Plus the Republican Party formally censuring two of their own to get to the bottom of january 6th and Party Leaders sparking criticism after calling the events of that day Legitimate Political Discourse. We knew they were coming after liz cheney and Adam Kinzinger, which is in addition to Everything Else completely undemocratic but the real shocker of course was trying to sanitize the mob violence and attempted Coup On January 6th as Legitimate Political Discourse. We are now the party of the big lie officially. Plus a moment of defiance on the sidelines of the olympic games. Russias Vladimir Putin and chai into chinas xi jinping showing a united front. How they blasted the u. S. And its allies over the standoff at the Ukraine Border. And controversy with cameras in the classroom and punishing violators including teacher. Why critics say its designed to censure and intimidate. Good morning, everybody. Its saturday, february 5th. Im lindsey reiser. From chicago to ukraine well be covering it. In florida mike pence went further than hes gone before in credit sighing his former boss. During his speech to the conservative Federalist Society pence called out former President Donald Trump by name saying hes wrong in his claim that pence had the right to overturn the 2020 election. I heard this week that President Trump said i had the right to overturn the election. President trump is wrong. I had no right to overturn the election. The presidency belongs to the American People and the American People alone, and frankly, there is no idea more unamerican than the notion that any one person could choose the american president. Under the constitution, i had no right to change the outcome of our election. Trump fires back in a Statement Doubling down on his claim, adding i was right and everyone knows it. Josh lederman joins us now more, good morning. Lindsey, for four years former Vice President mike pence was former President Trumps loyal deputy, trying to keep any conflicts between the two in quiet, even as on january 6th protesters were chanting Hang Mike Pence but now those tensions between the two men are bursting out into the open as the former Vice President makes clear he disagrees strongly with his former boss on the idea that he had any Legal Authority to intervene or to overturn the results of the 2020 election. Now a source close to pence tells us former President Trumps recent comments blaming mike pence for not intervening and saying the fact that democrats are now trying to change the rules for how those electoral votes get counted was a reason that pence decided he felt he had to speak up now. Now were seeing the fact that the Vice President is more willing than he has ever been before to publicly distance himself from the former president. Up until now, mike pence said that he and former President Trump might never see eye to eye on january 6th but hes never come out this far and actually rebuking his former boss, something thats being watched very closely as republicans wonder whether former President Trump, former Vice President pence or both may seek the president ial nomination for republicans in 2024. This infighting between pence and trump coming as another incident of Friendly Fire has been breaking out at the rnc, where there was a vote yesterday to actually formally censure both republican lawmakers, Adam Kinzinger and liz cheney, the only two republicans who sit on that January 6th Committee that is investigating the attack on the capitol. Both have been cut off from gop support. We should point out a lot of senior Republican Leaders would like for these tensions between republicans to stay in the background. They would like for republicans to be talking less in public about the 2020 election and more about the elections that are coming up, the midterms just a few months away in november and of course the president ial race two years from now. They would like to see republicans focusing more on bread and butter issues that helped republicans win that election in virginia for the governors race, with Glenn Youngkin just a few months ago but were seeing increasingly january 6th and the results of the last election still very much on republicans minds, particularly those named mike pence and President Trump as they head towards the next election. Lindsey . Josh, thank you. For more welcome back miles taylor, former department of Homeland Security chief of staff under trump, now the Executive Director and cofounder of the renew america movement. Good morning, thanks for being with us this morning. Good morning. I want to play what former pence aide olivia troy said last night about pences remarks. I was shocked. I will say this, to hear him finally say donald trump is wrong. I have never in my entire tenure of working for the Vice President have heard him ever say those words especially publicly, and so i think that was a big step for him. I mean, do you agree . Weve been hearing a lot about how significant this moment is, but youve been very critical in the past saying you never saw pence stand up to his former boss. Is it too little, too late . Well, lindsey its a good question. I fully agree with olivia. Its shocking. Both of us sat with mike pence. Ive known him since he was a member of