Transcripts For KQED Charlie Rose 20141225

And by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Stars in the movie birdman, he plays a washed up actor trying to make a comeback on broadway. Keaton rose to fame, big fame in 1989 with tim burtons batman. But until to you he has been mostly out of the spotlight. Los Angeles Times writes of his performance, it is so intensely truthful, so ear ily in the moment that it is hard to imagine keaton will ever be better. I spoke with him recently in los angeles at his home. Where were you in your life when the idea of birdman came to you or you went to it . I was working on a film in canada. And i got i received a call from my agent. And they said all hando inarritu has a script that he wants to talk to you, that he wants to discuss with you. And already i was interested. And she said i dont know how are you going to do this she didnt say dont come. She said how are we going to figure this out. He cant fly there, or something. But he wants to talk to you here. And i thought well, its probably not going to work. And then i thought about it for the night. And i called her back, i will make this, without. I flew back to a restaurant right up the street because all hando lives over there, right over there. And we met thats how it came so then we met and discussed it. And he asked me how i worked. And i asked him how he worked. And as i tell people, the script would have to have been horrible, like unreadable for me to say no because i think any actor will tell you, and and i said you know, he called me to say some really nice things. I said yeah, we were both talking about how good all hando alejandro is. I said all you have to do is see a couple of his movies. In fact, all you have to look at is and i probably would have signed on. He says all i had to see was the crash, the Automobile Accident scene. And i would have signed on. He is one of those people, you know, he is extraordinary, an extraordinary filmmaker. And has become a friend. And you have interviewed him. Rose oh yeah. Hes something, isnt he. Rose oh, yeah. Your father was a drink s that true . Is that true . No, no. Because my father was. My father is a mean drunk. You understand . Okay he beat the out of me. I was okay. He said im taking off my belt or dow want me to take it off and use it. I said well, i made myself you know, but. Okay, okay, okay, hey, hey, hey. Oh, god i didnt know. Im sorry. Im sorry, that is thats horrible. Im sorry. I can pretend too, you know. Im telling you you have no idea. Come on, lets go. Come on. Yeah . Yeah. Why dont you get your wings and your bird sue,man. Everybody talks about you and whether you were working a lot or not working. Uhhuh. Were you working a lot at the time that this came on your plate or were you sort of saying maybe its time i start working . No, i made that decision over a year before that. I kind of, i kind of started dialing in the scope a little clearer. And on the rifle. And i had already done the the truth is i was always doing something. Because i always feel i felt like you have to stay in the gym to some degree, you know. And how i did it was sometimes not on the sly but i would go do something that maybe i didnt care if it just kind of went away, just to explore a character or sometimes i would do it once i took it because the job was so right down the street. The money was good. I admit, guilty as charged. That is not the smartest thing to do ive learned. But i did it so i was always doing that. But i certainly dialed it up by doing hbo project with larry david. Robo cop. There was Something Else in there i keep forgetting and all pretty good stuff. And then 24 came along. So it was never like there was like an absence of me, i suppose. In is that i was pretty board with what i was the words coming out of my mouth. Not necessarily i wasnt crazy about the things i was getting. But it was more me than it, you know. Rose you were tired of yourself. Yeah, kind of over myself for a while. Rose so you went to montana. I lived in montana on and off. I mean part of the year for my kid is 31, so you know, almost 27 years now, Something Like that. Just hanging out . Well a lot of fishing you and brokaw fishing. We fish a lot. And then do television and talk about it. Yes. How about is that job. Yeah, and being, you know, i always wanted to be i always knew as a kid i needed to live, i had to be outdoors. I dont know how to not be outdoors. And i had to either have a farm or some space or my dream since i had been a little guy but i was obsessed with the west and but you know, it was a place where i have a Great Community of friends there. Probably more there now than probably anywhere. A 1q e beginning the ranch operated in a ranch, you know, it was an operation, a little bit of cattle, a little bit of hey. And then i dont pretend to act like its really more of a its more of a recreational and big amount of space where i just feel at home. Rose because the perception was, even the president of the united states. Yes. He said hey, why dont you make more movies . First words out of his mouth. Which was a little disconcerting. Because you had been making movies. Not to me. Im thinking that is an interesting question, coming from you. But you who were trying to the leader of the free world, why are you worried about that. Rose but it does show a perception that you werent making a lot of movies. Yeah, to some degree, well, i wasnt making a lot of movies. The truth is a never really made a lot of movies. For as long as i have been