Transcripts For ESPRESO 20240704

General and you were appointed ambassador to Great Britain . My name is vlasta lazur, lets start. Two people, who just a month ago were key leaders of the ukrainian army, turned out to be unfit for service. We are talking about Valery Zaluzhny, exchief commissar , and serhiy shaptala, former chief of the general staff of the armed forces of ukraine. They themselves did not officially comment on this information. The media wrote about it. On sources in the ministry of defense. Initially , the mirror of the week reported that former head of the armed forces of ukraine zaluzhnyi, who was proposed by president Volodymyr Zelenskyi to be appointed ambassador to Great Britain, was released from military service after passing the vlk. Later, ukrainian pravda reported that the same thing happened to the former head of the general staff serhiy shaptala. The latter has not yet been appointed ambassador, but it is possible for now. Rfe rl contacted the minister for an official comment. Defense, they promised to provide the details of the dismissal of zaluzhny and shaptala tomorrow, of course we will wait, but even without explanations , the defense will be canceled. Many questions remain in this story. The armed forces were led by the unfit, asks Maryana Bezugla rhetorically, peoples deputy and deputy chairman of the committee on national security, defense and intelligence. However, it must be admitted that for a long time she demanded the dismissal of general zaluzhnyi from the post of commanderinchief of the armed forces, and criticized his position on mobilization. At the same time , she reminded that zaluzhnyi and shaptala advocated the mobilization of persons with disabilities. The disabled zaluzhnyi and shaptala resigned through the vlk, but advocated the mobilization of persons with disabilities of the third group and denied the possibility to exempt persons with disabilities of the second group. The armed forces were led by the unfit. Another peoples deputy and representative of the defense and intelligence committee, roman kostenko, with whom i have already spoken directly on this topic, draws attention to Something Else currently , people who have both the second and third groups of disabilities serve in the ranks of the ukrainian army, many some of them took up arms in the first days of the russian invasion, and they still cannot be released from the army through the vlk, because this process is very long, complicated, overbureaucratized, kostenko told me. At the same time, vlk is currently the only legal way to leave the army, and here another question arises, could zaluzhnyi simply use this method to switch from military. Work to civilian work, well, because there are simply no other mechanisms, the answers to these questions can already be i can only give it myself, but as i said earlier, the exhead does not give any comments yet. Well, oleg simoroz, a veteran of the russianukrainian war and public and political figure, activist olezhe, joins our broadcast. Good evening. Good evening, i wish health. Each other olezhe, clarify this point, are those who say that it is very difficult to get rid of. Through the vlk, that it is bureaucracy, that it is months of extraordinary efforts, and that does not always work out, are they right . Yes, i confirm these words, as a matter of fact, i was discharged according to the decision of the military medical commission, i had a traumatic amputation of both high limbs as a result of a combat wound, but this process, well, lets put it this way, i basically understood everything from health, but this process is maximally bureaucratized. It is maximal incomprehensible, we dont even have an electronic document flow there, and to be honest , it also took, well, a slow, long process, a worse situation, for example, is also in my unit, when people have serious injuries, of the same limbs, and there are people , who received serious concussions, i emphasize serious, this is when there are violations, speech disorders, when, excuse me, a person seriously stutters, there are very, very Serious Problems with the psyche, unfortunately, we do not. Have any understanding about the methodology of Adoption Solutions of the vlk, they differ a lot many decisions regarding disabled people are not. Not clear, and frankly, such people are no longer useful in the army, they are transferred to reserve units, where they, sorry, protect themselves, we do not give them rest, they suffer , but the state is forced to finance them, that is why there are such problems at the military medical commission, and here the main story, which concerns mr. Zaluzhnyi and mr. Shaptala, is what the military and veterans do not perceive the most, this is what we showed. They said that the system is not the same for everyone, and, that is, well it would be half the trouble, how, if, and, they would show that there are problems, but here the story is shown, that for the generals it turns out, the system can be different, it is a story about injustice, and it is a completely inadequate story, yes, if they went through all this, you would understand that science is not right, you would understand that we have such wonderful legislation that even if you are appointed to a high job. The embassy and to a top position as an ambassador, and this is an important state job, in our there are no legal grounds to release a person, that is, i am just me i will clarify for people who have not encountered this, that is, the vlk is the only legal method by which you can be discharged from the