And and keep taken away for ever but you're wrong you can do so much more to control your high blood pressure doing the minimum isn't doing enough I'm under a lot of pressure and can quit whenever I want better to know that but I like my job just treat me better check on me give me something green to nibble on every once in a while and maybe we can do some exercise on occasion let's get to it after all we're in this together listen to your heart don't let it quit on you high blood pressure can lead to a stroke heart attack or death get your blood pressure to a healthy range before it's too late find out how at Heart dot org slash blood pressure checked change control a message from the American Heart Association the American Stroke Association and the Ad Council. 960 the Patriot k k n t Phoenix division of Salem Media Group online on to it is hard radio if you have questions let us be the. News this hour from townhall dot com I'm Greg kludge than in Washington it's the deadliest ever attacked by Islamic extremists in Egypt at least 235 people were killed in a crowded mosque when militants blasted worshipers with gunfire and rocket propelled grenades the attack appeared to be the latest by the area's local Islamic state affiliate correspondent Saddam a gun and tells us where President Trump is condemning the deadly incident the president calls it a horrible and cowardly terror attack on innocent and defenseless worshipers tweeting while playing golf with Tiger Woods and Dustin Johnson he wrote The world cannot tolerate terrorism writing we must defeat them militarily and discredit the extremist ideology that forms the basis of their existence here earlier tweeted that being in the Middle East in the 1st place is a mistake Authorities say the assailants got away there was a scare in London earlier today. Shoppers scattered in panic and police flooded one of the city's busiest areas after multiple reports of shots being fired at Oxford Circus subway station but an hour later police said they had found no sign of any gunshots suspects or casualties London Transit Authority say Oxford Circus station has reopened the Mall of America in Minnesota says that 2500 people were in line at the 5 am opening this morning that's in line with a year ago for Black Friday in Massachusetts Melvin Hernandez was shopping he spent his entire Thanksgiving Day waiting outside of Best Buy store though bus's they got their own food the inch Sharp the 4 K.'s. Smart t.v. For $179.00 and. The original price is $500.00 I looked it up everywhere and can. Good that there are no wells Wall Street today the Dow Jones up 32 points the Nasdaq was ahead by 22 more on these stories of townhall dot com. Hey I'm down here at your feet wait you're a basketball yes the basketball the kids left me here a long time ago I missed you through the year and here in those shouts of joy could you give me a little air and remind the kids of how fun I still am Ok great let's get down to as Native American parents and caregivers are encouraged me to healthy lifestyles Park kids is helping them get outside and play get ideas get involved get going at less than slash Indian country such as I u.s.c. H.h.s. And the counsel I rescued to us from a shelter in 2011 I loved those because she's always the diva does whatever she wants obviously is sleeping right now. She's so loving she is so comforting when I walked into the shelter I knew right then this year a special post Instagram store and shelter for that amazing adoption stories stored in shelters for years to visit the shelter pet project dot org to find a pet near you brought to you by Mattie's fund the Humane Society of the United States and the council it's back once back America's largest producer of gun shows a gift card. Captain Erik Lawrence was training Afghan soldiers when his truck was hit by an i.e.d. a Little way from Kandahar to. Hit an i.e.d. That just took the truck into the open ear and slammed it on the ground. I knew of 1st that I got hurt pretty bad because I can buy legs. I sat home alone for months I don't want that anymore I want to go back to what it. Was hesitant at 1st you know because I work for a good year. I want to be productive person. Oer be a drain on society I want to be a positive thing in society maybe a helping to write my resume having a job interview I got the job helping veterans like Eric because what we've done for over 65 years Paralyzed Veterans of America paving access for veterans employment through Operation pay for more information visit p.v.a. Dot org a public service message from Paralyzed Veterans of America. It takes 12 years to create a graduate it takes about the same time to create jobs the difference between a child becoming one of the other could be. The studies prove that reading to a child regularly dramatically improves reading skills and kids who read well by 3rd grade 4 times as likely to graduate so United Way is calling for 1000000 volunteers over the next 3 years we're asking you to step up make a pledge tutor a child who needs help mentor a kid who needs someone on their side volunteer to read to children make a difference because when a child advances the band's entire communities to prove. The path to success or failure starts long before graduation day and the difference between a graduate and a dropout could be you dear reader to do a mentor give up picking volunteer live United take the pledge to living knighted now brought to you by United Way. Your listening to the best of the 7 Chris shell. Access leaves and. Chris Buskirk principal and. Chris show. Now. I have Christmas turkey is set leaps and this is the setting Kris show the 5 o'clock hour of a Monday afternoon hope you all have had a good start to your week not always easy getting going but I think it's worth it once you do get moving in the right direction hope hope it's been a