Transcripts For MSNBC Countdown With Keith Olbermann 20090718

congress are prepared to work as hard as it is going to take to make this happen. and i am grateful for the work that they've already done. i'm confident that we're going to be putting in a lot more hours. there are going to be a lot more sleepless nights. but eventually, this is going to happen. >> mr. simon, place your bet. >> i think health care reform is not in trouble yet. but it's on the verge of being in trouble. i think douglas' statement at the cbo is an extremely damaging one. because it strikes at the heart of what president obama is saying. president obama's fundamental argument is, we can't do nothing. because if we do nothing, health care gets more expensive and the system collapses. elmendorf is saying, well, he's half-right. if we do nothing health care does get more expensive. but if we do what president obama wants, it gets even more expensive. therefore doing nothing becomes an acceptable option. whenever you give congress the option of doing nothing, they're going to take it. so this could be a real death knell, unless the administration can take on the facts and figures how we're going to pay for this thing. >> do you want to bet on the history of doing nothing or bet on the president on this one? >> so far he's been very much a wonder kid and everything he touches turns to gold. however, when you have supporters in the back room scratching their head and please let us come back after august to revisit this and have a sustainable system where we're not bankrupting the economy more than it already is, i think he has a tough road ahead of him. >> roger simon, what do you think they'll get before the august recess? do you think they'll get out of the senate finance committee? >> i don't know. i suspect -- i don't think he is really going to get a health care bill from the house and senate by the august recess. and i'm not sure he's going to get a bill on his desk -- >> we're going to have to leave it there. thank you, roger simon and maria teresa kumar. chris matthews will return monday night at 5:00 and 7:00 for more "hardball." "countdown" with keith olbermann starts right now. which of these stories will you be talking about tomorrow? first class hypocrisy. governor mark sanford flying high on the taxpayers' dime. the phony fiscal conservative won't take federal stimulus money to educate the poor, but he will spend public funds on expensive airline tickets to south america. you know, the place where his mistress lives. >> i've let down a lot of people. >> a conservative think tank allegedly putting its thoughts up for sale to the highest bidder. do i hear two million? when fedex tells you it absolutely won't be part of your paper plate scandal, there's always u.p.s. what can green do for you? turns out not every mccain loves joe the plumber. daughter megan sets her sights on huss her father's unofficial campaign mascot samuel wurzelbacher. quote, joe the bummer is a dumb ass. he should stick to plumbing. crank calls gone wild. the brash pranksters who dupe others all for the enjoyment of their internet followers but have the jokes gone too far? >> you need to break a window, ma'am. >> the king of pop's new song hits the internet. ♪ and the wait grows longer for the toxicology report that might answer the question of what killed michael jackson. on monday a custody hearing to figure out who gets michael's kids. all that and more now on "countdown." good evening from new york. i'm david shuster in for keith olbermann. the governor never liked that crazy stimulus. the governor is a fiscal conservative. as a candidate he attacked officials for their hefty travel expenses, quote, this kind of lavish spending with taxpayers footing the bill just doesn't make any sense to me. if i become your governor i'll fix that problem. in our first story on the "countdown" that governor spent nearly $500,000 of taxpayer money traveling first class and staying in the best hotels. whoops. some of those trips by governor mark sanford of south carolina were to argentina where he visited his mistress. evidently sanford had no problem with his own personal stimulus plan. when sanford became governor of south carolina more than six years ago he did institute stricter rules about travel expenses for all state employees but records released under the freedom of information act offer a different picture for governor do as i say not as i do. more than $44,000 for sanford's first class and business class tickets. including trips to poland, china, and london. in june of 2008, a south american trade mission where he later rendezvoused with his mistress. air fare? close to $9,000. sanford later had to reimburse the state for part of that. during almost all of these trips other state employees flew further back in the planes in coach. officials in south carolina are already responding. from the state senate minority leader, i reckon he's a hypocrite. and from state senator larry martin, a republican, i think it's going to be a huge disappointment to a lot of folks to realize that he just isn't the type of person on a