and msnbc and cnbc, my friend John Heilemann is here. John, on any and all of it, i really felt and i havent said this out loud yet, so im curious and anxious to hear what you think, that having lived through the couric interviews of sarah palin, that what was so disastrous was that couric revealed her i think what wallace did was reveal the ignorance of the man who is currently our president , the indifference to the human suffering, and the fealty to manufacture data that has no basis in reality right yeah, and nicole, its funny that you mention sarah cooper, because i know youre an addict of sarah cooper, millions of people are but whats the sarah cooper brilliance the sarah cooper brilliance is to some extent is when you take the face away and you take the trappings of the office away, youre left with just the words, right . I mean, shes a brilliant comic, but part of why its powerful is that you get to hear trumps words for what they are, in all of their ridiculousness and all of their absurdity and its why that satire is funny and devastating to him and i think, in a way, Chris Wallace did to trump in that interview a little bit of what sarah cooper does to him in her comedy and you see you cited two New York Times story when youre in the white house, as you know, nicole, and youre a republican president and youre getting eviscerated by both the fake news, in your view, by the New York Times, and your friends at fox news, who you rely on for slavish devotion, you know youre in trouble. And hats off to Chris Wallace, hats off to the New York Times. Journalism at its best this weekend of different kinds the Interview Form that Chris Wallace delivered and the kind of investigative and other reporting that the New York Times is doing really laid the president bare for what he is right now and just how dire the situation around him is politically. Jonathan lamir, another sarah cooper fan, i will share this right now. Shes going to be with us tomorrow and im dying to ask her first what shes going to do with all of that new material from the new coronavirus briefings that donald trump is restarting my questions for you are so many, but let me start with a twoparter one, how did they think yesterday went and two, why are they putting the president back in the forum that really put in motion the collapse in his Approval Rating . First of all, thats a great get tomorrow that will be a lot of fun, looking forward to watching that they do not think it went very well, nicole this will not surprise you whatsoever the president was quite angry with how yesterday went, you know, and kudos to Chris Wallace for a terrific interview and there were a number of places where, of course, the president stumbled, most notably are some you played at the top, about the infection rate, misstating the idea about testing. Of course, misstating the mortality rate later, calling dr. Fauci an alarmist suggesting once again that he may not honor the election results, you know, that he would have to wait and see before he made that judgment, echoing what he said in 2016, when he claimed the whole process was rigged and many fear that he is on the verge of doing that again now, particularly with his the way his attacks, unfounded attacks on mailin voting. This is the dilemma, though. The white house is currently having right now is to how to best utilize the president of the United States there are some in the building, Kellyanne Conway and others, who feel like he should be trying to engage the virus a little more headon here that they should be having briefings again. That the president maybe doesnt need to be involved in all of them, they certainly should be shorter. Perhaps he wouldnt take as many questions from reporters but they feel that that was sort of useful for him to be out there. We saw a few minutes ago, he for the first time tweeted an image of himself with a mask mind you, hes still only worn it once in public. Others in the building, mark meadows suggest thats not a good idea. He feels like the president often trips up, hurts himself with comments about the virus. He would rather he be out there talking about the economy and other things of course, the deciding vote is the president himself. And he has been saying for months now that he misses those briefings, those forums. They did come to a crashing halt after that comment you said when he suggested about injecting disinfectant you know, he also aides were telling him that his poll numbers were suffering because of the ratings, because he wants to get back out there. He cant have rallies right now. Weve seen him use the rose garden for more political events in recent days he wants to have some sort of forum. Its not clear whether the virus briefings would be a daily phenomenon, but we want to hear him more and more. He says he misses the ratings. He wants to be back out there. He misses the ratings i dont know where to start. Let me ask you a serious question, Jonathan Lamir on the sort of vein tapped by the New York Times investigation and part of how we got here, mark meadows offlining the Coronavirus Task force into a small meeting around the chief of staffs table, a lot of small meetings around the white house chiefs table. It does not have enough room for the full complement of the kinds of advisers you would want at the table. And the reporting supports that. They had dr. Birx there with charts the piece devastates dr. Birx. I hope she has a job promised to her at the trump hotel company, because they destroyed her credibility as a scientist whos out to get dr. Birx . There are some people in the building, nicole, who feel that, of course, this response to the pandemic has gone poorly, as you know, in this