Is a cultural shift if somebody doesnt shake it and its not the end of the world. And you countries including germany rollout drastic new measures to counter it with a 2nd wave of cold 19 as case number surge beyond the peaks seen back in spring. With your headlines ill be back again with another look at about an hours time to watch for to international so glad to have you with us. Hello and welcome to cross talk youre all things are considered im Peter Lavelle there is a saying in washington dont let the perfect be the enemy of the good this appropriately describes the political warfare. Over another stimulus package at the center of this standoff is who wins or loses just prior to the election in the meantime tens of millions are suffering with no end in sight. To discuss this and more im joined by my guest brad like unshipped in gothenburg he is they call me as a c g t n i freelance reporter for shin how as well as a r t contributor and in greenville we crossed to hana cox she is a newsmax insider contributor to the Washington Examiner as well as host of base a monthly vodcast all right cross talk rules in effect you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate it ok lets go to hannah 1st and that is theres a big standoff going on in washington. Another planned stimulus package and both sides of the draw on their lines in the sand. Do you think theres going to be one and maybe in your mind is it necessary go ahead. I dont think theres going to be you want to least not before the election and i think it depends on who wins the election in november well see if we have another one coming down the pipeline or not personally i dont think we need to have another one i think we need to reopen our economy we have had a 4 shutdown for many months we had an exasperating result of the pandemic weve been hurting Small Business as weve been hurting people and industries across the spectrums of our country its really dire we see that we already are experiencing shortages in a lot of areas we absolutely have to get people back to work americans are looking for handouts they want to do their jobs they want to go back to their businesses that they felt and the fact is that we cant continue to say an economy theres no amount of money that we can just throw people to make this go away the stimulus on the 1st time around was probably needed for the individuals i dont think that we should have seen and for in corporate welfare that went to the industries the 1st time around but certainly we dont need another go up and thats a democrats are pushing for and republicans largely agree brad what about you i mean i agree in many ways with having here but well it is far is working people i mean the very rich actually got richer during all of this they got they got welfare of their welfare that they didnt meet here but if you look at the 1st round it was the middle class and working people who were largely ignored or just temporarily given an injection what is your thoughts on this i mean should i im not interested in bailing out local governments or bailing out states when they anything like that im interested in a whole new get back on their feet and im the type of person that i dont like giving cash to people you know theres a lot of ways to help people but this is an extraordinarily time ok and a lot of people been put on their backs i because no fault of their own so how do you stand on this. Why i think we have to we have to look at it 1st and understand that letting people go on employed that was a Political Choice by the United States better government there was other countries for example in europe and where i live in the Czech Republic they were doing a wage subsidy system so for example you know they. Government will pay 70 percent of the furloughed employees wages so that was a way that we could have done it here in this country we could have paid a wage subsidy for people to keep their jobs instead the government chose to let people go on employed and course when we talk about this theres this republican talking about this painted small nonexistent non incentive to work well it was their choice im sure people would rather work as we talked about people dont want to hand out they would rather have their jobs because of course its more secure you know as far as whether were going to happen on the stimulus i think nancy pelosi in the notion or posi told minutes and we have 48 hours so my tomorrow we should see something and i dont think its going to happen peter say the truth i think we got it we really should go back oh if we want to point blame and i dont think its really appropriate to do that but i think that what youre seeing is mostly from the Republican Party because it was been its been them thats been refusing to convene matric otto didnt convene the senate until now we have a Supreme Court justice and it looks like hes lucky in that when he has election or to keep his Senate Majority because i think personally i think he thinks that trump isnt going to win and i think he thinks that the only way that he can keep his Senate Majority is by getting in green card justice you know brad say interesting is im pretty much drawn the same conclusion were going to hunt him down right now i think the thing i get that sense here is that i and this is very cynical and cruel politics in my opinion here because in there and i think among standard republicans and we can make it as we can make a separate program that. They dont see trump is winning this election and they will inherit an economy that has deteriorated even more id like to point out to our viewers we have a situation similar to this in 1032. 