Transcripts for BBC Radio 4 FM BBC Radio 4 FM 20190915 050000

He's warning people about the danger of AIDS have left a legacy of misinformation creating an impression that people who are H.I.V. Positive or debilitated by the virus now it's time to break the stigma he says in a forthcoming B.B.C. Wales documentary he reveals how he tried to keep his diagnosis secret while living with the theory that it would be disclosed against his will boxing Tyson Fury is facing the Swedish Boxer auto Valen than Last Vegas at 11 rails Fieri has the upper hand despite suffering a deep cut to his right eye in the 2nd round which needed the attention of a doctor the British box is hoping the fight will be a warm up for a rematch early next year with the W.B.C. Heavyweight champion Dante while the B.B.C. News Chris Aldridge something understood examines the process of trial and error in a minute 1st on Friday will take a deeper look reporting. When journalists write the 1st draft of history it's against the clock and under pressure to find a narrative that suits the facts to hand so it's no surprise that occasionally they get things wrong in a brand new series we're taking for new stories which left the public with the wrong idea will be slowing things down retelling and correcting it's the antidote to dog whistle headlines need jerk reaction and viral stories the corrections with nature fiction and me Chloe had to say starts on Friday morning at 11 on B.B.C. Radio 4. On your farm visits Northern Ireland's 1st new distillery for 125 years that's in half an album 1st year on Radio 4 it's time for something understood this week the rice and priest Malcolm Dhoni examines the process of trial and error. Yes. The 1st spring and summer in our new house in coastal Suffolk was a bit of a disappointment horticulturally I mean. My wife and I left a small garden in north London about the size of our living room for 2 thirds of an acre where the wind some days blows direct from the Urals. Moving to the country we were looking forward to a feast of fruit and vegetables but it was little pickers that 1st year. Vegetation which thrived in the shelter to the east founded on the East Coast. Whole essay and. 10 am. Gardening veterans who love their eyes down naivety though in our defense we've made some accommodations with different soil types and prevailing conditions it wasn't a complete disaster Nevertheless we had to embark on a series of experiments to find out what would enjoy growth. He concluded that there's really no point in trying to grow Dale he keels over and done us where we can grow fragrant modern and lush bushes. We've also discovered that planting seeds tricked into the ground is unreliable. Now we tend to start them off as seedlings and plant out later ideas on we haven't exactly achieved Cornu Copia but by a process of trial and error we're getting that. This is a pretty domestic example. But that kind of suck it and see experimentation is an essential human trait is at the very root of how we find out about world how we grow up form relationships and develop philosophies and religions we make suppositions then we test them to see if they hold water I'm fascinated by this experimental impulse how it effects the decisions we make the police reform and the lives we lead. Some people say that at the beginning of time it was just such an exercise of trial and error mostly era to be honest the changed the destiny of human beings and the planet they inhabited. As the Biblical book of Genesis described the 1st humans Adam many were in the Garden of Eden it was paradise barring one condition and the Lord God commanded Adam you may freely eat of any tree of the garden but of the tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil You shall not eat for in the day that you piece of it you shall die. The prohibition was too tempting a challenge for Adam and Eve. What difference would having the knowledge of good and evil Mike would they really die so in the spirit of experimentation Eve took a bite out of the apple and handed it to Adam. In that crunch moment Adam and Eve suddenly understood more about themselves than they had before. Whether this was a successful experiment is open to debate it depends whether we view Adam and Eve's actions as arising from curiosity or disobedience. The narrative itself is pretty unequivocal. As a result of disappointing God pair were banished for me and with their action came the consequences of disease death pain in childbirth and a fundamental corruption of the natural order. And God. In a God of the Veda and bought for. The title as a goblin version of the god League and the band 70 minute jam was itself a kind of experiment. As for the actual Adam and Eve venture into trial an era theologians from different religions and traditions disagree on its meaning some say it demonstrates mankind's arrogance and sinfulness while others suggest it marks an inevitable rite of passage this is symbolic narrative about the need to challenge investigate and grow up American astronomer Carl Sagen leans towards this 2nd approach consider a story in the Jewish Talmud left out of the Book of Genesis. In the garden God tells even Adam that he has intentionally left the universe unfinished it is the responsibility of humans of a countless generations to participate with God in a glorious experiment the completing of creation. Whatever our background or history humans are gloriously experimental is clear right from birth baby stick things in their mouth to see what they taste and feel like. And try simply warning a child that the