Who is accused of stashing rocks as the schools . And multiple claims that looters have been using credit cards stolen from the wreckage of flight 17 in ukraine. Hi there im Brianna Keilar. We begin with the world lead. Its almost with a sense of disbelief i must report for the third time in a week a passenger plane has crashed. This time its a plane owned by swift air by operated by air algerie. Reuters is reporting the wreckage has been spotted in the west african nation of mali. According to the president of that country, the plane took off from the nation of burkina faso bound for the capital of algeria but lost contact near mali which is now where it lies according to reuters. Thunderstorms were in the area during the flight. Burkina fasos transport minister says the plane was asked to change course. Mali is in turmoil with islamists can fighting the government and French Forces there. This crash comes a day after a Transasia Airways an flight crash while trying to land in rain. Taiwan. At least 48 people on board were killed. Its only been a week since malaysiaia Airlines Flight 17 was shot down, allegedly from a section of ukraine controlled by prorussian separatists. 298 people were on board. Three planes, hundreds lives all gone in a week. Its temperaturing to read patterns into it. After all, weather may have played a role in the two most recent incidents and malaysian 17 and this latest plane were flying over conflict zones. Joe johns, what can you take us about the latest crash . The report is that this wreckage of the plane that was just spotted was found, there are reports that now that the wreckage is located they can try to figure out what happened. This would apparently end a search this started in darkness though there is still some question how long it took authorities to determine they had a missing plane. 1 17 a. M. Local time, flight 5017 left ouagadougou bound for algiers. It was supposed to be a fourhour overnight flight but about 50 minutes after takeoff, it disappeared from radar over mali, close to a zone of on going conflict between rebels and the government, an area the faa warned pilots to stay above 24,000 feet to avoid becoming a target. But early indications suggested bad weather in the area may have contributed to what authorities referred to as apparent crash. Air Traffic Controllers told the pilot to change course to avoid sandstorms in a part of the world where conditions are breeding grounds for hurricanes. The military chief of staff for the burkina faso army. The plane expressly asked to change itinerary because of the bad weather. That may be a reason. There may be other hypothetical that sees linked to other conditions but we cant at this time venture in that direction. Air al jerry said the plane had apparently crashed about 70 kilometers or 45 miles from the southeastern city of gow. The plane, a staple in small commercial passenger jets, was carrying at least 110 passengers plus six or seven crew members including the pilot and copilot. About 50 of the people on board were reported to be from france, about 25ing from burkina faso. Authorities reported a long list of other nationalities on board. None was american. The plane was owned and operated by a spannish Company Called swift air. Some experts say the 18yearold aircraft has outlived its prime but any number of factors could have contributed says patrick smith, a pilot and author of the book cockpit confidential. I think weather is probably the biggest challenge to flying in africa. And theres a certain how to call it, improvisational aspect to flying in africa that you dont have elsewhere. The air safety in africa gets a bad wrap. In a lot of respects flying on the continent is very safe. A lot of questions out there right now including whether this plane was missing for several hours before news of the disappearance was actually made public. No explanation on that so far. Joe, thank you so much. With two of these plane crashes in two days, what can we learn from these tragic events . Do they have anything in common . I want to bring in tom for man to explain this to us. Walk us through these two crashes and the circumstances surrounding them. They have wildly different circumstances but some things that are the same. Lets look at the first flight bath of that the jet believed to have crashed here in mali. It took off on this four 0 fivehour flight and its a remote area where yes, the government has been fighting some islamic extremists. But that raised concerns early on. The next step was what you were talking about. Look at the weather patterns at the time. This is area down here where the plane went down. Lets look more closely. Look what it was going through at the time it, very intense storms, which were active during the flight that the area is known for. Now lets look at the crash from the day before over in taiwan. And here is the flight pattern again, and this plane went down also in a period of time where theres no fighting going on around here, nothing like that, but there were heavy rains associated with a typhoon. This is the area were talking about right over here. We dont know the official reason for either crash yet but weather really does matter. If you look at this chart from boeing, the causes of Worldwide Air accidents from actual