Transcripts For CSPAN3 UCLA 20240705

I am going to start as rick asked us to do because of got a lot to cover. Rick beat me to the punch but i too was at this conference that rick hosted it really seems like a book and i was on a panel with neil just coming out hear from d. C. Where maybe there was something going on is little worrisome. I note the three days we were here and took the plane back it seemed like the beginning of covid issue continued and got a lot worse. But here we are following this where things are better on that front but we have had an electionin the meantime were sel elections especially one that really does raise a question of threats. Im not going to do a long introduction of the very shortest to give you a sense of who people are vincent is a secretary state of michigan elected in 2018 and again in 2022. And then we have two Election Officials from some of our largest jurisdictions local jurisdictions in america. Neil kelly has just retired from 17 years of service in Orange County. You are a county with almost 2 million registered voters. And was elected in 2020 and actually came into office in the aftermath of the 2020 election and for Maricopa County depends how you count my be the second largest theres disputes from Harris County can let them have the title thats good. We have a wide range of state and local experience. We are going to hear from them all some things bill here are not pleasant literally were going to hear some things that can give you a sense of the atmosphere in the threats that are out there. But i guess im going to ask all of the panelist to say some initial remarks. Go where you want to go but threats to elections that we are talking about today we could think of it in a couple of ways but some of the things that have happened the terrible things he changes in attitude but also some of the institutional concerns that we have. What are the institutions we have in place . How should they be working . What about certifying elections are having postelection audits . Or how quickly we are able to account the votes. Are those types of things helpful or could we do them in ways that are bettered to help mitigate the threat against election. So with that i open it up to johnson to say a few words at the beginning and then we will go down the line for. Thank you, thanks for having me and thank you for bringing us all together. I started as a young law professor in my late 20s about t was. But it was rick who was in many ways, used his textbook at the time of my election law class but also relate leading the way in building a community of election law scholars so thank you rick for the work you have put into build this community through it many ways and institutions over the years because it is needed now more than ever. And i think a testament to the great names and voices to see gathered today are a reflection of ricks work over decades to build that. We have all been a part of them anyway so thank you all for being here. I think now as we look to the threats of democracy that we are facing, i have found three things. One i is i think the pillars of democracy are rooted in people and the law. There have been attacks on both of those pillars try to overturn legal precedent. The voter officials weaker. But even more than the law, the people in our system will determine the future of our democracy. That is also been under attack by the threat the vitriolic threats will talk about today that we have all faced many have faced, thousands of base were fr doing our job of administering elections. Basically every potential position in democracy from coworkers to secretaries of state and everything in between with people who are not beholden to the law of the principles of democracy and are willing to start the law or up and the system to advance certain parts of the political goals. When i think about the threats we are facing today the first two things i will say is without the law without the people those threats will become realized. But the law is strong and it upholds the law in every aspect of the system of upholding principles of democracy we can survive. We will survive not only this moment but we can also thrive. What i have seen over the last several years the administrative positions as a system in michigan and nationwide that has endured great threats. But it is stronger now and 2024 then we were at this stage leading up to the 2020 election. We are more organized. We are more coordinated. We have more professionals on both side of the optically local positions than ever before. And in many ways the challenges and threats will have endured in the system over the last few years we have worked to enable us to be more prepared for anything thats going to come our way in 2024 so i am optimistic. And someone whos done this work for several decades and wants to be a healthier emerge from various points in our history from the 2000 election to 2004 until now i have only seen at large bed toward a healthier democracy even though the challenges have been significant. I am hopeful and really determined to make sure we get to the other side of the 2024 election with a stronger democracy than ever before. Can i followup with one more specific and certifying of the 2020 election your state as well as other states the number of potential legal problems were either a local official that might say the not going to certify an election. Weve counted the votes have gone to the Legal Process yet there is administrative point could you walk us a little through what that potential threat is . How real it is . How we should get around it . And reforming our institutions to avoid that last step problem we probably were not thinking a lot about. Notably we built in a whole system to preparedness that involved postelection security and work. Thats particular focus on making sure after the results are reported the peoples who job it is to certify Election