Journal in just the last hour, hannity simply explained, quote, weve been friends a long time. I have sought legal advice from michael. With us to make sense of how the president s fixers fate is now inextricably linked to his own, were joined by some of our favorite guests. Outside the new york courthouse, tom winter, Kristen Welker following developments from the white house, former chief spokesman from the Justice Department matt miller and joyce vance, former u. S. Attorney. Both matt and joyce msnbc analysts. Tom, lets start with you and the dramatic twists and turns which i heard from two friends at fox news, shocked them there in their workplace. But sean hannity now playing a role in this cohen legal drama. So, nicole, this all came up because earlier today Michael Cohen in a legal filing through his attorneys said that hes represented two clients three clients, rather, in the past two years. President trump, of course, because thats his personal attorney. The second attorney would be Elliott Brodie and the third person who didnt want his name to be revealed. In Court Proceedings, judge essentially ordered cohens attorneys to disclose the name after arguments from United States attorneys, after arguments for media lawyer arguing any name that should be mentioned in the court should come out publicly and that name is, as you have said, sean hannity, fox news host. So, basically what theyre saying is that at some point in the last two years hannity was engaged with Michael Cohen in a way that Attorney Client privilege might be invoked or might be sought in this case. So, thats what we know as far as the development of who Michael Cohen is represented. As far as the overall hearing which we believe is still underway and as of 4 00 here the doors are now shut, meaning we cant go back in, but judge kemba wood is continuing to hear arguments as to whether or not Michael Cohen has the opportunity to review all the documents that were seized in this search warrant, whether or not kind of of a referee, if you will, who is going to be an allison rosa arbiter here and have an opportunity to look and decide what Investigative Team has access to with the United States Attorneys Office or whether a separate team working for the United States Attorneys Office will be able to look at all the documents and items recovered from cohen and then will be able to hand over items that are not dont have to do with Attorney Client privilege in order for them to continue their investigation. So, thats whats being heard back and forth. One thing i do want to mention is President Trumps name has come up directly in court and was brought up by a federal prosecutor. They were talking about this notion of Michael Cohens letter this morning to the court where he said, hey, this is a highly publicized case. Theres all sorts of political back and forth. Theres questions about whether or not this investigation is independent or not. And federal prosecutors took exception to that. They said that mr. Trump mr. Cohen and mr. Trump have you used inflammatory language to be able to talk about this case and they said that that language drumd up some of the Media Coverage thats been going on over the past several days or frankly the last week since the search warrant was affected here in new york. Thats whats going on behind me. Again, the hearing continues. We dont know if were going to get a ruling today as far as whats going to happen if this temporary restraining order is going to be granted, if there is going to be any sort of special measures that are taken into account. So, obviously a lot still to be decided today. We may not even get an answer today, nicolle. This may be a written order we get from the judge either late tonight, tomorrow, or in the days ahead. So, a lot still to come. A lot to develop, but obviously a lot of information coming out of todays hearing so far. Kristen welker, i talked to a source who said he didnt know if donald trump was aware of Michael Cohens representation of sean hannity. But he confirmed that sean hannity is in constant daily contact with the president. And i went back and looked at Sean Hannitys reaction on the air monday night, the night of the raid of cohens offices which the president described in that building behind you as an attack. Actually we have that. Lets watch. The fbi has raided the office, the home and the hotel room of Michael Cohen. The personal attorney of the president of the United States. Robert mueller is so far beyond his mandate, this is now spiraling out of control. Everything that we have warned you about is now coming to fruition. And mueller has ostensibly tonight declared war against the president of the United States. Clearly his objective is to remove him from office. Now, i told you and ive told anyone who will listen, muellers team is corrupt starting with him and it has been from the beginning. I have to play that a couple more times because the whole thing is a laughable joke in the context of knowing now that part of what was unearthed in mondays raid of cohens offices could be documents pertaining to the legal relationship that Michael Cohen sought to keep secret this afternoon in a manhattan courthouse about representing sean hannity in some capacity. Well, right. A couple of points you raise that i think are significant, nicolle. First of all, the facts that you have sean hannity, the president and his allies now making the case that that raid that happened last week and these Court Proceedings today are all a part of the next we are witnessing the special counsel investigation cross a red line. So, privately its meant that the president has increasingly infuriated at mueller, at Rod Rosenstein and then publicly you see his allies attacking them more forcefully. I am told, by the way, talk of potentially firing mueller, firing rosenstein has abated a bit, particularly in the wake of the syria strikes, the president shifting his attention to that crisis for now. To the other point that you bring up, though, this revelation that Michael Cohen has represented sean hannity, sean hannity just speaking out about this moments ago, nicolle, on his radio show, let me read you what he has to say. He says, ive known michael a long time. Let me be very clear to the media, michael never represented me in any manner. I never retained him in a traditional sense, but i have occasionally had brief discussions with him about legal questions. And he goes