congress on capitol hill from indiana and rarely have i seen him stand up like this, if ever. He certainly didnt do it even Behind Closed Doors when donald trump was saying incredibly offensive things or pushing for illegal or immoral actions. First i would say it is disappointing that were 13 months out from these events, and remember, mike pence opened his remarks in florida by saying that this week, he heard that donald trump believed that he had the ability to overturn the election. Thats not true. Mike pence knew in real time as this was happening that mike pence wanted him to overturn the election, and he should have been pushing back in real time. That said, you cant understate the significance of this moment, because it truly could be a flashpoint that creates a schism within the Republican Party that needs to be exploited by the rational side. Keep in mind, over the course of the past year, a lot of the gop electorate frankly has been radicalized by donald trump into believing this notion that the 2020 election was stolen from them, and that mike pence had the ability to unilaterally overturn it. Pence pushing back creates an offramp for those people to go from the radical side hopefully to the rational side, but i will still say this, lindsey. When i joined the Republican Party many, many years ago, our ambition was to be a big tent party. Instead we are a Big Lie Party at this point and its still an access of insurrectionists that are running the gop. Miles, what is it about pence and his influence that gives an offramp . Weve seen mitt romney. Weve seen murkowski and collins, cheney and kinzinger, all these people have given this offramp for what you call the rational side of the gop, but it doesnt seem like a ton of people are taking that offramp. Well, look, when you dig into the numbers, its clear that the big bulk of these gop primary voters are going to be tough to pull away now from the big lie. The damage has been done, but there is reason for hope in some of the poll numbers weve been seeing very recently. So just the other week, john bolton released a new poll that showed big, big damage in terms of trumps brand in the Republican Party. Last year, one in three republicans in the United States called themselves trump republican. That number is now getting close to one in ten, so Donald Trumps support is actually slipping among his base, more and more republican primary voters say they want to see a fresh face and i think that lends credence to the notion that pence coming out against trump is a potential offramp. It gives some of those folks who no longer call themselves trump republicans some other figure to hang their hat on and a different direction to go, albeit one thats only degrees of difference. Mike pence needs to go further than he did if he really wants to lead a rational faction of the Republican Party. What do you make of the january 6th insurrection called Legitimate Political Discourse and what do you make of the censures of cheney and kinzinger . First, its truly disgusting. We are talking about an event thats only happened one other time in American History and we talk about sheas rebellion from the 1800s in very, very dark terms an attempt to overturn our democracy. This is similar and should be talked about in dark terms in the future. What i worry about is the gop Legitimizing Discourse around a peaceful protest is going to affect our History Books for years to come and is going to create deep societal divisions over that event. That said, its clear in the fight within the Republican Party to define whether this was an insurrection or peaceful protest, The Good Guys are losing. This is arsonists versus firefighters, the arsonists have almost complete control and the firefighters, liz cheney and Adam Kinzinger are being told to leave the scene and put down their hoses. Whats ironic about this to me is the two people that could save the Republican Party are being expunged from the Republican Party actively by its leadership. That shouldnt just be worrying to that cohort of rational republicans. It should worry all americans, including democrats who want to be able to work with another side that isnt inclined constantly to take hostages and never give them back as always, youve given us a lot to think about. Miles taylor, thanks for your time. Thanks. Still to come, President Biden orders 2,000 more troops to Eastern Europe but ukrainian officials claim russias army is reaching full combat strength. Were going to talk with a retired Lieutenant General who has been meeting with ukrainian counterparts. Later, can you imagine being monitored every second of your day . A new republican sponsored bill in iowa could mean cameras in every Public School classroom with penalties for teachers who dont go along with it. Teacher dont go along with it oh. Oh. What ing on . Oh, darn let me help. Lift and push and push there. Its up there. Hey joshie. Wrinkles send the wrong message. 