A republican. He was a marine corps veteran, but his new mission in life was to work against war and especially against Nuclear Weapons and nuclear proliferation. Were going to speak with 2 of Daniel Ellsberg, personal friends, randy credit, go a long time comedian and social justice activist. The former director of the william m counselor fund for social justice and host of the radio show live on the fly, which airs every friday afternoon in new york and armand coney. Hes a former Colorado County commissioner and executive director of a National YouthSports Charity. Gentleman, welcome to the show. Id like to begin by asking both of you how you met dan ellsberg for all of us who knew him. It was a memorable event. Certainly, randy, i think you and dan went back pretty far. How did you meet . Actually, we didnt seem like it because i met them. Uh, i called them up, but i think about 3 years ago else to do one of my shows on a julia such as 2021, mid 2021. And we had a great conversation. He knew all the people that i knew, william counselor, for example, and we got into a lot of stories by phone. And then he did a show by himself for an hour and a half. And then the, and suing couple years, he did it 9 times. And including the last time i spoke to him, he put it on so he interviewed me and to that was like 4 or 5 weeks ago. And that was it. And so, you know, thats my history with Daniel Ellsberg. And on almost immediately after meeting, den ellsberg, you spent some real quality time with him. Tell us about that. Yeah, um, in march of the thing was march of 2015. I flew up to new york. There was a conference, the 72nd anniversary of the dropping of the on thomas and japan. And there were some, there was a survivor there. There were people from japan, dan was one of the keynote speakers and i flew out there because he was a here of mine. From when i was a young. Im glad in 8th grade. And i wanted to meet him, and i walked up to him after he had spoken induced myself to him, lied to him, said i was a blogger, and asked if i could interview. And then we went into a, a quiet room and i interviewed him and then we went to lunch. I asked him if he had any lunch plans. They said no, we went to lunch and then ill get into this later. But i ended up spending 10 days with him at his house in may of 2015. Help him with the book of the doomed a machine that was just in its final drafts and interviewed them for 40 hours and how america has liked to go to war. Randy, youre a close friend of julian assigned someone for whom den ellsberg had a great deal of respect. Tell us about dans commitment to julian and about the relationship between the 2 of them. Well i, i dont think all the people have been doing that assign shelf since the 2016 account down to freedom. And, and i, ive had you on many times at john pilcher and the craig murray and so many others that are close to his lunch. But i gotta tell you, dan ellsberg those 9 times. Each time he was different. Each time he was poetic is prime. You can see that commitment in the never spirit himself, when i said im going to be doing a show on a saw just as im in. Uh so uh that guy at ease and he was like just in for him. He was in for daniel hale and for you and for a jeffrey sterling and so many other whistle blowers and but that, that assigned case really got to him. And he spent so much time we had conversations. So once a week, i call him on his phone and say that al squared year speak up. So i speak up and act and we have, we just loved the conversations. We are serious guy, a very serious guy. We did have a sense of humor, and we have diesel, a lovely chat. But the assigned case, like i said, nobody was more zealous and fervent and eloquent. Then Daniel Ellsberg on, i want to ask you about that quality time that you spent living with Daniel Ellsberg and with his family. This was during the period when dan was experiencing Writers Block of all things in trying to complete his epic work on the history of Nuclear Weapons. Tell us about that and about how he was able to break through and complete that book. Well i 1st id say just spending 10 days with dan and patricia in their home that um was a life changing for me. And i was uh, it was a week of my 56 birthday. And dan is a very, very present man. He, without questionnaires, may be, was, may be one of the greatest intellect. So of our time, the last of the mohicans. And we would sit in his office and studio in library with a 1000 books on war and american history. And the 1st or 2nd day that i was there, and just in his presence and with all these books, i was just and, and he would, he can talk, you would ask a question and he could go on one time in our interview, i asked him a question and i think he went for almost 4 hours without getting up going the bathroom or drinking any water. He, he had a mind that was just theres no words to explain it. And he did this with a, as randy and said, with a great presence and a great kindness. And a great mindfulness for the person who was asking the questions. One of my favorite stories is i think on the 3rd or 4th night there patricia and dan are sitting there. Were having dinner and patricia says to dance. So dan, how was that uh, working with r and and dances. Ive never had anyone who could do it on does and i said, mom, dad and at the dinner table and we laughed and patricia turns to me and says, how do you do it . And i said, well, dan has at least 10 stories going simultaneously. Any waves them together with a conclusion and create of ending hes a sort of, uh, its it, you just have to group this into a certain way