on to say that there was never a thirdparty involved in this. So, again, hes trying to make the case this was him seeking legal advice from Michael Cohen. Nonetheless, it sort of underscores the fact there are links between all of these men and as you rightfully say, nicolle, sean hannity is someone who the president speaks with, who the president meets with at maralago, at times has met with at the white house as well. And so it provides this growing picture of sort of who is in the president s inner circle. And when you talk about an inner circle, it doesnt get much closer than Michael Cohen. Hes the president s fixer. Hes seen as his family, and thats why the president is so infuriated by all of these developments. That is why they are arguing in court today. They want to have the ability, the president s team, to see these documents before they become a part of this legal case. Well have to see what the judge decides. As tom points out, we might not have an answer today, nicolle. Kristen welker, i know youre covering a lot of different stories for a lot of us here in new york. If you have anything else that develops on the donald trump, sean hannity relationship or on anything, any reaction there from the white house folks to whats happening, still unfolding in that courthouse in manhattan, run back to that spot and well take it at any point in the next 55 minutes. Absolutely. Let me get to you, joyce vance, on the question of shaea hannity. Not only being the president s tip of the spear, in terms of being his messenger for the maligning, the character assassination of men like bob mueller and jim comey, the men who carried men and women who carried out the raid on cohens office had to reach an incredibly high bar to be able to raid and seize documents from the president s personal Attorneys Office. Does that look different in hindsight, knowing that sean hannity was one of Michael Cohens clients . It doesnt look different to me at all, nicolle. The search warrant says that the fbi and the u. S. Attorneys office provided probable cause to believe that cohen was involved in Election Campaign finance violations, was involved in either bank or wire fraud, and they were searching for evidence and for documents and for electronic information that would be relevant to that inquiry. So, the fact that theyve come across a clients information in a Lawyers Office is not unusual. Thats a situation that the taint Team Procedure the d. O. J. Uses all the time in these sort of cases is well equipped to handle and what would have normally happened had the president and cohens lawyers not objected to this process is that the taint team would have seen that there were files related to a third client who presumably is not part of the investigation. They would have shut those files and put them aside and they would have never gone on to the Investigative Team. The irony is that hannitys name only surfaces here because of the motion, the very unusual motion filed by cohen. To keep the documents to be able to go through them before theyre turned over to the investigators. Exactly. And the argument they made was that this culture the argument they made i think i have a line from that. In a filing today basically asserted that there is a culture or climate, i think was the word they used, that was politically biased. It turns out the bias is on the other side, lets ma ryan the rule of law, lets malign the Justice Department, malign the fbi, was one of the clients who sought to have his legal records protected. Yeah, its really pretty extraordinary. The president s argument is, im above the law. Even though theres no Legal Authority for doing things differently in a case involving me, you have to essentially because ive been maligning the Justice Department. Matt miller, let me bring you in on this. Youve got the keenest eye on what has really been some of the most startling developments of the trump era, sort of the constant war on the Justice Department, the constant character assassination against Donald Trumps own appointees at the Justice Department, at the fbi, a war waged largely night after night after night by sean hannity in the primetime hours on fox news. What do you make of todays finding that he was one is one of Michael Cohens clients and one of the people Michael Cohen sought to protect in terms of keeping those records under seal . I think what it shows is that they have an alignment, not just of common interest where sean hannity is speaking out on President Trumps behalf, but they obviously have a business relationship. Sean hannity now we know was a client of Michael Cohens. He said in that statement you played earlier that he was just seeking legal advice. He wasnt represented in any kind of matter involving a thirdparty. Its hard to understand what that legal advice is. Michael cohen is not an auguste lawyer. Hes a fiktsxer to payoff porn stars with hush money. For sean hannity, hes going to have to answer questions about what kind of legal advice that is and hes going to have to answer questions about why he didnt disclose that relationship when he was railing against the Justice Department last week, railing against this raid. And whether he was actually worried about some kind of information that would involve the matter for which Michael Cohen represented him that might become public or might become known to the Justice Department. We dont have any reason yet to believe its that relationship the department of justice is investigating. They seem to be investigating Michael Cohens work for donald trump, maybe his work for others. Maybe his own individual legal problems. But it raises serious questions. I say it raises serious questions about Sean Hannitys his objectivity. I dont think those are real questions or have been for sometime. But it raises serious questions with fox news let me press you, not about his objectivity, but his motive. Right. We have all accepted and there is a bit of sort of putting sean hannity on the couch that goes like this. That part of avenging roger ailes death is defending donald trump in a way they couldnt defend a man who was a fatherlike figure. I cant wait to talk to gabe sherman about that. Hes going to join us in a second. But there is something about the zeal with which they defend donald trump. So, it may not be a lack of objectivity, but it may be an additional motive to just ideological agreement with everything in the trump agenda. Yeah, thats