to 2012, this is bar over here represents the accidents in which the pilot lost control of the aircraft. And in many of these cases, one of the primary causes was severe weather. Brianna. What about the other side of this, tom . Aviation, safety analysts worldwide are on alert for possible missile strikes right now. Do investigators have to consider that right here . They will absolutely have to, whether or not there was possibly terrorism involved, they have to consider the possibility of some sort of equipment failure in an aging fleet. They have to look at inadequate training or perhaps distracted pilots, and so many other things. But in these circumstances it, weather for these twos crashes has to remain a strong suspect because statistically, it is one of the biggest reasons that planes go down. Brianna . Tom, thanks for explaining that. If the air al jerry night has met the worst, that would mean at least 462 people have died in major airliner tragedies in the past seven days. Is that a sign its less safe to fly or is this all just a terrible coincidence . Joining me is bob francis, the former vice chairman of the National Transportation safety board. He worked on the twa flight 800 crash investigation. Were looking, bob, at weather as a possibility here. But you know, i wonder, youve got weather. Youve also got two of these crashes happening in conflict zones. And it makes you wonder even just as a passenger who determines the flight plan . Who is making the call about exactly where the plane goes here . Well, i think that in both of these cases, until we see otherwise, that weather is a pretty good suspect. And then you get back to obviously, most directly the pilots and their responsibilities. But also, you go to the companies and are they dispatching aircraft into areas where there are known to be problems. Where theres known to be weather issues. Exactly. Also, we look at, for instance, taiwan where this crash yesterday happened. Obviously, there are issues over the malian desert. Are you surprised that there would be crashes when you have pilots and you have airlines that are experienced with there being weather problems in these areas . I guess im surprised, but im disappointed. Yeah. Because and its unfair to point at the pilots. My responsibility is more directed toward the companies and the people that are dispatching these airlines to even fly if they know that the conditions along the routes are going to be such as they are. Which is alarming because it perhaps is a more systemic problem which is what youre pointing to. We look at this past week or so, and it feels like a trend although i wonder if it really is. This is the deadliest year though in terms of commercial aviation since 2010. Is it just a coincidence . Is there something going on, or do you think theres sort of a pattern . I think its coincidence. I dont think its a pattern. I mean, the two today that are clearly weather related, i mean, that can happen in anytime. It just happened to have come about on the same day. And what about i think especially as a lot of people are traveling throughout the summer in the u. S. And they might be thinking im traveling domestically or internationally or im on a u. S. Carrier versus an International Carrier or a smaller International Carrier, is there a difference in safety records between these . There is a difference in safety records. Not talking specifically about those two airlines because i dont know that. But certainly the places they fly and the kinds of operations they do are less safe than flying from here to buffalo or wherever youre going. So i think flying with u. S. Carriers, flying in this country is as safe as you can get. All right. Bob francis. Thats pretty safe. That is pretty safe even though some people get scared obviously of flying, it is safer than driving. Bob francis, thanks so much for your time. Coming up, russia doubling up in ukraine. New evidence the u. S. Says it has that russia is planning to deliver more powerful missile launchers to rebels. 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Russian artillery guns. The state department making this announcement a short time ago. We have new evidence that the russians intend to deliver heavier and more powerful multiple rocket launchers to the forces in ukraine and have evidence that russia is firing artillery from within russia to attack Ukrainian Military positions. This despite repeated denials from russian president Vladimir Putin that russia has any involvement in the stirring up of the violence in ukraine or any connection to the shooting down of flight 17. I want to bring in our pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr. Does this alleged evidence suggest that russia is going to perhaps invade ukraine . Well, that, brianna, would be the most dire circumstance, wouldnt it . Right now what u. S. Officials say though is they dont know. Putin is building up the forces there and they have been monitoring these artillery firings for the last several days. U. S. Satellites, u. S. Radars in the region have been able to determine these artillery firings are taking place. You know, it would be the ultimate dire possibility if he went ahead invaded into ukraine. What they think at the moment though, sources are telling me is that putins