The day began one day after this shocking, if i can say that decision by the grand jury, one day after that. The day began with mayor bill de blasio announcing the unveiling and details on a new Training Program for the nypd. The Training Program set to begin this month that is intended to help officers maintain a nonthreatening posture to deescalate situations and be more precise in how they use force. Heres the mayor talking about that. The relationship between police and community has to change. The way we go about policing has to change. It has to change in the city. It has to change in this country. I am fundamentally convinced it will change. The mayor getting very emotional last night in the wake of the decision of the grand jury, address the city before a microphone, talking about his own son dante and having to warn him about his interactions with the police. A lot of people in new york felt the mayor was hearing them at that moment. There were some very harsh and negative reactions today to those statements from the mayor from the head of the patrolmens benevolent association. Patrick lynch the head of the police union firing back at the mayor he says threw them under the bus. What Police Officers felt yesterday after that press conference is that they were thrown under the bus. That they were out there doing a difficult job in the middle of the night protecting the rights of those to protest, protecting our sons and daughters, and the mayor was behind microphones like this throwing them under the bus. Today a lot of continued head scratching and hard questions about just how the grand jury in Staten Island reached the decision it reached. Unlike the case in ferguson in which Bob Mcculloch released the totality of the grand jury record to the public, something weve been sifting through now for over a week, Staten Island District Attorney dan donovan has declined to file to do the same to Staten Island. A judge today issuing a very cursory summary of the findings there. We know there were 50 witnesses, 22 of whom were civilians, arrests, cops, and doctors. Jurors saw 60 exhibits including four videos and that grand jury sat for nine weeks. We did, however, get a little glimpse into the proceedings from one of the most key witnesses in the whole affair, thats ramsey orton. That is the man who filmed the now infamous video of eric garner yelping i cant breathe, i cant breathe, as he has a chokehold placed around his neck. Mr. Orta in an interview with the daily news said he went to the grand jury expecting he would be testifying for hours and instead testified for about ten minutes. Nobody on the grand jury was even paying attention to what i had to say, he told the daily news. People were on their phones. People were talking. Also, a lot of backlash today against the officer in question, who has escaped criminal indictment. Daniel pantaleo. Mr. Pantaleo was sued earlier this year. The city had to settle a civil suit, a civil rights case for officer pantaleo doing a strip search in public. There are many calls tonight for the officer in question to be fired. The nypd of course has an internal investigation ha has been ongoing for several months. There have been no conclusions. As a protester shouting down bratton and wanting to see Police Commissioner bratton fired over what they see is a continuation of policies they thought they had dislodged. Joining me now, jonathan moore, he is the attorney for the garner family. Thank you for being here. My pleasure. Were you surprised by the grand jury decision yesterday, or did you have some feeling as this was going on that we werent getting that this was going to happen . Well, i was actually stunned by the decision. Although i wasnt surprised. What i mean by that is if you look at the evidence, the evidence is overwhelming that something wrong happened here. That these officers, not just one but several officers were engaged in misconduct. It wasnt surprising to me because its been the result in a lot of cases where theres overwhelming evidence of misconduct. So it was a stunning decision. What is your reaction to that interview ramsey orta gave today . There is a sense in ferguson whether its true or not but definitely there are some people who say Bob Mcculloch never wanted an indictment and the way he conducted the grand jury was to assure that outcome. Do you feel the same way about donovan in Staten Island . I certainly do. What mr. Orta said illustrates that. But even more important illustration of that, he gave all the officers who were present other than pantaleo immunity so that their testimony for their testimony so they would be immune from any kind of criminal prosecution. How he could do that in the face of the fact that mr. Garner was we believe killed by not just one officer but a group of officers who not only compressed his neck but compressed his chest. So from the beginning of this process he granted immunity to officers who should have been suspects. So let me get this straight. He granted immunity we see a number of people in that infamous video of course. Daniel pantaleo is the man who applies that arm to the neck. And he was the one who testified for two hours. But the other officers had already been granted immunity in exchange for their testimony