Results at the county and state levels simply do their jobs and under michigan law and every other state it is not a substantive role it certified the Election Results once they have been through basic math. Its completed at local and ultimately statelevel. So in 2020 what we saw unfold through what we now know and is now been revealed to the generous sixth committee is a strategy for alternate electors in the hands of congress or perhaps adoption or the adoption of state legislatures that is the centerpiece of that was delaying or blocking the certification of the Election Results the state and local level. I think its important to note the strategy is entirely dependent upon the people appointed those positions. The law is clear but if they choose not to follow the law we will see consequences as we have said time and time again. It will also create chaos, confusion create a talking point for those who want to create an air of uncertainty falsely so but uncertainty nonetheless it gives them a hook to bolster state legislative positions so it is a Clear Strategy thats geared not necessarily a blocking the ultimate certification of the progress because of her layers are in place to ensure results with it certified in our state and many others. We will get there eventually in the effort to block certification will fail but they know that. The success is rooted in their ability to create chaos and confusion and uncertainty and doubt around Election Results. The strategy for political actors state legislatures and in congress to not accept valid Election Results for the people and instead accept an alternative slate. Thats the strategy we saw unfold mission was a first date that was the domino to fall the goal was to get us to delay our certification can take that to pennsylvania and create the all we saw that going in at the local level we work to ensure our state was certified we can talk about that nittygritty but the bottom line is anticipating mexico and other states of illustrated strategy this not just about president ial elections it will unfold in many elections to come but we have to talk about it and recognize it not from a necessarily successful legal strategy. Because it wont be. It could potentially be successful narrative strategy to enable doubt and confusion around election the harms it builds is rightfully elected to govern with any legitimacy. Thank you. Rick, i echo the secretarys comments so thank you so much for hosting this. Its a challenge for usc graduate to come here at. [laughter] i have some thoughts thought the best way to do that is to write them down. I have many thoughts i want to talk about related to this and i promise to keep it to five minutes. Im so bear with me this may be might Gerry Mcguire at moment but i am retired so thats okay. I served as a non partisan nonn official for nearly 20 years. It is fair to say it not much surprises me anymore but im dismayed at the tax on free and Fair Elections the erosion of trust playbook used by one canon after another quite frankly many voters are starting to catch on. There are parallels to what we find ourselves today we do not have to dig too far in the past to shed light on it. Electricity began to evolve in 18th and 19th century many people were too afraid to use it. Widespread fear of electricity caused many to believe it about black magic or witchcraft one u. S. President Benjamin Harrison was so afraid of being electrocuted he never touched a light switch in the white house. As the titans of the Electrical Industry battled it out name such as westinghouse, edison and tesla capitalize on fear and spread disinformation about the dangers and mysteries of each others solutions. To dominate the industrialization of electric power spreading false or to distorting the truth about competing technologies benefited the purveyor of the myths and ad disinformation. Sound familiar . Looking back on this its hard to imagine how seemingly rational people can be fooled so easily. Then again fs four to 21st century elections and our past continues to haunt us. The continual volley between those claiming there is no wads widespread fraud elections versus those who believe all elections are ripe with fraud is getting us nowhere but add to that a small subset of vocal individuals across the country whose extremist Election Fraud views are afforded outside respect. As a result Upcoming Elections are not very appealing to those who run them and in fact this is mutated into a real migraine for Election Officials. Before getting into those details i went to examine the word fraud. The definition of fraud in its purest form is wrongful criminal deception intended to result in financial personal gain. We should not conflate disagreements with laws, regulations and rules of voting with the outrageous notion all elections are rigged. Is there work to be done . Of course i want to give you one specific example. Too often Election Officials are bound by outdated laws that should be updated many of which can for the erosion of trust. Case in point voter list maintenance needs an overhaul. Why are we compelled by laws to update our address if we move when it comes to our drivers license, our passport, our taxes in our dogs license but not a Voter Registration . Legal constraints on voter list maintenance can duplicate ballots outdated addresses and suspicion. These kinds of disparities only fuel a public hungry for explanations as to why the favorite candidate lost election and becomes a catalyst for future erosion of trust. The reality is elections are far more secure than they were just a decade ago. As an example many Election Officials deploy an array of preand post election system testing, Voter Registration audits, and a softer reviews that go well beyond the requirements found in federal and state law. These are not the days of the early 20th century there is a violence at the polls, stolen ballot boxes drifted