army, even if you, i apologize, are healthy, but you really need it, then you can be discharged, well, if they really want to, well there is a need for a reason now during the legal regime of martial law, and there is no such concept as the expiration of a contract, even among contract workers, there is no such concept, as it is very necessary, even we see it as a high state job, there is no such thing, there is really no reason for this decision vlk, well , god forbid, if someone from your family died on war, if someone needs serious care, that is if you have a Family Member with a group of disabilities and he seriously needs care, then there is no such thing, and what im saying is that they used the story from. Well, thats still a conditional half of the trouble , but im sorry, well, the vlk is a story about bureaucracy, about corruption, about inadequate decisions, about queues, about shuffling from the wounded, and with all my respect and to the former chief of staff in the queues, no one has seen him at the vlk, where they are currently suffering , the boys sit wounded, for months, and it is inadequate there story, it is poorly resolved, here it turns out that. You can get it very quickly, i honestly say, yes, i also take it badly, because i have friends who even had one limb amputated, and they remained limited fit, they continue to serve now, that is, even after the amputation of a limb, this is not a reason for the vlk to dismiss you from service, during wartime, no, if there is one limb and it is there, whether it is a knee or treated, the vast majority of. Decisions vlk is limitedly usable in wartime and unsuitable in peacetime, accordingly, these people do not even have the right to resign, and here it is not a matter of whether i want or not, they are forced to continue their service, and the majority continue their service in televsion positions, but here is the story that they are not given rest, right away they showed us a story about the fact that if we really need to, we can use it, well, please, well, we are talking about justice, and we are talking about some civilized countries, i believe that it was necessary to go in a completely different way, and the authorities that appointed the meritorious for this position, and i think that Valery Fedorovych should do the same was to come forward with the position that this story should somehow be regulated by law, because it is a very unfair story in relation to those servicemen who are asked to remain in the service during martial law, explains that now everyone. Is important, we do it conscientiously, and in my case, i say, a lot of wounded, traumatized comrades are currently in military service, here we see such decisions that we generate with this, yes, we show that injustice is possible, everything is wrong, absolutely, it depends on how much you personally have took time to in order to pass, to undergo vlc, i had three of them, the first vlc was quite short, it. There was prosthetics, i was still lying in a military Military Hospital at the time, the second vlc was superficial, they decided that there would be another month, i was being treated, then i was dismissed, she every time after a decision, every time after submitting documents to the vlk, it was a month or two, but the last time i was dismissed, it was two months, i was waiting for a decision, but what is the story, well, the one who came, the one knows, its trash. With the bureaucracy, despite what i say, i was lying in the central Military Hospital, vlk i came to the central Military Hospital, they had to apply for such a photocopy of documents, they had to go through another. 500 examinations there to show that the legs did not grow back, as a result, then i had to independently redirect all these decisions of the vlk in my military unit, that is, not there is even a normal document flow, you play a postman, and you talk about your diagnoses yourself, you play a surgeon and so on, that is, i will tell two stories here, here is a trigger with the fact that there are simply a lot of things that are unclear, and yes, the second story, what it is really takes a long time. And that is, it took almost two months for me to have an extreme vlk, and after discharge, well, in my case, lets say this, i was still in the hospital, that is, i was not going anywhere, i was not in a particular hurry, but there is a story when people were seriously injured, they have already been discharged from the hospital and they do not know what to do with them, and they are waiting for this decision, because without the decision of the vlk they cannot continue home, for example, go, and, excuse me , half of the persons body does not move , and, well. What a cool position, for him it is necessary to recover for a very long time in order to simply be present in life, these are all the stories, and unfortunately, i say again, it is not that we do not solve them, we also show that if someone really needs, it can be done in a different way, but if it is very necessary, if a very high position, someone very high has asked, i say again, it breeds more injustice, and not those. Reforms in the army , about which we talk, shout, but alas, oleg, but look, the hardworking whisperer, they are not on another planet, they could not not knowing all those problems and those, all those moments that you are now talking about, what the vlk looks like, can you imagine what they were guided by when they gave their consent to this decision, look at my subjective assessment in. They whispered that shaptala and zaluzhny, i think, also