exactly right. Not just ideological motive, but these are people who share all work in one kind of very small set of shared relationships. And now we find business relationships with the same attorney. What i was going to the point i was going try to make, you dont really question were not going to get into Sean Hannitys objectivity, but it raises real questions for fox news, whether they knew about this, whether he disclosed it to them, and whether they are okay with him continuing to rail against this investigation when we were now know he has a very personal interest in it. It goes beyond just him and goes to i think the entire network. Everyone is staying put. I want to play you sean hannity responding on his radio show just after this news broke a little over an hour ago. Lets listen and talk to gabe on the other side. Michael never represented me in any matter. I never retained him in the traditional sense as retaining a lawyer. I never received an invoice from michael. I never paid legal fees to michael. But i have occasionally had brief discussions with him about legal questions about which i wanted his input and perspective. And i assume that those conversations were Attorney Client confidential, but and the other thing i will need to point out to the media that is apparently going insane over this. Not one of any issue i ever dealt with Michael Cohen on ever, ever involved a matter between me and any thirdparty. Joining us by phone right now is gabe sherman, special correspondent for vanity fair and msnbc contributor. Hes written about fox news for many years. Gabe, you and i have had many conversations about the relationship between some of the most prominent figures on air and off at fox news and the republicans they cover and in many instances bolster. There is no one more integral to the Trump Defense than sean hannity. Yeah, thats right, nicolle. I mean, you cant really draw a line between where the Trump Administration ends and Sean Hannitys radio and nightly fox program begins. I mean, he has been so intertwined really from the beginning of the campaign. And, you know, for sean hannity, this is Donald Trumps ascendancy recommends something as a Second Chance for hannity. For years hannity really graded at fox of being second fiddle to bill oreilly. Bill oreilly was the 800 pound gorilla, the big star. When oreilly was forced out of the network last year amid Sexual Harassment allegations, hannity emerged as the unchallenged true star of the network and his close alliance with donald trump made his ratings bigger than ever. And this has been something of an ego inflater for sean hannity where finally late in his career he gets to be the biggest star in right wing media, i would say, probably bigger than Rush Limbaugh at this point. And hannity is famous for telling friends, he does dont this for the money any more, thats probably true. Hes fantastically rich. Hes doing this because he in his wildest dreams probably could never imagine being as influential as he is. Gabe, let me ask you a question, though, about what goes on inside fox news. There is not comfort in all corners of fox news with the line that sean hannity takes, the absolutism that he takes in defending everything donald trump does. With this development today, i looked back at some of the die hard conservative supporters of Donald Trumps, people like ann coulter and Laura Ingraham who didnt hesitate to take their shots at donald trump when he seemed to back pedal from a Campaign Promise like the wall. Not so with sean hannity. Sean hannity has Donald Trumps back in a way that totally transcends policy. Does todays development give us a clue into why that might be . Without question. I mean, obviously it raises the question of what Financial Relationships exist between them. Now, hannity said he didnt pay Michael Cohen while that may be true, there may be other ways he maybe paid, a Consulting Company cohen set up. We dont know the full spent of their relationship. What i have heard from inside fox news, my sources, this is a fast moving story so it will continue to develop. What i have heard thus far is that hannity retained cohen last year when Left Wing Groups were calling for hannitys ouster from the network around his coverage of the seth rich conspiracy story. Sources inside fox told me that hannity grew, quote, paranoid that there was an orchestrated george soar osled campaign to get him off the air and he retained lawyers, i believe, other than in addition to cohen and perhaps hired private investigators to look into his enemies who were trying to do these boycotts to get him off the air. So, i believe, and and i have not 100 confirmed this because its fast moving, what i have learned thus far, hannity consulted cohen on how to stop and perhaps fight back against left wing attacks that were trying to boycott his advertisers. Gabe, are you reporting, then, that your initial belief is that Michael Cohen was retained to help sean hannity fight back when the going got tough inside fox news, and that youre reporting at this hour that it wasnt the kind of relationship Michael Cohen had with the president s prolific donor, mr. Brodie or with the president himself where cohen was involved in hush money payments to porn stars . Is that your understanding . Thats correct, i have not heard any echos of it being any kind of sexual relationship that hannity was seeking to silence. My knowledge thus far, and again, its fast moving so it could evolve, but what i have heard thus far is he hired cohen as a fixer to try to stop political attacks and perhaps damage and go after his enemies. Now, as oftentimes lawyers like Michael Cohen will hire private investigators to look into people that are perceived enemies. And when hannity mentioned on his radio show there was no thirdparty involved, i dont know if he was referring to the fact that there was no thirdparty meaning like a woman in the case of Stormy Daniels or no thirdparty meaning a private investigator. But my, my suspicion based on the reporting ive done is that Michael Cohen is exactly the kind of person you would go to to find a private investigator to try to look into, say, media matters or any other Left Wing Group that was calling for a boycott. Okay, gabe sherman, this is weird but ive got to do this. Sean hannity is watching. He says what gabe said is a lie. You can say thats 1,000 true. I never asked michael about left wing attacks versus me. So, i