The near times, vanity fair were she was contributing editor and national publications. Shes also editor of cuba, a travelers literary companion and cuba confidential. She teaches International Journalism at the university of california at santa barbara. Without fidel is a terrific book, fun to read and format it and the subject matter is endlessly fascinating. Alice castro are able to stay in power for 50 years . Why was the United States not able to topple him and how was he able to maneuver so that communism fell everywhere else in the world . And if the United States had no sway in cuba, how was it that he was not overthrown by his own people. Families in this book discusses cuba somewhat without fidel. She reports on a stillness in the relationship between raul infidel and continues to report im not part of the story that never seems to end, the miami cuba washington ballet. Well, everybody is waiting for the shoe to drop which will come first, fidel dying for cuba opening up for obama. Nice to have you with us. Its a wonderful little paragraph that i wanted to read to you that says it all. Now if i can find it. And she very first, 2009, few doubt and wrote castro celebrated a halfcentury ago a halfcentury rule. Two weeks later, barack obama became the 44th president of the United States. To the castro brothers, obama said he the 11th batter to set it to play. All told not to shabby record for a brother duo from the town of iran, cuba. These are big numbers than once a day to certain reckoning. The book i hopeful offers and answers and reflections on the diplomatic train wreck that is passed for u. S. Cuba relations and what the future might look like in both countries. And then she makes reference to one of my alltime favorite cartoons, cartoon by robert hancock, a businessman standing behind his desk and stayed on the phone, no, there is a is out. Never. Its never good for you . And that is the answer to my question. Thank you. [applause] thank you very much. Ive got to quickly respond to a couple things carla said. The payoff on the new yorker cartoon is that the digit number is over. Regarding cuba. We have been in the age of mabrey. I cant tell you its going to be totally transformative very quickly, but dh of matter we are starting to see the door open. The other thing is will fidel castro ever die . Well, theres been certain points in the writing of this book but i certainly thought i was going to go first. Anyway, thank you both for coming. Thank you politics prose for having me. I know this is columbus day and you could be doing all kinds of colombian things. Thats mac anyway, for those of you who dont know that Christopher Columbus not only discovered the United States ever and ever, on the way he stopped by in cuba. He actually stopped in a little town called bar code, which happens to be my favorite place in cuba. It is out on the eastern tip about guantanamo. I know you know about one time. One place americans know about. Just on the north of that is missing part of a special place called arakawa, where three rivers meet on a map and go into the ocean. That is where columbus landed and eventually got here. Theres another auspicious date that happened on october 10th known as cuban independence are famous for her next question al gore goes beyond that, the cry of yarborough come at the very beginning of the First Independent lawyer. You may think theres been discontent just politics postkennedy proposed fidel castro. There have been contentious politics from cuba from the spanish arrived in who is a very rough, some would say savage colonial period and the independent source did not go quickly. They took a long time. There is a 10 year war in many people tell you many cubans tell you after getting rid of the spanish they go very quickly to the United States as not quite a colonial power, but certainly i figure surrogacy. Its been a long go. And when i tell you about this book. Let me just tell you because they think i need to clarify a few things. When i was asked to write this book, fidel castro we thought was on his deathbed and i was asked to write basically a brief meditation on the death of fidel. I want you to know that was in august of 29 2006. Over three years ago i did a brief meditation. They said just 40,000 words and no court in miami, havana for the funeral and get some reaction in miami. Around a year into this project, you didnt have a funeral. Anyway, this has sort ofbecome i call this sort of Fidel Castros own outfit. I refer to it as the fidel you. What i learned is we have in a new age and fidel castro who has been blessed by the gods in so many ways so many gifts and talents and is quite tragic that he will leave the legacy he does having given so many gifts as he did if he got incredibly sick, almost mortally ill in the major tremendous medical advances. Unlike sharon, who i guess you could say things went badly from the neck up, and but few doubt just the opposite. He underwent an emergency intestinal surgery and i will read you a portion in a moment. A surgery involves so many complications and became so lifethreatening. There is nobody who could have survived would he survive and he has. He is not in great health. I know you all want the actual date. He does so to ron and soldier on as his thing. Quality of life is not that important to him. Quantity of life. In any event, what happened is this book began as a meditation and morphed into something very different. It became a trilogy and basically a long time. The second is about castros and focusing on too many particular to militant anticastro specialist i guess you could say. The last part is about raul, the rain of raul castro. We are now into this and basically in a nutshell its been a seamless transition. The casters do not leave things for accident in any way and this was well planned. Since then extremely well executed and theres a lot of casualties and that cuba and we can talk about that in a little bit. I thought it would just read a little bit to set the stage on what we thought was castros last day and then go into a couple of other things. The first chapter is the pursuit of immortality. The guy and began july 27, 2006. It is not scheduled, nor was it supposed to end that way. It would have been hard to imagine less appealing to fidel castro, a prominent kurdish