iron is hot and not to be touched so many children it takes a sizzle and a yelp before they recognize the truth being told isn't enough we have to find out for ourselves. This curiosity is essential to our creativity artists writers musicians and performers of generation by generation push the barriers in their work. Composer Terry Riley is seen as a pioneer of minimalist music. His work is influenced by jazz and Indian classical music and he experimented with music techniques and delay systems as with his piece rainbow in Curved Air a landmark of minimalism. Or . People talk of experimental art there have been creative minds whose work has been driven by the need to explore new technologies or forms a new edgy work in almost any discipline gets to be called Ave God But most artists are arguably driven by the need to discover something new rather than to experiment for its own sake. Because I once said I can hardly understand the importance given to the word research in connection with modern painting in my opinion to search means nothing in painting to find is the thing but this doesn't mean the dot is don't experiment in fact it almost defines the creative process because or did confess that there was a period in 1912 when the studio became a laboratory The finding comes from searching trial and error impressionists expressionists Cubists and conceptualised of all challenge just to see things in a different way by experiment with color fall and perspective every art form from music to movie making has its own equivalent. Most often though we think of this process in relation to science in both his pure and applied falls. Experiment is the very heart of the process developed in the 17th century known as the scientific method in short this involves making observations asking questions of those observations forming a hypothesis and testing the theory in an experiment before analyzing the results and forming a conclusion. Seeing and testing a central in the scientific method and close to what we did as children ready in his book so long and thanks for all the fish one of Douglas Adams characters says a scientist must also be absolutely like a child if he sees a thing he must say that he sees it whether it was what he thought he was going to see or not see 1st think later then test but always see 1st otherwise he will only see what you were expecting. But if seeing is important so too is the testing the 10th century Islamic scholar. One of the fathers of the scientific method says that experiments must be rigorous the Judy of the man who investigates the writing of scientists if learning the truth is his goal is to make himself an enemy of all that he reads and attack it from every side he should also suspect himself as he performs his critical examination of it so that he may avoid falling into either prejudice or leniency. The poet Kim Roberts in her collection the scientific method wrote lyrically about how such critical examination means that chemistry proceeds in increment test tubes and retorts powders in stoppered bottles some bright blue chemistry proceeds in currents we try this fail try that from stop at bottles some bright blue powder of nickel sized treat try this problem out try that the pill color of a robin's egg powder have nickel sightread waits to reveal its secrets Carla has burnt orange robin's egg blue man the high pressure to still. To reveal a thing secrets patience and precision are required to bloom in a high pressure to still demands just the smallest change patience and repetition are a quiet watch your test tubes and retorts the powder is just the smallest change. Proof of how chemistry proceeds in increment. We try this fail try that. Experimentations about trial and error and the error tells us at least as much as does the success. Dr Norm Lawson of the rocket chemical company was trying to develop a formula to prevent corrosion in nuclear missiles but he couldn't get it to work his experiments failed 39 times until finally his aptly named water displacement product became good that's why it's called W.D. 40 era failure is an essential part of experiment another inventor James Dyson a vacuum cleaner fame agrees. Over the course of 15 years he made more than $5000.00 machines before settling on one that revolutionized house cleaning but he said I learned from each one that so I came up with a solution so I don't mind failure in fact he thinks era should be celebrated as part of the educational process I've always thought that schoolchildren should be marked by the number of failures that had the child who tries strange things and experiences lots of failures to get there is probably more creative. And sometimes the products of experimentation have unforseen consequences in 1944 German scientists used a new form of fuel hydrazine to power the 2 rockets. After the war derivatives were used in the treatment of TB one of these hyper nerves it was found to be effective but had unexpected side effects James 11 knew the physician and medical journalist says it was observed to have the side effect of inducing euphoria or as it was put colorfully at the time patients danced in the holes though they had holes in and Alex. Seemed. To get enough there's a large turn to find out of. Any man to beat or. Entire life. And I'm a gay man out of $5.00 and art and. Even if you die. Or live. Decently out save. The. Changes in off the air but a 1st for. The substance later became popular as 90 depression then withdrawn because of other side effects testing is vital and retesting proof is elusive asked Professor Stephen