west wing in particular, theres always a search for scapegoats and always a search for people to blame, particularly when the president has so often said he wont accept responsibility for whats happened he made a passing reference of that this weekend, but we remember when he was asked a few months ago about the testing failures, he said, it wasnt his fault at all but youre right, the times laid out reporting that backs up what weve been hearing, as well that dr. Birx certainly took a s sunnier approach to the response here while dr. Fauci was more airing on the side of caution with how things were progressing, dr. Birx, some feel in the white house now was telling the president what he wanted to hear it will be interesting to see if indeed these Coronavirus Task force briefings do start up again, will we see either of them dr. Fauci has been largely sidelined. He has not been permitted by the west wing to do any sort of Cable Television interviews. Hes had to resort to zooms and facebook lives and things of that nature. We havent seen dr. Birx in a while, either. It will be interesting to see if theyre part of this as the president grapples with the idea of trying to get back out there, you know, as infections surge across the country, and the clock is ticking on his reelection bid. Were only five or six weeks away until early voting begins in earnest dr. Gupta, i want to ask you about the two top scientists in this country both of them battered by their association and efforts, ostensibly, to try to help the country fight the pandemic this New York Times reporting were talking about has aides describing dr. Faucis methodology of working the phones, of calling officials in hot spots and really trying to understand the ground truth in the hospitals, at the places where testing is occurring, the supply chain what is the reality of what they need and what they have. And then they describe the methodology adhered to by dr. Birx as almost 100 data driven. It appears that someone in the piece tries to push back and suggest she doesnt just look at models but i wonder as a doctor and as a scientist, what are the process and cons of each approach nicole, always good to see you. You know, the pros of dr. Faucis approach is that hes actually understanding the realities on the ground, in a way that dr. Birx focuses singularly on models is missing. You know, models are great, but models are only as good as the input into the models. And as you know, nicole, theres been so many uncertainties about quality of data. The department of health in florida is actively manipulating data we dont even know what icu beds look like in terms of availability so you can only model data in way in which its actually quality data going in. And so thats why dr. Faucis approach has been so embraced by folks like myself and others on the front lines, because he gets it im not saying that dr. Birx doesnt get it she has an incredible career in Public Health in our armed forces but dr. Fauci recognizes the Human Element in a way a model will never capture and it goes to something, im hearing all the political headlines that have come out in the last 48 hours. You know whats happening, nicole, just down the hall from me, im in our covid icu near seattle. Family members are losing their loved ones and having to save cest goodbye on face time. Often the patients in a coma anyway they cant say goodbye in any meaningful way people are dying the lack of empathy thats happening here from our president on down, the galling way in which the governor of georgia is deciding to sue the mayor of atlanta for not instituting a for instituting a mandatory mask policy, its complete medical malpractice and its awful if they walk a moment in our shoes, in a family members shoes who have dealt with covid and providers who are trying to deal with covid, they would never dare do what theyre doing. Its incredible to see whats happened because you brought us back to where we belong, talk about what you see happening in the country right now. And what you think our real prospects are for turning the ship around. You know, what im seeing here, nicole, is that people are scared ive had the American Federation of teachers, School Districts across the country, teachers, substitute teachers say, doc, what are we going to do . Shouldnt we have n95s in the classroom . If youre wearing one in an enclosed space in a classroom and you think covid is airborne, what should i say . We dont have enough for us. How can we make sure youre safe parents are worried. Everybody is worried either for a return to normalcy or their loved ones that are in icus that they cant see we are at a height of anxiety, nicole, we dont have the political will to deal with. What im really concerned about is what im seeing at the state level. If the white house strategy is to empower states, look at what governor dewine is doing countybycounty approaches for a virus that knows know boundaries, much less global ones hes doing a countybycounty approach governor kemp, outright dereliction of duty. Its unacceptable. I can go on, but thats what im worried about, as are teachers, as are parents across the country. And John Heilemann, when you just look at our conversation over the last 18 minutes, the extraordinary disconnect between where donald trump mouth goes and you have to assume his head leads him there, and whats on the minds and on the heart and whats weighing on every american family, and im thinking about people who have spent their lives building a Small Business, held their breath through april, got to may, and still made, and just to see the country blow it. See the country literally engulfed in not embers like the bs pr spin in that