Barely everything the user does on the internet including e mail, online chats, and browsing history. We will speak to Spencer Ackerman and longtime innocent expert journalist James Bamford. His most recent article is headlined, they know much more than you think. They claim we are only doing international, only doing Foreign Communications. When youre asking for local phone calls throughout the United States, everybody in the United States on a daily basis, where is the truth in all of these claims . All of that and more coming up. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. The sentencing hearing for Army Whistleblower Bradley Manning began wednesday with a prosecution witness undermining the states own claims mannings disclosures to wikileaks harm the United States. On wednesday, retired Brigadier General robert carr, who oversaw the Pentagon Task force assessing the leaks impact, admitted that not a Single Person lost their lives as a result of the disclosures. Press by mannings defense on deaths resulting from the wikileaks cables, he said tosuggested the main harm the u. S. Was in souring relations with foreign governments and villagers in afghanistan. Manning is facing 136 years in prison after being found guilty on 20 counts for leaking hundreds of thousands of government documents to wikileaks. He was acquitted on the most serious charge against him, aiding the enemy. The prosecution is expected to call up to 20 sentencing witnesses during the sentencing phase. The senate held a longawaited hearing on government surveillance wednesday just as new details emerged on the government spying exposed by Edward Snowden. The Guardian Newspaper revealed details about a secret program called xkeyscore. It allows analyst to search with no prior authorization through vast databases. Slideing to a presentation provided by snowden, it gives nsa analyst realtime access to nearly everything a typical user does on the internet. While the program is supposed to target oversees internet users, the guardian reports xkeyscore provides the technological evenility to target the u. S. Persons for extensive electronic surveillance without a warrant. The nsa deputy conceded that the bulk collection of phone records and minds of americans under section 215 of the patriot act has been key in stopping only one terror plot. More after the headlines. In breaking news, the russian broadcaster rt is reporting Edward Snowden has been issued travel papers and has already left the moscow airport where he has been stranded for over a month. Snowden had remained there despite reports last week russia had granted him temporary asylum. Snowdens father has revealed the fbi tried to enlist him in traveling to russia to convince is under return to the United States. Russian television network, he said he refused. To be in a notional tool for the nbi to use against the fbi to say your father is on the aircraft, what are you come talk to him, i wasnt interested in that area did i wanted there to be valued to my son and i hope youre watching. Your family is well and we love you. We hope youre healthy. We hope you are well. I hope to see you soon. But most of all, i want you to be safe. Edward snowden has been issued travel papers and has left the moscow airport. Egypts interim government has authorized a new crackdown a protest backing houston president mohammed morsi. Wednesday, the government about gradual steps to remove crowd set of occupy the squares and call for morsis return. Protests continued overnight. The u. S. And pakistan have agreed to reestablish a full partnership damaged by rifts over u. S. Drone strikes in the 2011 nato attack that killed 24 pakistani soldiers. John kerry spoke today after talks with pakistani prime minister. I am pleased to announce today very quickly we were able to agree to a resumption of the Strategic Dialogue in order to foster deeper, broader, and more conference of partnership between our countries. And this revitalized dialogue will address in a realistic fashion all of the many key issues between us from Border Management to counterterrorism to promoting u. S. Private investment and to pakistans own journey to economic revitalization. John kerry has invited sharif to washington fo for talks with president obama. He says he still wants his government in the drone attacks on pakistani soil. And the light of todays discussion, we will continue this dialogue on how to stop this policy of drone attacks. Nations is warning violence against afghanistan civilian population is increasing 23 over the same time last year. The figures were disclosed wednesday. The number of civilians killed or injured rose i 23 compared to the same time last year. Deaths and 2533 injuries, total of 3852 civilian casualties. This marked an increase of 14 injuries and 28 in over the same time it in 2012. Usled nato Occupation Forces to do in its formal mission in afghanistan next year. And a report from the pentagon says the Afghan Military will substantial training, advising and assistance including Financial Support goes quote long after the december 2014 withdrawal date thre. Were heldal elections in zimbabwe wednesday in the latest challenge to longme president agave whose main challenger called the elections a huge farce and accused supporters of rigging the vote. A local Observer Group says up to one Million People were prevented from asking their ballots. He African Union has voiced support for the vote saying elections appeared to be peaceful, orderly, free and fair. The United Nations is threatening to forcibly disarm rebels. The u. N. Has given members of ae m23 militant Group Deadline of today to turn in their weapons or face a military offensive. In a video statement, the head of the new you in force for the drc said his troops will establish a new security zone surrounding goma. Used weaponss resulting in civilian casualties. In m23 