Orban, and a guy like fice, well, what do you and i say about this to all actors, and they already have in their hands, too, and if not a nuclear baton , then the right of veto, like this hungarian corrupt official, well, if not the controlling voice in german society, then already more than 20 alternative for germany, and so on further, and the point is that i will emphasize this again, democracy is the best that exists today, but democracy must learn to defend itself, because then humanity pays very dearly for the fact that democracy sometimes cannot defend itself, and this applies, among other things, to the situation we are talking about we are talking to you, because ukrainians know that if in 2014, in the 13th year, forgive me for that , in the 13th year, everyone stood for ukraine, the full stop was already long ago, well, we are up to the 17th year explained that this is not a civil war. Sir, roman, benvoles, this is the former secretary of defense of great britain, in the ze telegraph edition, writes that ukraine should recruit more young people to the army in order to prevent the decline of the counteroffensive, quoting ben wallace the average age of fighters at the front is over 40 years. I understand the desire of president zelensky to preserve the youth for the future, but the fact is that russia mobilizes the entire country at a low level. Putin knows that the pause will give him time to build a new army. Therefore, as britain did in 19391941, it may be time to reassess the scale of ukraines mobilization. Well, according to the exminister, today the whole world observes whether the west has the determination to defend its own values and a rulebased system, whether it is in the war that is currently raging in ukraine, or whether it is the scale of mobilization and Human Resources that are currently being used to protect the ukrainian state, at a time when war, combines the elements of the first world war, when there is a trench war, and the elements of the world war , when quadcopters, drones strike, ultrasonic missiles fly, is it all decided by the mass of people, will it still be enough the intervention of western countries in this war and putting an end to this war, only they will be able to, given the resources they possess, because their resources are definitely enough to finalize the russianukrainian war. Well, when the situation is sometimes analyzed, they make a comparison with the first world war, the Second World War, but this is an incorrect comparison, it can be compared there in certain operations in certain physical persons, but such a comparison, forgive me, it is a little out of perspective. Here is the evaluation of what he says benolos, its incorrect, its the first, the second, whats important, whats important is that both world war i and world war ii have shown that evil can only be defeated by joint efforts, joint efforts, and what key figures in the United States are saying today america, help, more help, shared. And you and i say not only help, but also joint actions, to be close, polish soldier and ukrainian, german and ukrainian, french, british. And so on, then the matter will be completed very quickly, this is the first, and secondly, to be side by side with diplomats in the same way, to be side by side in matters of industry, the economy , solutions to all problems, to be close, to be close, to understand what is needed by you, comrade, friend, associate, ally, then the questions will be removed, very, very quickly, the fact is that if the United States of america did not come to help london outside the requirements dictated by the isolationist policy and position and, the letter of the law, and roosevelt did not do it, i emphasize once again, outside isolationist policy and position congress, well, hardly. The situation has reached such a point that the finale would be as it happened, in the end, when nazi germany was defeated, and i perceive this position of ben volos only as his next step towards what he has to say, must become everyone is close to the ukrainians, then the issue will be resolved, this thesis , remember, you and i literally still. Five months ago told that, why are you reacting to blackmail, nuclear blackmail of russia, just like now, but we dont we can do it, because it will be a direct clash with russia, and you are already there confrontations with russia, because a similar situation that happened in slovakia and hungary can happen in you, and it applies to everyone without exception, and this is a substandard activity. In russia, this is the underground activity of the fsb. From this it is necessary to understand that not all situations will end the way they ended in karabash, they can end in a different way, the way the situation in africa is happening now. Therefore, taking the position of ben wellos into the discussion, understanding that it is rather a tactical tool, rather than a strategic one. Im talking about its absolutely time look at the formation of the response in a different way and do not pick at the drop of a hat, but make global decisions, the essence of which is to unite forces in the fight against evil. Thank you, mr. Roman, for the conversation, it was roman