trust your sources are superb. Let me just add one more mr. Shant to yomr. Mr. Sean hannity to the body. Id like to allow you to respond if youd like. Yes, thats an interesting response. Ill say. Hannity has flatly denied things in the past that i have had multiple sources on and known to be true. So, i think hannity, like many others in the trump orbit, have sort of questionable credibility when it comes to denying things that are later proven to be true. But that said, i did preface this by saying its a fastmoving story. This is what people inside fox news were talking about in relation to hannitys relationship with cohen. And if hannity is saying that is not the case, hes more than welcome to correct the record and tell the world exactly you know what im going to do, im going to put you two on a text and have you work this houts. We have your reporting which is always superb. We have seans response. I know youve done an Extraordinary League of body of reporting of your own. I wanted to give you a chance to respond to seans realtime response to our coverage of this, gabe. Thank you so much. Jump back on the phone, though, if you learn anything else. We always want to hear it. Will do. Join meg at the table, carol lee, Nbc News National Political reporter, brett stevens, the New York Times oped columnist hes always here for the weird of of days. Msnbc contributor john who is here for plenty of weird days himself. Commentary magazine editor, also an msnbc contributor, and mark mckinnon, my brother in weirdness, creator, executive producer and cohost of the circus. And in washington former democratic congresswoman Donna Edwards at the senior fellow. For mr. Hannity, we are very happy to have you as a viewer, sean. Keep watching. Go. So, im not sure that this is anything but a side show and sort of a distraction oh, come on. They went to court to protect the whole hearing today was about Michael Cohen making an argument that the climate is biased against him and mr. Trump so they wouldnt have to reveal these names. The only name we didnt know was sean hannity. Right. But when i say side show, cohen could be just trying to blow whatever smoke he possibly can. Sean is saying that he basically was hardly a client of cohens. So, one or the other thing has to be true. Either sean is not telling the truth and he and cohen are deeply wrapped up together in some legal matter that cohen had to hide or sought to hide under the terms of the Attorney Client privilege, or cohen is engaged in some weird effort to kind of spin a story in some strange way and hes added hannity to his client list, but he isnt really a client and i dont understand any of these people. And i dont know how much longer we can go on before were all institutionalized. Go ahead. This gets at something, and i hate to cite him approvingly. Something jim comey said in his book, that this operates like a mafia family. You have the don. Youve got his fixer. Youve got the circle of trusted acquaintances and all of them have these inter locking relationships. One of the things that comes out of this for me is the extent to which its almost a misnomer to describe Michael Cohen as a lawyer. Correct. I just checked the law school he went to a fourth tier law school. Its not the sort of guy you go to if youre very rich for first class legal advice. What do you do with a fixer, what do they do . They fix stuff, right . We know the sort of things that Michael Cohen was fixing for donald trump. It would be interesting to know the sort of things that sean that he was fixing, if any, for sean hannity. Yeah, i mean, every time there is a Development Like this i feel like it just raises more questions than answers. And the questions are what was the service that was provided, why did he not want his name to be disclosed because he says in the court he didnt want this to come out. Right. What did fox news know . Did this have to be disclosed internally . What did the president know . Was there any relation to the president knowing that and the defense that sean hannity has delivered on behalf of the president . And i think this hangs together for two reasons. One, cohen did a lot of seedy stuff. Before the hannity news broke, we were going to, we were going to bring our viewers up to date on some of the cohen headlines. Cohen the president s fixer is in the wall street journal today where tthe wall street journal reports he killed a story in us weekly. One of the reasons he got fired from the view. They were preparing to report about an alleged affair between donald trump, jr. , who had been a judge on Celebrity Apprentice and one of the contest ants. To bretts point, cohen really wasnt operating as a lawyer in trumps orbit. He was operating as a fixer. The addition af Sean Hannitys name, again, i dont know im sure none of our viewers watch as much fox news as i do. I want to understand the other side and where theyre going and how far theyve gone. And to describe sean hannity as having gone the farthest from reality would not be an understatement. His constant attacks on the d. O. J. And the fbi which are now run by men hand picked by donald trump, by the way, the Southern District of new york, u. S. Attorneys office, also run by i think one of two u. S. Attorneys donald trump interviewed personally in the oval office. It is an interesting piece of the picture being filled in today. Yeah, this is infrastructure week, right . Again. Hi, sean. I dont think its a surprise that sean hannity is talking to the president s lawyer. There is a close relationship there with the president. That doesnt surprise me. Youre not surprised hes a client of the president the lawyers fixer. Im not surprised hes talking to Donald Trumps lawyer. Two things. He should tell us what he was talking to him about. If it was a casual relationship its not that important. What was he talking about, the media boycott . What was it . Two, the thing ha really disturbs me and surprises any journalist, the clip you showed earlier. Hes reporting on the raid on the office with great outrage, without disclosing that hes his attorney as well. Thats where i have the problem. So, this is about disclosure and transparency and so we should have known before that reporting happened on that case. And as he said, maybe there is a motive there. On all of that that comes together, maybe hannity saw this leading toward trumps lawyer and let me bring joyce back in on the legal question. You