Transcripts For CSPAN2 Key Capitol Hill Hearings 20151027

What matters is what he says, not where he says it. So i hope that, you know, the Prime Minister will take account that this has been a partisan issue command it should not. I hope he reaches out in a way that is unmistakable to democrats and republicans alike, but emphasizing the nonpartisan nature of the relationship, and, and i think that i would expect this meeting actually will go well. The primethe Prime Minister has an interest, and also the president has an interest. Do i think that in the aftermath there will be the closest of friends . Do ii think that the chemistry will be perfect . No. I think they have different worldviews, but they recognize the points of convergence, the common needs right now, and both have an interest in elevating that at this point. You know, comes back to thinking about those things that bind us and particularly on the issue that divided us. One of the things that we used to always say, we knew our objectives were the same the tacticsthe tactics might not always be the same, but the objectives were the same a threshold has been crossed. An agreement will be implemented. How will it be permitted . Tomorrow a defense hearing that the defense secretary. We have it live at cspan3. Later in the day the state department and Homeland Security officials give it an update on the syrian refugee crisis. That is also live on cspan3 starting at 2 00 oclock eastern. I am on the capitol hill show. I cover what senate for legislation is going on and other key events. As a network we have cover things gavel to gavel. We have covered all of the hearings by the select committee on benghazi in the house of representatives. So this is one of the next in the series. I got there and crews were already set up. And so they can show what was going on even before anybody was ever going there. And this happened during a key moment when she came into the building and they assigned desks that they could report from. A lot of people said it was their first hearing. They called it a historic moment. It is interesting to see and hear from them. I tweeted out a picture of them that shows secretary clinton talking to other members of the house. Again mainly democrats who seemed very pleased and trey gowdy who appears to be sweating at the time was happy to be leaving the room now that the hearing has concluded. The most interesting thing was the conversations that didnt get captured on camera. And there are other members of Congress Talking to each other. We have the gavel to gavel coverage, the house and senate. And when it comes time for the key hearings on capitol hill, we are there and we devote resources on television, radio, and online. Making sure that the viewers can understand without any commentary and this is one of those key events that i think a lot of people will remember for years to come. Coming up next we talk about the Defense Strategy and spending overseas. And arnie duncan was part of a discussion at the National Press club at the effectiveness on standardized testing. Part of the event included new data conducted by the council of the great city of schools. This is one hour. I am the executive director and i want to thank you very much for being here this monday morning. We are going to go ahead and get started because i am sorry to say i can say that we will begin wrapping up this conference at about 10 30 p. M. We have been asked to meet with the president on this report at 11 00 oclock. So we will have to end early here so we can get over there in time. We will end this and look around at 10 30 p. M. I apologize for that. I would also like to thank our panelists in our moderator for being here today and we will introduce everybody shortly. It looks like the last two are coming in now. I want to thank the research council. They include ray hart, Amanda Corcoran and liz and others. Will you stand so everyone can see you . Thank you. [applause] thank you so much. We are here this morning to talk about a new report from the Council Called student testing and inventory and literary analysis. The next steps that all of us on the panel are proposing and this was initiated by the board of board of directors which was comprised by the superintendent and one School Board Member from each city. In the discussion where they met in albuquerque about this time in 2013, the board realized that frankly we did not know as an urban School Coalition just how much testing we were actually doing. Nor did we have a sense of policies and practices in place from district to district. The board charged us with what was administered in the urban Public Schools in the 2014 and 2015 school year, as well as reviewing how the tests were being used and reporting of the results of our inventory no matter what that inventory said. We were not interested here in who is right or wrong in the public debate. And we have some actual evidence about the extent of testing in our schools and proposing next batch. Finally you should know that no one paid us to do this study. It was all done inhouse with our own staff and it was released as soon as we had finished her. And theres more than we can possibly describe this morning, but we generally concluded three overarching things from the research. First, everyone has had a hand in what the current testing system looks like. And the situation was not created by just one entity. Its inconsistent and redundant. And three, there are a lot of tests. And its hard to know how many tests are too many. And it would be difficult for anyone to conclude from the results that we are releasing over the weekend and into today, that what we have here is not too many tests or that the tests are not being too frequently given. In general we found that the average student in the schools will be required to take about 112 between prek and high school graduation, this amounts to about eight standardized tests per year. We can tests of indifferent subjects as two separate tests and we count multiple administrations of the test during the school year as separate tests as well. In all there were over 400 test titles that were administered across the 66 bigcity School Districts, not counting special education diagnostic tests or a career and Technical Education tests. Students across the School Systems on which we have data sapper testing over 6700 times in the 2014 in 2015 will year, the focus of our review. Finally the time devoted to taking this constituted about 2. 