Protestations about iran come at a tricky time for him Israeli Police are recommending that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu be indicted on two Corruption Cases the recommendations follow a months long investigation into allegations of bribery well in the latest book by our next guest israeli Prime Minister netanyahu who denies all allegations comes under fire for more than just bribery joining me now amidst yet more bombing of palestine by the British Armed Israeli Government is present open finkelstein his latest book is called gaza an inquest into its martyrdom thanks so much norman coming back on the show israel back militarily by the u. K. Is again bombing gaza a sad time in this for the book. When i wrote the book i didnt expect that it would be timely i wrote it as a historic document because palestine and gaza in particular were falling off the news much to my surprise because the situation in gaza has reached the breaking point since two thousand and twelve the un reports have been saying it typically right will gaza be livable in twenty twenty then the next reports i think its going to be sooner than twenty twenty and now in the past month not just un reports but israel has been saying gaza is on the brink of collapse or reaching the point of no return and so theres a lot of desperation israelis fear that diseases break out in gaza theyre going to spread to israel and so were. Turning point a crisis point not sure what you would want to call it to be essential fact as i see it is this. Seventy percent of the people of gaza are refugees more than half are children theyre trapped theres no way out and the u. N. Reports and even israel is saying the situation there is on livable now you use your own semantical imagination how would you describe a situation where people are caved into conditions which are literally on livable what word would you use im not going to use that word use your own imagination and thats the United Nations relief and works agency put it it said gaza is unique in the world in this one regard wherever there is a natural catastrophe say there is drought. Or a human made catastrophe say war in syria the people always have the option to flee theres always the option to flee gaza is the one case the one instance in the world today where there are verging on an on livable situation thats not poetry thats a physical biological fact livable ninety five percent of the water in gaza is unfit for human consumption each day when a child drinks water the child is poisoning him or herself but they cant leave their caged in as your former Prime Minister put it gaza is an open air prison lets just skip through because i know you go through the day doctrine which is to do with lebanon and then explain who goldstone judge goldstone is and how initially he caused sadness than an uplifting feeling amongst those who support the palestinians and then ultimately the tragic and was an important moment and i hope youll allow me to give you the time to explain under International Law war crimes consist of three things disproportionate attacks indiscriminate attacks and targeting of civilians. Those are equivalent under International Law that is to say there is no hierarchy this proportionate force indiscriminate force and targeting of civilians are all considered equal war crimes along came Goldstone Goldstone had three so to speak immunities i mean even number one is a very respected International Jurist meaning the number two is not only jewish but hes not jewish just by fortune hes proudly jewish hes very self identified as a jew number three he self identified this is zionist he doesnt run away from that label thats who i am he sits on the board of directors of the Hebrew University in jerusalem his daughter did what is called namely she when she went to israel for nationalistic reasons he is a bona fide zionist jewish respected jurist he produces a report and he crosses a red line it causes a red line he said the attacks were not in the sensually disproportionate and not essentially indiscriminate he said the purpose of operation cast lead was to punish humiliate and terrorize a civilian population in other words israel israels objective was not military it was not targeting combatants it was not targeting military sites its objective was the civilian population that was a horse of a totally different color and just very briefly and then and then suddenly here we can judge well he came under huge attack personal attack professional attack dredging up his past when he was a judge in south africa under the Apartheid Regime going for the moral juggler telling him he cant attend his grandsons bar mitzvah in south africa hes a South African with a south African Citizen and still is comes under tremendous attack and then on. First two thousand and eleven which is april fools day in the United States we all thought it was a prank opened up the newspaper Washington Post he recanted the whole report because he said that he had underestimated the number of hamas military casualties because previously everyone had said how is it that hamas had been untouched by the british back warplane as strikes well killing songs goldstone claim that he recanted because of what he called new information that since he had published the rip the report was published he came to new conclusions based on new information i went through all the new socalled new information there was no new information its very clear there was no new information i can even say ill admit i cant prove it but i talked to a very respected jurist who knows goldstone very well very well he said theres no way he wrote that we cant in the Washington Post he knows his style this it was it was very murky calling from him because a large part of the book there then goes on to got it right so im going to not let me get to the point after he recounted everybody got scared because in my opinion i can prove it again he recounted not because