the world. >> he loved art a lot. he loved paintings and water colors and even crayons. >> her explosive theory about conrad murray. >> here did a terrible thing. there might have been others involved. >> catherine jackson in an extraordinary hour. the interview starts now. tonight an extraordinary look at michael jackson's private through his artwork. he started drawing as a child and new revelations about the iconic singer. much is kept in a airport hangar in los angeles. joining me now in an interview is michael jackson's mother and friend. >> thank you. >> we are surrounded by this incredible art, most of which has never been seen which your son michael did. what i am struck by, i love this picture which is -- how old is he there? >> about 9 or 10 there. >> he is clutching his own work of hard. he painted that. i don't know what is more impressive. the art or the hat he is wearing. very stylish. clearly from an early age, he loved art. tell me about that side of michael. >> michael loved art a lot. he loved paintings and water colors and even the crayons. he would always draw. when he was even in school he would draw pictures and they took one of his drawings and put it on the front of the year book. >> was he self-taught? >> he taught himself. just a talent that he had. i can't say too much more about him, only his father was an artist too. he loved to paint and draw. i thought maybe he might have picked it up from him, but he had a natural talent for it, michael did. >> did he always paint throughout his life. was he always painting without being aware of it? >> yes, yes. when he was just a child, when we moved to havenhurst before we remodelled, it had a house in the back and he made that into an art studio for himself. >> what do you think the art brought him? painting. what did it give him? >> you know what, i really don't -- i can't answer that question, but sometimes when he's not doing anything, he would start painting and think that is a way of him relaxing. >> a bit of escape. >> yes. >> you got to know michael 25 years ago. tell me about how you met and about the art collection. it's something we don't know much about. >> we first met about 1979. through mayor bradley of los angeles. the first time that i had a chance to talk to michael, he said now you are a sculptor and said yes. what type of sculptor and i said i build monuments. i said i never met a monument builder before. i said what do you do, michael. he said i love life. he said i love life. i said that's a great job. i love life too. he said i'm an artist too and love to draw things that inspire my life. >> this collection, how many pieces are there in it? >> i have or we have 98. other people have some. there is maybe about 20 pieces i brought and he did artwork on the other side. i made the paper for michael in the 1980s, a special paper. they couldn't counterfeit it. he ran out of the paper. that's why i started doing artwork. >> some of the pieces here, the martin luther king picture, abraham lincoln and he painted a lot of former presidents. he loved to do that. >> he loved abraham lincoln and freedom and the whole aspect of people being free. artists being able to create beautiful things to inspire people like he wanted. >> katherine, he had a strange obsession with the number seven and with chairs. me why those two things in the pictures all the time. >> michael was a seventh child. his name had seven letters in it. he would always talk about that. the number seven means completeness in the bible. >> there is like a lucky number for him. >> for him. >> what about the chairs. why did he like draws or paining chairs? >> he an obsession with chairs. not a plain chair, but chairs that you see had a lot of art in it. a lot of curves and other things like that. he would draw. >> there is one prophetic picture of a little boy sitting on his own in a corner. just seeing it now on the screen. michael had written next to this in his handwriting before you judge me, try hard to love me. look within your heart and ask have you seen my childhood? what do you think he meant by that? >> i don't know what, i couldn't tell you. that is the picture i have one too. like that. are you showing it? >> yeah, we are looking at it now. it's a very -- the boy looks -- >> he looks sad. i think it's because michael always said he missed most of his childhood. he loved to run and play and loved children and i think this is what this picture stands for. >> i interviewed a lot of people about michael. many of your family. your children have interviewed, janet and la toya and jermaine. they all said michael was such a happy child and loved playing pranks on people and that kind of thing. do you ever feel regret as his mother that he did lose the childhood really to superstardom? you had your time again, would you want the kids, especially michael, to go into that crazy world? >> well, to a certain extent. none of my children really -- my husband was sort of a -- very strict about things like that. where we came from, there was a lot of crime. we cared about our children and didn't want them out there on the street running around and breaking in cars and doing like most of the children did back then. we did things with them in the house. that's when they started the singing. as far as having a good time