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This morning, chinese president xi jinping and russian president Vladimir Putin have deepened their partnership against the west, saying there are no limits to their alliance while expressing joint opposition to the expansion of nato. Meanwhile, Russian Troops along the Ukraine Border have reached full combat preparedness, according to Ukrainian Military officials speaking to the New York Times. U. S. Forces seen here yesterday are training Ukrainian Forces as they prepare for a possible invasion while President Biden orders 2,000 more troops to Eastern Europe. For more we turn to matt bradley, who is live in ukraine. Good morning. What more do we know about the meeting between putin and xi and how the u. S. And ukraine are preparing for russias next move . Reporter the meeting between putin and xi, this isnt entirely new, as the world increasingly especially the Western World increasingly Ostracizes Moscow and beijing. We started to see these two coming together saying to each other, if you dont have a friend, then you have a friend in me. This is a major point of pressure for both of those world leaders. For beijing, when it comes to taiwan and their perceived expansionist policies towards taiwan, same with the russian leader, and Vladimir Putins perceived expansionist policies toward here in ukraine, it helped that Vladimir Putin went to beijing for the olympics armed with a contract for 10 billion cubic meters of natural gas every year for the chinese. They seem to be finding common cause with each other against the west and we heard from the ukrainians in the New York Times telling that reporter that it looks as though the russians are now at full capacity to invade ukraine. Now that wouldnt be so surprising, the u. S. Has been saying that for quite a while, even though ukrainians have been playing that down. If they invade theyll likely come right through here, harkiev in the eastern part of ukraine and in this area of ukraine, i was there and heres what we did. This Border Crossing on europes Eastern Fringe Stands as a monument to displacement and despair. Whats life like on the other side . Translator its like we are Indigenous People being oppressed by colonizers. We are not allowed to go either here or there. Reporter on the other side the selfdeclared lahansk government has been at war with ukraine. For the thousands that cross back and forth on this bridge into russiancontrolled territory every day, war with russia isnt imminent. Its their past, present and future. What is the significance of this crossing . Translator this point is very important for the People Living on both sides because its the only one thats still functioning. Most people cross the checkpoint to get their pension, get vaccinated, visit relatives or buy groceries. Reporter here the west pledges of support have always rung hollow. Is there anything else you want to tell the world about this . Translator tell biden please dont send troops to shoot around here. Well deal with our own problems. Reporter so as you can see, lindsey, for most ukrainians, war isnt imminent. The russians are already here. Lindsey . Very interesting perspective, matt bradley, thanks so much. For more were joined by retired Lieutenant General ben hodges who has been meeting with ukrainian officials as part of a u. S. Delegation. Lieutenant general, eight a pleasure to have you on here. Right now, what do you make of the reporting from the New York Times citing the Ukrainian Military that portions of russias army have reached full combat strength and appear to be in the final stages of readiness for military action, should the kremlin order it . Well, lindsey, for sure Russian Federation forces have been gradually building up really since last year using exercises to sort of mask what theyre doing to build up their capability, so were in a dangerous time. When i was in kyev, i talked with president zelensky, its very clear. Hes not confused about the threat. They know what is out there and what the potential is for a very serious attack. Is he essentially putting forth a more relaxed persona outwardly not to close panic. Behind closed doors and maybe in conversations with you its much more serious . Look, he has a difficult challenge, for sure he is concerned about the survival not just of his government but the sovereign state of ukraine. He knows this is what is at stake but he also knows what the russians are doing is not just preparing for a conventional attack but also trying to ruin ukraines economy and cause the collapse of his government. So is he concerned. Hes trying to balance how do you avoid the destruction of the economy enat the loss of the resources that are needed to defend the country. Hes not asking for american troops to come into ukraine. Hes asking for Financial Resources as well as weapons and ammunition. Should the west worry about this strong stance from china and russia . I think were worried in part because the Chinese Communist party is watching how we do in this particular case with ukraine. If the United States cannot muster all of our allies and all of our partners and deter the kremlin from a further attack in what is obviously and clearly illegal, if we cant stop that, i dont think the Chinese Communist party will be really impressed with anything we say about taiwan or the south china sea, so this has implications well beyond ukraine. Lets talk about this claim from the pentagon that russia planned to create a video depicting a fake ukrainian attack on russians to justify