man who zealously guarded his personal privacy, but there it was across the front pages of newspapers and websites five months after his neardeath following emergency surgery. Chapter and verse virtually every inch of the intestinal tract of cubas maximum leader from the lecture straight onto the end for castro and obsessive autocrat matters big and small, nothing couldve been more distressing. His control had been threat. The moat around his personal life had been breached. His patient confidentiality violated. Fidel castro have been a land of the master of his own day. A new portrait, that of a frail jim marion is carefully crafted persona of the vigilant kyra and with his infirmity, castros fierce grip on the largest island in the caribbean finally began to loosen. Disbelief and wonder millions of humans on both sides of the florida straits. Could it be fidel castro was mortal . Is the movie star dictator in the worlds longest reigning has day, and castro take his time leaving the stage. Anyway, i am going to leave that we can go do a couple of things. You can ask me questions. A lot of people have specific topics or it depends whether you want to hear more about fidel or more about role for u. S. Cuban relations question mark one of the things i would like to say is a lot of people think weve gone from fidel to rattle rattle, but the cuban army is the ceo of the country now. That is a useful way to look at it. He will never have the not nor does he ever want his brothers seem kind of niche and he will run cuba pretty much like a corporation. The cuban army has got two divisions. They are pretty much appropriated every part of the economy. They started to resent, with the Farmers Market and they are inching their way through all the of the economy. The good news about this as they are very efficient in what the army does do tends to be done more successfully with better results. But other parts of the economy do not work out as well. It was very disappointing when the succession was announced that the primary were given two people, most of 75 years of age. We have also had in march of this year basically a purge of the cuban government and many of the most familiar face as to cubans, but also to last and westerners are no longer part of the cuban government. As of friday, the Vice President was eliminated from the government. Balenciaga, castros personal assistant who is the foreign ministry. What is so interesting about this is these men had a thick waists are fidel castro and the revolution unstintingly almost 24 7 for 20 years or so and they were taken out. At least 15 people we know about. Some of you may recall right here in washington during the whole song to. There is a cuban diplomat who basically was the ambassador here. They had at the intersection for nongovernor has and he basically was the cuban point in and did a very effective job for cuba. They were the winners. The u. S. Was the losers which tends to be the case. And Fernando Ramirez is one of these men who is now gone. This is how when a highlevel purge this has been in this very interesting how little press and attention this has gotten in the United States. Tell me if im going to fire, too deep, too soon to write other and why would something that significant, almost 15 major leaders the cuban government just gone. Two of them after they were basically called out, which was done by raul castro immediately the next day but these abject letters, rall will apologize in for their errors. Right out of the old stalinist playbook although i hate to make those comparisons as cuba is not a stalinist island. Its a very different species. He was right out of that playbook. You say to yourself i did this get so little attention . This is something i wasnt planning on talking about but its really interesting. As reporters ive been guilty on occasion. They talk about the historical parallels the cuban revolution but this particular purge might not have a visa. It involves what it takes. I know. I did it for years. This is the good news about this book. I decided finally i dont care. Let them take it finally. And they did. I showed up not last year the year before and arrived at jose marti airport in the wind but man. The ministry of interior people got me and said he wont be coming in the country. This happens much more often than you might suspect and it really keeps the coverage very guarded, which is certainly not unique to us to cuba. This is the case in any place where there is an authoritarian country. I mean, they want a certain amount of what they consider the pieces that are too diligent, two critical. The visa is not. I think that this purge that happened in march was standing because basically these men who really gave their lives to the revolution were dismissed. Two of them happen to be in prison as they understand it. Two of them being charged with treason. By the way, how did these guys get in trouble . How did it happen that the 15 top officials in the cuban government get into such hot water . They were under surveillance. I talk about in this book where the officials are supposed to know they are wiretapped and this was done with a cited as evidence of liberal castro called a private screening to other officials to make the case for why these men had to be dismissed. They made casual disparaging comments those things like will fidel ever died which cubans say every day and refer to some of these leaders put in, almost all of them over the age of 75 a tightness is. And one of them, the Vice President of the country who was in charge of handling the economics of the country for so many years, the cousin who is a cardiologist made a crack about machado has been made number three after fidel, after rival and made some crack about a gas it would have had a favorite to the country if he came in with his heart problems we had to go. I understand he is facing treason, which is a very Serious Business in cuba, potentially a capital offense. Normally when people fall out of favor in cuba you go on with the pajama plan. This is much more serious than that. Its one of the things that so interesting because he lives, you know, such a part of washingtons social life. Im not going to say names. Very well known washington insiders would have been to dinner, schmooze and talk politics. Very wellliked. You