Hawking. Any physical theory is a ways provisional in the sense that it's only a hypothesis you can never prove it. No matter how many times the results of experiments agree with some theory you can never be sure that the next time the result will not contradict the theory. Is hard to come by ness and science is even less obvious in the areas of philosophy spirituality and religion where facts are like hen's teeth maybe that's because science and religion lost different questions. The evolutionary biologist Stephen Jay Gould observed science tries to document the fact or character of the natural world and to develop theories that coordinate and explain these facts religion on the other hand operates in the equally important but utterly different realm of human purposes meanings and values subjects that the factual domain of science might eliminate but can never resolve Galileo in the 16th century was of the same mind and thought that where we set our experiments was important I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the Scriptures but with experiments and demonstrations humans ask unanswerable questions why is there something rather than nothing why is there so much suffering in the world does prayer work what happens when you die. For some a sacred text seems to answer the questions for Conservative Jews Christians and Muslims for example the Talmud the Bible and the Koran represent inerrant revelations of God's word no trial and error here just givens but for many other believers even devout ones faith is something that has to be tried and tested faith is by nature about trust rather than proof or certainty faith may be informed by evidence but it's still a hunch says the former Bishop of Edinburgh Richard Holloway the opposite of faith is not doubt but certainty where you have certainty you don't need faith faith by definition always employees doubt. For me having grown up with a belief in the literal truth of the Bible my certainties would challenge when a close friend or so a Christian confided in me that he was gay. I found it difficult to believe that a loving God would regard him as some sort of disordered person the reality of his sexuality and his right to express his humanity fully was at odds with what I had assumed was a was tight belief system. What I had thought was on the sale of Lee true no longer dovetail with my lived experience is made me feel the need to test all sorts of other beliefs I had previously thought were given. It made me a faithful experimentalist. Faith doctrine and life are in a dynamic dialogue. And once trial and error comes into play sometimes hard won assumptions have to give. The Dalai Lama seems to agree we must conductress X. And then accept the results if they don't stand up to experimentation. On why X. Must be rejected. This doesn't mean that we simply dismiss sacred texts or ignore the hard won wisdom of the sages Neiges. There is wisdom and common sense to be found. And perhaps there are some lessons we shouldn't need to have to find out experimentally in every new generation. Some things are self evident in the exploitation and child abuse for example. And some things are right with out of generosity and justice. Do we really need to place those values in the research that. Often is the rules of engagement that religious or social ideology set in place that needs to be challenged experimentally so with for example a revered text intended when lived out inhibits human flourishing or sidelines groups of people because of their gender ethnicity sexuality or health then it needs to be examined questioned. Because sometimes observation trumps the text. It's a matter of OS acting like normal human beings living experimentally It's what we do is how we learn. Is the Dutch indie band face to morrow counsel in this song trial an era. Thing still uncertain. When a child reaches adolescence it's not unusual for them to experimentally pressure test their parents in order to find out where the boundaries are and more fundamentally to understand who they are and where they fit in the great scheme of things columnist Suzanne mall the mother of 3 teenagers says their demands are they fit I want to be a star I want to change the world I want unconditional love I hate you I want to take risks I want to be safe. I want to be free. Is not clinical research it's intuitive and often fiery but teenagers and nonetheless trying to establish their identity is sometimes means knocking their parents off the pedestal that they may have initially placed them on the psychologist Kali pick out cleverly notes the child looks up to parents and their wonderful powers and idealizes who they are but the adolescent looks down on parents and their unfair or 30 and criticizes who they are in the child's eyes parents can do little wrong in the adolescents eyes they can do little right without parents falling from grace the adolescent would never feel justified in challenging them for control and beginning his or her rise to independent power this social experimentation seems to be hardwired we form relationships by trial and error. We introduce people to our friends and see how this plays we dated Joba we read body language we might end up sharing a bed or a flat it's all a process of road testing one another to see if a crush will turn into mutual love this is not simply individualistic families friendship groups clubs corporations cultures all experiment in order to find ways to act or behave collectively it's how and why we vote in government and vote them out again living by trial and error keeps us