doing this, i dont think i have that many. You know, i have probably popped in here and there on little things. But not that many. I could have certainly done a lot more. When you met with alejandro did you say to him s this my life . You know, he and i really try to remember this. I guess, he if he said we did then i dont think we made it up he made it up. I didnt say that but i probably said okay, on es obviously there is obviously this thing. Do we how do we not make that the issue which was never his intention. Because as you know, surely its about alejandro. Rose its about him. Exactly. Im just the vessel. So like to that degree i probably mentioned something. Because he said i did. But honestly, i dont remember a big i dont think we had the time to say well, you know, you played batman and youre an actor. For me i thought well, this will drag me and it down. Lets just jump over that. We have got a lot of work to do, you know, because of the difficulty of making this movie. But we probably acknowledged it. In fact, i was surprised during the shooting of it that he didnt talk about it more. That he i was just kind of surprised by it. But he was so there was so much to do. And that seemed to be i dont know. Unless i missed something. Let me just look back at the things that you have excelled at that pleased you. Starting with nightshift. What was it about that. Ron howard said later one of the great regrets of his career is he never found a place where you two could Work Together again. Yeah. First of all, thats hard to do because you have to understand and im sure you do understand, as great as all this attention is, and man s it great. Is it fun. I make no bones about it im not coy about anything. Rose yeah. Let alone this. It really is always a question of what comes to you when. I mean i definitely have worked really hard im a hard worker and i dialed it up. And i changed a few things around and really started to lock in. And i look the at it like a 15 rounder. And i said i know what i am going to do and im going to do it because by about round 12, im not getting hes to the getting off his back. Rose hes out for the count. And that was pie goal. So i said yeah, but you are only in the fourth round now but how do you get there. So i started to sit down thinking, working, focus. And i never stopped trying to be good at what i do. Everything would come up, all that said, and taken the truth is you have to have the good fortune and have this it has to come along with the right director. You have to have a piece of material that is any good at all, not just birdman n anything. Any actor out there has to have the opportunity you know, so a friend of mine once said a relative or someone once said about a role, that was a great role and great movie said to him, why didnt you do that movie. And he looked at them and said, it doesnt work like that. It is not like he said ill do that you have to be in the right place at the right time. Everything has to work out. And to a large degree, thats what this is. How much of it i created and how you be believedly blessed i am and the good fortune a combination of all that. So it comes around so im sure ron is right. He looks at certain things and goes thats not really right for him or that could be right for him or so Something Like this could have come around when i was 28 or 32 or and maybe i would have been good in that. I would like to think that it doesnt matter. You just you know sometimes it you get all the wood on the ball. Sometimes you get a good chunk of the wood on the ball. And sometimes you miss the ball. When tim came to you for beatel us. I didnt understand what was dk gheit el juice. I didnt under than what he was talking about but i liked him. I thought well this guy is svming i wish i could do it you seem like a really nice guy. I know are you creative but i dont know i dont get it. And i got a phone call that said would you talk to him again. And i liked him. So i thought yeah, sure. Explain more to me what you are trying to do. And when you see t you understand why it was probably hard for him to explain. And i went home, i thought wow, i just dont i like this guy. I would like i thought no, dont do it and then i met him again at a Mexican Restaurant and we talked and talked and talked. And he said a couple of things that i just logged in. I said give me the night, or two days. And i called the Wardrobe Department and because he said something that made me think of something. And i said send me wardrobe from different time periods randomly. Just pick a rack. And he said something about Something Else about we exist in all times and all spaces. And then i thought of an idea of a walk. And i knew had to be i said i dont know. I called and said i got an idea. And i dont know if its going to work on not so lets just go do this thing. And here is the amazing part about it. He never saw any of it. We discussed it, i said i want hair that looks like i stuck my phone in an electrical outlet. And its wardrobe, i said i want mold. He said like he was under rock. I want mold some where. And she created this amazing and then so then i said okay. And i showed up for work and i walked on the stage and said this is either going to be way off the mark or hes just going to i dont know what he is going to do. He got it meetly. And its not like it was way out of what he was talking about. But it was and he said yes, that and lets do more of that and gave this unbelievably free thing with do you know why this is a Favorite Movie of so many