times story, engulfed in the flames of this pandemic sk and ive used this metaphor before, you know, pulling the alarm, and nobodys coming right, from the very beginning, nicole, you had a president in terms of how he addressed this problem, you know, from the earliest days when you had that ship off the coast of california and the president was like, dont let the ship come ashore because well have to count the numbers, think back to that the president sonly concern throughout has been his political fortunes, has been his ability to get reelected, has been how this will affect im its completely consistent with the kind of pathological narcissism weve seen from him from day one but i find it incredible, some of the things this reporting reveals, and particularly the story you cited in the New York Times, how hes been enabled in this moment like the chief of staff. And mark meadows, you know its a truism in washington, d. C. , that next to the president of the United States, the most powerful person in the country is the white house chief of staff. And everything about the reporting in that story was that the white house chief of staff, rather than saying we need to face squarely into the reality of whats happening or consider what the worstcase scenarios might be going forward, was bias towards a political and substantiative approach that said, we want to assume the best case, rather than the worst case, and we want to turn away from the reality and try to build a political approach that basically denies whats going on dont get too close to us. Dont talk about the virus talk about stuff that will take peoples minds off of what is the fire that you just described thats engulfing the country its not only reckless and irresponsible and totally outside the way in which every really good or even decent white house chief of staff that you and i have ever covered or seen in the course of our lifetime, but its insane. Its not just bad management and bad politics, but its its selfevidently was doomed to fail from the moment that they undertook this process and you watch them throughout this story trying to cherrypick data, get dr. Birx to provide the most favorable data and cling to that data rather than doing what anybody would do in this circumstance, which is to say, hey, you know what, maybe this is going to turn out to be okay but if it doesnt turn out to be okay, it could turn out to be really bad and our responsibility here, both substantively and politically should be to make preparations for the worstcase scenario no one around donald trump, and of course donald trump, but no one around him ever seemed to think that that was the way that they should handle this. Its all such good points and i guess my last thought, John Heilemann is, we should have known when we saw the treatment of Migrant Children at the border, that people thought that that was okay to do to human beings decided it would be okay to wait eight to ten days to test people, for the president to have an instant test, and the people that come in contact with him and the rest of the country to have to wait and render Contact Tracing useless. And to set it all back turn on the light switch, go back to work, go back to school. Thats what weve got. Thats the guy in charge of our country, at least for now. John heilemann, Jonathan Lamir, dr. Vin gupta or a truly extraordinary day of headlines, thank you so much for talking us through it after the break, the latest attempt by the president to cast doubt on the results of the next election it comes as his poll numbers against joe biden go from bad to absolutely devastating plus, as the nation mourns the death of an icon, john lewis, a call to action in honor of his legacy stands in direct opposition to Donald Trumps divisive agenda. Our dear friend and colleague, joy reid, who starts a new adventure tonight, joins us ahead. Im so excited about that. And rising worries that the alarming crackdowns against protestersn iportland, oregon, could be coming to a city near you. Yep, all of those stories, coming up. Cosentyx works on all of this. Cosentyx treats the multiple symptoms of Psoriatic Arthritis to help you look and feel better. Dont use if youre allergic to cosentyx. Before starting, get checked for tuberculosis. An increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. Tell your doctor about an infection or symptoms, if your inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, or if youve had a vaccine or plan to. Serious allergic reactions may occur. Watch me learn more at cosentyx. Com. Watch me i but what i do count on. Ts anis boost high protein. Rs, and now, theres boost mobility. With key nutrients to help support. Joints, muscles, and bones. Try boost mobility, with added collagen. Well the names have all changed since you hung around but those dreams have remained and theyve turned around whod have thought theyd lead ya back here where we need ya welcome back, america. It sure is good to see you. Can it help keep us asleep . Smart bed is on sale now. Absolutely, it senses your movements and automatically adjusts to keep you both comfortable save 25 on the sleep number 360 c4 smart bed with any Smart Adjustable base. Plus 0 interest for 24 months. Ends monday. Are you a good loser im not a good loser. I dont like to lose i dont lose too often i dont like to lose are you gracious . You dont know until you see, it depends i think mailin voting is going to rig the election. I really do. Can you give a direct answer . You will acceptthe election . I have to see im not going to just say yes. And i didnt last time, either another alarming obliteration of president ial and democratic norms that should not be allowed to fade into the