alert and alive unless we make observations about what's around us and test what we see or what we're told we simply live with the status quo there's no movement the development it may have become a bit of a cliche but the line attributed to Socrates has a certain resonance. An examined life is not worth living. Inertia is a form of prison. There's nothing wrong with stability but as the world changes around us new knowledge becomes available we need to continue to test ourselves in our surroundings to do new things. The Czech poet Miroslav Holub said that we need to experience was beyond us go and open the door maybe outside there's a tree or a wood a garden or a magic city. Go and open the door maybe a dog's rummaging maybe you'll see a face or an eye or the picture of a picture. Go and open the door if there's a fog it'll clear. Go and open the door even if there's only darkness ticking even if there's only the hollow wind even if nothing is that. Go and open the door at least that would be a draft the U.S. President of the $930.00 S. And forty's Franklin D. Roosevelt believed that we need to take risks it is common sense to take a method and try it if it fails admit it frankly and try another but above all try something living experimentally is an exercise in faith you do your search you make you calculations you observe and out of all of that form a theory it has to be something you can have some belief in you have to think it'll work otherwise why would you invest in it it's going to be more than idle speculation then you give it a go and see if the wheels fall off. For my wife and me. It's not just the vege patch the spending experiment. Is the whole move from the cities of the country. We've thought about it for years we have no idea if it will work until we try to. Intervene trials never as successes and failures. This year. The Onions of rum to wave of the shots in the Gali can fail miserably. Was it from last was the variety could have it a number of things we need thinkin try something else then there's Mary chasing copper to sings there's no option but to take our children a. Place to take chances. To. Visit Santa. A. Result please. Take. A chance. Of. Something understood was presented this week by Malcolm Dhoni and produced by Jonathan a son of an It was a T.B.I. Production for B.B.C. Radio 4 if you'd like to find out more about the readings on the music featured in the program you can visit the something understood page on the radio for website. The production of whisky is all about time as a one in a minute as a visitor distillery in Northern Ireland 1st the latest series of costing Yeth continues on Tuesday. And wants a Let's reclaim on it a bit of land striving for a green up lads This is amazing what church obstacles it's going to take what's happening here it really matters because it's all about healing the Achilles heel of all renewable energy finding innovative solutions to environmental challenges there really is a collecting the D.N.A. As they move through the environment we can filter that water and he said to survey the wildlife in remote areas costing on B.B.C. Radio for the planes in the air listen continue to preach continues on Tuesday after News at 330. And now for on your Fama with Ruth Sanderson. When will this all be harvested soon well you know as you can see here there's a lovely golden color coming off at the moment with a little bit of green So it's a little bit to go yet the pickles look good and food and yeah the pickles Yeah the little pickles are barley know so they're looking really really good at the moment . This morning on your farm I've actually come home sooner than I did and I am on the ards Peninsula which is the most easterly point of the country in fact the most easterly point in all of our lives and but I'm the reason I'm in the state of the party this morning is because this Barney is going to meet whiskey a distillery very close to here I've come to meet the owner of the distillery and in fact the farmer of this barley Shem Brown and. I grew up with 100 metres from here i'm our family farm is just actually over that hill so yes as a young boy you know we would have been run through these fail lose and make them born arrows at a Sollie trees always had to be a Sollie tree are these are you know art of the marsh not set yeah yeah I was word for it yeah it is absolutely gorgeous here I love with barley high at looks like Bell but from far away you just want to put your hands in it like Russell Crowe at a gladiator to you know something I was just a fight to actually make that reference but but yes there's been numerous people I think maybe even treason May there was a photograph of her if you can remember trees are. Like just about every no I don't you know everybody seems to get a photograph of their homes and they just love to just sort of skim over the top of the barley so tough time let's why like it's a berry I was thinking barley It looks incredible up close and far away with the airs on the movement of it you know with got a lovely good. To it but also like the feeling of it that little tug almost let it get gives on your skin Yeah yeah. Yeah roughness with a little bit of a pickle typically pickles. But yeah yeah I mean is it the sort of you can tell at this point right that's going to be that's going to be good and can you tell if it's going to be good for alcohol you know I suppose really all we can say is that of the pickles are good in food and you know there's an awful you know there's a there's a lot of Florida and there producer good sort of conversion and