dont hear anything. Its a mistake he disappeared in cuba, the show must disappear in the United States as well. That said, i dont want to give you the impression that i think cuba is a stalinist country. It isnt. There is a zone for it and complaining might be the National Pastime of cubans. But that is done privately. And you can talk about we dont have food, we dont have this or that generally can be done privately. You go outside into the public arena. You get on a soapbox. First of all, they dont like large groups that are government authorized what is interesting about them being thrown out as according to ralph castro to have been wiretapped for a year. They are in private homes. So i find that very interesting. A lot of people say what is going to be the future here after raul and then i promise to open it up to questions. A good way to think about this as a corporation that runs cuba but down the road, i think we will see some other caster is and they are not going to be fidel signs. Fidel has many son in some of you might have noticed theres a lot of publicity about various children in this book for women he didnt marry. He probably hasnt had 11 children from various people, various women. Mostly the women hes with now. But i dont think its going to be his children, but roles children. Raul has a son named alejandro and he is someone we should keep our eye on. Alejandro has a big future. Its in the ministry of interior and its got some very important part yes. Hes got china and the huge portfolio for cuba and he has intelligence and intelligence doesnt get bigger than that in cuba. Theres a very interesting daughter of fidels name, Mariela Castro and this woman is truly a liberal progressive. This is a oneman who is a bohemian. She had a chat with the trillion and now she has a couple kids and her passion is, samesex marriage, things that, believe me, this is a big deal in cuba. Any latin American Country championing. She even arranged for some couples to be married in a Government Ministry and arrange for some transgender surgery. When i say this is a free thinker, this is a free thinker. By cuban standards i tried to imagine what those old generals with roel and has been with roel for 50 years, what theyre thinking and how they are trying to be nice and with a really think because there is a significant amount of in cuba. Shes taken on her mothers sinecure running the womens federation and these are the two kids and then theres various nephews and nieces. My point being is that castros private diagnostic family of cuba contrary to what fidel has said. They are all over and various ministries. But again, nepotism doesnt necessarily protect you. There is a famous instance of fidels oldest son who is running the Nuclear Power program in the 90s and things went south in a bad way and fidel fired him very publicly inside it are not running a monarchy here. It is a mixed bag with cuba. Id like to disabuse people are thinking that as a stalinist republic, the tropical marks of them, i dont know. Raul has talked about he aspires to the chinese model of the vietnamese model and i think hes moving there. What would basically have now are openings and closings. A lot of cubans say they have whiplash. One day things are opening and we are going to have our computers and telephones and and transgender surgery and the next thing you know the Vice President is thrown in the pokey. This is the kind of paradoxical complex gray zone. They have completely and totally confused at this point, but how about at this point i throw it out then and you have some questions and you can tell me what you want to hear more about. Wonderful presentation. [applause] the microphone is right here. As you make your way to the microphone, i would like to ask you what you think will happen is the United States opens up to cuba and had some form of recognition, what you think the steps will be and what effect that will have in cuba. That is a really good question. What a lot of people dont understand is the u. S. Embargo was codified under the helmsburton act. I think it was 96, 97 after the downing of the cuban plays. The president no longer has the prerogative to take a pen and the embargo, which he did until that moment. But what can be done and what really is going on is the embargo can be dismantled surrogate keys mail and obama has 30 made a lot of moves. Basically what obama has done to this moment is he setting the clock back to work relations were with cuba before george w. Bush. During the clinton. We had a lot of travel, a lot of engagement, a lot of agreement. The last eight years you really saw the most retrograde and most tightening of the embargo. Nevermind that it did not seem. We got the results for it, but thats another story. What obama is doing is going back slowly. Theres a lot of things i think we have military agreement now, narcotics agreements. A friend of mine saw raul castro last week and told them sent in the obviously one of the leaked which they have signed agreements to fly over her to take people out of guantanamo on an as needed basis in flyover. Before that they had to go out into the ocean. We may see our intersections become embassiesagain. They are small finetuning things because president obama is not going to risk a lot of capital. Hes got a lot on his plate and he doesnt want a firestorm. That said, the climate has changed dramatically in miami and the opposition, much of the opposition is now moved to the sun or from the far right where we refuse to have any policy that the embargo. But now we see some of the most prominent names in the miami political firmament now on engagement. I think what obama sees is the wisdom of the endlessly tightened it up on cuba for 50 years. We really didnt get anywhere. Basically were walking away empty handed. Who do you work for . It worked for a few dow castro. I dont think Fidel Castro Curtis date in power with completely unfettered trade. They want less contact. They talk about freedom of the press and multiple news agencies, et cetera. So several dissidents told me day one that i arrived in cuba, they said fidel castro needs the u. S. Embargo and it took me about five years to actually understand that they knew what they were talking about. I will take you back i think you knew about that, whereas it had a real impact on my family because my husband lost his job because of that. Was that a possibility of any opening or was it a very unrealistic view of americans in this country with not that it is realistic fair play for cuba. They might want to give us a time period . We are talking probably in the 80s. I dont want to get too personal, but somebody in the family as night has been less related to that family. I dont know what their fair play for cuba was realistic. 