down rivers and a party manipulated party ms and coerced voters. We should not treat modern elections as though they are relics of the past. This fixation with blanket cries of fraud is not improving elections. In fact the irony of chasing conspiracy theories is that it can deter voting across party lines. Response to ricks question what are some the things that need to be done to assure free and Fair Elections . An acceptance of Election Results in 2024 i humbly submit we should continue to expand audits, partner with prosecutors on any violations of election law, improve the Voter Experience and use election materials to communicate facts about misinformation directly with voters. Which will continue to build trust and confidence among the electorate. In addition as citizens we ought to put more effort into improving elections rely less on encouraging election denier litigants who think they can overturn Election Results based on rumor and conjecture. In fact the courts have been unanimous in its opinion as well. Uniteds federal judge linda parker wrote in her decision related to a challenge from the 2020 november election this case was undermining the peoples faith in our democracy and debasing the judicial process to do so. So friends and colleagues, the next time you turn on a light switch think back to a time when electricity ceased being in your curiosity we entered expanded air of rationality, industry and science. Likewise we can continue to improve elections have as much faith and turning on a light switch as we are casting a ballot. Rational people can sort this out with respectful mutually satisfying conversations, thank you. Thank you neil. [applause] i am going to go again and follow up on a specific issue. You pointed to cleaning up Voter Registration rules are modernizing them and improving them as a way we might tamp down some worries about election conspiracies. I want to put another issue on your plate which is when you are familiar with here in california. Under california laws the question of how quickly we count the ballots whether there are ways in which in every state being different in their own ways might find ways to have a quicker but more transparent way of counting the ballots it. I am sure all conspiracy theorists would not find a satisfying that there is a question for the average voter why are our ballots not coming in . Are there things we can do in that realm to instill Public Confidence and keep the worst of the conspiracy theorist about whats going behind the scenes Going Forward . Whats its a great question i believe there is. In california there is a real desire to expand the opportunities for voting. Its something i supported and is understandable but when you expand that you are extended the time. All of the laws that have been passed in the last 10 years in california have done just that. We now one of the longest campuses in the country think may be the longest of 30 days. That doesnt build suspicion. Especially as your processing provisional ballots are ballots that come in lates according to them beyond election day but of course we know there all caps before election day you are going through that process of gin the eligibility checks. One of the things i did and this is not for everybody is to invest in technology that would speed up the canvas. There are optics that are challenging when youre taken the full 30 days. We were able to cut that time in half. Not every county can do that of course. But i would suggest that is one way we should work to improve the processes to invest in technology to invest in ways to improve the canvas process in short the timeframe. It just sews it distressed when you have that too long. One thing on that because i totally agree we cannot have that conversation that knowing the onus is not entirely on Election Officials to meet those deadlines with greater funding from lawmakers at the state and federal level and laws that enable creative ways in transparent ways to tabulate ballots in a way that is transparent. Thats also what gets us there. And so it is really importantlye hear others think we should do this. We would love and support from the federal government to better fund and more fully fund our election so that we can meet the more stringent goals and we have to recognize the onus cannot be in local Election Officials to speed up the process and increase capacity without additional funding to enable more options and creativity and transparency for doing that. Event . All right. Thanks so much. Im the America County recorder response of a recording which rm sure is very exciting to all of you. Voter registration early voting in the second largest voting jurisdiction in the United States not that there do not give Harris County that. Thank you very much rick you are the man. Thank you to ucla law. I went there this morning because thats where i thought it was. [laughter] that was a double bummer because i was in the wrong spot and i learned its a lot prettier than my law school. Will make a provisional speech here. [laughter] i think this is titled threats i thought to give a few examples i think we have an audio clip we matched together thats a three minutes my proms only speak for two minutes but to give you a sense of what continues to this day as it happens on a weekly basis the first threes to me, my personal cell phone than to her to the call centers do we have that somehow lined up . A seat for fair and competent elections thats what it says here on your homepage for your recorder position you are trying to fly here. You call things on hinged and insane lies with as a Forensic Audit going on. You need to check yourself. You need to do your job right because other people from other states are watching. You renege on this deal or give them any more troubles you will never make it to your next on the board meeting. You have to stand before god someday are you a traitor to your country . You know they cheated on that election. I dont know who pissed you off your going to need that money to keep the fire burning where you are going. You are more corrupt than anybody else. Listen you liar. First of all you are not the recorder at the time of the election. The second of all they are not handing everything over, why is that . And third, arizona never did in the official audit, you liar. So pull your head out, stop being a liar. Go on tv and tell the truth. You creep. Himself 600,000 ballots to count. We received a 1. 