bezsmertny, politician, diplomat, former extraordinary plenipotentiary ambassador of ukraine to the republic of belarus. Friends, we continue to work live on the tv channel. Press, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms, for those who are currently watching us on youtube, i remind you that we are conducting a survey, today we are asking you about the following are you satisfied with the way the ukrainian authorities are fighting corruption, yes, no, at this moment the vote has already been taken, 94 of people who are dissatisfied said that they are dissatisfied with the way the ukrainian authorities are fighting with corruption, why are we actually asking about it, because today the west. The press is full of publications about the fact that officials of the Biden Administration are much more concerned about corruption in ukraine than they publicly admit. Document of the United States of america, this document emphasizes that corruption can force western allies to abandon ukraines fight against the invasion of russia and that kyiv cannot postpone the fight against corruption, and of course they write about corruption, about how ukraine fights corruption other publications, in particular spiegel, spiegel says that ukraine is no longer in the first place in the priorities of the United States of america, and it is obvious that kyiv will soon have to think about exiting the conflict without defeating russia, well, at least thats german the leading edition writes how it will actually be there, we will observe and comment with our guests, in the next program we will have British Army Colonel glen grant and veteran of the russianukrainian war yevhen dekkiy, so wait, thats it, goodbye, goodbye, good mood to you, antwerp shakhtar na megogo. In the matches against the belgian champion, the miners must score maximum points. On october 4 at 19 45, cheer for the victory of shakhtar. Turn on the Champions League exclusively on meigo. There are discounts on nazoferon 15 in podorozhnyk bam and oskad pharmacies, there are discounts on samples of 20 in podorozhnyk, bam and oskad pharmacies. Attention, an incredible novelty from rozpak tv, super warm and very comfortable alaska style boots. Perfect fit, waterrepellent material and a feeling of warmth even in 30degree frost. Alaska style boots have a universal design and practical black color, so they will fit like men. Also for women, sizes 36 to 46, so get two pairs at once, for you and your husband, the zippers will ensure a perfect fit, even on the widest leg. The insulation perfectly retains heat and wicks away moisture, and the top is made of waterproof and wearresistant raincoat fabric and reinforced with ecosuede. Alaska stayle boots can be worn both in wet weather and in very cold weather. 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Highquality, light and warm alaska style boots will provide comfort and skill. Autumn and in the frosty winter and in the unpredictable spring, you will always be warm, comfortable and dry. Universal design, basic black color and a favorable price, only 799 uah, call. Vasyl winters big broadcast. Two hours of air time, two hours of your time, two hours to learn about the war and what the world is about. Two. To keep up with Economic News and news sport two hours in the company of favorite presenters, presenters who have become like relatives to many, as well as distinguished guests of the studio. Events of the day in two hours. Vasyl zemas big broadcast, a project for smart and caring people. Espresso in the evening. The war in ukraine is the main topic for ukrainians. Wins and losses. Analysis and forecasts, politics and geopolitics, Serhii Rudenko and the guests of his program will talk about all this, people who have information and shape public opinion, people who defend ukraine and create the future right now, the main and interesting thing in the verdict by serhii program in the evening, from monday to friday, at 20 00, repeat at 12 10. Greetings, friends, the war continues, and ukraine is in this war. Continues to hold on and believe in victory, some fight, others do not fight, but in any case, our nation, our state continues this thousandyear war, which has now manifested itself in its new dimension, and we will return to this war in our conversation, although not before the war that is going on now, before the war that was, well, almost 100 years ago, somewhere around 80 years ago, i thought about the Second World War, druze a war that left a lot of white spots, a lot of unresolved issues, a lot of question marks that were never straightened into exclamation marks, unfortunately, lets try today to straighten such a question mark into an exclamation mark and try to put another full stop. We are talking about a scandal that happened in canada, it is connected with a veteran of the sss Halychyna Division. We are talking about yaroslav hunka. On september 22, president Volodymyr Zelenskyi took part in the solemn session of the parliament in canada. During it, in particular , the hero who fought for the independence of ukraine was applauded from russian aggression. World war then the speaker of the parliament, anthony rota, introduced the 98yearold Yaroslav Hunko or hunka, whom