50s there is little early. Whether that was a real estate point of view of of view of what is something sort of dreamy. I am of the belief fidel castro came to power on a date playing card and that was solace in. It was about getting the united state out. By the way, the ceiling is entirely since he is shed many tears. Spanish was a really growing on trend grueling was a nasty they didnt want to remember the name. And now, the genius of 10 was using the springboard of nationalism and i dont think it was over to his advantage to have the u. S. Come in. I mean, he needed to go live. He needed someone to play david. There have been a time with obama because there is not the double if theyve been trying to the leader. Its very interesting what fidel caused the u. S. These days. He is more from being convalescent achieve too dependent in chief and he writes a column every other day called reflections and the hours refers to the United States as the empire. It is a phrase he and hugo chavez used, the empire he needs a certain amount of friction. I think all these passwords and newsgroups were somewhat misguided. And used. Im sorry to say this, probably entirely infiltrated by cuban intelligence. Not that there were a totally sincere and genuine people involved, the cuban intelligence has no peer outside of stasi which had a great deal to do with their training. Its true. I just dont it was ever in the cards because he didnt want it. The way we really know this is in the 70s. Henry kissinger is so that china. Hes done that theyre going. We would get that one going. William roberts is in negotiation and they ford to sign off. I spoke at line we will do this, trade ambassadors, other tropical calibration and that will open at a banquet in the china. One thing, one line in the sea and you cannot do. You cannot send troops to 5000 miles away to africa to interfere in civil war that has nothing to do with cuba. Just dont do that. What is the deal . Send 5000 troops to angola. He lost at least 5000 soldiers. Use tell me what was more important, relationship with the superpower 90 mouse away for it to an african country across the atlantic. By the way, some people think theyve lost as as many as 50,000 people. Having said that, Nelson Mandela credited for hastening the end of apartheid in south africa by diverting so my feeling no it was never in the cards because fidel castro did not want to. User to answer the question question i was going to ask. Is there anything the United States could ever have done in order to have some degree of normalcy. I remember vividly on december 31st 1958 all excited to came down to sierra madres in the concentration camps revealed a make out what wonderful liberator. This is a foregone conclusion the United States that i was it the enemy of the nationalistic thrust of his politics . Well, thats a good question. A lot of people spent a lot of time on what they talk about isnt fidel castro came to new york, came to washington, and save several speeches in the seminal event talked about is they came up to visit with eisenhower and was busy. Eisenhower was playing golf that day. He sent Richard Nixon and nixon hated castro. You can see it just as an let it go. He just hated it. By the time nixon was done with his meaning eisenhower he told basically he was the antichrist and that was the position. The invasion plans were formulated in time and meeting when they came to power and said that the way, very important that guys got to go down there. Hes a threat and its a piece of cake. Its a cakewalk. So you know, it is hard to see there is a lot of antipathy and fidel castro could have done differently. He said something very interesting. He said i will not come to washington like every other cuban before being indicted for money. This is again nationalism. This overlapping pride of castro, which infuses everything, political and personal and had this to say in cuba i spent a lot of time in the reason i do that is the personal is the political in cuba. It is his way or the highway. Either way, ive interviewed him twice. He can be a totally enchanting, interesting man, take and take intellectual. Theres nothing he cant discuss. Hes not culturally certainly a cultural deficit. He has the politics and science. He knows few equals. Batistas strategists. When he was a child, before he was 15 years old, he studied machiavelli. He studied napoleon. So many kids are out there reading a serious military strategists. Anyway, does that help . When i was 12 years old i was eating napoleon. [laughter] castro photo book when he was 10, asking him for some money. How do you like that . The famous letter. You know the day when you look at the letter and i cant quote it exactly. And my first book cuba confidential, and you just know. One other thing so you had the idea of what a scorched earth warrior this man as is his family as you may know and i write about it extensively was very well lost. His father was a selfmade man who came to spain to fight for the spanish and fell in love with the new world and just threw labor and greg amassed a very large part on trend ferment sugar cane, a nimble mind and fidels mother was then made and was married to another person and have multiple dalliances with women who worked on and had to come to the castro think a thin she was a young woman and she is six children before he married her. While he was married. But this is a cultural context for that. The point being this fidel castro had a lot of money, that he had a cultural deficit. Both of his parents were selftaught, semiilliterate until they were older and were able to teach themselves. A very touchy matter where he raised as a young man and tells his father we put the postage stamp, the most recent things this kind of touching. There is kind i hate to say a tender side, but there was as a young man particularly with