raise a good question. What would the bar have been for the raid to include all of cohens clients . I mean, we learned some new dates today so on august 2nd of last year, bob mueller got permission from Rod Rosenstein to widen the scope. That happens to be the same date on which the search warrant was executed. What kind of information about what kinds of figures, doing what kinds of crimes would have justified both those events, the widening of the Mueller Probe and an extraordinary search warrant . So, there are two sorts of things the government has to do when they get a search warrant. The first is they have to meet the standard of proof called probable cause. They have to convince a federal judge and in this case some pretty highup people in the Justice Department including Rod Rosenstein that there was sufficient evidence to support the inference that there would be proof and perhaps fruits of crime that they would acquire during the search, not just of cohens business, but also of his home, and the hotel room he was staying in. Thats a pretty hefty bar. And then they had to have some substantive allegations. They had to provide an affidavit based on evidence that the agents had put together that convinced the judge that they were legitimately looking into violations of Campaign Finance law, of bank fraud, and of wire fraud law. So, the substance has to match up with this high procedural bar, and it tells you that they werent just speculating. They werent ruminating about what might be happening. They were going after specific allegations of crimes that they believed cohen had committed. All right. A source close to the white house today told me that the president s anxiety about the cohen raid likely falls into three distinct categories. One, things he knows mr. Cohen did for him he doesnt want people including his wife to find out about. Two, things the president doesnt necessarily remember cohen doing for him, but that he worries wont look so great. And three, things he may not have ever known cohen had handled on his behalf. And, you know, carol, as weve been talking about, those concerns make more sense the more we learn about Michael Cohen. Yes, they certainly do. Its the latter, the middle part that you talked about where he may not remember or isnt really sure that gets to the heart of why some of the president s legal advisors think he should never sit down and talk to robert mueller. When it comes to sean hannity, you know, i think that part of why what everyone has such curiosity around this is because of the company hes in. And i dont mean the people. I mean hes one of three people who used Michael Cohens services to have payments whether its Elliott Brodie 1. 6 million, a woman who said he i impregnated her and Stormy Daniels sean says to me directly there was no thirdparty involved. Clearly i guess the point is Michael Cohen isnt doing this because, you know, he lost his teddy bear or Something Like that. Its not these arent thats not the space in which not his line of work. He makes dirty things go away. There are two things here. One is its not illegal to have Michael Cohen as your lawyer. We should stipulate Michael Cohen is not some font of illegality. If you have any connection to him you should therefore be considered a criminal and go to jail. The second thing is that the relationship of sean hannity to the truth and at fox news and whether fox news cares that he had a wild conflict of interest because his lawyer was somebody he was doing programs about, that is an issue that fox news is going to have to deal with. It still doesnt come to the level of what is the Public Policy implication of this. There is only a Public Policy implication if there is some connection between hannity, cohen and trump. If hannity and cohen have something going on, im not sure its any of our business what it is just because Michael Cohen is finds himself in the middle of a legal jeopardy situation. But the fox thing, thats going to be interesting and telling. They may do nothing. Sean, they let sean do some pretty bad stuff. He probably wasnt working on seans will, i would guess. Well, you never know. Let me get you back in on this part of the conversation and ask you this broader question about fox news doesnt do a lot of soul searching, but they did after the Sexual Misconduct scandals. They did apologize for some of the substance of Sean Hannitys coverage around the im sorry, yeah, around the death of seth rich. Sean hannity seems to sort of function i know gabe sherman described it this way in a world with no rules. Even inside fox news. They describe it as the inmates running the asylum, the people who have to live by the rules as opposed to people like sean who do not. Do you think there is any incentive for anything to change over there . I think theres only one incentive, that will be the one that always mattered at fox news, money talks. Each incident they backed down, when oreilly backed out, they apologized at the seth rich incident. There was mass outrage from the public that led to boycotts and advertisers pulling their programming first from bill oreilly and later from hannity. Thats what led to them pushing oreilly out the door and forcing hannity to apologize and the network apologizing itself. Absent any kind of public pressure, i dont think were likely to see anything from fox. And so i think if we see, you know, more embarrassing details about what hannity did come out or more embarrassing details about him actually trying to use his perch on the network to go after this raid because he was worried about something that might come out about his own conduct, you know, if that leads to a real impact on the companys bottom line, then we might see some change there. Absent that, i wouldnt hope for very much. Brett . In the overall book of Rupert Murdochs business at fox news, its not the largest business. What fox news provides murdoch is access to the president. Thats what i think at this stage in his life, what really matters to him to be able to pickup the phone and have a good relationship. We have a post truth presidency. We have a post journalism network. The two are extremely well matched and i cant imagine almost any scenario in which sean hannity gets forced out while donald trump remains in office. A great shame for many fine journalists who work at the network. We wont paint the network with a broad brush. Tom winter, thank you for your reporting. Matt miller, thank you for your analysis. Joyce is stuck with us a little while longer. When we come back donald trump takes on the man he fired because he didnt like the way he was running the russia investigation. Jim comey firing back in a set of explosive interviews. Reupping the central question at the heart of the mueller investigation. Does russia have something on donald trump . 