number of fronts that people thought he was. but governor sanford's spokesman sees nothing amissaying the governor was always very judicious and compares quite favorably with previous administrations on use of the state plane. and we believe he would compare favorably on his use of other state travel as well. but even sanford's use of the state plane easily exceeded that of his predecessor. and this footnote. regarding the governor's most recent trip to argentina when he went awol, the department of homeland security was concerned about his whereabouts. let's call in msnbc political analyst and author of "renegade, the making of a president" richard wolffe. great to see you. just when the governor thought he was out of the spotlight his own records drag him back in. >> yes, the moment of maximum peril. just when you think you're in the clear and all the storm has blown over, what comes out? another story to confirm what people have already thought about you, that you're not quite what you seem. you're not telling the truth. this is a guy who came in under the banner of authenticity. different kind of politician, someone who would clean things up, as you said. he was campaigning against bad stuff by his predecessor. there really ought to be a blagojevich test on these people. you know? if you really can't live up to the standards of someone who gets indicted before you or falls into disarrreput you ougho pack up and go home or at least go to argentina. >> the truth is most people would not begrudge their governor traveling at least in business class unless he railed against that kind of thing as a candidate and unless he was so frugal with state funding that he wanted to deny stimulus money to those in need. >> well, those are two important analyses but i would suggest that maybe the voters of south carolina wouldn't be too happy about him taking a side trip in argentina to go dove hunting. i mean, really, it's not exactly a trade mission. i don't know what kind of trade he's doing unless it's dead birds but, you know, yes, there is a legitimate case for governors, of course, to travel business class. that's fine. no one begrudges that. but the hypocrisy piece of this is important because it takes the story in another direction. again, it comes back down to the idea that he's not telling the truth, lying, deceiving people, and a core element of his story, not just the family values piece, but the money, the fiscal conservativism wasn't true either. that's the reinforcement that's so difficult. >> and a criminal probe found sanford committed no criminal wrongdoing on his trips to argentina, but now a state legislative panel will hold hearings on whether sanford spent state money on tyrsts with his mistress. so the whole mistress-soulmate misive not yet going away. >> and what's the downside for these state officials, state legislators to go after this stuff? you know, his base has collapsed. if you're a republican you want to show that you do take this stuff seriously, you have values and stand for something you believe in but sanford pretended he upheld those and if you're a democrat of course you want to make as much hay as possible. so, yes. this one rumbles on because he has given them the ammunition. >> by the way, when sanford was interviewed by the associated press about a recent trip to argentina he evidently lied claiming he flew coach. it seems to make the hypocrisy that much more egregious which may or may not have been too much for a sanford spokesman who announced today he was resigning. abandon ship? >> when the rats disembark there is a signal. look, the spokesman, the communications director said he was leaving for personal reasons. you know, mark sanford was not in the clearest of minds when he was speaking. let's forgive him the ap stuff but nothing else. >> how much damage does this continue to do to the republican party the longer that sanford decides to essentially dig in and say i'm not going anywhere? >> well, for a start, there's nothing he can achieve in south carolina but more broadly for the brand, you know, the party needs to clean house. it's very hard when it comes down to a state level but nationally and sanford was for better or worse a national figure, too, they've got a lot of cleaning up to do and they need to find some new characters to pin their hopes on. >> msnbc political analyst richard wolffe, thanks as always. we appreciate it. >> thank you, david. >> you're welcome. and today a cold case in the area of politics, sex, and hypocrisy has suddenly become white hot, thanks to a lawsuit filed by the wife of a former republican congressman. chip pickering who served 12 years representing the third congressional district until his retirement in january. in the lawsuit filed against pickering's mistress, pickering's wife claims the adulterous relationship ruined both the marriage and pickering's political career. she claims mississippi governor hailey barber then offered then congressman pickering the senate seat of trent lott in 2007 and the lawsuit further claims pickering's mistress insisted if pickering accepted the position their