if it's manipulative i foreign interference? >> that's correct. >> the framers were generally and deeply concerned with the threat of foreign interference, true? >> yes. >> why were they so deeply concerned? >> because foreign nations don't have our interests at heart. they have their interests at heart. >> with the framers find it acceptable for an american president to pressure a foreign government to help him win an election? >> i think they would find it unacceptable for a president to ask a foreign government to help them, whether they put pressure on her not to break direct evidence shows, direct evidence shows that on july 25 the president uttered five words: do us a favor, though. pressure the ukrainian government to target an american citizen for political gain and at the same time simultaneously with health ringer $91 million