noise of todays news cycle donald trump sewing doubt about the outcome of an election that hasnt happened yet, as polls continue to show him trailing his opponent joe biden by gaping margins. The latest from the Washington Post and abc news shows biden up nationally by 15 points, a gap thats widened by five points since may for trump, its a political crisis largely of his own making that same polling Shows Americans reject his response to the pandemic and his frequent efforts to down play a virus that has killed 140,000 americans. On the question of which candidate voters trust more to handle the virus, joe biden now has a 20point lead over donald trump. They are almost neck and neck on the same question back in march. Joining us now, msnbc legal analyst, who worked with the sdny civil division, our friend, maya wiley, and former Top State Department official, our friend, rick stangl. I have been dying to you, rick stangl, because you and i have started this conversation about what if he doesnt leave and i know ive shared this before that i spoke to a former senior military official who says that you can bet your last dollar that there are conversations within the military about what to do, but its not something they would have approached with this white house as of yet maybe trump is accelerating that process . Yes, its the most chilling and diabolical thing i think a president has ever said. And as you and i have talked about this, i think the republic has to be prepared, congress has to be prepared, the military has to be prepared for an american president to not accept the results of an election, that would undermine the democratic norms that weve all abided by for a couple of hundred of years so i just my brain finds it hard to comprehend and of course, you know, he was trying to put the election last time he thought he was going to lose, he wanted to be able to say that it was rigged and hes doing the sam thing now, although now he is a sitting president maya, i struggle with this personally at the beginning, they were misstatements, there were distortions, they were flatout lies at the beginning, he was caught on access hollywood talking, saying, you know, melania called it locker room talk. It was the language of a sexual predator we have shied away from saying what we see, because we cant believe our eyes and i wonder if in that gap between what we see, what we hear, and the minute it takes us to get our baearings, he continues to move the goalpost to say this in a sunday show interview, i may or may not accept the result of an election in what was once the greatest democracy on the planet should be an International Headline absolutely. You know, donald trump is desperate and desperate men do desperate things it makes him very dangerous. Hes been a danger to our democracy since day one. Lying as the commander in chief in and of itself is dangerous, but now were looking at a president who has, you know, by avoiding the truth about the coronavirus, by stoking fear and hate, we now have 140,000 americans who have lost their lives. And we have a country with so many states with out of control, you know, Coronavirus Infections that is the kind of thing that he cant lie his way out of. And so what we see is desperation. And that desperation from donald trump usually ends in distraction. The distractions themselves are extremely dangerous for democracy. Calling, for example, in advance the sanctity of our elections, suggesting that things that we know to be true, which is that mailin balloting is pretty safe, yet he says its going fraudulent these are all distractions that serve to pull us away from the facts that he cant run from and to stoke fear. And i think that what we have to do is keep our eyes on what matters most to society. And thats us. Thats the people of this country. Thats our health, thats our safety, and we have to demand that our leaders call their attention to these important issues so to that end, rick stangl, joe biden issued this statement. Mr. President , your ignorance isnt a virtue or a sign of your strength its undercutting our response to this unprecedented crisis at every turn and its costing americans their jobs and their lives. Its long past due for President Trump to listen to somebody other than himself and how to fight this virus, because after six straight months of deadly mismanagement, it is spiraling even more out of control twopart question for you. Do you agree were sort of at this fork of the road, where were about to drop off into something worse than where we are. And two, if that assessment is right, and i think it is, how bizarre that Donald Trumps answer is to restart the briefings that put in motion the collapse of his poll numbers theres about 16 parts to that question, nicole. I do think that you can handle it okay, my brain is i cant im not a doctor, i cant speak for whats happening. It does seem like its not that were going through a second wave, but that parts of the country are going through a first wave for the first time. And that areas that did go through a first wave like new york may have a resurgence, because people are not taking it quite as seriously as they did what i find so disturbing about this moment in time, and im going to use whats going on in portland as an example, donald trump has it exactly in reverse. You should use local and state officials toofd whatev do whate need to do about a constitution, which is a right that our founders put in there so they could protest, skpusand you shob using the federal government to do testing and create ppe. And hes got it exactly backwards. Hes telling the states to do testing and deal with the virus and he is saying, yeah, im going to go and