00 going into night when Franklin Delano roosevelt was a knock you rated and that was from november to march this i mean its going to be from november. General what do you think about that if its true is it really cynical part of the republicans. I think its a really cynical outlook and there might be a few that feel that way certainly i dont think youre going to see a lot of people eager to help joe biden bring in a great economy and so i think maybe you know theres a small amount of people that would be in that camp but i think most people that are in the republican camp recognize that we cant keep doing anything like this is not sustainable that its not going to actually clogged the bleeding for very long and that we have to really move towards other solutions now it is important for now republicans were happy to move forward with another stimulus plan and the difference was that they were bickering about the amount for the democrats the democrats wanted some a trillion the republicans wanted like well lets try and they both are ok with spending of vast amount of money and so i think that maybe theyre playing politics with some extent i think certainly they they are preparing for trying to lose i think its definitely bidens race to lose at this point it seems like its trending in that trajectory so well see what happens as a whole i dont think that theyre coming through alicia standpoint i think this comes back to free Market Limited government view points and we know that many like this bailout like this dont work and again they always save for their cronies the people who are wealthy the few the connected the big businesses they dont go to the little businesses they dont go to the people its a really screwed up way and i cannae well great it goes back to you know youve all heard it before i mean if we look at this year 2020 then the very rich got socialism and in the the rest of the people that will is im ok i mean theres something inherently unfair about that i mean you know it ideologically im probably closer to one on this year but at the same time you know you have these issues of people losing their homes when you lose your job you lose your health care is one of those peculiarities of the United States here i mean theres a lot at stake right here because you know i look at how the europeans that if you keep people whole but thats the hope thats the goal keep old as we get out of this year and i think that you know. There should be more of an effort on this by both Political Parties because you know the way i look at it is that you know its who is going to win and lose the political edge going into the election and tens of millions of people i mentioned in my introduction they dont really matter theyre not part of the political calculation that they might being too cynical going after a. Well i think thats right of course the whole o. C. I mean you know people on the left always say oh i see needs to be more hardcore she needs to be mark or the negotiations but that its not this is not a right shes not a very tactful politician of course shes just trying to tank the election for trump she knows if another stimulus gets out hes got to check going to people with his name its going to help him even just a few months and she doesnt want it you know its of course its petty but the real tragedy here is look if trump loses if this happens if she does not get this stimulus passed trump loses were not going to have stimulus until january or february for individuals i mean thats just how its going to be i mean theres no way like i can said republicans dont want to have joe biden a better economy im sure Mitch Mcconnell i mean what you know in kentucky where i live we call him the darth vader about i mean thats really his ideology hes you know hes just going to bring a reckoning for democrats we know that its going to happen because you want so when the midterms i mean hes just only ideological i think trump is not committed you know to his job personally i mean i think that trump hes not committed to this job i think he doesnt want to get it if he loses it if he loses you know that hes hes out you know him and brad brings up such an excellent point here i mean you know what was it one of trumps last tweets i mean you know i mean he tweets a lot so maybe it was a 24 hours ago you know you know go big or go home ok i dont understand why it wasnt saying this weeks or even months ago ok i mean this is just. A negligence political negligence here right now and it gives too much leverage to nancy pelosi and and i think i dont see him going on twitter and this and staring down the g. O. P. In the senate saying you know if you dont do this im coming after you im coming after you on twitter and he never does he is actually very distant from these they go she asians until the last the last inning is if i can use a baseball for him well i wont pretend to be able to psychoanalyze trump i miss can feel. It is most american sister hes coming from and what hes doing on this day so. Ill leave that to people with better degrees than me but i will say that certainly there its kind of a rock and a hard spot there right id like to see polling on what percent of the Republican Party actually supports emulous and wants to see another round of it i know speaking as someone whos kind of more of a libertarian bent on Republican Party i dont want to see another round of stimulus i dont want to see more of my tax dollars going to United Airlines or American Airlines or or to boeing you know thats ridiculous and its a lingering wonder well what about 2 workers to work there is that the 1st round you know and i think if anything im very rarely in favor of Government Spending programs but if anything if there is some sort of for shutdown as we experience and people are being forced out of war then i think it is appropriate to get people to know their tax dollars back that they have paid into the system as we saw happen with the call 100. 