has also targeted you installations with its fire. Risks to thehe civilian population in goma [indiscernible] security zone in goma. The u. N. Forces operating under an unprecedented Security Council mandate authorizing offensive capability against the rebel m23 and other groups operating in the drcs border region with rwanda and uganda. Rwanda has been accused of backing the m23s operations in the drc. On wednesday, the Rwandan Government said the u. N. Ultimatum risks undermining ongoing peace talks in uganda. A National Strike for a living strike. A right to chicagosupporters, workers rallied outside locations of the donalds and whole foods. And mcdonalds employee spoke to the chicago tribune. We want the right to former union without threat of our jobs. We cannot support our job families. The strike continues with walkout that more than a dozen Chicago Stores today as well as in milwaukee. It follows earlier actions this week by fast food and retail workers in the same cities as well is in new york city. Paid a rareama visit to capitol hill on wednesday for meeting with congressional democrats. Obama sought to rally support for Congress Takes a fiveweek summer recess on issues including immigration reform, the implementation of obamacare, economic proposals, and a renewed budget showdown with republicans this fall. We had a very enthusiastic meeting with the president of the United States. He reiterated some of the message that has gone out across the country about jobs, jobs, jobs, jobs. Seeing everything we do through the eyes of how we can responsibly reduce the deficit to create jobs, to build a Better Future for our children. At least one major disagreement emerge from the meeting when talk turned to obamas pending nominee to replace outgoing Federal Reserve chair ben bernanke. Democratic lawmakers say they raised objections to one of the top front runners, larry summers. Sparkedname has opposition from progressive critics over his role in pushing deregulatory policies that helped cause the financial crisis. According to one lawmaker who attended wednesdays meeting, obama was defending summers from attacks and the left and in the media that he felt were very unfair. The white house said a decision wont come until the fall. Samesex marriages are underway into more states today with the enacting of Marriage Equality laws of minnesota and rhode island. Dozens of lgbt couples have already tie the knot in minnesota after courthouses across the state began holding ceremonies at the stroke of midnight. The first samesex marriages and rhode island are being held just hours later. 12 u. S. States along with washington, d. C. Now allow same sex marriage. Congress has given final approval to a bipartisan measure lowering student loan rates for now, only to hike them in just a few years area did the Interest Rate or stafford loans climbed to 6. 8 last month after congress failed to reach a deal to avoid the hike. Under the new measure passed by thesenate last week in house on wednesday, students will pay a lower rate through 2015 but then see those rates jump as they become attached to financial markets. Nateas votl five members of thel Labor Relations board, the government body that oversees labor complaints. The vote was held after the senate reached a deal last winter approved the president s nominees in return for preserving the filibuster. It gives the panel a quorum of five confirm members for the first time in a decade. The panel has been slowed in recent years by republican refusal to confirm the democratic embers, threatening u. S. Workers main recourse to defend the right to organize and to protect themselves against antiunion activity by employers. A federal court has dismissed a lawsuit from a group of immigration agents challenging the Obama Administrations policy suspending deportations for undocumented residents who came to the u. S. As children. The suit claimed the Obama Administrations deferred action for Childhood Arrivals Program prevents agents from detaining immigrants who could threaten on wednesday, but a Federal District judge in texas throughout the suit saying his court doesnt have proper jurisdiction to decide it. Democratic Congress Member Luis Gutierrez spoke out on the house floor wednesday in support of a group of jailed young immigrants down as the dream 9. They remain in an arizona. Detention center addressing house collects before they leave for the summer recess, he urged support for the release of the dream 9. For those in detention like the dream 9 in arizona and the many others who hav because of could get a ticket and never see the children again because they get deported. I hope there in your thoughts. Speaker, i ask unanimous consent to answer this letter to the president of the United States asking for the release of the dream 9 held in detention in into thend enter record. At least two dream number members remain in solitary confinement after launching a Hunger Strike in attempting to collect the stories of fellow migrants. In florida, a group of activist at the office of rick scott. The law impacted instructions to theirry that impacted decision in the zimmerman trial. They held a mock session of the Florida Legislature were there were joined by jesse jackson. He compare their struggles to that of the Civil Rights Movement sank florida is so far theour time and so governor has rebuffed their actions and called for jackson to apologize for his remarks. North dakota judge has temporarily blocked a law that opponents say wouldve shut down the states only remaining Abortion Clinic area and to to take effect today for the law requires doctors to provide abortions to obtain admitting privileges at a nearby hospital. Such requirements can be impossible because abortion providers dont admit enough patience to meet hospital minimums and because some hospitals oppose abortion. The judge blocked the law while a legal challenge proceeds, saying theres obviously no it. For prochoice activists who departed from San Francisco and new york last week as part of a freedom ride out at the courthouse wednesday in support of the red river womens clinic. Those are some of the headlines. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. In breaking news out of russia, National Security Agency Whistleblower Edward Snowden has been given one year temporary political asylum in russia. He reportedly has artie left the moscow airport where he has been holed up for over a month. On wednesday, the Guardian Newspaper revealed details about another secret nsa program called xkeyscore, based on the documents provided by snowden, xkeyscore allows analysts to search with no prior authorization through vast databases containing emails, online chat and the browsing histories of millions of individuals. According to a slight presentation provided to the guardian by whistleblower Edward Snowden, xkeyscore gives analyst realtime access to nearly everything a typical user does on the internet. In its own training materials, in essay calls at its widest reaching system for developing intelligence from the internet. While the program is supposed to target overseas internet users, the guardian reports it provides the technological capability, if not the legal authority, the target even americans for extensive electronic surveillance without a warrant. Edward snowden first hinted at the program during an interview with the guardian in june. Target anyone, any where those communications will be picked up depends on the range of the Sensor Networks and the authorities that analyst is empowered with, which not all have the ability to target everything. But sitting at my desk, i the authorities to wiretap anyone from you or your account into a federal judge to even the president if i had a personal e mail. The guardian published its expose monday morning just minutes before the Senate Intelligence committee open an oversight hearing on the nsa surveillance programs. Nsa Deputy Director john dingell is conceded the bulk collection of phone records of millions of americans under section 215 of the patriot act has been key in stopping only one terror plot, not ththe dozens officials had previously said. The Obama Administration released three heavily censored documents related to its surveillance efforts, but the white house has refused to classify the legal arguments underlying the dragnet or the original rulings by the Surveillance Court on which the released order to collect phone records was based. President obama will be meeting with a group of lawmakers today to discuss the surveillance programs. The head of the nsa spoke wednesday at the black hat conference, a gathering of hackers and Cyber Security professionals in las vegas. His speech was repeatedly interrupted by critics of the nsas surveillance program. Our nation takes stopping terrorism is one of the most important things. Freedom exactly. And when you think about it, how do we do that . Because we stand for freedom. [blee] not that. But i think what youre saying what isin these cases, the decision, what tool should we have to stop those . [inaudible] congress. t lied to [inaudible] thank you for that. But i do think this is important for us to have this discussion because in my opinion, what you quickly believed is that which is written in the press, without looking at the facts. Williamirector alexander speaking in las vegas on wednesday. Were joined now by two guests. Spencer ackerman is National Security editor at the guardian and his latest piece is, u. S. Government declassifies court order on nsa surveillance as pressure builds. , investigativerd reporter who is cover the National Security agency for the last three decades, helped expose the nsas even existence in the 1980s, his most recent book on the agency is called, the Shadow Factory the ultra secret nsa from 9 11 to the eavesdropping on america. His most recent piece for the new york review of books is called, they know much more than you think. I want to begin with Spencer Ackerman with the news right now that Edward Snowden has left the airport in moscow and is been granted temporary asylum in russia, the significance of this, spencer. It will be fascinating to see how u. S. Foreignpolicy quickly becomes subordinated to the furious demands by the Obama Administration for russia to turn over Edward Snowden. It also creates some tension. Russia is another terry and society. This is something that really cap russia is an authoritarian society and this is something that really cannot , cynical purposes using snowden as a chit against the United States. Can you talk about what it was i mean, obviously, Edward Snowden has had enormous impact in this country and the reverberations are being felt around the world. One hearing after another now. In polls it shows most people in this country consider him a whistleblower, not a traitor. I wanted to start by your focusing on the Obama Administrations declassification of documents yesterday, and the significance of this. It is tremendous. Fabledthe documents were instances of oversight. The nsa and Obama Administration had decided to show commerce has been fully on board with these programs from the start. When you look at what members of congress who werent on the secret intelligence committed committees saudis documents, it a middle east a middle east arts opera talking about the threat of terrorism, the legacy of 9 11, and in describing there are some Bulk Collection Programs of phone records and they never say in the documents that these are all americans phone records, that these collection programs occur without any suspicion of any american with act of terrorism or espionage, which is what the underlying statute authorizing says. The Obama Administration and the nsa issued them right before