3 at the highest tested grade level. You should note that at this time it only included the time devoted to these mandatory tests took every student in a designated grade would take. It did not include optional samples or program tests or tests designed for a special population. And did not include time for test prep and it did not include time spent on tests that were purchased or developed at the school level. It did not count these tests because not everybody takes those tests. So adding them to the time of testing that everyone is given seemed to add apples and oranges and mandatory tests that are given to every child in a particular grade, optional test and special populations test. And that includes smarter balance and other college and career ready exams given by the states. Exams that were typically given that the secondary grade level, such as tests in American History or chemistry. Three, exams that were given periodically over the course of the school year to assess student progress. Some of these were required by the state and some by the district. Some are commercial and some were homegrown. And Student Learning objectives that are typically given in otherwise untested grades and subjects often form the basis for evaluating staff. Other mandated assessments, only when they are wired for all students in a particular grade. All have stayed summative exams that will take between six and nine hours apiece. 71 of the districts in minister and the tests in one of my subjects that will consume between two and five hours per grade. Nearly 60 in minister formative exams on average three times per year that will take between seven and 11 hours in the districts that give them. About 30 also in minister Student Learning objectives and dozens of subjects that take between five and 11 hours in each grade. In nearly all of the districts, they are going to give other mandatory test that consume an average of between three and nine hours. Many in the same subject to the same students in the same grade. The second big category involve tests that were administered only to samples of students, although they were sometimes required. But the National Assessment of educational progress is part of this. This also included optional tests like the sat. However, when these tests were required and they are required in some districts, we put them in the mandatory category. It also included those that were in a particular program like advanced placement or international baccalaureate. These can take another five hours or so, but some program tests are particularly considerably longer. The final big category included special populations assessments. Here we included englishlanguage proficiency for English Learners and various diagnostic tests for students with disabilities. In addition to the overarching conclusions that i mentioned earlier, we also found that the test were usually not aligned with each other or with any particular standard, although clearly some others are. Testing time did not correlate with students reading or math achievement. Third, there was considerable redundancy in the testing and i am sure that we will talk about that on the panel. Orth, some tests are not used for the purges on which they are designed. And test results include instruction. And particularly for the purposes for which they are given. [inaudible] it should give the nation caused. We have listed steps that many cities are taking to reduce testing. You will hear more about what miami and North Carolina are doing this morning and we got word last night at the boston Public Schools is going to be reducing its tests by half as a result of this study. In addition, we are pleased to announce that the council of the great city of schools will form formulate the commissions of academics and teachers and parents and we will do this in conjunction with our partners at the council of School Officers and we will charge this commission with developing proposals and models for how we can make this more strategic and thoughtful and coherent. With that, i would be happy to answer your questions during the Panel Discussion, but i would like to also introduce our secretary of education, arnie duncan, for brief remarks. [applause] they really dont know what is out there. If they do at the federal level, it becomes more of a federal requirement. It certainly took two years. And i think that that speaks to some of the complexity of this issue. This is one that all of us in education have struggled with or thought about for a long time. I often tell the story about taking over the chicago Public Schools in 2001. We were taking the illinois and iowa state tests. We lived in illinois but not iowa. But we stopped taking the iowa tests cut out the effect can see and our team believes in and thinks about this all the time. It is the goal of high standards and we think that its hugely important that many states adopted no child left behind and especially disadvantaged children who are told they cannot be successful. We actually believe in high quality assessments and i will come back to that. Mike spoke about that in his comments. We believe in meaningful accountability. We have to talk about achievement gaps. And whether that is a school or district level, we need to know who is making progress and who is not. What we do not believe in which is clearly unnecessary are lowquality and redundant assessments that do not help anyone. And we have to say what have we done to contribute to the challenge and what can we do both individually and collectively to get us to a better spot. And that includes the state and district level and we have the levels out there. That recommendation actually came when john was a state officer in new york. And its so important for all of us to think about. So how do we get more strategic assessments that drive instruction. These are not in conflict with a good instruction, but they help to promote it. They actually want to know where their children are, parents do. They want to help their children do better and if it doesnt make sense or if it is confusing, that is not helping to drive instruction. So if we think about time and time is one part of this conversation, the other part is the coherent strategy where good assessments are leading to better instruction. So we say that the goal of every great teacher is not to teach but to have children learn. And how we assess the learning and the strengths and weaknesses and how we empower students themselves along with parents and teachers, to know what the childs strength is and weaknesses is, the to help that child improve, that is what we need to get to as a nation. We want to be a better partner and try to lay out a roadmap with suggestions that we think would be helpful. We want to listen to chris and his team and figure out how we can get this to a more rational place. So i think together its a very important conversation to have. We are not going to solve it all today. But we need to open it up and so on an ongoing basis we should be looking at this. We look at lots of things and see again if youre reducing the amount of time but its still not benefiting instruction, that is a good soundbite. If youre reducing the amount of time leading to better teaching and learning, that is pretty powerful and i think that that is the next iteration of this conversation. So i think that this is very important and i think that chris has