of the public pressure but because he was blackmailed the public pressure i go through the details doesnt make sense i think it was blackmail he said of course. They found dirt on him everybody even the most you why Amnesty International well because after the goldstone everybody got scared what is what is israel got a nice everybodys got a skeleton in their closet and even the most intact couple person has a relative who has a skeleton in their closet personal threats and means that i see over this i think there were personal threats or fear of personal threat and so what happens after. Operation cast lead in two thousand and nine there were about three hundred human rights reports everybody was weighing in after operation protective edge in july august two thousand and fourteen which was many times worse in operation cast lead six thousand homes were destroyed during cast lead eighteen thousand during operation protective protective edge three hundred fifty children killed during task five hundred fifty children joined protective edge there were you know you could count on the fingers of two hands the number of human rights supports Human Rights Watch put out a substantial reports after operation cast lead after operation protective edge one simply forget about what i mean you do say it in the book planet of the national and so am the state was the only one that actually weighed in after the operation protective five reports complete total disaster i want to just say because the city may be listening and i want to say i dont the book is not written with malice against amnesty i was so crush i was so devastated because i had depended on amnesty if you look at the first four chapters in operation cast lead a lot of its based on amnesty they put out a very good report of the twenty two days of the. Operation cast lead twenty to the death and destruction. Stuff on protective edge you wanted to see you were like suffocating what are you doing here ill give you one example. They put out a report its called families under the rubble and it describes israels targeting of homes during operation protective and it says while israel destroyed all these homes many civilians were killed and they said attacks were disproportionate the attacks were indiscriminate but then they say we think there was a hamas militant in this house and we think it was a hamas militant in that house and we think it was a hamas militant as if as if this was a legitimate military attack that had become excessive but then you read the breaking the silence the Israeli Soldiers who were in gaza and they described what happened and what you see happened was. Im using their words they go into a neighborhood they roped off the neighborhood they bring in the denying bulldozers and now this is the words they use they bring in the bulldozer they say both those it goes back and forth back and forth demolish is one house now demolish is another house then it says demolish is a neighborhood back and forth twenty four seven back and forth they said alice is if they were in a sandbox. I dont no one comes amnesty and pretenses if there were big military targets theyre ok visible in ill just stop you there were going to go to a break more from professor no one because im in part two of going underground. Ok everybody im stephen ball. Hollywood guy youll suspect every proud american first of all im just george bush and our visa to suggest this is my buddy max famous financial guru just a little bit different im not. Going to harness the inner windows up with all the drama happening in our country and im shooting the road have fun meet everyday americans. And closely start to bridge the gap this is the Great American people. The. Local walmart selling you on the idea that dropping bombs brings police to the Chicken Hawks forcing you to fight the battles that still. Produce offspring to tell you that sloppy gossip and tabloid myself of the most important is the day. Off the bad guys and tell me you are not cool enough to buy your product. These are the hawks that we along with our audience will watch. Welcome back were still here with professor Norman Finkelstein can i just take us back to the eightys the first intifada now that really were now approaching the. Quote if you quote little ignoring. This is when britain labor and tory governments were refunding them that they were trying shooting to kill shooting doing just beatings mass arrests torture trial detentions sanctions of course and yet they still keep on fighting the child is now in the news i had tamimi. Hopes you think of getting a fair trial and the only democracy in the middle east theres no hope of her getting a fair trial if you look at the record in fact the that the Israeli Human Rights Organization for the occupied territories it has stopped. Coordinating and cooperating with the Israeli Military trials because its just forces so were not going to even bother anymore to go through the motions because all it does is provide a. Smokescreen for israel that theres a Legal Process going on when there isnt so we can leave aside that its a done deal shes not getting a fair trial but we have to look out the potential there is a potential there the palestinians have basically tried three strategies they have tried to armed resistance thats gaza the fact of the matter is speaking honestly they want they want into combat with israel three times cast lead protective and most called pillar of the fence in the number two thousand and twelve each time the goal was to say to end the siege then work it didnt work i wanted to and that brutal illegal immoral siege it didnt work the armed resistance is not produced the result the objective that they sought we all can agree its now kind of not the discussion and. More diplomacy doesnt work its a waste of time they called the fancy hotels they just talk and doesnt change and eventually america. Seems to back that point to the hell still go to still go to the meetings