and all, they were in the little league and things like that and they learned to play the music and michael always said he didn't have a childhood, but he enjoyed what he was doing. >> i think that's true. when you talk about his father being tough with them, was he too tough? did he have to be that tough? >> i didn't think he was too tough, but back in those days, everybody raised their children about the same. if you did something wrong, you got a scolding for it and you also got a licking as they called it. today you can't do that. michael looked back at those times and said he was abused. they call it abuse, but sometimes if it wasn't for the strap, what would this world be like today? >> do you think that the world has gone a bit soft in terms of discipline? >> i think we have gone a bit too soft. i really do. then they have too much things out there for the children to do. they are too open with a lot of things. things that we weren't open years ago about. i just feel bad. i know that the world is -- i think it's doomed. >> do you? >> the bible tells us the world will be destroyed. i think. >> when you look at america, modern america now, where do you think people are going wrong especially in bringing up children? >> i think society is sometimes the fault of it. they tell the children to call 911. then some cases maybe they need to do that, but then some cases, some parents are afraid of their children. some children tell their parents if you do this to me, i will call 911 or call the police. whatever the children can do. >> i talked to your children. all said in various stages of their lives we have a tough up bringing and our father was strict, but as they got older and in some case his their own kids, they began to realize it was the kind of tough love they needed. it's interesting for me to talk to them now that they are older. it must be for you an interesting experience to hear their views change as they get older. >> they do. children change. for instance, tito is that said i am going to raise my children like -- they call their father joseph -- just like i was raised. all of the children all of the terrible things they laid on michael. he didn't do these things. there wicked people out there and they accuse you. >> it must have been very hurtful for you as his mother, some of the things michael was accused of and the court cases he had to fight. how did you feel as his mother. >> oh, my gosh. it almost destroyed me in a way when i say it just hurt. i know michael didn't do those terrible things. there so many wicked people, why are they doing this to him? >> hold that thought for a moment. when we come back, i want to talk to you about michael's life and what his legacy should be. back now with michael jackson's mother and long time friend, bret livingston strong. did you advise michael that his own behavior, i intrude michael a few years ago and he had a very child-like quality to him. did you ever feel concern that he was allowing himself to get put in the positions when he had all these young boys come out? did you say michael, i think you should be careful because the rest of the world may not see this in the innocent way you do? >> i talked to him about it. i never told him to stop having children around, but he did stop having a lot. most of the children that were around michael was his own relatives. i can remember that my sister in law walked into the store and saw this one of tabloids and they had something ugly to say in the headlines. she just went berserk and said those are my grandchildren. they are michael's cousins. 'they saying this? >> do you think all of the accusations and allegations and the trials he had to go through, do you think it all contributed in the end to his physical condition? and his early death? do you think all the drugs he was taking for the anxiety and the lack of sleep, the pain killers and so on, was it all connected do you think in the end to the pressure and the tension and the stress? >> you know what, i think a lot of that was exaggerated about the different things he was taking. i have been to my son's house unannounced and i have been there announced. i have never seen him in that way. i know he was taking pain killers because he got burned on the top of his head. very painful. all the other stuff they added to it, i don't know if that was the truth or not, but i don't think that has anything to do with the way he died. >> what do you think as his mother caused his death? >> i don't know. all i know is they used propofol and they shouldn't have used it and they used it in the wrong setting. that's all i know and that's what caused his death. >> what are your feelings towards dr. conrad murray? do you blame him? >> um, you know what, i can't even describe the way i feel about him. he did a terrible thing. it might have been others involved. i don't know that. i feel that. i would rather not answer that question. the only thing he did for a person's life. four years in jail is not enough. i will never see my son again. he can get out and he will enjoy his children. but -- >> michael trusted him. >> yes, he did. he did trust him. >> here trusted a lot of people. >> he trusted everybody. >> did you meet conrad murray? >> never met him still to this day, i have never met him. >> has he tried to