and, and he would annotate the New York Times as he was reading that and for breakfast i, id be sitting there and hed be, hed be taking notes, he had a photographic memory, he had the ability to constantly over his life time to be reviewing every thing that was coming out from freedom of information. And at one point i said to him, how come no one is talking or writing about this . He said, because this information has only come out in the last 5 years. So what dan was able to do was give this oral history of how america has essentially liked to go to war over 50 years because he started out in this field with the ran institute when he graduated, harvard with a doctorate degree and followed all along the way and he made himself available to anyone you saw this and when people were remembering him how they met him at protests, if it was 30 years ago 20 years ago. And the time he gave them in order to make them feel like what they were doing was so important to our society. Thank you. Randy credit co and armand county for talking to us about your friend the great whistleblower Daniel Ellsberg. Were going to continue discussing the legacy of Daniel Ellsberg after a short break and stick around to hear how he dedicated his final years to stopping the proliferation of Nuclear Weapons state to. 2 2 the everything had changed with her daughter. She was completely when they came back and they told jamie, your daughter is having a diabetic ketoacidosis, i was miserable. I just felt sick and nauseous, and hardest cancer, diabetic per entourage. That affects every part of the organ assist. The expand or the American Diabetes association is that the American Diabetes association has been bought all by the millions of dollars that the pharmacy, to corp see. And then every year i wasnt given a specific diet i just told to inject and test. So i wish i could go back and change the governing bodies, put those recommendations out, forces physicians to live within those guidelines for fear of reprisals. People have not been told the full truth on how to manage the diabetes and what, what the consequences are funding low carbohydrate diet. There was a multiple 1000000000. 00. They found the corporations that were go bankrupt. Says 2060 numerous monuments to serve you as soldiers in poland, ukraine and the Baltic States have been destroyed or vandalized fish their stuff by the u within. Yeah. Im not sure. Or even some others could. I skip everything, so thats the most on whether its, its best for almost 3 of the Police Government denies the rule of, so itd be assumed just in the victory of a non system. And is it raising historical memories of world war 2 . Is the 40 piece from your story. Although it did seem the non c regimes, the trustees would remain, thinks in peoples consciousness, but have a but as long as russell phobia is profitable and brings dividends, you are willing to have a to rewrite the cost. Yes. To, to uh, take up the provides just leave me a message i need to see because it looks like so i need to be introduced to play the the. 2 welcome back to the list of ours. Im john to reaku. 2 were speaking with comedian and social justice activist, randy credit co and with former Colorado County commissioner and youth Sports Charity director armand coney, about their friend the great whistle blower. Daniel ellsberg. Gentlemen, thanks again for being with us. Randy. One of the things that dan devoted a great deal of energy on, especially in the last decade and a half of his life was the repeal of the espionage act. Dan always believed that the espionage act was unconstitutionally broad and vague. And he wanted many whistle blowers including Chelsea Manning and jeffrey sterling to appeal their convictions. When that didnt happen just 2 years ago, dan leaked more classified information and ask the Justice Department to arrest him and to charge them with the espionage. But that didnt happen. Tell us about that as well. You know, dan, of course, was very daring guy and he was dedicated to repeal of the espionage act which came in 1917, basically as a tool everybody knew and congress when they voted for that it had nothing to do with the ferreting out the german spies and everything to do with repressing any descent of the entry into world war one. Thats what it was all about. And almost all but 9 people who were arrested and convicted under that espionage act. All but your fucking were were non german, super 9 german sap were read. Were rounded up over that period of time. And then of course it was used during the 1st red scare. Uh, but uh, but dan knew all about it. It was, it was illegal. It was an archaic law, it had no purpose. And he said that what it was being used for it was, you know, it was like you official secrecy is act a secrecy atkin bread and thats what it had be come. Thats what it was. A tool of to do what the breast do and, and it would totally separate the 1st amendment. And he was obsessed with it. And i just wanted to say add on what arms are saying about nuclear war and is obsession with that. The last time i spoke to him last time i spoke to him, i just got back from dont ask him variable in my scale. And he wanted to get a feel on what it was like there. Because he was very customers. Think about the future. He thought that nuclear war was coming, and so he said, do me a favor. Lets get off the phone. Lets talk about assume, and thats what we talked about, what i was sharing from commanders in a dont ask about the use of a nuclear weapon. He said everything that you told me confirms what i believe and so he did. That was a deduce a book out when