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Learn more at cancercenter. Com Cancer Treatment centers of america. Appointments available now. When this guy got a flat tire in the middle of the night, so he got home safe. Yeah, my dad says our insurance doesnt have that. What . you can leave worry behind when liberty stands with you™. Liberty mutual insurance. Do you think the russian s have something on donald trump . I think its possible. I dont know. It always struck me and strikes me as unlikely and i would have been able to say with high confidence about any other president i dealt with. But i cant. Its possible. Was President Trump obstructing justice . Possibly. It is certainly some evidence of obstruction of justice. I dont think hes medically unfit to be president. I think hes morally unfit to be president. Values matter. This president does not reflect the values of this country. That was some of what ousted fbi director jim comey had to say about President Trump with abcs george steph notify list. Central to Mueller Probe, do the russians have something against the president and has the president obstructed justice . Heres how the president responded on twitter. Of the 18 tweets he sent out since friday, half of them were about jim comey. Leaker and liar. Weak and untruthful slime ball. My favorite, this one, my great honor to fire him. Slime ball, jail. I hardly even knew the guy. I cant keep going. The panel is still here. Don and joyce are here as well. Donna, lets start with you. It to me seems like a disgrace beyond disgraces, that the rnc has been weaponized for the sole purpose of maligning this man who certainly endured enough humiliation at the hands of donald trump to get his day in the court of public opinion. You know, i mean, look. Jim comey served he served with distinction. I have to tell you, i was out in the field when he held that press conference in the waning days of the election and it was devastating. At the same time, there was nothing groundbreaking at least from what i can determine in this book. And so it raises the question of why it is that the president and his tag Team Including the rnc came so strong on this one. I dont even understand it. You know, then to fire back with name calling, calling jim comey a slime ball, and then the rnc saying, oh, there was a lot of name calling going on. It really was seemed kind of ridiculous and overblown for what was revealed in the book. Joyce, it seems like all of the debate and the political mud slinging aside, will endure long after the book tour is over is that comey leaves unanswered the two central questions of the Mueller Probe, did the president obstruct justice and does Vladimir Putin have something on him. And you know, really the data that was put together, the evidence on those questions really didnt begin to even be compiled until after comey had been fired. So, theres been a lot of conversation about whether mueller will be happy to see one of his potential witnesses parading about, discussing his book. And i think part of the response to that is that comey has already testified and is locked in to answers about what he saw. But for much of the relevant time period, he simply wasnt involved. And i would just add, nicolle, that its possible to disagree with some of the decisions comey made, to disagree with his choices, but to still believe that hes hardwired to be an honest person who truthfully relates what he observe. You know, Savannah Guthrie asked me this morning about when i worked for bush and books that were portray him negatively came out, and i remember back in 04 woodward had a book out about the iraq war that was scathing. And our strategy was to put it on the Campaign Website to say we love this book so much we think you should read it. It was our little moment of like, were not scared of this big bad book. Were going to send it out to our whole campaign list. My point is its been so long since i thought about what normal white houses do, what normal campaigns do its hard to evaluate the way trump deals with something strategically what you would normally do dont flatter with attention. The more attention hug it so people think its fine. Nothing controversy there. The one thing i was surprised by out of the book is the notion about obstruction of justice and what comey thinks about that. He said hes not sure. If anybody were sure youd think it would be him or have a pretty strong feeling. That was surprising to me. On the issue of trump and russia, we were in russia last week doing our whole show. I know you were. It was incredible. Do you have a taster . Yeah, we had burner phones, thats for sure. But john heilman, my cohost with alex wagner, did an interview with maria, the head of shes the Foreign Ministry spokeswoman. And in a clip, my show, maybe we didnt have time because of all this happened today. Do we have did . Hang on. No. Anyway, it was clipped with the Foreign Ministry spokeswoman, john talked to her, when trump was elected she just accidentally said, thank god. And then john turner said, did you just say thank god . And she really had her wings pinned to the wall. In a rare incident where she kind of scrambled and clearly didnt know what to say. But john caught her. She said thank god trumps president. That was a very interesting revealing moment from the head spokeswoman from the Foreign Ministry of russia. Kellyanne conway attacking comey said, this guy changed the results of an election. For them. So according to her, he is to be criticized because shes working in the white house now. Like, theyll say anything that comes to their minds at any moment. Its one thing to say, what comey did, you know, to us is difficult spencer christianab , despicable. But it was good he reopened the investigation because hillarys crooked. Thats not what kellyanne said. She said he did a terrible thing. He won us the election. It was a stunning thing. I saw that, too. I couldnt believe what i was reading. That being said, i think trump, with his political instinct, is smart to attack comey. I think this