relationship would not be able to continue. a spokesman for barbara denies that the governor ever offered pickering that seat but here's the real curiosity. not only did mr. pickering campaign on family values and pushed a constitutional amendment against gay marriage, not only did he call for the resignation of president bill clinton, but mr. pickering was living in the christian fellowship home on c street in washington, d.c. otherwise known as the fellowship or the family while he was allegedly carrying on his extra marital affair. the c street fellowship hall was also occupied by the nevada senator now confessed adulter john ensign as well as former congressman and now confessed adulter er mark sanford. let's bring in our msnbc political analyst eugene robinson. great to see you. >> good to see you, david. >> eugene, wow. that c street fellowship was busy. >> it sure was. you know, they did a lot of bible study there and you have to wonder what parts of the bible they were reading. i mean, some parts they kept reading again and again, the part where so and so begat so and so and somebody else begat somebody else. you know, and all the lying with that they did in parts of the old testament. clearly, they seemed to keep going back to the racy parts and took that as some sort of example. >> obviously democrats sometimes have affairs, too, but on the republican side there seems to be that extra layer. these republicans campaigned on family values as if they had them and their opponents did not. >> they did. you know, obviously, the republicans have no sort of lock on the market of sin. democrats, sure, if they were all to be found out, it would balance out. but that is a crucial difference, because it does bring the whole hypocrisy question into play. and, you know, let he who is without sin cast the first stone. well, clearly, the republican lawmakers are not without sin. they keep throwing the stones. and their glass houses keep getting shattered. >> as a party, have republicans learned any lessons about the family values or are there still plenty of office holders and candidates ready and willing to go there? >> ready, willing, and able and, you know, it seems to me almost, and this will sound silly, but it seems the way it's happening that it has to be learned one congressman and one senator at a time. after someone is found out in one of these affairs and there's a scandal you don't hear a whole lot more from that individual whose sex life has been exposed in that way. you know, preaching to everybody about family values. but it's -- it seems that the party as a whole doesn't quite get the hint. it's not that you have to be in favor of immorality as a party. it's just that if you claim to hold yourselves to some sort of impossible standard, well, dog gone it, you don't make it because it's an impossible standard. >> and getting back to this c street stuff at the house, a cautionary tale there. i mean, should religious right republicans seriously not -- seriously consider not living together ever? and on top of that, should spouses now be skeptical when a congressman says, i won't be home this evening because i'm studying bible with the guys. >> i think a lot of spouses probably have already put that house off limits to their lawmaker hubbies. i think one lesson to be learned here is you can imagine an atmosphere that something like the atmosphere of a very pious frat house and even a very pious frat house is not, perhaps, the healthiest atmosphere for someone to spend those long nights, you know, away from home here in the sodom and gomorrah of washington. and once again, we find that, you know, it's better if they just, at the end of the day, go home. >> and just like their fraternity houses where things are all fine and on the up and up, there are also of course religious study groups where these things don't happen, where they do actual religious study and studying the bible as opposed to studying, i don't know, other things. those people have to be the most infuriated of all because it essentially diminishes their work. >> it does. and unfairly, as you point out. of course there are bible study, religious study classes and seminars and groups that get together and this sort of thing doesn't happen, but, you know, it's a bunch of republican congressman and it's this one c street house. it just -- there seems to be a tendency there and one hopes we've heard the last of it, but who knows? >> some of us hope we haven't heard the last of it, eugene. eugene robinson, pulitzer prize winner and native south carolinian, eugene robinson of msnbc and "the washington post." thanks as always. >> good to be here. >> okay. a conservative think tank full of thoughts and opinions if not any actual principles. the american conservative union accused of putting its endorsement up for sale. $2 million? $3 million? it would believe whatever a corporation asked. fedex apparently said, absolutely, positively not. but did u.p.s. deliver? we'll find out, next on "countdown." re/max agents have the experience to get the job done. nobody sells more real estate than re/max. where do