an invasion. Right now the administration hasnt provided evidence. We know right now russia, the kremlin, theyre denying these allegations here. Should the administration which says they are protecting their sources and methods, should they provide evidence . Well, look, first of all, this is entirely bleefl. Believable, soviet now russian technique to do things to create pretexts. The russians have been giving out russian passports in donbastk and other places and say its their duty to protect russianspeaking people wherever they are. This is entirely in step with their normal procedure. I like the fact we, the u. S. Government, are being much more open talking about things like this, that we discovered. This is part of challenging the kremlin and the Information Space and giving, shining light on the fairytale that comes out of moscow. I got to be quick with you here because im out of time. Where do you see this going over the next few days . Is diplomacy still an option . Diplomacy is absolutely still an option and i am so impressed with what the administration has done more comprehensive and intensive than probably 1995 and the Dayton Peace Accord but we really need germany to put the Posure On Moscow as well. Retired Lieutenant General ben hodges, thanks for joining us. Thank you, lindsey. Wicked Winter Weather is leaving Tens Of Thousands of people in the dark and the cold in parts of the country as well as stranding passengers on more than 1,600 canceled flights this morning. What more can we expect, after the break. The break. I think they look good, man. Mm, smooth. Uh, they are a little tight. Like, too tight . Might just need to break em in a little bit. You dont want em too loose. For those who were born to ride theres progressive. With 24 7 roadside assistance. Okay. Think im gonna wear these home. Excellent choice. Age is just a number. And mines unlisted. Try boost® high protein with 20 grams of protein for muscle health. 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So puffs plus lotion rescued his nose. With up to 50 more lotion, puffs bring soothing relief. A nose in need deserves puffs indeed. Americas 1 lotion tissue. From tennessee to new york, about 188,000 customers are waking up without power this morning and more than 1,700 Flights Canceled as a result of treacherous snow and ice. Records for the coldest morning lows could be shattered in areas of South Central texas, following really one of its most significant icing events ever there in the Lone Star State. People in new york and new england, theyre digging out from more than a foot of heavy snow in some areas. For more on all this, we turn to nbc news correspondent Meagan Fitzgerald live in chicago. Youve been there in the freezing cold for a better part of the week, what you can tell us . Reporter its not letting up. Forecasters say the storm made its way out of the country, its these freezing temperatures that remain from texas as you mentioned up to the northeast. Here in chicago, the windchill is bringing temperatures below zero degrees. The biggest concern is dangerous ice. This morning the Winter Weather in many parts of the country tightening its grip. Some 10 Million People across the southeast from oklahoma to arkansas under a freeze warning, already the icy conditions wreaking havoc. Slick roads leading to crashes on major highway in texas backing up traffic for hours. Coming in from ohio shot straight down to avoid the big storm and you cant avoid the black ice. Reporter Freezing Rain Weighing down power lines and causing trees to topple over. In the Lone Star State fears the subzero temperature also shut down the power grid, reminder of last years deadly crisis that lasted for days. Most of the state will continue to experience subfreezing temperatures for a few more nights. The power grid continues to perform well. Reporter but still, some 30,000 customers are without power. Here we go again. It did get down in the 40s in our house, so we were Walking Around with our down coats on and staying warm. Reporter in alabama, just outside montgomery, a tornado ripped through, tearing roofs off homes, Tossing Trees and injuring at least eight people. You can see the debris but this one beat on the house. Reporter Snow Pounding Residents from illinois to the northeast and into new england. The storm is throwing everything at us. We have snow. We have freezing rain. We have sleet. We have icy roads. Reporter in central new york, know and even half inch of ice is a storm thats causing millions of people to dig out. Now youve seen those treacherous Road Conditions but its also impacting the skies. Over the last couple of days, we have seen thousands of cancellations and delays, heading into the weekend, were already seeing nearly 2,000 delays and almost a thousand flights that have already been canceled. Lindsey . Meagan, you and your crew stay safe out there, thank you. Still to come, republicans in iowa have a new idea how to monitor what kids are learning, Surveillance Cameras in the classroom. Well break it down next. E classroom. Well break it down next worries sure would help a lot wouldnt you like to get away . Sometimes you want to go where Everybody Knows your name and theyre always glad you came among my patients, i often see them have Teeth Sensitivity as well as gum issues. Does it worry me . Absolutely. Sensodyne sensitivity gum gives us the dual Action Effect that really takes care of both our Teeth Sensitivity as well as our gum issues. Theres no question its something that i would recommend. If you have Type 2 Diabetes or high blood pressure. Youre a target for. Chronic kidney disease. You can already have it and not know it. If you have Chronic Kidney Disease. Your kidney health. Could depend on what you do today. Farxiga farxiga is a pill that works. In the kidneys to help slow the progression of Chronic Kidney Disease. 