Now on bbc news, conspiracyland. Access to your money will be owned by and controlled by the state. What happened to the people who fell down the rabbit hole into a world of Conspiracy Theories during the pandemic . Youre going to be all be issued Carbon Credits that will be connected to your digital ip. How far have they fallen and how far will they go . Youre trying to label me as angry, if i was angry. Im just asking. Going youre a bleep whatever. Im entering the uks Conspiracy Theory movement and investigating the media at its heart. Some of its followers now think almost everything is a hoax. They hold a range of different beliefs, which many would never act on. But there are others whose views seem to be becoming more extreme. They are very divisive within the community. Ive had people drive their carat me, ive been shouted at in the street. Theres one slickly produced Conspiracy Theory newspaper that seems to be playing a part in this, and im tracking down the people connected to it. Do you think that calls for action in the paper, for people to take action, to do something, could result in action that is not peaceful . Of course, i mean, people make their own decisions. The search for answers will take us across the uk and to berlin. At the extreme end, there have been Conspiracy Theory driven riots at the us capitol and a coup attempt foiled in germany. You cannot say, ok, on twitter, im nice, and on telegram, i say, kill them all. But whats happening in the uk . The small devon town of totnes is known for its warmth and open mindedness. But something has gone awry. The Conspiracy Theory movement that boomed during the pandemic has taken hold in the town, and a motivated minority continue to protest and hand out a Conspiracy Theory newspaper. Its a rival to peter shearne� s local paper, the totnes pulse. Im hoping that he can help uncover more clues about whats happening. Tell me about the light newspaper. When did you first come across it . That was during the pandemic, and they appeared through our doorways. They targeted totnes because i think. They thought it was fertile ground. That is the worst aspect of the light newspaper, and the theorists, they come up with these Conspiracy Theories, is they are very divisive within the community. Totnes is often regarded as a bit crazy and of course the reality of alt right is that genuinely, it, for me, is crazy. And the fact that totnes might be getting a reputation for an alt right agenda being pushed is upsetting because whilst, yeah, totnes is a little bit crazy, but its our crazy. At first glance, the light looks like a normal newspaper but, as well as more mundane articles, there are others promoting disinformation about covid and vaccines, financial control and extreme theories, like the great reset and agenda 21. Ultimately, all about the idea there is a sinister plot looking to do us harm. Articles also talk about the use of force against aggressors, the government and whoever else they oppose. In its pages and on its Telegram Channel, there are posts about wars and battles. There are also calls for modern day nuremberg style trials for the government, medics and journalists who they see as complicit in these sinister plots. The light and its Telegram Channel have shared far right figures and groups with extremist links. That includes conspiracy theorist pauljoseph watson, Holocaust Denierjohn Hamer and anti semitic blogger lasha darkmoon. It shared details of rallies from far right group patriotic alternative and content from its leader, mark collette. The group alpha men assemble, which offers military style training to anti vaxxers, has also had its messages shared by the light on telegram. Former mayor ben piper says he became a key target for the Conspiracy Theory movement in totnes because of his role enforcing coronavirus restrictions. He fears a campaign of harassment mounted against him has been exacerbated by publications like the light paper, which featured him. I canjoke about it, but it was pretty upsetting, actually, to be accused of being a. A tyrant and a totalitarian and a fascist. There was an aggression that bled through the editorial that was not as innocent as it was making out to be. Ive had people drive their car at me, ive been shouted at in the street, ive had people confront me in the supermarket, and shoving their phones in my face, you know, and trying to provoke me, you know . And, you know, sinister Telephone Calls from strangers who dont identify themselves, you know, of an evening and stuff like that. And the people who ive known for decades who went down those rabbit holes, theyd rather actuallyjust buy into somebody else� s paranoid logic, you know . And that was really disappointing and sad. You know, ifeel quite battered by it, i really do. I want to know more about the movement in totnes. A local former doctor called stephen hopwood, who says he specialises in alternative medicine, seems to be a big part of it. A group he was involved in setting up hands out the light paper every week and organises monthly rallies. The truth is what were looking for and heres an opportunity to discover exactly that by reading the light newspaper. I spot the latest march advertised online, talking about revolution. So i get in touch with stephen and he invites me along. Theres an undercurrent of hostility and suspicion when i arrive. Everything i do is filmed. Six, seven, eight, nine, ten. Protesters and stephen talk about the government wanting to control everything from vaccines and money, to how plans to reduce pollution are actually part of plots to limit our freedom. It goes beyond the pandemic and straightforward political opposition. What are your priorities as a movement now . Is itjust the vaccine . No, its to have a conversation. So i keep coming back to we dont think that we know the absolute nature of reality beyond all doubt. But we do find vast inconsistencies with the government narrative that cannot be ignored if