Russian Forces are doing this at his orders to try and open up some maneuvering space, if you will, for the prorussian rebels. Those rebels have been pushed backing in recent days into smaller areas because the ukrainian forces, the Government Forces, are making progress. Putin doesnt want to see the Ukrainian Government forces make progress. He starts shelling to try and push those Government Forces back and open up more areas back to the rebels. But this is a hair trigger situation because at any minute, those Russian Forces could cross the border. The belief is they are completely under putins orders. Putins control right now and it is going to be up to him as to what happens next. Brianna . Its moment by moment. Thank you, Barbara Starr at the pentagon. Now, a week after malaysia Airlines Flight 17 crashed in Eastern Ukraine with wreckage spreading out for miles, the site is still not secured. Journalist and others are still walking around. Once investigators leave, taking photos like this one. Australias Prime Minister tony abbott says he has sent ept 509 Australian Police to london so they can help lockdown the crash site. He says he realizes the rebelcontrolled area could be dangerous but that he has Vladimir Putins support. I absolutely accept that there is potential for difficulty, but president putin has said all the right things. He wanted to see as a father himself grieving families given closure. And this is incredible. Investigators on site have discovered a huge new piece of wreckage. Joining me now from ukraine to talk about this is the spokesman for the organization for security and cooperation in europe which is the group thats monitoring the crash scene. First off, michael, can you tell us about this new piece of wreckage, where it was found and if it gives any more clues . Thanks, brianna. Good to be with you. So yes, today was pretty much day seven for us. We were out today with the malaysians, their third day here and the australians, their first day here. We covered a very, very large piece of territory today. And then closer to the end of the day, we went into this vet heavily wooded area and it was a jaw dropping experience. We found this big piece of fuselage and i think brianna, the best we to describe it, its basically intact for quite a few meters of what most people would recognize as part of a commercial airliner in the sense that the windows are still intact. If you wanted to, you could almost go inside and you would be covered. So and the odd thing that struck us too is that there was no real broken trees or branches. It just appeared there. It was extraordinary. In addition to that, we documented today with our malaysian and australian friends quite a few big, big pieces of jagged fuselage. And sadly, as well, for the second day in a row, we did find scene signs of human remains yet again today. Oh, and you mentioned, michael, your australian friends. So who is there from australia at this point as we know that many australians are really waiting to kind of come if at this point. It strikes so many people as unfathomable that the perimeter here isnt secure yet. Yeah. I think the best way to put it almost is baby steps. I mean when we came here on day one, we had three representatives from the Ukrainian Government from their service and then we had the dutch briefly here, the malaysians for three days and today the australians arrived, three of them. I think two or three moral are coming tomorrow. And brianna, just to give you a sense to your listeners of the very, very complex situation in here it, not too long ago, we had eight colleagues here held in captivity for a month. And when that will happened, it really already limited our ability to go out. Beat had new security protocols. But when the crash happened, quick talks happened with the rebels here and a route or a channel if you will, was opened to the crash area. It was very difficult at the beginning. I wont say it was easy. But then if today or yesterday were an example, we had lots of time to explore and we covered a lot of territory. So that was very, very helpful. New evidence today you said of remains that had not been identified or really seen before, located before. Will those be transported soon . Well, are our job here is to report to establish the facts and report and definitely we reported that tonight. We located the Geographic Area it was in. We documented photographically and the time really has come for experts for far, far better place than we are to come here and either collect that or go further with that investigation. Of course, once again, big concerns here about the security situation. But we do view this as an achievement that four different groups have come in by now. It is certainly something, be but theres so much frustration that it hasnt gone beyond that even at this point. Michael, thank you so much. Really appreciate you being with us. And coming up next, armed men kidnapped him just outside of his hotel and he, would for cnn. One of our own being held by prorussian separatists. Now a public request to those rebels to let him go. Plus, a horrific scene in gaza as a school used as a u. N. Shelter for women and children is hit. Both israel and hamas knew it was there. How did this happen . [announcer] word is getting out. Purina dog chow light healthy is a deliciously tender and crunchy kibble blend. 