although some people would say, well, thats a good prosecutor trying to get people to roll on the person who was there. You had videotape. You didnt need their testimony. You had videotape. You had mr. Officer pantaleo saying he didnt apply a chokehold. The medical examiner said there was a chokehold. There was petechial hemorrhage on the neck which was evidence of a chokehold. Sow didnt need these officers to get an indictment. Understand were not talking about a conviction. Were talking about a reasonable cause, probable cause to believe a crime had been committed. And thats all they were supposed to get looking for. Was there anything in the conduct of the grabbed jury did you have a morning one day where you woke up following this case and you said i dont like the way this is going . Well, the fact they took so long disturbed me because what happened is i think what happened in ferguson, they made this grand jury into a trial. But its a onesided trial. Its not an adversarial proceeding. So i was concerned. But when i heard about the immunity, which i didnt know until actually two days ago, it seemed to me the fix was in. The officer in question, theres a lot of people calling for him to be fired. Daniel pantaleo. What do you think . Well, you know, he killed somebody unjustifiably. I dont think he should be an officer in the city of new york. We dont need those kind of officers. There are a lot of very good officers, dedicated people who do their job day in and day out and do it because they want to help people. Their reputation, their job is made harder by bad officers who are not weeded out and are not fired from the force. What does it say to you that the city had already filed a civil rights suit against him, settled a civil rights suit against him for 30,000 for what appeared to be a pretty humiliating moment in which he had strip searched two gentlemen, stripping them down to their underwear in the street . Right. That kind of conduct suggests fairly outrageous conduct by an officer. You dont do that. Thats clearly against the law. Its not unusual for officers to have complaints and to have nothing happen to them. I cant tell you how many cases ive had over the years where weve had officers caught on tape engaged in misconduct, officers who juries have found have violated constitutional rights, where juries have found acted with malicious and willful intent so the jury gave punitive damages who nothing happens to them in the Police Department, in fact they get promoted. Jonathan moore, attorney for eric garners family. Thank you very much. Really appreciate it. Yeah. When we talk about whats happening with eric garner or Michael Brown or tamir rice in cleveland, theres a sense in which people talk about black lives matter and they talk about police and they talk about the kind of gap that opens up between communities of color in particular and police. But there are of course many people who live in both of those worlds. My next guest is one of them. Eric adams is the borough president of brooklyn but he spent 22 years as an nypd officer, as a captain in fact. Was the Founding Member of 100 black Law Enforcement officers who care. An organization of black Law Enforcement officers. You then went on to be a state legislator. Youre now Brooklyn Borough president. That sound from the head of the patrolmens benevolent association, that the mayor threw them under the bus, whats your reaction to that . I dont think thats true. The pba, pat lynch, hes going to protect his members. The mayor has to protect all the people of the city of new york and ensure we have effective policy. So hes going to do and say what he believes is necessary with his overarching and important position that the mayors taking right now. And its the right position. So having spent 22 years in the nypd, what do you think the locker rooms and precinct houses around the city were yesterday when that came out . Well, i think that it probably makes some guys may have looked at it as saying you know what, we didnt expect this. Some may have thought they did. But i think we need to emphasize that many of those officers are going to hit patrol, theyre going to do their job and theyre going to do it effectively, but those who arent doing it effectively would need to ensure that its corrected and have the training thats needed. Theres a few ways people think about what weve seen here. One of them is talking about stop and frisk. Okay . Stop and frisk of course a policy im sorry, broken windows a policy inaugurated under Rudy Giuliani. A kind of concept of Crime Prevention that says you penalize people and you enforce small infractions as a way of sort of creating a sense of order. And a lot of people pointed out the fact that eric garners infraction was selling loose cigarettes allegedly, untaxed cigarettes. The mayor and commissioner bratton say they believe in this kind of policing still. What do you think about that . I do as well. You really do . Yes, i do. I dont want to return to a city with people that urinate on the street, where people are discourteous to everyday new yorkers. What you do is you use the right amount of force to correct small infractions. Someone should not lose their life because theyre selling loosies. And that is the