youre an intelligent, caring, discriminating individual. And we have a lot of those in totnes that think for themselves. Tell me about the light paper, what is it . Its an Alternative Newspaper with alternative journalists writing alternative perspectives on a whole spectrum of issues. Whats your response to allegations that Something Like the light has pushed ideas that are anti semitic, that are far right, that are denying the holocaust . Yeah, well, again, you know, its one of the things that annoys me, you know, is that our movement, you know, bbc especially and all the rest of it try and, you know, chuck mud at us and say were far right or anti semitic and all the rest of it. I mean, really, it couldnt be farther from the truth. A lot of the language thats online accompanying some of the ideas that youre talking about. Yeah. I� ve seen, it talks about war, it talks about hanging, it talks about capital punishment. Not on my website. No, no, on telegram. Well, thats nothing to do with me. Just because some person has a belief or says something, it doesnt mean that somebody else believes that. Try and drop that as a reality. Just because one person says something. But you do seem quite angry, and i have this sense that theres a lot of anger in the movement. For you, for your misrepresentation. Im angry with you for your Editorial Policy Being dictated to by government and corporations. Im angry with you. Thats not true. I get the sense. We dont feel youre representing the people or the facts in a proper evidencial based way. Do you worry about. Because you are angry. Im frustrated. Do you worry about anger and violence . That translating, ever, into violent action . No, im not angry, im frustrated. So, again, you know, youre trying to label me as angry, if i was angry, id be goin and whatever. Im just asking. Im not saying that. That would be angry. This is just talking in an animated way because, you know, were having an intense moment and im going to communicate clearly to you, im not, you know, angry. Well give you a nice hug at the end, you know, im a nice chap, you know that. Brilliant, thank you so much for your time. 0k, and thank you, too. Thank you. No financial privacy and much more. Access to your money will be owned by and controlled by the state and how you spend your money. Weve just left the march and one prominent feature was the light paper. It was being handed out, there were lots and lots of copies and it strikes me that people like that, well, maybe theyjust dont even realise the kinds of ideologies that they might be exposed to or drawn into. People being handed out the light, they had a mixture of different reactions, some people said theyre open to it, other people who took it did not agree, or were almost laughing at the movement. I just want to know more about the light and i want to understand how this paper, thats not made in totnes, is influencing the community here and other communities across the uk. So, whos responsible for this paper . The editors name is darren nesbit, but he also goes by smith. He performs in a band and his Facebook Page features posts about coming for those at the top and building underground economies to avoid financial control. He rarely gives interviews to the mainstream media, but he has agreed to meet with me. Im on my way to meet darren nesbit, who is the editor of the light paper, that paper thats at the heart of this investigation, and i want answers about it. I want to know how its funded, i want to know who its linked to, and i want to know more about the people behind it. The build up to this interview has been pretty hostile, and darren has insisted that he will ask me questions as well as me asking him questions. But i do hope that ill be able to get some answers. Darren� s views are immediately apparent. Hes open to Conspiracy Theories suggesting that covid was a hoax. Terror attacks like 9 11 were orchestrated and that almost everything is part of a sinister plot. Im surprised we got to the second issue, in all honesty. Im certainly surprised its still going. At the end of the day, you know, people want the paper. And for as long as what they want the paper, well keep publishing it. The papers been criticised for links to figures who are considered far right figures or anti semitic figures, whats your relationship with these groups . I dont have any relationship with them. Why do you allow them in your paper . Because, if they write good articles on topics that are, you know, useful, topics that are interesting to people, then we should have them. Do you worry that, by defending those individuals or giving them a platform, you are effectively condoning these kinds of views for your readership, or, at the very least, advertising these kinds of characters and views to your readership . Well, we definitely hold our readership in a higher regard than the bbc hold its viewers because we credit them with the ability to make the same kind of decisions on each piece of information as they go along. How do you. As an editor, do you feel responsible for what you put . Because i do think that theres a certain amount of editorial responsibility that we all talk about. How do we make sure that we are giving our readership accurate and fair information but also that we are not promoting hate or hateful ideas or Anti Semitism . We dont promote hateful ideas. But you have. No, we havent. What about someone like graham hart . So the paper directly defended graham hart. He was sentenced to 32 months in prison for making anti semitic remarks on his radio show. And in the article about him, there was no mention of those comments. It was suggested that it was just a conversation, but he said things likejews are filth, theyre like rats and they deserve to be wiped out. Yeah, thats pretty harsh stuff. Yeah, well, why defend someone like that . We didnt, we defended his right to say it. But you think its right for him to spread hate like that . And you think its right to