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Locke was not named in the search warrant. Students at Virginia Tech were told to shelter in place for three hours overnight because of a shooting. Its been almost 15 years since the horrific shooting on campus, one of the worst in u. S. History. The overnight shooting happened at a nearby hookah laung, one person killed, four others hurt. Police are following up on leads. A story that has millions of people around the world transfixed, a desperate Rescue Operation in morocco, a 5yearold boy trapped in a well more than 100 feet down. The well gets narrower at the top, so rescuers cant go down themselves. Theyre trying to dig a hole into the hillside to get to him but its a Del Crat Operation Delicate operation because of the risk of a landslide. Imagine cameras installed in every Public School classroom so parents and guardians can watch every moment. not George Orwells classic 1984. Were talking about a new republicansponsored bill in iowa. The bill would fine teachers and staff who dont keep the cameras working or obstruct their view. Deduction 5 of their weekly salary per infraction. A similar bill was proposed in florida. The lawmaker who proposed the bill is designed to increase the involvement of parents in their childrens education. This is part of a growing Movement Among conservatives across the country who want more say in what kids are taught at school. Opponents say its meant to intimidate teachers teaching race and history. According to pen america, a free speech Advocacy Group in the first three weeks of this year, more than 70 bills have been filed in 27 states all to regulate the teaching of topics like race and sexuality. Here to discuss this with us is Democratic State representative Sharon Steckman of iowa and Ranking Member of the Education Committee. Representative, good morning. Thanks for being with us. Good morning, thank you for having me. Appreciate it. What is your reaction to this bill and where does it stand right now . Well, its waiting to go into subcommittee. Theres a meeting wednesday at noon with the three that were assigned to that bill and well see where it goes from there. You know, i entered office as a retired educator to help education and to work for Public Education and i find this is not the path that i want it to be going down. What are your specific concerns . Im speechless. Well, first of all, the privacy of the rest of the students in the class. Weve had cases where we have an informants child in a class and they cannot be photographed or a video could not be taken of this em. We have kids that are having custody battles, health issues, maybe they have a seizure in the class that everyone then would be able to see, all of those issues are not, you know, what we should be doing in our Public Schools, and i have talked to teachers who reached out to me and they said if they pass Something Like this, were just leaving. Theyll leave en masse. I want to get back to that in one moment. I know your states dealing with a teacher shortage. First i want to ask you, it appears republicans are tapping into this idea that parents need more say in what kids are learning, and in a lot of cases like we saw in virginia, its working for them. So what are you hearing from parents . Is this a solution to a problem that exists or does it really exist . No, it does not exist. If they had taken time and gone to the school, every single book in the Card Catalogue at the school is online. They can look at it. The curriculum, they can call the school and see exactly what their kids are learning. I, as a teacher, would have loved to have i did have parents come in my classroom. I welcome that, come in, see what im doing. Come in and volunteer, help me out, you know . We like parent involvement. Teachers are not the enemy. We need to be working together for all the kids education. What does this is a to teachers . What are they telling you . Because your state is dealing with a teacher shortage. You guys are trying to find new ways to recruit and retain. I doubt that a bill like this would be a part of that strategy. No, we have over a thousand vacancies across the state. I heard from one of my former students who is now a teacher. He said thats alarmed at the teachers leaving his school right now, and he said you know, if they pass this bill, and the bill that says they have to have lesson plans written for an entire year at the beginning of the year, he said i can go get an i. T. Job and make lots more money than im making now, but i love what im doing, so theyre demoralized and this is not happening. We have five bills