you want to be? the amazing always infinity. ♪ it's astonishingly flexible. ♪ unbelievably soft. ♪ and has an amazing material... that's 4x more absorbent than you may need. making fluids seem to... poof... disappear. just like magic. ♪ always infinity. have a happy period. a day on the days that you have arthritis pain, you could end up taking 4 times the number... of pills compared to aleve. choose aleve and you could start taking fewer pills. just 2 aleve have the strength... to relieve arthris pain all day. a right wing think tank accused of offering its endorsement based on which corporation would be willing to cut it the biggest check. has conservative thought become more corrupt than we suspected? nope. sounds like conservative thought could be exactly as we suspected. an astroturf campaign is defined as a public relations campaign seeking to create the impression of being spontaneous, grass roots behavior. and a stunning example of that our fourth story on the "countdown", conservative principles apparently for sale in the nation's capital. in a letter obtained by politico.com the executive vice president of the american conservative union dennis whitfield two weeks ago wrote a letter to federal express allegedly trying to pry money from that company in exchange for the acu's support in a legislative battle with u.p.s. over unionization. first, the come on. quote, we have reviewed your concerns regarding the nlrb, national labor relations board, and we believe we could strongly support your position. we stand with fedex in support of this legislation. then show us the money. quote, for the activist contact portion of the program $2,147,550 to implement the entire program. when fedex said it wouldn't pay the acu flipped and joined with other groups, informing fedex it was going to back the u.p.s. position. we are going to actually stop this story right now because we do have some breaking news now. we have just learned from cbs news that the newsman who poignantly informed the world of the assassination of president john f. kennedy in 1963 has, himself, died today. cbs news a short time ago announced the passing of legendary journalist walter cronkite. he was 92 years old. cronkite spent 19 of those years as the anchor of the cbs evening news. nbc's matt lauer now takes a look back at the life and impact of walter cronkite. dallas, texas. the flash apparently official. president kennedy died at 1:00 p.m. central standard time. >> walter cronkite was a natural born reporter who became as much a part of our lives as the events he covered. >> tension is mounting here at cape canaveral. our interview with the senator will be entirely unrehearsed. >> reporter: his steady telling of history made him the most trusted man in america, chronicling the nation's triumphs and its tragedies. >> dr. martin luther king, the apostle of nonviolence in the civil rights movement, has been shot to death in memphis, tennessee. >> he was a quintessential american. he came from the heartland. he wasn't flashy one way or the other. his reporting was straight forward. >> i just fell into whatever it is i do naturally. >> in a hostile environment of outer space. >> reporter: born walter leland con cite in 1916 in st. joseph, missouri, he was an only child. an enterprising boy, his first job at age 7 was selling magazines and later "the kansas city star." he reported for his college newspaper at the university of texas. at 23 cronkite took a job where he would first make his name as a wire service reporter for united press, covering the second world war. >> united press bureau. make it snappy. >> reporter: he learned to write, as he said later, fast, accurate, and unbiassed. >> it's just one of the most exciting businesses there can be. >> reporter: cronkite accompanied bombing missions over germany and covered the landing of american troops at normandy on d-day. >> i'm just back from the biggest assignment that any american reporter could have so far in this war. >> reporter: after the war he covered the nuremberg trials. by 1950, a new medium beck onondaga. the brave new world of television. edward r. murrow asked him to join cbs news. at the time tv was less reputable than radio, fraught with risk. >> unfortunately it seems to be upside down. >> reporter: for the young reporter, at the time television was the future. even without formal broadcast training, cronkite seemed born for the job. it wasn't always hard news. for a time he cohosted the morning show with a puppet, sha sharlemane but then he was named anchor of the evening news, 15 minutes long. >> as walter grew in stature, television news grew in stature, cronkite made cbs news respectable. >> reporter: less than a year later the news expanded to 30 minutes and viewers increasingly tuned in to cronkite, who saw his job as a mission to get the facts fast and to educate his audience. this is his long-time producer. >> you kind of believed and trusted what he said to you because he had more experience, more knowledge, and it was in a day when news was a much more serious teaching tool. >> he was family. he was someone who made us