good day and I think we're going to improve your Dale a little bit with this hour of the something I've been excited to talk about for for quite a while and I think I might not be the only one to be honest with you we were talking earlier in the show Seth and I said that I had an opportunity to emcee an event recently for a for the Rio Verde Republican Women's they were in doing a scholarship for for students at a.s.u. And I had a chance to talk with quite a few of the people out there and you know what they told me was so many of them said exactly the same thing is we really like it when you when you go deep we really like it when you talk about history or talk about maybe a political theory and tell us something we didn't know before you know maybe we just knew a little bit and you just dive deeper and we feel like we knew something more after the fact well guess what this is going to be one of those hours this is going to be one of those hours where we talk about one of the things that made the modern world and that is the Reformation why are we talking about it today well it's interesting so there's that of course but but the reason is is because tomorrow marks the 500th anniversary of the event that kicked off the Reformation sometimes called the Protestant Reformation or just the Reformation but October 31st is the day that we traditionally celebrate or some celebrate some. Simply mark as the day that Martin Luther nailed the 95 thesis theses to the. Door of the church their invitation Berg Germany and that really was historians generally agree that that was the single event not the only one but the single event that really kicked off the Reformation well but the Reformation was a was a religious of that right this was something that took place within the Roman Catholic Church and then led to to Protestantism that's true it's certainly true we'll talk about that but there was there were other things going on in Europe and it was also a significant political and cultural of it too that helped shape the modern western world and these things are all I think worth exploring and so I brought in a very special guest today a dear friend of mine who the Very Reverend you know not just merely Reverend but very Reverend Michael Badcock he is the pastor of Calvin Presbyterian Church here in Phoenix he is expert church history and understands all these things that we're talking about the theology but also the social the political context the history and I know we have a lot of people who have remarked to me that this is a subject of some interest to them as well so without further ado why don't we dig into into into the history of the Reformation pastor back Thanks Chris and he built me up too much so I'm overselling No no not as Jack I'm on your side I'm seriously underselling because I guess why don't you just take a 2nd you've been on the show before in my garage last last Christmas time we talk about the history of Christmas in in. In the western what some people would call Christendom it's a Christian holiday or has been until recently and any rate what is. I just tell people maybe a little bit about your about yourself and how you. Came to. Embrace or appreciate the Reformation both from a you know from a religious from the really religious side but also to appreciate how it impacted Western civilization right well that's a long story I mean now we're talking also 500 years actually even longer than that but but I was actually born and raised as a Roman Catholic myself and so I was in a monastery when I started becoming very convicted. Sin and meaning to life looking for what is the purpose of existence of the more I try to find I could not. That eventually I was led to read the scriptures and as I did I became very clearly. In tune with what Martin Luther was in tune with that that. Salvation and has to be from outside ourselves we as individuals everybody is a sinner now a lot of people may not like that terminology but it's the fact that everyone at least knows that they're not perfect and that they have a lot of errors in their life a lot of regrets and you know the Bible calls that sin. And how do I get out of my guilt how do I get away from feeling myself that Martin Luther he was so I was in August and in Monk feeling so guilty about his sin that he would spend hours confessing them and eventually his confessor violent stop it's mentioned will Martin Luther Why don't you just love God and His statement love God I hate God and of course if you look at the Scriptures and it says you must be perfect how can you love a God who demands perfection when you can't be and there's no way to become perfect and that's really what kind of kicked off the Reformation it was this feeling I got to find peace I got to find relief for our guilty soul and he Martin Luther did that by reading through the Scriptures where he found that faith in Christ was sufficient and by by putting your faith in the perfect Messiah Jesus was the way that you find peace and and to be restored to fellowship with God So that's where it started out. 95 thesis basically the Roman Catholic Church the medieval church was. There was a lot of moral issues and this isn't just a propaganda Crist's this is this is a reality this is history where there are pope's who had a lot of different children they're supposed to take a vow celibacy and yet here they are having all these children there was no question at all that nunneries were also a place where nuns were having their babies as priest and nuns would hook up together and it was a very immoral society. About 75 miles about 75 years before Martin Luther we had one of the pope's that basically died of buggery I mean he was a homosexual and he it end well for him but what will me ask you this what was the what was the context I guess what was the social and political context of what it into