contact you? >> i don't think so. >> he has never written to you or anything? >> no. >> it was a devastatingly awful thing to happen to lose this son of yours who is just 50 years old. half a life really. >> yes. >> will you ever get over this do you think? >> never. every morning, all through the day i think about michael. if i wake up through the night, my mind is there. >> what do you think? >> i just miss him. being a christian and believing in resurrection, i feel they will see him again. i'm sorry. >> that's perfectly understandable. you are his mother. i can't imagine a worse thing. i can't even imagine how horrendous it must be to lose a child. >> i know. >> it's so unnatural. >> yes, it is and it should be -- >> lots of people say that michael in the build up to his death was working too hard, was too tire and couldn't sleep and you heard all of this. is that true? i also heard from people that were working with him on the tour and everything that he was pretty fit and enjoying it and having a good time and excited. what's the truth? >> excuse me? >> how did you think he was? in the build up to his death physically. >> you know, we have a trial going on and i would rather not say. i talked a lot already about it. >> were you concerned about him? >> oh, yes. oh, yes. when they told me he had 50 shows going on, i was concerned about the shows and i thought it was a little bit too much. michael had not been on stage in about ten years. i called him and i told him. the way they had it structured, they had every other night he would be working. on a night and off a night. on a night, off a night. he was used to working at least once or twice a week. i just kept calling and telling him they had to change the schedule. i thought it was too much to him. >> did he listen to you? >> oh, yes. >> did you feel there were bad people around him? >> yes, i do. >> enabling i guess is the word you would use and allowing him to -- >> it was -- i just don't want to answer those questions right now, but i feel there was. they didn't care about him. all they cared about was money. >> it was about money, you think? >> yes. >> let's take a short break and when we come back, i want to talk about the incredible art and how michael's children are doing. you are raising them now. >> yes. >> i think people are fascinating about that and they seem to be doing great which is good news. >> they are. >> we're will be back in a moment. energy is being produced to power our lives. while energy development comes with some risk, north america's natural gas producers are committed to safely and responsibly providing generations of cleaner-burning energy for our country, drilling thousands of feet below fresh water sources within self-contained well systems. and, using state-of-the-art monitoring technologies, rigorous practices help ensure our operations are safe and clean for our communities and the environment. we're america's natural gas. i think we should see other people. in fact, i'm already seeing your best friend, justin. ♪ i would've appreciated a proactive update on the status of our relationship. who do you think i am, tim? quicken loans? at quicken loans, we provide you with proactive updates on the status of your home loan. and our innovative online tools ensure that you're always in the loop. one more way quicken loans is engineered to amaze. daddy has been the best father you can ever imagine. and i just wanted to say i love him. so much. >> heart breaking scenes of michael jackson's memorial season with paris jackson, his daughter. i am here with an interview with cath rib r rin jackson and art mentor, bret livingston. incredibly painful for those kids particularly in public. you have taken them into your home and bringing up michael's children. how are they getting on? >> they are getting on very well. >> they seem to be doing remarkably well and seem to have between them all his kind of zest for life, his talent, his confidence in public and all of those things. it's extraordinary to watch. it must be for you too. almost reliving michael. >> they are in school. the two oldest go to a private school and the youngest doesn't want to leave home so we have a tutor there for him. the oldest, prince, the oldest boy, he is such a great student. >> is he? >> his grades are so good. they are a pluses. >> do you see the spirit of michael in them? >> yes, i do. >> how would you feel and paris started down this road. if they want to go into show business. >> paris does. >> do you feel pleased or concerned? >> i am pleased and i am concerned at the same time. i don't think that michael would want her to be out there this soon. she wanted it so bad low and she kept saying please, grandma, i want this. it was something she really wanted and i gave in and said okay. >> how good is she? >> she is very good. she was showing me and i said how do you know you can act? you haven't had acting and i started sending her to acting and after that she said just try me. she said i can cry on queue. she showed me how she can cry. >> amazing. >> she is very good. she is good. >> how do you think they have coped with losing their father? >> you know, i don't think that they act like normal children. they play and they have a good time, but i don't think they will ever forget. i don't think