Transcripts For DW The Day 20240713

Do that when what needs to even should be thats the fault. Is of the ship but you look at snake oil. You see that the actual delivery were doing more we are together its obvious that the alliance needs to be renewed but it. Also coming up with the poison gas they claimed thousands of lives in bhopal india 35 years after the worlds worst industrial disaster angry calls for justice remain undiminished and an answer. These killers did not heed anything why have they not been brought to court why havent they been hanged they are responsible for this. One to our viewers on p. B. S. In the United States and all around the world welcome we begin the day as nato turns 70 in many ways the worlds most powerful military alliance after 7 decades of existence exhibits characteristics that you could expect from a person turning 7 you could call it the natives Senior Citizen syndrome those natives still matter at 70 how a tune is a Cold War Alliance to the 21st century us president on drum months so long ago called nato obsolete but he was not the 1st or last to suggest that nato has identity issues or even existential and similar questions were posed immediately after the berlin wall fell and the soviet union fell apart most recently french president mccrone complained of a brain death at nato a result of americas disengagement in the alliance tonight nato at 70 how old or how young is the alliance really. Nato performs on an impressive scale exercises like this united and with clear leadership but the political reality often looks different better quotables occur frequently the latest on tyga nest french president emanuel macron he criticized me to his brain dead in an interview with british news magazine the economist a damaging political slap in the face just before the meeting in london. Because on my call in my prochoice very media savvy and knows how these things work and he knows how to make his voice heard. Its clear that the timing before the meeting in london was chosen deliberately or it could look at on who you. The french president s remark was mainly aimed at turkey for its military operations undertaken without consulting nato partners turkey is a geo strategically important nato member but it has stepped out of line with its offensive in Northern Syria nato the only major western military alliance was paralysed to intervene another problem turkey has entered an arms deal with russia buying a Strategic Missile Defense System. More experts have agreed for months and even years that theres a problem with the alliance only a problem dollars. A problem that u. S. President donald trump has exacerbated time and again americas withdrawal from syria surprise the alliance showing that the most powerful until name most reliable nato member is acting without consulting its European Partners in the normal problem of the now we have a problem with the americans a problem in the west with Transatlantic Relations why the americans see the europeans need us to problem not the solution you know problem. Nato secretary general u. N. Stoltenberg is under pressure hes seeking a clear commitment from all members 1st Strong Alliance for stoltenberg its also a budgetary issue last years we have seen that have started to increase again more troops more exercises more investment stoltenberg also try to get mccrone on board during a short visit to paris but without success frances president repeated his criticism. That there probably needed to be a wake up call and im happy that i was able to spark a debate and that we can now think about our strategic goals. Objectives strategic but stoltenberg did receive support from barry lynn german chancellor and of america defended nato. And isnt of interest and we depend on this Transatlantic Alliance and thats why its right for us to work for this alliance and take on more responsibility. 70 years since the Defense Alliance was founded the Global Security situation is much more complex than it was during the cold war tensions over u. S. Leadership alarm at turkeys small arming ties with russia and french doubts about nato is the viability the alines is on the pressure but not only from the outside. Never used Catherine Martins reporting there lets bring in our correspondent max hoffmann he joins us from london tonight good evening to you max so nato at 7 and they have always been critics of the alliance but you wont find many people talking about nato celebrating its birthday is that justified realism or would you say due to excessive pessimism it seems like at the moment theyre trying to avoid a fight there sort of a truce going on here in london not to talk about the multiple problems that were also mentioned in that report by Catherine Martens and that plague the alliance but to say ok this is the 70th out of verse 3 lets talk about it later sort of you know when your uncle turns 70 and you know that the family members have some issues and they decide not to not to thats a fight during the party so it reminds me of that but you know the world in the situation in which nato is today 70 years after its foundation is very different from the situation it was in up until the 1990 s. I want to ask you about what the french president said in that interview with the economist last month you know warning of brain death at nato as a result of u. S. Disengagement in the alliance whats the feeling among nato members now is is he telling the truth is he right. Almost every member state rejected that language including im going to back who usually isnt that outspoken also donald trump rejected it and the turkish president in his own drastic way even called him i knew him i call himself braindead because he said that but when it comes to what he meant by it that the foundation of nato isnt necessarily what it used to be than many nato say he does have a point just take the simple example. The turkish that are part of the Alliance Call the kurds in Northern Syria terrorists but they are d at the same time the allies of the americans so of Donald Donald trump and the military of the United States of america so indeed they dont necessarily have the same foundation theyre in this very good point that were going to be talking about a little bit later in the program as well the u. S. President donald trump hes accused other nato members of being free look is not paying their fair share for defense of nato hes also question nato whose usefulness how much damage would you say has been done by the u. S. President making those accusations. There has been a reversal of roles to some point donald trump no longer says that he thinks nato is useless apparently he has seen the use of it at least for his personally a mess and in the here hes the one defending the nato. As opposed to him i do in my column has been much more destructive in his narrative of nato in the last days but youre right about the spending. This is still a favorite topic of donald trump and well see how he deals with that on wednesday when the leaders actually come together the work and thats when these issues usually come to the table meaning thats when he usually criticize. Germany for not spending those 2 percent of g. D. P. Or other european nations but of course if you look at the numbers theyve increased a lot since donald trump has taken office. 