which Martin Luther found himself having had these personal. Struggles I guess with with with with his own guilt and sin and here it led him to it led him to a place where he had to search out through through the through the Bible right and figure out what that meant he was in a monastery Right right yeah. He looked you know he did a pilgrimage to Rome and came back and then you know he basically from rural Germany where he was was not that wasn't the center he was teaching in a new university but it was a new university and as all new universities it had a whole lot of notoriety and so yeah he was in a very deep place up the middle of nowhere as it were right so here's this monk you know basically he comes off in a sensitive figure to being sort of comes off the farm basically goes to Rome he's very idealistic I think if if you can say somebody is idealistic if you expect other people to do what they say they're going to do a live up to it's there at least attempt to live up to the principles that they as well as he gets to Rome he's basically completely put off by what he is apparently shocked yeah yeah that's again it's the gambling drunkenness the usury simony you know simony was where you would buy a church office if you wanted to be a bishop and you had just enough money well you just pay the money and Martin Luther was seen all these kind of things for the 1st time and became completely dismayed. What was the what was the sort of political cultural context of Europe at that time I mean there were a lot of things going on in European what Martin Luther did of course he wasn't the only one who will talk about that later because there were there were sort of proto all reformers who had come before Luther and then there were of course other people who had picked up the baton after he was gone or even during his during his lifetime but what was what was sort of the what were the things going on in Europe generally culturally politically technologically that made this a ripe time a right moment in history so there was an awful lot actually you know back to that night there are 10th century the Muslims began moving into Europe they had completely conquered Spain Well not completely the least of Southern the southern kingdom that Spain. And 1491 Isabelle and Ferdinand Christopher Columbus thing they were able to join forces and force the Moore's out . There was out also and the end of it was they stopped the Muslim forces from coming in but during that time also remember that there was outbreaks of the plague people were dying people were very afraid of death it was a very big reality and then also in the late actually hold hold that thought we got to go to a quick break when we come back we will will will continue with the pastor Michael Badcock discussing word of the Reformation come from it's been 500 years as of today and as of tomorrow it's been 500 years where did it come from a what how did it help shape the modern world we'll be right back. Mike Gallagher believes there are some issues that we all should agree on Am I wrong to react to the Harvey Weinstein scandal by observing that not everything cash to be. Right there is this paradise now where everything that occurred because of left vs right the Mike Gallagher show weekdays at 8 on intelligent talk 960 The Patriot. 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A over year one right here in the back were over by the fence you know by yeah the bike right in the grass where the kids left me a while ago you know how lonely it is being left day after day not being able to cruise a reservation pardon me remember when you got me for the kids you told them No you could go have fun enjoy the outdoors and be careful Yeah I really miss it especially when they put that playing card in my spokes and I made a really cool sound the faster we went well did you get my tires a little air dust off my seat and remind the kids how fun I still am here. Yeah and I may need a couple of bolts tight until now let's go as Native American parents and caregivers are encouraged me to healthy lifestyles for kids is helping them get outside and play get ideas get involved get going let's move dot gov slash Indian country brought to you by u.s.d.a. H.h.s. And their council. Did you know easy Big Media dot com was named the Web site every Arizonan should know for more than 30 years as the big media has brought readers Well we are discussing the 500th anniversary of the Reformation the where it came from and what it meant for Western civilization we are joined by the Very Reverend Michael Badcock and that of course that him that we were just playing of that was chosen specifically for this there was a hymn called a mighty fortress is our God It was written by Martin Luther and it is one of been one of the most popular hymns in the throughout the Protestant world for the past several years Catholics are seeing it I did not know that yes they are at sea that's how good it is trying to integrate him that came out of the Reformation a lot of ways I what what's Luther's favorite. Maybe was a Luther said about what is this quote that reformation was carried on. Luther's him or something to that effect right yeah yeah how does that go well I'm not exactly sure the exact quote but certainly. The peasants and poor people were staying in the hands and that's what carried on that the doctrine of the Reformation So yeah it would we went to the break we were you're you were really answering the question of what was the context into which Luther nailed these 95 theses on to the church door I mean maybe before you go back to talking about the broad with the seas now you had said in 1902 just 20 What is that 25 years earlier . Christopher Columbus of course had discovered North America we also have we also have the situation where we have the Ottoman Empire the Muslim Turks who