condone the spreading of hate in that way . Again, people should be adults and make their own decisions. We believe in the right of people to hold ideas, hold thoughts, ideas, and express their views. If we dont have that, if you take that away in one. If you take one iota from that away, and were now down the road of censorship, of thought control. Do you think that calls for action in the paper, for people to take action, to do something could result in action that is not peaceful . Of course. I mean, you know, people make their own decisions and they need to be responsible for their own actions. People should not be passive and just let the world change around them because there is an agenda and a purpose behind it and its not for their own best interests. Are you concerned that there is some violent rhetoric and that actually thats not something that could happen in a peaceful way . Because there are quotes ive read in the paper, for example, one that says from the most recent edition, i condone the use of force only to defend against aggressors, which necessarily means im100 Anti Government since government is always an aggressor. And if that makes me an extremist because i want you to have more freedom than you want for yourself, then so be it. What do you think of a quote like that . Is that, you know, do you endorse violence against the government, is that what that is . Thats not what hes saying. So whats he saying . Hes talking about self defence. But. But in what. In what situation would you employ that . If the government said, right, we want to take your property, or you have to come and lock down, you have to leave your house and come to a vaccination, say, i dont know, it could be a gazillion different scenarios. It surprises me, if thats what you think, why you dont say theres no place for violence in our movement, and so we dont include these kinds of people in the paper and we dont allow them to share their posts on the Telegram Channels . Because i might be wrong. So you think violence is justified . No, i dont, but i might be wrong. My aim is not to do anything else apart from get to the truth and then obviously let other people have a bash at seeing that information as well. Thank you, thank you. What really struck me about that interview with darren was just how topsy turvy it felt. It seemed like we were talking about different realities, and thats quite scary and quite tricky when youre trying to challenge someone. Because what theyre saying, or some of what theyre saying, seems to contradict reality in the evidence. I noticed how darren washed his hands of responsibility when it came to hateful ideologies, far right figures, even calls to action or violent rhetoric that have been promoted in the paper and on its Telegram Channel. And no amount of saying that something is peaceful or that you dont condone violence changes that, changes the fact that that content exists and has existed. Theres evidence to back up the idea that calls to action, like those featured in the light and on its Telegram Channel, could be affecting attitudes. The logo is laid out exactly the way that you would expect. Dr rod dacombe is an academic from Kings College whos been studying the paper and wider Conspiracy Theory movement more generally. So we did a nationally representative survey of around about 2,500 people. We were really interested in conspiracy beliefs. So whether people were kind of consistently believing the same things they have done over the last couple of years. The other thing we were interested in doing was connecting that to the idea of participation. So were people who, say, read the light, were people who engaged in Alternative Media more likely to participate in rallies, in Direct Action and so on, than other people . So, first of all, we need to be really very clear that most people who are interested in these ideas, or who take part in the movement and go on rallies, that kind of thing, do not engage in violent acts and do not think that they should be justified. However, according to the survey, around 60 of those people, a higher proportion of men than women, but around 60 of people felt that, in some circumstances, violence could be justified at one of the rallies or protests. So its a very small proportion of people, but a larger, perhaps, than we were expecting proportion of people from the survey who attend those rallies. The nature of the Conspiracy Theories that people engage with are different, theyre qualitatively different in the sense that they dontjust require you to accept information passively, but you are almost obligated to take part, to do something. And that call for action, that call for participation, which is embedded in lots of the things say that you read in the light, i think characterises recent trends in Conspiracy Theories. And i think the issue that were faced with is that we have a whole set of ideas, which are based on the idea that you can assign blame for whats been going on, whether its for lockdown, or for supposed vaccine harms, or whatever on individual people. Once you start highlighting individual people and saying that retribution and punishment needs to result, which is of course a really big thing in these ideas, then theres a Clear Pathway through to violence that we see in the literature thats obviously going to be reflected here. There are related papers to the light in ireland, australia and canada. The light also has links with the german Paper Democratic resistance. The lights Editor Darren says he speaks to its editor two or three times a year. The german paper refers to the light as its partner paper. I turned to Whistle Blowers who used to write for the paper in germany. They reveal how some of the papers writers and one of its key donors have met with members of the reichsburger group, a fringe group that sprung to prominence in december 2022. 25 people have been arrested in germany on suspicion of being involved in a plot to overthrow the government. 