been a great part of it as well. Look forward to giving us a much better place. To begin the Panel Discussion i would like to introduce our moderator, caroline henry, who is the executive director of the education association. Thank you. Im really honored to be here today. It has been a whirlwind of news on this topic. My members have been busy burning the midnight oil. We are a member of the media that covers education and we have a really great panel and we have chris from the executive director of the council of School Officers and we have the deputy secretary that will be taking over and i think the folks are knowledgeable about this topic and i am delighted to jump in. So my first question is to you and over the weekend as we all heard, the administration of knowledge that it bore responsibility for over testing of students. It also announced that the president has directed the Education Department to review the administrations role and how to address how it may have contributed to the problem and to respond accordingly. The department came out with a 10 page action plan in which not only do you accept some responsibility but you kind of layout stats that you plan to take to help states and districts cut back on testing. So some of my members have written about this at some of it is new and some of it is not so new and im hoping that you could maybe walk us through what is new in this plan and what do you think is most significant. Thank you for the question. Let me add a couple of things for the leadership around the report and around these issues. Having been a teacher and a principal with the sense that the key question is how do you establish the right balance. Theres no question that needs to be an assessment that is highquality and well designed and give good information to parents about how their kids are doing and how they can improve instruction and to students about how they are progressing and that distracts us from good instruction, things that are getting in the way. The good news, which we call out in the plan over the weekend is that we have states all across the country that are moving toward this. Dozens of states that have adopted better assessments and there is too much testing that is not helping instruction. And that includes student achievement and growth. The progress is that no test should be given just for the purpose of educator evaluation. We lay out the principle assessment that it should be time limited, that we think that it should cast the amount of instruction on testing and many states are taking action in this way and we will talk about the work that is happening in North Carolina, we know the work that is happening in mexico and delaware on these issues. We are laying out the principle that this should be one of multiple measures that are used when evaluating the progress with work of educators. As well as the principal assessments that should be transparent and actionable and timeless and its important for educators to get education on which to act. And we also want to get to the heart of the question to help the financial support. We have already made available their ability of the assessments that they give. The president made a significant proposal for 2016 focusing on a setaside for those to put those tort in on it for they give so that they can call the assessments that are unnecessary or duplicative. And teaching is the core after in helping districts bring together those that evaluate the assessments that are given. Dollars and technical assistance, we will continue to work with them as they evaluate the assessments that they give and try to identify the ones that they cannot. More importantly once that they can improve upon with a more comprehensive and Critical Thinking focused assessment. And we will continue to work on this as well. And that includes others that identify opportunities. Many states have received waivers from giving an eighth grade test that also take High School Tests and those taking High School Algebra should not have to take it again. Fourth, we will continue to identify policy areas in which we can reduce the appropriate level of the role of assessment. We are looking at the teacher placement, where we want to make sure. Teacher prep programs are focused on how well we assist students with learning, but we dont want them to look at that only through the lens of assessment. We are also working with flexibility around teacher of valuation in places where we can use more performancebased effectiveness as a part of how we are looking for learning for teacher evaluation. Ultimately we hope to accelerate the progress of work that the numbers have hardly begun. Thank you for laying that out. One thing that i dont think you got into too much is the point that made the most news. Was this idea of a 2 cat. I remember secretary duncan, when you were at the conference last spring, you said that you had been public about there being too much testing. And that at that time you had urged them to cap state and district testing. In the past six months, what has changed, in your view, if anything, to put forward this recommendation that congress should ensure that states cap the amount of state assessments, you know. Do you think that there is a federal for this beyond urging states to do it and Congress Actually coming in and saying that they shall cap testing . I think that these are all hard and complicated issues that get to the heart of the appropriate state and local role. I think that what has happened, the fact is that the lack of clarity has led to redundancy and duplicative exams and things that are low quality. The Biggest Issue is not just the time that the lack of coherence and strategy and the lack of driving instruction and willpower. So we could have a lot of debates about the appropriate conversations to have. I think that collectively we all haveations to have. I think that collectively we all have a mutual responsibility to help to get this to a better place. So we are all trying to be pretty self reflective. What we tried to do is provide a lot of flexibility. Some folks did some amazing things. Pointing out an example in tennessee of a fantastic arts teacher that really didnt like what the state was doing in terms of the assessment that basically created his own. And i think it has been adopted state wide. That is an example of it being used in a productive way. And i think what we are trying to do is provide some clarity in terms of guidance with what we think makes more sense. We could have an academic debate, but at the end of the day is it working for children and teachers and parents . And we need to find a way to let this work. You urged in this action plan that this is part of it. And maybe we can talk about where that came from . That would be john. Okay. [laughter] the amount of time to cap the situation as well, standardized testing and also the amount of time that was spent that involved traditional test