Transcripts For CNNW Starting Point 20120228

demeet truce newlen. we're learning much more about him today. he attended the lake academy alternative school, a school dedicated to serving at risk students. his facebook page on december 30th concluded with a post that said this. die, all of you. one witness to the shooting says that lane's face was basically expressionless when he opened fire and all the horror, of course, was caught on the emergency dispatch. >> attention, chardon rescue. we have an active shooter at the high school. active gunshots at the high school. chardon, we have three students down in the cafeteria at this time. we still don't know where the shooter is. also, there is a fourth one down in room 200. >> t.j. lane would ultimately be chased from the school by a teacher. and then arrested less than half a mile away near his own car. all of this unfolding in a small town, roughly 30 miles east of cleveland. at chardon high school, classes were canceled today. the flags will be lowered across the state. let's get this morning to mike dewine, going to start us off, ohio attorney general. also joining our panelist, will cain is here with us this morning and mark lamont hill and jennifer rogers is here from reuters. appreciate it. thanks for being with us, mr. attorney general. start off the latest on the investigation. what can we expect today? >> well, i don't think you're going to get any surprises. the young man who has been -- will be charged today will appear in court. the investigation continues to try to find out exactly why he did this, but, you know, while i think it's important to point out is that chardon high school did a fabulous job. they had a plan in place. they executed the plan. everyone did exactly what they should do. chardon police and all the other departments, the sheriff's department, everyone responded and did it correctly. you know, horrible, horrible, horrible tragedy. our investigators and the attorney general's office were there very quickly. we were doing the crime scene. our investigators from what we call an ohio bci and processing the crime scene. it's just so sad to think that you have a high school that's a crime scene. >> you know, it's amazing really when you think of the lessons learned from columbine, which is a story you know well and i covered as a reporter, to think that all this many years later that schools really did a good job by all accounts of immediately sort of clamping down, locking down and teachers were getting tremendous credit today for helping rescue and even save some of these students. there is, we're told, videotape, surveillance videotape of this young man, t.j. lake, opening fire basically -- lane, excuse me, lane, opening fire in the cafeteria. have you or your investigators seen this videotape and can you tell me what it describes? >> well, the investigators have seen it. i know it does exist. you know, i don't want to comment much beyond that. we are dealing in this case with a juvenile. court proceedings have to take place. but, you know, what has been reported in the press is pretty much accurate about that. >> okay. so we know as you mentioned, there's a crime scene certainly at the school. i know investigators as well were at the young man's home. apparently being raised by his grandparents. his parents weren't really in the picture. we know that both of this parents had arrest for domestic violence. his brother served time in jail, i believe his father as well. what will the investigation involve in terms of his youth and background as far as his family? >> well, i think any time you have a tragedy like this, one of the things you want to find out is if there were any warning signs, if there was anything that, you know, we need to know about this young man. that would include questioning his friends, questioning his family members, exactly what you would think very good police work in trying to talk to anybody who has any knowledge about him. doesn't bring the people back who died. these students who died who were injured, but it's part of the investigation, part of what we simply have to do to try to figure this out. sometimes there are things in life you never can quite figure out. >> can i ask you a question? >> why someone does this, very difficult to tell. >> let me ask you if this is going to be part of your investigation. we know that all of these students were at the cafeteria that morning and one of the things that was not unusual about t.j. lane coming, even though he attended a different school, is it seems that all of the buses met at the one high school and someone off to vocational school, some stayed that the high school, and some of the buses went to this alternative school for kids who were clearly having some kind of a rough time. is this going to be an area of your investigation, you know, sort of having all of those populations together, could that be just inherently some kind of a problem? >> well, i suppose it could be, but i doubt that. you know, we'll find out what the facts are. but i don't think there was anything wrong with the protocol that the school was following. this is standard procedure in many schools, where you have basically a bus transit area or transportation area. so there's nothing that i see in that that is alarming or would indicate that something was done wrong. >> before i let you go i want do ask you a last question. we know that the hearing is set for 3:30 this afternoon. what happens in that hearing? how does that go? >> well, typically, you know, this is a initial hearing in regard to possible bond or in regard to, you know, what happens at this point. we would assume -- i have not talked to the prosecuting attorney, david joyce, yet but what we would assume is this case would be at some point bound over. and he would be tried in all likelihood as an adult. >> obviously gun laws has been your issue. what are you doing on that front, sir? >> well, again, we have a task force that we have been working on in the attorney general's office to look at repeat offenders who use guns. but in his case, it simply does not apply. there's no indication that -- he's only 17. there's no indication he's a habitual offender. so what we have been looking at which deals with, you majority of crime in this country is because caused by people who have had crime in the past. this may not be true, noond predictors we would hope to see to be able to tell what he's going to do in the future. >> all of these cases you try to figure out what happened, what was really ultimately behind it. mike dewine is the ohio attorney general. thank you for joining us. so interesting. i covered columbine. it's just one of those cases that months and even years in the columbine's case, or decades, actually go by, you start to really piece to the what exactly happened. but from what we know, this young man had a really troubled background. family history was kind of a mess. just a disaster that -- but what led to the immediate act is really unknown that the point. >> beyond just incredible sadness that's involved in this story, would guest there are going to be two things we're going to wonder about in the future. facebook page hinted at possible trouble, posts you head. we're all going to be asking questions and wonder in the future, how much do you monitor facebook page. what can facebook page provide insight. >> and twitter, too. he was tweeting things. >> social media, it's interesting when you compare it to columbine and how long ago it was and now just what it was like yesterday. not just at the school but for the whole country as well. it will be interesting to see if there can be lessons land because as mike dewine pointed out, lessons in the school and the school did a good job. >> you wonder, right, because of course there was no twitter in columbine and no lessons learned for how you monitor social media and take those necessarily eri s serious seriously. will you put up his facebook page? you may not be able to read it from a distance. he was thauking agent this quaint and lonely town sits a man with a frown. no job. no family. no crown. i mean -- his luck had run out. >> these are warning signs. even before their t. there were social media, social interaction where kids are sending outcries for help. oftentimes these cries for help are linked to bullying. that's something we have to pay attention to, not only the kids who cry out for help. they say this kid was being picked on for his hair and clothes. that's something that we have come to accept as everyday school life, and it's not. >> that's what i was asking about the dropoff points, the bus taking kids going to the vocational school and kids going to the school for troubled kids, and the main school. you have to wonder if you have kids who are already sort of struggling does it makes a lot of sense, would they stick out inherently, already you have this issue. i wonder if that could add to problems or not. >> one other element, soledad, in this story, this part about the teacher is amazing. >> who had -- >> frank hall who chased the kid out of the school. i mean, what an amazing -- apparently from the facts we know, what an amazing act. >> that kid -- that guy is a hero. we'll learn lots more about him in the days to come. let's get right to alina cho with the other headlines. >> hey there, soledad. the u.n. human rights counsel is meeting today to talk about syria's government and crimes against humanity. 