difference. How you approach someone for a minor infraction should be the same way throughout the city. And were not doing that. As a Police Officer, as someone who has dealt with im sure thousands of situations throughout your career in which youre making a judgment in the moment about deescalating, escalating, danger, threat, what do you say when what do you think when you see that tape . When you see that officer come in in the situation that another officer seemed to have under control . Exactly. And escalate. And thats at the heart of what were looking at. In certain communities on park avenue in manhattan we use calm and collective and reasoning, and on park place in brooklyn we believe we go from zero to 100. We cant continue to use this high level of force for minor infractions. And thats what the commissioner and the mayors looking at. How do we effectively let police know theres one standard of policing in the city and were not doing that for 20 years. Weve got to remember that. A rookie cop that started 20 years ago was indoctrinated in policing that was ineffective policing. What do you mean by that . What was that indoctrination . Stop and frisk. No longer looking for bad guys but for any guys. Using marijuana arrests, infraction. This whole process of believing that the answer to all the issues is arrest first. That is not the policing we need to look for. We need to keep calm and order and not disorder. And the answer is not only in apprehension and incarceration. Should this officer in question be fired, officer pantaleo . Yes, i believe. I believe anytime an officer takes the life of an innocent person they should no longer wear a blue uniform. They cant just merely be placed on a desk. I dont believe you can accidentally take the life of a person and remain a Police Officer. How much faith do you have in the training announced by the mayor today . This was great training. When you look at what theyre because training doesnt can training change the things were talking about here, which is the snap judgments, preconceived bias, a set of cultural assumptions about people youre dealing with . Do you think that can be trained out of people . I think your question is a great question. I cant modify your heart, but i can modify your behavior. And if you cant modify your behavior, i must remove you from the agency. What we are doing differently now is that when officers leave the academy, within six days they forgot about all that good training when they go to communities of color or impoverished areas. They keep that good training when they go to great communities that they perceive as great communities. When you what is that dynamic about . Why does that happen . Because many people believe the indoctrination once you get into a Police Precinct and have real conversation and an oldtimer tells you forget about that stuff youre in the bunker now. Exactly. This is how you handle it. And when someone tells you and you begin to believe you that no long your want to treat the people in that community with the same level of respect because of their economic conditions, then you have a problem. And thats what we have to change. That is at the heart of this problem, that were not treating all new yorkers the same. Eric adams, former new York City Police officer. Take care. You can see protesters now fanning out across the city yelling shut it down, shut it down. Last night several key transit points in the city shut down. Cars backed up for long distances. We see protesters now in what appears to be the west side highway. They marched up through downtown as they fan out and shut down traffic across the city. Some protesters have head add cross the Brooklyn Bridge into brooklyn. And as we walk the protests not just here in new york but in washington, d. C. That have also shut down some major traffic arteries, as we see them in minneapolis and protests planned as well in boston and some in los angeles, there is a question about whether this will add up to anything in terms of national policy. Is there anything washington can do about the way this country is policed . Joining me now, Elijah Cummings, democrat from the house, who has some strong feelings about this. Congressman, are there National Solutions on capitol hill to the discontent being expressed that were seeing right now . First of all, i think there is a tremendous amount of frustration. Not only were the people who were watching in new york protesting but all over this country. And yes, there are some things that we can do. And i think the president has begun to shine a light on these problems. Keep in mind, chris, a lot of people when they heard about Police Misconduct said, oh, no, that cant be. Can imagine. And so on a national from a national level, again, this whole push by the president for body cameras, i think thats a good idea. I think its a good idea to do the task force. We need to look at things like these military weapons in neighborhoods and policing used by police in various communities. We need to look at diversity with regard to how does the d. O. J. , can they have an impact on making sure that Police Departments are diverse. And borough president adams just said something very interesting when he was talking about the whole idea of