9 million from arizona. [inaudible] i could do that with my eyes closed. 60000 results. [inaudible] this is 60000 question. I dont know. Are you i cant file a complaint for you if you are. Im disgusted by people like you. You are a joke. I am sorry i do not tolerate that kind of language. I am hanging up. It is a disgrace it really is disgusting. What you are doing. Look if you have a concern. Can be hung or shot thats what we do for a traitor, for treason. See better think of that. We will arrest you you could go for treason will be shot or hung. Okay look. We are going to investigate you you are going to be arrested for corruption, for treason. I do not have to take this i do not have to take threats, goodbye. We continue to get those on a weekly basis the last two were from people who work our call center probably makes 17 an hour. May be 16 an hour. Certainly not a great recruitment tool but they continued to do that im very proud of them. Why does this continue to happen . All people have agency am a huge believer in free will. Its ultimately down to use his turn a reprobates who called in. But the incentive structure is such that i fear this will continue. My wife, who is here, it knows i hate when disney continues to make marvel movies i am like oh my god another superhero. But i imagine bob sitting wherever the disney headquarters is saying should we print a billion dollars or not . I think we should insult lets make another marvel movie. So unfortunately a lot of incentive structures are there for people who are in positions of leadership to continue to do this. That is especially true in my savior johnson says shes optimistic in many ways i have a little bit of optimism on the National Scale in arizona i am deeply deeply pep pessimistic this is a necessary ingredient for winning the republican primary in the state of arizona is to say the 2020 election another 2022 election and maybe it will throw in others, was stolen to win a republican primary and in some ways politicians are behaving rationally and theyre simply going along with incentive structure we get people like the five you heard from who will continue to be outraged because they hear from people they trust. People they believe the world is being stolen from them and then we get voicemails like that and i think its going to be hard to break out of that cycle. I do want to follow up on the issue of direct threats from the public with all of you around here. Let me ask a more specific question and then lets all three talk about this because i know you are all facing this. You came into office just after the 2020 election. But of course the aftermath of the election postelection audits which got a lot of deservedly bad press in arizona were going on. Could you Say Something about melody postelection process, the audit process, but what is a legitimate and what kind of oversight and postelection is legitimate . Where were the lines crossed her work could the lines beat crossed . Something after the election looking back on oversight is appropriate i knit other things might be very harmful. With all the good things about this, or a good thing about this people became more aware of the audits that are in fact done because arizona has long done postelection audits. After the tabulation of all the ballots which are paper ballots then it to make sure the machines were properly calibrated and reading the belts correctly there is a test done before the election. Those tested fed through the machines born partly statistically significant number belts are pulled from the ballots counted they are sent to bipartisan groups republican and democrat sitting across from you so that they do a hand count tally five aces statistically significant percentage that amounted to about 47000 votes that were cast and 47000 hand counted prior to the 2020 election they match these machine count one 100 . Things like that are important what is not helpful as having a group of partisan lawyers who were conspiracy theorists who thought chavez has stolen the election somehow from the grave. And already said donald trump had won the 2020 election to then go spend six months with no election expertise making every single Conspiracy Theory possibly could. It was a disaster thats probably why arizona became the global hotspot for this movement. I do want to go down the line of direct threat to Election Officials i want to also tell the audience we are going to be moving to audience questions in the little bit so if you are looking to have a question theres a microphone each side of the room then began to call on people that to that section. Maybe well start on this senate work that way. What we heard was terrible and weve heard that story across the country in a number of ways. Election officials i dont do say you are anonymous you are somewhat anonymous in an earlier era in a good way you have become sometimes wellknown and targeted peoples ire. What do we do about it . Both what do be do with people involved in various efforts here . Legally and institutionally. What is to be done about the great rise in personal threats to people running our elections across the country . What cesspit narrative shift. I think of it as u. S. Soldiers and how they were treated weve moved to a culture you might not agree with the military action that you support ultimately the men and women in the armed forces. There has