people including the president . No, i dont. But i saw the most adorable little girl the other day. I was getting coffee and i can could not take my eyes off how unbelievably cute this kid was. She was about, i found out later how old she was. Because im going oh, man, i have spent if she was mine, i wouldnt have a job. I would just hang out with her all day. She was the cutest thing i ever saw. Got a call, and the guy calls me over and says do you know her Favorite Movie. And gi know, but she sure is cute. Her favorite, she is this big. Her Favorite Movie is beetle us. And i thought beetlejuice, i said are you sure that is okay. No, she quotes the lines, so it goes from that to 80yearold people. No, i couldnt tell you why. I think it is something where they just have never seen anything like it before which is a credit to tim original. Thats what he is, original. And then he comes to you for batman . Yes. Which everybody is kind of, but tim got it, because he and i got know each other. He said no, no, no this is and in fairness i think a couple of the guys, a couple of the executives thought maybe its with a bad idea. They were probably looking at marketability you know, because beetlejuice was very popular. And but he got it and i got it immediately. I went oh, yeah, i know what this is. Rose what did you say it was in your mind . You know, dark, however you want to everybody says dark, dark say relative thing. I didnt see it i also thought this is also funny. And i dont know that that factors into how they do it now. But i said no, no, there is i said and he is obviously a depressed dude, you know. He witnessed the death of his mother and father, so lets start with that. And and tim was just looking and he had that long hair, i remember his hair going as we go and i said everything he said he was like yeah, yeah, but i thought so a what does that mean. He said youve got it i agree with you. And then he expounded upon it even more. And then i thought okay. Well, whatever. Good luck on that, warner brothers. And de. And 400 million later. Yeah, he started everything with that. He was he created the whole look with anton first and everybody else. But the whole he just saw t you know, and went for it and. Rose and then batman too. Yeah swirx fine. It was all right. I thought that is too bad, this is inherently an interesting character, operatic, really. I know it is comic booky and pulpy, but really under it, it is not like youve never seen the dual personality thing, you know, weve seen that before. But cirano deberjerac and all that. But there was something way more. I thought a this isnt very good. And tims not involved any more. Blah, blah, blah. But also what was interesting was where he would go, where that guy could go. And the way to get him to where i thought he should go. Lets go back and just retrace how he got there again. You know, which sult mately what they did, in the 17th or 18th or fourth or fifth version of it but its inherently an interesting guy. And for me the key always was, i only said this interesting it was never about batman t was bruce wayne, you know. That was the way in, who is that guy. And who is that guy on the screen that would be as least at least a little ent takening as opposed to grim. Rose right, right. Was it hard to walk away. No, easy, easy. Rose even when they rolled up the bank well well, yeah, im not going to there was one occasion, people would ask me this and i go, because it never really changed my life. I live the same way that i it just went like that. There is only one thing, this hunk of real estate i wanted to buy, oh, i would like to have that. It had a good river on it. And i went. Rose and it cost money. And it cost a lot of money. And i thought that one hurt for about a day. Rose only a day. Oh, yeah. Rose if i had done this i could have maybe bought this. If i argue i would do any of those, there is no birdman. Rose if you had done another batman there would be no birdman . Uhhuh. Because i also thought look, the wayne, our comic friend, he looked at me like he didnt understand the controversy. He said you cant do that again. Because maybe a handful of people went youre in big trouble if you keep going down that road. Will you have to do a lot of work and remind people of Everything Else you do. Whether theyre right or wrong, i really have no idea. But i just thought why should i keep by the way, had it been kind of good, and as tim said, i really want to do this again. I would have probably done it. You want to be into those kind of alejandro, you know. You want to be in business with those kind of artists. And they bring on new directors, new story ideas and worry about whether it is going too dark and all of that. They could go darker and darker and darker. Yeah, exactly, yeah. A wildly creative guy so when you left that, where were you in your own your own head. Have you been in to batman. Go do a bump of stuff i did, and some was good and some wasnt was okay. And that would have happened regardless. But there is no doubt that you have to keep on going, you have to be in the last movie that made money. Just a fact of life. I understood the risk of that. I thought one of these next roles i take is going to have to do a little bit of money. Do a little bit of business. And some did okay. And some didnt. And also right around the end, the business changed. I would say not in america, not in the movie business but the world has gone strip mall. Really a strip mall. A couple 6 anchor stores. If you look at them as global things, the