training. Training is important. A lot of times there are biases and there are issues. Maybe police dont even know the impact that theyre having on people but it can be very, very negative. And basically, chris, i can tell you, i live in the inner city of baltimore. In the area where the wire was filmed. And people are basically looking for respect. They simply want to be respected. So again, i like the way the mayor in new york has handled this so far. And i think thats part of the reason why you have the Peaceful Demonstrations there. Because somebodys saying, wait a minute, lets at least take a look at this, try to figure it out and try to address these issues. You know, we saw in this country this massive spike in crime. It started in the late 1960s and 1970s. It sort of reached a crescendo if you look at the data in the late 1980s, early 1990s, and then weve seen this remarkable thing happen. In city after city that had Different Police tactics and different dynamics weve seen crime fall, pretty staggeringly, actually. Do you think that has changed the politics on capitol hill or are the politics on capitol hill still very much mired in the kind of crime politics that were central in the 1980s and 90s . I think that politicians everywhere are looking at crime from a different perspective. Keep in mind that a lot of the crime youre talking about was drugrelated and weve got people sitting in jails today, chris, who have gone to prison for years for nonviolent drug offenses. I think congress is looking at that and a number of jurisdictions are looking at that. And youve got people in colorado lining up with dollar bills for marijuana while ive got people in baltimore sitting in prison for buying and selling marijuana. Again, yes, i do think the policies have changed. One of the things we found here in baltimore is we had more of a at one time we had more of a stop and frisk and they were arresting all of these mainly africanamerican men and they had and they thought that was the right thing to do. But when the mayor reduces that stop and frisk and we found that our crime rate actually went down. So a lot of this is about respect. Weve got to get back to that. By the way, body cameras are not enough. Theres some kind of way weve got to police and the people they are supposed to protect and serve have got to come together. Congressman Elijah Cummings of baltimore, thank you very much. Thank you. You heard the congressman talk about body cameras. The president of course announced a Pilot Program to purchase body cameras. And theres a lot of people in the wake of the eric garner decision who i have seen saying wait a second, if we had this on tape, what difference will body cameras make . Im going to talk to one of the most outspoken advocates for body cameras here in new york after the break. To treat symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently. Tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medicines, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex. 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And the reality is it revealed the flaws in the criminal Justice System and it also revealed injustices. And so im not prepared to say that it was a hollow victory. The reality is that body cameras give an objective view of individuals encounters. And im glad to have supported it and im glad to have pushed for it. But has it changed your thinking at all . What was your reaction when you saw the video and then you saw the decision by the grand jury . I was very disappointed. But body cameras were not the endall beall. There were clearly a number of other issues were pushing in the city of new york Going Forward including but not limited to the fact we really need an independent prosecutor whenever it comes to Police Shootings or whenever it comes to any deaths. And so we are urging Governor Cuomo to appoint a special prosecutor in cases like this. So would this be now, the governor in my understanding has the power to do that. He had the power to do it in the case of donovan. He chose not to. Chose not to. Do you think it should be written into law or you just want to see the governor make that regular practice . I want to make it a regular practice. It would be great if it could be written into law but the reality is Going Forward on any cases where there is Police Misconduct resulting in death or serious injury we should have a special prosecute because theres an inherent conflict in local prosecutors and because they rely upon Police Officers. So ive heard i think the body camera issue is interesting. I think its really caught fire in the wake of these various incidents. Obviously, the president has endorsed his Pilot Program. Is the idea in your mind that we have an objective record of what happened or is the idea that it acts as a kind of check on the worst instincts of Police Officers who know in the moment that they might do something this they shouldnt be doing that theyre being watched . Evidence suggests that when Police Officers wear a body camera their behavior comports to, you know, certain behavior. So its clearly it will change their behavior. And all across this nation as we study body cameras when Police Officers wear body cameras it automatically changes their behavior. And weve seen this in some places in Pilot Programs in california. Theyve used it, right . In reel toe, california it has reduced the number of claims, false claims against Police Officers. Its resulted in the exoneration of Police Officers clearly Going Forward and right now in new york city we spend 212 million in claims as a result of Police Misconduct. So when you have a camera obviously it will reduce those claims and provide us with an objective recording. But say that number again. 