put in unmarked troops there like Vladimir Putin in crimea and deal with that so he is the most incompetent president in american history. And whats particularly dangerous is if he starts to use somethinglike portland as his fire to use that to declare partial law. To send other troops into other parts of the country and say this whole thing with free speech and the free press isnt working under the circumstances. Thats the real danger and thats what weve seen throughout history where authoritarians take power. Rick stangl in there working in a putin crimea analogy at just the Perfect Moment in this bizarre journey were on okay, great news everyone staying put but after the break, our friend joy reid, who debuts her new show tonight and her big interview with joe biden, we get to talk to her, next dear freshpet, rudy got older and suddenly stopped eating. Then we found freshpet. Now rudys 13, and going on 3. Our nation is founded on the principle that we do not have kings, we have president s and the constitution is our compass. When you see something that is not right, not just, not fair, you have a moral obligation to say something, to do something our children and their children will ask us, what did you do what did you say for some, this vote may be hard, but we have a mission and a mandate to be on the right side of history the conscience of congress, john lewis, civil rights hero and longtime congressman from atlanta, georgia, passed away this weekend after a monthslong battle with cancer joining our conversation, host of the brandnew show debuting tonight, the reidout premiering at 7 00, my friend and colleague, joy reid. Im so happy about this news. Im so happy im going to get to watch you at 7 00. Youre so important to telling the story of this presidency and this political moment and i just want to send you my congratulations, first thank you so much, nicole i truly appreciate you thank you. I heard you friday night at about 11 50 call into Brian Williams newscast when the sad news broke and i stayed for the onehour documentary you had done about congressman lewis and i wanted to ask you about something you said that night. You talked about what he thought of this generation of activists. And it gave me a teeny bit of solace that he was heartened by the black lives matter movement, by the swelling numbers of support for them can you talk about that a little bit more i once saw john lewis interact in atlanta with some black lives matter activists, who were really crying out i think this was in 2015 and there were just so many of these cases of black young men and women, you know, being killed by police or being harassed by police and there was so much anger that they felt and he came out and had this gentle spirit and said to them, basically, i was you i know what it is to be angry, to want to scream out and cry out against injustice and want to, you know, curse injustice out, you know . But that, you know, he was a living example of having taken that spirit of protest you know, his angry 1963 speech that he wanted to give where the white house was ready to Start Playing music really loud, to drown him out, they were so afraid of that he was going to say, to emerging as this sort of beacon of being able to work with everyone on the hill, probably the most liked member, other than Elijah Cummings on the hill the two of them were probably the bestliked people in congress and also somebody who never stopped being fear and he never stopped being angry at injustice. And he never gave up on the idea that we could do better and had to do better and if something was wrong, he had to neil, you know, even with all of the physical ailments that he felt, he still felt that he needed to go down on one knee and kneel with the protesters and do that symbolically in the halls of congress and he never stopped being that young man and god bless him and god bless his memory and the sound we played was from impeachment i remember, i think i was anchoring when that happened and you could almost put that frame around literally everything thats happening. I mean, i think there he was saying to his republican colleagues in the house and the senate, just look at what we can all see. The abuse of power is front of all of you, just do the right thing for your kids, for your family how do we how do we get back to that . How do we crawl back to that we are so far from that. The New York Times reporting this weekend about a secret society to have governors that have to meet without staff to bypass all the disinformation and incompetence coming from the federal government i mean, were so far from what he called for, just in december. You know, its i was listening to that segment and it literally boggles my mind that grown men and women have to sneak around and meet to save the lives of their own constituents, because theyre afraid that donald trump will be mad at them if they save peoples lives this is insane and you know, john lewis died only a few hours after ct vivian and he was another hero of the civil rights movement. And there was this video of ct vivian confronting not bull connor, but a guy whos standing near bull connor, but whos silent and he says to him, why are you following him. Why are you letting him drag you into the pit of hell dragging you into the worst depths of history. Hes dragging you towards na naziism. Why you letting him do that . You need to man up and walk away from him and john lewis was crying out to republicans, you can walk away from him you dont have to do this. The idea that you would let i think about the Florida Governor almost every day because i still have so many friends down there you really would rather let people die than defy this