his father. But he is very much, very similar to both his parents. His parents made a lot of money, that you never would have known. They worked on the ranch and farms from morning until night every day of their lives. Very real, incredible work ethics. I went on to cuba in 2001 for what i thought was a weeklong vacation on the beach. Ended up with librarians and i ended up and followed an arrested. In 2003 during the invasion of iraq but is iraq all the time, all these guys were arrested in prison terms up to 28 years. I wonder if you know what had become of the script and what is the state of dissidents in cuba today. I know exactly what actually read a piece of the purge with a purpose and it was just horrible. They rounded up in 2003 i wouldnt call them reporters. They were home librarians, people have acted as she, et cetera. But on the other side is the tightening and is the repression. The incident that makes me the most recent one, its been all over youtube, and its of an afrocuban man clearly inevenlyuated. Inebriated. You can go look on the internet. And what happened is somebody was talking about cuban music, and they had cameras on the streets of havana. This was just like a couple months ago. And this clearly inebriated man jumped in front of the camera, and he said [speaking spanish] and hama means food. And libertad freedom and liberty, obviously. And he just kept saying in front of the cameras, what cuba needs is food and liberty. What cuba needs and he kept saying, and he clearly had too many drinks. Well, woe be it to him, because that ended up on youtube, and he ended up in the pokey. Next thing we know, this poor drunken cuban is getting a visit from state security, and then he was sentenced to two years in prison. Again, heres the good news, because we basically have cuban bloggers and somehow they get it out. Dont ask me how, because theres so many controls on them. They got it out that this guy had been arrested and sent to prison for two years, and they got out out. And an International Outcry through blogs here and then hitting the diplomatic channels, the last i heard was he was sent to a psychiatric institute. They said to save him from alcoholism. [laughter] which would mean just about half the country. [laughter] be they were really if they were really serious about it. But i think hes being released, but now he is saying he has nothing more to say on the issue. [laughter] so thats the way it works, you know . As i said, theres a zone for speaking out. Theres a famous blogger down there, yolani sanchez, and shes defied all the conventional truths and pushed the envelope, but she got herself enough attention that shes a little bit untouchable. But you never know. Who would have thought that the Vice President of the country, that Fernando Ramirez, these are huge names in the cuban firmament, would be taken out and forced to write mea culpa letters. Who would have thought and why does that happen . You didnt explain that. Oh, i think it happened because raul wanted his own people, and these people were all associated, came to power with fidel. Theyre younger, theyre technocrats, and all none of them are in the military. And who did he put back in power . I hate to say it, but valdez who, there was a terrible period in cuban history where they locked up, it was called the new man, and a lot of gays and homosexuals, anybody, liberals were put into these rehabilitation camps. Well, the man who ran that has been put back in power. Hes been given a huge portfolio. He runs internet, he runs communications, and hes been given a place he took one of the politboro seats from one of those guys. Ventura, they really have put in the real dinosaurs, they actually call hem them the taliban in cuba. Louisiana you know, pick your phrase. And the technocrats in the socalled moderate flank now, of course, moderate is all relative, but theres an expression in cuba which is that fidel gave an address in 1962, and he was saying what respect he has for intellectuals. And he said inside the revolution anything, outside the revolution nada, nothing. Well, the problem though is nobody knows whats inside or outside. They keep changing the zone, the strike zone. And thats completely capricious and elastic. But my basic hunch is that raul wanted his own people, and everybody who took like i said earlier, who took a big slot is in, is a general. Theyre almost all generals. One last follow up. Do you remember the diplomat journalist that was among this group that got arrested, does that ring a bell at all . The diplomatjournalist. Im not sure do you know from what province . Diplomat he was in havana, im not sure if he was in a different province before, but he was arrested along with the other dissidents. I dont i mean, theres, you know, espinosa jepe and palacios. Now, of course, you all know how they got these socalled dissidents, is through infiltration. It was one of the most chilling trials ever. My favorite one was agent what was her name, ophelia, what was her name . Where she testified against i mean, their best friends were spying on them. Their best friends were given computer codes, thats how trusted they were. Theres a wonderful part in this book about nester [inaudible] you always saw him in havana, he had the beret on, and he always wanted to talk, and he was always talking about we need freedom and rights, human rights, and reporters need to be able to write what they think. Well, this guy turned out to be informing for 40 years. I mean, the list that he turned in, and and theres a wonderful documentary by an australian filmmaker about him. And its a remarkable story. And and the testimony, what got me was that they publicized, they made it a big public trial, and all these people who everybody thought were big disdent leaders, who were informers, stood up and said, oh, it was the greatest event of their life in performing and how it gave them such a fulfillment and it was such a reward of being a cuban. But you normally, i think they reveal the identity of 12 or 13 agents. Now, thats a lot of agents to give up for pub publicity. And thats what went through my brain. And i guess what the equation was, was that the castro brothers wanted, they wanted people to know we are listening. Be afraid. Be very afraid. Because we are everywhere. And were even