prep simulation. The challenge is it is difficult at the federal level to figure out what is the right answer across this. So we have suggested that the states should take on this responsibility of setting a cap and communicating with families about what assessments are given and how the time is used. And the goal here is going to be balanced. Because what we do not want is for states to move away from quality and say that we are going to do last writing and problem solving. And then there are those doing so willynilly. I was pretty surprised as to how the report did not mince words as far as local School Systems now. He said that they share responsibility for what todays testing portfolio looks like which is too often incoherent, misaligned, redundant and or inappropriate. And i think that those are pretty tough words for your own member districts. How hard will it be to fix the situation at the district level. After this is all over if anyone has any job openings, please let me know. [laughter] and again the board of directors actually asks for the report and they also view the report after it was done. They solved the language that we used to describe what they were doing and they said amen, you are exactly right. And i think that because they have embraced what the nature of the issue is that we are going to have a much easier conversation with our own members about strategies used to reduce the amount of testing. So i am not actually terribly worried about them because they really own the issue in a lot of ways. But let me ask chris to join me in this on the 2 thing. I understand and appreciate what the administration is proposing and i think that generally what the administration is proposing in its action plan is really an important step to action and i think that there is no doubt about that. And at the same time it is not clear to me that implementing a onesizefitsall acrosstheboard of the 2 cap is what the solution is to this problem. It will reduce the amount of time that one spans. But issues of quality and use and redundancy in all of that did unaddressed and there is a strong possibility that people will cap the test and the lemonades the tests that could be helpful in informing instruction. You could easily have a situation where under 2 , which is really what youre left with, which is only the federally required test. And those that are given to inform instruction could be squeezed out of this. So i would be concerned about being too hard and fast without what a percentage actually ought to be. I think that the sentiment in terms of reducing time is part of this but drawing a line is clear and i think it could create negative unintended consequences that we cannot foresee at this point. Chris, i know you want to jump in on the idea. But as you speak, i would love for you to address the findings in the report about the lack of alignment on many of the tests being given on the urban district to college and career ready standards as a leader that has been at the forefront in promoting the Higher Standards and the aligned assessments and i think that that would be somewhat concerning to you. I really appreciate your work on this. I think its clear that could have unintended consequences and so we are in a place where i would rather talk about polity and the idea that we are giving a bunch of tests that are not allowed with standards that are being taught is really the headline for me here. That these tests are just being given because they were given in the past. No one would have done so if they would have been a part of the standards of that point. These tests were given because they had been given over the last 10 to 12 or 15 years, i think. And i think that that is an important point for the state. I really appreciate what the secretary said about all of us owning some of this. And the districts need to own some of this as well. Im hoping that today will be a start of the conversation with states and districts. The second thing is that mike and i worked together to release a report last year where we laid out some actions of state and district we are going to take to reduce testing. Obviously given that the survey had just been completed, we do not have any data to show the impact yet. But we do have 39 states working on reducing testing and we are tracking map. Theyre having conversations at the local level. And they care about it. I was just in School Last Week when the parents were telling me how important it was that they were getting assessments regularly. So for all the hubbub about assessments, i know that their art parents that want to know how their kids are doing. I do want to get that conversation started. And so i would love the doctor to respond to this idea and also to talk a little bit about what you all are doing on the testing front to reduce testing and also to experiment with new approaches as to how you are getting these tests done. Thank you very much and good morning to all of you. I appreciate the opportunity to be a part of this panel. When i was a student i had to take a lot of tests. For me the big idea is the purpose of the test and that is where we had started in North Carolina. About two years ago we did an Extensive Survey of our schools to find out about testing. And what we found is when we include state and federal tests that take about 1. 6 of the students time and then when you add in local tests, that bumped it up to about 2. 3 . So we started having the focus be teachers and students and that brought us to the point of students, teachers and our parents and what should be the purpose of the test is to help students and help teachers know what to do next in the classroom to improve student growth and achievement. For this here for the first time, we are doing a concept we take the standard for fifthgrade english Language Arts and the standard for sixthgrade math and we are counting the standards and administering shorter assessments to students, three or four during the year so that we can give immediate feedback to the teachers and to the students about what to do next. As this became very important to me after having a focus group for fifth graders, seventh graders, and eight graders. One eighthgrade student said he would be so helpful if you would talk the standards and give me a shorter test so i would know what to do to improve if i am not learning certain stuff. And so we are taking the lead of an eighthgrader that says lets have smaller test spread out over time and that we would use that feedback immediately to help students improve. And will talk about what he has been a to. And to have a conversation to the issue. Of how much time we put before the kids to equality 81 dash qualitative conversation of the efficacy of these assessments provide to invade have informed teachers and parents . The third point is that the need to recognize or have been overstated the problem may face today is the result of the cumulative impact with