we talked about that. That was what was introduced a yeah. Machine. Yeah. So we talked about that. That was that i think was one of the last shows i had him and scott ritter on his book and dan, talking about nuclear war. So it was assigned to the 1st amendment. The espionage jackie was obsessed with trying to get repealed. And the, the possibility of probability of a nuclear paula cass holocaust. So dan was so passionate and, and its in like he just buried himself into everything that he did that he was committed to really did. And he was definitely a voracious reader and up to date on everything. And, and a very, a genteel individual and unselfish. I mean, really an incredible role model. The fact that he buried himself into these issues, even at this late stage in his life, it reminds me of i of stone at age 80, going to greece chandler x out of sweet, ancient greek. To write the book, the trial socrates on. I want to ask you about something that dan devoted his final years to that was the fight to stop the proliferation of Nuclear Weapons. He was passionate about this topic. Tell us about that. I think this is what mixed in such a fascinating hero of our time is that he never wavered and is commitment to bringing a speaking truth to power. And he is, you were asking about his Writers Block. I, you could say it that way, but dance intellect was one that no one could hold a candle to. So he was a perfectionist by my terms. And i said, after reading the draft of the book, this is done. What do you need more of an order to do . And it took another couple more years to finish it. But he always made himself available. Obviously, as he got older, it became more difficult for him to travel around, but he would go to washington. You go to other places, he was always on there. When he passed away, all of the main stream media was trying to bring the story back to what happened in 1971 when he released the pentagon papers. But in fact, what he was trying to talk about was, where are we now and what is the danger of how close we are to ending the world . And he says this in his book and to simplify it. Its not just one person in the us or a russia that has the ability to make the call and releasing a nuclear bomb. This is handled all the way down stream. And then if anyone makes a mistake, if any one was to make a call in different countries, i believe its 9 or 10 countries that have Nuclear Weapons that we could, we could be a just such a difficult time and a game changer and, and ending and so he kept wanting to put this out and it kept understanding that the media wanted to do the story of what the highlight was. And this is how we started our relationship in terms of me asking them questions. He said, how do you understand all of this so, so why was always fascinated on how the newspapers wanted to cover the injunction on them rather than the contents of the pen . Again, paper and i would implore every one this book is out of print. But secrets should be a book that is required reading in every high school in america, because it really gives you a d n a about how, how an empire called the united states. It would make a plan in order to go into a new illegal war. Randy, what do you believe the legacy of Daniel Ellsberg will be able to grow and in stature . Uh, you know, for an ever more i did. The fact is the man was very dedicated. Do you mean he was what . Uh uh. Melville called, uh, john brown. Uh, you know, a bd, theres a receipt every so often in life and he was one of those either so dedicated willing to go to jail. He was willing to go to jail and 7170 to do what get to say it was more important and he go to jail a then can not do what he did. So in any spot for all of his life, from that point on that to do the right thing and, and to support the, just to, to fight against a military adventure. And the people who were unjustly jailed uh, you know, and, and thats it. And he just just wants them to it and never flinched. And its so even all the way. And so he was 91 years old, 91. 00 plus the guy never met the never, never subsided. His it never. So ive subside and the energy and dedication that going put out there. And so its an expiration because he was so selfless and that its inspiration if he can do it at that age. You know, cuz i know patricia, you say wait a 2nd. I got a shoulder due date, i got 3 tomorrow i, i much address is going to kill me 5, you know, but he always, always wanted to get out there and get to work out a very wise person. And he disseminated that information. As i said, uh, you know, uh, without hesitation and very selflessly was he dedicated to, to his wifes work. So i think that dan ellsberg 50 or so now the world is still here in, in a, b, m e. And what are you called just the actual liberties . Not in the, in the, in the east river like it was on the planet or the age. The charlton heston. We will, we will, which we will. She will be bigger than ever. Theyll look back at this man if society the grows in the right direction. And on, dan was a major figure in my life and in yours, i want to believe that our children and their children and will learn about him and about his bravery in school. Do you think that will be the case . And i know because he was so advanced. I had 24th of july. So ago i was in california with my children who are now almost 19 and 17. And i called dan up and we went by his house for an hour and a half, and i had to prime them and explained to them what the vietnam moore was and the release of the pentagon papers. And that was of, for People Like Us who are dedicated to what is happening with our