willing to give up it seems like its a significant loss. You know, again, i dont like to make it too bleak because theres a lot of nice zones that one can maneuver in, and people do maneuver in, but when the axe falls on you, its not a pretty picture. You said earlier that castro, the embargo act and the lack of contact that the United States has had with cuba for the last past decades, you said that it sort of tightened castros grip on cuba. Do you feel that with obamas new engagement kind of strategy, itll affect rauls grip on cuba, and do you think itll be anywhere near as long as castros reign . Well, i think while fidel who, by the way, obviously, he has very impaired health, but hes still alive. Believe me, as i said earlier, you and i would not be alive. Just so you know, hes lost most of his intestines, his gallbladder, he had at least two bouts of pertynitis, several failed surgeries. I, at the age of 18, had per peritonitis. I was in perfectly healthy condition. They asked me if i was ready for last rites. Thats how serious it is. This is a man in his 80s, multiple searchings and multiple surgeries and multiple bouts of peritonitis. So hes very impaired, but hes not, you know, he could live for a while. You know, he has, obviously, a lot of medical apparatus that help him get through, and hes willing to, hes willing to stay in that kind of impaired state that a lot of people would be very frustrated with. And hes living now, hes back at home. He has a medical suite at his house and surrounded by his wife and his children. Hes a little bit of the retired grandfather with a very large medical arsenal. You know, as i said, raul has got a different economic model in his head, but he is not going to go against his brother. As long as fidel has breath, fidel has veto power, okay . So he, hes too respectful and too loyal to his brother to openly go against his wishes. But most of us think that raul is much more of an economic reformer than fidel is. Although they both believe that it was perestroika and glasnost that brought down russia. And, in fact, the firing of the former foreign minister, raul and, again, taped. We get to see everything because they tape everything. He says to him, we will not tolerate a gorbachev in this country. We will hang that gorbachev, and he points to talks about a very famous type of cuban tree. And so it has to go at their schedule, at their pace. But certainly, they recognize theyre in financially disparate shape. They just had three desperate shape. They just had three hurricanes. The International Financial Global Crisis has hurt them terribly. So theres financial desperation, and that is making them reform even faster than they would like to, because they have to. My next question, i guess im afraid oh, no . You can ask it afterwards, but weve got to wrap it up now with these last two questions. Okay. Thanks. First, i wanted to pay homage i havent read the book. I read cuba confidential, but just listening to you tonight, ill take it home tonight and probably read through are it thank you very much. All the way through. Ill take homage anytime. [laughter] no, because from what you say, you clearly have reached what most outsiders havent reached which was understanding the cuban people. And the dynamics on the island and everyone who thinks that its a pretty rigid picture is missing something, and its why im so glad that things are opening up and that more and more people can get down there and sense the dynamism. Theres one question i had. An incident, maybe you write about it in your book, when [inaudible] appears at uci and students start standing up and asking him questions he couldnt answer, and he clearly wasnt prepared for oh, yeah. The questions. Yes. And within 24 hours yep. It spread across the island. Thats right. Well, youre in a controlled institution thats right. The most controlled institution, arguably, on the one of the most controlled institutions. Yeah. The only people in the room who could have filmed this stuff and then gotten it out i know. Your explanation . Cubans are nothing if not entrepreneurial. [laughter] you know, it is one of the [inaudible] one of the most painful ironies of cuba is that the most entrepreneurial people and certainly in the Southern Hemisphere would be, have a marxist system imposed on them. Because they are, theyre just sort of naturally capitalistic. And, you know, they always talk about inventing things and resolving things. These are two famous words in cuban spanish. Yes, what youre talking about and i dont think most people know. The head of the National Assembly and who a lot of us are just amazed how he survived the purge. Two people who were amazed at, the Vice President of the National Assembly and the head of the culture. Were just amazed that they, theyre the two heads standing from the old guard. So were all wondering what did they do . Are they good friends with mariela . Yes. Probably. And one actually had a rapprochement with her too on the transgender surgery issue. What hes talking about is he was talking to a bunch of young cuban students, and a couple of students stood up and said but we want to have some controls. We want access to the internet. We want this. We dont have anything. We need this, we need that. Why cant we have a larger zone of freedom . How can we compete with other people . And he really didnt have the answers. And then they said we want to go to hotels, and he said something, you know, were not allowed to even go into a hotel, and he said, well, when i was your age, my family didnt have the money to send me to a hotel. It was completely irrelevant and very embarrassing and, again, made the internet. So theres enough people with access to the internet that the word gets out. The bad news is, as i said, ramira valdez is the minister of information. And he actually said as soon as he got the job, he said the internet is the wild cult im giving a rough translation the wild cult of technology that must be controlled. Right . He actually said something closer to the bucking bronco than you know . [laughter] and they do. They have put in, like the chinese have, a lot of controls. But theres still ways out. Theyre very entrepreneurial. Theyll hook up to a phone line, theyll get a modem, theyll get the word out, and, you know, remember the overwhelming