the state requirement and the statutes in local districts to be predictive and not be surprised if the scores come out if you put those together you have a complex issue. Dont forget in many cases assessments across the country reflect the proverbial the tail wagging the dog. They were generated to pass a test so that this data the student data level for this state solution and mandates the end of course, assessment for every single course taught in the state. Literally hundreds of not thousands of force assessments. What is the solution . Rather than ask permission for you to embark with the Debt Forgiveness so last spring decided to decommission those assessments at the district level to put under our control for the purpose to generate a benchmark. To simply eliminate those assessments restored to 260 minutes of teaching time. We testified in tallahassee and the governor issued the executive order amid the school year that eliminated the need for the vast majority of end of the forced assessments we could decommission almost 300 and discourse assessments at the elementary level we went from 23 mandated at zero middle schools 77 down at four. As Senior Highschool with the real brought of coursework 186 down at just six. We are supportive of this report the next phase of the conversation can i just be a percentage of time it is a quantitative analysis with a robust and honest conversation with the purpose behind these assessments that is a qualitative conversation of America Today should measure the president when don facebook to put out a statement tuesday as the end of an era you think that is accurate or is that a misreading . Look at the facts they echoed everybody has said i believe that for a while he also believes it is important to hold ourselves accountable for Student Learning the other point i want to make to talk about the 2 it is a lessening courageous leadership. We live in a town where most say why they are right and everyone else is wrong. You dont have many looking into the mir that is the best outcome. So what are you willing to do as a leader to do differently . But i am very confident and optimistic of where were going because people come at this with humility. This is in flames people of passion and certainly you were the target of fierce criticism of the rollout of the new standards and test the knockdown movement was so strong in new york i believe 200,000 students were grabbed zero is this the effort to bury that hachette . Is the effort to make sure we have a smart approach. At the end of the day that purpose is to help us serve students. All of us at this table there is a civilrights function. We need that information by race and income and we need to act on those. It is an abandonment of those principles to say there are smart ways to have educators said the local levels for those that say do we need these . Are there places that have the students writing to Historical Research . In the present president talked about that. With part of that instructional process else to drive continuous improvement. He touched and i am deeply concerned about i think over testing or no testing of all or two sides of the immoral proposition three cannot go back to the years were about a high performing students hid the pockets of underperforming kids you need some degree of assessment did not to be logical and restricted and a non redundant but this report is not meant to empower this moral responsibility we have to our kids and teachers. At this point we will open it up to questions for members of the media. If you have a question erasure hand please identify yourself. I thought the most interesting parts of the testing plan was the fact you are easing up on the student growth so could you talk more about that to offer details of that flexibility . Is this change in relation to the comments received that are largely critical . We are adapting the hour rule on the feedback but the key up part of the assessment to major teacher programs have good information how they affect Student Learning to create flexibility of their way to any one factor or elegant. This will evolve what to make sure the states are innovative very creative to have of the evaluation over time. It is important to understand from a system that focuses entirely on input to look at the outcome. To act like outcomes to work in in disadvantaged communities that we will continue to challenge that. I still am not clear after listening to you both with the put that forward as a discussion point if you really mean it . It is not that hard it is put up as a recommendation. To be very clear for the fifth time the goal is not just the capital we want to reduce testing it is to have good assessment that drives instruction if testing is reduced to 1 then that is all losses of failure. Is that good assessment that helps teachers it is a could outcome so we have a clear recommendation one piece of this very important puzzle. So it doesnt quantify the amount of test prop that is one area that goes into instruction and what the effect it may have on the classroom. The goal is the bad test prep to simulate construction so the goal that districts would spend to be focused on quality instruction if they ask students how to solve the problem in math and it will focus on a good understanding of mouth in a lot of vague good assessment of construction that is for those low level or for guessing the deal will have the instruction that has the same lowlevel skills so it just cannot be about the time of equality. We did not include the time spent on test prep it is a phenomenon at the individual school level of the mandates so the schools are responding to the accountability portion with the inordinate test prep we wanted to make sure that anybody do that the time to not include data entry urged somebody to do that. But it took two years to do what we did. I am tired. [laughter] one of the things you mentioned in a report is there over 400 test titles and often at the district level there are testing contractors pushing day shiniest test making so much money in this industry is a realistic to think we would have a reduction of test prep because so many vendors have materials that are aligned to the test . It is a great question. Sova tavis vendors have played a role to drive the amount of testing now it is our fault for buying them. So with that political pressure is sometimes put on people the villain of the reasons why it is important for a coalition to work on these issues of federal states and local is be coz we put out a report on the amount of testing doesnt mean the vendors will say okay. They will not do that so our responsibility is federal state local actors to create an entire midori set of proposals to make it to connected. From the state level were already seeing the states example after example working with the School Districts to reduce testing the other is 30 minutes last of testing to ready just in one year. At the time issue