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When we pulled up, there were a number of heavily armed prorussian militants outside this hotel. When we got out of our vehicle, they started looking at us very intensely. I noticed a man in civilian klose was with them. He had a photo of the journalist were talking about anton skiba. Within moments, they had moved in on him, taken him into custody and taken him away. That was two days ago. We havent seen him since. What did they accuse anton skiba of doing . Well, during that detention process, if you like, we tried to talk to the men and engage them. And they made a number of accusations against them him. They told us he was allegedly dangerous. They used the word terrorist. They told really quite an extraordinary story saying he had been making postings on social networking sites offering rewards, financial rewards for the deaths for killing prorussian separatists. These are the allegations that have been made against him. As you mentioned, we only worked with him for 24 hours but he has worked with another a number of other Media Outlets here in donetsk covering the civil conflict here. There are a lot of journalists here very much worried about his safety and his wellbeing and indeed, human rights groups, journalist protection groups, even the u. S. State department issued statements calling for his release. Tell us, phil, what cnn has been doing to try to get him released in conjunction with these other entities. Well, in the interests of transparency, the reason were reporting this now is because for the last two days we have tried to engage the leadership of the prorussian groups here, the socalled donetsk peoples republic. Explain our concern and desire to have him released, the fact we see him as a fellow journalist and so forth. We have tried diplomacy, if you like. It hasnt worked. We received a very brief phone call from him yesterday. It was very short. We have reason to suspect that it was perhaps made under duress. And so because of the failure, if you like, of that softer approach, we are now reporting this publicly. And we are now calling publicly for his release. Brianna . We will continue to do so. Phil black, thank you. Coming up next, women, children and u. N. Workers reportedly killed in a strike on a shelter in gaza. Now both israel and hamas are pointing the finger at each other, but the u. N. Is making one thing clear, israel knew civilians were staying there. Its a complete checkup of the services your vehicle needs. So prepare your car for any road trip by taking it to an expert ford technician. Because no matter your destination good maintenance helps you save at the pump. Get our multipoint inspection with a Synthetic Blend Oil change, tire rotation, Brake Inspection and more for 29. 95 or less. Get a complete vehicle checkup only at your ford dealer. Purina dog chow light healthy is a deliciously tender and crunchy kibble blend. With 20 fewer calories than purina dog chow. Is purina dog chow light healthy. Stress, fkids, now what . Lets build a new, smarter bed using the dualair chambers to sense your movement, heartbeat, breathing. Introducing the sleep number bed with sleepiqtm technology. It tracks your sleep and tells you how to adjust for a good, better and an awesome night. The difference . Try adjusting up or down. Youll know cuz sleep iq™ tells you. Only at a sleep number store, mattresses with sleepiq start at just 999. 98. Know better sleep with sleep number. Welcome back to the lead. Im brianna keelner for jake tapper. Before it was a u. N. Shelter, it was a school. Now its one more scene of human suffering in the israelipalestinian conflict. The fog of war is thick in gaza right now. Its still unclear which side is responsible for this nightmare, but that same u. N. Spokesman says both hamas and the Israeli Military knew exactly where their school was. Heres what we can confirm. Innocent lives were lost. Scores were injured. And this conflict is still nowhere near over. I want to bringing in far han hawk, the Deputy Spokesman for the u. N. Secretarygeneral. Far han, thanks so much for being with us. And part of the issue with this is we cant really tell who is responsible at this point. Its actually the idf has said various actions may have caused this attack and a misfired rocket is one possibility that its investigating. This is actually a tweet that theyve put out implicating hamas. They said hamas fired from a populated area near a u. N. Shelter and prevented civilians from evacuating after we sent warnings. What are you hearing on where the responsibility lies here . Yes, brianna. Were still trying to get details as you can imagine and, of course, we also have to deal with the large number of dead and wounded inside the school. What is clear is that our schools, our facilities of the u. N. Relief and works agency, unra are clearly marked. Weve given out the coordinates for those schools. This case, this was one of those that is sheltering Palestinian Refugees from are the fighting in gaza. Right now theres more than 140,000 refugees or you know, people displaced by the conflict in gaza who have taken refuge in our schools more than 80 of the unra schools are being used for these