majority of cubans are under the age of 50, and, you know, they want more, you know . And every cuban has family in miami or elsewhere, so they get, you know . Be as i said, this is going to be very tricky, them opening up. And, again, theyre in no rush to see this embargo disappear very quickly was they are not ready. Because they are not ready. Cuba doesnt have the infrastructure to absorb it. If millions of people went down there, there is no roads or hotels. Not enough. I mean, theres one road that goes from one end of the island to the other, and the leading cause of death is halfway. It doesnt make it all the way across. Thats right. Halfway. But thats what happens when youre there everybody wants to go. Every wants to go because it has the or appeal of the forbidden. I remember driving down that there and theres donkeys and bicycles, they are not ready for prime time, so they need to go slowly. Im sorry you lost your visa. But i got to write this book. [laughter] its called kiss your visa goodbye book. [laughter] my husband, when they detained me its never very nice to be detained. They have that little thing saying, you know, ministry of interior, you know what that means. I knew very well things could get nasty quickly. And my husband bob said to me, well, i think youre going to have to call the new book cuba will be sorry. [laughter] but ill tell you something, its been such a relief to finally write about this island ive been covering for so long and not worry, you know . Keep your visa [laughter] okay. Hi. My names katherine, i grew up in washington, and ive been hearing about the cuban missile crisis since 96 when the internet started. I went to private school in washington, my parents were always watching the cuban missile crisis and what not. Right. And as far as the internet is concerned, i personally think the internet was infiltrated, catalyzed by spies itself. So the actual cattilyization of the internet, my personal opinion, budget necessarily right wasnt necessarily right. Yeah. It was more in terms of finish i dont know. All right. Lets get this straight about cuba. The infiltrations everywhere. It is if youre taking out your 15 top leaders, that means your foreign minister, your Vice President , head of ministries, if theyre being surveilled, everybody else is being surveilled. And so this goes with the territory. But this is not unique to cuba. China, all kinds of authoritarian states do this. You know, we my finish what ive always said, i sort of understood it early on, was that, you know, you just understand that theres a lot of eyes on you. When i would go to cuba, and ive made 12 long trips there, you know, i would change my hotel room three, four, five times. You just keep on moving the cameras around. And just kept trying to pick up your trail. But Everybody Knows that this is part of the game, and the dissidents know this. And i must tell you that probably my favorite thing in this book is the part on surveillance, and that is probably the most corrosive legacy of the castro family, is that, is this mistrust and suspicion among cubans. And it actually got imported into miami. And you saw an interesting replication of it in some of the nasty parts of the cuban history in miami as well. Anyway, i can see that we are i have one more question i think its time to okay. I just wanted to say Hillary Clinton tried to, tried to make cuba a state, and it, like, absolutely failed, and i think that was a very difficult thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you, carla. [applause] this was absolutely fantastic. I think that we learned well, i hope that we can go to cuba with you sometime. I would just we have so much i really learned so much, and it sounds, it sounds really like a place that all of us should visit and hope we have a chance to in the next decade. If not before. We ann louise will sign books, theyre for sale at the front of the store. Those of you not getting your book signed, if you could just fold up the chairs and lean them against the bookcases. Thanks a lot for coming. Thank you, ann louise. [applause] [inaudible conversations] a look now at some authors recently featured on booktvs after words, our weekly Author Interview program. Washington post columnist Sebastian Mallaby talked about the career of former Federal Reserve chair alan greenspan. George borjas discussed his research on the impact of the economy, and in the coming weeks on after words, former Senate Majority leader and u. S. Envoy for middle east peace during the obama administration, majority leader george mitchell. Harvard Business School professor eugene soltis explores the motivation of white collar criminals. Also coming up, Georgetown University philosophy professor Jason Brennan will discuss the flaws in democratic systems. And this weekend editor at large for the guardian, gary younge, will talk about his investigation of gun violence in america. There was a very general sense that areas, low income areas of color where people of color live, that that is where things like this happen. And that if a young person is shot i dead in one of those areas, it doesnt challenge your understanding of the way america works, it actually confirms it. You peek to the dub you speak to the journalists and you say did you think to kind of follow that up . Theyll say its not so surprising that someone would get shot in that area, and so it becomes not news, you know . Theres that phrase when dog bites man, thats not news. Its when bites dog man bites dog, its news. After a while who of these dogs . And why do these dogs keep biting the same people and and what can we do about these dogs . After words airs every saturday at 10 p. M. And sunday at 9 p. M. Eastern, and you can watch all previous after words programs on our web site, booktv. Org. I could not think of a more apropos story than that one that really kind of described how people view flyover nation, because you had a reporter from bloomington, indiana, who went down and, i mean, really went out of her way to find some sort of christian mom and pop shop that she could stereotype. This was during the freedom the rfra battle in indiana. They were getting and that was basically allowing people to say, well, if you own a business and you want to choose how you want to run your business, thats fine. You