he wants to stay out of prison. and this is the only way he can do it. >> it's audacious again even one step beyond that because mike johnson is not only defending donald trump, not only suggesting he's a martyr, but saying the republican party is a rule of law. if you lookepis at the dictiona under the term gaslighting, that's it. like mike johnson suggests -- >> gaslighting with rocket fuel. >> yes. i just think, dan, there's been a lot of reported debate inside democratic circles about how far joe biden should go in the campaign, in thein re-elect campaign on this topic, and i wonder if you have a thought on this because there are fairly wise and established democratic strategists who say if he goes too far-out on this convicted felon thing, if he focuses too much on the criminality of this, he's going to alienate voters right there in the middle. and i wonder what you think about that. >> theyo convicted felon aspectf donald trump is one piece to a

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