41 people reportedly killed across syria just this morning. syrian's government continues the latest round of shelling attacks. british journalist wounded in the same shelling attack that killed american journalist marie colvin is now reportedly safe in lebanon after being smuggled out of syria. another wound eed french report is refusing to leave. nick robinson is live in beirut with the latest. good morning to you. >> good morning there. we do understand from the activists now to help get toing to ree colvin, took several days. three activists were killed in the operation just to bring him to safety. what the activists are saying is that the other three journalist, the french journalist who is very badly wounded in her thigh bone, she and the other two are still in baba amma field hospital in homs. this is what the activists tell us that they believe at this time and, of course, they're very, very concerned about how they're going to get these other journalists out at this time. we also understand these journalists have so far refused to get help from the syrian red crescent who went in last night. part of the red cross team to try and get them out because they don't want the syrian authorities to take away all their evidence of what's been happening in homs. they say they refuse to leave. the other three at the moment as far as we know still in that neighborhood of homs. >> all right. nic robertson, thank you for the update. turning now to our cnn in-depth this week focusing on gas prices. national average rising another two cents, to $3.7 2k a gallon according to aaa. the average price of course inching closer and closer to that $4 mark. rising oil prices due to tensions with iran are pushing gas prices up here in the united states. and the cost of gas, up more than 12% since the beginning of the year. voting under way, michigan right now, it is gop primary day there and in arizona. and what happens today could set the tone for super tuesday next week when voters in ten states go to the polls. the most recent polls show that mitt romney and rick santorum in a virtual tie in michigan. romney's home state. just a couple of minutes soledad will talk toen fer jennifer granholm and say why it could backfire for the gop, big time. two police officers are recovering from injuries after a protest rally turned violent in sacramento. officials say a white supremacist group called the south africa project clashed at the capital with counter protesters. many of them from the occupy oakland movement. one of the injured officers was reportedly hurt by a tear gas canister. a united airlines plane made a belly flop on the runway at newark international airport in new jersey. the pilot was forced to make an emergency landing when the pilot's front landing gear collapsed. 71 people on board including an infant had to slide out on the emergency chutes. nobody was hurt. for the first time in the history of the daytona 500, a winner crossed the finish line on a tuesday. matt kenseth took the checkered dpl flag just before 1:00 a.m. eastern. the race was marred by ten cautions and a terrifying crash that caused a two-hour delay. there you see the beginning of it there. juan pablo montoya slammed into a track drying truck. that triggered a violent explosion. montoya shockingly is okay. he said the crash was caused by some kind of malfunction with his car. >> moving, moving, traveling. it just felt really strange. as i was talking to the radio car just turned right. >> i didn't think about the truck. i'm hitting the jet. it's not going to be fun. >> he looks incredible. the race was originally scheduled for sunday afternoon but rain postponed it twice. then, of course, there was the crash and ten cautions. the green flag finally dropped after 7:00 p.m. last night. 36 hours later, soledad. >> you know, if you can do a press conference after your big fiery crash, it's all good. it's all good. thank you. appreciate it. still ahead this morning on "starting point," the former michigan governor, democrat jennifer granholm is going to join us and tell us why she thinks today's x factor will be the auto bailout and mitt romney's lack of support for it. gordon gecko's change of heart saying greed isn't good after michael douglas is helping the fbi. here's jen's play list this morning. we judge harshly here, by the way. dolly parton "9:00 to 5:00." more like "2:30 to 5:00." 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[ female announcer ] discover what's next in your life. get this free travel bag when you join at aarp.org/jointoday. ♪ yeah. >> i love luther vandross. i love my mom but i love luther vandross. >> i completely agree. this is luther vandross starting us off this block. it's all over my ipad. voting is under way in the straight of michigan. mitt romney's home state, of course. he won four years ago against john mccain. now the polls are showing him neck and neck with rick santorum. one point behind, according to american research group. there are 30 delegates at stake in the state of michigan. i spoke to jennifer granholm, former democratic governor and host tv show called "the war room with jennifer granholm." why do you think mitt romney is facing such a tough battle in what's considered to be his home state? >> romney supported a bailout for wall street and not for the auto industry in his home state when his father ran an auto company was as though he pierced us when we were on our knees. and so i think that has a lot to do with the fact that he's not doing well. in addition to all of the, you know, flip-flopping and pretzel spin that he's been doing about why he took that position. >> let's talk a little bit about michigan, in fact, and the voter population there. i know obviously the voters in detroit are different than the voters who are in the suburbs who are even different than the voters from the exurbs. tell me about them. >> if i held up my michigan map, upper and lower peninsula, you know, in the detroit area right here, the detroit area is largely democratic. but, you go up the i-75 corridor that's flint, that's detroit, that's saginaw, that's where romney is going to do well because the republicans in those places are more economic conservative. but if you go to the west of the state and the north, then you would see that it's much more of a social conservative. so you're going to see a split, i think. michigan's primary will be divid divided. the delegates will be divided by congressional districts. so even if mitt romney wins the number of votes cast, actually rick santorum could come away with more delegates and more congressional districts. the west and north, i think, play to his favor. >> jobs are on the line. every republican candidate turned their back, even said "let detroit go bankrupt." not him. >> don't bet against the american auto industry. >> do you think that there is not as much leverage in that ad? when you look at the poll and you reference this a little bit before, something like only 42% of people in the state of michigan support i'd ted the ba. even now looking back saying that it was successful. is that a problem? >> actually of all voters, it's -- it's very popular. but among republicans, which is, of course, what we care about tomorrow or today, the bailout was a challenge. none the less, people here understand that it worked. and the thought that mitt romney would say, let detroit go bankrupt in a "new york times" op-ed is really so utterly -- such an example of pandering to a national audience when he comes from detroit. and then when he comes back to detroit and he says, i love the american car, i've got all these cars and not only that, my wife has two cadillacs. i've got every automaker covered because i've got one from each of the big three. it's not so much about his wealth but that he appears to be trying to make up for something that everybody knows he opposed. so i do think that the president -- it all bodes well for the president in a general election. i think that michigan, unlike in other years where it was swing state, i think michigan will be solid blue in november because it worked and michigan's economy is back on track. >> how much of a role could gas prices have? here's what rick santorum said about president obama talking about gas prices? >> we now have $4 a gallon gasoline. some are suggesting it's going to be $5 and maybe more this year. why? because the president is doing nothing toal lay t al to allay the world to replace the oil that is tenuous right now in the middle east. >> even people who admit that the white house doesn't directly control the price of gasoline at the pumps will say, hearing the president over the weekend talk about while it's not really his fault, about the gas prices, isn't going far enough. do you think it's a mistake for him to take that position? >> i mean, it is the truth. i mean, the gas prices are up. let's be very clear about it, because of the unrest in the middle east and speculators who are taking advantage of that. truly, to blame the president for gas prices, i've said earlier, is like blaming rudy giuliani for 9/11. it's ridiculous. however, people who are putting money into their gas tanks want something done. and who else do you blame but whoever is in charge. the reality -- and the president out there explaining this. even as he has opened up more oil and gas lease, even as there is more drilling off of the gulf, if you opened up every potential possibility for drilling, the u.s. energy information agency has said that it would only affect gas prices to the tune of three corrects per gallon. so newt gingrich and others who want to bring it down to $2.50 when this is a commodity that is traded on world markets is absolutely ridiculous. the president has to get out there and say that but he also has to say, i understand this hurts. >> jennifer granholm is the former governor of michigan and the current tv host of "the war room." thanks for your time. appreciate it. >> you bet. we're going to have live coverage of the arizona and michigan primaries beginning at 6:00 p.m. eastern tonight. with a special edition of "john king usa" followed by live coverage of the results at 7:00 p.m. eastern. still ahead on "starting point," following breaking news, a second student has now died in that ohio school shooting. we're going to hear from chardon high school student who describes the shooter's silent rampage. rick santorum is urging democrats to vote against mitt romney in the primary. the romney campaign is calling it a new low. we're going to have will cain what he thinks. don't you wish. also we've got will cain's play list this morning. back to willie nelson. i love willie nelson, but, my gosh, don't you have anything else in your ipod? >> let it play for ten seconds. >> you only have six songs on your ipod. >> it's true. [ wind howling ] [ technician ] are you busy? management just sent over these new technical manuals. they need you to translate them into portuguese. by