have been invading Europe from the east. We have Muslims at the basically at the gates of Vienna in the same period so we have the Crusades that have been going on also for several 100 years but there's this war between Europe and the Muslim East that's been waged on and off for a few centuries right. How how does this how do you think I guess the question I had was. How do all these things come together make this a particularly ripe moment for reformation of the church and before I guess the 1st part of that is what role did the church play in European society leading up to the Reformation Well the church was the center part of all European society the church was the place where people were were born they were baptized they grew up there they were buried they were married the church was probably the most important aspect of society and so in that regard the church was very important and and of course the pope. He was the one that ordained or installed kings and emperors and he was so that every every aspect of Europe was centered around the church in one way or another taxes were sent to the pope and unless the pope agreed remember. During this time there was. Henry the 8th king of England who wanted a divorce and. He had to go to the poor pope to get that divorce ratified of course the pope said no and and that's where the English Reformation took off but so again that the point is is that the church was the center of all European life. And and so what the so what that church be in that area was looking to the church for their blessings for life itself. It became a very very important aspect for Martin Luther because again he was looking for peace he was hoping that the church would give him direction and he wasn't finding the direction in the traditions and the rights of the Catholic Church at that time and so with Luther nailed these 95 Theses to this door I guess maybe a couple things One is for people who don't know what the thesis and what were the 95 and that's one question and then but once he did that once he did that this set off a chain of events and in the immediate future of the next months couple of years that I think Lou Well we know Luther did not foresee it coming. Right so I guess what's the what are these these these not maiming them but what does it mean to post them why did he do it and then what was the chain of events that that set off right well just during that time there was. A man by the name of capsule who was going around the pope and Rome was trying to build St Peter's Cathedral he needed money to do that he himself ran out of money because of gambling problems and such things but but the problem is he had no money he needed money tensile was going around saying to people if you give money to the church you will you will have less time in purgatory purgatory is that space between the grave and heaven that the faithful would go to to have their their guilt kind of cleansed and what not so anyway to make a long story short he was making a lot of money that Pope was Bacolod might utensil very influential men. That 95 Theses were really a challenge. Why purgatory number one and why do you why do you have. To pay money to the pope Why can't the pope just absolve sin and let people spring out of Purgatory So that's really what the 95 thesis was about to say what why is the pope trying to get this money when there is enough money to go around for it to help the poor to there's a famous quote attributed to Tuttle in the coin in the coffer clinks. The one that coined the coffer clinks. So from purgatory Springs. Right well the look of truth in advertising I guess I guess he's at least making his claim that clearly I won't say truth in advertising but he made his claim clear so that Yeah exactly so the 95 pieces was basically a challenge it was I want to challenge people to a debate on this issue of purgatory and the sale of indulgences and so then what it was so Luther does this in October of 1517 Again sort of in this outpost in Germany and then what happens after that yeah well well that's the interesting thing is just you know just prior to all this the Gutenberg printing press was invented so that enabled print it out pamphlets and books and things like that to get well so a couple of guys took those thesis printed out and began distributing it so all alot of places in Germany now had they infer the thesis that Martin Luther had put up right so now everyone was talking about yeah what is this a thing about indulgences Well Martin Luther then began writing a series of books and tracts against other parts of the Roman Catholic Church that he began to find to be somewhat not keeping aligned with the Scriptures and finally . He was called before the Papal. Before the papal Leggett's and a town or city called berms. Where he came to give a defense are these your writings Yes they're my writings are you going to recant and he said Well give me 24 hours to think about this because the problem was some of the stuff that he wrote everyone agreed was good you know even the Roman Catholic bishops and the pope said this in these are good faithful writings of the church. But somehow there are actually hold that thought because we're going to go to a break but I want to ask a quick clarification before before we go so salute proposed these 95 theses. On the door of the church and then they get printed he starts writing these tracts of things which get printed only possible because of the printing press that you think that you think that Luther ever would have been called in front of the people like it but for the printing press but for the fact that these were distributed No I don't think so I honestly just never would have known about a problem Zack because like you said he was in a productive little place it's no wonder no one heard of Martin Luther right right now or about that what he