one man . Hes not god hes just a man. But the cowardice that you can key on the hill is shocking. John lewis was literally 17 years old when he started defying the police that could kill him in the street he was 23 when he got up in front of 250,000 people and spoke before the march on Washington King didnt even make 40 and he laid down his life and his country. He was 26, john lewis, when he got beaten in the head these were basically kids and they had more courage than a member of congress, of the senate the kids in florida, you know, who marched against gun violence after they faced a gunman in school they were like 17. I met those kids those kids have the spirit of john lewis the parkland kids. These men in congress, these women in congress, how dare they risk peoples lives because they think trump will be mad and hell tweet at them. Pathetic it sure is. And youre going to have, because youre you, both joe biden and Hillary Clinton on tonight. And how much of this infuses your line of questioning for both of them tonight what do you want them to answer for you and for your viewers tonight . I believe just asking all they can say is no, right . Were like, ask for everybody. Were like, obama can we get michelle and get used to it yeah, but, i have so many questions. Because, you know, if he wins, joe biden is going to inherit hell, you know and hes been there before, inheriting hell with president obama. They emerged into an economic catastrophe in a failed war in iraq and all of that, but this will be worse. So im very curious to see how he responds to that. There are literally a secret police force in the streets of an American City and soon to be deployed to more this is unprecedented. And i think between the two of them Hillary Clinton, having been secretary of state, she looked out into the world and said, what can we help to fix in the world. You know, what country do we need to be moved by the suffering of the people in the streets . Well, now that country is us the country that people pity is us the people where people are dying in unbelievable numbers and a seemingly helpless government cant stop it, we are that country we are the pitied country. We are the country some other nations minister of state is trying to help figure out how to fix. That is a sad state of affairs god bless the man who wants to be president in these circumstances, because it will not be easy. And the woman who tried to warn us. I remember what Hillary Clinton said, do you really want someone who can be baited with a tweet as your president . We have watched him being baited about shutting down states, we have seen him being baited about liberate virginia. Just about everything she predicted that has come to pass has, indeed. And youre right about what joe biden will inherit i cant wait to watch you tonight and every night. Thank you so much for spending time with us i know its a busy day well be watching. Thank you so much, nicole take care. Tune in tonight for joys new show the reidout. Joining her, joe biden and Hillary Clinton. Dont miss it. After the break, donald trump after the break, maya will be back, rickta sngl will be back. Well all be back. Dont go anywhere. Now is the time to support the places you love. Spend 10 dollars or more at a participating Small Business and get 5 dollars back, up to 10 times with american express. Enroll now at shopsmall. Com. Sixtytwo thousand seven hundred and ten dollars and thirtyone cents. Sofi allowed me to refinance all of my loans to one low Interest Rate and an affordable monthly payment. And i just feel like theres an end in sight now and that my debt doesnt define me anymore. Sofi is helping me get my money right. Incidentally, i took the test too when i heard that you passed it. How did you do . Well, its not the hardest test the picture, its an elephant. You see, thats all misrepresentation. Well, thats what it was on the web. Its all misrepresentation. Yes, the questions are easy i bet you couldnt answer the last five questions. They get very hard one of them was count back from 100 by 7. Maya and rick are back. Maya, i said in the last hour if you have known anyone with alzheimers or dementia, its a gut punch to see trump playing whatever hes playing, president ial politics or president follow this shiny object by bragging about his results on a test meant to screen out cognitive decline any mother had alzheimers and i was fortunate enough to keep her home with me for several years. It is a gut punch and whats also clear is that were having an unfortunately a credible and important conversation about Donald Trumps cognitive capacity i think every one of us who has experience with anyone we love having cognitive decline, we recognize what these tests feel like when our family members are taking them. Donald trumps defensiveness is in and of itself a concern because it indicates that he does feel that he may have some cognitive decline. By the way, thats not our biggest problem right here in and of itself. Its that we have a Republican Party as joy said earlier that is not circling the wagons around democracy but is circling the wagons of secrecy around whether or not donald trump is prepared and able to serve and whether or not we have a go government that isa abusing its power as we have seen in portland hes not leading us into a conversation about solutions at a time when we need to talk about whether were bailing people out in term of their rent and instead hes trying to hide testing and high dollars for testing and emergency aid package. Is that cognitive decline or is it just because hes a horrible leader only the voters can decide but theres no question that whether its one or the other or both, donald