3 countries back that only met that goal of 2 percent of g. D. P. Now you have 9 countries and you know max we we can talk about many things that have changed including the u. S. President s position on nato but one thing that hasnt changed and that is the soviet union or now russia russia remains the nemesis of nato that has not changed in in these past 70 years we would you agree with that. Well there was a period where there was where they got a lot closer with russia just right after the fall of the berlin wall and up until you know even not a couple with 5 or 6 years ago the situation really changed been bloody near putin decided to take action in Eastern Ukraine and also in crimea that was the turning point for the alliance some called it a wake up call and thats when russia was really officially identified as a threat to nato especially of course in the Eastern States of the Nato Alliance the Baltic States poland and that still remains the case but it was with what i mentioned earlier brant is that the world has gotten complicated its no longer just russia its also the threat from the south whats happening in syria its also china as will be officially mentioned tomorrow because were not only talking about the real world but also cyber space and thats why the americans for example will urge the europeans again not to do business with the Chinese Companies as who away when it comes to installing a 5 g. Network in the european union. Our correspondent max hoffman joining us tonight from london where those 78th anniversary commemorations are taking place for nato max thank you. Well turkeys military incursion into Northern Syria last october is 1 of the latest issues putting strains on nato turkey considers the kurdish y p g militia in Northern Syria to be a terrorist group but the wife eugene there are allies of the United States and they were keen to breaking the isis caliphate or heres french president emmanuel back wrong with strong criticism of turkey delivered earlier today. As a call and indeed the possibility. Of an answer to. This and the i believe on the day. When. They now find it in a little fun with. It and sometimes it. Looks. As if you know that was the french president there posing the question is my enemy also your enemy if we are both nato members will for more on nato lets bring in steven cook hes a senior fellow for middle east and Africa Studies at the council on Foreign Relations in washington d. C. Good evening to you stephen you know we just heard french president when you were a microloan accusing turkey of working with isis proxy groups attached to isis i mean is that true that do we have evidence that turkey is working with groups that work with isis. You know ive never seen any convincing evidence that turkeys working directly with isis or isis proxies this far better evidence that turkey has worked with al qaida and al qaeda affiliates in syria and in fact that there is some of the militias that they are working with what they call the Syrian National army or in fact militias that are affiliated with or connected to al qaida in some way i think that the french president s statement on this is is a bit over the top although he is raising a very good question of when he asks why are you fighting against the people who are fighting with us against the Islamic State lets look at it from the the angle of turkey turkey is demanding its nato allies treat the syrian kurds of the wind. As terror they say you know you should see them the way we see them in turkey have a valid point. Well in it to some extent it does the y. P. G. Is a group that is directly linked to the p. K. K. A kurdish turkish terrorist organization has been waging a campaign of violence against turkey since the need 1980 s. Though when you separate the 2 groups the y. P. G. From the p. K. Kate ones hard pressed to make the argument that the why p. G. Has directly targeted turkey or turkish civilians or the Turkish Military the why p. G. Has been allied with the United States in the fight against the Islamic State nevertheless this doesnt diminish the turkish sense of threat coming from the fact that the why p. G. Is so closely associated with the p k k we look at turkey a nato it looks in the eyes of many as to be the black sheep of nato but its also we have to seem to have success on playing hardball recently were going to have a look at that issue in just a 2nd but 1st i want to go back to last week which was the week of the thinks giving holiday in the United States take a listen it seems that democrats are accusing me of being too soft on turkey but bread and butter i should note that id like previous witnesses you and i have actually met its very unusual. Listening explain this to our International Audience that the u. S. President there kind of making a pun about forgiving the country turkey while he pardons the things giving turkey which is a tradition a president ial tradition in the United States and are the democrats right however when they criticize trump for not being hard enough on turkey. Well its not just democrats there are republicans who are outraged at the way in which President Trump has been solicitous towards what they perceive to be turkeys bad behavior on october 29th with which happens to be turkish republic day. The house of representatives passed in an overwhelming bipartisan fashion 2 resolutions one recognizing the Armenian Genocide and a 2nd one calling for sanctions to be applied on turkey theres very little these days that the house of representatives does that in a bipartisan manner but nevertheless turkey and its actions in northeastern syrian a number of other actions including the purchase of the russian s 400 air Defense System has brought House Democrats and House Republicans together as well as Prominent Senate republicans and Senate Democrats just yesterday senator Chris Van Hollen a democrat from maryland and senator Lindsey Graham one of the president s staunchest supporters was a republican from South Carolina the very strong letter to secretary of state my prom peo asking for him to impose sanctions on turkey for turkeys purchase of the f. 400 Defense System yeah and certainly completely signals here because trump also justified his decision to pull u. S. Forces out of Northern Syria because he said we had to get out of the way of the Turkish Military as its the Turkish Military dictates us Foreign Policy at the same time trump is repeatedly cold turkey is great ally of nato do you think thats a view that he