key surveillance votes. This is what they now turn around and say amounted to congressional oversight and knowledge of these programs. Are these documents that Edward Snowden had already released . Well, no free at these were some different two of the documents or things the Obama Administration used in sort of summaries of the programs not in detail for congress and one of them was a really extraordinary document from the fisa court that comes amid the first document from snowden we published back in june, disclosing the secret order on verizon to turn over all of their subscribers phone records. This one goes into more detail about the rules under which the nsa can access the phone records that it collects from millions of americans, particularly in cases where what the Obama Administration and the nsa has said, lowlevel technical officials like snowden, for instance, can actually access the databases without the fabled reasonable articulable suspicion of connection to terrorism or espionage. It also disclosed there are algorithmic searches the nsa has built, and im sure mr. Bamford knows more about it than any of us will ever know, can explain in more detail, but in those ces dont occur when there is reasonable articulable suspicion, but when an algorithm determines a proper peen should go to an analyst. When we come back from break, we will continue with Spencer Ackerman of the guardian and jim bamford, who has covered National Security agency perhaps than anyone in this country. Stay with us. [music break] this is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. Our guests are Spencer Ackerman of the guardian and James Bamford. , the breaking news at this hour is that Edward Snowden has been granted temporary asylum in russia. Talk about the significance of this and what Edward Snowden has revealed and its effect on what were seeing even just this week from a yesterday and today, in congress. Well, it is an enormous development. Leaving the airport for the first time in the russians had granted him a year. In that year, he will be able to maybe figure a way out ife stha to to one of the countries in south america. It gives them some breathing room. At the same time, it is the final act in this trauma between the United States and russia over what will happen to him. It is very interesting what will happen now. Is obama going to cancel his trip to moscow, which is scheduled for september . Theres a lot of interesting things that will start happening now in terms of u. S. Russia relationship. In terms of what snowden gave away and what he leak yesterday in the xkeyscore program, i the levelas amazing of access the nsa has to worldwide Internet Communications. I have written about this time and again about access to Internet Communications, but two things struck me here was the amount of access, where they can get access virtually anywhere in the world to everyones Internet Communications whether it is e mail or google searches, whatever. , whene other thing was youre looking at these locations, there are three of these locations that are inside the United States. Map, one ofat the them looks like it is in San Francisco, which is where the at t has their large switch up there, where nsa set up their secret room. It looks like that may be one of their locations. Another one looks like it is in texas and another one maybe in new york or maybe along the jersey coast where the cables come in. There is an enormous extensive access to all of this telecommunications and how easy it is for analyst to actually access it. It is one of these pulldown menus on your computer that you address. R in an email i put in my email address or whatever. Airs another little opening for how much of my emails you would like to see a week, a month, or however much. And then he hit it and youre reading it. Thecan just flip through subject line and pick out which ever emails you want to read. It is really frightening when you think of how much information these days we put into emails and google searches and how easy it is for this agency to access it all without really much oversight at all. What Edward Snowden said , i sitting at my desk certainly heavy authorities to tap anywhere from you or your counter federal judge or even the president if i had a personal email. The head of the house Intelligence Committee immediately called him a liar and said that wasnt true. Yesterdays to hearing, some of the interactions were quite remarkable and important at wednesdays hearing. Oughtk leahy a firm accused the Obama Administration officials of overstating the excess access. This is him questioning john inglis. How many cases of section 215 bulk phone records collection reticle to preventing a terrorist plot . I might answer in open session then offer to provide details and classified session. The administration has disclosed there were 54 plots that were disrupted over the life of these to do programs. Section 215 was critical in preventing of those plots, 13 had a homeland nexus, others had essentially plots that it come to fruition coming europe, asia, other places plots were were americans . Crux of the 13 that had a homeland nexus, 12 of those, 215 made a contribution. The question you asked is more pres precise. But for 250 does plots wouldve been disrupted. That is a difficult question to answer. It is not necessarily how these programs were actually, it is not how these programs work. You have a range of tools that may tip you to these plots, others may give you an insight into the nature of the plots. Enforcementde law power, ultimately completes the picture and allows you to intercept that plot. There is an example that comes close and that is the case of i read the material and is it e to say the 54 but fors ms. Focused on the homeland, detecting plots that cross the foreign and homeland a main but it was in 54 cases. It was not, sir. I want to go