governments and societies we take for granted that their gender are our childrens generation are barely getting an understanding of what has happened in our lifetime. What i would liked in to be remembered for by those who have had a chance to look up to them. The anti war activists like myself and, and others, is that dan was a north star for us in so many different ways. One is i spoke to, i dont think there are many intellects like him who could retain the, the volume of information. We have to think of the, the arc of his work and what he was able to do and, and talk about and that he is as and randy said, who was on wavering and the fight. He has shown us that speaking truth to power as the true ethics in life. You can only really think of a couple of heroes who would be willing to give up their life for the cause if its a now samantha della, if its a Martin Luther king, john, youre a hero of mine. If it wasnt for dan meeting, Daniel Ellsberg, id never meet you and weve become close friends. Theres only a handful of people if its julian assigned. If its edward snowden, that has taken on this cause to reveal the lives of our government. And so as people for under standing getting out of under this rock or pushing away the cloud in the midst information and the gas lighting of our educational system of our think tanks or of our media stand will always be someone that someone should and could discover and thats what you will be known for as somebody who revealed that after world war 2 that america lied to go to war and kill millions of people and we did it again and again in the last 50 years. Thank you. Randy credit co and armand county for joining us. And thank you to our viewers. As i said at the start of the show, it is impossible to overstate the importance of Daniel Ellsberg in National Security was a blowing. Ive called him the godfather of all whistle blowers, without dan ellsberg and his courage there would never have been an edward snowden, a chelsea man and a tom drake. Or even a john curiosity. Ill be forever grateful to stand for his friendship, his guidance, and his sacrifice. My life was richer because dan ellsberg was in it. Im john to reaku. Thank you for watching the whistle blowers until next time. 2 2 2 the the, the gym and so just deal with the, with the one with taking the picture. They were proud of the muscle by the way, to go in your mouth because i didnt recommend your pins in there. Know that he got cutting away. Or i actually was who i see on google more guy and with then almost a week ago. And then well get to bundle the, the general say to us, love to the street. But this, this indeed reality last has never been did you purchase a i did you please give us a time to time prize size and call you to do this to yourself if its your ex thats i see v as in. Im sure this is a very Bold Decision by the gym and government to even stop because when the agreement was reached, gena, they did more divisions and more and more questions or more of those they are using to pay us what they are giving us just go to the Position Congress and now we have not been supportive calls. What has been happening here, it will open the ponder as box the next thing it will be them both then also have to pay the we have this to boom on tenderness in the united states. Really exported it now to the world because the multinational corporations and weve damaged the belief that babies needs be nurtured and cared for in love. And, and so youve got a whole bunch of traumatized people all over the world with post Traumatic Stress disorder that dont nobody here. The starting 1983 fishing with my father on a young man. The site met all exactly the same as a kid does. When he goes out in the lake and the communities and for a parent is with a rod real families and calendars for a really long time. My mom was pregnant with me still long winding. And i grew up on long line. Ive been having this issue since probably 1970 was my 1st year that i seriously pointed to the explainable biomass is near historically a levels, growth rate have dropped falling when its done and its worse form has of leveling effect. And it has a tendency to really just sort of strip away everything thats there. The wave fisheries are changing. Its the way our country is changing. Its increasingly hard for Small Businesses to make it abundant. Stocks are important. I mean, who wants to fish the last bit, the message i would leave to you is the importance of not giving up the importance of working together and also the importance of taking care of your corner of the ocean. The blue one and the put to most of the location of the unit 731 was a unique organization in the history of the world. What they were trying to do was to simply do nothing short and build the most powerful and most deadly biological weapons. Program that the world had every now through you know, to production with it. So just to show the great deal to the new suddenly a little bit through here. Keep a move model. Uh, mazda thought dismissed nguyen to one of our, from the sale of that. I dont understand, i wish to know about doing so need. I know he didnt hook us up more or less than a j o i had to put on with this kind of a my, the, i dont know, a party bill. You cannot push the couch. So for those people to go to 00, want this on this to should buy a new on it. So i can send more simone catering done on the, on the, on the put the ticket button together. The, the headlines most goes on. She sounds of key words latest attempted terror attacks on the crime in bridge. 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