big anchor stores are china, india, america. And Everything Else backs watered down. New york doesnt look like what new york used to look like. New york is what america and ultimately the world is so in the movie business, its just part of all of that. Its corporate and by the way, whoever is complaining about or whining about it should go do Something Else for a living, i guess. It is the way it is. You know, you are either a Long Distance runner or you aint a Long Distance runner. Thats why i keep doing this endurance is one thing. You have to build a lot of kind of muscles. And i dont like to luls. So i thought yeah, ill figure out a way to do all this. Et ceteras go. Where are we going. To get you some coffee. Did i do something to disrespect you. Not yet. Look, i have a lot riding on this. Is that right . Yeah. People know who i am. They dont know you, your work, man, they know the guy from the bird suit who goes and tells stories on letterman. Sorry if im popular. Popular . Popular . Popularity is just bloody little cousin of my friend. I done even know what the that means. It means my reputation is riding on this and that is worth a lot. Exactly. If this doesnt work out for you you go back to your video, and dive back into that cultural genocide are you perpetrating. A douchebag is born every minute, that was pd barnums premise when he invented the circus and nothing much has changed. You know if you put out any piece of crap people will line up to see it but long after you are gone i will be on that stage earning my living, bearing my soul wrestling with complex mum emotion, that is what we do. Is that what tonight, you wrestling with complex emotion. Tonight was about being alive. This isnt a new york city is how we do things. Where are you going . They have coffee here. What is interesting about birdman and boy you knee it after you had that dinner with alejandro, it really was, it was his story too. Here is a guy who was wondering what is it all about. Yeah. And how do i find something new. And how do i define what i want to be in a new way. Right and what kind of person can i con into playing and be photographed doing me. Yeah, no, not really but it is, what i love about him, i love a lot of things about him. But he will tell you that and unabashed and not just being coy about t he is to the being ironic he said no, i was going through a lot of things and had the courage to say im going to put it on the screen and say these things and his intelligence is so hes so intelligent so, bright that it reaches a lot of he packs a lot into an hour and a half half or whatever it is, philosophically and idea logically and intellectually. But mostly what i love about it is all the guts and the heart and the soul and how much humanity, hes really gutsy really courageous. Rose what is the story he is telling . Well, you know, as you know it is a lot. There is a lot if you could follow and go wow, because its about an actor but it its about and i know this sounds cliche but it is really about anybody, but beyond that it is about who people are, how your ego because overruling and such a liar and also how necessary it is. And how unnecessary it is and then the question, who am i as an artist. Am i really an artist. Do i need to be loved, an this guys case, hes you know, hes i mean hes you know, i say pathetic. And i dont mean it necessarily in derog torely but literally i found the character pathetic but at the same time really noble and courageous, actually. But its a lot of things. Its about how you see yourself or how what it all means to not just be an artist but what are you willing to lay on the line in life and not lay on the line in life app ultimately are you being your true self to some degree as far as that, a lot of stuff. She says stuff about social media, and where we are today about fame, the to see if you can recapture that. She criticizes him and is accurate in saying hes irrelevant. He doesnt matter because i think there is this kind of science fictiony parallel university that has been created by you, you kind of literally dont exist any more if you are not connected through social media. People dont, they dont know how to get to you or communicate with you literally an entire generation. At the same time if you sigh this about, hes out of it because hes not connected to it but also she is guilty of being addicted to it to some degree, you know. Everybody gets it in this movie. Everybody gets it. He tells it the truth about everybody, and everybody lies and everybody tells the truth and everybody bears their soul or is expoted. The yet sick exposed but shes also not wrong about what she says riggan is, you know, constantly exposed. But also hes not totally wrong. Hes learn not wrong about what he is trying to do you know even if its for himself. So everybody, i like that he that is why i say hes an equal opportunity offender. Rose was it tough because of the way alejandro films. Yeah. These long seven, eight, nine minutes. Extremely but. Rose you have the capacity to be improvisational and go off script and all that. The capacity. Yeah, and there is none of that. Rose and if you do, you let everybody down. Everybody. And you have to be wordperfect, physically in the right spot at the right time. And you throw the luxury of multiple takes multiple angles is out. So if anyone would ever judge a director like they do some, like gymnastics or some olympic events, degree of difficulty, it is not even close. This guy crushes everybody. Because the difficulty for everyone