Transcripts For BLOOMBERG Charlie Rose 20150118

From our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. The Supreme Court agreed friday to resolve a National Debate over samesex marriage. The justices will consider for cases from four states, and the four states are among 14 that banned samesex marriage. The decision comes just months after the Supreme Court refused to hear any appeals regarding gay marriage in october. It would help lift state bans across the country. Couples can now get married in 36 states. Joining me now is david boyce, who has taken a stand in the battle for gay marriage. It is a pleasure to have you here. Absolutely, it is a pleasure to be here. This will help to review decisions by the sixth Circuit Court of appeals. The court upheld bans on samesex marriage, and what this means is that the Supreme Court is going to definitively decide the Marriage Equality issue, probably this year. They will have a decision in june and will argue it sometime in late april. So we are going to know by june of this year, by the end of june, whether or not there is a national, established, definitive right to Marriage Equality by the constitution. So that means you have all couples that would have the right to marry the person that they love. The person that they love. I heard that Anthony Kennedy said it is crucial that this comes down. If you look at the vote in the windsor case, it was a different case, or the vote in lawrence against texas case, again a different case, but both cases were articulating the fundamental constitutional right to equality, regardless of gender regardless of sexual orientation. Justice scalia, who is still a fan of Marriage Equality, he says that Marriage Equality is inevitable. If the court does this, the court is going to find some base someday soon. What you think the court decided to do this not . Do this now . What the court did last october was helped stand a whole decision a whole series of decisions that invalidated decisions against Marriage Equality. To let those bans be invalidated and let other courts uphold it created a split on this important issue. They were looking at cases that expressed the issue on the in the right way . They were looking for conflicts, i think if the michigan case in the six circuit did with the core in the Fourth Circuit it, i dont think they would have invalidated those cases. The Supreme Court had to take these cases, because you have a serious split in the courts. How historic is this . I think this is a very historic case. This is like the civil rights issue in the last 50 years. This is like brown v board of education . I think so. Each of those cases they had a huge step forward for equality. It is interesting to me that the country has turned on this already, and here is the court coming behind where the country was if they rule, something could change, something does not turn out the way we think it does . It is hard to see how the court, given what the court said in windsor and what the court said in lawrence, it was very difficult to see how the court at this point could do anything other than uphold the right, the court interestingly has scheduled two arguments, the first argument says that our states constitutionally are required to adopt Marriage Equality, and the second question is if they are not, are the constitutionally required to recognize marriages from other states . You only reach the second question if you decide that the first question is a negative. You cant read anything into the fact that they have both questions, because both questions were presented in the case that was coming out. For example, in the ohio case coming up, it only involved people who were seeking recognition in ohio for marriages that took place in other states, so they really had to have both questions, but the fact that they had both questions means that they are going to definitively decide both issues. Will this mean that people will make friends with the court . [laughter] the court will be buried. Both sides of the issue. Will you be one of them . I dont think so. I think the issues here are pretty clear. I think people will put in, and maybe i will even participate in that, but fundamentally, the issues are clear and the lines are drawn, and i suspect that while the correlation while the court will listen, they will come in to that argument with [indiscernible]. You think the legacy of the Roberts Court will be samesex marriage . I think this will be the most important civil rights issue of the court, and one of the most important issues that this court could make. What do you say, this was something for the court to decide, better than the congress to make a law . The court had to decide it, because in our system of government, it is up to the court to decide constitutional questions, so we decided, our founders decided two hundred years ago, that there were certain rights, freedom of speech, freedom of the press the right to assembly, equality, those were so important that no majority could take those away. You dont put freedom of the press up to a vote statebystate, you dont put Marriage Equality up for a vote state by state, the Supreme Court has held 14 times that marriage is a fundamental right that the states cant take away. Great to see you. Great to see you. Back in a moment. The news this week has been dominated by the terrorist attacks, and here at home, the fbi said it has broken up a planned lone wolf attack on the u. S. Capital. Joining me now is matt olson, a cbs news contributor. Matt, thank