too you know a good amount of alcohol and yeah I mean the last thing we would want as a little then pickle that will never we that there's very little substance to it other than the than the than the husk you know there's no value or not as far as making whiskey goes so we so you know we we want to really rind you know food for Pickle so in a month and. Let's go we wonder at the paleo Yeah absolutely. The growing that we're actually on here at the minute is an extension of the family farm and I bought a scrying myself maybe you know maybe 25 years ago you know I've been. Well I don't know maybe you might some might say maybe a part time farmer because I have other business interests and you know I don't do as much farming as I would like but still very much interested and still have my own tractors still you know restoring tractors you know you're a bit of a collector I think it's back to say you know yes yes yes some have to say I'm fortunate enough that I love to collect unusual things I want to talk to the distillery Yeah yeah there is yeah that's World War 2 T. 34 keep in check you think keep everyone and chat keep security you know security can never be too high on understand but I know it's lovely to restore restoring a lovely old tractor at the moment from the early seventy's at a track marshal quite nostalgic he quit in the style to parts that. You know I love looking back at history and I love trying to learn from history I think that our past as as extremely important I'd love to keep all things new things are not belt telecast new things are plastic and they're electronic and I've got batteries so most things of today will not be a byte and 20 and 40 in 50 years because they're not designed to be but the stuff of the 1950 S. And forty's and thirty's you know it's just it's lovely to see in them from old motorcycles to tractors to to military vehicles so to escape gas because that's something that takes a long time to make to grow and to make and to mature and also then the bodies in hard luck you keep it it's well it's interesting just talking to you that you're working on a slightly different time scales here at a much longer time scale. Yeah whenever you know myself and my team set out to make whiskey I think one of the real real attractions for me is that we're not wanting to sell young whiskey we're not here for the long haul and you know the 1st whiskey that we might release might be a 10 year old whereas other distilleries are released in the 3 year olds and for your rules I mean my goal is to try and hold on as long as we can possibly release maybe a 10 year old and that's the plan because you know a good single malt or a good pot still Irish whiskey it'll always be much much better after Haven't you know a longer time in the barrel to tell me why this all started because she had one rotten thing he did that he drank you know I have never drank from growing up I would say that I have tried it I could never understand that you know that. Goodness me as most going to say there's a 15 year old about but maybe maybe that's not politically correct to say that but but let's be realistic let's let's be realistic here as a 1516 year old you know and somebody sets a beer in front of you. And I just could not understand that I mean one could like it or you just was never from a Coca-Cola or a mean. It was just the far far more nicer product to drink so then why have the Taito there open a distillery I think we're back to quality. What really got me into this was that and 2005 we bought who tale and in 2004 we bought a pub you know and then that got me into the drink specials because I had to do dailies with some of the drink suppliers. And I love the idea that if I put a lot of I don't want to I don't well maybe I will use the word love I put a lot of love and passion into a product like whiskey and I make the best whiskey that I can make and maybe hopefully maybe one day you know that the whiskey that we actually produce will be awarded when are a world class whiskey you know we'll get rewarded for about attention to detail and the passion that we put into the product we were the 1st people in Northern Ireland in over 125 years to be granted a new distillers license and we got in 2013 I'm wondering if this comes back to a you're in a stylistic bones here because there is an amazing story a bite Irish whiskey both north and south you know we had this this real tradition on the island VIGELAND of distilling whiskey which a lot of us have forgotten about you know even in Belfast There was done those there was a massive distillery and up the road and cumber and everybody seemed to be making whiskey and then that that sort of died out so was there something in you that thought this was a great you know story from history that you wanted to resurrect a bit. Well I suppose this particular market sector this this business really did fascinate me because I really wanted to make something you know my other business ventures that I've had we didn't make anything we bought stuff we sold it I want to make something that might be about for a while you know 10200 years ago there were hundreds of distilleries all over Ireland and I suppose going by you know you till 200-2011 there were only 3 all of our debt and all of our There was only 3 there was about a night in Scotland but it was only 3 now there's obviously reasons because Irish whiskey was the biggest whiskey in the Word and their biggest market was America and then you had prohibition and that was the ME and Keller that killed off a lot of the Irish whiskey distilleries and