you now see on the screens, to the audience. I thanked him for his service and noted that he supports the Ukrainian Army even today, after that the Canadian Center for israel and Jewish Affairs reported that hunka was part of the 14th Grenadier Division of the sss galicia, which was part of the waffen sss of nazi germany, the minister of education of poland pshamyslav charnyk said that the hun should be extradited from canada, there are already political implications in this story consequences, anthony rota resigned, and canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau had to apologize for a mistake that deeply embarrassed the parliament and canada, well, actually, today we will talk about the roots of this scandal, and then , of course, we joined in making up our own delusions about nazis in ukraine, about nazis, well, in quotation marks, of course, who live there outside the borders of ukraine, killing, well, lets say, about their own, filled with russians, such a military formation as roa, the Russian Liberation army, which, lets say, participated in the suppression the warsaw uprising in 1944, let me remind you that when the soviet troops were stationed near warsaw, the warsaw uprising broke out, and then marshal rokosowski wanted to help the poles defeat the nazis in warsaw, but marshal zhukov. Did not allow it to happen, the actual warsaw uprising was suppressed, and then the soviet troops already covered everyone, but the question is that the Russian Liberation army suppressed this uprising and killed the civilians of poland, lets say, but the russians want to mention this, but the sss galicia they wear it like a rag in front of a bull, in front of the world public and talk about what you see, these are war criminals who allegedly took part in the extermination of jews and the killing of local residents, whether it is true or not, and what they say. Whether it is true that after the second sss war, galicia was recognized as criminal, as a military group, a military entity that committed war crimes, whether they were punished, whether they were convicted, whether they were discussed at the nbera trial, we will talk about this with our guest tetyana shvychenko, candidate of historical sciences, ms. Tetyana, i congratulate you, good day, there are no simple stories in difficult historical times, and today, in such difficult historical times, we are talking about nayema, actually, the prerequisites of this conversation i voiced what happened in the parliament of canada, the resignation of the speaker, the apology of Justin Trudeau, and the main accusation that you see the gun, belonged to the organization, to the formation of the military sss galicia, which division, which allegedly committed certain crimes. Please tell us, from what we know, in those times, whether it was the activities of the sss galicia were investigated, how they were interpreted after the war, whether it was condemned. And of course, more than one study was conducted, several studies were conducted, this topic is extremely topical, so to speak, when it is profitable for the russians, and what we know and factually proven is that the vapss Halychyna Division has never been convicted, nor on at the newbern trial, nor. By any other tribunal, there was a special british review, it also found no evidence, and the last largescale investigation was conducted by the canadian Government Commission in the 1980s, it lasted for more than five years, and in 1989, they declared that evidence that Ukrainian Divisional officers committed war crimes simply does not exist, they do not exist, and i would like to quote roman danylyuk here, a veteran divisional officer, who said in his papers that if we had committed even the smallest war crime, we would have been involved in the newbern process, which condemned the fascist sss party as a criminal organization, here i will insert my remark that when this subject is manipulated, then often try to take advantage of the fact that people confuse ccs pairs as the party and the sss as a purely military military, military military organization, army, army, and, therefore, not a single divisional officer, i quote mr. Roman, not a single divisional officer was arrested for actions against humanity and humanity, we did not fight against the United States of america, great britain, france, we fought bolshevism, the immigration officials checked each of us very carefully when we entered america, canada, england, australia and other countries, and we did not hide who we were, our divisionalists showed themselves very well on the acquired homeland, they. Actively cooperate in almost all ukrainian public institutions, i am not talking about myself, i have enough public duties for a dozen people, divisionalists continue to stand at the forefront of the Ukrainian Community almost throughout the world, now they strive to help in the development of the ukrainian state, for which they shed their blood, this is what he said in 1993, confirming everything that has already been proven by various investigations, you know, history, well, it is clearly history, the interpretation of history, it can be hypocritical, i just such and such a story came to mind, but when