is secondary. With induce states building assessments and reedy to take a look at the old test to make sure we dont keep giving those. Will get the Bigger Picture and for decades you had 50 different states all doing their own thing so you had no way to compare it was apples to oranges. So you figured out who was doing a good job into wasnt so there were starting to evaluate themselves so over time we could see which districts are improving faster if North Carolina is doing something we should replicate that. So were still crawling we just never had an education and whos accelerating the learning of black children of the english language murders . What combination help them get better faster . We never had that. Are you disappointed as an effort to to make the interstate comparisons . Were very pleasantly surprised and nobody predicted this love all of courage it is an ongoing process but seven years ago you said so many states would raise standards no one would have said that is possible if all goes to local leaders. Headed in touche 2016 some have seen the moons over the weekend to smooth the relations between the Democratic Party in the teachers unions and they see this in a political context of above for you to respond to that and is this the beginning of the administration to do the about face like Charter Schools . Is that down the road . This is about students we have an opportunity to make assessments better that one of the key is resources as a going to do discussions with other reasons they make choices is they dont have the resources to develop and analyze a richer assessment because rigo those high be districts to have that resource is that would help a lot. This is how do we ensure the system to achieve at the highest level . I dont want the media to misread the president had won a clear message to do the right thing. Something is have been politically popular just keep it in that category. I have to say everything is political at some point. As a member of the board be demanded this report this analysis be conducted two years ago so the fact is released now is to just recently concluded so shave on us that it is chock full of information we limit actions to talking about it to convince ourselves and hopefully that will not be the case. The big idea is repass the test is not to medea or not to feud just right all the benefits of this today growth and achievement. You have the last word. [laughter] [applause] [inaudible [inaudible conversations] afternoon. Welcome to our program the 1965 immigrations act for cry of the president of the american constitution in society and for those of you that may not know about us it was founded in 2001 with judges and policy makers to makh judges and policy makers to improve the lives of all people. To shape vital constitutional issues such as what we will hear discussed today. Thank you for posting todays event it is not the first time we have partnered with programs of mutual interest and i know if it is not though last part of the past couple of years we have marked the anniversary is of several important civilrights laws the act of 64, Voting Rights act of 65 but we wanted to make sure we didnt forget the immigration act of 1965 that was part of the effort to make the laws is more fair and respectful of the quality. It to radically change to a limit National Origins that flavor favored the immigration system to other parts of the world. Yet despite the laudable goal than the content they ended for in the lead toward discrimination in those divisive policies we see today. A of the politics. So to lead us through discussion with our distinguished panel we have a real expert the senior cabinet adviser the nations largest hispanic civilrights advocacy organizations preparing the network for the implementation of executive action on immigration. He is author and coauthor to supervise the Research Reports coordinated pro bono litigation and as a parttime resident there working on a book of the reform act of 86. [applause] so thanks to the panel and also to this espn2 audience. Each of the panelist will have their opening remarks to have a few minutes of discussion in an open to audience q a. Two o bed with a discussion of bed 1965 act and then we will discuss the subsequent developments how that affects workers rights. We will not go into detail on each bio that is all available to the audience. But before beginning to the act we might want to start with a brief recap so thanks to my colleague who did a similar introduction of a big go what we give you the history of the immigration policy and it is not that hard. Because we had no immigration policy. The getting the late 1800s not just to limit the number said people with the kind of people there were exclusions for certain kinds of diseases or prostitutes and so forth Congress Passed the chinese exclusion act the title should be selfexplanatory to bar most agents reentering the country and in the early twenties the u. S. Pass the First Comprehensive law of National Origin quota laws. They created in immigration quota for each foreign country based on 2 of the percentage of that population that was that nationality. Said to be hypothetically 1 Million People was a quota of 2 percent for perot congress was to make sure for those that are already here. A 1952 s second major Immigration Reform the immigration and nationality act and for the first time priorys for the employment jesus. With the immigration selection system that remains one form or another to this day. As we consider that fact was that todays panel will answer what happens and why. A second set of questions how did that shape the migration flows and policies . What lessons can redraw that todays policy makers cameron from as we face the 21st century to begin our discussion we turn to rose. I am pleased to be here today. It is helpful to specify bed immigration act. Congress provided there shall be no discrimination place of birth or place of residence so for the First Time Congress provided grace chao no longer be a factor as reconsider the historical implications and the Lessons Learned in to be published but the buoyancy that we examine to think about with the immigration act if we could consider that as a civil rights law. With the civil rights legislation to think about that question to examine the intent so i a read that statute is that consistent of what day insisted . They have argued with pieces of civil rights of legislation. Then 1964 civilrights act ben followed by the 65 Voting Rights act many of these are instrumental but theyre not perfect laws but by contrast to argue the 1965 pact should be considered to be the most effective of all civil rights laws of the past. And only did it abolish race and National Origin but it did open the borders by allowing millions so from that perspective we can save the 65 backed is an important piece of civil rights legislation. But that idea was not shared by all and we examine the