tomorrow. [ male announcer ] ducati knows it's better for xerox to manage their global publications. so they can focus on building amazing bikes. with xerox, you're ready for real business. forty years ago, he wasn't looking for financial advice. back then he had something more important to do. he wasn't focused on his future. but fortunately, somebody else was. at usaa we provide retirement planning for our military, veterans and their families. now more than ever, it's important to get financial advice from people who share your military values. for our free usaa retirement guide, call 877-242-usaa. ♪ that wakes you up a little nicki minaj in the morning. i have no comment on things she's done. but musically, i like her. big primary day in michigan and arizona. romney and santorum kind of in a dead heat if you look at the margin of error in the polling. primary, all registered voters can cast ballots. rick santorum has been sending out robocalls which are not in and of themselves unusual but he's going to democrats to ask democrats to support him against mitt romney. here's how it goes. >> on tuesday, join democrats who are going to send a loud message to massachusetts' mitt romney by vote for rick santorum for president. this call is supported by hardworking democratic men and women and paid for by rick santorum for president. >> so, of course, mitt romney no surprise is calling it a new low. >> he's right. he's absolutely right. >> is there a backlash on it? if you're going into republican requirement and you get a robocall that says this is paid for by hardworking democrats supporting rick santorum, doesn't that sound kind of mixed messages? >> backlash will last one day and one day only and that day would be today because if anything it's an admission of unelectability. >> exactly. >> admission that, democrats, if you want to win, you want rick santorum to be barack obama's opponent, you might still betemit romney but your odds are better. but if that effects santorum today? what is that? no, we want to win this election. they go vote for mitt romney. but tomorrow and a week from now this will be long forgotten. and if rick santorum wins michigan, we'll never talk about this again. >> i think romney has been good at beating his opponents and picking on his opponents when he finds weak spots. if i was romney i would beat this like a drum. >> the democrats for rick santorum who is supposed to be a real true conservative. >> you take that wager. you say we'll do this and hopefully win michigan and this gets drowned out. if he loses, maybe you're right, mitt romney can pound this home. >> that's the one thing i would agree with, michigan is that high stakes. if you want to take a risk like this, take it in michigan. this could be a back breaker in mitt romney. if you lose this, the narrative of him unwinding and he could lose out. >> i get why he's doing it but why is he doing it? why not just let the democrats do it for him. there was already talk out there that people were going to be doing it. >> sticking his name on it. >> why go out there and say this is paid for by rick santorum. >> you can be that reagan democrat model, that i am the blue collar republican, i'm the blue collar politician, rick santorum, i'm here for you auto workers. it didn't say vote for me because i'm less electable. he is trying to play blue collar here. maybe reagan democrat. >> let's send a message to mitt romney. >> let's continue this conversation through the commercial break but i like the way everybody is getting hot and bothered about it. still ahead on "starting point," breaking news that we have to get to this morning. a second student has now died in that ohio school shooting. we're going to hear from another student, nate mueller, a bullet grazed his ear in the attack. he knew the suspect, t.j. lane, close friends with one of the victims. also, greed apparently not good. gordon grekko is helping the februarys get guys like him. you might remember her as claire huxtable. you're watching "starting point." we're going to take a short break. active naturals wheat formulas restore strength for up to 90% less breakage in three washes. for strong, healthy hair with life, new aveeno nourish+ strengthen. with determination. courage. and all the points i earned with my citi thankyou card. 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to androgeloffer.com and you could pay as little as ten dollars a month for androgel 1.62%. what are you waiting for? this is big news. welcome back. breaking news to tell you about this morning. a second victim has died in the ohio school shooting. now, according to the count medical examiner russell king jr. died at the metro health medical center where he was being treated for gunshot wounds. danny parmertor were also killed in the attack. three other students hurt, joy rickers, nick walczak and demetrius hewlin. t.j. lane is expected in court this afternoon. and classes for the roughly 1150 students at that school have been canceled today. flags will be lowered across the state. school shooting a nightmare for anyone but certainly for anybody who is in a position of leadership at a school. principal steve perry is a cnn educator. he is a contributor as well and founder of capital pep magnet school. he joins our panel from hartford. usually we're talking about education policy. i have to imagine though when you see that unfolding you have to think about your school. >> rocks me to my core to think about one of my kids who i welcome every day coming in and hurting some of my other kids, to the point where it kills them. it's a frightening thing that, honestly, can't be stopped, but can be -- the folks in chardon did an amazing job of making sure the rest of the children were safe. >> there was a young man i was talking to, nick mueller, one of the things he was telling me was sort of the description of the shooter. it's honestly, almost like a cliche, you know, expressionless, didn't really say anything. here's what he said. >> tell me a little bit about him. >> he was a quiet kid in the past three years. but back in middle school he was always really nice and funny. and he was like one of us, one of the guys. and he was a normal kid, and well all liked him. >> you know, that's something i think you hear every time you have a tragedy like this. some version of that. so what do you do as a principal to monitor and try to watch the kids while also making sure that, you know, you're educating them, which is your first priority? >> well, actually, one of the things that we do is we have a pretty large what we call affective side of the house, social workers and other people who are there to help children. in addition to that we've designed the school in such a way so that every single child as an adviser. this is someone who communicates on a fairly regular basis with the child on a daily basis and the home on a biweekly basis. more important than that we go on facebook. many of the things that we see happen in the school have a root or have in some way go through facebook. our kids are pretty unfiltered on the internet. fortunately, unfortunately. so we find out a lot about what they're dealing with through those various avenues. >> okay. so let me show you a little bit of t.j. lane's facebook post. i think it was right from the end of december and it's kind of bizarre. in a quaint lonely town sitss a man with a frown, no job, no family, no crown. his luck had run out. lost and alone. he longed for one r om one thing, the world to bow another his feet. feel teeth, not just mocking you. not just stalking you but inside of you. die, all of you. would you say, listen, we now know what student x is saying and it's bizarre? >> absolutely. one of the things that happened to us not long ago is a child posted something and his mom found it. and she contacted the child's adviser, meaning each teachers a an a. responsibility as adviser and teacher. by 8:00 a.m. that morning that child was in a facility receiving the support he needed because children are often far more expressive than we give them credit. we just don't listen. they're all about the symptom. if you look at the children, some of them are withdrawn, some of them are disengaged. some of them become volatile towards their parents. these are sure signs of a child who is doing something or grappling with something bigger than them. parents, you have to look at the signs. again, i don't want to say that this parent or these parents had anything to do with this horrible tragedy. sometimes, as i said earlier, someone just goes to fo far and we're here. in the meantime, there are some signs that you can look for to monitor what's going on inside your home. and then within the school we have to design schools so that we can engage the children where they are. too often we leave children to feel like they're isolated. that's where this starts to fester, when children feel like they're isolate sdpld we're going to talk to the next hour about really heroic acts, i thought, by some of the teachers in this school and we bring steve perry back to talk to us. other headlines making news. alina that has for us. >> good morning. incredible video from a deadly crash on the interstate. so fiery it actually melted pavement. a tanker truck crashing and bursting into a fireball. it happened on i-94 in wisconsin, killing the driver. police say the tanker was hauling about 7500 gallons of fuel when it crossed the median and crashed. the accident closed both directions of the highway for hours. the bodies of two senior u.s. officers who were killed friday inside afghanistan's interior ministry have come home. the caskets of air force lieutenant general and army major arrived at dover air force base in delaware yesterday. they were gunned down in retaliation for that koran burning at a u.s. base. a french fishing boat now telling the cruise ship carrying 1,000 people including 8 americans had been stranded in the pirate infested waters offer the indian ocean after an engine room fire on the italian costa allegra cruise line yesterday. they were trapped in the dark because the ship's power shut down. everyone is safe. minding your business this morning. gordon gekko