212 million. Not annually. Last year. 212 million in police in claims, yes. In claims. In claims. Wow. Thats a lot. Thats a lot. And clearly, you know, obviously police cameras, body cameras are just one part of a larger discussion regarding aggressive policing in the city of new york and nationally. Do you think the direction of policing here in new york city is headed in the right direction . Mayor de blasio has set the right tone. Hes framed the narrative. Working with him on a wide range of issues. Today he announced retraining. Were talking about again issuing summonss for nonviolent offenses and for serious and for relatively minor offenses in the city of new york. And so theres a wide range of things including providing diversity to the department above the office of captain. Public advocate patricia james, thank you so much. Thank you. Really appreciate it. Protesters continue to walk up the west side highway, and some are headed downtown to the Staten Island Ferry Terminal as hundreds, thousands throng the streets here in new york protesting the decision not to indict new York City Police officer in the choking death of eric garner. Well be back with much more. Our streets our streets at this hour new york city protesters just down a few feet from us, streaming up park avenue, blocking traffic, taking over the street, shouting through bull horizon, justice for eric garner. This happening as protesters fan out across the city. Some headed down to the Staten Island ferry, protesting in 80 cities around the country tonight in the wake of that grand jury decision not to indict eric garner. And reaction nonindict the officer that put the chokehold around eric garner. The reaction to that nonindictment of officer Daniel Pantaleo hasnt cleaved to the normal or expected redblue liberalconservative divide. For instance, heres how glenn beck reacted. I dont know exactly how this happened, but i will tell you this. The decision of the grand jury in new york on the death of eric garner, heres a guy who was not resisting arrest, was not being a jerk. The video is very, very clear. How this cop did not go to jail, was not held responsible, is beyond me. Well, thats not even indicted. Hes not even indicted. Right. Glenn beck isnt alone. In fact, theres been a huge array of conservative thinkers and writers and media personalities who are more or less saying the same thing that i think most people say when they see that video, which is something horrible happened here and there should at least be a criminal indictment. But the big difference seems to be between liberals and conservatives and frankly between a lot of black folks and a lot of white folks in how they understand this is the degree to which race played a role in this. Last night mayor bill de blasio used the phrase black lives matter, which has become a rallying cry in the wake of several deaths of black men at the hands of police around the country. But that, that sticks in the craw of a number of commentators on the right. First of all, there was no racism in this case. Theres no indication this was if this man were a white man resisting arrest at that same size the same thing would happen. From my knowledge of the case theres absolutely no element of racism here and there was no intent by the Police Officer to cause any type of deadly harm or physical harm at all to the decedent here to mr. Garner. I think this would have happened to a white guy doing the same thing. I dont think it had to do with skin color. I think it had to do with poor judgments made by the group of Police Officers. Joining me now, msnbc political analyst michael eric dyson. Michael of course got into it with former mayor Rudy Giuliani on meet the press on precisely this issue. What is your reaction to that . On the one hand youve got so many folks saying look, this was messed up, its hard to look at that tape and think it wasnt messed up, but this isnt about race. You know, this is about the just the police or this sort of thing is a tragic accident. Well, a couple of things, chris. On the one hand it makes me know that what im doing is so important in schools that im trying to teach young people that race mds isnt just about calling someone the n word or feeling negatively about black people in your mind or soul. You know, professor eduardo banil silva says you can have racism without racists. And you have structural impediments that have people flourishing in reference to racial realities but may not appeal to somebodys conscious racial bias and weve got to really help people understand that. Number two, from the perspective of many of those commentators, of course they dont think it has anything to do with race because they are not constantly engaged with the peril and the terror of wondering is their blackness