to be a culture where you do not disrespect you do not target the people who are working the actual election machinery and think of them as Public Servants you might not agree with every law and as neil said that certainly open for discussion and its something we should continue to contest and improve. You dont go and target them as they come back from vietnam i guess. So a cultural change. I definitely agree with what steven is saying. You look at data currently Election Officials was good at data three and five are more afraid today then they were in 2024 and five are concerned about running their elections. In other words getting people to work them to get poll workers to come and work the elections. To Stevens Point earlier about i dont think this is going to go away i definitely agree with that. We need to look at ways to reduce the risk of these threats per network with the group Call Committee for safe and secure elections, the 32 member nonpartisan body that is focused on working collaboratively together with Law Enforcement Election Officials to help reduce the risk. How do you do that . You raise awareness pretty work on plans of Law Enforcement to be able to respond that perhaps in the past. There are election deniers and Law Enforcement community. That can create certainly problems around the country and some think we need to continue to work on. Yes i can tie her took Law Enforcement 45 minutes to get to my house and then out infamous approach just outside my house was to begin and it was happening yes on all of those things i will add to pieces. One, the law. We in Michigan First thing we did in january with a cooperative legislature at the state level has been to introduce a package of laws to protect those who protect democracy making a felony to threaten Election Officials the penalties as well and sentencing penalties were pursuing a law to ban the intentional dissemination of deceptive practices or deceptive practices with elections if you intentionally repeat or disseminate information or allow for the dissemination of information you know is false about election procedures and the like, this should be the she penalties and consequences for that. Because we know the roots of these threats are the misinformation. That jen jenner people of the vitriol to try to attack those at the forefront of democracy. Sunsetting are laws of the state level i note nevada at a number of states are doing that as well. It will be great to see the federal government make a stand on this in both support their Financial Investment and also for the protections center also often others have proposed legislation on that front. In the face of that an action at the federal level we are working at the state level to implement those changes in additional protections what georgia has done to a tax system coworker started on election day theres a place they can text that will connect to Law Enforcement clerks and others we get wrap up a response that is important we are adding Additional Ministry protection for election as well. But the thing i really want to land with and emphasize here is what god is through 2020 is spiritually, emotionally all about was the fact the truth is on our side. Democracy is on our side. The law is on our side, the history is on our side. The constitution is on our side in the vast majority of American People are in our side to wanting to preserve democracy. Knowing these threats are wrong. We find a lot of strengths in those truth in michigan and elsewhere. And through that it enables us to absorb that and come back stronger to the point where, i have tried to emulate that leadership in michigan. No others have as well to show strength the face of these threats because that is how we get through it. What i thought election in 2020 was extraordinary we recruited 30,000 election workers in michigan in 2020 and other 11000 in michigan in 2022. Those folks are coming to our defense. They are coming to the defense of democracy. I was at polling places in every election state, local, federal, throughout our state but i saw november 2022 was extraordinary because usually when i shall put a polling place people are just doing their jobs. When i showed up to polling place that i vote in and theres a number of precincts in detroit on election day in 2022, i was met with almost as overwhelming force of energy. Coming from the Election Officials who showed up to work. Instead been tired and ho hum, doing their job there was a pride there. There is an energy there ive never seen before. And that was extraordinary to me i saw that all around the state the people who run our elections in many ways and they come sit with that strength and emboldened by these threats they stand up stronger and do their work with more pride and determination to ensure the threats will not succeed at interfering with our process of Election Administration that is again real experience and gives me a lot of hope that with leadership and strength and knowledge of who we are and we are on the right side of history we can harness all of that to create more Energy Around protecting our officials at the very least of the administration and thats it we work to do in michigan. Obviously its not universal but in my view the path out of this moment too. 51 footnotes. Its on the misinformation front. Just before i left office i was receiving hundreds of requests as people were marshaled to request materials from us. Election officials from the country are receiving the same request. For instance i want all of your cast a vote records are cast during the election and then they would ask what is a cast a vote record and what do we do with that . And so to me quite frankly ignorance on top of misinformation Election Officials having a slow march to the sea need to continue to educate the public on postelection issues its not an easy solution is not going happen overnight but i think going to continue