truth there are one or 2 other little issues that all happened there was the invention of the patent still or some people call it the coffee still it could produce whiskey faster and believe it or not maybe even maybe even better to a degree time on the Scots embraced this new technology the Irish wouldn't and didn't embrace it and then the Scotch sort of started to produce whiskey cheaper so you had you had a total crash overnight off the biggest whiskey country in the word so the distilleries disappeared we probably a bigger history in the make and of whisky than anybody in the whole wide word here and Northern Ireland Belfast and has been has been forgotten but but through people like our sales and others provided that the quality is there you know we'll try and bring that that history back and bring it back to Belfast I like that you are really keeping it hyper local here you're growing your own. Barley on the line and it's being aged a mile down the road and then distilled here as it's very much of this place we're actually on the potential less so for those who aren't familiar with that it looks northern art and kind of looks like it's got an arm sticking ite and where we're kind of in the middle of the forearm here it has always been written right throughout the whole of history as being agree plus to grow cereals even at the top of the peninsula there's an old Mullings that and it's day was was possibly the largest in Ireland which I think again proves you know the potential awards a wonderful place to grow barley. What's this here that I'm stroking so I can stop touching it you know do it you've asked is a sensitive question there because you know that's one of the things that we really you know keep to ourselves as to what variety because we're doing this on such a small scale relative to 2 to the big guys who are you know by and they're they're barley M. And ball in fact they're not buying them barley they're buying their barley from a mold sting you know house you know and little did that's already multi we're talking 3 industries here you know you've got farming which is grown your own crops and industry all of it so when you have mulling barley which is another industry all of its own and then you have distilling whiskey which is another industry all of its own and we're actually doing all 3 you know $2.00 to $2.00 a bit of a degree a degree the 3 the 3 or 4 distilleries in one area could all be buying their barley from the C.M. You know Mullings house which technically in a sense means that. to degree all of the whiskeys or old going to sort of beagle the be sort of the be the c.m. Toot to a degree to ana and i say to a degree because the may have different distilling techniques but the role materials are all the see i'm on our our role materials it's we bet like a a good red wine you know good bore do got tara was at has and how does we could get to position here were people might look i'm go old you know what they act lindvall whiskey from 2016 as as just the best ever whereas do you know the 17 just was numbers good so you know what's which we're which what should what she was you was a wet year and you know without just doesn't happen in west gay but it could if there are more people like offs that he that there are nasser voiding with question you're still not going to tell us what with is are you know inode you know what we will have to keep some secrets ok i think we can bet wiccan sad barley anyway count way but what is part of it is our that yeah She and where are we we've just arrived at a shed Yeah we've just come to the farm where we where we do the modeling. And as you can see there you have Graham our distiller. He's feet deep in the barley at the moment so basically we've got we're in a shed with a concrete floor whole of the ball to of the shed is covered in sort of the big bright tangle of barley agreed to how much is actually here Kim you know we would flow or. 6 Tom at a time this is this is how it was dumb. It was after it was. You know it was state and water tanks and I mean that's a technical process and maybe maybe I'll let green. Give Graham a bit of a break whereas this little I thought you were going to say there should be going give him a bit of a look at what we could do we can. Do it for a have. You stopped pretty quickly. Tell me why why technically you're the distiller technically why is this different than any other way this is there's just no way of doing it so it gives us top control from start to focus we can see everything that we're doing here we can see every nearly every green so highly important as this but this is really important because we want to prevent the build up of hate. But we also want to stop that from tying. Yes The Because molting is basically filling the green and think it's time for Germany so you get. A GRIP come out of the degree and after a few days that's when you start but they can actually bind together. But we don't turn it so there's a physical reason as well as it's the gossamer the temperature but the reason for the modeling is it's also for the conversion of starch to sugar because you know if you are. To start nothing will happen whereas if you had yeast sugars. It's the formation of about the whole system of the chemistry comes this is where the chemistry comes and I'm Graham you're the distiller this is your this is your best noise is it the chemistry that does it for you is that thérèse does it the the methodology Arroyo and R. And West what floats your boat you know it's all those things and it's feeling that you're creating something that