was doing a centrally a century earlier it would have maybe just been a disputation among amongst monks nobody ever would have been been the wiser interesting we'll come back on that point with more of the something crucial we find out how did the Reformation impact how did the Reformation shape the modern world in which we live. Or in news I'm Greg kludged in in Washington in Egypt militants open fire and set off explosives at a mosque today killing more than 200 people officials say it is the country's deadliest ever militant attack on this day after Thanksgiving shoppers in this country were out before dawn looking for Black Friday deals retailers that have had a tough year hoping to cash in on one of the biggest shopping days of the year Argentina says it's accelerating the search for a submarine that has been lost in the South Atlantic for 8 days amid growing fears for its 44 crew members the Navy says an explosion occurred near the time and place where the sub went missing that has led some to give up hope but the search continues stocks pushed higher on Wall Street the Dow was ahead by 32 the Nasdaq up 22 points the s. And p. 500 ahead by 5 more details at s.r.m. News dot com. I'm an almost Everest coalescing class in the senior neighborhood any Tell me then I'm a pretty good kid Well I'm one out of every 5 children in America and I'm struggling with how please visit Feeding America dollar return and find your local food money for ways to help every dollar you donate up by 8 meals for kids like me we are feeding America back to you by giving a man can game yeah countdown. Yeah you it's me your heart listen to me we've got to talk high blood pressure is serious and yours whoa what happened to us we used to be so much more active but lately you've been ignoring me I know you think I'm just going to keep taken away for ever but you're wrong you can do so much more to control your high blood pressure doing the minimum isn't doing enough I'm under a lot of pressure and can quit whenever I want but you don't know that but I like my job just treat me better check on me give me something green to nibble on every once in a while and maybe we can do some exercise on occasion let's get to it after all we're in this together listen to your heart don't let it quit on you high blood pressure can lead to a stroke heart attack or death get your blood pressure to a healthy range before it's too late find out how at Heart dot org slash blood pressure checked change control a message from the American Heart Association the American Stroke Association and the Ad Council Hey I'm down here at your feet wait you're a basketball yes the basketball the kids love me here a long time ago I missed my the air and here in those shouts of joy could you give me a little air and remind the kids of how fun I still am Ok great. As Native American parents and caregivers are encouraged meant to help in lifestyles for kids is helping them get outside and get ideas get involved get going at let's move back to slash in the country actually at the u.s.d.a. H.h.s. And the constant. Hi pare I'm here for my flu shot and I heard there's an option for people 65 and older there is but you actually have to be 65 very flattering Thanks untutored light you know who I am right I just turned 65 and I know your immune system gets weaker with age and I don't want to miss a day of work or risk spreading the food at the people I don't think we've met before but what I do know is you can't be successful Ok what if I said I only have one life to live and I need protection against the flip and know. Who's the boss of my health I am. Clue season is here and people 65 and older need to ask about the vaccine made specifically for their age flu vaccination is especially important for people with chronic conditions like diabetes and heart disease which could worsen with the flu Oh I'm so sorry about that I thought you were like 35 don't. Visit the National Council on Aging at n.c.r. Way dot org slash flu to learn more and talk to your doctor about vaccine options for people 65 and older. You are listening to the best of the 7 Chris shell. I am Christmas turkey is Seth's and this is the setting Chris show our guest is Pastor Michael Badcock he is the pastor of Calvin Presbyterian Church here in Phoenix and he is an expert on church history and he is joining us today because today is we're on the eve of the 500th anniversary of the date that is commonly understood to be the kickoff of the Reformation it was of course a huge huge event in the life of the Christian church but it had also enormous implications for our for our politics for our society for our culture the implications of the Reformation that was set in motion by Martin Luther in October 15th 17 reach into every area of our lives so I just one of kind of finish with I want to finish with just one like this last question on what happened after Luther did and then I come I want to talk specifically about what I get Ira not what but how the Reformation this something that was happening inside the church Reformation means reform right obviously at the Luther wanted to in the other people follow want to do is they want to reform the church they saw imperfections in the church they wanted to make the church better Ok And yet this has this really shaped history of change that you know the arc of history in well throughout throughout the world indirectly but in Western civilization it was very direct before we get to that though the question is is this so a couple things happened right after Lou in the few years after Luther rights or post these post these theses what how did Luther see his mission after that the. Warms and what was what was his men who were the important people who came immediately after him Yes well those good questions well Martin Luther saw himself primarily as a pastor and so that's