now saying greed not good. michael douglas who played gekko is now helping the feds tackle fraud and h made this psa for the fbi. >> hello, i'm michael douglas. in the movie "wall street" i played morgan gekko, cheated while innocent investors lost their savings. the movie was fiction but the problem is real. our economy is increasingly dependent on the success and the integrity of the financial markets. if a deal looks too good to be true, it probably is. the fbi also announced that in the past fiscal year 241 corporate criminals were convicted and it secured $2.4 billion in restitution for victims. all beautiful beaches and sunny weather apparently making life brighter for hawaiians. a new gal lum well-being poll shows it's the happiest place to live because hawaiians are less stressed and depressed than people living in other parts of the united states. they report better eating and exercise habits which helps boost their mind. that's a really big surprise. >> yeah. guess what, if i lived in hawaii, i would be happy, too. >> new york, by the way, hey, new york, you would think at the bottom of the list. not so. >> no. >> in the middle. west virginia has that distinction. >> i would think we would be higher up. you're here because you love it. someone break into "new york new york for me." thank you. still ahead on "starting point," we told you about the bodies of two men, both fathers returning home from afghanistan. they were killed by an afghan who was trained by the u.s. this morning we'll talk to the representative adam smith who has held a hearing on insider attacks. then, of course, who could forget her. claire huxtable,fy lish shah rashad is up next. playing out with usher. all energy development comes with some risk, but proven technologies allow natural gas producers to supply affordable, cleaner energy, while protecting our environment. across america, these technologies protect air - by monitoring air quality and reducing emissions... ...protect water - through conservation and self-contained recycling systems... ... and protect land - by reducing our footprint and respecting wildlife. america's natural gas... domestic, abundant, clean energy to power our lives... that's smarter power today. have 46 grams of whole grains... mmmm. ...and a touch of sweetness. you'll be delighted to discover how good they taste. get your free sample of quaker oatmeal squares on facebook. fy lish shah rashad maybe famous around the world on "the cosby show" which ran until 1992. she's a star of the stage as well. in 2004 she was the first african-american actress to win the best actress tony award for her performance in "a raisin in the sun." now she's in tyler perry's film called "good deeds." this wednesday and thursday on new york public radio she's going to play in a radio adaptation of "their eyes were watching god." one of my very favorites. 75th anniversary of that publication. it's such an interesting idea, a radio adaptation of that. it's a book that was written in the mid to latest '30s. do you think it's still relevant today? >> it's good literature. good literature is always relevant, isn't it? >> i know the right answer is yes. yes, it is. i was a english lit major. i should be able to answer that. it's such a great, great story. >> isn't it? >> yeah. >> when you read it did you feel that thaw could see everything that you were reading? >> yeah, because she was a beautiful writer. until alice walker brought her back you never thought about that book much at all. >> she was a -- she was very descriptive. very good at that. >> do you, when you are in tyler perry's new movie "good deeds," it really is, i think it's kind of about race and class to some degree. is that something that's interesting to you sort of outside the realm of art and literature? are you thinking about it today and it's politics basically today? >> race and class, race and class. race to class. >> it's a little bit -- changing from race and class from race to class. maybe we will learn something. >> good point though. this is a spiral that just keeps going on. it means that there's no end game out of that one so i'm not going to go in there. >> all right. i like someone who is going to dodge my question but tell me. >> right. >> respectfully, i'm dodging your question. >> i'm not dodging your question. i'm really answering your question. you asked me was it of interest to me. >> it's not. >> no, no, no. it's interesting -- what's interesting to me is how humanity creates this maze for itself, is how we continue to create this foggy thought in which we see ourselves separate from each other. this is amazing to me. after how many millions of years in existence on the planet? after how many great vi civilizations have come and gone? how many inventions, how many discoveries and yet we continue to do the same. >> i feel like i'm being chided. and you asked that question. >> what question did you ask? >> let me ask you this question. when you see s and n did a send-up, did you see this? >> i saw it. >> it was so cute. let's play a little bit of it first. it first. >> ♪ >> that's mya rudolph playing you. >> oh, my god. >> there are people who said, i think it was carl rove who said this is what paved the way for the obama presidency. >> did he say that? >> i believe so. >> he said so many things. i'd rather not listen to it. i think that "saturday night live" did what it does. it made good sport of everything. whereas people will get a chuckle and a laugh out of it. having spent years with mr. cosby my mind goes another way. i think, you're marginalizing too many things. you're marginalizing the president's level of intelligence and preparation and his ability to hold office and to govern. >> so cosby show was not directly responsible for the president taking office? >> why would you give american people the credit that he deserves, that we are intelligent people and can cast a good vote? why not call it like it really is. >> i like it. this is a feasty interview. it's so nice to have you. as you know over the years we've done a lot of interviews. i'm a huge, huge fans, i'm he going to go see "good deed." we appreciate it. i think she slapped me on my hand. >> no. no. >> yes, i did. still ahead this morning on "starting point," stopping insider attacks by afghan forces who have been trained by the united states. the issue has been highlighted. stay with us. we're back in a moment. your finances can't manage themselves. but that doesn't mean they won't try. bring all your finances together with the help of the one person who can. a certified financial planner professional. cfp. let's make a plan. bodies of two americans killed in afghanistan are back home this morning, victims of backlash for the burning of korans. we've seen the protests in afghanistan intensify this week. military insists that u.s. and afghan relations are not in crisis even in spite of these pictures that you're seeing. let's get to democratic congressman adam smith from washington. he's a ranking democrat on the armed services committee. thanks very much for being with us. >> thanks for having me on. >> what was your take away from these hearings where you were trying to figure out the best way to eliminate the threat of attacks from some of the troops that are being trained by the united states? >> well, certainly we need to do more in terms of screening, who comes into the afghan national security forces, who contracts for them, make sure that we have some background. second, we need to identify problems sooner. people who look like it have a potential conflict and remove them from the situation. even if you do all of that, this is a very, very difficult situation. it's a volatile country and it is a problem to have almost 100,000 u.s. troops in that country fighting in a war. these conflicts are difficult. i think it points up the necessity of as soon as possible turning over authority for governance to the afghan people and pulling our troops out. it's a very hostile situation and there is no way to completely solve this kind of problem. >> here's what jay carney said during a white house press conference. listen. >> it is important to remember that 95 to 97% of the missions the u.s. forces embark on in afghanistan, they do so with their afghan partners. we're talking about thousands and thousands of operations that proceed successfully with afghan partners. >> so you talk a little bit about how one important role is vetting everybody ahead of time, but what's the role of understanding culture, do you think, and is that done as well as it could be done? >> well, it's important. it's something we've worked on, particularly in the last two or three years, trying to -- i've been to training centers in our military bases here in the u.s. that train specifically for that. look, there's a limitation. it is a vastly, vastly different culture. our service men and women do an amazing job of understanding it, of working with the local afghan people, of understanding what their concerns are. there's no way to perfectly do that. we're talking about two vastly different cultures. and, again, i think it points up the need overall to get us to the point where we can get our troops out of that country and turn over responsibility to the afghan people. >> but how often -- >> it's a very different and difficult place. >> when there are attacks, there's something like 42, how often are those attacks based on some kind of taliban infiltration and how often is it almost like a personal conflict? >> well, according to the military, it's more the latter than the former. more often it is a conflict between the afghan and the u.s. forces that arises out of some of the cultural stuff, a whole bunch of different things. sometimes it's taliban infiltration. more often it's the conflict you talk about. as i've said, those things are difficult to avoid. look, the president has put us on a realistic path here. the goal in afghanistan and pakistan is to stop al qaeda and the taliban to be in a position to threaten us. the president has aggressively prosecuted that war, taken out bin laden, senior members of al qae qaeda, pushed the taliban back. he's been as aggressive as he needs to be. at some point