was really high, im working on a movie now my fear was every movie i do after this, there was so frightening and exhilarating and fun and nerveracking and all that, i thought every movie after this im afraid is going to be boring. The good news is its not. Because working on a movie with really talented and quick witted fun charming people, and the movie is really good. But heres what happened. What happens is now that you are working on a new, a traditional way of movie making, multiple takes, cuts and angles, you think back, i have was thinking about how we made birdman and its kind of like if you are ever almost had a head on collision and people swerve at the time you were quick on your feet, reflexes were good. You kind of went through it and then that night it hits you how scary that was, that is what happens now. Im on the set and i go wait a minute, what were we thinking am how did we ever think that we can make that movie the way he made that movie. I still kind of dont get it. Rose and it accelerates it, it adds drama and movement and energy and direction to it. Yeah, all of it, yes. I dont know how you ma make t actually, i dont think the movie works quite if you shoot it traditionally because it pulls you into the about a minute six or something, its like you quietly hear a door close behind you and you go okay, youre in now. There is no going back. Are you going down the road with this thing. And it is a ride. And the weird thing is its a comedy and here is what i am glad about. If this throws any attention towards comedy in the best way, in comedy gets some credit with the accolades, i think its great because comedy is very often doesnt get its due. Rose i just talk to countries rock, his whole film was about a guy without wants to be taken seriously. Comedians want to be taken seriously but its much harder to do comedy than serious. Yeah, they say. And i suppose thats true. They say. Comedians say that, at least. You know what is interesting about that. I told somebody the other day, inevitably, i dont believe in that kind of you know, the bs, the kind of false humility, aw schuks thing or im to good. Or i saw that movie and im horrible. When i see a scene and gi oh, boy, im that. I say i missed that one with you when i get it, i slay anything, i will say yeah, i got that scene or i got that line. I nailed that one. Im not afraid to say that because its authentic. Its true. Also i dont like it when i see a scene i, i go oh boy, i dont know what i was thinking. That is who you are. You have been honest all your life. Pretty much. You are not a guy who lived an illusion. No no no. Im sure i have but but it didnt last long so whats interesting about what you say about come dee, every time i go back, and i go, you look at a scene and you go oh, man, one more shot, that one little thing. It hit me the other day, its almost inevit inevitably comedic. The other once you go that was pretty good. I will take that but if you go oh, i should have waited a teeny bit longer. You want to nail that thing. Rses if you ever sit down and talk to comedy writers and people who write for standup, they will explain it to you. Will you get it more than you ever have. Yeah. Rose i made a speech and i had to get comedy writers because it had to be funny. They just know, as you say t is the quarter second t is how you hit it. It is how you hit it that makes the joke. Are you a friend of david letterman. He understands that in spades. Yeah. Rose has always understood that. I said david work the first time t was clear to not me, everybody, this guy just had wit and a midwestern kind of take on things that cut through the bull and was smart but pretty smart. And cut right to it. Yeah, comedy is a whole other i was working with a bunch of really good actors, john flaherty, was doing this thing he was like a mathmatician. He would watch and go here is what we are going to do. Here say joke that would crush him every night. Get a laugh every time there was one on this side and this side. And kept saying that is not working. And he said we are going to take that one out. No, no, no. That that gold he said no, were taking it out. Here is what is going to happen. Were going hit this one, move it closer, well slide it closer to together in time and that one will work and nailed it. And wrz it means it is science and craft. Yeah. Rose they just know. Yeah. Rose what is all the doing for you, though. And why do you think theres been the response, other than the fact brilliantly directed, great performances, wonderful cast, all of that. But there are other movies that has that. I know. Rose this has hit some nerve this film. I know. I wish coy tell you. I i, there are people that come up to me on the street that have nothing to do or people that i know with nothing to do with entertainment business. Nothing to do with movie making. What they say about it when they talk about it, what they want to say about it is articulate and im knocked out by what they say about it, and what they want to tell you about it. Rose so what is that. I think alejandro found, i think when are you as courageous as he was in making this movie that he that you cant, you cant you cant not be you can hate this movie but youre going talk about this movie. He just said im going after this, im going to tell the truth about in a clever way how life is, how you feel and not be coy about it an i think it makes people, theyre not used to that and once you hit that, like when you go into somebodys brain, you can you know, you can hit a