what he sought to do to pastor the people that were under him and his charge so he wanted to feed them the Word of God part to do that he translated the Bible from the Latin from the front we're not from a lot but from the Greek and from the Hebrew into German he actually his translation of the kind of established a form of German that became pretty widespread Anyway that's just another side issue but so he translated the Bible into German he taught it he preached it he encouraged other pastors. Throughout Germany and throughout Europe who were seeking . To come into the Reformation So that was basically his mission and that's what all he really wanted to do and in fact you know it's an interesting things that he said you're not setting your your interest I'm the other one yeah you're the other guy. But. He said that his one of his faith his best friends was a man by name length and who also taught the university with and he said you know we didn't do anything with this reformation all we did is drink beer and the Word of God did the rest of the work so there of course also brewed beer they were there Burberry Yeah. Lots of things came out of the Reformation Right yes exactly and there's nothing better than a good talk. Cold glass of beer but anyway. So there was him then following handers also swing Lee in Germany he was in Zurich who died fighting a war and so he was a very soldier. Minded kind every farmer. That there was feral and John Calvin and Geneva there was boots are and style spared and that eventually through the machinations of a king who did not who wanted a divorce but wasn't granted when he left the Roman Catholic Church and men like Cranmer and others about Henry the 8th they were in England right yeah they started their reformation up in England John Knox was up in Scotland and he eventually was kicked out of his exile from his home country. Made his way to Geneva sat under John Calvin but when Mary when the Queen Mary Bloody Mary died he was able to go back and he entered back into Scotland and reformed Scotland so those are some of the big names. For these you had these sort of individual reformations country by country right I mean there were there was a big ark there was a big There were big themes going on they were all they were in contact with each other and they were reading what each other's tracks and writings but it's sort of had been just the nature of the nation state at that stage was such that these things sort of happened a little bit different in each country you had as you say crammer of the who was one of the 3 Oxford martyrs him he and Nicholas Ridley and Hugh Latimer in England Knox and Scotland and then of course you've got them in Switzerland you've got you've got Calvin Of course in some ways the chief of the reformers a French woman but spent most of his professional life in Geneva Switzerland you know he's a can't you know this but I find that people don't know generally know this but one of the foremost universities in the world is the university in Geneva That's right top university in the world it started off as it was founded by Calvin is his academy there yeah in fact all the almost all the great universities. Hold that thought right because you're right I wanted to go there but we're going we got to go to a quick break we'll be right back with more on the Reformation. Larry Elder is continually dumbfounded by the media the Harvey Weinstein scandal is now being used by the left to say well done to come to the same things we've elected Donald Trump we've done the Harvey Weinstein the issue is really really really not just what's going on in Hollywood the issue is Donald Trump The Larry Elder Show weeknights at 9 on intelligent talk 960 The Patriot. Among holiday season releases this splendid new film wonder has earned spectacular success finishing 2nd in precincts giving box office with enthusiastic reviews and an impressive $27000000.00 in ticket sales the story follows a 10 year old with facial birth defects braving his 1st year of school with support from his loving parents Julia Roberts and Owen Wilson behind the scenes wonder involved surprising collaboration between conservatives and progressives in Hollywood Participant Media produced Al Gore's global warming films while Walden Media is best known for family friendly fare that affirms traditional values like the popular Narnia series these 2 companies managed to work together backing this new film that's completely a political while celebrating strong families kindness and every day if left and right Hollywood can get together behind fundamental Virgin's the nation needs most Shouldn't our representatives in Washington make every effort to follow their example I'm Michael Medved. Take over year for right here in the back were over by the for you the bike Yeah the bike right in the grass with the kids left me a while ago you know how lonely it is being left day after day not being able to cruise a reservation ordinary remember when you got me for the kids you told them you know you kids go how fun enjoy the outdoors and be careful. And really miss it especially when they put that playing card in my spokes and I made a really cool sound the faster we went well to get my tires a little air dust off my seat and remind the kids how fun I still am very. You are here and I may need a couple of belt tightening too now let's go as Native American parents and simple savings plan teaches you how to start saving without going overboard so you don't need to sell all your belongings and live in a commune these under ease a lot of us now Tom you don't need to get a 2nd job. You just need see the big dot org Don't get left his coffee beans so I am 1st class Kirk is set up so welcome back to the setting Chris show continuing this discussion of the Reformation why well because tomorrow is the 500th anniversary