responsibility has to be turned over to the afghan people. it's critically important that we move in that direction, we give them the greater responsibility and begin to draw down our forces. >> congressman adam smith is a democrat from the state of washington. it's nice to see you, sir. thank you for being with us. >> thank you. >> "starting point" continues. in our next hour we're back in a moment. americans believe they should be in charge of their own future. how they'll live tomorrow. for more than 116 years, ameriprise financial has worked for their clients' futures. helping millions of americans retire on their terms. when they want. where they want. doing what they want. ameriprise. the strength of a leader in retirement planning. the heart of 10,000 advisors working with you one-to-one. together for your future. ♪ good morning. welcome back, everybody. our starting moint this morning is breaking news. a second student has died after yesterday's ohio high school shooting. we're learning more about the accused shooter and his dead, silent rampage. also, a fight for michigan and arizona underway. the polls are open. the race is tight. rick santorum is now asking democrats to help him out. he's trying to make mitt romney the loser in his home state. the pennsylvania judge, we talked about this yesterday, there was a big debate over wlornt a guy had a right to wear a zombie muhammad costume. the guy who was the victim, alleged victim, eventually sort of got a tongue lashing by the judge. >> had a right free of assault. >> yes. yeah. a very -- we'll sit down and talk to the judge about that case because there was some sense that he didn't have a really good insight into the first amendment. talk about that. "starting point" begins right "starting point" begins right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com zwroo well come back, everybody. let's talk about the second victim who has now died in the ohio school shooting. according to the county medical examiner russell king jr. died at the metro health medical center where he was being treated. danny parmertor who was killed. there are three other students who are hurt. it all started, of course, when t.j. lane opened fire at his high school yesterday. one witness to the shooting says that lane's face was expressionless when he opened fire and, of course, all the horror was caught on emergency dispatch. >> chardon rescue, we have an active shooter at the high school. chardon, we have three students down in the cafeteria at this time. we still don't know where the shooter is. also there's a fourth one down in room 200. >> t.j. lane, the alleged shooter, was chased from the school by a teacher and then arrested less than a half a mile away near his car. all of it unfolding in a small town 30 miles east of cleveland. ted rollins is live in char df on. what's happening? >> no school here again at chardon. people reacting, of course, to the news that another student has died. there are still two more students that are in guarded, critical, serious condition. one other student hospitalized in stable condition. so clearly this community, very small community, classic suburb outside of cleveland. they're dealing with the grief and the questions of what could have forced t.j. lane to do this. he's described by students that knew him as a kid that was sort of part of the gang as a young elementary middle school student but then started to be more reclusive as a high school student. in the last few years. he had a difficult childhood. according to court records his mother and father both in trouble with the law. his father doing prison time for domestic violence. he has a brother in and out of jail. how that factored in, who knows. he will make his first court appearance about 3:00 local time. >> give me an update on the community, how people are doing there? >> there was a candlelight vigil here last night. a lot of people showed up. obviously these people are in shock. you talk about the parents that took their children to school yesterday morning and within an hour they get a text message to come back and get their child and that there has been a shooting in school. it just, as any parent, you stop and think about it, just imagine your child, their whole life ahead of them either dead or fighting for their life. this community is really rallying around those families here this morning and will in the days to come. >> ted rollins for us with an update on what's happening there. thank you, ted. appreciate it. let's get to craig scott. he was a student at columbine high school when that school shooting happened on april 20th, 1999. 13 people were killed on that day, including craig's sister rachael. thank you for being with us. not only was your sister killed, your friends were killed. you survived the columbine school shooting. what was your reaction when you heard about this school shooting? does it take you right back to that day? >> you know, it just makes me feel for that community. i have -- it takes me back a little bit to that day, but i hear a lot of stories because i travel and speak in schools and meet with so many students and hear a lot of sometimes sad stories about things that students are going through, things that students do and so i'm just so sad for their community right now. >> i heard that you speak to 3 million students a year as you go to assemblies, the largest assemblies across the nation every single year. so if you could talk to the students at chardon high school who aren't even in class today obviously, what would you tell them? >> you know, i would share with them that, you know, how important it is how you treat one another. that was a big lesson i learned after the columbine shooting and that there really -- they really are one family in that school and one of the biggest messages that i give to schools is that kindness and compassion makes such a big difference and how you treat people, the little things that you do, the things that you say. i think that those are actually the biggest anecdotes to anger and hatred. i think a lot of the students that go on these shootings are disconnected and feel isolated and alone and i think that being bullied or feeling alone is never an excuse to shoot someone, take someone's life, but at the same time i want people to reach out to students that are on the outside, that are having a hard time. >> you say that that compassion lesson was learned because the last conversation you had with your sister rachael before she died was a fight, you guys fought, and then she was killed in the shootings. how long did it take you, you know, before you felt like you were on a path to recovery after that school shooting? i mean, how long will it take these students before it feels like normal, if it ever gets to that again? >> you know, it will take time. it took, you know, for the school to really feel a sense of normalcy again, it took, you know, over a year to two years. for my family, you know, getting through the loss of rachael and going through that grieving time, that took longer. and i do think that right now with the community, it's very important for them to come together to focus on the right things to be there for each other. yes, in the schools i do focus on compassion. i share my sister's story with our program, and we know that just by sharing her story, and she was a person that kind of reached out to people that were on the outside, and sharing some powerful lessons behind the columbine shooting, we know of school shootings that have been prevented and sooiuicides that e been presented. with what's happening right now in ohio, the best thing that they can do is just be there for one another. tell each other right now how much you appreciate, care about, love one another. it's really important. >> there are many people who point to columbine as a lesson, as really what chardon was able to do. they executed on a plan that ultimately came out of what happened at columbine. is that in any way a silver lining out of a horrifically terrible store ji? schools know how to go into lockdown, they know how to spring into action. there was not that chaos that surrounded what happened in columbine. >> that is -- that's a great -- that shows how far schools have come, that they were able to respond so quickly. i think a lot of schools are at that place, too. now what we need to continue to focus on is the culture of school and for it to be a place where there's not just teaching of head knowledge but there's character and students know what it means to really be in relation to one another, how to treat one another. i think that's a big source -- a big problem source in schools today is that focus on, you know, what it means to be a person of character. and t.j., you know, who did this shooting, you know, there's really no excuse for it. i know that a lot of people are going to say, you know, try to figure out why did he do this, and i feel for any student that feels on the outside or feels bullied or feels picked on. it's not good enough anymore for me to hear, well, he was picked on so he killed, you know, other people. usually people that had nothing to do with his pain. >> yeah. we're going to learn a lot more obviously about the alleged shooter. he goes to court as you know today. craig scott is a survivor of the columbine school shooting but he lost his sister and many friends. thank you for talking with us, craig. we appreciate it. >> thank you. there are some other stories making headlines. alina cho has a look at them. >> soledad, new this morning a british journalist escapes syria. paul conroy was wounded in the same shelling attack that killed american journalist marie colvin. he was reportedly smuggled into lebanon. french reporter edith bouvier who was injured in the same attack was injured. she's refusing to leave. they want to know that it will not confiscate photographs or recordings. the government is stepping up its shelling attacks this morning. at least 41 people have reportedly been killed just today. our cnn in depth this week focusing on gas prices. the national average rising another two cents to $3.72 a gallon. that's according to aaa. the average price inching closer to that $4 mark. rising oil prices due to tensions with iran are pushing gas prices up here in the u.s. the cost of gas, up more than 12% since the start of the year. we'll have much more on your gas prices later this hour from cnn senior business correspondent, ali velshi. stay tuned for that. it's primary day. voting underway in michigan and arizona now. what happens today could set the tone for super tuesday next week. the most recent polls showing mitt romney and rick santorum in a virtual tie in michigan. romney's home state. the santorum campaign has been robo calling democratic voters in michigan asking them to come out and vote against romney. romney is calling that a dirty trick. and an alarming health study to tell you about. people who take prescription sleeping pills, even in small numbers, may be nearly four times more likely to die earlier than those who don't take them. that's the conclusion of a new study in the british medical journal. researchers also report people using ambien, lunesta, sonota are also more likely to be diagnosed with cancer. almost 10% were prescribed sleeping pills in 2010. >> wow. why that connection or that correlation? is it that people who are not sleeping have all kinds of other medical issues, that's the connection? >> it's interesting. the cancer issue -- >> dr. cho, come on. yeah, it's very interesting. thank you for that update. we'll keep looking into that story. still ahead on "starting point," we'll talk to congressman peter king about afghanistan's future and whether he thinks the united states can still trust the forces that it's been training. plus, passing the time in prison with music. inmates in federal prison now allowed mp3 players and access to a music library that's probably bigger than any of ours. we'll leave you with tim mcgraw. no more willie nelson. 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[whoosh, clang] you need lifelock, the only identity theft protection company that now monitors bank accounts for takeover fraud. lifelock: relentlessly protecting your identity. call 1-800-lifelock or go to lifelock.com today. the bodies of two senior u.s. military officers killed inside of afghanistan's military made it home last night. their alleged killer is a junior officer in the ministry's department. meantime, anti-american demonstrations have lessened. look at these pictures. military is insisting that u.s. and afghan relations are not in crisis. republican congressman peter king of new york. he's chairman of the homeland security committee. when you see pictures like that and then people say, it's not in crisis, can we show that videotape one more time. it may not be crisis, but it looks pretty bad. how would you assess it, sir? >> i don't know if we'd call it crisis. it certainly is a turning point. i have supported the mission in afghanistan. i believe it's important to our national security that the taliban not be allowed to re-establish a base in afghanistan. having said that, if we cannot control or the afghans cannot control their own military officers, if our top military people have to be at risk inside the interior ministry, then we have to re-assess our position there. as far as the demonstrations in the streets, it's partly encouraged by the taliban, partly from provok ka turs from pakistan. the fact is that it's important i think for our government to make it clear to president karzai that we're not going to tolerate this. if this does continue we're going to have to re-assess our entire mission there. soledad, i don't think it was right for the president to apologize the way he did. it was giving credence that somehow the accidental burning of a koran or the mistaken burning of a koran somehow could justify any type of response like this by the afghan people. all that our soldiers have done as far as building hospitals and schools. >> why do you think an apology gives credence to the demonstrations as opposed to creden credence, listen, it was inadvertent. it was not intentional? >> because if it rises to the level of a president of the united states, we feel the president of the united states has to go out and apologize for something that our military did as a mistake, that to me somehow equates all of the good that our military has done. this could have been done by a senior military officer in our military to theirs. it gave it importance. we were acknowledging it had importance which i don't believe it should. we can't continue to accede to people's feelings. burning the koran was wrong. the tremendous work and good that our troops have done, that should have been emphasized by the president. if he was going to make the apology, it should have been done by more of a senior military official on our side ornate tow side. >> less about the o apology and more that it came from the president. >> yes. >> i want to play a little bit of what newt gingrich said. he's on the campaign trail obviously. here's what he said about what's happening in afghanistan. >> we're not going to fix afghanistan. it's not possible. these are people who have spent several thousand years hating foreigners. what we've done by staying is become the new foreigners. the karzai government is playing us for fools. >> first, do you think that's true? and, secondly, do you think that that is helpful? >> i don't think what newt gingrich as a republican is saying is helpful at all. the fact is it should be the position of the republican party that we do not want the tally bab to re-establish a base in afghanistan. i don't think we will ever rebuild or make a new afghanistan. what we can provide is structure which can keep the taliban under control or away from positions of power. i don't think anyone's expecting aev a jeffersonian government. if we can have inches be city tugss in place, reasonable military, reasonable governmental structures, that's what we're looking for. i think that the surge from general petraeus carried out and which is being continued by general allen, i think that can provide a semblance of stability. that's what we can hope for. if it doesn't work, then we have to make a decision. if newt gingrich, again, this to me is typical of newt gingrich. when things go bad, newt can always jump in and throw gasoline on the fire. it serves no national security purpose whatsoever. >> all right. let me play for you, guys, do we have this, this is the robo call that's been going out from rick santorum's folks to democrats. listen. >> on tuesday join democrats who are going to send a loud message to massachusetts mitt romney by voting for rick santorum for president. this call is supported by hard working democratic men and women and paid for by rick santorum for president. what do you make of that? >> you know, it's not unprecedented. john mccain did that in 2000. >> if you were advising rick santorum, what would you advise him? good, bad, it's net nothing? >> i think it might work. the reason i say that is i think rick santorum does have a certain appeal to working class catholics, many of whom are registered democrats. it can have a marginal impact. so i think it's more plus than minus for rick santorum. and in a close race that one and two extra points could make the difference. >> what happens? let's say if tonight mitt romney does not win the state of michigan, give me the landscape from there on. >> yeah. from my perspective if romney does not win michigan, it creates real problems for his candidacy. i think you will start seeing more activity among the republican establishment, whatever that is, talking to people like chris christie, jeb bush, paul ryan, mitch daniels. if mitt romney has not been able to break loose at all, can't win michigan, it raises real problems. rick santorum has had a lot of negatives over the last week. if he is still able to win michigan, that shows a real problem that mitt romney has. >> so it sounds like you're saying, because i know you're not going out on a limb to say it shows a real problem for his campaign clearly. so does that mean moving into scripting that list you gave. do you think one of those guys goes on to become the candidate? >> i don't know if they will right away. i think they'll be getting lined up, recruited. they'll try to get one of them to agree to make the run, let's say, if super tuesday doesn't turn out better for romney. there will be more of an interest and emphasis on having someone ready on super tuesday if mitt romney does not manage to break loose and to have that candidate come in. again, i have no inside knowledge. just whispering and mumbling here. again, among top republicans who are concerned that governor romney has not been able to break loose. the longer this goes on and his weaknesses show, the stronger president obama becomes. >> i want to talk about that whispering and mumbling sir. listen, you need to come and hang out with us on the set. we'd love to panel with you. >> thank you, soledad. >> my pleasure. thank you for being with us. still ahead this morning on "starting point," we're going to tell you about some new details in that 2008 murder of jennifer hudson's brother, mother, and nephew. hear about the moment that hudson knew something was terribly, terribly wrong. we'll were you date you on that story. plus the economics of gasoline. what is driving gas prices? ali velshi will join us. we leave you with jen's play list. white snake. "here i go again." ♪ on my own ♪ going down the only road i've ever known ♪ ♪ like a drifter, i was born to walk alone ♪ hite snake. walk alone ♪ alk alone ♪ ♪ i like that you know gees. sugar land on me last time. >> easy. who's with him? >> jay-z. >> jay-z. how can you lose with that at 8:27 in the morning. let's talk gas prices going in depth on it this morning. they're spiking. the national average rising another two cents to $3.72. that's according to aaa. the national average prices have been going up for 21 days straight, but why? let's get right to cnn's senior business correspondent ali velshi. some of the spike is because oil prices have gone up and the gas prices haven't caught up. people have talked also about iran and speculation and fear and others have said it is the fault of the white house. what is it? >> probably with the exception