trump has created a very real conversation about his cognitive capacity and thats something we all have to be concerned about. Rick, i have covered and i can detail every bit of journalism around his mental state. David brooks quoted some republican senators leaving a briefing in 2018 describing his rambling rambling resembling someone in early alzheimers. Senator corker said hes not displayed the competence for the job he has john bolton said hes unfit. I thought it was after he was out of office that the truth emerge but now we have donald trump constantly talking about his acing, im not sure anyone as the screen for cognitive function and talk about his answers as though it was a math test its not a math test i just wonder if were moving too fast that we dont sit in this revelation from the president yesterday for a minute more im less concerned about his cognitive decline or iq than his maturity im the father of two boys i would say that conversation would have happened when they were nine years old, ten years old, 11. The test is really hard. I bet i can do better than you can. His mental age is in the single figures. The other thing about the issue of cog ani the other thing about the issue of cog antive decline its like, i dont care about his acuity i care about his morality. I dont care about how he processes problems, i care about his ethics hes the first president we have had thats a sociopath who has no morals and ethics thats the whole ball game when we focus on cog ani when we focus on cog antive decline and him not processing and counting back to 50 by 7, that gets away from the problem of the unconstitutionality, his abuse of power those are what concern me. Cognitive decline has nothing to do with that maya and rick, two people i know and love so much. I notice youre in different rooms. Thank you for spending some time with us. We cant end the program without celebrating a few lives well lived the very best humanity has to offer are often the people who want the best for others it was a life, a mission for adrian gomez making sure children on the border had a good education and happy he was an assistant Program Director at a shelter in brownsville, texas the job he held proudly because he wanted to make a difference in other peoples lives. His daughter said her dad loved every one. He had a huge heart. He was only 52 were thinking about his family today hoping they feel some small comfort knowing how much good he left on the world. We also want to tell you about Samantha Diaz. Shes the granddaughter of a mexican migrant. A young woman who should have been celebrating her 30th birthday next week she became a mom as a teenager she worked her way through school became a medical technician and got a job along side a card kol gist in florida. Her family grew. She recently became a mother of three. A teenager plus a 1yearold and 2yearold its tragedy that this week her aunt had to remind herself how to change diapers because samantha died of the coronavirus ten days ago Palm Beach Post hit it on the head Samantha Diaz was the american dream. Thats how well remember her. Thank you so much for watching, for letting us into your homes during these truly extraordinary times. Our coverage continues with the fabulous katie tur after a quick break. Weve got the retinol that gives you results in one week. Not just any retinol. Accelerated retinol sa. One week is all it takes. Neutrogena®. And still going for my best. Even though i live with a higher risk of stroke due to afib. Not caused by a heart valve problem. So if theres a better treatment than warfarin, i want that too. Eliquis. Eliquis is proven to reduce stroke risk better than warfarin. Plus has significantly less major bleeding than warfarin. Eliquis is fdaapproved and has both. Whats next . Reeling in a nice one. Dont stop taking eliquis unless your doctor tells you to, as stopping increases your risk of having a stroke. Eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. Dont take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. While taking eliquis, you may bruise more easily and it may take longer than usual for any bleeding to stop. Seek immediate medical care for sudden signs of bleeding, like unusual bruising. Eliquis may increase your bleeding risk if you take certain medicines. Tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures. Ask your doctor about eliquis. And if your ability to afford. Your medication has changed, we want to help. With spray mopping to lock away debris and absorb wet messes, all in one disposable pad. Just vacuum, spray mop, and toss. The shark vacmop, a complete clean all in one pad. My agerelated macular degenso today i made a plan with my doctor, which includes preservision. Because he said a multi vitamin alone may not be enough. And its my vision, my morning walk, my sunday drive, my grandsons beautiful face. Only preservision areds2 contains the exact nutrient formula recommended by the National Eye Institute to help reduce the risk of moderate to advanced amd progression. Its how i see my life. Because its my vision. Preservision. Happy birthday. Cheers nice technique with that, nice come be a part of it online. Godaddy is making it possible for everyone to create a website for free. Learn more at godaddy. Com were definitely getting more admissions every day than were having discharges. Were starting to fill up. We dont know when its going to stop. I know everybody is getting sick out and around time. We know that more is coming at some point trying to brace ourselves for the long haul. I would much rather see us be able to prevent infections rather than trying to deal with the consequences and people in the hospital and the hospitals fi