feel safe and secure. >> good morning. and it's windy. >> reporter: for nearly 20 years cronkite brought the news to as many as 22 million americans every night. his broadcast was the number one evening show for 13 years. he covered presidents from truman to clinton and was fascinated by politics. he took us to convention after convention, perched in his booth over the floor. >> wait a minute. wait a minute. >> reporter: sometimes his emotions showed on air. >> i think we've got a bunch of thugs here, dan. >> we're at t-minus 19 seconds. >> reporter: when it came to american exploration in space, he was particularly excited and awed. during a tumultuous time in our history, his nightly sign-off became one constant we all counted on. >> and that's the way it is. >> reporter: away from the anchor chair he had many interests -- a passion for fast cars and song and dance. and most of all for sailing, a sport he shared with his beloved betsy, their family, and others. march 6th, 1981, after nearly 20 years on the cbs evening news, he anchored his last broadcast. >> this is the cbs evening news with walter cronkite. >> good evening. >> walter was a gold standard. he set the pace. he had this almost personification of integrity. >> walter was the ultimate television preacher who they came to to be told, everything's fine. >> reporter: walter cronkite lived out the rest of his years still itching to cover the big stories that broke. he worried, though, about the fate of journalism. >> journalism ought to be about telling people what they need to know not what they want to know. you must be responsible if we're going to have the informed public that we need to have to make this democracy work. >> reporter: but in the end walter cronkite remained an optimist who believed mightily in america. >> anything i've learned, it is that we americans do have a way of rising to the challenges that confront us. there's reason to hope for the 21st century. >> again, the news from cbs news tonight that walter cronkite, once the most trusted man in america, has passed at the age of 92. he was the anchor of the cbs news from 1962 to 1981, a constant presence for so many people who grew up or watched the news during those 1960s and 1970s. joining us now is margaret carlson of "the week" magazine and bloomberg news. i know you have your own memories of watching walter but what do you think now? >> that piece, which was wonderful, reminded me how much the news mattered and how much he mattered to the news. you know, my daughter's first recognizable face from the tv was she said walter cronkite, because we, you know how you would choose your broadcasts. that was the one that we turned on. and he was always old. i remember when -- can you remember walter cronkite being young? and he always had that authority that comes with looking old. then he had it just because of what he conveyed and how he did it. and it's no slight to the people doing the news now including you, david. you know, he is part of the greatest generation that tom brokaw wrote about. and we've come away since then and it's not that it's not as good. it's just that it's different now. and it mattered so much back then that you, when something happened, you would tune in to walter cronkite. >> walter cronkite's family said that he had been suffering recently with a cerebral vascular disease which is essentially the brains and arteries in your brain and head degenerating so i gather it was tough at the end but by all accounts he had a remarkably healthy, very rewarding and enriching life. >> well, knowing how to say good-bye at the right time was another gift he had. he left when he still had some good years in him and spent them with his family and spent them sailing and seemed to, you know, just lead a good, happy life, which is harder these days in the 24/7 news cycle. back then you felt like there was a possibility that, you know, people like walter cronkite thought about the news. he was an anchor in the sense that he was heavy and grounded but he also still had time to report and have a life. >> margaret carlson of bloomberg, thank you so much. again, the end of a television broadcasting era. cbs news announcing the death of walter cronkite at the age of 92. we will have more on the impact on television, the impact on the news, and more memories of walter cronkite on the other side of this break. you're watching "countdown" 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>> david, thanks for having me. i headed home tonight after "nightly news" and unbelievably i did a telephone interview for a friend who's preparing a journalism textbook and she's writing this in los angeles and i just finished talking about walter and the effect he had on not just my life but our country and our industry. for the past half hour, not knowing until a few minutes ago what had happened. he, you know, from the perspective of my low class living room as a little kid, i was born in '59 so i came up right during the height of the cold war, the space shots as he used to call them, the moon mission, vietnam war, he was it. our dinner couldn't be