of the last one it's all of the above. i brought my prop, will cain. behind will cain, my prob, my oil barrel which shows the price of oil selling at $108.56 yesterday. four months ago, five months ago the beginning of october oil was 80 bucks a gallon. $79.20 exactly. this week $108.56. that's an increase of 40%. now go back to october 1st. gasoline was $3.40 a gallon. it's now $3.70 a gallon, roughly that's an increase of 10%. if gas had done what oil had done, and most of the price of a gallon of gasoline comes from the oil that goes into it, that's the most expensive part, gas would be at $4.76 right now. >> are you saying we're going to get to $4.76. >> it's entirely possible. that's the part to worry about. the second part is what fuels it. you said, speculation. there are two kinds of speculators, there are the companies like airlines that use the oil, they hedge against the increase in price by buying lots of it. there are people who buy it, jen, for profit. they'll never take the oil but they think it's going up because iran, which supplies 2 million barrels a day. >> uncertainty sort of gives them the edge. >> right. growing world. why would you bet that oil was going anywhere but higher? and that's the issue. so, remember, we like speculators when they make our house prices go up so we can sell them. that's because that's an asset we live with. we don't live with our tanks of gas. we burn them up. yeah, it's all of the above. people are betting the price is going up. >> since it's so heavily correlated i personally believe to how the election could go, what do you think it looks -- is it possible to bring the price of gas down by any party? >> no. not in the short term. in the long term it is. >> okay. >> in the long term it is. we had news that transcanada pipe lines, the group that was going to build the keystone xl pipeline is going ahead with part of that extension. they're resubmitting their plan. that's a long-term solution. anybody who says they have a short-term solution to gas is lying. >> but they're going to pretend they do. they'll say they should release the strategic oil reserves. >> no effect. >> you know. >> it does not have an effect. the one thing that could derail this economic recovery, which is real, for all the deniers out there, economic recovery is real, this is the thing. when you pay more for gas, you pay more for for something that you got last week. >> i am going to call you with all my financial questions. >> hit it out of the park. >> as always. >> did you like my prop, will cain? my texan. >> will cain is often my prop as well. >> oil barrel. >> all right. thank you,ally, appreciate it. still ahead on "starting point." now a second student is reported dead in that ohio school shooting. we'll be joined again by dr. steve perry. talk about how the school responded. they're getting high remarks from what they were able to do in the immediate aftermath of the shooting. we'll talked about what's been learned since the shooting at columbine. also, passing time in prison with music. inmates are allowed mp3 players and have access to a music library that's pretty terrific. plus out with last year's kaths, in with the new cast of "dancing with the stars." it's been announced. we'll tell you that. we'll tell you who's on the show, kirsy alley apparently. you're watching "starting point." we're back in a moment. 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[ male announcer ] it's a network of possibilities -- helping you do what you do... even better. ♪ welcome back, everybody. breaking news this morning. a second victim has now died in the ohio school shooting. according to the county medical examiner russell king jr. died at the metro health medical center where he was being treated for gunshot wounds. danny parmertor was killed. three other students have been hurt. i talked to a student, nate bueler, who described for me t.j. lane's rampage. >> his first shot made me look. his second shot i watched him take which hit somebody behind me. and his third shot hit me as i was turning away. his face was expressionless. it was -- i can't even explain it. it looked like he was on a mission and he knew that he was about to do it. >> t.j. lane is expected in court this afternoon. the classes for the roughly 1150 students are canceled at school today and flags are going to be lowered across the state. the school shooting a nightmare for anybody. for anybody who's involved in the education of students it is particularly terrifying. principal steve perry is a cnn education contributor. he's also the founder of capital prep magnet school. he joins our panel from hartford, connecticut. one of the things i found remarkable about the story, really, it was part of the heroic part of the story was response by the teachers. following the twitter accounts and the students, they said that some of the teachers, particularly two, literally ran out of the classrooms and chased down the alleged shooter. >> these teachers are heroes of the highest order. who knows how many more lives they saved because of their heroism. it's a real challenge. if you can just imagine, you're at school with children and another child comes in with a gun and begins shooting, there's nothing that we are equipped for. there's nothing that we think about that equips us to prepare for that, and they did an amazing job. my hat goes off to them. >> one of the teachers apparently grabbed a bullet proof vest out of his classroom, put it on, and then ran out and chased down. that was the word we were getting last night. >> he had a bullet proof vest. >> i do not know. this is the word we were getting from some of the students and bystanders that we were talking to. so, steve, what kind of training do you get? what kind of training do you give your teachers? because obviously you have conversations about the potential for this possibly happening. so what do you advise them to do? >> well, we -- i don't know about a training. there isn't a full-on training. we do have conversations about it and there is a procedure, just like so many other procedures from homework on out. this is what you do when this happened happens. i just had a conversation with our staff this morning going through, reminding them again when it's code red, this is what you have to do. you have to move the children away from the doors, put them in the center of the room where they can't be seen, drop down the shades. make sure you do what you can o to keep the children safe and do not move. do not move until there's an all clear. >> earlier we were talking to a young man who was a survivor of the columbine shooting, he lost his sister and a couple of friends. his take away was trying to remind everybody to treat each other kindly. he said his last conversation with his sister was a fight. they had an argument and then she was dead before the day was out. here's a little bit of what this young man, nate mueller, had to say about the alleged shooter. >> i heard two teachers, one, mr. hall, who had chased the student out, and i know for a fact our teacher, mr. ritchie, had already been prepared with a bullet proof vest in his classroom, which he had put on and dragged anything walzack into his room while also getting other students into the room as well. but i think everybody knew what they had to get done and did it as fast as they could. >> tell me a little bit about him. >> he was a quiet kid in the past like three years. back in middle school he was always really nice and funny. he was like one of us, one of the guys. he was a normal kid. and we all liked him. >> you know that, as you know, steve, is what you often hear in these kinds of cases. horrifying horrific tragedies. they seemed quiet, relatively nice. only later or even in court looking backwards do you start to recognize some warning signs. what do you look for in your students? >> well, one of the things you look for in regards to boys in particular is that they're withdrawn. boys can sometimes be quiet in middle and high school but withdrawn means that you just can't engage them. that's a telltale sign. another is in their writings. many of these children will on facebook and other social networks, they'll say some things that they may cloak in metaphor, but they are what they sound like. when a kid is talking about killing and dieing, you should do something. you should make sure that you reach out to that child. in our school we have an advisory system where every single child is assigned an advisor. that advisor has the responsibility of getting to know that child, will meet with them every single day, what other schools call home ri we call advisory. so it's structured so that we can engaming those children. for girls it's the same thing. not so much withdrawn, their writing. communication they have with one another. and how they communicate to their friends. children typically tell you. we have to listen to the kids. the kids tell us what's going on if we're just willing to listen. >> steve perry joining us this morning with a perspective as a principal at a school in hartford. west hartford, connecticut. thank you for your update. appreciate it. >> alina has the other headlines. >> soledad, a french fishing boat now towing a cruise ship carrying a thousand people including eight americans. it had been stranded in the pirate infested ocean. the coast stay allegra cruise liner. they were trapped in the dark because the ship's power shut down. everybody is okay. new details emerging this morning in the 2008 murders of jennifer hudson's mother, brother, and nephew. prosecutors say hudson contacted her mother every day but when she sent a text message on the morning of october 24th, 2008, she never got a response and that's when she knew something was wrong. suspect william balfor goes on trial next month for the murders. not clear yet if hudson will be called to testify. a united airlines plain made a belly flop on the runway of newark airport in new jersey. they made an emergency landing. 