holds or do you think thats the advice that he has been given. It may very well be the advice that hes getting think that there are people here in washington who believe that the United States must hang on to this relationship which during the cold war was a very important relationship and that if the United States seeks to preserve the relationship good things can come of it i think what they are overlooking is the fact that the turks themselves would like to have a more independent Foreign Policy of the United States would like to develop its relations with countries like russia and iran in ways that are not necessarily in the interests of the United States so that no matter how the president treats turkey whether its in this list this matter that the president does or if he follows the advice of members of the house and senate and sanctions turkey the turks will continue to. Advance their own agenda their own interests in ways that they see fit regardless of the wishes of the United States yeah its definitely as they say a relationship that is complicated steven cook with the that council on Foreign Relations joining us tonight from washington d. C. Even as always we appreciate your time when youre inside thank you. My pleasure. Well it was the worlds worst industrial disaster but the description barely captures what help do in the indian city of bhopal 35 years ago in the early hours of december 3rd 1904 poisonous gas leak from a Union Carbide pesticides plant spreading rapidly across the city in that 1st night more than 3000 people die over the following years the number would rise to 15000 and many of the survivors they suffered as will disorders cancer birth defects among a long list of Health Problems but it doesnt stop there 35 years later theres still no closure and there remains calls for adequate compensation Better Health care and above all for justice. Decades they have been campaigning some still living with their injuries. Of is still baring their grief. But without that night everything was destroyed my sons and daughter in law died and my leg was amputated. I have to drag myself around these killers did not heed anything why have they not been brought to court why havent they been hanged they are responsible for this yet. It was december 1984 when 40 tons of deadly methyl i so psion 8 known as m i c gas escaped a pesticide factory in the indian city of bhopal within the 1st few hours 3000 people were dead some dying in their own homes. Hundreds of thousands more were injured many of them children. d over the years the death toll has risen and official estimate stands at around 15000. 00. The Company Responsible Union Carbide has never faced prosecution but it did agree a 470000000. 00 payout in 1989 campaigners say the company which is now owned by dow chemicals must pay much more in compensation including to the families his children have been born with brain damage and with disabilities the people are waiting for it proper to get a standard medical treatment protocol is needed thats not yet available and finally in some ways the most important question is whether the justice. The question many have been asking for 35 years and still it seems there is no on. What it is the sloan but you wont find on a male you know if you live in or youve ever been the longest nigeria you probably know about the slum city of macaco known as the worlds biggest Floating City it is home to about 300 cells and people and despite it saudis rococo has never appeared on any city planning documents or melts but then it is about to change. Welcome to my cocoa a floating slum in the nigerian mega city of lagos officially this part of the city does not exist you wont find these dingy canals and ramshackle house indicated on any city maps but john and his team are trying to change that on to their Location Tracking smartphones they crisscross the old ways with the aim of pushing the cocoa and its approximately 300000 inhabitants on the map where i was a man made up of girls from. Actually. Collected went of interest within the neighborhood within the houses so what is on the map so we can have more. Points of interest on this in my book on city streets and have is enough to get. All of this going to be under market for free john works for south africa based ngo code for africa the Organization Behind this drive to map out the slums and improve the lives of those who live here. Every point of interest is carefully entered into the system like what the floating barbershop. Will undermine. To be part of the point of enjoyable would she want to come and model whom are those who want someone who without property deeds or in many cases even illegal existence the inhabitants of macaco live with the permanent threat of the fiction for this local traditional leader appearing on a map for the 1st time is a step towards cementing his peoples place here. Where some of you before in my cork or we were in the dark but now with the work you have done we traditional chiefs can see that you have done a good job we are only fisherman we didnt know how to mark out the different neighborhoods as you know we are very happy. John believes that inhabitants of this part of the city should have access to the same knowledge of the neighborhood enjoyed by those who live elsewhere in lagos. All of these westy walking on it when we are done it would look like the rest part of the goal here because the street to see the difference is the public will be able to see this neighborhood differently as the map is ready to go online. Well the day is almost done but the conversation continues online youll find us on twitter either at u. W. News or you can follow me at brant goff t. V. That we get to use the hash tag the day to remember whatever happens between now and then tomorrow is another day well see then a. Light can carry information. Site can help feed people. Still people can be happy without light. How much light do we really neat. Weve seen the light on made in germany next. Do you know what you used to barbecue your sausages. Charcoal of course charcoal also from wood cut illegally in tropical forests and seas findings are truly catastrophic for its. It cant go on like ghost. Town called an environmental disaster why is the trim soon lucrative why is it taking so long to find alternatives in 45 minutes on d w. A historical trimming joint intelligence business and pollution. One to 7. A run up people of the islamic revolution. Opens up making its initial flirtation capitalism strikes in states of emergency but 6 into chaos. John henderson introduces payment hence the people threaten steel order. 979. That created todays market starts december 23rd w. Nature does a spectacular job of lighting up out planet but when it comes to running out 24 hour a day cities man made electric light is a must at a low cost an astronomical 100000000. 00 euros a year there are new types of lights and lasers