00 checks that most americans got now that was not aware that the vast majority of those trillions of dollars in the 1st stimulus package their lands right that was a very small percentage and i have no faith that this congress would in any way make sure a 2nd round was better that we know who theyre going to find in these things its never the people they dont on the people thats not the way our system is rigged and so it is a really screwed up version and its not capitals and its not free market and the 1st place but certainly when were looking at forcing people out of business were not i mean in a bailout people should be dealt out which again are the individuals and the Small Business owners but what is until you are both Political Parties i mean theyre trying to garner their votes the peoples votes when they cant be bothered to sit down and get get into the weeds because like i said bailing out the airlines no im not for making sure people that work at the airlines get something that get them through im florida ok and because the airlines were bailed out and then they go buy their own stock and then they fire people all against the rules that if a middle sized business in Denver Colorado breaks the rules youll end up in court for godsake for you know defrauding the government ok go ahead brad before we go to the break. Well you know as far as bailing out the companies i mean i think theres some argument to be made that it actually could be a good thing if it is tied to the condition that you dont lay off your employees and i for example i was there when they were or it was the condition before they did. Well and they were there was the condition before and then some of them said oh you know we dont want the government money now like now magically dont need the government money when they say you can lay off your workers we had a similar situation over there were going to do it with t. S. A. Check Airlines Smart wings group in the Czech Republic the government was going to say ok hey will balance out but the government going to be a 90 percent shareholder so i personally would be in favor of that if the government actually took over the hill or solvent and then you know them back. So im back yeah i mean its good work theres an argument seem to be made here if you let these companies go out and people are out of work obviously the economy has tanked i mean i think the government has to have a really central role and i think if you look at the ecomil the only economy a major economy thats growing this year and the one that is now the largest economy in the world by purchasing power parity and thats exactly what it does well thats what its very interesting and i think you know this this is because people were forced to go on unemployment i think that we have to have a serious rethink and what government should do when were going to do that after a break were going to jump in here were going to go to a short break about to that short break continue our discussion on the stimulus package they are. The single greatest most important aspect of any functioning society is price discovery prices sky very more so than any moral or aesthetic or ethical. Kind of set of rules because without sound money without sound prices coverage you dont have a society full stop. Americans love buying homes. This was a fundamental part of how our Political Leadership and our country a large understood the bargain you get a whole and then you know rebel right thats the things you dont revolt if you have a stake in the system. And be really interesting to dial it back and think about the longer deeper history ill play housings men in the United States not just that question of the American Dream but the bigger question if you the dream has been for. Welcome to cross talk where all things are considered im Peter Lavelle remind you were discussing a new stimulus package. Ok lets go back to him here i mean you know one of the things ive been thinking about during this entire economic crisis because its a crisis depending on where you are i mean if youre unemployed you dont have health care its a depression for you and if you have a squabbling politicians in washington jockeying for political advantage well you dont know what to do maybe youre going to lose your house are going to go into bankruptcy so many think there are so many of those stories going on here but i mean it i think its time to start rethinking what the economy should do for people here because as weve pointed out in this program the cronies and their friends say you know theyre given money that they didnt even need so you know i consider myself a conservative but i dont think of myself as a libertarian because i would like to use government and government money to get my agenda through and not just say let the market take care of it because the market isnt taking care of it ok its not ok 2008 now we have to help when we have to hey im almost finished will we ready for you are you going to you have a growing number of people in america they just see the economy as a wreck for them the millennial i mean go even further back i dont respond well i think this notion that weve had a kind of a free market in this country in my lifetime is kind of laughable we have it its like people who want to tie up the market regulations and red tape and say look at the family thats not saving you well it cant its tied up its bogged down well. Weve seen is an economy that has been wracked by people doing what you said pushing for the agenda they want to say they want to pick winners and losers they want to do what they think is best manipulate the economy and it goes badly every time we see that that has hurt people weve seen that that has enriched a lot of the few and continued to make the lower half of our