of the Reformation So in a sense this this hour of the something Chris show has been 500 years in the making my guest today is Pastor Michael Badcock from Calvin Presbyterian Church today he's an expert in church history and as we were parting it at the end of the last segment talking about the University of Geneva it's one of the foremost universities on the planet and it was started as off actively as a seminary that by John Calvin in the in the middle of the 16th century in order to train his in order to train pastors in Geneva and developed over the centuries to become again one of the foremost centers of learning on the planet not unusual right so many of the great so many of the great universities on the planet were founded as a result of a reformation I think most of our Ivy League universities in the East Coast are all founded originally to be trainers of pastors Harvard certainly that way Yale was that way you were told me I didn't realize Brown was founded to train Baptist ministers interesting Princeton of course grew out of the of the law college had it which was to train well it's kind of it's a longer history but up to train ministers I got sacked by some ministers in this country and that just you know by the way it's that was one of the main results of the Reformation. You know it wasn't it wasn't modern men who called the medieval age the Dark Ages it was that people that live in right about the time of the Reformation so men like harassments right they go back they were the. The Renaissance renaissance is just that old French word that means a rebirth while they were the ones who actually coined that it was the Dark Ages because. The people were filled with a lot of ignorance and darkness and most people were pretty illiterate even a lot of the priest that they memorized the mass but they didn't couldn't read and so there was really a really a dearth of of ignorance. Even among the clergy and the Reformation because of its desire to put the word of God into the hands of people they began to teach people how to read and to write so one of the great benefits that we have in our modern age is modern education and reading and writing I mean you know that it invent reading or writing obviously but they certainly did promote it but effectively invented public education Yeah right I mean this is something people don't appreciate you and people often when they say oh you know there that's a puritanical culture that's kind of used as a slur there's this thought that anything that's puritanical is repressive of in some way. Or comes to romantic love between a husband and wife the Puritans were very much at the forefront of that if you read Puritan writings the same thing that was a Republican education they really were you know they. They had they had a great interest in changing and transforming society and so you know so they were very well educated and they try to educate their people well right and not just an elite This is what I think is interesting is that they thought that the Word of God was for everyone was for the euro was for the was for the farmer in the field as much as it was for the priest in the cathedral and so they wanted the they wanted the Word of God in the language that everybody could read English French German etc and they wanted to of course the other parts you have to be able to read Yeah right so they want people to be able to read they want to people you know to kind of play out on some of the themes that they saw throughout the Bible they want to people to be able to be self-sufficient right Yeah right exactly they were really were aiming for if only secondarily at a middle class type society which leads me to my next question this is the big one for this show anyway this is the big one was America possible without the Reformation. That's a big question and like I was saying to you during a break I wish that we can go back into a time machine and pull Martin Luther out of the situation to see what would happen . But but of course you can't do that I'm not convinced that America as we know it today what if existed without the Reformation and primarily because what happened was is that during the Reformation it freed people to think to have a freedom of thought. You know all the really great thinkers you know civil liberties and political thought were they come from they didn't come from Italy they didn't come from Spain they didn't come from France. Those were Roman Catholic countries where they come from well John Locke was huge influence upon our founding fathers right John Locke he was in Scotland a Protestant nation following that David Hume and then you had Barclay there and all stirred north of Ireland you know that idea of Adam Smith writing a political economy exactly right and then you had you know in Germany where in that German it's not so much of political thought so much but and the way of thinking about who we are as individuals so you had you know people like need Khant . Marker Hegel you know Marx you know what I want you know I might hate what Marx wrote and some of his philosophy at least it was from a country that was not dominated by. A severe. You know oppressive government that was imposed by the pope but what let me ask you this what role did did the Reformation the reformers have on the thinking of the founders of this country how did it influence the way they thought about politics influence the way they thought about society about culture and how did it shape the development of the colonies Well yeah that's some really good questions and I don't know if I have all the understand of that but I think that at least one important thing is that because most of the founding fathers were not necessarily even Orthodox Christian right they they held to a form of deism but that was at least what I would say is that it was at least possible for them