because he likes the five star hotels but there his head as the reason but that is the reason im not a complete imbecile which is a serious possibility and he doesnt even realize that nothing is happening and joy he would say is for the positive i write stories like. This. And then there is the third possibility which is mass nonviolent resistance and i do believe that it has potential and live action or not i had to go after your book. And some people may wonder because obviously there was a one to one woman that hit israel and one against israel was always has will how will it what is no violence that youre talking about how does it fit in with gun the and with with military well lets be clear i am very emphatic in the book the palestinians have the right to arm resistance they have the right to fire their socalled rockets at israel i do not waver i am not equal on that point i said at the end i will say i say they have the legal right look at what the law says i go through the law very carefully they have the right to resist with armed force the Israeli Occupation and the israeli denial of their right to selfdetermination but there is a big has that separates what you legally have the right to do and whats politically prudent that is to say what works and i say in the book that although they have the legal right and i will not for a moment retreat into. Howard this from that point i say politically it has not produced the results that were your announced objective namely to end the siege on the other hand i do believe that mass nonviolent resistance has the possibility lets take a simple example the image that. Illuminated the palestinian oppression during the first intifada was the little children with the stones the children of the stones as it was called and when National Public opinion accepted the right of children to throw stones in the face of this is really killing machine they had the right to throw stones against israel the occupiers now imagine use your imagination for a moment the israelis were raging they were furious they were driven mad by this little girl i had them in me who smacks an israeli soldier how dare you smack and goober mention how dare the intermeshed in the subhuman smack and over mention and its really soldier and they were all these serious debates on israeli t. V. Whether the soldier was showing honor or the shot what the soldier was showing how or this by not reacting to the girl imagine if the palestinians adopted the strategy every woman should smack a soldier smack a soldier today just like we have the meat to movement let them have a me too i snapped a soldier this really should go mad. Men and he has an opportunity a possibility now thats according to gandhi by the way one of the things he says is if a woman is being raped and the woman to resist the rapist she smacks him she scratches him she pummels him this is in my view thats not violence thats the person trying to summon the moral courage to die with dignity he says i dont call that violence. He said when you have such a vast disproportion in power between the zero presser and the zero press with the oppressed in cages and some kinds of what you might call symbolic resistance or he said in my book thats not violence so he said in one nine hundred thirty nine the german verma the army the aloof to invade poland poland comes out with a few tanks a few artillery pieces to resist the german army and air force gandhi said thats not violence either now g. Is exactly with the palestinians a few token rockets or a young woman smacking a soldier whos been occupying humiliating degrading destroying the lives of people for fifty years five decades and she doesnt have the right to smack this person who invades her home kills her cousin you know you have that right even not leave aside the international or even the apostle of nonviolence Mahatma Gandhi said you have that right i have no doubt none whatsoever if he were alive today and he was as you might know a strong proponent of what he called dr an arab right in palestine it wasnt a palestinian right adverb right in palestine and he was very emphatic in one nine hundred thirty six as you know there was the arab uprising against the British Occupation of palestine and gandhi was asked about it and he said look. I wish they would adopt the tactic of nonviolence i wish but he said according to the canons ca and awareness according to the canons of right and wrong they have the right to use armed force in other words according to current legality and morality are people under occupation have the right he says i wish they would choose my strategy but they arent under a legal obligation to not resist the people of gaza they are under a legal obligation to just lay down and die of blockade a blockade which is at the point of making the place on livable unlivable the whole International Community knows it israel itself says it and theyre supposed to lay down and die they dont have the right to resist now that makes no sense to me so im not going to fold them im going to say i dont think its a wise or prudent strategy i think if you took the one million children of gaza you put them at the head of a mass demonstration and you marched in those checkpoints which are suffocating them which are strangling them strangulating them which are throttling them you march in those checkpoints and you say were going from room were growing through i think israel will have a very hard time when they kill children yes im not doubting it but the point is youre in operation protective they killed five hundred fifty children people of gaza got nothing for it the blockade is still there the siege is still there i think if you bring a bring a million children and. You raise a legitimate demand. And the siege and the blockade this place is unliveable the water is poison this will kill maybe ten kids maybe ill kill one where the way way before you reach five hundred fifty if they manage to stay nonviolent