you for doing this. I want some general questions to set the context of where we are, and you spent most of our time focusing on these questions. If we are at war, who are we at war with and how will the war be fought . We are at war with al qaeda the group that brought us 911. That is what this group in yemen has been tied to the attacks and they fall into that category, a group that is closely affiliated with the core al qaeda, and that is the group that has been most operationally active over the last several years. So as we look at the range of threats and the range of groups in pakistan or afghanistan or the middle east or yemen or syria or cross north africa, we have been very focused, and i was very focused at the National Terrorism center, for attacks in europe or the United States. We are concerned about tax there and also isis. They are calling for young men and women to attack. Unfortunately, the attack in paris is in some way that culmination of trends that we have seen over the last several years. They are calling for, as you say charlie, smaller scale attacks. They are saying, what ever you are, travel carry out jihad there, dont travel to us. We are going to inspire you, we can send you instructions online, through their magazine for example, but just carry out an attack. It may be a small scale attack but it will be an attack nonetheless. Why do some of people want to go to syria and have gone to syria and have received military training. Syria seems to be the place . Syria has been a magnet for extremist over the last couple of years. It approaches over 18,000 total foreign fighters. Going to syria. The real concern though is that 3000 europeans have gone the cause of their ease of travel back and forth from europe and obviously the potential that they can come back through europe and to the United States. What happens in syria is hard for us to know; it is that we dont know, we dont have a good intelligence connection in europe. Back to the war, what will be the tools of this war . The tools of this war are different from past wars and conventional wars, and we have seen this in the past 13 years since 9 11, and we have certainly seen this in the last couple of years, and the idea is to use all of our tools. Use military force when appropriate and necessary, but also use intelligence collection, Law Enforcement, diplomacy, economic sanctions, every tool at our disposal is going to be necessary to take on this fight, it is not just a military solution. That is often a last ditch resort. Are the people military trained . If you look at a group in yemen, they are very difficult for us to introduce sources into, and they are increasingly difficult to infiltrate electronically, in other words to conduct electronic surveillance, whether it is wiretaps or seen their email. They have become increasingly suspicious because of leaks. That is a real problem for u. S. Counterterrorism. The way we tracked down osama bin laden, did they learn from that . They definitely learned to be cautious, and yet we were still able to kill him, but that was just one part of a broader story where they learned from the past. Over the last couple of years, they have learned to be extremely careful, and now they use encryption and in some cases they just dropped off altogether. Al qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula has taken credit for the attack in paris. Does the Intelligence Community accept the fact that they paid for an excepted and conceived the attack . I think that is still an open question for my colleagues and colleagues inside the Intelligence Community. Certainly they played a role and the question is how they a role. They certainly paid a role because we know that the younger brother traveled to yemen and trained there and we know at least they were inspired by al qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula. Do we know whether they had any contact with the american cleric killed . We dont know, but he still resonates even three years after he was killed, they still cite him and he still has an influence, and it is obviously quite troubling for u. S. Counterterrorism officials. Why do people become jihadists . That is difficult, and as you mentioned at the opening, there was a plot to attack the terror the u. S. Capital, this young guy from chicago, it is hard not to look at anything from his past and say that he was going to buy two m16 rifles and carry out an attack. It is really hard to discern what in his past made him susceptible. The problem is this a messaging, whether it comes out of yemen or isis or syria, it preys on people who are may be susceptible to this violent message, and whether they have Mental Illness issues or if they are just marginalized, it definitely has an impact on a small number of people. Do you fear that an event in paris may be an accelerant and will cause people to be motivated to do it . I do have that concern, and it could act as an accelerant, and i think what we are seeing in europe with the arrest of the raids in belgium and in germany and other places in france, my sense of that is that those are efforts to really get ahead of this problem, they are efforts to disrupt, but now because of that concern, paris might act as an accelerant to their actions in other words, accelerate their plotting. That is the kind of thing we would have looked at in the United States as well, who are we seeing on that path from radicalization to mobilization to violence so that we need to know movein and do an arrest . Did we perhaps lose a