the cause of some kind of alienation, estrangement, fear, or trepidation on the part of people who engage them . So they dont have to think about race, therefore they dont. And so they dont see the connections that many of us and many other of our allies understand when it comes to race, that what were trying to say here is that the likelihood of this kind of event occurring to a big white guy is rather minimal when compared to it constantly happening to socalled big black guys. And you dont have to be big, of course, but it certainly exacerbates the tension thats are already there just beneath the surface. You know, ive seen this argument used by a few people, bill oreilly being one of them but others who say look at the numbers. Theres actually a sort of shocking number of deaths at the hands of police in the u. S. We dont actually have a great count of it. Could be not counting as many as 500. But when you compare it to other countries its just way out of whack. But you know, in the grand scheme of things were talking 140 or 150 or 200 africanamericans killed at the hands of police, you know, and then they say, what about crime, what about, quote, black on black crime . What is that argument about to you . You know, its about doing everything but what is necessary to do. Its about acknowledging the nose on your face. Its about trying to deny whats most obvious. I dont want to invoke occams razor here, whether its been misinterpret or not. But the fact is we dont want to plain deal with the fact that race makes a difference in a lot of stuff that goes on in this country and to call it into question is to really be on the defensive because a lot of people say oh, no, all youre doing is being racially paranoid, youre being racially obsessed, look at all the black people killing each other, look at the relatively minor numbers of Police People who kill black people. But theres been a brilliant deconstruction of that kind of, you know, what we call statistical myopia by bill oreilly, and theres been a challenge to the use of those numbers and what we end up seeing is lies, damn lies and statistics. But lets put it this way. Those are minor numbers. And it doesnt make a difference except if its your life. If you lose your life over something thats wrong, one is too much. Much less 300 or 400 of the like. So the reality is the way in which those numbers fuel other racial realities in this country that have to be dealtw poor schooling, horrible neighborhoods, the way in which people are racially profiled in retail stores, then you put the police overlay on it. So its the aggregate of all the data that we can command here to suggest there are tremendously difficult things that black people and brown people and other poor people have to deal with who are people of color. And ill tell you what else, chris, which is amazing to me, is that what many of our White Brothers and sisters dont understand again is that the same kind of arguments theyre making now were made against Martin Luther king jr. Youre an interloper, youre exaggerating, youre addicted to the media, youre coming into places where black people get along with white people without your kind of intervention, theres not much racism here, youre making it up. The same thing was said in the 50s and 60s and 70s. I know. Ive done the history. I know what was said. Martin luther king jr. Had a letter written to him by, what, seven protestant clergy and a rabbi. You know, youre creating trouble, youre creating tension, this is a problem here. So dr. King said, you know, what we have to do is to understand that america is so deeply infected with racial bias, both conscious and unconscious, that we just cant even begin to understand how deeply indebted we are to certain kinds of racial logics that make what many White Brothers and sisters think seeing common sense and what black people think is paranoid and invented and made up. Michael eric dyson, always a pleasure. Thank you. Thank you, my friend. All right. Attorney general eric holder got before a microphone today and dropped some jawdropping truth about the Police Department in the city of cleveland. The worst parts of that, ahead. Hands up, dont shoot youve tried to forget your hepatitis c. Its slow moving, you tell yourself. I have time. 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We have determined that there is reasonable cause to believe that the Cleveland Division of Public Police engages in a pattern and practice of using Excessive Force and as a result of the systemic deficiencies including insufficient accountability, inadequate training and equipment, ineffective policies and inadequate engagement in the community. Attorney general eric holder today in cleveland announcing a department of justice report that is incredibly damning about the patterns and practices of the cleveland Police Department, a Police Department thats come into the public eye recently with the shooting death of the unarmed 12yearold tamir rice, who was holding a pellet gun. Among the shocking findings in the report, this one caught my eye. This is something that investigators found. We observed a large sign hanging in the vehicle bay of a district station identifying it as a Forward Operating base, a military term for a small secured