is a story of the pig versus the prig. The thing about the pig the thing about the pig, no matter how much mud is spattered on the pig, which is the president , very little extinction because you expect him to be covered in mud. A prig, the stain on his spotless shirt, youre going to say thats a stain on your shirt. Thats the problem comey has. Trump has comeys number, basically an unlikable scold who holds himself in very high moral regard. Now, that may or may not be justified, but as a matter of public relations, jim comey is not coming across very well. And anything he says that doesnt stand up to minute scrutiny and hes already had a few blunders, is going to cost him in this contest between the two let me ask you, because the person who wont let comey thats the p. R. Battle that youre describing. But as weve all said, hes also a witness in the Mueller Probe and i imagine the person who will establish the fact pattern around these two questions of obstruction of justice or pro tension collusion with russia will be bob mueller. How central is comeys testimony around his own firing and the testimony of the witnesses to that decision, to the Mueller Probe . Its central to those pieces of it. But there were a number of things i think joyce talked about that happened after comey left. Right. That are also part of it. But i think if you were just to take them on their face publicly, donald trump and james comey, based on the evidence thats out there, you would give more weight to james comey in terms of what hes saying. And he said it was partly because he said it under oath. And so it is very critical and not just that, but he took these memos, he has memos of this. He clearly sought to keep a very detailed record of what happened there, knowing that it would be significant. And he said that. And it is. And so i think the idea that he isnt sure if there is obstruction, though, is a really interesting piece. And maybe that is related to the fact that a lot of the elements of obstruction, most of them, happened after he left. Let me ask you, joyce. Because proving obstruction is proving the intent to obstruct justice, does that also require someone other than the person who was fired to establish . Well, comey can certainly talk about what he saw, what he experienced, what the president said to him. But i think youre right, nicolle, that much of the evidence and as carol discussed its that pattern that then develops after the comey firing. The comey firing is perhaps the first public event that we see where there is this inkling that obstruction may be happening inside of the white house. Donna edwards, im going to pin you down on something you alluded to because i think the richest irony of the comey book tour with even Kellyanne Conway acknowledging it was jim comeys actions in the final days of the campaign that put her inside the west wing, that put donald trump over the top i dont know if kellyanne meant to say that or not, i havent seen her retract the statement as the days went on. What was it like for the democrats to be on the side of incredibly polarized politics giving jim comey the greater benefit of the doubt than the majority of trump republicans . Well, look, i think jim comey has the benefit of the doubt for some things. But the fact is and as i said, i was out in all of those states as a surrogate for Hillary Clinton. I felt the gut punch out there when that when he made that statement. You could feel it in volunteers, in canvassers, the entire atmosphere in a church. I think it goes without saying, i actually agree with Kellyanne Conway on this. Jim comey swung the election. There we have it. Donna edwards and Kellyanne Conway agree 4 47, mark the time and place. I want to touch on one thing brett said. I think trump, whats right in front of him, the book, there is a longer range play. He realizes he may lose in the courts or the d. O. J. The only way he wins then in the court of public opinion, by convincing enough republicans and republican senators to stick with him through an impeachment hearing. Which is what makes sean hannity so important. I do think democrats are being foolish if they buy if they take comey in completely. The stephanopoulous interview, i havent read the book, but the stephanopoulous interview shows a series of i think extraordinary blunders on comeys part in comeys own telling in which he selfaggrandizingly arogated himself to the role of speaking to the American People about whether or not Hillary Clinton should or should not have been indicted. He should either her or not indict her. If he wasnt going to indict her, he should have released a one sentence statement the issue was closed. By doing that, he has another dark night of the soul around october 28th and swings the election. I think to embrace the man whose behavior i think shamefully had a political effect, that he had no right to intervene in, i think is a bad play. Im sorry. I just think hes a bad actor. He exposes himself as a bad actor. Ongoing his legacy will be intertwined with both sides on that, the effect on the clinton campaign, being fired by donald trump. We are hearing that that Court Hearing in manhattan is wrapping up. Were going to sneak in a break and take you right back there. Tomorrow, its a day filled with promise and new beginnings, challenges and opportunities. At ameriprise financial, we cant predict what tomorrow will bring. But our comprehensive approach to Financial Planning can help make sure youre prepared for whats expected and even whats not. And that kind of Financial Confidence can help you sleep better at night. With the right financial advisor, life can be brilliant. If yor crohns symptoms are holding you back, and your Current Treatment hasnt worked well enough, it may be time for a change. Ask your doctor about entyvio, the only biologic developed and approved just for uc and crohns. Entyvio works at the site of inflammation in the gi tract and is clinically proven to help many patients achieve both symptom relief and remission. Infusion and serious allergic reactions can happen during or after treatment. 