step in this battle because we got so focused on isis, because they know how to use social media because they are so violent in terms of beheading, they were visible and how to use terror . I dont think we lost a step i know that the headlines were very focused last fall on the beheadings and the horrific filings, but i know from my own time inside the government that we were very focused on them this is a group that tried three times in 2009 to take down an airplane bound for the United States. Underwear bomber . Underwear bomber in 2009, the printer plot in 2010, and in 2012 another plot was disrupted, so we knew to keep our eye on them. Shoe bomber was not them . No. When you think when you think about al nusra, when you think about isis, and when you think about al qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula and other al qaeda groups, are they in competition with each other for some prize . At the leadership level, we have definitely seen this conflict, isis on one hand and al qaeda and aqap on the other and they are definitely at odds. But i think the rankandfile and certainly individuals like what we saw in paris are like minded enough that they are going to work together, were not going to see them at odds with each other. It is said that bin laden never believed that it was time to establish a caliphate establish an islamic state. Yet here comes isis. Right. That is still a conflict. Isis is still established on establishing a caliphate, al qaeda in pakistan, they are still focused on carrying out attacks against the west, and in fact we talked over the last several months about this group in syria of veteran al qaeda individuals, they have they have big plans to attack us . Yes, to attack the west. They still retain that focus. There is a strategic difference between these two groups, but at the tactical level and the level that we see in paris, there is a commonality that they are going to work together. Who leads the effort against terrorism in the United States . Is it is it obviously, it is the pentagon . Is it special forces . But is there a place were there is one person that says i am responsible for the battle against terrorism . I actually think, and this is my experience, i think it starts with the president. We meet every two weeks with the president and the president at those meetings. Every two weeks . Every two weeks, i briefed the president , here is this plot, here is the sky, and then i turned to the cia director the fbi director, the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff and that was followed up by meetings at the white house with the now Security Council team, so it was largely led by the white house and we all played a role. But there was a point, and especially on what happened in afghanistan and in the captures that were made of that original group, where many of them went to guantanamo, where they had somehow wiped out the core leadership of al qaeda. And now we are looking at a totally different challenge. It is a totally different challenge, this is the evolution of the threat. We have devastated the leadership of core al qaeda, they are nothing like what they were 10, even four years ago but this threat has spread geographically to other places and it has become much more diverse. You have groups in yemen and in isis and in yemen, and if you look at boko haram in nigeria. There killing so many people. There killing hundreds of people last week, and they are not interested in carrying out attacks outside of nigeria, but they are in line with this ideology, and this philosophy has spread, and it is not a monolithic threat, it is much more diverse now. At the time of 9 11, the afghan government, the taliban government, was giving a safe haven to al qaeda. And pakistan tended to is yemen a safe haven for al qaeda . Is afghanistan likely to be a safe haven for al qaeda . Are there places like libya that totter on a failed state and are susceptible to that . This is an enduring problem this safe haven problem, you put your finger right on it. It was the problem in afghanistan, there was a huge effort thereby the United States and other countries, but the question is, yes, in parts of al qaeda in parts of yemen, are groups like al qaeda getting a safe haven to train . Does the Yemeni Government have an incentive to stop them . They are better than they were. They are a good ally of ours. There is intelligence sharing and Operational Intelligence of their, but that country and that government has seated problems so the ability of the United States to work with them to build their capacity to be better at counterterrorism has a longterm effort, but it is absolutely essential. You can add to that list mali and parts of north nigeria. The president got involved with mali in a big way. But the fear now, and im asking this question, theyd got involved in paris, and we just saw one cell and we dont know how big it was. How many sleeper cells might there be in the United States . Is that a huge concern . It is a concern. We are fortunate in the United States where we do not have the same degree of problems that europe has, in france, in belgium, and i think also in the united kingdom, in terms of the number of extremist, the number of people live to places like syria and have returned with training and have been radicalized. We put a lot of resources against this problem, so we have efforts by the fbi and the Intelligence Community to understand who is been radicalized and who is moving in that direction. But the answer, also, you have to