the people of gaza israel will be forced by International Pressure to break the siege present on finkelstein thank you. Joining me now to go through some of the weeks headlines is broke and former liberal democrat member of Parliament Lembit opec he wrote the headlines i have there some for you quick switcheroo u. K. Prime minister meets the dutch pm today yes he lost his foreign minister over putin so whether these connections that weve got between german corbin and something russian and salvi at and eastern and evil and evil you know that because its in the mail online the reason made months Jeremy Corbyn authorized the release of his stars efile after he was named in a foreign spy dossier as a contact for a check agent you cant get a much longer headline jack mate obviously you have its just go i should because i was the first ever journalist in the study had quarters in the i didnt you know in the brig through and told them to keep the files safe so that we could find out things like this im safe maybe you were trying to conceal the dirty secrets of jeremy court is your take on this story its rubbish its complete rubbish Jeremy Corbyn as there have been afraid of his sympathy towards the left he was always a peacenik in his past days before being an even meeting diplomats i mean sir oh of come to get the Boris Johnson story which we dont have here whos he me toyo this is the other point Boris Johnsons friend friend has been exposed as a spy too but that doesnt count because hes concerned if you imagine the russian hostage doesnt count its just a little corbin because hed loves the russians maybe more so as you can go to defender of father than day on friday to moscow and commemorate all the millions if fought against the nazis unlike was present to the. As a celebration of the bafta this event i want to get now enough ok anyway lets go to a bank seventy three percent owned by the u. K. Taxpayer yesterday going well the herald reports r. B. S. Never challenged infamous let customer memo says conduct report lots of secret documents have come out suggesting a certain lack of respect for customers including one suggesting that customers should be allowed to hang another one saying that many of them are tiresome but remain numerous have slightly embarrassing concern i was the head of the financial conduct of already not releasing this until the Treasury Committee in parliament ordered them to what exactly is going on with regulation of the to here why dont you ask them because a lot of people are asking that same question this seems to be in the Public Interest because it suggests a certain attitude towards the customers who are bearing the brunt of the collapse of the british and frankly western Banking Industry they havent really come forward yet there will be apologies there will be red faces but it does give an insight into how grateful the banks were for us bailing them out maybe if we took the twenty seven percent back as well the bank wouldnt be letting customers hang and i presume that wasnt literally lets not go to a tweet from a very senior figure in the turkish government yes this is a complicated story. Colleen has tweeted hes a government spokesman into into his italian translate into english being a chance they didnt says the news reports of people id why p. T. Ill explain that in a minute agreements with the regime on afrin or apparently for propaganda purposes however it does not mean there are not some secret and dirty bargains going on whatever happens zayton dolly military action will continue taking place and it will reach its goal complicated to allow the turks in the truck that strike whats really underlying this is a web of intrigue which suggests that americas been fighting terror with terror is another group called the p. K. K. Which is regarded as a terrorist organization but american money american arms five thousand truckloads. Weapons have somehow been poured into this mass presumably to fight assad but actually that really hasnt made much of an impact except to give the terrorists songs thats why its so complex its not that complex russia syria the United States working with the allies in africa against britain and turkey no thats completely not the case nato civil war well its nato civil war but its not that civil war within the civil war because its not all clear why america is essentially backing both sides turkey is claiming that theyre the ones who are sorting out the problem to some extent it looks like theyre right but im telling you its exactly the biased well i think it should be on the side of washington or mosco finally united i cant believe you just said its against london now but anyway i meant ok self at the same time thank you thats it for the show will be back on saturday would be off the coauthor of britains twenty fifty modern slavery act the bishop of dolby alice to redfern if the idea of modern slavery in a society now driven to use food banks and rules the poor till then by social media as you know topping fifty years to the day of the death of marxist historian of the english revolution Christopher Hill author of the world turned upside down. Is Getting International recognition with the help of israel at least in the world of zoos. Dismiss it. Like you know. This isnt my cup of tea is going to sunday ill be. The only palestinians who gets the most help from its jerusalem counterparts i dont think theres some of those. Under that vision to look at. And the earth is all off. I know im going to. Do more. But theres a. News paper trying to german media with fake evidence of a russian troll farms meddling in the countrys politics. On the program or going home for suspected russian vaults twitter is believed to have blocked. American. Medal winning russian curlers. For. The Winter Olympics will take his case to sports. To discover why. Youre cheating in from right around the world this summer welcome to most
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