70 people were on board including an infant had to slide out on those emergency chutes. nobody was herd. consumer reports is listing its top cars. the exis l; 460 l is the top. chevy corvette, hyundai genesis sedan and toyota camry xlev 6. the vehicles with the lowest scores on the consumer reports road test. that would be the jeep wrangler unlimited and jeep liberty. scores reflect how well a vehicle performs in areas like braking, acceleration, fuel economy, comfort and cargo space. jams for jail birds. a new program providing prisoners with mp3 players. eligible inmates will soon be able to buy them from their prison commissary. then they'll be able to download from more than one million songs in a music library at the jail. the catalog does not include any songs deemed explicit or obscene, probably a good idea. federal officials say the program is aimed at helping inmates deal with stress and boredom in a safe way. critics fear they could use those as bargaining chips. abc has revealed the new cast of "dancing with the stars." trying to inherit the crown from j.r. martin knees. a few of those joining the show is sherry shepherd. steve itchingle actor, jalil white. gladys knight, gavin degraw, and extra host maria demunez. i think sherry shepard on will do well. >> gladys knight. she probably knows more moves than anybody else there. i put my money on her. still ahead on "starting point," free speech fight. a pennsylvania judge who said a guy didn't have a right to wear a zombie mohammed costume. plus the jesus discovery. in this season of lent the authors who say they may have the earliest proof of christianity. we'll go back to will and his play list. "jenny, don't be hasty." ♪ s was how my day began. a little bird told me about a band... ♪ an old man shared some fish stories... ♪ oooh, my turn. ♪ she was in paris, but we talked for hours... everyone else buzzed about the band. there's a wireless mind inside all of us. so, where to next? ♪ wait, let me do your introduction first. really major religious discovery is being unveiled today. its results of an archaeological discovery back in 2010. they made a discovery in a sealed previously unexcavated tomb in jerusalem. they claim it will revolutionize the understanding of jesus, his earliest followers and the birth of christianity. the new book is called "the jesus discovery." you have brought in what you have found. these are what's called bone boxes. explain what those are to me. >> we call them oshuwaries. stone could have fins. they're for the bones of the deceased. they were used in jerusalem for around the time of jesus. >> these are replicas. >> yes. those are actually sealed still today in the tomb. >> it's still underground. >> let's talk a little bit about this. back originally you were in this finding which you called the jesus family tomb which was believed to be the burial place of jesus's family. and now you are able not very far from there, 200 feet away, to get a robotic camera in to make a major discovery. first, tell me what the discovery is and then we'll talk about why the robotic camera. >> the discovery are these two. the one on the left, you can see a fish. it looks like a whale like fish and the stick figure coming out. if you remember your bible store rirks image of jonah. >> being thrown up literally by the whale. >> exactly. >> the reason it's significant, it's in the new testament. jesus says my resurrection will be like jonah. a jonah has never been found on any jewish art of the period. these are jews, but they're jews who are probably proclaiming jesus faith in his resurrection. >> this is 200 years earlier than any christian icon found in the catacombs of rome. this is the earliest christian icon ever found and next to it is a resurrection statement. the only resurrection statement ever found in an osuwary. >> you had to use a camera because, of course, the real ones are still underground. you had to get access through a camera. will you ever be able to -- >> under be a building. >> under a patio really. will you ever be able to bring them up and bring them to the world, the real thing, not the demos? >> right now these are museum quality replicas. they are going to be in a press conference at 11:00. they'll be on display there. >> they're beautiful. >> by an act of god the osuwaries happen to be in manhattan. >> nothing to do with us. they're here. >> the film of the discovery is going to be on discovery sometime this spring in the u.s. and vision in canada. >> it's an amazing story. i encourage everybody to read it. thank you for joining us this morning to talk about it. appreciate it. they're beautiful. still ahead this morning on "starting point", the judge who dismissed charges against a muslim who attacked a man wearing a zombie mohammed halloween costume is going to join us. is it free speech or offensive speech? you're watching "starting point." we're back in a moment. dad, why are you getting that? is there a prize in there? oh, there's a prize, all right. 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[ male announcer ] for a better-looking tomorrow. vicks nyquil cold & flu. the nighttime sniffling, sneezing, coughing, aching, fever, best sleep you ever got with a cold...medicine. ♪ follow up this morning to a story we first talked about yesterday. a man dressed as the zombie prophet mohammed. it was a halloween costume. he was wearing it during a parade in pennsylvania last year claimed that he was attacked by another man, a muslim, who was offended by the costume. it was all caught on tape. this is the tape. kind of tough to tell what's going on. the man who allegedly assaulted the guy in the parade was originally charged with harassment. the judge though ultimately dismissed the case and then that judge went on to say this according to the defendant's own recording of the trial. listen. >> i think our forefathers intended that we use the first amendment so that we can speak what's on our mind not to piss off other people's and cultures, which is what you did. i think you misinterpreted a couple of things, so before you start mocking somebody else's religion you might want to find out a little bit more. >> the judge, mark martin, joins us now. it's nice to have you, sir. thank you for being with us. he's a pennsylvania district judge. you talked about the first amendment right. ultimately it wasn't intended to be able to piss off other people from other cultures. clearly you have an understanding and background of muslims. you talked a lot about it when you were giving your decision. tell me why you felt like you had to explain things to the guy who was originally bringing the case. >> well, this gentleman had made a misstatement when i asked him why he dressed up as mohammed zombie. he seemed to have the idea that mohammed had -- after he died he rose from the dead, walked along the earth as a zombie and then a skended in heaven. to me that clearly is a misstatement, missunder standing of the facts so i tried applying some of my training, experience i've had as a member of the armed forces from 27 years worth of service, three deployments to the middle east, to try and bridge the understanding gap that he apparently had. my overall intent was try to reduce conflict between members of my community. >> jonathan turley, who is a legal scholar, he took exception with a couple of things. one, he was interested in knowing why the original charge wasn't assault. what happened was, of course, the gentleman who's muslim ended up trying to rip the sign off the guy in the parade and all of it sort of ended up in court. why was the original charge not assault, why was it just harassment? >> the -- those police officer's discretion. the definition of harassment in the pennsylvania crimes code is basically somebody with the intent to annoy, alarm, or harass another subject another to physical -- unwanted physical contact such as pushing, shoving, striking, kicking, things of that nature. the reason i dismissed that charge was because they failed to prove to me beyond a reasonable doubt that this offense had actually occurred the way that the alleged victim had described it. >> why didn't you give the first amendment lecture? i don't think because we have the recording, it didn't sound like you chewed them out. you sort of lectured him sternly about first amendment rights and you gave it to the guy who brought the case, not the gentleman who was watching the parade who tried to rip the sign off the guy who was dressed like the prophet mohammed. the costume was offensive, but isn't that his right as an american citizen, to dples any costume he wants? >> okay. first couple of things, we only know that the defendant attempted to rip the sign off based on the testimony by the alleged victim. i don't know what happened. >> okay. >> it was not proven to me beyond a reasonable doubt what happened. second, you're absolutely right. the alleged victim had absolutely a right to dress the way he did. now just because he can exercise his first amendment rights doesn't necessarily mean that he should. i think there is a limit to what our free speech consists of. with our first amendment rights comes a set of responsibilities to use those rights correctly. you wouldn't advocate ethnic intimidation which this is almost on the edge of becoming. i don't think anyone would accept any kind of ethnic intimidation. just because you can dress up in a white sheet and a hood doesn't mean you should. >> well, i'm sure that there's lots of issues raised when we talk about first amendment rights. we'll have to continue this conversation. judge mark martin, we appreciate your time explaining your point of view in this. thank you very much. >> thank you. our "end point" is up next. stay with us. ♪ ♪ and the sky is deep and blue ♪ ♪ won't you take me american flight 280 to miami is now ready for boarding. ♪ there with you fly without putting your life on pause. be yourself. nonstop. american airlines. the day starts with arthritis pain... a load of new listings... and two pills. after a morning of walk-ups, it's back to more pain, back to more pills. the evening showings bring more pain and more pills. sealing the deal... when, hang on... her doctor recommended aleve. it can relieve pain all day with fewer pills than tylenol. this is lois... who chose two aleve and fewer pills for a day free of pain. 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