so. but they are doing quite well. very well. >> bret, come back to you and michael. you knew him extremely well. very heart rendering talking to katherine about all this stuff. can't get a more powerful voice really than michael's mother. does this resonate with you? what was your feeling about michael and the build up to his death. were you concerned about him as a friend? >> his enthusiasm to succeed brought all this strength out in him. he just wanted to create more and be in front of his fans again. he was enthusiastic. >> were you concerned as a friend of his about what was possibly going on? >> during the time that he was pretty much studying to do the concerts, i had very little contact with him. the contact that i did have, he was upbeat and enthusiastic. he would call me early hours of the morning and leave me fantastic messages. i never knew he had a problem, but i know that over the years he would trust people and he would not do any due diligence or sometimes his inner feelings, he would not listen to them and he had a lot of trust he should have questioned. >> you said an interesting thing to me in the break about michael's relationship with his father. >> yes, he loved his father and i think a lot of the publicity that his father may have been harsh on him. i think people should know that he respected his father and thought his father was fantastic that gave his brothers and sisters a wonderful future and he respected him. his father turned up at all those terrible trials that he had to go through and he was always supportive of him. he loved him. >> katherine, what would you like michael's legacy to be? >> i know he will be remembered as the artist he was, but a lot of people misunderstood him. michael loved life and loved people. he gave so much to charity. he always loved to give to the people that didn't have. even since he was a little kid about six or seven years old. as i always tell the story about he was laying on the floor watching tv and remember when these little black kids had the big stomachs and the flies flying around their mouths and he would start crying and he was telling me, mommy, one day i will do something about this. >> and the scenes from ethiopia and africa. the starving young children. >> the starving young children with the big bellies. he has always been giving to charities and things like that. he gave more than people knew. >> what do you think is the biggest misconception about michael for people who didn't know him? >> the things that were coming out in the media and people believing what they read. these were all terrible lies. >> like what? >> like he was molesting young boys and other things that he was doing. that he might have been on pain killers and things like that. as far as them trying to make him out to be a terrible person, he was not that. >> let's take a quick break and come back and talk further in a few minutes. there have been many disgusting statements made recently concerning allegations of improper conduct on my part. i ask all of you to wait and hear the truth before you label or condemn me. don't treat me like a criminal because i am innocent. >> when you are his mother, you would know michael better than most people. do you think it is even remotely possible he could have done anything inappropriate with a young boy? >> no way. no way could michael have done that. he would always me the things he loved the most is children. he would slit his own wrist rather than hurt a child. we would sit and talk about that and he said people want to make out for me to be this terrible person. >> he was misinterpreted. by people who may have been jealous of his success. he loved animals and he loved nature. and children had a special feeling in his heart. it was an inspiration for him. >> michael was unconventional. he never really grew up even though he was a fantastic businessman and incredibly successful. you got the feeling that he wanted to be within a kind of child-like world. like a security blanket for him in many ways. is that how you felt? >> you know, michael was one of my younger children and his brothers had children so he grew up also with them. he wanted to play all the time. he grew into an adult and the kids come over and he would play hide and go seek with them and everything. he did neverland, he did it for the children. and also i imagine he did it for himself because he didn't get a chance to go to those theme parks like other children did. he would have bus loads of children, school classes and children that even in his theater he had two beds, two hospital beds and he would have the sick children to come and watch. movies and rides and things like that. the children that were bedridden, he made sure he would have a place for them. so they could see the movies or have shows on the stage and all of that. >> how did you feel about the extraordinary level of fame that michael had? he was the most famous person on the planet for years. did that scare you? that level of fame? >> not really. i was like michael. he didn't act like it. he didn't act like he was the most famous person in the world. he was just a down to earth person. he is very, very mild tempered. >> how often would you talk to him? >> i talked to him at least twice a month and sometimes more. >> did you feel you had