outpost used to support Tactical Operations in a war zone. Throughout the last few months in the wake of ferguson youve heard people talk about feeling as if the police were an occupying force. This Police Station in cleveland apparently embraced that identity. Another finding in accountabilityregarded matters, in terms of Police Investigating deadly use of force or Excessive Force. This again from the review. Deeply troubling to us was that some of the specially trained investigators who are charged with conducting unbiased reviews of officers using deadly force, admitted to us they conducted their investigations with the goal of casting the accused officer in the most positive light possible. Joining me now, ohio state senator nina turner. And senator turner, this report i would imagine is probably not news to a lot of people in cleveland but certainly pretty damning document. Yes, chris. And some of those details that you just read are pretty surprising. You know, one bright side to this, though, in all of this is we cannot forget that the mayor of the city of cleveland did ask for the department of justice to come in and to do this investigation and we as a community have to stand and be ready and be committed to make these changes, be ready, not to be afraid to deal with what is right in front of us, that we have a very real problem not only in the city of cleveland Police Department but all across this nation, as you have been highlighting in your show. We also got some new information today, again, also fairly disturbing, about the officer, timothy loehmann, who shot and killed tamir rice, the 12yearold boy holding that pellet gun. We found out he had unsuccessfully applied to be a new York City Police officer, he was turned down, he had then joined a suburban Police Department, independence, ohio, and was asked to leave after less than a year at that Police Department, described as emotionally unstable, unfit for duty, including handling of firearms described as dismal. It appears the cleveland Police Department never checked his past record. How is that news being met there in cleveland . You know, its very disturbing. He should have never, based on that evidence, he should have never been allowed to join the cleveland Police Department. There is much work to do, is that revelation. The fact that young tamir rice did not even stand a chance, chris, that he was shot less than two seconds from the time the police reached the scene, that is unconscionable. It is totally unacceptable. And we, the collective we, the Police Culture has to change. We have to deal with the subliminal biases that police tend to have. And not all police. Because the report was very clear that the vast majority of cleveland Police Officers do the right thing. But there are components within that Police Department that need to be changed and we have to have the courage to deal with that. A little 12yearold boy lost his life. His family is reeling from that. A community is reeling from that. And we cannot ignore that. So something has to be done. And im certainly glad to see that the mayor has a commitment to make those changes that the d. O. J. Is talking about, and to partnership. Im very hopeful to that. Something has to happen because tamir rices death cannot be in vain. State senator nina turner in ohio. Youre seeing live images right now in new york city as throngs take to the streets protesting the death of eric garner, the decision of the grand jury not to indict the officer who put him in a chokehold. Lots more after this break. Here they come. 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And raising a ruckus in reaction to eric garners death and what they see as the lack of accountability for that death at the hands of the new York City Police department. Well be back with much more live from new york after this. Just moments ago a throng right behind us marching saying hands up dont shoot, a chant popularized in the wake of Michael Browns tragic death in ferguson. One of the things thats made this eric garner decision so difficult for people, has made people so angrys we have videotape of the incident itself. Youve probably seen that tape. But theres probably more tape you havent seen that might be even more upsetting. Were going to show that to you ahead. I dont know where were going, dude. Throngs of protesters now boy once upon a time, there was a nice house that lived with a family. One day, it started to rain. The house tried to keep out all the water, but water got inside and ruined everybodys everythings. The house thought she let the family down. They just didnt think it could happen. They told the house they would take better care of her. Always. Announcer protect what matters. Get flood insurance. Throngs of protesters now flowing through the streets of Lower Manhattan tonight at this hour, walking in the streets, stopping traffic. Chanting whose streets, our streets. No justice, no peace. A huge group coming in now, coming up from downtown new york. You can hear the chant. The last moments of eric garners life, i cant breathe, i cant breathe. I cant breathe i cant breathe that chant of course is a reference to the last few moments of eric garners life that were caught on camera. But the tape of that continued