little thing it kind of hits this thing. And makes it react to it. Just simple humanity, nicole nicholson, i called him and said would you come see this movie of mine. And afterwards he looked at me. And what did he say, masterful. Im glad you made this, keats because now i dont have to make it and then he called me the next day which i knew he would. And i got the really clearheaded articulate focused jack. And he went on for like 20 minutes. And all he kept talking about was the beauty of it. The beauty. There was beautiful and the beauty. And i thought yeah, alejandro is not afraid of that stuff. Rose you can do the best impression of him around, cant you. No, no. Rose yes, you can. There are people who nail him. Rose no, you got it. Rose but he has distinct features that make it easy for someone that does impressions, doesnt he i have seen robin do it brilliantly but robin could do american brilliant. Robin once did, imagine a conversation between mar long and jack. Jack yeah. Yeah. Wow. That just that hit people hard. You know, thats interesting. I dont know why, like the robin dropped people to their knees, i think that is saying something about the birdman. Kuz a lot of people go through things and you read about someone, you feel badly. And you go thats too bad. But for some reason his death was really hard on me and other people. I flew, but i didnt hang out with him. I think it is a similar thing with birdman where for some reason, there is something about it where it just it goes through its like the bullet misses the ribs and this is all the bones t doesnt deflect t just goes right. Rose what is it though . I dont know. I dont even want to know. Rose thats true. You dont really want to know. Because it is almost, if you try to figure it out t takes something away from it. It is in the land of sort of, you can feel it but dont know it. Totally, 100 percent. Rses by its but its done a marvelous thing for you. Yeah. Rose beyond all the buzz about an oscar. What oms has it done. Has it given you any sense of wanting to change the way you do things . To change your anything . What has it changed for you . Even before. I dont know its changed. What has it encouraged. To trust that im not that you know, courage is always one of my one of the great virtues you can have, meaning ride out the tough stuff. Enjoy the big stuff, dont keep keep it in perspective. Keep trusting your gut and when this comes along with a guy who you go man, i can jump on that train and you jump on that train and it works so it makes you go way, i am just going keep on by the way, if i keep on doing what i im doing im sure some day we will be sitting here talking about, we will do some movie i did, what were you thinking. Rose i can do that now. Thats going to happen. Here is what said. He said are you the guy. He said there is no one else. You would do what it required. You were not a guy that that thought i have to imagine myself in a certain way. You were prepared to say i will inhab think the character like nobody. I think the fact and add to it i think if i had a millisecond of doubt and i probably had about a milli second of working with this guy, it was kuz i knew that there was a risk involved because i thought are you really, everything you think you are you obviously arent if you dont have the guts to say i will do this and i might fail. Because otherwise never want to look back and go i kind of wimped out on that one. So i thought, i think its really lacks courage not to take it on and risk what might be talked about or done or whatever. I have never, i always feel good about myself by saying, i tell people, occasionally what i lack in talent sometimes i think i make up for in guts or stupidity so i dont think you should an afraid. I think you know, its one of my fair ri favorite virtues. Anything, for anybody. When i see people, athletes im not talking about actorsing im talking about people. I mean im not kidding, this may sound i dont care how it sounds. You look at people who say, they profiled that guy from new hampshire, two kids and he went into liberia, and literally hand fought works with ebola patients. Are you kidding me . Thats. Rose thats courage. Thats courage. Yeah. People never understood about you, and no reason for them to know because they dont know the inner lives is that you had so many other things in your life you were curious about you read a lot. You care about public affairs. You like the company of smart people. Yeah. At the same there was no you loved hollywood. You loved acting, but you didnt have to be doing it all the time. No. Rose you didnt have to be in the public eye all the time. Right. Rose you didnt have to have fame. Right. Rose what you had to do was have things in front of you that excited you, stimulated you, and were a conversation you wanted to be part of. Yes, and i just wanted to be good. And by the way all this other stuff, and the perks of whatever you get by being wellknown, i actually dont like a lot of attention. But i dont want to ago like i think its all evil. Its fantastic, am i wrong. I just told you this story about a woman who maybe your big fan, if you act like that doesnt make you feel good, its a lie. Rose absolutely right. It makes you think like im doing something that is connecting some way. That is the best. That is the best. Tom is right, im endlessly curious. I dont know how to not be curious. And so sometimes the only thing, the only impatience i have among my other that is something i have to work on, impatience, is i keep