to do that. Neil anticipated my last question im going to put it this way. All of you do not have any election official across the country who does not believe in transparency and education and reaching out often to critics of people who do not understand. There are various state laws that require open access to things. One is i would like to have you talk about how you do that or how it is successful but then theres the question people are asking our people take advantage of the transparency are there ways where theres lots of record requests for observers who moved beyond observer status to become active participants and protesters . So tell us about transparency in education but also where you think there may be issues and whether it would need to finetune some those processes. Go ahead. One oh things have done in michigan and we have seen at work is creating an ongoing support for local and amplifying the only voice amplify that worker truth teller task force in michigan thats per pop of faith leaders Business Leaders and sports leaders and all of her 83 counties. Rented building method in 2024 we have voices locally known and trusted voices who are not Election Officials to service trusted voices of information but have also been targets to try to diminish that trust so lets fight other trusted sources of information like faith leaders and others who can build that faith and confidence in our election and combine that with increased transparency work many officials are already doing. So the information gets out there. Because again the benefit of this is that the more transparency of a process in a good faith effort is another antidote make sure it reaches the people who needed and meeting people where they are new people theyve already build trusting relationships with. Going there to communities themselves as part of what we are adding to our portfolio is to work to overcome some of the challenges. Arizona has unique challenges as well that you are creating. Yes we have tried everything under the sun. And it feels good and we are going to continue to do that some people ask of any of your Communications Efforts works . On mike thanks for validating the last two years of my life. If you look at the longitudinal studies on the confidence of elections there is a little bit of reason to believe its working. We are going to continue to cry because quite frankly thats what we can do. The most advantageous thing we can do is some of us joined for a tour two days ago. Three days ago, Something Like that. I probably did 40 tours of our elections facilities and the general election. You can see the machinery, humanize the process, see the life of the whole paper ballots. It is a tradeoff as john mentioned as a strong tradeoff because people with the Tabulation Center 24 7 365 the pole footage of manipulated and the mildewed defects so that very popular on the internet. Or they will identify employees who are nonpublic facing employees and target them on various social media programs. Our default has always been to be more transparent, more transparent but it is often thrown in our face and i guess that something we are going to have to continue to learn with, to deal with. Have a little bit of patience for Election Officials as john suggested. Prior to 2016 nobody gave a darn about how the process work to their were not many Communication Specialists within elections departments. We are just Getting Better and better but were still playing g catch up in terms of communicating how the mouse trap actually works. The name of the game used to be the mousetrap itself prior to the last five years. I agree with both comments i would add that i took advantage of the good studies that are out there in the research that has been done on trusted voices in elections and in local communities it is the election official despite all the things we hear the most trusted voices of the election official. One thing i wanted to do is target the influence peddlers of election desires and open up our process like steven talked about having streaming service for postelection work. I took it a little bit further and build a broadcast platform with our team to use cameras that focus on the ballots free to use screenshots of what the operators are seen to really sey given in the weeds look as opposed to a football field of view of the process. And we changed a few hearts and minds. If you do one little step at a time thats going to be very important. I want to leave it with this when Bernie Sanders the whole issue in california if you recall in the primary that was a real challenge his observers and supporters descended on my office in the hundreds and at the end of it all they were supporting us on a reddit they were supporting its own social Media Outlets because of the tours and because that facetoface communication and dialogue. So again its a slow march to the sea but we can someday win this. There been a lot of innovations but for instance you can rebuild the voting record to the cast vote record in a lot of scientist can do this for some jurisdictions are posting about images online. I think the holy grail will be when you can get a receipt even if you vote by mail of the people he voted for you have to do that in the manner or it is not accessible by anyone on the backend. No jurisdiction does is currently just because some people ask me matt can you tell me how i voted in the 2020 election . And what do you really want to be yes you voted for President Trump and so does your neighbor so well done you guys or Something Like that. [laughter] at that is still the thing we get the most questions about is why cant i have a receipt for who i voted for . Its just because the sacra sinks principal right now is the secrecy of the ballots we have not figured out a way to completely make that so nobody on the backend. Because chase bank can access your account a lot of people say you cant do it like