have no political experience, but still zaluzhny is moving to a more political job, the ambassador of the United Kingdom to Great Britain, he is there, well, in fact, he is being reassigned there after the post glaucoma, and he is for this position, i think agreed in principle immediately during the conversation with the president , well , as a matter of fact, zelenskyy himself confirmed it, that they had discussed something about this with the president , i think that he did not pay any special attention to it, as a matter of law, yes , he will be written off, but they knew exactly the problems at the vlk, because i think that Valery Fedorovych knows very well why they fired the same ms. Ostashchenko, the former commander of the medical forces, by the way, by the way, also through the vlk, or how they could be fired, she was fired because of the history of turnstiles, and now the audit has shown that we have highquality turnstiles, it turns out, there were about 30. Thousand american ones, we have, sorry, a lot of units were supplied to the chinese, it cost lives, there are examples when it cost the lives of servicemen at the front, because of the history with the vlk , because of corruption, because of inadequate methodology, because of the fact that, im sorry, they humiliate simply the wounded at these military medical commissions, well, and too many other moments, there she was a great opponent, that we should have blood transfused at stabilization points and so further, well, absolutely just profane and. He knows why she was fired. Vlk, it was an integral part of this, this release. And the story that we vets, we , wounded servicemen, shout about the problems of the vlk, it is not new, it is highlighted in the ukrainian media, because i am not the only one of the wounded who talk about how everything is not ok there. Therefore, it is very unfortunate that i am 100 sure that they knew the real state of affairs, but decided that now is already. Lets say this is not the time, you can close your eyes and let yourself be used, i will say this, what are such actions of the authorities are somehow their joint responsibility, but it will reflect on the reputation of Valeriy Fedorovych zaluzhny, who is highly respected by the veteran community, by military personnel, but there are things that we will not turn a blind eye to, i believe, here he muttered. A little, a little differently, by the way, i wanted to ask you how you think this will affect the reputation of zaluzhnyi, and you talk to veterans, to the military, what they say about it, how unhappy or surprised the military are about this , this situation, i will say so, plus the military in that, that they say white in white, but they are not looking for any substitutes, they are not, they are not politicians, they say everything as it is. Indeed , zaluzhnyi has a very, very High Authority and we really respect him as the commanderinchief of the armed forces of ukraine, but i say once again, in this case, this is history. About injustice, about double standards , about the fact that if it is absolutely necessary, then it is possible to act, with the circle of people with whom i communicate, this is a fairly large number of servicemen from the native line of the army, so we do not accept such a position, such a decision, i say again, thats why that this is a story about double standards, which should definitely have no place in the modern army, generals, soldiers, sergeants, teams, they should be absolutely equal, before the law, before the law on military service, military duty, all procedures, all vlk must be held in the same way, moreover, we must sit in the same queues, but this is a simple position, therefore, unfortunately, this will reflect reputationally, well, inside the country, and in front of the veteran, veteran community. Among the military, lets hope that in the future, Valery Fedorovych will pay more attention to the concept of social justice , there is no doubt that he can define it that way, i cant help but ask this question, i know that criticism will probably be heard because of this, but please tell me, are you sure that Valery Fedorovych, the vlk really recognized him as unfit, how often does the vlk. And is it preparing the necessary conclusion . Well, look, the vlk can write any statement, because the vlk system is corrupt, yes, very corrupt. I, look, i do not undertake exactly, i will not undertake to comment on whether it is true conclusion, i wont take it, because i simply dont know what they were. There are diseases, well, visually, this is one story, but with all due respect, people could have developed chronic diseases there, which really, according to the laws of medicine, according to the laws of logic, well, this does not even fall under limited suitable service, when will we see this decision of the vlk , something tells me that we will not see the decision of the vlk and the clause under which the dismissal was due to health, but we should see it, do you think we should see it . Taking into account the demands of society , taking into account, sorry, even the political ratings, the level of public trust, i think it was just fair to its own people, and here it was necessary, look, well, i could be wrong, well, i appreciate the story, that this is a mechanism transfer to the embassy of Great Britain, as we said at the beginning, that this is the only, the only possibility to release a legally meritorious person from the army. I admit, okay, yes, but about it, but about it, it must be said directly, people, to be