served in my house until he said, that's the way it is at the end of the broadcast. he was the icon. you know, when that opinion poll came out in the 1970s calling him the most trusted man in america, it stuck. no one quarrelled with it. the moniker stuck to him forever. he was really the first modern day anchor, i guess don huet at cbs is credited with coming up with that term, and people forget over the next couple of days will talk a lot about how he broke the news of kennedy's assassination to the country. we remember the black and white video from that day in 1963. he removes his glasses, loses his composure, just ever so briefly. he was 47 years old on that day. he had covered, of course, world war ii and we're looking at it right now on the air. young men got old very quickly in that era and walter cronkite lived one of the great american lives. >> brian, for a lot of people who were born after walter cronkite was off the air i wonder if you can put in words the steadfastness of the gravitas of walter cronkite that exists to this day, the impact that he still has had on broadcasts, whether it's yours or cbs or abc that the network broadcasts in so many ways were defined by the likes of walter cronkite. >> first of all, try to imagine a country with three networks so just three choices in this amazing new box called television. families, as they used to gather and it's hard for us to believe gather around a radio and kind of stare at it and watch the words come out of it, this was magical. it was black and white but we didn't know any better. and so when the notion of an evening newscast came around, various anchor combinations were tried. the camel news caravan on nbc actually, you know, bore the name of a cigarette company. and then cbs news, they loved the nickname the tiffany network, really made their bones from hard news coverage, dating back to ed murrow, the blitz in london over radio. they came up with a very, very strong combination headed by walter cronkite, who set journalistic standards. he was an old school print reporter from the midwest. he was a no nonsense guy. look, he loved the air time. he was an on camera creature, after all. but his first concern, his first love was journalism. i'm a great collector of the recorded telephone conversations of president johnson and to hear those two guys talking, a president at the prime of his power, an anchorman at the prime of his, really sounds like they're running the country over the phone almost too close a collusion for journalists and president. but walter never crossed that line and he worried about that line until the day he died. he expressed his dismay over some of the trends in television news early and often. >> brian, i'm told that you had at least some contact with walter cronkite as you made the transition into the anchor chair at nbc news. i wonder if you can talk briefly about what you knew about him personally. >> i've been very lucky to get to know him. he's had -- i'm happy to say he's had dinner in my home, and you know when you have public figures who are your icons growing up, people you worship, this is the guy i wanted to be. i don't know how to say it any more plainly. it's so nice when they turn out to be everything you wanted them to be. and this was one such case. he was gracious. he had a terrific sense of humor. walter's friends were walter's friends. and there's no one who made fun of walter more than walter or his beloved wife betsy who we lost a few years ago. a fantastic guy. >> brian, i know that nbc nightly news and msnbc, we've all been going back to a lot of tapes in the preparation for the anniversary on monday of the 40th anniversary of the apollo 11 mission to the moon, and correct me if i'm wrong, but i believe that was the one where when walter cronkite was doing the broadcast he was momentarily speechless when neil armstrong was putting his foot down and that famous transmission, one small step. and later he apologized for being speechless. >> yeah, talk about old school. can you imagine? and they did something quite controversial. obviously we were glued to those grainy black and white live tv images from the surface of the moon, after all, and we watched armstrong step out. we heard walter say simply, man on the moon. and after the landing, cronkite appeared to be drenched in sweat. they cut away from the surface of the moon to show the anchorman. and he had -- he was just looking around in absolute amazement, because this american life had spanned such a great distance. it was still an outlandish idea that this was happening at all, but again, you know, i was watching him that night. i was watching that coverage. it's unbelievable that his death comes now as we're looking 40 years back to the moon shot. and so many americans were watching him at the height of his power. a friend of mine says cronkite used to address the nation. other people did the evening news. >> brian williams, managing editor, anchor of the nbc "nightly news" who got to know walter cronkite and like so many of us grew up watching walter cronkite and his incredible broadcast on the cbs evening news. thank you so much for being part of this and part of our coverage as we remember walter cronkite who died today at the age of 92. brian, thanks again. >> david, thanks. i'm flattered to be asked. >> okay. we'll have much more on the life of walter cronkite, his work, how he's being remembered tonight by his friends. we will talk to daniel shore, a correspondent with cbs news for many years who now works at npr but worked with walter cronkite for so many years. we will talk to him on the other side of this break. you're watching "countdown" on msnbc. 