back to Spencer Ackerman. Can you please unpack what we just heard . Your the Deputy Director of the nsa say two thing simultaneously. First, the bulk phone records collection that has gone on for at least seven years of all americans phone records, hundreds of millions, yours, mine, everyones, has in may be one case maybe stop the terrorist attack. Maybe. At absolute most. Important to link with yesterdays documents the subtle comment, he said that was the wrong way to view the program, that it wasnt as he put it a of stopping ace plot. He says that is not the right way to view it. Look at what they Tell Congress and 2011, the documents the Obama Administration disclosed yesterday, they present both of these programs, the one we sort of, commonly called prism and the bulk phone records they call to 15, when you put them together, they described them inseparably and talk about how they directly disrupted terrorist plots and Tell Congress in secret documents that disclosing these programs would disrupt or potentially disrupt one of the most important safeguards to keeping the country safe since 9 11 and making sure there is not another terrorist attack. Thats what they Tell Congress ahead of key votes authorizing these programs. Session,n open directly, they cant even say that seven years worth of phone comeds collection basically a network of everyone social interaction, conducted over the telephone which is easy to tell from metadata, for seven years, for all americans, has maybe stopped one terrorist plot. Stewart baker also testified at wednesdays hearing. He opposed proposals for greater oversight over the nsa surveillance programs. The last thought, and ive heard senator lewman dulls proposal and judge carr proposal, i have to express some doubts about the ideas appointing a council from outside the government to. Epresent who or what is this person supposed to be representing . The terrorist . The court . Some abstract interest in Civil Liberties . Are we just want to let them decide . We got rid of the independent counsel law precisely because we were uneasy about having private parties just make up their own Public Policy without any check from the political Decision Makers or without any client. I fear were getting into the same situation if we start appointing counsel to represent something in the context of these cases. That was stewart baker. Jim bamford, your response . Certainly can do a much better job on oversight than they have been doing. Way to doterrible oversight to the fisa work. It is a secret court, secret address that produces secret decisions, and it is basically a rubber stamp by 10 out of the 11 judges or republicans, conservative republicans. Andas never been reformed probably the 35 years it has been in existence. They could have an advocate in there, a government appointed advocate who is a fully cleared person who can argue the other side in these cases. They can have judges appointed by not by one chief justice of the United States who may be politically oriented in terms of ideology. They could have a variety of judges appointed by federal Appeals Court judges. There are a lot of things they can do, much more transparency in terms of what is released. We can see by spencers line,sion here about the basically, that goes on. We have clapper saying a complete lie in terms of surveillance, the fact the nsa was not doing any mass surveillance on american citizens. In my new york review of books article i write about numerous times Keith Alexander, the director of nsa, has gone out and said his agency does no surveillance of americans reed. T give us a couple of examples. Youre saying that Keith Alexander has repeatedly lied. If you go back to a number of his speeches, he has given speeches before a number of groups and these different groups, which i discuss in the article, he is actually asked rectally about surveillance on u. S. Citizens and he says, no, we dont do surveillance on u. S. Citizens. What about the telephone records . If thats not surveillance, i dont know what is. Then you have all of this discussion about 54 plots. The one plot they actually have discussed was the subway plot in new york where the information actually came from the british. They were the first ones to come up with the information, not the nsa. And the other one was this case were someone in san diego was detected sending 8,000 to somalia. I mean, that is their big cases . This is useless surveillance. But you can tell how congress byntually approves this peeling away these layers of deception. Mentioned James Clapper. Wednesday, republican senator Chuck Grassley criticized him for making untruthful statements to commerce in march about the bulk phone records. Oversight by congress will play an Important Role as we move forward in the valuation of the wisdom and value of the intelligence programs. However, Congress Needs Accurate Information in order to conduct oversight responsibilities that the constitution demands that we do under our checks and balances of government. That is why he was disturbing to see the director of National Intelligence was forced to apologize for inaccurate statements he made last march before Senate Intelligence committee. Though statements concerned one of the very important programs that we will be hearing about. Nothing can excuse this kind of behavior from a Senior Administration official of any administration, especially on matters of such great importance. Lets go back that was republican senator Chuck Grassley. Lets go back to march when senator ron wyden question James Clapper about the nsa. Does the nsa collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of americans . No, sir. Not. Does not wittingly. There are cases where they could inadvertently perhaps collect, but not wittingly. That is what clapper said about the nsa in march. Spencer ackerman, we have come a long way, or