purposes. Weve made clear where those schools are, and the fact that there are civilians in them. So they shouldnt have been attacked by anyone. If there was any military activity, there shouldnt have been any military activity near those schools either. But whether or not there was activity nearby would not excuse anyone firing at the schools. Weve been very worried about the safety of these facilities. The secretarygeneral ban kimoon warned the Security Council just two days ago about his worries that our facilities could be struck and now here we are two days later and this is a horrible attack and well need to find out who did this and what happened. Do you know apparently, israel is saying that hamas has been basically hiding among civilians that they hide among the innocent in this case. Do you know if that happened with this shelter . At this stage, we have no reason to believe that the shelter had anything other than civilians. The people from the relief and, would agency have tried to make sure that their areas are kept free of any type of militant activity. Of course, we would still need to get more details. But regardless of what was happening in and around the area, the bottom line remains, that school should never have been hit. And you can see a reason why. The casualties are overwhelmingly going to be civilians who were just seeking shelter, seeking a safe area. Sure. In the midst of conflict. Farhan, speaking to that concern, twice the u. N. Had asked for the unwra had asked for ive passage to get these people out of this shelter those requests were denied by the Israeli Military. Like i said, were trying to get details about how it was that these requests were not granted. I dont know the the precise reasons why we were not able to evacuate people. But yes, the relief and, would agency was trying to evacuate people. Well have to see what went wrong and this is something were trying to determine. Now, in this case, it sounds like u. N. Staffers were not among those who were killed. I dont know, you can tell us if they were among those who were injured in this case. But certainly u. N. Staffers have been killed during this conflict. What can you do to protect your own people there to help out the gazans in this conflict . Yes, youre right. That staff of the relief and, would agency have been killed. Three of the women who are School Teachers for the relief and, would agency have been killed in recent days. Two of them killed among family members while they were at hair their homes, one person killed basically walking to her home on her way home from her work. And so these are people who have been devoting their time to the extremely risky task of trying to protect a large number of displaced civilians. And they themselves have been put in harms way. Ultimately, the only thing that will guarantee their protection is the only thing that will guarantee the protection of the people of gaza as a whole, which is a halt to the fighting. This is why ban kimoon, the secretarygeneral remains in the region trying to work with different parties to obtain support for a ceasefire that can go into effect as soon as possible. And indeed, he is meeting i believe just in the recent hour with secretary of state john kerry in cairo on this matter. Now, the shuttle diplomacy is extraordinary as we watch this all unfold. I want to ask you about this is obviously not the only shelter that unwra is providing to gazans. It is a big chunk of the population, i think about 5 that is seeking refuge in these shelters. Should gazans and those who are watching feel that they are safe in other shelters or are there plays where they can go . U. N. Premises. Anywhere around the world, are meant to be safe from all attack, safe from militant activity, safe from being any site where weapons will be stored. Those are part and parcel of the up munities the u. N. Premises have. And that is meant to be respected by all sides. If that is respected by all sides, then yes, people will be safe. But if it isnt, thats a huge problem and its a huge violation of our ability to protect innocent people. Whoever is responsible, i think ban kimoon said it is appalling. Thats something a lot of people certainly connect with. Farhan, thanks for being. Farhan haq with ban kimoon, the u. N. Secretarygeneral. Now come cog up next, russia apparently not too happy about being linked to the shooting down of flight 17, now blaming the western media for making assumptions without any facts. Plus thieves through the wreckage in the hours and days after the crash. Now what they found is being used to victimize the passengers again. [announcer] word is getting out. Purina dog chow light healthy is a deliciously tender and crunchy kibble blend. With 20 fewer calories than purina dog chow. Isnt it time you discovered the lighter side of dog chow. Purina dog chow light healthy. [ male announcer ] if you cant stand the heat, get off the test track. Get the mercedesbenz youve been burning for at the summer event, going on now at your authorized mercedesbenz dealer. But hurry, offers end july 31st. Share your summer moments in your mercedesbenz with us. Offers end july 31st. Moderate to severe is tough, but ive managed. 