thinking i got a lot more creatively to do. I want to hurry up and get it out of the way because i got this other stuff i want to do. Rose what is the other stuff. Oh, man, i think doing stuff for other people is just its selfish, actually, because i know it will make me i think dow it not for your ego. Its just, you are only here once. And the world is so much bigger than you are. Rose but youve got too deal too, knowing that, and how real and courageous you are, you have got to feel like damn, i sweep the theatres. Its so great. And it is great when it comes around. Rose unexpectedment you didnt go out searching for this vehicle. No, but i got to tell you this. I went out, i started dialing the scope. I started bringing things in focus and start seeing that thing in the corner, on that Mountain Side and people saying okay, its dark. Walking down a little closer and pick one off, maybe this is that say little comedy. A little you do the other guy. The other guy was probably the first jab. And people go oh, yeah, i forgot. He can hit. And you go okay, what is the next thing. And then you start and so i started this for me thats more work than probably most people tend because i continued to be curious about that, i want to go do this, do that. I could turn around and go bac to africa tomorrow. It is the greatest place in the world. But a lot of stuff had to go away. But theres also this. Are you an actor. What you do, and the opportunity to do what you do well is a remarkable thing. Yeah. Rose an to do it with the company of people who have the same skill levels. And who will make you bring out the best in you. Yeah, blessing. Besting. Yeah, yeah, its all a blessing. Two arms, two legs. And at the same time, is it beyond the sense of enjoying i mean you love the idea that people recognize this and see it and attention and the buzz. All of that. Yeah. Simply because it is human to like that. Yes. Or not crave it, i dont want to lie to you and go oh, i dont really like that. So i dont know where you were right before you began to get closer, and began to what was it happening to you when you said, well, maybe i would have blocked closer. Yeah. Maybe i ought to be more available. Yes, be more available. In a lot of ways, make yourself physically available. Kind of let people know, no, no, no. And that started a while back. And by the way, i dont want to mislead anyone here. It is not like people are going knocking on doors, come on, mike, read this and at this go see the man chopping the trees in the backyard. He wouldnt do this. There is a lot of that. And there was some like maybe, and i didnt, but so there it wasnt like so you know, yes, there was that, bringing into focus and wanting to do it and at the same time, ironically, it is kind of like, i think you and i, i told you, i had a job where you go home at the end of the day and you go well, i have to clean up you know, kuz this is what i did. Its a weird birdman made me feel like that a few other jobs made me feel like that mostly you go home going i dont know quite what i did today. Rose birdman made you feel what . I need a damn shower because i just came from a mill and i worked my ass off. And i made something. Rose and i earned my pay. I earned my pay. Rose i gave them everything hi. Yeah. Rose and all the years, all the experience, all the skill. Yeah. Rose all the love i just laid it out there. And i made something. Rose like Bruce Springsteen at the end of a four hour concert. Yes. Rose i have given you everything i have. And when Bruce Springsteen ends a four our four hour concert. He gave something, he made something, that he is a product. People went home with something, that too. Rose its nice to feel that. Boy, is it. Rose and that is what you were feeling in the end. Yeah, im sure there will be others i am not going to get it. I am going to get it but you know. Rose to have it four or five times in your life. Dude. Beetlejuice 2. Uhhuh. Do you think will you have it again . I have been saying it for so long now that it reached the point where you go now im even tired of talking about it. Either you want to do it or dont want to do it i dont understand why you wouldnt want to do it. It is so original and people like it so much. It makes so many people happy. And tim, you know, from what i understand, is relatively interested. But you dont make it without him or at least tim being heavily involved. I dont think you make it without him. Dow like you created you just told us. Story about it was what you did that sort of converged with what he was thinking about. Yes and more. You gave definition. Yeah. To a question he had asked. But he had the imimagery. And everyone, danny elfman, bowel much, the those guys this thing. And i went wow, i dont know what this is but it sure is fun it is a crazy thing, in an actors life, they expect every time you go out to be better than the last time and bigger than last time it is impossible. It is. Because you have to have all these things and as you once said, good fortune. Yeah. All that has to come together. Yes. So here are you in the midst of this, the buzz, the feeling of accomplishment, the sense of this is why im an actor to get a chance to do Something Like this. When people call it a comeback, you want to dismiss that and say no. Its wok with me. Call it what you want. For me comeback, it has been a comeback for me since, lets see, i showed up here with 270 in my pocket. I got my first job when i was 20, 25 is when the comeback started. For me its just like all one thing. But