critical perspective of the act arguing for the first time it imposed limitations on countries from the western hemisphere making the emigrations of the mexicans. Withy undocumented population in the 1965 act with the immigration of people from the western hemisphere. There are critics to argue that it did nothing for the immigration of people in africa. For those of african descent that the diversity lottery programs that was put in place in 1980. They have argued in fact, the 1965 act has those quotas by limiting the Refugee Program from those coming from communist dominated countries with bad National Origin from that perspective. And to put in place that ongoing dissemination. The other they might apply to highlight so it is part of the immigration is system so what was put in stone under that at to allow for unlimited immigration and then to sponsor the children married and unmarried so as to promote those losses upon close examination from that system that is set in place to provide for a limited quotas to note who counts as family all of these different factors that lead to significant delays to promote family unification and how we think those with the perspective. Before you start but the opponents of the law of the critics to anchor age that is well lead to the chain migration end of the historical point about that the with the mitt the immigration to the family members. The intent of that was to restrict immigration into those who already had family members in the United States. Just a little point. 8q for the invitation to be here. Pointing to that central tension but it creates the problem of the legalities as we know it today by creating essentially a disconnect on the one hand it of the other the political restrictions to curtail immigration from certain countries with high emigration like mexico and the since it has opened from all over the world that is juxtaposed against the background of geographic historical relationship so mexico for purposes of immigration is like mozambique but that to me and is very different. So we get is if it is a problematic act in immediately it starts at the state and the federal level in the United States and that is what i want to focus on. So the act then creates that cascade of problems of political and legal developments that grapple with it without addressing that fundamental disconnect so you see a series of enactments that we could say are on the edges of the problem but not to the root of it is self. So very soon thereafter we see the effects of the state level to pass the employer sanction laws so it can connect the idea of who should be working to the concept of illegality california is in the recession this stopped employers in california from hiring unauthorized workers. This goes before the Supreme Court a event in that case it has to grapple with the idea of the states reentering immigration regulations and the end of way there was significant state regulations and through 1880 that we may substitute but from 1875 lot is the federal government dominant the post 65 with the concept of illegality the states start to reenter the and the sanctions law goes before the Supreme Court to say the power to regulate is unquestionably a power but they have held it is a regulation of the immigration so the Court Upholds this law so that triggers postdate and federal action later 11 actually to waned which alternately in 1986 with immigration control act is preempted by federal law. By you conceded government attempting to do with the problems created in 65 by spreading a mass Legalization Program. Said to have a significant portion at that time to legalize. But its it becomes very clear so the federal government attempts the more punitive response for the federal and axmans that forces the United States out of this problem with dave harsh deportation standard to create a larger class of people subject to deportation so the legality created by the lot so where does something there is extremely interesting to allow for state level enactments to control for immigration. Many of those provisions although enacted in 1996 lie fallow the next several years. As we argue in our new book book, what and said happening for the state involvement is activated through political mechanisms is you start to see in the last 10 years with a significant stake a. M. Local enactment. 12 trend toward the attempt withy illegality but the current landscape goes to the theme of the discussion with the 1965 act that we currently have a patchwork in the United States where the prospects whether documented in the United States and also with different prospects is a former of structural a quality we might want to think about moving forward that in many ways the lawn that impacts the lives of immigrants on a daily basis. The internal question of equality how we should think about integration of laws like california the later the way they treat generally and specifically in cities like new york or at the city level vs. A restriction this law of alabama or arizona should be think of these to different types of laws as similar for purposes of understanding human discourse if we only need one and immigration what to allow these various efforts . Finally thinking how the landscape has developed with a federal law to create a condition we have significant state and local response is to which extent do we allow these to be a forerunner of defacto policies . That states and local efforts affect national law making it becomes difficult for congress from those jurisdictions to vote in ways to override those so john mccain, in the early 2000 immigration policy is described as a moderate in did promote certain acts as a comprehensive package including a Legalization Program but after the proposition 200 he no longer can hold those positions to the moderate immigration in positions end is forced to take a more extreme position it you see that middle disappear. So one of the of legacies is the creation of the legality because they have not dealt with that fundamental problem with those that are attempting to do chip away at the problem now that leads to a situation that the prospects for significant comprehensive reform. The queue to monitor it to host this event i will build upon the fellow panelist remarks to save not meant to be a revolutionary bill. That is often tossed around when we looked at how the law has transformed the u. S. Labor market in to partner with some negative ways. The 1965 law is credited for creating a sizable and documented position of today so keep in mind today there were no quotas from latin america and of course, for centuries between the territory of mexico and the United States the with that position of 120,000 pieces from the western hemisphere initially only 40,000 and by 1977 it was cut down at 20,000 to be around for mall a quality vs. Equity. With a companion civil rights legislation certainly it did create formal inequality but in fact, did it have