to hold that view. Because you know taken off the shackles of Rome taken off the shackles of fear and oppression that Martin Luther as see as he preached the gospel that has he preached you know that that salvation is is a free gift of God It freed people up to to think independent and I think that was one of the it made ensure that that the founding fathers found I don't know that the Reformation had a direct direct informs but at a secondary level because of the influence it had on the on the culture on educating people advocating on a larger segment of the population and ideas that gave people about who to rule exactly right this is this is always the question of politics it always comes back to the same thing who rules like that right the Divine the right the monarchy or so accuracy always had this idea of the Divine Right of Kings which they tried to predicated upon Scripture well with the Reformation there came a different idea which is that people have a right to rule themselves of course it had seats in the Old Testament of course but also in classical Greek political philosophy when we come back short segment but here's the big question you're a minister in the Presbyterian Church why is it why is it that the American Revolution is sometimes referred to as a Presbyterian revolution Ok We'll be right back right. 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So Justin I was playing that view game crossed the gate it was pretty cool I was running I was like the general path and I'm at this digital for all the clues are like. And I want playing in this virtual stream or this quarter but you have too much real it was just clearly on My Tronics forest world so what did you do well my parents took me to the forest the real forest when I was running down this well it was an actual path and then I saw this real life frog it was all white rabbit and I saw an owl so then I played in this amazing stream with water around my ankles like when it watered then me and my sister and my parents said I want a campfire it's all cool stories all night long oh that's a pretty cool too this weekend. Plus getting closer to nature can get you closer to your family to find a forest near seal you got to discover the forest for Rocky by the u.s. Forest Service in the Arkansas. This is it I hope you are learning something about the Reformation but why it happened the context of happened in the influence of had the huge influence it had on Western civilization and on the founding of this country the true the how it influenced the well just the founding itself but then the trajectory of this country over the past couple 100 years so even if you're not a Protestant You can preach she ate the rats ration that's it that is exactly right the question I have for you but this is you are a minister in the Orthodox Presbyterian Church there's there is there is a school of thought. That says and I've read this in several places that the the American Revolution assumption was a Presbyterian revolution was called the Presbyterian revolution by some of the historians have written on the other of the revolution Ok why well I think Presbyterian is another one is an intellectual. Denomination and there's a lot of deep thinkers and they were thinking about how civil government ought to be run and how and there was a separation of church and state for that but I think a lot of it had to do with the fact. There's a lot of different things and that but I think part of it had to do with the fact that. Presbyterians helped to fund it you know and they also. A lot of them joined the the forces as chaplains but also as soldiers but also I think later on it was the Presbyterian polity and form of government that led the United States to think of you know. Separations of you know like legislative. Judicial. And executive executive branches of the government and it was basic is that it's all found in Presbyterian polity that we have various. You know regional national local levels and. So I think a lot of it was just like again some of their idea of what polity looks like how bit odd it be governing themselves. And that there should be checks and balances you know and Presbyterian has them there is a lot of mutual accountability and there are and there is all there is a lot of. Well there's this idea of mutual accountability there's like this idea that people everybody should be accountable to somebody right and that and a separation of power with reliance upon the people themselves exactly right man James Madison who was the primary author of the Constitution while not a practice it has been here and so was educated by Presbyterians Right right and so maybe this is part of it there I think that has a lot to do with it yeah you know I think that this is this is this something that to me this is fascinating because to kind of the cultural influences on the American founding on the American Revolution we talk a lot of I would do it here on this show as you know a lot we talk about the theory a lot of political philosophy but culture comes before politics and culture is driven by in most cases by which it. Appears that there's looking into I think even more Thanks so much for spending the time and I would like to usher explain to. The 500th anniversary of the Reformation why it's significant work of people who want to hear more from you we're going to find you they can always find us at Calvin o.p.c. Dot org That's our website and our government worship is 4150 East to come much of sounds good thanks very much for being with us see you tomorrow see at 3 all right but. Take an ordinary putty knife and scrape off the old wax ring place the new wax ring over the flange then line up the bolts with the bowl and gently set in place making sure a proper seal is created with the flange and drain.
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