society poorer it doesnt work and thats why we do need a free market because this allows people to give money to the places that are actually producing something that makes their lives better and thats all that free markets mean instead we have these businesses propped up i would love to never fly American Airlines or Delta Airlines again but because theyre and that with the government they control the routes they control how many gates they get at the airports they control largely different cities that they go to i dont have a lot of options because these businesses are propped up by the government they fight they lobby they spend money to prevent new airlines from coming in Offering Better Service as offering Cheaper Services thats what happens when you see the government get in bed with this we always lose as the consumer we always loses the employees its not a good deal and so i have to push back on the notion that the 2008 recession and all of these problems were the cause of the free market thats not true we know it was the cause of government getting a battle is ridiculous it only note ok fine and we can agree on the point to be the winners and losers are always picked it and its in the end its because they have influence in washington again in 2008 barack obama had the chance to of a lifetime of to be a great president and to sort of pushing back on these big banks that destroyed the lives of so many people but he didnt ok and the people who are left behind i mean the number of people that experienced bankruptcies and being thrown other house but theyre still feeling it today and 2020 and now we have this happening again i mean but i think were maybe are going to sides of the same coin and let me go to brad here i mean i think you know when we have a situation like this and the government exists of its magnitude United States. Its incumbent upon the government to go in and intercede and they dont agree with them here this is not something for ever ok not forever but to make sure people can get through this year because what were seeing right now is like a recovery where the lower and lower leg of the case means you dont even matter you dont even really imagine the economy anymore so lets why should we help you theyre just being left alone and forgotten because theres no political consequences or thats a dangerous situation. Now well i mean though and 08 crash this is totally because of deregulation i mean its because of the Derivatives Market all that stuff that was. The decriminalization of some of these really risky and Different Things i mean look this is totally because of deregulation and that same thing were saying now. What what were seeing now in this country. Well what weve always had in this country is exactly as you mentioned is that we have the supremacy of capital over the government and because of that we have this system exactly as it works when we talk about the total free market libertarian pure capitalist system i mean this is academic its so my friends that are go musha listen to calista know whatever i mean this is cool like you want to go live in this kind of world that never existed i mean go right ahead but this is the real world there are systems which which the government is heavy rain supreme over capital and then again as i mentioned before the break if china china has broken what i what ive seen now that we are living now in the great transition some people calling it you know from china and United States going 2nd china becoming the 1st World Economy or major power in the world and. Peter im sure youve read mark fisher as capital a surrealism we have now i think broken this realism this capitalist realism where we are programmed to think that this is the only way that things can work which is the only way to be successful the only way to create Economic Growth its just not true when you look at it you see and in this country i have. Family here that im with now the United States thats Something Else america is the greatest country in the world where you have so much Economic Growth and you look at the unemployment you look at how many millions of people are going unemployed how many people are losing their homes how many people are going to get to that who day who is that great for i mean and we also have the democrats are saying no to be this election is going to destroy you know the world is going to put on like joe biden but you know for most people the world already over. I was rushing back our analysts saying i dont think you know im very successful about capitalism it was starving their people were starving and still we opened up trade with them until we started buying their products until we opened up capitalism for their people the only reason china surpassing us is because we have been spending money into places we shouldnt spend money weve been involved in too many countries Foreign Policy weve been playing defense for too many people weve been taking the wrong end of the stick for decades and were allowed other people or youre going to have ratted me out and you know a. Hugo i would i would have to finish go ahead with it ok well no im just im saying i think that theres this really weird thing that i see happening or people point to china and say look their systems working better than ours their system wasnt working better than ours are people are brutalized their people are still not given basic freedom of choice basic freedom of movement its not any kind of place to point to and say look kind of better theyre doing than us theyre not and its only by our openness that they in any way are feeding themself so i think that you have to point back to use habits and successes that its so great that when we even get a little bit of a capital is going into the market in communist countries theyre able to