honest, that it was used simply as a mechanism, and so that this does not happen in the future, it is necessary to legislate that a person can be dismissed from the army if he moves to a top position, for example, in the embassy, ​​we would not have such problems if he is needed somewhere else, if the state still needs it somewhere, conditionally speaking, absolutely, because the situation in relation to military personnel is absurd, because now it can. As double standards, which is wrong. Oleg, such a question, do you think, in theory, zaluzhnyi still has the possibility to return to the armed forces, if he is still needed there, does the conclusion of the vlk put an end to his return to the armed forces . Well, first of all, how was he released as unfit for military service, that is, this is the same point as mine, there is still a comma after it. That he is excluded from military registration, and, that is, we cease to be conscripts. People, well, theoretically, but there must be grounds for this, but considering that this person has the rank of general, i think he can submit an application to review the decision of the vlk, if necessary, eh, well, everything depends on that , or admits the vlk has at least restricted him from being fit again , i dont know, by the way, maybe he was. Recognized as unfit with a review of his health status, but if it is, for example, some kind of disease that is curable, then in theory, in theory it is it is possible, it is possible to review such and such a decision of the vlk, i, well, this is, well, this is not an amputation, that is, i do not undertake to say what the disease may have been, but theoretically yes, this, this is possible, answering whether in in the future , a hardworking person can assume some position in the army, theoretically he can, but for this he needs to repeat the decision of the vlk, which recognizes at least limited to fit or suitable. Oleg, thank you very much, i will just tell our audience once again that we did not just invite you to comment on this topic, because you were wounded at the front and. And went through the vlk and you know from your own experience what it is like, and therefore we it was important to simply compare these processes in order to understand why it was necessary, or not necessary, given the short period, to pass Valery Zaluzhny through the vlk. Oleg, one more topic, i know you follow it. Recently we learned that Kyrylo Tymoshenko, the former deputy head of the office of the president of ukraine, is returning to the ministry of defense and will become a fulltime adviser to the minister of defense rustem umyerov. I will remind to our audience, the last time tymoshenko worked in the president s office, he was remembered for the fact that he used a car that jenner motors gave to ukraine in order to carry out various missions in the war zone , and then, after publicity, he returned the car to the military, as how do you feel about his return, what do you think why him they returned, they returned the status of an official, i will say yes, i am indisputable. Historically negative, but here i would like to turn to Rustem Umerov and remind him that there is such a thing as the institution of reputation, sorry, mr. Kyrylo tymoshenko is an absolutely negative character, the one who, during the fullscale invasion, distinguished himself by initially riding a very luxurious porsche cars, then he decided to change to a car, which was determined for the humanitarian needs of our country from ours. Partners, he decided to use it not only in his work, journalists have already investigated what he used in principle and for his own purposes, in his life, which is absolutely unacceptable, in this case, Kyrylo Tymoshenko was associated with corruption in the reconstruction of roads in a large construction project, this is also a verifiable fact and its traces are very. Vividly traced in the journalistic investigations of our ukrainian journalists, that is why for me this person is negative, sorry, the military sometimes say, i will allow myself such, maybe a little harsh word now, i would be with them in one he would not have sat down to do something on his own, but here mr. Omerov appoints him as his fulltime adviser, well, here he is personally responsible, and we note that it is not bad. He started as a minister, there were some frank changes there, and there were at least some hopes , but this appointment indicates that mr. Umera, in principle, is completely under the control of an official of the president s office, and he does not represent anything as a minister, but he is, and i will be frank, i may be criticized for this, i i consider mr. Umerov. Just such a tame official of the president s office, if he didnt even have enough conscience, he didnt have enough strength, holding the position of a minister after all, and not some adviser of the ermak, you are a minister, he didnt have enough wisdom to leave the position, to say no, i wont take taking on such reputational risks and losses, the ministry of defense does not need such a corrupt person, if he is not up to it, well , it is bad for the ministry. Defense, that the office of the president can just calmly manage one of the most important ministries. I will only add that we addressed to ministry of defense for a comment, we asked a representative of the ministry of defense to be included in this broadcast and to comment on the tasks of Kyril Tymoshenko in office, they refused, but they sent us an answer to our questions and said that among the tasks of Kyril Tymoshenko will be the