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[ doorbell rings, dog barks ] oh, thats what blows your mind the advanced technology of a doorbell. [ male announcer ] tweet an expert and schedule a callback from any device. Introducing the xfinity my account app. Im Brianna Keilar in today for jake tapper. Its been nearly a week since flight 17 went down. U. S. Intelligence points the finger at russianbacked rebels using a russian provided Missile System to shoot it out of the sky. When the global consensus blames your government for the deaths of 298 innocent people, what do you do . Blame the media. The minister for Foreign Affairs saying theres no evidence who brought down the flight yet and that all the whispers about russia can be traced to the western medias irresponsible tweeting we have the allegations, you know, speculations you know, basically the media making its own conclusions without any facts. That concrete proof could come soon with flight 17s black boxes being analyzed in the uk. In the meantime, what, if anything, can the u. S. And europe do to hold russia accountable . Joining me now to talk about this, republican senator from new hampshire, kelly ayotte. Thanks for being with us. Ed goo to be with you. As you look at this, how do you think that the u. S. And europe can hold putin accountable . Well, first of all, i never continue to be amazed by the brazenness of Vladimir Putin with trying to blame the media, trying to blame everyone except for himself and russia for what happened to flight 17. And what we can doing is issue tougher economic sanctions against russia. Sectoral sanctions that will be much more hard hitting against their economy, sector, energy sector, also thinking about their financial sector, much tougher than weve imposed. Europeans need to step up to the plate and join the United States of america and need to give support to the Ukrainian Military to defend themselves against russian aggression. If youre talking about targeting the defense and energy sector, weve seen some targeted sanctions unilaterally from the u. S. , you have the eu talking about travel bans and asset freezes. Is that really enough . Totally inefficient. In fact, it is time for europe to step up. Think about the europeans that were murdered on flight 17. This was obviously just horrific what happened to those individuals. Its been directly connected to the russian backed separatists. The responsibility for this really does lie with Vladimir Putin. Its time for the europeans to can an knowledge this and to step up and to really take tougher actions against russia. It really seems in a way doubtful i guess. Were hearing even from one of our loan colleagues. Senator john mccain had this to say. The europeans are not going to do anythinging if anybody believes that, i have some beachfront property for them in arizona. Arizona is land locked, not a lot of beaches there. If you have you can kind of see it from europes point of view. They are so dependent on russian energy. How do you say to how do you appeal to europe and say, this needs to be done even if youre going to be taking certainly an economic hit and a political hit to get this done . Well, certainly to protect freedom, you have to be willing to sacrifice. Also with europe, we also need to i think have a longer term strategy with energy. The legislation ive supported would open up our natural gas resources, have to come up to europe with a plan for Energy Independence from russia. Weve got to look at the energy issue longterm. Europe cant allow russia to be involved in the way they have been in ukraine. There are grave implications for europes security. I want to get your reaction to something that happened today. Hillary clinton during an interview said that the reset with russia, which obviously she shepherded during her time as secretary of state said it worked. She distanced herself from the president s recent struggles with russia and emphasized successes in the first term of the Obama Administration and didnt mention the second term. Do you think theres been a difference in how the administration has dealt with russia from the first term to the second . Actually, no, there were lots of concessions made early on when secretary clinton was in office. And if your goal was to allow russia to expand its territory or dismember its neighbors, then you can define reset as a success. But the reality of the facts are that reset has been a huge failure. What we have seen is not only the invasion of ukraine and the illegal annexation of crimea and what weve seen in eastern condition ukraine. They have given arms to the assad regime to murder tats own people, they have had gross Human Rights Violations in their country. Think about them banning adoptions for children that need parents be the to our country. What concessions do you feel should not have been made that contributed to this problem . One of the first concessions was not to build the Missile Defense sites in poland and the cech republic. On other agreements weve made concessions. For example, i know that secretary clinton cited the new s. T. A. R. T. Treaty as some kind of success. If you look at that, we made many. More concessions. Russian made few if any concessions in terms of reducing its armament. There are arguments russia is violating the imf treaty. Thanks so much for being with us, snorkelly ayotte from new hampshire. Good to be with you. Coming up next, victims families already struggling with their grief and unknowns. They now have to worry about thieves using their loved ones credit cards. How looters could be making a tragic situation even worse. When folks think about what they get from alaska, they think salmon and energy. But the energy bp produces up here creates Something Else as well jobs all over america. 