after that, and what came afterwards is almost more upsetting. Back off. Back up. Come on, lets go. Back up. Could you back up, please . Were trying to give him some air. Getting him an ambulance. You got him on the floor, yall talking about back up . You hear this . Now youre trying to get him an ambulance, after they harassed him, slammed him down, nypd. Nice try. Ems is coming down the sidewalk. Did anyone call the ambulance . Sir, does anything hurt you right now . Its ems. Sir, ems is here. Answer their questions. Okay . He cant breathe. Sir. Its ems. Come on. Were here to help. All right . Were here to help you. Were getting the stretcher. All right . Were going to try to get him up on the stretcher. Its going to take six of us. Why aint anybody doing cpr . Why aint anybody doing cpr . Because hes breathing. Hes breathing . Yeah. After they beat him up, did whatever they did to him. Joining me now, harry segal of the daily news who wrote about that portion of the tape. What you said was more chilling even in some ways than that first part of the tape. Why . Because this man is lying there, he needs medical attention, he was a threat to nobody, and hes treated literally like a piece of meat. Hes tossed on a gurney. An emt comes out, touches him for a second to see his pulse, doesnt clear his airways, does nothing. And then he dies of a heart attack on the way to i think on the way to the hospital. And you have these people standing around. There is no sense of what the urgency of the situation actually demands. Youve got officers just standing there arms folded. Absolute total casualness to everyone on the scene. No. Not to the people filming and the people they have stuck inside stores, clear the way, clear the way. And theyre saying he cant breathe. And the cops are just utterly dismissive. And this mans on the ground. Hes unconscious. Hes unresponsive. And theres no care. Its not the way you want to see a human being treated. We see in the last frame of that the officer in question, the one who the grand jury declined to indict, Daniel Pantaleo, waving at the camera. Which is, given everything thats happened, pretty shocking and pretty chilling. He didnt know that this man was going to die. He had taken him down. Im sure hes taken down lots of guys. I know there are three suits against him the city had to pay out for for doing pretty rough things, all to black people. And i think he thought, hey, this is just another day on the job. Up until he died. You chronicle youre a columnist at the new york daily news. Youve been chronicling this era of policing. What does this mean for this era . We had a Mayoral Election that was covered nationally because it was about in many ways turning the corner from a kind of a style of policing that people had come to really resent, particularly people of color in this city. Where is that turn now in the wake of the garner decision . This mayor whos very progressive and sincere and the Police Commissioner are trying very seriously to turn the page. You see these protests here. They are so different from occupy wall street and the ones under kelly and bloomberg. Theres a lot more space for people. Theyre trying to let pressure out. They changed policy dramatically on arrests. Many less misdemeanor arrests. The crimes are going down. Thats the pressure. If the crime numbers start going up this whole narrative of reform goes away. But yet at the same time theres polling that says people dont believe people thought crime was going up. These old habits die hard about how people think good policing looks. Well, part of that is the New York Post and the police unions, which have a narrative of urban apocalypse. Every day. Every day. And they hate this mayor. They think chirlane is black lady macbeth, and its gotten very nasty. And the unions in the meantime are saying things, they complain so much about quotas under the last administration. Bratton says ill give you discretion and their response is to threaten a work slowdown. The police. Its really remarkable. Outrageous. Harry segal of the daily news. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you for having me. That is all this evening. Live in new york city as protesters continue to fan through the streets here, shutting down traffic. The the Rachel Maddow show starts right now. Contribution its been great having you out there. Youve seen the footage as chris has been live in the streets. Further footage here. Union square in Downtown Manhattan tonight from just moments ago. Thats the larger image on the left side of your screen there. You see a line of protesters there basically in a tense standoff with Police Officers on motorcycles. Those protesters then marched through the city, marching down broadway chanting hands up, dont shoot. Weve also got shots from foley square. Foley square is further downtown. Further south in Downtown Manhattan. Its where city hall and the big judicial buildings and new York Police Headquarters are located. There are reportedly Something Like 5,000 people converging in and around foley square tonight in new york city as we speak. These are images coming out of washington, d. C. Tonight. Loud and ive got to say relatively cheerfullooking
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