banks. Chase can access hemming dollars you have in your bank account. You dont want that for election administrators. But we tried other methods like allowing people to track their ballot through all stages of the process allowing people to text message alerts, allowing people to go the voter profile and see the election they did cast a ballot it not how they voted but they did cast a vote in. That has been appreciated. Lets all add to all of that we all have responsibility here i do not mean to sound like a broken record but when it comes innovations like these they are made possible by a greater funding at the state and federal level for us to advance and explore the innovations for transparency, research so many of you do that enables us to an generate ideas we can implement and test and match with the funding to make real. And so for me one of the biggest frustrations of doing this work having were from different angles throughout my career its less now but a lot of ways in which we have to solve these problems on our own. When we can collaboratively solve these issues and i dont mean to call them problems we can collaboratively meet these challenges through partnerships with various different entities that are all wellintentioned thats receipt Partnership Ability being attacked but nevertheless partnerships with state and local government and through funding and partnerships with research and academics up us develop the data to enable these solutions. I really want to emphasize there is a role for all of us to play in this work. The more we can enable collaboration and the Partnership Building a Publicprivate Partnership the more it enables us to meet the needs of the moment of greater transparency, greater efficiency and everything in between. The quick plus one i paid for all that transparency the additional transparency of carriers activating additional funding on top of my regular budgets at the county level so absolutely. Are going to go to your questions and ask a few things one, identify yourself because ive a bright light above you and i cannot really see you too, ask something quick and three, make sure it is a question so right here on the rights. About best practices for transparency and trusts and running early out centers. American precinct you can say to the voter at your Political Party has a poll watcher there who could see the people inside the pole book or registered voters they could check that off on their own list they can seat nobody voted twice they can see when the voting chain prevents totals at the end of the day what the totals were there were not more votes in the people who voted and if they were concerned about how the county clerk added up all of the precincts you are a party had challengers in every precinct that could see the numbers and add them up for themselves. With Early Vote Centers they have to cover it many ballot styles from all across the county with electronic poll books and breakdown and reporting of totals by different ballot styles and precincts the stories much more complicated and sometimes harder to trust. Where are the places that do this well . And how did they do it well . I am really curious and are there places do it less well that is my question. Its a great question its good to see you and thank you for the question. Wheat moved to vote centers in Orange County in 2020 but the process in california since about half of the counties currently operate the centers so 11 days of voting early. In a one of things to your point directly is to provide electronic data to not only the campaigns but observers and poll watchers that will show in real time the process of individuals cast in their ballot. Whats the party whats her address whats her name et cetera they would use that in comparison to what they saw in the vote center itself. Not everybody used it. Not everyone took advantage of it but its one additional where you can put on top of the vote t center process for transparency. I was going to say, sorry for interrupting but my entire states is it morning because of your school because princeton Beat University of arizona. Is not going to mention that progress not even acknowledge the question. As the days of your mythology we had voting by precinct you could simply show up and see this precinct explosive 2000 voters he would see and be able to match the balance pretty soon as you start having vote by mail and a vote by mail have eight jurisdictions that went out the window. You cannot account for those dont come in by precincts into the post office and go there so its not like you can say if only of i watch 50 people show up to the voting location this precinct and have more than 50 voters anyway. So we heat produced on a daily basis a cast vote log shows who checked in the Political Parties you said thats why they can stop texting me after you cast a ballot as they dont try to drive it to the polls i think there is more we can do about that but im really hesitant to move away from the boat center model because voters really, really enjoyed it creates a redundancy and voting locations at a point will we need them the most. Just because it just not take much imagination to imagine someone doing something stupid one of the voting locations were under a precinct based Voting System everyone at that location will be out of luck but making good going on the road just 2 miles away and go to another voting location. I do think there is more. When you are talking about numbers like my county is 2. 