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Expedia. Find yours. train horn vo wherever our trains go, the economy comes to life. Norfolk southern. One line, infinite possibilities. Could help your business didavoid hours of delaynd test caused by slow internet from the phone company . Thats enough time to record a memo. Idea for sales giveaway. Return a call. Sign a contract. Pick a tie. Take a break with mr. Duck. Practice up for the business trip. Fly to florida. Win an award. Close a deal. Hire an intern. And still have time to spare. Check your speed. See how fast your internet can be. Switch now and add voice and tv for 34. 90. Comcast business. Built for business. \s welcome back to the lead. They are the innocents. Innocent victims of a civil war and now were learning that the passengers aboard flight 17 are at risk of becoming victims of identity fraud. Our Business Correspondent cristinaa oh lesh shi is here with the details listen to this. Yesterday on the lead, i spoke to shane hadding, the brotherinlaw of cameron diel, a father of two killed when the plane was shot out of the sky in ukraine. Shane told me camerons credit card accounts had to be shut down out of fear they may have fallen into the hands of looters. I mean, getting his credit cards, you know, destroyed because people are abusing it in the ukraine, i mean, that is just unfathomable. It is unfathomable. I mean its horrible to think about this. How widespread is this threat . It certainly couldnt have happened in a worse part of the world. This area is known for having hackers and the scene is littered with personal belong g belongings and information. Its a criminals gold mine. At the end of the day, we spoke to a cybersecurity expert, brian krebs, hes the cybersecurity guy who actually uncovered the target hack. He said that he hasnt really seen any of these credit card numbers pop up on the black market yet but remember, that doesnt mean that its not possible down the line. Sometimes these hackers wait and these thieves wait to put those credit cards online. At the end of the day, we did have the interior advisor to the interior ministry in ukraine say that these people are death hunters and that the families should cancel the credit cards and then we had the dutch and the British Bankers Association today of yesterday actually acknowledging that there is potential for fraud and telling people that the Bankers Association would cover any losses for the victims. So these thieves are presumably stealing the credit cards and then selling just selling the information, right . To buyers . They could be selling the information. They could also be using the information themselves. Remember, when we will this is an area thats particularly sensitive and not great. If you actually look last year, there were four russian nationals and run ukrainian that were charged with running one of the largest credit card hacking schemes in history. About 160,000 cards hacked. These included infiltrating some of the biggest Computer Systems of the Biggest Companies out there from yet blue to jc penny. Obviously these families wont be held liable, right. You would expect there would be protections when it comes to credit cards, certainly. Most Credit Card Companies have some sort of fraud protection. That really depends on the country that the card is issued in. And it comes down to the particular bank and the kind of contracts the bank has with the Credit Card Processing Companies as well as with the customers so its really country specific. Earlier today, i called mastercard. They said when it comes to the netherlands and the uk, those customers, their card holders have zero liability when it comes to fraud. Thats Just One Company foo real quick before we let you go, it sounded like shane was saying some of camerons credit cards may have already been used. But youve heard of none yet being used . What we dont know exactly is what he said yesterday in the interview was abused. And we dont exactly note what that means. But we, what, we know is that perhaps they were taken into somebody elses possession. Cristinaa alesci, thank you so much. Im Brianna Keilar. I turn you over to off wolf blitzer live from jerusalem in the situation room. Happening now, a situation room special report. Breaking news, shelter carnage. A Deadly Strike on a United Nations schoolhousing Refugee Families in gaza. Women and children are among the dead and injured. Flight ban lifted. The faa clears u. S. Airlines to resume flying to tel aviv even as a cnn correspondent witnessed continuing streaks through the sky. The largest pieces found so far of flight 17 as the u. S. Says it has proof russia is firing across the border into ukraine. We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. Im wolf blitzer in jerusalem. Youre in the situation room
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