build in people like the tsarnaev brothers, the people who were responsible for the Boston Marathon bombing. You have those individuals not on our radar, really, and able to put together a very simple but deadly device. One of them had gone to chechnya, had he not . There was some information that we had received from the russians about him. The fbi looked at that and they tracked it down, and they talk to him, and they did everything legally that they could, and then they stopped. And that is sort of the challenge. How much can you do to keep all of these people on the radar, to keep all of these people under surveillance in a free service in a free society . There is always a concern about those we do not know about, they could carry out what it is a smallscale attack, and that needs to be said, we not talking about a 9 11 scale attack. I would talk something that happened in paris . Something like that, or something that happened in london, a soft target transportation, like subway, train, or bus, or a Grocery Store, like a good jewish like a jewish Grocery Store like we saw in paris. We strive to be 100 effective in the counterterrorism business, but i think realistically you have to assume that there that it only takes one person. It only takes one person with a gun to carry out an attack it only takes one person. It only takes one person with a gun to carry out an attack. We saw that in boston with boston strong, and we see that now in paris with je suis charlie, so the poor strong. So people are strong. What are we doing to stop this recruitment process on the internet . This is a really important part of the response to the counterterrorism effort. We were going along with the fbi and the department of homeland security, but it has to be about countering file and extremism. The president said in his press conference about the summit he is holding next month, including the Prime Minister from the u. K. , this is going to be about Building Trust with muslim communities within the United States, learning how to counter that message, giving families the tools, religious leaders the tools to counter that message, a couple of days ago the mother of an individual was stopped, and she made this statement, to isis. Directly addressing baghdaddy, leave our children alone. Thats what she said. That is a muslim mother of a young man being charged with a crime trying to join isis. That is the kind of thing that we need to have across this country. That is what the president is going to address next month at this summit that he is holding. What will come out of the summit . A very high level emphasis that is happening across the country, but a high level of this is on Building Trust and outreach to muslims and arab communities, and teaching our Law Enforcement how to identify signs of radicalization and building bridges between muslim communities in the United States and Law Enforcement so they trust each other enough so that when a mother or a neighbor sees a problem, they can go to the police or the fbi, these are longstanding problems that are going to take time, but it is really important. There are two ways that the u. S. Has responded, sometimes with allies, and sometimes not. Iraq. The air bombardments have been more successful in iraq than they have been in syria. Is that a Fair Assessment . I say the same thing now that i am out of government. We just have a much better partner in iraq and we have a better ability to carry out effective strikes and we have more of a presence on the ground. So we are in a better position to be more effective in iraq and in syria at that is going to take much longer because it is more difficult. But i do think that it is important when we take out a leader or infrastructure in syria that is part of isis, that we take those steps, and i think it is going to take longer, but it is an integral part of our strategy. Thinks for coming. We have a boxer with an incredible life story, and it has made him an incredible icon and a National Hero in his native philippines and is the subject of a new documentary called manny, and here is the trailer. When i was a boy i knew i had to fight to feed my family. I had to fight to survive. Boxing was my only hope. Manny has been boxing for 20 long years. Manny pacquiao has been boxing for 20 years. He is in eight time World Champion who will someday be in the boxing all of fame. If you are a fighter, and truly a fighter, you get back up and you fight again. He knows the ruthlessness of boxing better than anyone. If you are a fighter, and truly a fighter, you get back up and you fight again. I dont care who it is. I will fight anybody. It is bigger than boxing. It is bigger than being a prize fighter. His journey now is about fighting and winning 48 people. It is a huge burden, but he accepts it. Why do i box . Why do i fight . Because it is gods will. I am pleased to have Manny Pacquiao at this table for the first time. Welcome. Thank you. Why do you fight . Because it is gods will. It is gods will . Yes. It is gods way, not mine. We are very poor. My family did not have money to send me to school. You have given a lot of your money to the poor in the philippines . Yes, because i feel what they are feeling, the feeling of being poor, not having food to eat. You are in the congress. Do you want to be president . It is up to god. It is in gods hands. My future. God has been good to you . He has been gracious and he has provided all of this. Why are you so good . Is it brain . Is it heart . Is it fists . Is it speed . It is a