could be you know 25 years old before it's actually ready to be served you know it's the legacy of that and that's the it's did all these little steps correct like the end of the perfect and thought. Oh my goodness that smell oh GRAHAM It feels like a died and gone to heaven where in the the maturation warehouse is right yes this is a warehouse and we are surrounded by barrels rows and rows and rows of barrels right up to the ceiling in some cases height height which is in here there's but to have those barrels in here no it's so it's about half full That's all whiskey Yeah all whiskey. Do you have to test them all yes C.M. Told me that it's my job our 1st release barrels could become. And we're going to assess its cost in the ventilator and then decide why would we go forward under balling from the just because I think that in time you guys because you're getting to the point where the 1st whiskey is nearly ready to go nearly ready to be you know so properly that it's quite quite nerve racking. Yes that's the worst thing. You can do so what's. The earlier steps the process so we have a fair degree of confidence but there is a very individual footprint here the weather here makes a difference the fact that we're on the peninsula that actually gives the spirit a real sense of place I think hope. That really well let's find the cost. And see what's inside All right. So I'm with. You also maybe here the sort of the the Sandy the Sam I'm feeling from our feet we're actually standing on an earthen floor and I this is again going back to you know that historical traditional side of making whiskey if you go into one of the big modern distillery companies modern distillery how uses much ration warehouses up today the whole floors you know they're concrete they're storing their costs you know vertically on pallets and for left surrender night and everything and if you look at our maturation where. We're standing on Earth and floor and you make me and my hands and you know it's from a health and safety point of view it's a nightmare but tradition very important to us here and you can get if you smell and maybe know you that I've actually told you about it you might also get now that we're actually standing on what you look at that earthy smell total I. Think you reported there are times you. Where there ever a been a right time or or a wrong time to years ago you know not to the 17 thank you both remember the great THAT. You made at that site but but I do believe that if I had a choice of going back in time for an era afraid it was John weigh in on the for maybe. Not as far back as I thought we are about to pop one of these barrels to the grave talking through the proof that well just trying to get this corkscrew like. The. Ball. Here the. So it's going to go ahead I was there all the way up. The flavors to pick it up was lots of the spiciness from the new MC and the green but you can just start this sense the sweetness of that cherry cask coming in the play so it's actually already quite complex but it's also $63.00 and a half percent alcohol so if you're going to have a little tears just have a set. Well 1st of all blow your head off. It's really like it's a really deep deep concentrated flavor and what I'd like a point this right very much is that it fails your whole head do you know it you can feel it all through your mouth an old on your throat and in your chest and in your head and up your nose yeah it warms of head so. You see I think we've come at a really interesting time because you are nearly at that point where you know the whole mood it's up around why you started was to make a really good whiskey from the barley that very on your farm die in the road and you're getting into 2 point noire without whiskey is nearly ready to be sold I don't know it's kind of like being pregnant or something you know you're growing something and then suddenly there it is you really don't know what the big going to look like put it back where you know what there's a wee bit of you know yeah you don't really know what your baby's going to look like but I'm going back to our philosophy on our plan we want to make the best that we can possibly make if this doesn't taste good. I might be working here for much longer so that's what. You asked about 3 P.M.'s I hope that it really well so far we've done a good job and preserve it well everything is done with flavor in mind 1st. Reed Sanderson was on your farm on the peninsula in Northern Ireland the producer was bit trysts friends and. Now it's time for a look at the weather forecast and Susan Powell is with the sellers in a very good morning to you we're moving into every settled spell of weather for the week ahead as high pressure builds across the U.K. Through the early part of the week that it will pull in some rather cool air from the northwest and give us a couple of quite chilly mornings especially Cheese Day and Wednesday but there will be plenty of autumn sunshine around and so the afternoons should still turn out to be pleasantly warm with temperatures getting into the low twenty's back to today and we have a cold weather front there dividing the U.K. Into still some pretty warm weather to come to the south of it softening to the north considerably fresher fail and we find our weather front at the moment straddling the U.K. Across from Northern Ireland in to northern England so let's start with the weather for England and Wales and with the presence of that front generally more cloud around today but skies are clear to the south of the front as we start our day and it's been quite chilly