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He has played by a sirch. Different set of rules, or shall we say no rules at all. He never thought that the little man, especially women, even more, women like me mattered. That ends now. My attorney and i are committed to making sure that everyone find out the truth and the facts of what happened. And i give my word that we will not rest until that happens. Thank you very much. Do you know sean hannity . Stormy a very brief breemt statement from Stormy Daniels the porn star at the center of Michael Cohens legal calamity. Looks like Michael Avenatti is in front of the micro phones and considering taking some questions. Lets listen in. All right. I will now accept questions about todays hearing and other topics related to my client. [ inaudible ]. I think judge wood was very reasoned and measured in her approach relating to the documents. Our number one concern was that the documents, the integrity of the documents, be maintained during the process. It is clear from the order by judge wood that thats exactly whats going to happen. That will ensure that no documents or destroyed or otherwise tampered with, which is our chief concern in connection with this process. [ inaudible ] im not going to answer that question. Thats a rekick clouse question. Next question. [ inaudible ]. She is ultimately going to determine whether a special master is appropriate or not. One thing i will say is this i said last friday and this weekend that Michael Cohen was radioactive. And that anybody that was associated with him in the last 20 to 30 years should be very, very concerned. What we witnessed earlier in the hearing with the disclosure relating to sean hannity proved my point exactly. He is radioactive. Anyone that had any contact with this man in the last 20 years should be very concerned about what secrets of theirs are within these documents. Next question. [ inaudible ]. Im sorry . [ inaudible ]. Depending on what is contained win those documents, i think there is significant danger to the president. The president trusted the president trusted mr. Cohen as his fixer for years. He trusted him with his innermost secrets. And i think that the chickens are about to come home to roost. Next question. What advice would you give President Trump today . I wouldnt begin to advise the president at this juncture. I think the ship has sailed. Why did miss daniels come to court today . There was absolutely a reason. We wanted to ensure that the integrity of the documents was maintained, and we wanted to len her voice towards making sure that the American People learned the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth about what happened to her and to others in her position over the last ten to 15 years. [ inaudible ]. We havent made a determination yet as to whether she will attend each hearing in connection with this process. [ inaudible ]. I think it speaks volumes. And i think sean hannity got thrown under the bus by Michael Cohens counsel today, who was clearly more concerned about protecting the president than protecting sean hannity. But we will let them sort that out. Anything else . [ inaudible ]. I have been concerned with my safety for the duration of the case as my client has been. But weve decided the risk is more than worth it and we are going to see this to conclusion, whether its next week, next month, next year. No matter how long it takes, were not going away. Thank you. That was Michael Avenatti, attorney for Stormy Daniels, calling the president s attorney, Michael Cohen, radioactive. There are also so many developments. I think we have got tom winter joining to us tell us what ended up happening. I understand a temporary restraining order was denied. That seems to be a setback for the case that the president and his lawyer Michael Cohen were trying to make; is that right . Thats exactly right. The hearing is wrapped up. The temporary restraining order has been denied. But we dont have a final resolution yet as to what is going to happen with these do you mean and who is going the review them. I want to bring in hannah rapidly. Hannah, you were in court until its conclusion today. What did you hear . What did the judge say . Right now the judge ruled that the government has to produce those documents that they seized. They have to give them to opposing counsel for Michael Cohen, for the trump organization, for President Trump himself, on a rolling basis. They are all going the review those documents, and then meet again to determine the best course of action. Again, the judge did not rule out the the possibility of using a socalled taint team or a special master to determine what documents are privileged and what are not. Bottom line, we have still more decisions to come from the judge and from the federal courthouse behind us here in manhattan. M to, hannah, thank you so much. Joyce, seems like a pretty obvious setback for the president , for Michael Cohen, for their attorneys. I saw that the judge also commented on their allegation that there was a climate of bias that somehow affected this, really defending the constitutionality and the legality and the appropriateness of the warrant itself . The relief that they have asked for in this case, cohen and the president , is really unprecedented. They are essentially attacking long established procedures under the Fourth Amendment that permit the government to acquire evidence in a criminal investigation when the government can prove that its entitled to move forward because there is probable cause to believe a crime has been committed. So she responded very appropriately, protecting these ongoing basis that Law Enforcement across the country works every day. Mckinnon, you get the last word, my man in moscow. Michael avenatti is more than a lawyer. He is a performance artist. We have to give him more credit than that, it would seem. His cases are winning in the court of law now. I think he started that way. But he has actually made legal arguments that judges are he is like a speed boat going around the destroyer. But a lot of people sold him short when they thought that was his only trick. He is prevailing in court now. He has a number of tricks up his sleeve and he has made clear he is not going away. In that president has met a match. He has good case to make. Good case. Bottom line. My thanks the a, joyce, carol lee and the rest of you. And sean hannity for texting me. Thanks. Im micolle wallace, mtp daily starts right now. I have got say, when sean hannity came out, i was on air, and i didnt quite know if the words that were come out of my mouth were real, but they were. Nicole, we will keep on this, thank you. If its monday, is the president trying to hide something
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