5 million registered voters. The ability of average joe to do anything with that data set is pretty limited in all data scientists in elections arty know the election is not stone they can see the voting patterns and how they line up this boxers of blue or red. I dont know how much it helps the average joe. Okay were going to cohere too the left again. Is my mic on question. Going to cant hear. I am David Holtzman im a graduate of princeton university. But still questions for you. [laughter] i have connections to michigan and arizona as well. Im also 2000 graduate of a law school and its Public Interest law, former poll worker, is at the league of women voters and Redistricting Commission for los angeles county. I wanted to ask about rogue poll workers and rogue election workers. What sort of simple remedies or administrative remedies or criminal penalties do you think people should be considering or you might consider to discourage election workers from failing to do their job in the critical moments . We dealt with this challenge head on and 2022. There were lively widely reported efforts to infiltrate polling places with rogue poll workers. Saw a lot of pressure and counties all across our state due to the hiring of poll workers for the most part to pressure clerks into hiring individuals. We recognize two things. One, we have to and it is important to have balance when it comes a poll workers from both parties and all that under our law and in the practice. So we do not want to diminish that and we do not want to make assumptions a persons Party Affiliation indicates a rogue status. So we continue to recruit all workers from both parties and some clerks worked with some of these efforts to ensure that we were being as transparent and open as possible and accessible for everyone because theres nothing to hide in terms of the process itself being secure and operate with integrity. So that said we work to recognize the input challenges. But there was no question in terms of the actual election day or election work that there would be no tolerance for any shenanigans. Happy st. Patricks day. I use that word throughout the 22 election cycle but any shenanigans from anyone. And so the challenge became making sure we were empowering people to respond if anyone showed themselves to be a bad actor. We did that in a couple of ways. Every precinct had clear rules about what poll worker schedule we ask every poll worker to sign a code of conduct going into election day indicating both they were knowledgeable about the guardrails they were going to be expected to abide by and if they didnt they be removed then you have to empower people in every precinct to remove people and have a system in place if things escalate, deescalate and perhaps remove working with local longform is to develop those partnerships and then having an additional level of coverage with our staff. Some of you may know i came out of Voter Protection work as a nonpartisan space you have people on the ground and precincts all throughout the state to rapidly respond to issues. Now we get the same thing at the department of state in every election particularly ones of great prominence we have people throughout the state who work directly and are connected directly to war room so that we can identify and rapidly respond to things and then if we get asked by the press, talk about them from a place thats a wealth of information as opposed to or debunking things over rumors of things happening that are not really happening. Our goal is to have in addition to a line of communication coming from polling places at every point throughout the day at my office at seven within five 10 minutes of every precinct every one of our 4500 precincts in the state so if anything occurs we can be there on the ground immediately and train people to figure how to address the situation. That was her bifurcated way of doing it the other thing to keep in mind in michigan are clerks how are poll workers at the local level the work we did in 2020 to recruit 30,000 election workers meant we were almost fully staffed for 2022 long before any efforts infiltrate the process began there were very little openings are poll workers as we began the process theres always turnover, always openings available. Recognizing that we generate and recruit 11000 poll workers as well to ensure there was an abundance of talent and clerks could pick and choose who they wanted to hire and do the work to make sure people were putting in poll worker positions or any other positions had been vetted and also know the guardrails they have to up id buy it once they are employed. What about additional financial or criminal penalties for bad actors Going Forward . Yes. We are trying to develop them in the states but well established voter intimidation and other types of protection we can use in partnership with local prosecutors and attorney general. We issued a press conference right before election day to basically anyone thinking of trying anything dont do it you will be held responsible you will not succeed in creating chaos and confusion you will find yourself with a criminal record potentially and just to be very clear no tolerance for disruption. I would add to shenanigans i would not tolerate any tomfoolery either. [laughter] i do and to Say Something a little controversy i received online criticism for it. I felt a little bit proud of it. That is for all of our boat Center Employees i had them a rn through Law Enforcement backgrounds where we did intelligence checks on them. I didnt but the Law Enforcement posted. And we discovered 10 individuals with social media platforms they clearly had an agenda moving forward. Secker j benton talked about the vetting process is very important. By the way it none of the organizations endorse that. I think its very important process we should be doing. Worried about it, plan for, turned out to be not that big of an issue. When anyone says i think this is going on, come work for us and they are complicit. [laughter] we have a long day ahead of us this is been a great kickoff to our event i would to thank the panelists were being with this. [applause] good seeing you. Will ask elite next panel to come on up and get assembled for it. Good seeing you. Will ask the next panel to come on up and get assembled but will get started again just a minute or so