right now pending in the Education Committee that regulate what Civics Teachers can teach, what Government Teachers and social studies teachers tying their hands. We need to be teaching our kids Critical Thinking skills. You need to look at both sides of an issue and come up with their own thoughts and they cant do that if theyre not hearing the whole story. The president of the National Education association, becky pringle, says instead of wasting public funds on monitoring equipment, we should employ additional qualified professionals, reduce class sizes, and provide more programming that helps students acquire the skills they need. Right. This is on top, representative, of covid protocols, testing thats expensive, this is on top of infrastructure. What other Classroom Needs could that money go to instead of these cameras . I dont think we have enough time. Small class sizes, especially i did my Masters Program on class size. It makes a world of difference. Better pay for teachers, more offerings for the kids. When i began teaching years ago, we had a nurse in every school. We had a counselor in every school. We had small class sizes, all those things are gone now. We have one librarian for our entire School District and my Elementary School is closed two days out of the week because theres no one there. Not my school, my libraryandin the school, excuse me. State representative Sharon Steckler we appreciate your time and perspective. Thanks for joining us. Thank you so much. Coming up next, hope for the parents of our countrys youngest. Kids under 5 could soon be eligible for their covid shots. How soon they could get in arms, next. Y could get in arms, y could get in arms, next lunchables built to be eaten. Do you struggle with occasional nerve aches in your hands or feet . 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More than 900,000 americans have died from covid, thats more than the population of san francisco. But there is some good news. Americas youngest could get their covid shots as soon as the end of this month as the fda weighs authorizing Pfizer Vaccines for kids under 5. Stephanie stan is outside Johns Hopkins hospital in st. Petersburg, florida. Reporter good morning, Young Children and babies 6 months to 5 months to 5 years old, we could see approval as early as the end of the month. Pfizer is asking the fda to review its Clinical Trials data, this move comes more than a year after the Pfizer Vaccine was approved for adults and since that time, more than 317 million doses have been administered in the u. S. Last fall, the vaccine was approved for children ages 5 to 12, but approval for kids under 5 has hit a few road blocks along the way. Youll recall that in december, pfizer announced its initial twodose trial for that age group failed to produce enough antibodies against covid, as a result the Company Begins testing a threedose regimen and believed that is the menlg minute the fda, the protocol the fda is expected to approve. The vaccine for children under 5 for all age groups in america. This would be a major milestone, this is how we continue to create a wall of protection around our children under 5, as we look to safeguard their health. Reporter many parents say they are relieved about this vaccine, others may not be as enthusiastic, in fact according to the latest cdc data, only 28 of kids ages 5 to 11 on average have received at least one dose of the covid vaccine, but the numbers really vary greatly depending on the state, for example, when you look at vermont, youre seeing numbers around 63 , so very high, but then when you look at mississippi, the numbers only around 11 and i can tell you that here in florida, just over 20 of kids ages 5 to 12 have received at least one dose of the covid vaccine, so at this point, lindsey, all eyes will be watching this to see how parents respond when it comes to children in that very young Age Group Ages 6 months to 5 years. Stephanie stanton, thank you so much. Switching gears here in just over a week from the super bowl, and on the first day of black history month, a black nfl coach slapped the league and three of its teams with a lawsuit accusing them of Racial Discrimination in their hiring process. Former Miami Dolphins head coach brian flores claims he was brought in by the New York Giants for a Sham Interview so they can say they met the leagues rooney rule which requires teams interview two external minority candidates. Flores talked about his decision to file this lawsuit, while hes still a candidate for at least one nfl head coaching job. I understand the risks, and yes, it was a difficult decision and i went back and forth, and like i said, i love coaching. I do. Its something that im passionate about. It brings me joy. Brings me joy. And i love helping young people reach their potential and become the best versions of themselves. Im gifted to do that, but this is bigger than that. The nfl has issued a statement denying the claims, saying theyre without merit and the teams deny the allegations, too. Take a look at this. According to the national law review, there have been fewer than two dozen black head coaches hired in the History Of The Nfl in a league where 70 of the players are black. First black head coach wasnt hired