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>> well, my thoughts, i mean, he represented an era. we used to call him uncle walter we felt so close to him. he was sort of a journalist's journalist. he didn't have any airs about him. he took everything as a job that he had to do. i think he'll be remembered by a great many people among other things for going to vietnam after the offensive there which didn't work and he did a piece on camera which he made clear, he said, you know, as a reporter i'm not supposed to give you my opinion but i make a big exception. he said the war wasn't working. the result was that president johnson as we later learned said, we're finished there. if walter cronkite is speaking against it the country will be against it. >> daniel, what kind of managing editor or boss was walter? when you would call from berlin or send your dispatches, describe the interaction when you were overseas and walter was the anchor. >> well, overseas and here in washington, as well, my time was more or less split between the two, but walter cronkite wanted and asked for the type of a managing edit itor of the program. he didn't want to be just another pretty face though he was a good look fellow. he didn't want to be simply handed copy all the time and so he made a point of saying, i'm not just a guy sitting here and you hand me a script or put it on the teleprompter. i am a reporter. he had worked in the early days for united press during world war ii in moscow and eventually came to work for cbs. we used to meet with him every year, all the correspondents from around the world would come in and do a program called "years of crisis" which was a year-end review on cbs. originally ed murrow was the anchor of it and after murrow walter cronkite became that. and it was a thoroughly collegial, i guess that's the word i have to use, thoroughly collegial experience. he never pulled rank although he had a lot of rank. and it was, we got a job to do, fellows. let's do the job. all of us felt that way about him. >> we're looking at video of walter cronkite moderating one of the famous nixon -- or the famous nixon-kennedy debate. so many people are familiar with that moment when walter cronkite took off the glasses and that awful day in 1963 and announced that president kennedy was dead. >> yes. >> did he talk much about it and the impact that episode had on him but also how he put it in perspective -- i mean so many people have now seen that and it was sort of woven into the collective memory of how so many americans experienced the kennedy assassination. >> i think you said that very well. americans tended to see the world through cronkite's eyes. and if walter said it, it had to be so, and uncle walter, which was only half joking, but he was accepted as the presence that when he said it, it was for real. he tried very hard not to let his emotions show and the kennedy assassination was one exception. i remember another exception during the democratic convention in chicago in 1968 when a lot of things were going on including the fact that reporters on the floor were being roughed up by the police and at one point they began pushing dan rather around a little bit and from his anchor booth, from his anchor booth walter said, the camera went down there and walter said, those thugs. and that was another thing i remember. he had to be really something of an occasion for walter to let his hair down and say how he really felt as a human being, because as the kind of professional he was, we just report. we don't let our emotions get in the way. well, it didn't often. >> it was 28 years ago when he retired back in 1981. were you surprised back then when he retired and what do you know about his life since then and how much contact were you able to have? >> well, i don't know how much i want to get into inside baseball at cbs. he was not very happy to retire. he would have liked to have given them two years more. then they put him to work doing things on "60 minutes" but he was like some of the rest of us. we don't have to retire. but they wanted to make room for dan rather. they wanted a younger face. and so on. and so he went not gently into the good night. >> your most recent conversations with walter cronkite and what is it that you think about the next several days and all the collective memories that people will have? what will stand out in your memory? >> i haven't seen walter for a very long time. i think the last time i saw him was when we ran into him in martha's vineyard and chatted for a few minutes. we