they said that the father was from the sss, they were talking about yaroslav hunka, allegedly. That there are jewish organizations, and well, the russians, of course, but i remembered the story about sturmbannfuhr, who joined the space program, i was already out of my mind, wernher von braun, yes, who joined the us space program, just cynicism in that that when we need something and it is beneficial, we interpret it one at a time, when we do not need it and it is not beneficial, we interpret it differently, i will remind you that schurman fuhr sss in werner von braun, it is, well, according to our interpretation, this is an sss major who had awards from hitler, he was involved in the creation, he was actually the creator, of the fa2 missile, which actually killed londoners in london, because the fa2 bombed london, and wernher von braun was directly involved in the creation of the weapon, which killed civilians in britain, primarily in london. When the war was over, well actually approaching its end, wernher von braun surrendered to the americans, they transported him to the usa, like many other scientists from germany at that time from the third reich, and that was it, and he joined of the apoleon mission, using, by the way, the works of a ukrainian scientist, a book, he was found in the library of congress, who calculated the trajectory of the flight to the moon, but the point is not that, i did not hear anywhere that in the United States of america, they said, you know, ss helped the americans reach the moon. An ss man carried out the apollo mission, well, we forgot that he was an sss, but he was a sss sturmbannfuhrer, his fu2 missiles killed londoners, but we forget that, here we raise the flag from the sss glachyn with yarosl hunka and start to kill peoples consciousness, in us later there will be a conversation, after we say goodbye to mrs. Tatyana, there will be a conversation with the diplomat who was at one time the ambassador of ukraine to the russian federation, kostyantyn hryichenko, we will talk with him about the diplomatic aspect of this case, how ukrainians should act , i want to ask you, about what, please tell me, lets remember how this division was formed, what tasks faced it, how here. There were fighters enrolled and what kind of battles they fought . Well, actually the Ukrainian Division of galicia, or the 14th Grenadier Division of the frontline troops of the sss galicia was a part of the german wafs from 1943 to 1945. In general, it is also worth knowing that there were 42 divisions in the sss, and 20 of them were volunteer and included various peoples of europe, including estonians, albanians, latvians, that is, very, very many of them, and in particular, russians as well. Oh, and just in case, here is about the creation, but i also emphasize that the Ukrainian Division of halychyna, it was precisely a military, but not a punitive formation. Its creation was announced in april 1943 by the German Occupation authorities on the territory of eastern galicia, which was then part of of the german governor general. Well , in fact, the tragedy of the ukrainian people, which was divided between two during the first world war, was repeated. Empires, and during the Second World War it found itself between two brutal totalitarian regimes, the division was part of the structure of nongeneral sss, which participated in holocaust and other punitive operations in the occupied territories, and the socalled troops of the sss, i. E. Vafs, and was assigned to combat operations at the front next to the wehrmacht, mostly ukrainians from the west of ukraine served there, and that the moment, when all this was taking shape, was very like this, it was incomprehensible to fly. The situation was absolutely. At that time, the opinions of the ukrainian Opera Movement were divided about whether ukrainians should join the ranks of this division or not, the revolutionary wing of the organization of ukrainian nationalists led by Stepan Bandera was against ukrainians joining the division, they were simultaneously engaged in creating of the ukrainian rebel army, while the moderates, for example, the people of molnyakiv were neutral and believed that it could be a Good Opportunity to create a strong, welltrained Ukrainian Army in the future. Which can become the core of the Ukrainian Army, and at the same time they were willing to negotiate with the allies of the antihitler coalition there, for example with the british, and at the same time, that is, the intentions of the ukrainians were quite clear, but the leadership of the third reich did not want to create a strong Ukrainian Army, with 80 thousand 80 thousand volunteers selected about 13,500 and here, too, i would like to remind about june 30, 1941, when the organization ukrainian nationalists led by Stepan Bandera proclaimed the act of restoration of the ukrainian state in lviv, and the germans did not accept it, in a few days they arrested bandera and his associates and sent them to the sachsenhausen concentration camp, and on july 11 they banned the activities of any ukrainian organizations, and in september the nazis began mass arrests and Mass Shootings of the residents of ouniv, but here too. It is worth