until 1989. As it stands now only one of the teams has a black head coach. Lewis moore is an Associate Professor of history. His work is cited in flores lawsuit. He also wrote the book we will win the day. And Charles Coleman is a Civil Rights Attorney and msnbc legal analyst. Charles, i want to start with you here. From a legal standpoint, how significant is this lawsuit and what will his attorneys need to prove . Its explosive. What we know about the nfl is the racism that exists has existed for a long time. The rooney rule is a rule that places the emphasis on quality rather than outcome. What has resulted is Sham Interviews that other black coaches like flores have engaged in in the last three years. He highlights a disturbing interview with the broncos, talks about the Text Messages he received with bill belichick, congratulating him on a job he hadnt interviewed yet by mistake. Because all of that spoke to what was not going to be a legitimate shot at getting a job. This is a lawsuit that has very serious implications, but i also want to underscore, in addition to the racial implications that the lawsuit has, there are also the allegations that the nfl has not taken seriously with regard to competitive tampering by its owners. So basically flores said he was offered money to throw games and lose as a black coach when he was in miami and he refused to do so. And thats why he was fired, even though he won eight out of his last nine games. That is something that has very, very Serious Problems with it when you think about what it could do to the league. If the nfl cannot prove the seriousness of the competition, they cannot maintain their fan base. Professor moore, im assuming that when you read this lawsuit you werent at all surprised by the allegations . No, this is something that weve heard about for a long time. What the lawsuit does is just really open that up. Ill give a story to sum things up. In 1973 Ebony Magazine put out an issue on the black coaches. There was four black coaches at the time, all assistants one of them says in a few short years the nfl is going to open up and black coaches will be throughout the league. 50 years later theres still just one. We saw black Sports Figures that took a stand, curt flood, mohammed ali, colin kaepernick, took a Lightning Rod when he took a knee during the national anthem. So does this represent Flores Prioritizing people who will come after him above his own Coaching Future . Yeah. I think flores knows that this might be the End Of The Road for him. But like the guys you mentioned, they understand that whats coming next is more important. To create an opportunity for guys there now, but also that young kid that wants to be the next mike tomlin or brian leftwich. They dont have that dream and i think flores is going to give them that opportunity. I want to play an interview about this. Take a listen. I think the problem is, theres a real discomfort for a lot of general managers, president s and owners of looking at black leaders as black men as leaders. You know, we could be your Walter Payton man of the year, you can be our mvp, our ambassador and go out and shake hands. But when we need somebody to lead our organization, we often look in other directions. Charles, you obviously see the implications and significance after lawsuits are successful. So should flores be successful in this lawsuit, do you see real change coming as a result . One of the things about that question is, it depends on how you define success. I think the nfl is absolutely going to move to settle the lawsuit and throw a lot of money at flores to sort of go away if they can. But the question is, what does injunctive relief look like when you talk about the Rooney Rule Being established. You dont want to move into a situation pushing people around quotas, where you mandate there are a certain number of minority coaches that have to exist in the league. At the same time what youre talking about is the need for a serious Culture Shift and its set at the top and maintained through accountability. I dont know if the nfl is ready for that. The question of what success is in this case is a looming one and one that we have to figure out. Because in order to really make change and have this be something that no longer has a place in the nfl, this is something we have to take seriously around figuring out. Its not just about number one throwing money at flores to go away and be silent and we never hear from him again but we dont have any black coaches. Or the alternative being that we just hire black coaches just because. I think we have to have a nuanced, skilled, thoughtful and sophisticated approach to how we solve this really, really significant problem. So appreciate your time and taking a deeper dive into this. Thank you. Thank you for watching msnbc reports. Velshi is next. Velshi is next voltaren, the joy of movement. Woman i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. Now, theres skyr with skyrizi, 3 out of 4 people achieved 90 clearer skin at 4 months after just two doses. Skyrizi may increase your risk of infections and lower your ability to fight them. Before treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. 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