combination. It is your faith, your mind, your hard work, and the most important thing is your relationship and your belief to god. Will your life be complete if you dont beat Floyd Mayweather . You know, what i have in boxing is never satisfied. It is a deeper motivation, what i have in boxing is more than my imagination, and i am happy for that, but if this fight will not happen, i think it would hurt more of the fans in boxing, not me, but more of the fans in boxing because they really want to see that fight, and i think the fans deserve that fight. There is talk that you have agreed . Yes, both me and my promoter agreed over the radio the terms and the conditions what we want to do, and the fight is just close to make it happen and we are just waiting for the contract to be signed by them. When do you expect it . I expect within this month that we will hear from them. When will this take place . It will take place in a gym on may 2. What do you think is going to be the revenue of this fight . That is not my focus, it will be good for the fans, and for the fans it will be very exciting. There is nothing i can say to you that you have not already thought about, but some wonder why this have not why this has not taken place before. Both you and floyd are both getting older and at some point it is not going to be a attractive. Yes, and i think this is the time to make that fight happen for me. Compare the two of you. Compare the two of us . Im the 1 one that, pound for pound, he [indiscernible] but how can you compare yourself when you are not pound for pound . He has been ducking you . That is what i feel, because i have been wanting this fight for the last four or five years. I think i mean, it is time to make it happen. Do you think he is making excuses, for example, drug testing is an excuse for him . No, if it is about drug testing, i am the one who implemented olympic drug testing, i am the one who is interested in it because there are a lot of fights that are cheated, there is cheating and i dont like that. I am very honest, and i have fear of the lord and i will obey my god. Because of your cheating, god would not like you. If you are cheating, god would not like youve. This would be bad in the lords eyes. What i am doing is in the right way. Compare yourself with him again. Who has the most powerful punch . Do you or him . It depends, he is a good fighter, so [laughter] youd like to see it . Yes. We will see in the fight. Is he faster than you are . He is claiming that. But we will see. Does he do anything better than you do . We will see when that fight will happen. When you lose, why did you lose . When you lose, you learn a lot. If you are careless or not confident of yourself, just make sure that until the round is not finished, dont overconfident and you have this interesting thing that you do that i like, which is that you look in somebodys eyes. Did you would you do that with him . With your opponents. Do you stare them down . No, i have this look in my eyes. What you see in their eyes . Can you see fear in another fighters eyes . Yes. Tears of happiness and tears of sadness. What division have you liked best . Division 135, 140. When did you learn to speak english . About six years ago. Six years ago . How did you learn . I learned because i come to america and i dont have, if i dont speak english, how can i communicate with other people, so i have to learn english. Of course, english is familiar to us because we, most of the people in the philippines, they speak english, like 90 of us. So you knew some growing up . Yeah, 80 of us speak a was because our major language in school is english. And when you finish fighting, when do you think you will stop fighting . A couple more fights and i know i will announce it, not only in the philippines but all over the world. You will announce it all over the world. Your ambition is to do what . I want to feel how bad you want Floyd Mayweather junior . How much does your heart want this, how much did you desperately want to get him in the ring . I really want this fight happened because the fans were not bothered to ask me question over and over, millions of question, yeah, exactly, and i have been bothered of that question, so i think it is just, i think it is a time to make it happen, so people dont ask that question anymore. What do you want to do for your country . I want to help people, i want to help poor people, because i have been there, i have been through how hard being poor family, no food to eat, i experienced that, we did not have food one day, one day we did not have food to eat, so we just drink water to survive. That is how my life, how our life, ive been through, so i am turning back to the poor people helping them, i know what they are feeling and what i did in every fight [indiscernible] and to build a house and to give it to a poor family so they will have a house. If you meet mayweather in las vegas, how many people from the philippines will you bring with you . There are going to be a lot of people all over the world not only filipino people but american, all over the world excited to see that fight in life. That is the fight they all want to see. Yes, i would to thailand, i would to china, i went i went to china, i went to the other side where that fight happened. When the bell rings for the first round, who ever your opponent is, what are you thinking . What is in your head . Thinking . Do you want to feel the other man out . What are you thinking about . Thinking to throw a power punch. A power punch to set him up . A power punch and to make them feel that how heavy and hard and how every punch here is what you said. To me boxing is a lot like chess, you dont just move a piece and see your opponent respond, you have to see the board and think 1012 moves ahead and anticipate the variables the opponent may counter with. When the bell ring starts, i study his style and then throw a combination shot and then a hard punch. What is the hardest thing for you in the fight . The hardest thing as a boxer training is the hardest thing. Training . Training is the hardest thing in boxing, and for me it is training, back to training again. Preparation . Preparation, because you do not know what is going to be in the fight. So training is the hardest part in boxing. Your trainer said that your power comes from your calves you know that . And your legs. Some people say in boxing that your legs are more important than anything. Power comes from them. They create balance, allens with the legs and the arms, so the coordination with balance with the legs and the arms, so the coordination with the balance is important. Do all punches go like this . I throw punch like this. So like this . So it is the knuckle. It is the knuckle . Like this. It is almost down. Twice. My favorite martial artist bruce lee. Why bruce lee . Because he is quick and he does a power punch. And i like that. Just power. Was he a hero to you growing up . Yes, his footwork and hand speed. Show me again . Unbelievably fast. Let me see it one more time. [laughter] the quickness of his hands. Are you born with quickness or is it something you can work on to develop your practice . You can develop your quickness. What is your opinion of muhammad ali . Mohammed ali. As a fighter. As a fighter he is good. Who is the best you have ever known about . You . The best fighter that you ever saw on film including me . [laughter] you truly believe that you are the best. Not including me because i am the one who break the record in boxing. The record in boxing is only six different division, and i break eight different weight divisions. So, i think that makes you the best of alltime . Chris r. I. M correct based on the records, i break the record of boxing, so so therefore . There are a lot of boxers in the world. Who is the toughest boxer you ever fought . Morales. Morales . Yeah. What does it feel like to get hit hard . When someone lands a solid punch, what is the feeling . It hurt. [laughter] especially if you do not train hard, it really hurt. That is why my children, i dont want them to be a boxer. You dont want them to be a boxer . I dont [laughter] i dont want them to be a boxer because it not easy. They want to watch from side boxing, but i dont want them to be a boxer. Yeah, but they look at you and see a National Hero, they understand the amount of money you have made, they understand the amount that you have done both in terms of financial contributions but also your own time and energy to your people so you are a hero. Everybody wants to be a hero. And your kids know that you became a hero because they want to be like me. Yes [laughter] dont you want them to be . I always told them that before i got this position before i get through this position, through the hard life, my first fight is only in boxing, it is only one dollar, 1. 50, that was my first one. Your first purse was 1. 50 . What was the biggest purse . It was 20, and my biggest purse, i made a guaranteed 256 26 million. Will you make a guaranteed 100 million if you fight Floyd Mayweather . I am not sure about that. I am happy with my life right now, i am happy because i found you want to fight him. I found a new life, i found a life with god, and that is the most important when did you find god . The last four years ago, when the jesus christ asked to be my lord and savior. How did that happen . There is conviction in my heart forcing me to read the bible and all the things that i am doing daily, drinking womanizing, gambling, filthy language from my mouth, and i dont like that anymore. It just happened in my life. And i read the bible and a lot dreams happen in my life, and im dreaming, and the dream not only a dream. Times. It is not only a dream, i i saw god, i saw two angels i saw paradise, i saw end times. It is not only a dream, i mean i am happy now because i find you have a larger purpose . Yes. For you to be in shape for a championship fight, how long will it take . For mayweather, list just talk about it. Six months . No, just two and a half months. When you train over long months, you become over trained, so if you become over trained, that is not good. So how do you know the perfect amount of time to train . Two and a half months and the first half month is conditioning, conditioning, and then two months before the flight before the fight it is serious training, you start serious training. Give me a prediction. The mayweather fight will take place in las vegas on may 2 of 2015. Yeah, we are just waiting for the contract to be signed by him. But is for may 2, 2015 it is a four may 2, 2015 . Yes, it will. Think you so much for being here. Thank you so much, sir. Boxing has a worldwide appeal because it is so physical and because it is so violent as well, but somehow through the ages it has had an extraordinary appeal to people. And by purpose is not only in boxing, but i just want to inspire people how important life is and to show the Good Relationship to each other. Thank you, manny. Thank you for joining us. See you next time. 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