remembering that for ukrainians, the russian soviet occupation at the time of the Second World War was not, well, the wrong word traumatic most of ukraine, occupied by the russian bolsheviks, survived at that time. Red terror, when in the peaceful cities of ukraine, after the first world war, ah, there was a russian civil war, and the red bolsheviks against the white imperialists, and both sides wanted to destroy ukraine, conquer, occupy and ah, grab our territories, went to us with the war, and then there was both white and red russian terror, there was also the occupation of ukrainian territories, the destruction of ukrainian statehood in the 21st year, the socalled shooting revival, when the russians physically destroyed the world of the ukrainian intelligentsia, famine, genocide in 3233, extermination of millions of ukrainians by hunger, repression, executions, exile, and during the great terror, murder of Ukrainian Resistance leaders in exile, we also do not forget that in in the 39th year, the west of ukraine was occupied by the soviets, and after all the horrors of this occupation, people were categorically determined not to allow a second invasion, and of course, most of the divisional officers who went voluntarily to these ranks, they were still students, they were young people people, and at that time german propaganda was also active, and ukrainian leaders of the resistance movement, some of them, thought how to use this moment, so the germans made a promise to the division at that time that it would fight only on the Eastern Front against the bolsheviks, thats how the only major promise that they kept then, and here too i would like to add this quote from one of the divisional officers and ukrainian historian, local historian vasyl veriga, but when he was asked whether you fought only on the Eastern Front, he said yes, it was stipulated, that they could not throw us on the western front was not against the americans, the french or the british, the germans kept to it, the truth was that there was a case when they sent one ukrainian battalion to france and at the first opportunity this battalion in its entirety went over to the side of the french, it was with us, it would have been with us in the same way, thats why we were kept on the Eastern Front, thats why it was our great, then it was our great tragedy, here the ukrainians, and on the other hand, ukrainians too, one good man told me, after the battles for bansk bystrica, which the Ukrainian Military unit liberated from the soviet partisans, he observed the following picture ukrainians in german uniforms entered the city from one side, and ukrainians in soviet uniforms exited from the other, that is the tragedy of the enslaved people, i want to believe that it has passed and that horror will never happen again, so, well, then the division in in the 44th year, fought under the fords, and then they went into battle for the first time after training and were defeated against the experienced soviet red army, and in the battles under the fords, out of 11,000 Ukrainian Divisionalists, about 800 died, that is, the majority only got out of the encirclement 3,000, and most of those who survived joined the Ukrainian Insurgent Army and were then transferred to yugoslavia to fight against the communist partisans of uncle josif broz tito, and from the fall of 1944 to may of 1945 , their units participated in hostilities in slovakia , slovenia and austria, that is , they were in absolutely no way involved in crimes against the civilian population, and they had no such motivation and no such facts to prove it. By the way, i think that those people who are married hardly read it to accuse the sss Halychyna Division of crimes against the civilian population, there against the jews and so on, and ivan bagaryanys novel circle of fire, he just describes this battle under the fords, well, i think that you must have read it, it is this novel, and there actually these events describe this battle, and it will end with the fact that a soldier of the sss Halychyna Division took aim at the tanks, a girl, a tankman, from the soviet army, falls out of the tank, and they are looking at each other, and there is such and such a scene, and it seems there are ukrainians, and there are ukrainians, but they ended up on different sides, because some of them were forced, well, lets say, like my grandfather, greatgrandfather, they just came to the village, took you and you went to the army, so, well, no one asked you, on the other hand, there too, you went to the army, thats why that you wanted to stop the darkness that was coming from the east, well, i think it is only worth reminding how many ukrainians were destroyed, killed in lviv, in galicia, and in general in western ukraine, after. After the year 39, well , starting in the 1940s, before the arrival of the germans, and also how many were resettled to siberia and other regions of the russian federation, ukrainians, so everything is clear here, in your opinion, as in the opinion of a historian, what should have been done by the ukrainian public, certain officials, how to respond competently to this scandal, the ukrainian side
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