have we . Where is this going right now . Lets just back up. The reason why ron wyden even asked that question in public hearing in the first place was to go back to keep alexander, general alexander at a different hacker conference last year was asked that question in different form and he said it was hogwash, that it was simply no truth to the idea that the nsa was keeping what he called dossiers on lanes of americans. On millions of americans. Clapper and the nsa and ultimately led widen out of frustration to ask clapper that question publicly. Last week he referred to a culture of misinformation in the Intelligence Committee by Senior Intelligence officials, clapper, alexander and others, about what exactly the nsa and other intelligence agencies are doing. To serve ale and americans wyden on the senate floor on tuesday told his colleagues again without using clappers name that clapper lied to him again in a letter saying violations of nsas very few restrictions on wasthese are done accidental. He now has a track record of sort of pointing and subtly directing attention to the discrepancies between what intelligence Officials Say publicly and what they say privately. Senatorer, lets go to wyden and that speech he gave on the senate floor on tuesday calling on the Obama Administration to in the bulk phone records collection program. The fact of the matter is, american phone records can reveal a lot of private information. If you know for example somebody called a psychiatrist three times in a week and twice after midnight, you know a lot about that person. If youre vacuuming of information on whom americans call, when they call on how long they talk, your collecting an astounding amount of information about a huge number of law abiding americans. The intelligence agencies tried emphasize they have rules about who can look at these all caps on records and when. President , i want to emphasize this because i think cableall of the talking, and talking heads on tv, i want to emphasize none of these rules requires the nsa to go back to a court to look at americans phone records and none of these rules erase the privacy impact of snooping up all of these records in the first place. On top of that as i indicated in the beginning, there have been a number of serious violations of those rules. For the senators who got the letters last friday, they know that. I want to tell all of the other senators on both sides of the aisle of the violation that are more serious, a lot more serious than the public has been told. I believe the American People deserve to know more about these violations that were described last friday by director clapper. Mr. President , i will keep pressing to make more of those details public. It is my view the information about the details, the violations of the court orders with respect to be bulk phone Record Collection program, the admission the court orders have been violated has not been, i think, fully fleshed out by the Intelligence Community and i think its a verbal amount of Additional Information can be offered without any way compromising our National Security. That is oregon senator ron wyden on the floor of the senate on tuesday. We will be going to more of him in discussion with our two guests, Spencer Ackerman with the guardian as well as we have been speaking with James Bamford who is cover the National Security agency for the last three decades and again the breaking news is where the news we had out of russia is that the person who started the ball rolling on all of these hearings right now, Edward Snowden who has been holed up at the moscow airport, has left the airport and granted temporary asylum in russia for a year. This is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We will be back in a moment. [music break] this is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. The breaking news is that Edward Snowden, the nsa whistleblower and leaker who has been holed up at the russian airport in moscow , has been granted temporary asylum in russia and has left the airport. We are talking about all that has been unleashed since he revealed what he knew about the nsas ability to monitor, surveillance and americans, and people around the world. On tuesday, senator ron wyden of oregon says he has seen no evidence that nsa surveillance has stopped dozens of terrorist attacks. None,ave seen a evidence, that this dragnet phone Records Program has provided any actual unique value for the American People. In every instance in which the nsa has searched through these ball phone records and had enough evidence to get a court order for the information was searching for. Getting a few hundred additional quarters does court orders every year would not overwhelm the court. May arguece agencies collecting the information in bulk is more convenient than getting and a vigil court orders, but convenience alone does justify the massive intrusion on the privacy of ordinary americans. I believe it is vitally important to protect safety and the liberty of our people. I dont see any evidence that this Program Helps protect either. That ought to be the standard in any domestic surveillance program. The Bulk Collection Program doesnt protect travesty or security, then it ought to end. Plain and simple. The executive branch simply has not shown anything close to an adequate justification for the massive dragnet surveillance that has compromised the Civil Liberties of millions of americans. That is ron wyden on the floor of the senate on tuesday. Spencer ackerman, what he is saying. And really clear language, as clear as you can say about secret programs in public, that as the Deputy Director of the nsa has confirmed, the nsa possible phone records collection of americans does not, has not, stop terrorist attacks as the nsa has repeatedly claimed read he is also saying there could be pretty easy safeguards that ssically