a close relationship? >> yes. >> do you feel he confided in you? >> yes, he did. >> did you ever hope that he would find true love? >> you know, i always thought about that, but michael seemed happy. so i wasn't too worried about it. and when he found a lot of joy in his children. in some of his nephews and nieces. he was very close to them. >> i think it is thing that should always be reminded when we talk about michael is just his unbelievable talent. i have never seen a more talented entertainer. the singing, the dancing and the showmanship. i was telling you before we started about this show, i saw in paris where he did the stunt on the end and the space guy flying off the stadium and it was so crazy and brilliantly done. you thought michael had done this. it was a spell binding concept the likes of which i have never seen before or since. he was a unique talent. one of the greatest talents ever in entertainment. can you answer that? did you feel that? >> i did. michael was a perfectionist. whatever he did, he wanted to be the best. he was the first to have so many number one hits on his album because albums used to be where you only had one or two hits and the rest would be the album songs. >> all of his songs were hits. >> he didn't believe in album songs. every song should be a great song. >> did he try stuff out for you? >> most of the things he had he played for you. >> would he drop it? >> you know what, i didn't see anything that i didn't like that he did. >> what was your favorite of all his songs? >> man in the mirror. >> why? >> that's one of my favorites. i like the earth song. >> why man in the mirror? >> because it was a message. a great message. a lot his song had messages, but this was the best of it. >> was michael happy in the end do you think? >> he was happy. i can never -- i always talked to the girl that was the kids's nanny, grace. i always said is michael happy because they were accusing him of all these things. she would always say michael had good times. me and the kids and michael. we would play and michael liked to run and play on the beach and whatever. she assures me. >> he managed to have a lot of happy times. that's good to hear. >> that's good to hear. you know you are not guilty of anything. if he thought he was guilty of these things they were accusing him of, he could never smile again, i could imagine. they put it in the papers and they had the trials. the first kid had accused him of child molestation because his father made him do it. he even told michael his father made him do it. i don't know if many people know that after michael died. i think his name is jordan. he came out and said he wished that he could have told michael before he passed and let him know he had come to the public and admitted he never touched him. >> how did that make you feel? >> it made me feel good, but i knew it all the time that michael had never done anything. >> michael's great wish was to build a memorial and i will talk to both of you after the break. ♪ [ male announcer ] ok, so you're no marathon man. but thanks to the htc one x from at&t, with its built in beats audio, every note sounds amazingly clear. ...making it easy to get lost in the music... and, well... rio vista?!! [ male announcer ] ...lost. introducing the musically enhanced htc one x from at&t. rethink possible. i tell mike what i can spend. i do my best to make that work. we're driving safely. and sue saved money on brakes. now that's personal pricing. michael jackson's mother, katherine and his friend. my songest son was i think only 8 years old and he suddenly began playing michael's music over and over for weeks and months. he never heard of michael jackson before. it was amazing to me that the whole new generation and it was the one positive i can see coming out of his awful death. actually a whole new generation of kids found another michael jackson again and realized how phenomenal he was. amazing thing. let's talk about two things. i want to wrap up. what are you going to do with his art? >> michael spent a good part of 25 years making this art. it was like a private world for him. a lot of the public thought he may have been doing things that they shouldn't be doing. he was creating art and it was like a world for him to retreat into this spiritual type of feeling where he would express his ideas. he absolutely loved that it and it made him feel good. >> people are going to hear this and see this and want to know if they can get ahold of them. >> michael always wanted to exhibit his art and unfortunately it didn't happen. he didn't want it sell it. a few pieces were sold before his passing, but since then we have been working together and planning an exhibit. he did a long time ago want to build a monument for where he wanted his fans to get married. we have a model of had here. >> it's amazing. based on the prince albert monument in london. >> they got many he loved. we thought he was deeply into monuments. we went around the monument and he wrote on the card that he got that day and he said he wanted -- we should try to work out a design together. that's who came up with this gothic and futuristic. >> the concept, it was like a wedding chapel. he would go in and be there. >> his statue, but on 2000 do, this was years before, but by 2002, he had one of