im okay with it. I kind of for the less ambitious folks, i get why that is a people want to dot extra work. I dont want to say lazy but i get that, i totally get that actually its okay. Totally okay. Its all right with me. You just like the doing of the thing, whatever people want to describe it as is fine with you. Absolutely. Rose because in the end you are the one who experienced the exhilaration of knocking it out of the park when given the opportunity. Yeah, and by the way, now that i hear you ask it and me talk about it, come back to what, really, because i go there were things i didnt do well. So there are things that did really well some come back, im not sure what you know what i mean. It wasnt always like that. I think in your case comeback means they just havent seen or heard much from you in terms of a movie that is generating so much bus that is what it is. Michael keaton at the centre of a movie that everybody is talking about, comeback reasons have at it. Exactly. We dont have an actor. And if we cancel the first preview the press is going to smell blood and we cant afford to lose any more money at all. What do you think we should do. Hire an understudy. Lets use the understudy. Please for the love of god, listen. Our Perfect Dream act certificate not going to knock on the door, hey, fellas, when i do start. Can i talk to you for a secretary. Yeah, whats up. Did you find another actor. Well, mikes available. He is. I thought he was doing the thing he was, he quit. Mike who. Quit or fired. With mike its usually both. Mike who. Jake. Oh my gosh, how do you know mike shiner. We share how do you know. Because kuz he told me. Jake, yes, ask me if he sells tickets. Does he sell tickets. He sells a of tickets, ask me if the threater critics love him. They want to on him. Everything for a reason, right. Think will come in this evening. Ill call him and find out. Has it changed you . Has in experience made michael dot, i do, dot. Its as good timing as could ask for this is as good as it gets. In terms of how i am, how i feelqc] ere everything is. Things are settled and all the areas i go yeah, man, god loves me figured it out. Its good timing. I think it all would have been good timing anyway, whatever. By the way, this could have come along or could have come along. When i did night shows i just do what i think im supposed to do. Whatever the job is i looked at the script, i did the work and add its whatever i added. Threw there is a scene where its a dramatic scene. I played it where i thought it should be. A very, very real scene. And it kind of shifted everything. Everybody like went and said okay, he talked he was very, very pleased but he wasnt ready for it. And i thought that is what the thing says that is what you do, right . So yeah, i committed to it and i tried to do it as best i could but why is it a surprise. That is the job. Hes acting like this and then he acts like that so now im acting like that. So thats what i am supposed to do. If Something Like that would have happened continuation turned things without people really realizing it where they went oh, hmmmm, okay. Thats interesting. But its great for me now but i it would have been good for me at any time it would have been good for me at 22 or 22, 32, 42, 52, it comes when once doesnt matter. Yeah, yeah. The question is how long, it doesnt really feel like a mans job a lot. And i dont cant quite put my finger on that because i really add miferment i look at Hall Holbrook and what did in the movie into the wild. And it was so unbelievably perfect and poetic and simple and brilliant. I thought look at that guy. Nailing that. That is admirable. There is part of me that goes i want to be that guy, and part of me wants to go this is aisle, this is em bar rags. I should have a job where i actually make something. Like a person, i dont know, i dont get it sometimes. I get confused. The best that i know feel a little bit like that. Really . Thats either encouraging or discouraging. Much success, thank you for this. Thank you. Rose michael keaton. The fill some birdman. I remember when i lost my mind theres something about that day feeling your emotions. How did we end up here . This dump . You were a movie star, remember . Im crazy maybe youre crazy. Birdman. Maybe were crazy wait and see. Youre birdman. Lets go back one more time and show them what were kanl of. Why dont you get your wings and bird suit, man what are you looking at . Rose for more about this program and earlier episodes visit us online at pbs. Org and charlie rose. Com captioning sponsored by Rose Communications captioned by Media Access Group at wgbh access. Wgbh. Org funding for charlie rose has been provided by the Cocacola Company supporting this Program Since 2002. American express, additional funding provided and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. This is nightly Business Report with tyler mathison. Brought to you in part by the street. Com and actions alerts plus where jim cramer and fellow Portfolio Manager stephanie link share their investment strategies, stock picks and market insights. You can learn more at the street. Com nbr. Still running the dow ends higher again. This time, the index having its strongest sixday streak in more than four years. Different views, stocks are sitting at or near record levels. The economy seems to be gaining strength, as well. But do wall street and main street see things the same way . And crowd funding a cure. How hope and generosity are working to ending a deadly disease. We have all