conversations with orban and putin. kent? fiona hill assessed both leaders both putin and orban extensively talked ukraine down, said it was corrupt. said zelensky was in the thralls of oligarchs. did dr. hill think that that had an impact on trump's outlook? kent. i cannot recall what she said in that meeting besides giving me the brief readouts of those two meetings, but that was my takeaway and that those two world leaders along with rudy giuliani shaped the president's view of ukraine and zelensky and would account for the change from a very positive first call on april 21st to his negative assessment of ukraine when he had the meeting in the oval office on may 23rd. peter and the table back. jeremy, it's been pointed out to me that we are folkused obviously on the call, the summary of the call. but that the origins of the scandal were put in motion way before the aid was actually held up. and i think peter and his colleagues have written about