were not what you would call very close friends. he was a professional colleague and all our relationships tended to be collegial. >> well, daniel shore, we appreciate you coming on and being part of our coverage tonight and helping us remember the career of walter cronkite and what an impact that he had and you had and so many of your colleagues at cbs news and throughout the world of journalism who had the opportunity to be part of that. and thanks again for being part of our coverage tonight. again, cbs news announcing tonight that walter cronkite, the legendary news anchor of the cbs evening news for nearly 20 years, he retired in 1981 but he covered the kennedy assassination, he covered vietnam, he covered the mission to the moon, he covered politics and everything in between. 92 years old. he passed today. cbs news made the announcement within the past hour. we will have more on the life of walter cronkite after this. would recommend it. julia tolbert, tell me your story. well, my irregularity was only occasional and i honestly thought it was just a part of life. what made you first try activia? i saw this ad, and i said, ok, i love yogurt and hey, it worked! humm. announcer: activia is clinically proven to help regulate your digestive system in two weeks when eaten every day. ♪ activia and now try a delicious blend of cereal, fiber and activia yogurt. new activia fiber. walter cronkite the legendary news anchor of the cbs evening news for 19 years died today at the age of 92. what was it like to compete against walter at another network? for an entire generation of us who grew up watching television in the 1970s the cbs evening news at least when we started watching the news, when i did, was something that my brothers and i and our parents did every night. for a lot of us we would simply sit around and talk about what walter cronkite had just told us. it's that sort of impact that you will find on so many people who remember watching the cbs evening news in the 1960s and the '70s until 1981 and then even afterwards when dan rather took over the anchor chair from walter cronkite, but again, the passing of a legend tonight. walter cronkite, the cbs news announcer who this evening died at the age of 92. he was the voice and prism through which so many people experienced the kennedy assassination or vietnam or the floods or the landing on the moon or watergate or political conventions. cbs was unbeatable for many years when walter cronkite was in the anchor chair and he was a difficult person to compete against when you're somebody like hugh downes. despite all the talents of hugh downes who worked here at nbc news before working at abc this was a competitive business and hugh downes joins us now. what was it like when you were there trying to compete against the cbs evening news and uncle walter? >> the funny thing is we got together at space shots and things of that kind but always were very cordial. i don't know either one felt competitive. it was a good relationship and i did get to know him and i'm really saddened to get the news now. even after he was -- he retired way too early but i think one of the things that -- one of many incidents i'd like to give you -- why he was called the most trusted man in america, even years after he left the nightly news, and this was the thing that happened at the height of the monica lewinsky scandal. clinton's family were in martha's vineyard trying to vacation and the papparazzi were all over them and walter offered them sanctuary aboard his yacht. and they escaped that way. they had a whole day, very pleasant day, and they didn't get bothered by the press. then what happened was when they came back the press was all over walter trying to offer him obscene amounts of money to talk about what they talked about, how they felt and he would never say a word. and that spelled out to be one of the reasons that he was the most trusted man in america. >> talk a little bit more about the camaraderie that you and ed walter and others felt toward each other when you were covering things like the mission to the moon. >> yeah. we had a chance to chat and one thing he said one time that i thought was very interesting and it didn't surprise me knowing walter, he knew what it took to be a good journalist and he said this will sound ideological to some people but i admired the way he said it. he said to be a good journalist you've got to be a liberal. and that's something that i think would stir up a lot of problems now with some people but i kind of admired the way he just flat out said that. >> liberal in terms of not perhaps in terms of the classic definition today but rather somebody who embraces freedom of the press and asking tough questions. i think we have just lost hugh downes but, again, in case you're just joining us, walter cronkite, and we've been showing clips now. there he is talking about warren christopher, bill clinton's former secretary of state who also had a crucial role in foreign policy in the 1970s and they're talking about algeria, another big story of the 19

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