make the nsa collecting metaData Collection just work as the patriot act lane language says it has to work, with some reasonable suspicion of individual suspicion, of connection to terrorism or espionage before you go and get a subpoena or warrant. I want to tell one quick anecdote that i think helps put this in perspective. For wired was working magazine and got a call from ron wydens office and you wanted to talk to me ahead of the vote on the patriot act. We spoke in his office and he said in secret the executive branch was interpreting the patriot act in a way that if the public knew about it, would astonish it. That the collection that he believed it had the power to perform amounted to essentially a revision of the patriot act entirely in secret. I asked what he meant by that. He said he couldnt at all tell me any details at all because all of it is classified, even the interpretation of the law in secret is classified. He fought a battle to even say publicly that such a thing even happened. For two years, ron wyden has nudged people to Pay Attention in some way to the fact this was even happening. He gave at the term secret law. I have been covering this for the past two years and had no idea what he meant until Edward Snowden disclose to my newspaper this overwhelming bulk collection. Ron wyden was entirely vindicated and it sort of underscores when wyden says to his colleague, maybe look in secret about the discrepancy between what the nsa is saying its violations have been, meaning accidental, and what it actually said to us in secret. Navi that kind of should get more attention. Maybe more senators should go back in a close session he sang come and look at that because winds record really does bear out and it also points out now that chris inglis has said it in that it has not stopped terrorist attacks, wind. Natodianne feinstein of california who chairs the Intelligence Committee defended the program. I was on the intelligence 9 11, and ifore remember how Little Information we had and the great criticism of the government because of inabilityepipes, the to share intelligence, the inability to collect intelligence. We had no programs that could have possibly caught two people in san diego before the event took place. I support this program. , think based on what i know they will come after us. I think we need to prevent an attack wherever we can from happening. , Diane Feinstein is circling the very different place than these other senators that weve heard from republican and democrat. Read she brings up 9 11. The u. S. Government had all the information it needed to prevent 9 11. It didnt need all of these ball Data Collection and everything else. All it needed to do was have the cia tell the fbi or the state department that these two people were coming to the United States because they knew it. They knew it because they had copies of their visas that have been sent to them. Knew there were coming to the United States. The problem wasnt collecting information, the problem was disturbing the information. Justifying all of this based on 9 11 is just total nonsense. Canted also get in the way of National Security . Are so inundated in information they cant make sense of any of it. That is the point. We have had this going on for seven years, thiserna domestic metadata telephone collection and up until 2011, the email collection also. And yet we have had after 9 11 had the underwear bomber the person flying to detroit that was going to blow up a plane Christmas Day the times square bomber, the two people in boston that just committed the on the marathon day and so forth. Those people were communicating internationally, basically. Theyre all communicating either and thenya or pakistan underwear bomber was in yemen and communicating with other countries in the middle east and also to nigeria, for example. Been takinga had all of this attention and paying attention to Foreign Communications and International Communications and set of domestic communications, it might have discovered those. Wheree a track record youre not able to discover those because you have too much electronic hay on the haystack and it is impossible to find the needle. That is what these hearings are good for. Does the fbi, local police, do they have access to this information from the nsa as well . Are they all sharing . The fbi is one of the principal recipients i think of a lot of this information. One of theg things i think should worry a lot of people is it is not just the u. S. Against this information. Theyre british, the australians, new zealanders, and the canadians all have access to the same information, and they distribute it within their own government, Law Enforcement organizations. Collection notta just for the United States, but for all of these countries around the world. Jim bamford, i want to read a quote that use at the end of your piece. It is from late Senator Frank Church, 1975. That capability at any time could be turned around on the American People and no american would have any privacy left. Such as the capability to monitor everything read telephone conversations, telegrams, doesnt matter. It would be no place to hide. If this government ever became attorney does, the words of the late Senator Frank Church in 1975, who convened the Church Committee hearings to challenge this level of total surveillance. That is the quote that jim bamford ins in his book. Thank you for being with us for this hour. Book,mford, most recent the Shadow Factory the ultra secret nsa from 9 11 to the eavesdropping on america. So to spencernt piece, they ackerman, National Security editor at the guardian. We will have a link your piece as well called, u. S. Government declassifies court order on nsa surveillance as pressure builds. Democracy now is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed
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