ever night across the southern Midlands parts of eastern England and southern England but here the best of the sunshine 1st thing whereas across northern England the cloud will continue to bad rain I think even on into this afternoon perhaps some of that rain eventual fringing into the north midlands North Wales and Northern Norfolk temperatures today just 17 and 18 degrees across northern England we have the cloud in the rain the low twenty's quite widely perhaps at 25 or an isolated 26 in the southeast of England the Northern Ireland the weather front brings us a cloudy start to the day rain on and off through the morning but some heavy more persistent rain through the middle part of the day before it starts to ease I think during the evening perhaps a little light brightness a high of just that teen phenomenon in the soft name the Scotland after a very windy night it's still windy particular to the north this morning especially across the northern But the winds will ease this afternoon we'll see some sunshine for northern Scotland today for the South. Quite a bit of cloud around and some rain I think across southern Scott and perhaps a little reaching into the central bout as well the highs today for Scotland 13 to 15 degrees and that's today's weather we look forward to a fine unsettled week ahead. Thank you Susan the ethics of crowdfunding and how William Blake's unique beliefs shaped his art Sunday is it 10 past 7 now Brian Cox and Robert inspired turn to Radio 4 tomorrow. Is bank for series 20 I thought we'd be over by series to get it turns out there's a lot more in the universe tonight are still closed that cycle of the monkey cage arguably the universe is an infinite cage and if indicate he's very real Yeah I knew about all the monkeys but in about all the other stuff stuff we got to do with the mysterious art dinosaurs the science of dreaming what makes creatures clever and rich in space with Helen Sharman and Tim PICKETT We were Danny Wallace on bridge Christie Maxiell river sound Katy Brand It wouldn't surprise me for after another series of this we should have covered everything but still Robin and and Brian Cox The Return of the Infinite Monkey Cage B.B.C. Radio 4 tomorrow at 430. B.B.C. News at 7 o'clock on Sunday the 15th of September Good morning this is Chris Aldridge the former Conservative minister has joined the Liberal Democrats accusing the prime minister of adopting a scorched earth approach to Brecht's it the trumpet ministration has insisted that Iran rather than who 3 rebels in Yemen attacked 2 important oil installations in Saudi Arabia the former international rugby player Gareth Thomas has revealed that he's HIV positive. The former Conservative minister Sam Jima has been explaining why he's decided to join the Liberal Democrats Mr GMO was unveiled as the party's newest recruited its conference in Bournemouth last night he'd been a challenger for the Tory party leadership just a few months ago but was one of 21 M.P.'s stripped of the party Webb when they rebelled against Boris Johnson to block a no deal breaks it Mr GMO said he feared his former party was varying towards populism and English nationalism from Bournemouth thought political correspondent Jonathan played reports when Sam Jima appeared on stage last night as the latest M.P. To join the Liberal Democrats it delighted delegates here the former universities minister said the party had a unique opportunity to create a new force in British politics and while he said he hadn't taken the decision lightly the conservatives for him no longer represented the values which had drawn him to the party Sam Jima campaigned for a 2nd referendum and in an interview with The Observer said he'd become an outcast in the Tory party he's accused Boris Johnson of adopting a scorched earth approach to delivering bricks by October 31st and playing fast and loose with the Constitution with people's livelihoods and their security later today Party members here will debate and vote on a policy proposed by the leader Joe Swinson of revoking Article 50 and cancelling breaks it without holding another referendum if the Liberal Democrats were to win a general election before me a prime minister David Cameron has accused Boris Johnson of only backing bricks and to further his career in the latest extracts from his memoirs published in The Sunday Times Mr Cameron launches a caustic attack on Mr Johnson and the Cabinet minister Michael Gove he says that during the referendum campaign they became ambassadors for the expert trashing truth twisting age of populism or Political Correspondent Chris Mason has been reading the passages writing about Boris Johnson's outlook him backing leave David Cameron so. as the conclusion i'm life to 8 izzy risked and outcome he didn't believe in because it would help his political career he's even more critical of michael gove a cabinet minister now and a cabinet minister iseman savvy to remember the few who defended britain from the skies between July and October 940 sarah campbell reports the battle of britain peaked on the 15th of September 940 determine to bomb britain into submission the not c.f. False the lived fall for launched its largest military as strike around $1500.00 aircraft were involved in the aerial battles which lasted all day watching the dog fights from the ground was 17 year old george don inspired by what he saw he lay to join the are a f.'s bomb a command it was quite something to say they reject cry of 5 jemmy chala and the kaiser or a ammunition and take and

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