3,000 police were involved in raids on several properties right across the country. At the time, its members said they were prepared to kill to achieve their aim, and prosecutors said the group was extremely dangerous. 0ne whistle blower also said members of the wider Conspiracy Theory movement in germany have been offered money by kremlin linked figures to push disinformation. Hes a lawyer called markus haintz. He recently stopped writing for the paper because he says its become more extreme. The newspaper went more radical. The most problem is the Telegram Channel. You cannot ask the question, is it ok to beat people Wearing Masks and then, later, is it ok to get a Death Penalty for those who made these Covid Measures . What are you doing, yeah . For me, the biggest problem is that the people who write in this newspaper. Do not say anything about it. I dont understand it. So they wont disavow it . Yeah. Some of them should say, ok, im a lawyer, im a doctor, im a journalist, im a professor. I cannot give my name for that newspaper any more. You cannot say, ok, on twitter, im nice and on telegram, i say, kill them all, and this has to stop. And a lot of people should say, anselm, no, its enough. What do you think the goal is of the paper now . I dont know. I think its a private vendetta from anselm lenz. When we spoke before, you described him as an extremist. Do you think he is an extremist . His wording is at the moment the wording of an extremist, yes. And how would you define an extremist . Everyone who brings people. In a position where they at least could think about getting violent. Markus is still convinced that the risk of violence is low, although others i spoke to in germany are worried about isolated attacks. The german paper editor, anselm lenz, did not reply directly to any of the points raised by the bbc. He called me a highly paid nato and bbc propagandist, and said, if needed, we are willing to take the fight by all means. Being here in berlin has really brought to life the risk posed by these kinds of movements and the Alternative Media and papers that sit at their heart. I think here, more so than anywhere else, people have been willing to go that step further, to really recognise the violence and hostility and how its escalated and the very real world consequences that all of this can have. But even then, there still does seem to be this disconnect between the violent language and the hate and what that really means in practice. I think this is a real warning sign to us in the uk about where our movement could be headed. What this all really means and how it can translate in the real world. Closer to home, referring to concerns about the uks Conspiracy Theory movement more generally, the uks head of Counter Terrorism policing, mattjukes, has told the bbc they are currently seeing evidence of Conspiracy Theories being interwoven with extremism and that this connection is very much on their radar as investigators. Telegram has not responded to the bbc� s request for comment. The lights editor says he isnt in charge of its Telegram Channels, although he acknowledges it is directly linked to the paper. Various posts are signed off by him and the papers team. I felt the hate of the Movement First hand with abuse posted on social media by people linked to these papers. And im waiting for my face to appear on the front pages of both the light and the democratic resistance. The inclination towards violent rhetoric and hate brings with it a risk of action offline. A risk thats impossible to ignore. Hello. A lot of energy pent up in the atmosphere, thunderstorms are forming, many of us are going to appreciate the rain, parks, gardens and wildlife as well, we do not necessarily want an awful lot of rain in a short space of time because that leads to flash flooding. Lets have a look at the picture through the course of today, at risk of thunderstorms, many areas of england, wales and northern ireland. Initially, these potent storms will be forming in distinct areas, distinct thunderclouds or cells, and this will produce a lot of rainfall. There will be a lot of run off, many parts of the country still dry, and that is going to lead to flash flooding. We could see 30 millimetres of rain in an hour, maybe as much as 80 millimetres of rain spread over a few hours, on top of that, hail and some strong gusty winds and frequent lightning. Away from that, plenty of sunshine around, so not everybody is going to get the storms today. This is what it looks like at the end of the afternoon, fine weather across parts of northern and Eastern Scotland with sunshine, but these storms later on in the afternoon will merge into a more coherent longer spell of rain and that will travel northwards across Northern England and into parts of scotland as well, and here there could be a lot of rain through this evening and into tomorrow. This is what it looks like early in the morning tomorrow, the worst will have gone through, england and wales at this stage, most of the rain is across parts of scotland, and then tomorrow in the wake of this weather front, we will see sunny spells and again one or two showers developing. Possibly one or two thunderstorms, but on the whole it is going to be a much calmer day for most of us tomorrow compared to sunday. As we head into next week, so monday into tuesday, we will see these showers again returning to parts of southern and central britain, some of these could bring thunderstorms, and it stays on the warm side but perhaps not as warm as it has been of late. Temperatures typically in the low 20s, but there is an indication as we head towards the end of the week, it starts to turn warmer once again. A day of National Mourning declared in pakistan for those who died on a boat off the coast of greece. Im certain ive done Nothing Wrong scotlands former first minister, nicola sturgeon, responds after being arrested and released without charge over the snp finances inevestigation