the equity there were looking for . Some was it hasnt. So looking at the foreignborn workers so the United States and mexico headed into a bilateral treaty to allow Foreign Workers to work temporarily this is known as a program that allowed 5 million workers but the program with fuelled the Agricultural Sector in the Industrial Work as well. You played a significant role in the u. S. Labor market so given the supply of shortage of workers coming from the u. S. Economy. Is enacted but hundreds of thousands of mexican workers participating in the program with no real pathway so contributing to the growth and that this same time we have employers that will rely arm that labor supply. There is some historical literature with the exclusion of mexican workers. There is a significant lobby pushing for the exclusion of latin American Workers with the concern there may overtake u. S. Population others note of mechanization and that they would not need as many people. So the end of the program is a Significant Impact that was there a cap on the mexican nationals but we also see a shift in the temporary worker program. It was relatively small in scale and continues to be. But prior to 65 showing the burden that shifted to the employer so this meant there was more of an active role the government played to determine which foreignborn workers could come to the United States. This gave the government more control for other latin American Workers. Also during this time those that take the position of undocumented workers should not be in the Agricultural Sector between undocumented workers in the labor market for many years that follow. What is the of larger consequence today . I argue there is a few. But not creating a permanent pathway, it is labeled of mexican workforce with a permanent transience they cannot be permanently integrated into the u. S. Labor market and some scholars have argued in some respects to replace the asian immigrants with the latinos year 1965 and that was even a jaded but said the facto exclusion to create to this permanent outsider demonized and exploited. So that a significant interdependency this stage of a labor certification process in the inevitable result with the undocumented population in the United States. What is the impact . Both documented and undocumented. And other forms of Workplace Discrimination of their disproportionate to the representation and the the list goes on. That has been fuelled by the undocumented population. There has been gloom and doom but charles mentioned the entire peace allocation 74 only 20 percent went to Employment Base 20 in 1965. Those with exceptional ability for another 10 percent went to perform skills. Some may say as the overall allocation that is relatively low. There is a larger critique that if we do what we need to do to attract the best talent in the United States. But we did see this and many of these are making a Significant Impact on the economy. So was it the right allocation . Also note said beecher to self employment how that affects the u. S. Business market or how this has caused economic difficulties but that is another aspect to look at. Two more points the impact of the law and africanamericans that gets relatively little attention but deserves more. In they often talk about latinos it reflects what it means for africanamericans there is a very vigorous debate is positive for harmful to say there is a positive impact and they tend to be more positive in terms of the Economic Impact overall. There are other general studies that have done some wage impact to get the same time to look to the industries where employers have intentionally chosen to replace traditionally vulnerable groups as a longstanding Latino Community and that is purposely with a guest workers are more exploitable and former paul. Formidable. But think of it as civil rights and equity. The of the ways in which the undocumented population has affected the latino communities with racial profiling and discrimination we have to ask ourselves what is the impact on communities of color . Antiminority attitudes another way to look at it that has spurred the growth including the Immigration Reform act. It pushes some employers to move away from undocumented workers to rely on guest workers or prison labor for other types of workers may be lawfully working. With that series of defense to impact that experience and of course, we know there is a Significant Growth of the population but the interplay when you have people come in his family based immigrants coming in under the Employment Based theme. It is difficult to cavan is in the isolated way so they still continue to of a significant deficit for temporary migration there were attempts to remedy that. It strikes me that in addition to books the equity verses quality of also has to do with supply and demand many people point to where that explanation to be partially true but it strikes me how much demand was there in Eastern Europe that was behind the iron curtain that did not permit emigration or is it a question of what happened at this point for what the catalyst may have talked about disrespect. One of the things we have yet to mention with that overall population and where we may be as predicted by demographers. So it will no longer be a majority white population but the offices of that. There might not be a single race to dominate the u. S. Population instead to reemerge as one of those in the United States we can trace back to because of the immigration of immigrants of color from mexico and china india and the philippines was the top spending countries over the last several years to think of it as the prospective if congress has never opposed any kind of immigration would we be in a different place today and what would that look like . One argument is the act could be thought of as erasing intentional or the effect of the racial barriers to emigration law. From affirmative action and a series of ways to address the ongoing impacts of discrimination. From one perspective we can think of it as a positive perspective because it promotes the view of discrimination. Others may say it is a negative perspective but it is one thing to think about going everyone to have equal access in the United States but it is another to have Immigration Law as a means to diversify that stream. The one to put that in there as a way to consider the role in our current population. First the point about taking his back to the program but we are reemphasize st. Only because directly preceding 65 you had that set for most cyclical migration retrieved the United States there are a significant concerns with a lot of ways that choice and agency may have been coerced but it was a way to promote cyclical and seasonal forms of migration. I wonder, and this is an open question, to what extent does significant federal Immigration Reform or rethinking ideas of illegality, even as those demographic changes happen, our concept of illegality