elevate themselves quite rapidly because of that buying Power Exchange i mean i think the thing is that how things work market is not capitalism is not a market i mean you can have markets under a socialist system but i think if you actually look at those speeches that she shouldnt think gives or the communist party of china i would i would really challenge you to find anything that bet is talking about this premise c. Of capital over the communist party. Is ridiculous i think and the idea that there isnt some basic liberties in china let me say what i have a friend right i know somebody who works at c. C. T. V. Who is the biggest trump supporter in the world ever mcgregor you know i have another editor that i that i work with as he did jim thats a fan of connellys or rice george bush and Boris Johnson they have more free speech and freedom of thought in china than you can even imagine in the American Media and that is particularly part of what makes them so successful. They literally shut down t. V. Channels when they show different times rallies and statements they cant use Different Social Media channels they have book burning and they go into hong kong and disappear people who in any way are running to where they are so i know its an internet i never see what why is that here or there i mean what what what i think that you know the this whole exceptionalism ideology in the United States you know its going around pointing fingers at everyone else but what about the livelihood of tens of millions of people in america i think we should focus our attention that ok and on top of it ive been to china you know capitalism exists in different forms everywhere theres certainly chinese characteristics of it ok but as we have tens of millions of people struggling in the United States a half a 1000000000 people in 50 years old out of poverty ok so for me its 2 civilizations that are very very difficult to compare though they both have similar economic systems and in china its working for chinese a lot better thats what tommy here had to respond. Well i just disagree that its working for chinese People Better either quality of life is no where close to what the quality of life is in this country and why do you think we need to focus on workers we do need to get people pathways for to make sure that they are able to pursue their passions their dreams to work hard and see the results of that i think its utterly ridiculous to say that our poor in america are living so much worse than poor in other countries we do see consistently that people in america have it better than other countries we do see that you still have better opportunity here then you have many other countries theres a lot wrong theres a lot being rigged the system is not free market is not happening is that this point and thats wrong and we need to remove those barriers that actually hamstring people what we need to rapidly running out of time weve had trump for 40 years ok and his supporters will say the economy was you know buoyant doing very very great until january february ok and they keep running on what happened the past nobody votes for the past nobody vote for the president oh is joe biden if hes elected how different will the approach be better because it seems to me it doesnt really matter because they have the same donors and they could still be making pandering to the same rich people you know this is all compute the theater whats going on right now because there are fundamental problems that are not being addressed and that is it doesnt look good go ahead year. Well i think youre absolutely right im not a trump and i think its laughable when people say hes a free market candidate or person like what i havent said i dont want to get i dont know what i want yeah theres nothing to me that really symbolizes that hes done a couple good things right like i think the regulating has been good i think weve seen some good news from that i think the a little bit tax cuts we got were good and yeah there was a good economy for a little bit there but youre right people will go back and vote on that theres also been some really bad things there was a trade war going on that was continuously going to have ruinous effects on our economy and i think some of that i swept under the rug due to the pandemic and so it was sort of a mixed bag economically for me all along as far as looking forward you know when i am comparing and trying to decide what i personally am going to do i dont see much of a difference i think youre exactly right i think both will continue to be bought and paid for i think thats the problem is systemic right the problem isnt the candidate people who say market we have better candidates why cant we have you know more options why cant we have x. Y. Z. Well there isnt this because the system is flawed at its very core and were not talking about addressing those are problems here but the system is lot ok you cant break into it ok i mean we have trust we have these monopoly companies that the cost of entry is just impossible right now and we have 2 Political Parties it doesnt allow different you know im a conservative but i have nothing to do with the g. O. P. Ok and i know a lot of i know a lot of left wing people that just find the Democratic Party to be a play i mean there are millions and millions of People Like Us who were shut out of the game ok because of the donor class and so many other things here i talk too much of my own program thats all the time we have you want to. Write a permit for joining us here in our state so you next time remember. Is your media a reflection of reality. In a world transformed. What will make you feel safe. Isolation or community. Are you going the right way or are you being led so. Direct. 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