construction of a single information summons in the Defense Forces during the war. State, his area of ​​responsibility is also media and communication, coordination of information policy, well , ironically, you know, media and communication, but when we asked to go on the air and to communicate his tasks, we were refused there, so thats how it is. Oleg, thank you very much, oleg simoros, veteran of the russianukrainian war, public and political activist, we talked about the vlk for Valery Zaluzhny and the appointment of Kyril Tymoshenko to the ministry of defense as an adviser. Thank you. By the summer of this year, 12 ukrainian pilots who have undergone tenmonth training in denmark, Great Britain and the usa will be ready to fly f16 fighters. However, by the time the pilots return to ukraine , only six of the approximately 45 aircraft will be delivered fighter jets promised by european allies to kyiv, the New York Times writes about it. The first fighters will be transferred from denmark, initially six and. 13 by the end of 2024 and the 25th year, when the planes will be transferred to ukraine, other allies, it is not clear, as the newspaper writes, the uncertainty with the terms of the delivery of fighters is related to the speed of training of ukrainian pilots and technical staff. Each aircraft requires eight to 14 personnel. Despite the fact that by the usual standards, the training took place , as the publication writes, it went like lightning, nevertheless after all, it took more time than ukraine and its allies expected, notes the New York Times. The publication also explains this by the fact that ukrainian pilots trained in tactics on soviet planes had to learn english and western language. Aerobatic techniques. As a result, pilots who began training in the summer of 23 were ready to fly only in january 24. The next group of eight pilots is due to begin training in denmark at the end of the summer. And kostyantyn kryvolap, an aviation expert, joins our broadcast. Good evening. Good evening. I congratulate you. Please tell me, are six planes out of 45 that are waiting for ukraine, in ukraine in the first place . Six planes . Is it a little or a lot . What the armed forces will be able to do. Fight with these six planes . Well, it depends to a very large extent on what models of aircraft they will be, what radars they will be equipped with and what missiles will be in the armament of this aircraft, if it is 150 158 mgm there, then it is quite serious, it can be done from a Long Distance make a serious impression there for the same crimea, on the already occupied territories, and if it is a plane that will not be very, will not have a powerful radar, then we will be chasing cruise missiles and shaheds, here it is, six planes are very few, me, me , to be honest, this information surprised me a lot, because max rlyuty constantly said that as soon as ukraine is ready, we will immediately supply the planes. And then there was an opinion that we did not have time to adequately prepare our infrastructure, something is not ready, but there are six planes here, if they are already arriving, then already so the infrastructure is ready, there are six, there are 12, so i dont quite understand this message and why there is a delay, well, maybe because, i guess, maybe because enough pilots have not been trained yet. Well, a long, long time ago, our pilots already passed all the courses, they already completed all three stages that should be in training, they finished everything , they showed how they even pass the aerobatic exams, there is a very interesting, very beautiful picture, so exciting, i i dont think the question is with our pilots, what then, do you have an answer to that question, well i think it cant even not. The modification of the planes that we want, and there are some delays with its modernization, because any f16 can be modernized to the latest version of the block 7072, well, this is already fantastic, because this plane is almost the same, if possible, soft f35, well , with the exception of radar visibility, Everything Else there is almost the same as on the f35, but tell me, please, does ukraine have enough infrastructure to protect. These planes from russian attacks, when they will come, even those six, because, well, no it is excluded that as soon as they appear in ukraine at 16, they will immediately become the target of the russian army, well, they will be hunted without any doubt, but they are also hunting for our su24s and su27s, and behind the migs of the 29th, we constantly see attempts to bomb that old kostiantyniv there and they are hitting myrhorod and this is happening all the time, but we are not. That is, we can assume that the infrastructure is prepared, and perhaps the same partners, who provide ukraine with these planes, they also took care of this. Well, of course, there is another one, maybe our technicians specialists, not all exams passed, because i always said that training pilots can take less time than training technical personnel. This is a completely new machine, it is designed according to. Different principles, there is a Different Division of responsibilities between the personnel, there is also a completely different weapon system, a completely different radar, communication, well, other things, so maybe there is still some delay in this , but if there are already six, then what you said, there you need up to 14 Service Specialists for one crew, for one plane, then they service all planes, these are such brigades, and they work. For maintenance of the f16 after