the lawyers write me a letter saying can you put a sculpture of michael's three beautiful children in there. michael wants that. he wanted me to have that and get that officially. so i have that in writing, but he wanted somewhere where his fans can go and in this structure, he wanted his music. >> sorry this going to be built? >> yes because we can sell his art and build even though it's a monument for where he wanted people to be married, it's a monument to his love of life. >> where would it go? >> at the time he was thinking las vegas. after what happened to him in santa barbara, he wanted to live in las vegas. he found a house. he was calling it wonderland. he was counting on the success of this is it. >> it will be ma monument and exhibit the pictures and to sell the pictures. >> he thought that his fans would support his art. by the sale of the art, he could support the children's hospital of los angeles. we all went there and put some of michael's art in the hospital when it was open. he was hoping to be there in i think 2007 or 2008 after he came back and he wanted to put some of his art there and they weren't finished with the hospital. when it did get finished, we went back and that's mary hart. i was hoping that they would permanently put michael's art in there because it's a concern's hospital. they welcomed his art. he also wanted from the sale of his art to support not only children, but animals and like some of his music was in support of the world. he was a very warm person. like his dear mother here. very sweet and honest person. >> it has been a fascinating experience meeting you, katherine. you are one of the people i looked at from a distance and always wondered what you would be like and it's been a riveting interview and i wasn't expecting this and i appreciate you being so honest and open and his fans were too. you have given them an extraordinary insight into your son and good luck with raising his kids. i can't think of a more valuable testament to his life than the kids getting the best chance in to live up to him. >> thank you for having me here. >> it's been a real pleasure and very nice to meet you. >> nice meeting you also. >> extraordinary interview. coming up, only in america. >> this is very interesting because michael wrote this quote. he loved michelangelo's work. he often wrote these notes and so here he is quoting michelangelo. >> a rare look and an exclusive tour and hundreds of millions of dollars worth of art michael created. >> announcer: you never know when, but thieves can steal your identity, turning your life upside down in a matter of seconds. >> hi. >> hi. you know, i can save you 15% today if you open up a charge card account with us. >> you just read my mind. >> announcer: just one little piece of information and they can open bogus accounts, stealing your credit, your money and ruining your reputation. that's why you need lifelock. lifelock is the leader in identity theft protection, relentlessly protecting your personal information to help stop the crooks in their tracks before your identity is attacked, protecting your social security number, your bank accounts, even the equity in your home. >> i didn't know how serious identity theft was... until i lost my credit and eventually i lost my home. >> announcer: credit monitoring alone is not enough to protect your identity, and only tells you after the fact, sometimes as much as 60 days later. with lifelock, as soon as we spot a threat to your identity within our network, our advanced lifelock i.d. alert system directly notifies you, protecting your identity before you become a victim. >> identity theft was a huge, huge problem for me and it's gone away because of lifelock. >> announcer: while no one can stop all identity theft, if the criminals do manage to steal your information, lifelock is there to help fix it, with our $1 million service guarantee. that's right, a $1 million service guarantee. don't wait until you become the next victim. call now to try lifelock risk-free for two full months. that's right, 60 days risk-free. use promo code: norisk. if you're not completely satisfied, notify lifelock and you won't pay a cent. order now and also get this document shredder to keep your personal documents out of the wrong hands-- a $29 dollar value, free. get the protection you need right now. call or go to lifelock.com to try lifelock risk-free for a full 60 days. use promo code: norisk. plus get this document shredder free, but only if you act right now. call now! lifelock service guarantee cannot be offered to residents of new york. michael jackson we know and knew. most is behind closed doors at the secret airport hangar. this was his private world of paintings and 54 trades. inside the hangar, this is made a secret, but the contents have been revealed chlg this is how the icon found happiness away from the stage and studio with brushes, pencil ils and water color. he wanted to be known as an artist and not just as the most famous entertainer in history. some estimates and the values area a staggering $900 million. here a sketch of frankenstein and peter pan. he was obsessed with chairs and the number seven. he was the seventh child and here on paperworks of michelangelo that michael cherished.

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