know, if you dont want to violate your religious conscience there are limitations. People think its a freeforall. No. If youre actively engaging in discrimination, youre going to run afoul of the law. But if you are sincerely professing your faith and saying, well, on this one instance of a wedding ceremony, i dont want to give you my artistic skill or my labor or expression, then thats understandable, and thats what rfra was about. This reporter actually went out of her way and went to this really little, you know, really tiny, little small town. It was one of those small towns where you have the storefront windows, and people still park out in the middle of the seat. She saw some crosses on the wall of this pizza shop and thought, here it is. Crystal, the daughter of the proprietor, was at the Cash Register that day. And be she asked her, well, would you serve would you cater a gay wedding . The weird thing is there was no Actual Service done, no goods, money were exchanged, anything like that, it was just a hypothetical question. Chris call said, you know, we serve gay and lesbian customers every day. Thats one thing. But the act of a wedding ceremony goes against what we believe as christians, so we probably wouldnt participate in that. And i was just thinking the reporter was going to go to a quik trip and say can i buy some fudge rounds and stack them up for a wedding cake or Something Like that, hors doeuvre, whatever. It was weird that they went to a pizza shop. And i wrote about this too because i have gay friends and family members. Im sorry. You know, im from the ozarks. We would never cater a wedding with pizza. Im not throwing shade on anybody who ever has, but do these people not understand . Our neighbors throw a block party in st. Louis, gay neighbors, fabulous, and they had bottle service. No ones going to cater their wedding with a pizza, for crying out loud. Anyway, so that became a big story. And this restaurant was, all of a sudden they were at the center of all of this maddening debate. They had to close up shop, close their blinds. They were getting death threats, all of this, for a hypothetical question with. And it was maddening because not only was it something that never actually happened, there was no discrimination that took place except the discrimination against christian proprietors of a pizza shop. Because, you know, you should this is more than an issue of whether or not you are serving a cake at a gay wedding or photographing a gay wedding or giving pizza to a gay wedding reception. Take that variable out of it. This is, ultimately, about who owns your labor. Can the government come in and say, no, no, no, you actually dont get to determine how you work, when you work and who you provide your services to and with who you associate. Exactly. Thats exactly it. Its about association. Weve already had Supreme Court decisions on this. Youre talking about indentured servitude, and thats ultimately what this boils down to. When you remove all of the window dressing, this is about indentured servitude. And people are too involved to realize what path theyre being led down with this argument, and thats the scary thing about it. And this, though, the fact that you had a reporter that went to this small town and sought someone out to prove a narrative that she was building, thats exactly why people in flyover nation have just had it. You can watch this and other programs online at booktv. Org. This is booktv on cspan2, television for serious readers. Heres our prime time lineup. Tonight starting at seven eastern, Randall Horton and Michael Mcclay discuss their respective books on prison life and reform from this years southern festival of books in nashville. At 8 p. M. , foreman White House Press secretary and former White House Press secretary dana perino from last weekends miami book fair. And on booktvs after words at 9 p. M. Eastern, the guardians gary younge reports on gun deaths in america. Then at 10, kelly oliver looks at Sexual Violence on college campuses. And we wrap up our sunday prime time lineup at 11 with federal judge David Barrons history of the debates between the executive and legislative branches over the constitutional right to declare war. That all happens tonight on cspan2s booktv. I have sometimes made the case and tried to document it with numbers that if you took the philanthropic efforts in new york city at the end of the 19th century, i am to go to the wall saying the amounts of money and effort spent on those were far more than the tax base of new york city could have ever matched in terms of Government Services if they decided to do government programs. A lot of that has gone away. I want to see that come back because that is the stuff of life, of communities. Thats what makes living in a community rewarding in the same way that you worry about what makes a vocation rewarding, what makes a family rewarding. And the title of the book, in our hands, comes from that concept of putting life back in our hands. Our hands as individuals, our hands as families and our hands as communities. So ill stop there, turn it over to jared. You can watch this and other programs online at booktv. Org. Sunday, december 4th, on booktvs in depth, were hosting a discussion on the december 1941 attack on pearl harbor on the eve of the 75th anniversary. On the program, steve toomey, author of countdown to pearl harbor. Ari hota, author of countdown to infamy and craig nelson with his book, pearl harbor from infamy to greatness, followed by an interview with donald stratton, coauthor of quality all the gallant men. Were taking your phone calls, tweets and email questions live from noon to 3 p. M. Eastern. Go to booktv. Org for the complete weekend schedule. For more than two decades, c. Nicole mason has worked on a range of pressing social issues from violence against women to reproductive justice to economic curt. Security. She is also the former executive director of the women of color e policy network at New York University robert f. Wagner graduate school of public service. There she held the distinction of being one of the youngest scholarpractitioners to lead a u. S. Think tank. In addition to being an author, masons commentary and writing have been featured in the los angeles times, politico, the nation be, the progressive,